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This would be the Pirate Parties that haven't any manifesto beyond "movies should be free"?

Strange claim, since it's very far from the truth :) I suggest going through the manifestos and policies of both the German Piratenpartei as well as the Swedish Pirate Party - both having been elected by voters into local and international parliaments.

German (in English): http://www.piratenpartei.de/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/parteiprogramm-englisch.pdf

Swedish: http://annatroberg.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Piratpartiets_principprogram.pdf
(to be updated with results from the autumn conference just held - see https://mote.piratpartiet.se/forumdisplay.php?f=825 for the results of individual motions and propositions)

In Germany, or better: in Berlin the Freifunk movement started like 10 years ago. The movement around mesh networking protocols spread all cross Europe and from there also to developing nations. The technology is available, the only remaining problems arise from liability risks. Berlin is going to launch a city-wide Wifi service soon. The Pirate Party strongly advocated for Piratenfreifunk, that is rebranded Freifunk technology. We also need to fight for good unlicensed spectrum. The Prague based OpenSpectrum Alliance does a great job to promote more access to spectrum and non-profit internet providers like Guifi.net advance customer services.

For the record in advance, I don't smoke pot. I don't enjoy being "slowed down" or not being able to think clearly (for the same reason, I'm very cautious with alcohol as well, and generally avoid it).

What drug can be consumed at a very high rate and not kill? I am betting your thinking of pot.

Personally, I'd love to watch someone TRY to overdose on LSD... 75 micrograms gets most people somewhat tripping; 200 micrograms is a good trip for an experienced user; 500 micrograms gets pretty much anyone to a point where they're unable to function (total loss of ego, awareness of world or self, etc); and the lethal dosage is assumed to be somewhere around 12 milligrams. That is, 24 times the amount that even a serious LSD user (such as myself) would consider extreme.

If you can get studies done by people who have nothing to gain by pot being legal or for it remain illegal you might have a chance. Those groups are the only ones who could deliver a clear unbiased result. Anyone else will have a biased result. All results from the biased groups for either side should be tossed. They have an agenda.

How's this one suit?

And while not a study, this is a pretty good related read for some "non potheads" trying to aim for the same thing.

http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/wiki/images/0/03/Parteiprogramm-englisch.pdf

This is the manifesto in english. The changes to this manifesto need 2/3 of votes on a party conference.

The statues are not available in english, so I'll post the translated German version:
  http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&ie=UTF8&twu=1&q=piratenpartei+grundsatzprogramm?sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A//wiki.piratenpartei.de/Bundessatzung%0A

As for the rest (positions, election program) please try to find it yourself or ask.

http://www.piratenpartei.de/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/parteiprogramm-englisch.pdf

They don't seem to have an overt foreign policy platform; but I'm going to take the wild guess that they aren't particularly hawkish.

Interesting to take the green example. Over here in Flanders the founding father of the Green party lamented more than a decade ago that his movement has been hijacked by extreme left activists to push their red agenda under the green flag. This week I read an article about the consolidated international pirate party. http://xandernieuws.punt.nl/?id=657895&r=1&tbl_archief Mixed with the free copying issue, which I would support, there were all sorts of neomarxist, anticapitalist and drug legalization agenda points. These varied from the mandatory left mantra of "open borders" and "free unemployment handouts, no work ethic required", even going as far as "legalize incest" http://www.piratenpartei.de/2012/04/13/piratenpartei-lehnt-inzestverbot-ab/ . Unfortunately, now they have left me no other option than to strongly oppose them, not because of the original founding ideal, but because of the unsavory red star package deal they have gotten themselves into. To put in to torrent terminology, there's some nasty left-wing spyware hitching along with the installer. Sad, really.

Excuse me? Lack of a proper program? How about this: http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Parteiprogramm This is in fact the PP's official stance on many issues beyond internet and copyright. It has been worked out and voted on in the process of many party congresses.

It is aimed at minimizing government involvement into some specific areas, but anything that is aimed at minimizing government involvement is anti-establishment and may just be a special case of libertarian movement.

"Libertarian", in modern English (and excluding groups such as libertarian socialisms, which are fringe even within the fringe libertarian movement), is a person who is against state/society intervention into and regulation of both social and economical activity.

All points that you've listed point towards them being "social libertarians". However, their economic policy - outside of curtailment of copyright and patents - is not a libertarian one by any measure, and, to the extent that it is fleshed out, in fact more left-leaning than anything. For example, some points straight from their program (I'm using Google to translate):

"Dismantling of private monopolies"

"Everyone has the right to free access to information and education. This is vital in a free democratic society to allow every person, whatever their social origins, the highest level of social participation. "

"The free access to education is in everyone's interest. Therefore, it is the responsibility of society as a whole, in the form of the state, a powerful and finance their infrastructure and educational purposes appropriate to make available free."

"Education fees of any kind will restrict the access to education and are therefore categorically reject. For this reason, the teaching aids is encouraged. This is the best way to establish that the use and creation of a free work of mediation of knowledge, and will be expanded."

"Everyone has the right to a secure existence and social participation. To respect human dignity and protect it is the greatest commandment of the Basic Law. A man can only live in dignity, if provided for his basic needs and social participation it is possible. "

"Since the goal is an income for livelihood for everyone, this should be guaranteed any income directly. Only by the dignity of every human being without exception secured."

They say a lot of things, but under Politics -> Copyright you find statements like:

Daher fordern wir, das nichtkommerzielle Kopieren, ZugÃnglichmachen, Speichern und Nutzen von Werken nicht nur zu legalisieren, sondern explizit zu fÃrdern, um die allgemeine Verfügbarkeit von Information, Wissen und Kultur zu verbessern, denn dies stellt eine essentielle Grundvoraussetzung für die soziale, technische und wirtschaftliche Weiterentwicklung unserer Gesellschaft dar.

Or in English (unofficial translation):

Therefore we demand that non-commercial copying, sharing, storing and use of works not only be legalized, but explicitly promoted to improve the overall availability of information, knowledge and culture, because this is a crucial prerequisite for the social, technical and economic development of our society.

I think there's a few copyright holders who would choke on that one. Also they want to built open, anonymous wifi networks and absolve the ISPs of all liability = free file sharing in practice. They have a very broad political program compared to the Swedish party, but they are no less radical when it comes to copyright. I do hope hey pass the 5% barrier in the national election in 2013, then it could get real fun (they had 2% in 2009 - more than 3x what the Swedish PP managed in their national election...)

"Pirate Parties around the world are one-issue parties"

This is incorrect. The scope of the Pirate Party movement differs from country to country. In countries like Sweden and Germany they evolved from being one-issue parties and worked out programs that cover a whole range of political issues, while their membership and electorate keep growing steadily. Here is the party program of the German Piratenpartei, for example: http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Parteiprogramm

You can't have a 'traditional' party right from the start, there need to be certain levels of momentum, manpower and support, for it to be able to branch out and compete with the established parties on their turf. The cool thing about new parties is that you can take part and contribute to shaping the program and course significantly, which is exactly what they need. If you agree with their general aims - contribute. Pirate Parties won't magically materialize out of thin air and change politics by people just waiting for them to do so.

What the Pirate Party stands for exactly depends on which party you're talking about. The German Pirate Party for example draws most of its support from the civil liberties, personal privacy and democratic reform movements. The copyright aspects are almost insignificant in comparison: There are four topics on the political agenda which rank higher than copyright and patent reform. Copyright is perceived as a vehicle for corporate control, so it's no surprise that the Pirate Party aims higher than just legalizing personal file sharing. (I am not a member of the Pirate Party and this is my opinion, not necessarily an official Pirate Party position.)

In Germany, a law was passed called Zugangserschwerungsgesetz. It said the Federal Criminal Police Office delivers secret list of blocked domains to the ISPs. After the elections in 2009 the government changed and even though the law has come into effect, the new coalition prevented the feds to give out the list. So de facto, Zugangserschwerungsgesetz has been rejected now.

This is partially the success of the German Pirate Party, which both thrived because of this law proposal (membership decupled in a few months) and forced a public discussion about this law (otherwise it'd just be rubber-stamped: "oh, this law is against kiddie porn. Good!"). It astonished me that the PP actually succeeded to bring common sense into the debate, because politicians often tend to turn of their brain when they hear "kiddie porn". Partially the success was also due to an online petition which had 134,000 signatures (which made it by far the most successful petition in German history).

It is also doubtful that the Zugangserschwerungsgesetz will pass German's highest court, the Federal Constitutional Court, which in the past has proven to value human rights (such as article 5 of Germany's constitution) very highly.

I googled on liquid democracy but did not find much detail.

You'll find lots of german sites on the topic, if you can read german, here's a few links:

http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Liquid_Democracy
http://wiki.liqd.net/Main_Page

German Pirate Party gets some attention, though it could be more. They have been successful this far, because they address topics that major parties ignore (internet cencorship, civil rights, privacy, government transparency, open access, copyright, patents, ...). They got 0.9% at European Parliament election in June and now they got 2% in federal elections. Their membership number is exploding (currently almost 10,000, graph).
Even though some pirates hoped for a better result, 2% is absolutely astonishing. If their success continues (and polls show that PP has 13% of all first-time voters, some time is working for us), they may very well be in the Bundestag (parliament) in four years. By comparison, Green party had 1.5% in its first federal election in 1980 and since the following election, they are represented in the Bundestag with constantly over 5%.

German Pirate Party gets some attention, though it could be more. They have been successful this far, because they address topics that major parties ignore (internet cencorship, civil rights, privacy, government transparency, open access, copyright, patents, ...). They got 0.9% at European Parliament election in June and now they got 2% in federal elections. Their membership number is exploding (currently almost 10,000, graph).
Even though some pirates hoped for a better result, 2% is absolutely astonishing. If their success continues (and polls show that PP has 13% of all first-time voters, some time is working for us), they may very well be in the Bundestag (parliament) in four years. By comparison, Green party had 1.5% in its first federal election in 1980 and since the following election, they are represented in the Bundestag with constantly over 5%.

• Feeling safe(r) when and where they are not, because of the false promise of BB to be watching (over) them.
• Mostly turning a blind eye on crime (and its victims), as the all-seeing eye of BB and/or "someone (else)" will surely take care of it.
• Having learned from an early age to show only herd mentality out of preference falsification in their desperate attempts to try and please the watchmen and be seen to obey "like every other good citizen".
• In the rare instances of courage, not fleeing insurmountable dangers out of the feeling that someone has got to be watching and will send backup any moment now.

Interestingly in Europe after a series of dreadful incidents on live video, this is finally being debated on the eve of general elections: http://www.piratenpartei.de/node/920/29268#comment-29268 - as at the other end of the line, in a situation room (that may be on the next floor or station, and yet too) far away, officers will have to watch events unfold and wish in vain to finally be out there with a gun again (or have sufficient forces to dispatch), e.g. to stop that attacker they can only videotape and helplessly watch wreak havoc on screen.

It's already working in germany.

The piratenpartei there got just approved to be part of national elections, which will take place in about 2 months in 15 states. After the german government had decided on a stupid domain-blocking scheme against (so they say) child porn, the piratenpartei got 0.7% at the european elections a short while ago.

The Spiegel (an important german weakly) and other media are reporting about the issue and discussion about regulation of the net is starting in the mainstream media and also within the various parties, forcing the parties to develop a clear position on things before election.

Up until recently the issue was not taken seriously by the german parties and security freaks like Wolfgang Schaeuble were allowed to install more and more legislation to control and observe citizens more closely and broadly (his party is actually using the following slogan in it's election campaign: "we're strong enough for both freedom _and_ security", which is of course bullshit, as we all know (Jefferson anyone)).

So yes, what the UK Pirate Party is trying to do is very much viable and makes sense. It'll raise awareness of the political cast to a problem unsolved and to the fact that people will not let their freedom be taken away so easily.

The big parties of the German government once again proved that they're just doing what they want and not what the citizens want! That's why I'm going to vote for the Piratenpartei (Pirate party) on September 27.

For what it's worth, the FDP (3rd/4th strongest political party) voted unanimously against the censorship law and has made digital freedom in general one of the major points of their campaign platform for the election this year.

TYPICAL GERMAN politics, come up with a screwy law, and make it even more screwy! So I guess what I can take from this is that child porn is ok to see at a university, but not a corporation or large ISP... Yeah that makes sense, really does...

I guess they introduced these exceptions because implementing the censorship infrastructure on the ISP side takes a great deal of time & money. Obviously only big ISPs can afford that ;)

The big parties of the German government once again proved that they're just doing what they want and not what the citizens want! That's why I'm going to vote for the Piratenpartei (Pirate party) on September 27.

You are oversimplifying the goals. There's more to it. Or you just repeat what the MSM is reporting about the Pirate Party. But the MSM is in fear right now because they have the most to lose from a success of the Pirate Parties. Here's the program of the German Piratenpartei: http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Bundestagswahlprogramm_Kernthemen

It's planned for tomorrow - details here: http://piratenpartei.de/node/773

This is yet another slew of ultra-pointless pre-election gibberish. Extremely violent videogames such as Manhunt are allready factually banned for public sale and sale to minors in Germany, based on laws existing since the dawn of the republic.

The rubbish on Computers, Videogames and the Internet that the ruling class in Germany has been putting out in recent years has reached staggering heights that are compareable to the situation in the US.

I for one am going to send in my support signature for the Piratenpartei (German branch of the Pirate Party) and do an all out vote for them whenever the occasion arises. If all German INet savy people do that, we could have the 5% hurdle for the Bundestag in no time. That'll teach them.

And if you are german, how about pitching in? Your signature paves the way to the Bundestag. For once get off your fat lazy unpolitical geek ass and help roll Schäuble and Zensursula straight out of office. And screw the Greens (Grüne) on this one! Don't forget that Tritin and Fischer had a big hand in passing that Internet law a few years back ('Gesetz zum verbesserten Schutz des Urheberrechtes im Internet' aka 'German DMCA')!

Beweg' Deinen Arsch und tu' was! (visit links above)

My 2 Euros.

The German Piratenpartei (Pirate Party) actually has quite a full list of policies they're presenting for the EU elections:
http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/EU-Wahlprogramm_2009
Sorry there's no English version but it covers some quite broad areas such as:
* Nationalisation of all infrastructure where there's a natural monopoly (it mentions telecoms and the power grid)
* EU-wide health insurance
* Expansion of nuclear power
* Expansion of public transport
* A ban on GM food crops
* A reduction in the powers of the EU (in favour of national governments)

Rumour has it in Sweden that the german Pirate Party is also growing in numbers.

As a member of the swedish Pirate Party I would like to ask any german /.:ers to at least visit their site and just read.

Changing things is not as difficult as the other parties would have you believe. People just have to realize that they can really win. Your opponents would love to win on walk-over, so don't let them.

The swedish Pirate Party has moved up from 7th place in membership numbers to 4th place. After slowly moving into the media spotlight for a few years, this latest shift took 3 days. We will most likely be taking over 3:rd spot in a few weeks time. People are finally starting to understand that things can change.

Think about that if you live in Germany or the rest of Europe:
* Things can change
* It is up to you to switch to the Pirate Party
* Don't give up at the first setback.

Did you know there is a Pirate Party in the US as well?

There are currently 7 registered pirate parties in europe, namely in Austria, Denmark, Germany, Finland, Poland, Spain and Sweden. Some more are in the process of founding/achieving formal acknowledgement. See http://www.pp-international.net/ or if you prefer a colored map http://piratenpartei.de/navigation/partei/piratenparteien-weltweit (black: formally recognized; blue: active but not yet formally recognized; red: planned)

That's true. I have tried to Google, but that is not really yielding satisfying results. I have come across several sites mentioning backdoors in the protocol or the program exploitable by government or someone else. Those are just rumours. However, via the Skype wiki I found a website detailing the leaking of a German report to the German 'Piraten Partei'. I have read it and it seems to be a quote of sorts for "Skype-Capture-Software" and several options, including SSL decoding and the installation of it all. It also mentions two proxy-servers to hide their own IP adresses, but there is no price given. So all in all, this -- as far as I could find -- is the most concrete evidence supporting that Skype is in fact not secure.

Probably a bit better than the translated page:
http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Press_release_2008-09-17

Also check out this mail to the Pirate Party International list:
http://lists.pirateweb.net/pipermail/pp.international.general/2008-September/001514.html

• Austria
• Belgium
• France
• Germany
• Italy
• Poland
• Russia
• Spain
• Sweden
• USA

kiddie porn, terrorism and copyright aside:

as far as I understand TOR - this whole network exists for users to remain absolutely anonymous. because of many many many proxies there should nowhere be evidence for who did what (correct me if I'm wrong)

SO if there is no evidence at all for any special activity, then this must mean that the police seized the servers just because they suspected the owners of doing illegal activities, based on nothing but the fact that they used anonymization software...
BUT in germany it is illegal for the police to raid a house without a strong suspicion (and I don't think "using anonymization software" is a strong reason - yepp, asked my lawyer, using anonymization software wouldn't even hold as indication

SO I'd say this whole raid was illegal...
and it's just another reason for me to vote the german pirate-party next time http://piratenpartei.de/