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Not true about the metro, when were you there last?

I didn't use the subway myself, I opted for the buses, which I was pretty impressed with (I am from England though ;).

the traffic is insane, and in between historical landmarks, the place is laid out in a grid pattern filled with boxy, unattractive 1960s office buildings (at least the downtown areas.)

You're bang on with these points. Still, out of all the cities I visited during my stay, Kyoto was my favourite.

Full disclosure ahead: I am a Spaniard, I lived for 2 years in Morocco (Casablanca) and I work in the railway business (software engineering, not civil engineering, but you can't have it all, can you?)

Believe it or not, but this is actually possible. Spain might not be any more the country many of you thought it was. Civil engineering in Spain and the rest of Europe is pretty advanced these days, as far as huge tunnels are concerned. Just look at Madrid's Metro and its spectacular growth here: http://www.metropla.net/eu/mad/metrosur.htm. The Line 12 was put in service in just 3+ years, and spans 40+ kilometres of underground tracks and stations. Look at the 27 kilometre high speed rail double tunnel currently being built beneath the Sierra de Guadarrama, a granitic mountain range 2500 metres high (http://www.geodata.it/english/progetti/gallunghe/ guadarrama/), which will connect Madrid to the northern cities of Segovia and Valladolid. And last, but not least, the longest metro line in Europe, currently under construction, is the Line 9 in Barcelona, which will also feature fully automated trains (http://www.finanzas.com/id.5214701/noticias/notic ia.htm, in Spanish).

However, having said this, I don't believe we will actually see this happen in our lifetimes. First of all, 27e6 euros (30e6 $) aren't enough even for preliminary studies of such a complex undertaking. The current Spanish government is extremely interested in infrastructure and development work if and only if two or more of the following apply: a) political gains are to be obtained, b) civil engineering firms tycoons line up their pockets even more and c) the european union foots a significant percentage of the bills.

And then comes Morocco, a developing country en route to democracy. Morocco has comparatively few transportation infrastructures deployed: around 1000 km of electrified, standard gauge railways. You simply don't build a tunnel to nowhere, unless Spain and the EU are strongly commited to finance development works there (and they currently aren't, and most likely won't be in a foreseeable future, even though it might be a hell of a good idea to even out differences and further good neighbour relationships in the Mediterranean area).

Lastly, governments of Spain and Morocco are at odds over several issues, the least important of which are the ones that got more attention in previous comments: territorial disputes and terrorism. The main troubles between Morocco and Spain (and the rest of EU) are immigration and commerce, and both of them receive a harsh treatment by the Spanish government. No compromises will be agreed upon unless forced by a third party, just because such an attitude improves the outlook of Aznar and his cabinet among the population right wing.

So, unfortunately, I believe this tunnel is just vapor, and will dissipate sooner or later depending on the result of the ongoing UN-sponsored Western Sahara negotiations...

Ivan

Good point, everyone claims "Well trying to shelter the kids is pointless, they will find out about it sooner or later and then all you have done it make it more desirable by forbidding it."

When I was a kid, I had all the access I would want to my father's pr0n (pretty lame by today's standards).

Guess what? I'm a subway freak nowadays. I travel to faraway & exotic places just to have a look at their wierd subways.

Good point, everyone claims "Well trying to shelter the kids is pointless, they will find out about it sooner or later and then all you have done it make it more desirable by forbidding it."

When I was a kid, I had all the access I would want to my father's pr0n (pretty lame by today's standards).

Guess what? I'm a subway freak nowadays. I travel to faraway & exotic places just to have a look at their wierd subways.

Good point, everyone claims "Well trying to shelter the kids is pointless, they will find out about it sooner or later and then all you have done it make it more desirable by forbidding it."

When I was a kid, I had all the access I would want to my father's pr0n (pretty lame by today's standards).

Guess what? I'm a subway freak nowadays. I travel to faraway & exotic places just to have a look at their wierd subways.

Was just there, and can understand why your memory might be a little hazy, but they have a subway (metro) system apart from the trams.
Amsterdam Metro

NYC is 398km, 469 stations and runs 24/7/365

Thanks to MetroPlanet for the details.

More than 20 years ago, I remember seeing at a computer show a daisywheel printer whose head was propelled by a linear motor (it was manufactured by a subsidiary of Exxon).

And in 1984, in Toronto, the Scarborough RT (Rapid Transit) line opened, which was the first full scale ICTS implementation. Since then, the small linear motor subway has found home in Vancouver and Detroit.

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

For a population of 2 million, why?

In the past few years I have visited a quite a few cities in this world around the size of Las Vegas with excellent mass transit. Getting around Vegas was a disaster. (I had a car) Getting around these other cities was a much cheaper, faster, and more enjoyable experience.

Athens - 3 million (rode in 2001, damn is Greek hard to read)
Barcelona - 1.6 million (rode in 2002, fantastic system, took two taxis in nine days)
Budapest - 2 million (rode in 2000. took me everywhere)
Bucharest - 2.3 million (rode in 2000. comprehensive but a little dodgy. about as clean as NYC)
Prague - 1.2 million (rode in 2000. they even have English signs!)
Warsaw 1.6 million (1999,2000,2001 - only one underground, but linked with dozens of tram lines.)

I should mention that all of these cities have extensive bus and streetcar networks which mesh seamlessly with their metros. And that all of these systems have incredibly high ridership. They're always packed, and yet they always run on time.

Next to what I've seen abroad, NYC is ok, Washington DC is fair, and Chicago and Boston (where I live and ride the T daily) are utterly pathetic. (I wish the crooked politicians in Boston would put 1/10th of what they put into the roads and the "big dig" into the MBTA. It'd be a city worth living in.)

I do believe that I'll visit Vegas again when their Monorail is up and running. And I bet I'll see a lot more of the city than I did on my last visit. (then again, if you've seen one glitzy casino...)

Check out the icons for the Mexico subway sometime. Insane they thought anyone would intuitively understand that shit, although I suppose it's easier for illiterate people to remember pictures than words?