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This reminds me of a story told by Ben Rich, the head of Lockheed's Skunk Works during the late 70s through the early 90s. One of the first projects they had under his tenure was to re-open the U2 spy plane assembly line and produce some new, updated versions of the airplane. However, the Air Force didn't want the bad vibe associated with funding new spy plane work (especially from our allies and not-so allies), so they required that the new airplane be called the "TR-1," hopefully shielding themselves from the cloak-and-dagger stigma associated with the old U2. As Ben Rich tells the story, when the press got hold of the news, they immediately took to calling the new airplane the "TR-1 Spy Plane." Nowadays, they don't even bother with the TR-1 part, and just refer to it as the U2 again.

Poor Hormel. Spam will ALWAYS be Spam, I'm afraid.

Here's the flying SUV that I want.

You know I just noticed the F/A-22 looks alot alike the F-35

There's something for modders to work on -- they prefer their machines to sound like a VTOL aircraft landing on a swedish death metal band

That's one of the funniest things I've ever heard, mind if I make it my .sig? It's especially funny in the context of my swedish death metal kick of the past couple years (the result of a search for new metal bands after metallica not only put out shi**y music but got the RIAA on all our backs). Actually, that'd be pretty awesome to have a JSF F-35B on stage at an In Flames concert.

Mike

I believe the military installation commonly known as Area 51 is actually an advanced aircraft development center, where they developed craft ranging from the old U2 spy plane to the F-117 stealth fighter.

Actually, both the U2 and the F-117 were developed at Lockheed's Skunk Works plant in Palmdale CA. A lot of information can be found in Skunk Works, a memoir by the guy who ran the place during the F-117 development. He also discusses where some of the testing took place in the book, and if I recall correctly most of it was (for the obvious reasons) well-known radar testing ranges.

Now, for all we know, Area 51 still could be an advanced aircraft development center. If they retired the SR-71 (also a Skunk Works Project) and allowed the F-117 to become public before it was absolutely neccessary, then what do they have that they aren't talking about?

Most supersonic aircraft require afterburners in order to go faster then sound, and afterburners are incredibly voracious consumers of fuel. I think that one of the other very important innovations is the "Supercruise" ability, seen on aircraft like the F-22 Raptor. This allows the aircraft to maintain supersonic speed for extended periods of time in a low power setting, and this in turn is just as vital for cheap, commercially viable flights. I hope that advances in sonic boom suppression will also work well with the necessary designs for supercruising, and that we may all be able to take advantage of such flights within the next 2-3 decades. If both aren't taken into account, and designers come up with plans that make for an either-or choice, it could mean supersonic planes will still be relegated to the relatively wealthy.

160 tons is not fucking *huge*
It's a lot, yeah, but I used to work on a towboat that pushed 25 barges capable of carrying 1,500 tons *each*
That's 37,500 tons of cargo
*That's* fucking huge

Now, I understand that you mean the aircraft is huge, not the capacity, but 160 tons still works out to the approximate capacity of a Lockheed Martin C-5 Galaxy

I believe that "Skunk Works" is a trademark of the Lockheed Martin Corporation.

The Skunk Works is the plant that built the U-2, the first jet fighter (don't know the name), the Blackbird (AKA SR-70, SR-71, etc), F-22, F-35 (the new joint strike fighter), the stealth fighter, and others that are probably still classified.

The Boeing version is called the Phantom Works, which is their high end idea plant which created Boeing's JSF entry (which lost to the Lockheed version, but that isn't important).

Just my little input of random facts.

-CPM

Wrong. Try again. The JSF (F-35B) is STOVL. Check your facts next time...

That's the kind of sh*t that pisses me off, I don't pay taxes to have the government simply hand that money to a corp.

Actually, that's exactly what you do. Of course you could delude yourself into thinking that your particular share of the money was going into Condoleezza Rice's pocket, or perhaps Colin Powell's paycheck instead.

Of course, your money is probably going to TRW, Lockheed Martin, or Boeing, or perhaps all 3.

Remember, it might be neat to think about Bill Gate's money, or how much cash Microsoft has, but really. Call me when Microsoft gets awarded a multibillion dollar contract that has the potential to blow up or get shot down.

I've never seen Windows crash quite like that.

... and Lockheed JSF videos may be found here.