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I'd like to see XForms support. It's a great technology for Ajax-ish websites which has tremendous capabilities and allows to drastically reduce the amount JS required for many types of web applications.

Mozilla is already at an advanced stage in working on an implementation. The current progress is available via an extension.

I'd like to see XForms support. It's a great technology for Ajax-ish websites which has tremendous capabilities and allows to drastically reduce the amount JS required for many types of web applications.

Mozilla is already at an advanced stage in working on an implementation. The current progress is available via an extension.

>If they could keep it, but change their ISP (either to broadband or to a dial-up service that
>doesn't suck quite as hard or b0rk their computer), then that might be the thing that gets 'em to switch.

You already can access your AOL email via another ISP. I have Comcast as my high speed, along
with their email. I also have an AOL account. The AOL account (using Comcast's high speed
connection) only costs $15/month and you can use Thunderbird to send and receive all your email
from all your AOL email accounts and all your Comcast email accounts.

Go read [How] "Can I read and send AOL e-mail using Thunderbird?" at

http://www.mozilla.org/support/thunderbird/faq

Share and Enjoy!

No need for an http proxy, the Mozilla networking library comes with built-in logging that can be turned on. For instruction see http://www.mozilla.org/projects/netlib/http/http-d ebugging.html

We really are trying to make it less of a religious thing. The whole browser space in general has traditionally been very religious.

(errr.. Add Ons... Change the name only because Microsoft copies the feature under a different name...?)

But... my experiences with the latest iterations of Firefox (both the 1.5 series as well as the 2 and 3 development series) have left much to desire. The biggest complaint is the incredible amount of memory the browser consumes - even without any extensions [...] and with a clean profile. If a browser manages to bring a 2 Ghz system with 768 MB to its knees in a mere half hour of browsing there is something wrong. Unfortunately this often-heard complaint does not seem to get the attention it deserves.

See, reports like this are why developers get jaded. Hundreds of people say, "use the browser for 30 minutes". Developers use the browser for days and don't experience the problem. Now what? The user is generally either unable or unwilling to get into the nitty gritty of real leak hunting, so nothing can be done. The developer gets frustrated, wondering where this problem is that he can't find.

Fortunately, David Baron wrote the Leak Monitor extension, that looks for a relatively common type of leak, which you can install, but it doesn't catch everything.

I'm not paying them so I don't have much right to complain, fair enough.

A lot of open source developers want you to think that as an excuse for their code sucking. But it's simply not true. You have every right to complain. In the case of Mozilla, they even have a complete system for people to complain, Bugzilla.

You have no expectation of them listening to your complaints, but you have every right to complain about problems with the application. The developers have every right to not pay attention - and in response, you have every right to not use their project.

Feedback is a very important part of an open source project. The idea that users have no right to complain because a project is open source is bogus - open source developers should appreciate complaints, because it's a sign that people want to improve their project!

So go ahead and complain about open source projects. They'll never improve if people don't complain. If the developers are too pig-headed to listen to their users, then the project will die as the users go elsewhere. Complaints are an important part of any development process, and open source doesn't get to be immune to complaints just because it's open source. Shoddy software is shoddy software, open source included.

If a browser manages to bring a 2 Ghz system with 768 MB to its knees in a mere half hour of browsing there is something wrong. Unfortunately this often-heard complaint does not seem to get the attention it deserves.

The day Netscape released the source to Navigator I compiled it and gazed in wonder at this 'real' browser I compiled on my Linux box. I followed the development of the Mozilla project from the failed start based on the old Navigator code via the slow-starting gecko-based suite all the way to the Mozilla suite. Then, suddenly, Firefox (under one if its many names) and Thunderbird appeared. They looked more modern than the Mozilla suite and individually had slightly better performance. I started using the threesome (Firefox, Thunderbird and the suite) next to eachother. For day-to-day browsing I used Firefox, for more involving things the Mozilla suite has always been more appropriate. I have also followed the development of Firefox (and to a lesser extent Thunderbird) closely, building local versions, testing nightlies, etc.

But... my experiences with the latest iterations of Firefox (both the 1.5 series as well as the 2 and 3 development series) have left much to desire. The biggest complaint is the incredible amount of memory the browser consumes - even without any extensions (errr.. Add Ons... Change the name only because Microsoft copies the feature under a different name...?) and with a clean profile. If a browser manages to bring a 2 Ghz system with 768 MB to its knees in a mere half hour of browsing there is something wrong. Unfortunately this often-heard complaint does not seem to get the attention it deserves. Firefox' development strategy being what it is there is not that much opportunity - other than by filing bugs - to influence priorities and design criteria.

So... lately I have switched more and more from using Firefox/Thunderbird to using the Seamonkey suite - the successor to the Mozilla suite. It still feels a bit more dated than Firefox and Thunderbird but it does offer much more in features while having a much smaller memory footprint. Add the Seafox theme and it looks quite a bit like Firefox/Thunderbird.

The way things look now I think Seamonkey will be my browser and mail app of preference. Should Firefox and Thunderbird ever run on top of XULrunner I might switch back but for now I have better things to do with my memory...

The day Netscape released the source to Navigator I compiled it and gazed in wonder at this 'real' browser I compiled on my Linux box. I followed the development of the Mozilla project from the failed start based on the old Navigator code via the slow-starting gecko-based suite all the way to the Mozilla suite. Then, suddenly, Firefox (under one if its many names) and Thunderbird appeared. They looked more modern than the Mozilla suite and individually had slightly better performance. I started using the threesome (Firefox, Thunderbird and the suite) next to eachother. For day-to-day browsing I used Firefox, for more involving things the Mozilla suite has always been more appropriate. I have also followed the development of Firefox (and to a lesser extent Thunderbird) closely, building local versions, testing nightlies, etc.

But... my experiences with the latest iterations of Firefox (both the 1.5 series as well as the 2 and 3 development series) have left much to desire. The biggest complaint is the incredible amount of memory the browser consumes - even without any extensions (errr.. Add Ons... Change the name only because Microsoft copies the feature under a different name...?) and with a clean profile. If a browser manages to bring a 2 Ghz system with 768 MB to its knees in a mere half hour of browsing there is something wrong. Unfortunately this often-heard complaint does not seem to get the attention it deserves. Firefox' development strategy being what it is there is not that much opportunity - other than by filing bugs - to influence priorities and design criteria.

So... lately I have switched more and more from using Firefox/Thunderbird to using the Seamonkey suite - the successor to the Mozilla suite. It still feels a bit more dated than Firefox and Thunderbird but it does offer much more in features while having a much smaller memory footprint. Add the Seafox theme and it looks quite a bit like Firefox/Thunderbird.

The way things look now I think Seamonkey will be my browser and mail app of preference. Should Firefox and Thunderbird ever run on top of XULrunner I might switch back but for now I have better things to do with my memory...

From everything that I've heard mentioned both here and on other sites, the biggest memory hog in Firefox is the Forecastfox extension. Once I uninstalled that, Firefox's footprint dropped down to the 30 megs or so that it's at now from the 70-ish that it was at. Granted, I haven't used said extension in quite a while, so it's possible that this problem has been fixed as well.

In fact, it does: http://www.mozilla.org/ports/os2/

Doesn't get much easier than this.

You can even have it transcode Google videos to different formats.

"All of this, along with some apparent recorded visits by US military and intelligence computers."

And the fun keeps on going now that the Wikipedia article for Eon8 has been nominated TWICE for deletion resulting in much flamage and sock puppetry by the SomethingAwful and YTMND crowd.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_fo r_deletion/Eon8_(2nd_nomination)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_fo r_deletion/Eon8

I found a Mozilla document about this issue.

http://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox:2.0_Institutional_ Deployment

They link to the Frontmotion MSI, so although it's not approved by Mozilla, they must think pretty highly of it. Also, please don't think my sibling poster's comment reflects the views of the entire open source community.

... and watch your browser's usage share plummet. :-p

Right. It's implemented in Firefox 1.5, but only on Windows.

I just tried Safari 2.0.3 and it doesn't support font-size-adjust.

It's worth pointing out, though, that although it's a seven year-old bug, at the time it was filed, it was an emulation of an Internet Explorer proprietary property, so it wasn't given much priority.

It's been added to CSS 2.1 drafts, but CSS 2.1 isn't yet a recommendation (it was a candidate recommendation for a while, but there were still problems with it, so it was moved back to working draft status).

If you want a bug you can legitimately moan about being old, try the seven year-old soft hyphen bug. Soft hyphens have actually been in HTML since 1995's HTML 2.0.

I don't see any ads. :-P

Sometimes I wish my code didn't need stupid hacks for unfixed 7 year old Firefox bugs either...
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9458

Grab the IETab extension, and set it to auto-render your intranet in the IE engine. I'm not sure it will use the IE7b3 engine, though. If it does, you'd have a "best-of-both-worlds" setup for your current situation.

I don't know about you but firefox is being a memory intensive program these days, it even crashes now and then for me. And opera is doesn't feel right on GNU/Linux (no native widget support). I suggest to you use Seamonkey http://www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/ until firefox developers start to use smart pointers or add a garbage collector.

Google has barely started. They're simply positioning their pieces right now. Their strategy is obviously a sneaky one: tiptoe up behind your opponents without drawing too much attention to yourself by openly beta-testing a variety of services, and then at the perfect moment, deliver the killing blow with the "kernel" of your plan that suddenly brings all these disparate services together into a nuke of integration. That kernel, for them, of course, is search.

What is search? It can be a lot of things, but in its finest form, it resembles what is popularly termed "AI". Can you imagine what Google could achieve by using search to suddenly unify all of its services? You get an email in Gmail about a picnic on the 23rd, and it's hyperlinked to a command that will put it in your Google Calendar. That's a simple scenario. Few seem to imagine search as an integration platform, like the GUI, but it is; it's not just for finding things.

I imagine the future of search to be a lot like how the ever-present computer voice in Star Trek could do almost anything for you. When computers are this sophisticated, what's the point of most GUIs? Just tell your computer what you want. GUIs can then be minimal and non-intrusive.

Now, the biggest complaint I hear about Google's services is that they have to be accessed online via a browser. Well, did you know that Firefox 3 is going to support the ability to run web applications offline?

-- random_blankspace attica ya-know-hoo dottius commius

http://tor.eff.org/ - distributed encrypted anonymous socks5 proxy client (and server, for those who do care), a successor to freenet
https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/2464/ - firefox extension that enables tor proxying only for urls that match user-defined patterns

At least the bleeding edge of open source browsers is a minefield ;)

The only way to really defeat phishing is to only use the web interface to start a transaction or to view information ... and require that the bank call the customer at the customer's phone number and verify that the transaction is authorized.

That's silly. There are perfectly reasonable means to defeat phishing already available. All that's required is a trusted path to a trusted component which verifies one's relationship to the site (in other words, a visible section of screen that the phisher can't alter in any way); this is what the pentame toolbar does. It's still vulernable to OS security breaches, but that's a far better than the current security models.

This is why I use the TargetAlert Firefox extension, it adds icons next to links indicating the files or effects they lead to.

Blatant plug of my own link: ChatZilla on XULRunner.

See also the "XULRunner Hall of Fame" on DevMo.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

BTW, here are relevant bug reports:

(Make sure you copy and paste them. Bugzilla doesn't allow referrals from Slashdot.)

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11773 0
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28325 7
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29709 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24307 8
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23131 3
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17462 9
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62278
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16008 5
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13171 9

Note how all of them discuss bindings to NATIVE widgets. The support has been there for YEARS, it's just played down in favor of XUL Themes in the main browser trunks for portability reasons.

As it so happens, the widgets are native. Mozilla exposes the underlying implementation. Which is why buttons look like Windows, Mac, or GTK+ buttons.

It reuses existing technologies instead of re-creating new ones. Javascript is very quick, depending on what you're doing. We're loading about 8k XML Object's in Javascript and it's only as slow as your bandwidth.

It uses CSS for style(look&feel), so your web guy can do it, or you can if you're familiar with it.

It has translation support built in if you wish to use it, nothing requires you to use it but using it is automatic, nothing to enable, no 3rd party libraries to include.

XUL itself(the XML UI files) are short, terse, and very easy to keep organized if you keep it split up with overlays(instead of a single file, which all languages have problems with).

It has a plugin interface built in. It's quick and easy to do a UI with it, if you know Javascript you're off pretty quickly, if you don't it's easy to pick up(until you get to the harder stuff). JavaScript is a real language, with Objects, Inheritance, Closures, a Garbage Collector, etc...

Hell, it runs Firefox and Thunderbird. AIM Triton is the same idea, different implementation(Boxely).

Making drastic changes to the UI is 10 minutes if you're just moving stuff around, sometimes less, rarely more. You can add themes to your app(Custom Branding for Clients? Not a problem, it's already built in). Again, translation is very little extra work. Client/Server is incredibly simple because of both JSON and E4X. We've got our app with a PHP backend and connecting them together is the simplest thing to do. Don't have to load up any extra libraries because you're dealing with XML, or any extra because you've got to work with XML-RPC.

JavaScript dev is much faster than C++ dev. If you need C++ dev, then you're at the wrong toolkit, although you can always XPCOM it.

I think you're questioning it as the end-all-be-all which it is not. It has it's problems, no comments in the xml code, although it's very straightforward and needing it is questionable. JavaScript and CSS comments are all there. Network connectivity is already finished for you. But it has it's problems, it's not the end all be all, but dev time is very quick, although it does have that lag when you're booting up a java app, but only 1/4 the time.

How do I spell Firefox? How do I abbreviate it?

        Firefox is spelled F-i-r-e-f-o-x - only the first letter capitalized (i.e. not FireFox, not Foxfire, FoxFire or whatever else a number of folk seem to think it to be called.) The preferred abbreviation is "Fx" or "fx".

Guys, give them a break, these guys are not a corporation or a 50,000 member foundation. I'm guessing it's a couple of guys who are trying to raise awareness. Who knows, maybe a designer will step up and help out instead of bitching them out.

https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/918/

Install NoScript to prevent Google from tracking which sites you visit and use Gimp.

Look for Google alternative. Say NO to Google Spyware.

P.S. Don't think it's important? Just wait until Google gets really squeezed on earnings. Then you'll see what evil means.

Agreed. Go vote for https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=98971 (note

Firefox and Flashblocker would have protected you.

OS X and Firefox with AdBlock and NoScript included for good measure == no worries here.

Still think Windows is [cheaper|easier|better|stronger|faster]?

OS X and Firefox with AdBlock and NoScript included for good measure == no worries here.

Still think Windows is [cheaper|easier|better|stronger|faster]?

I set Minimum Font size : 16

Me too. I use Mozilla, and read Slashdot using my own background colors & fonts with Javascript turned off. Works wonderfully (no Javascript kills the ads, too).

Actually, I'm quite pleased that Slashdot is fully functional with all the above changes.

You might want to try using the FlashBlock extension for Firefox.