Slashdot Mirror
Letter to the Community on Andover/VA Merger
The letter from Larry Augustin and Bruce Twickler:
The Internet is the original free software application. This has been repeated so often we can easily think of it as an empty truism. It's not. It's a rich, vital, and growing truth that still defines the way Linux companies do business today.
Linux flourished because it was born into the Internet world. This was a world of global, instantaneous communication, a world in which a developer community could explode from dozens to hundreds in a matter of weeks, and from hundreds to millions within a few years. That vibrant community made possible the incubator we know now as the open source development model.
But Linux also flourished because the Internet into which it was born was a small enough place for Linus' voice to be heard. The Internet of 1991 had fewer developers. Those developers had little difficulty finding each other.
Today's Internet is a vast place. Whether it will be a vast resource or a vast obstacle depends on our ability as developers to organize. We need a place to bring people together, to enable developers to find one another. But to call it a portal greatly understates the challenge. We're aiming for nothing less than the hub of services that accellerate and empower the next generation of open source development. We need a gathering place to:
- enable open source developers to reach one another
- create the forums where the open source model will evolve
- define and proclaim our values as a community
- drive open source to the cutting edge of future software develoment
Bringing together Andover.net with VA Linux's Open Source Infrastructure Business Unit gives us a great opportunity to empower open source's most important community sites. We are also bringing their story full circle. Themes, Freshmeat, and Slashdot each started as community sites run on an all volunteer basis. We're giving them an opportunity to work together once again. More than that, we're giving them the resources to play an enduring central role. By bring Andover together with VA, we're assuring the future of these important community sites.
This group is a separate business unit, because it will live independently from VA's core systems business. VA has proven this can be done in Linux.com and SourceForge today. Andover too: Slashdot never stopped running articles about SourceForge even while Andover was building Server 51. What matters to the community gets covered, regardless of where it comes from.
In this new structure, the VA sites will plug into the Andover management team, and the whole group will report to Larry Augustin directly.
We're here to serve the open source community. Period. If we ever fail or fall short in that mission, please don't hesitate to remind us. Thanks in advance.
Larry Augustin, CEO, VA Linux Systems (lma@valinux.com)
Bruce Twickler, CEO, Andover.net (bruce@andover.net)
Yes, but Oracle is expensive commercial software, and to run a high-performance Oracle backend they would have to hire someone with experience developing high performance apps on Oracle. That would entirely change the 'held together with spit, chewing gum, and perl' nature of Slashdot.
Did someone say unfair corporate domain dispute? Kinda brings me back to the etoys fiasco (yes, you can call slashdot/andover/valinux a corporation)
"From CmdrTaco's irritability, the way i've heard people like you from /. talk recently, it's beginning to get very, very, hard to believe you when you say 'We care about what we do.' or that the stories you post aren't at all influenced by andover and soon/now VA linux."</i></b>
More and more interesting, isn't it?
VA has made a wise decision in purchasing Andover.net and Slashdot is probably a big reason behind it, but from a community standpoint, why are we complaining? We can now count on Slashdot, Freshmeat, SourceForge and Linux.com to be there and be a resource for all of us to use, plus Rob and Jeff have made sure that they have continued to keep their rights in publishing material in the way that they have in the past. Bringing it all together is the key of keeping the Linux community growing and helping each other. This is the reason that I personally read slashdot and it is a great thing to have for such a large user base.
"Slashdot performance, well... sucks. Poor response times. Site just not responding for minutes or tens-of-minutes at a time."
/. is a poster child for Apache downtime.
This is particularly funny given the glee they take in talking about how much "downtime" IIS has... I wonder what they will do when
&sign($AC[0]);
Who was the idiot who set this Offtopic?!? This is one of the most -ON- topic posts you'll find here!
Fools.......
yes, slashdot will still be made up of natalie portman, first-post-mastahs and carpe tunnel injuries!!!!
--Sewgemaster
Tell that to the fucker with the 12 guage against my tmeple who makes me read Slashdot 24 hours a day! I'm a fucking plumber for god's sake... open source to me is when ther are no cadavers stuck to the grill up at the resevoir.
In short if you don't trust that Rob and his gang really are controlling this site then you haven't been paying attention.
I've been trying, but it's hard to concentrate WHEN THERE IS A FUCKING 12 GUAGE AGAINST YOUR HEAD!
Ed
When is CmdrTaco going to announce that he is a Linux evangelist paid for by VA?
This seems like a clear case of VA buying their own spin doctors. And Rob has a clear incentive to keep the stories upbeat in regards to VA, its stock price is his stock price.
So much for honesty in journalism. Is it really journalism if you RE-report the news?
Please rename to slashdot.com
Now that the most important information channels in the Linux community (Freshmeat and Slashdot) are controlled by public corporations, and now that VA is trying to co-opt developers who aren't smart enough to make their own web sites onto putting their projects on source forge, it's all over for Linux. Time to switch to BSD!
leq
*chuckle*
Yup, the lower the account number, the bigger the cock. That is why I post as an AC, because AC's were here before accounts and Karma whores, so ANONYMOUS COWARDS HAVE THE FATTEST DICKS OF ALL!
Ha, I would hack my copy of mozilla to tell you I
was running lynx on FreeBSD, and then you would
let me in because you would think that I was cool
because I wasn't mainstream, and then I'd tell
you about the good old days when we just looked
at the rawbitstream coming in and surfed by
flicking DIP switches, and then you would think I
was really cool, and you would make me your
leader and things would be good, but then in a
year or so, I would admit that I was running
Win2000 and that I had lied, and the people would
think "if they can penetrate us that deep, they
can be anywhere" and they would lose faith and
everyone would cry and go back to their day jobs
having realized that Kurt Gray, with his huge
UID 935 sized COCK had been wrong to ban
windows users, and some people would probably
cry, and there would be a few suicides, but in
the end life would go on.
define "large" for me.
... sorry, couldn't resist.
large (lärj)
adj. larger, largest. Abbr. L, L., lg., lge.
1. Of greater than average size, extent, quantity, or amount; big.
2. Of greater than average scope, breadth, or capacity; comprehensive.
3. Important; significant: had a large role in the negotiations; a large producer of paper goods.
4.
a. Understanding and tolerant; liberal: a large and generous spirit.
b. Of great magnitude or intensity; grand: "a rigid resistance to the large emotions" (Stephen Koch).
5.
a. Pretentious; boastful. Used of speech or manners.
b. Obsolete. Gross; coarse. Used of speech or language.
6. Nautical. Favorable. Used of a wind.
This guy is crazy! He keeps telling me he wants his $70k back. I don't know what the hell he's talking about. All he says is his name is Porter and he wants his money back. WHAT MONEY!? Somebody help me! Contact the Syndicate!
A story says that VA paid 800 million dollars for Slashdot, and stockholder's WILL require that it be a good investment or you WILL see lawsuits coming. They did it to Boot magazine, used to be a great place for information, now, it's all just ads and fluff. My predictions: Slashdot will fade into oblivion. CmdTaco and others will become millionaires, and leave the company (maybe start another good website).
I like this guy! You tell them, dude. Some of the people in here are plainly idiotic. It's nice to see someone engage in Straight Talk.
No way dude. You can't have a "natural" score above 2 unless you cheat at the console.
That's true no matter how much karma you get.
if you're a programmer, might I suggest www.advogato.org? Its quite good. Perhaps a sister site with more user oriented content would complement advogato, and provide the non-commercial news/community site we're looking for.
I would have agreed with you, except slashdot has already proven that they are more than willing to quietly bend over for a few bucks. Or do you think the freshmeat/slashdot/X10.com "advertising as top story" deal was just because scoop and taco wanted to do something kind for X10.com out of the goodness of their hearts?
Slashdot is a corporation now, and it will obviously act accordingly. Nothing wrong with that, but you need to take that into consideration when evaluating things you read here (just as you should with ANY news source).
This is a good point. Since Malda lost control of his company when he sold out to Andover, and further lost control to the board and shareholders when Andover went public, this transaction could have taken place without his consent. We are talking about publicly traded companies here. Typically the charter of public company is to benefit the shareholders, not to spread warm fuzzies. How much voting power could he and/or Hemos have?
Ahh hell when it gets down to it, its all about money anyway. I would have done the same thing in his shoes. I would be pretty happy with what slashdot has accomplished up to this point. I'd probably just let my options vest and take some time figure what I want to do next. I mean how many years can you run a web site anyway?
Yep a lot has changed in the past couple year.
Rob, she's a breakin' up. I can feel it slipping through your fingers. Time to consider the vest and run strategy. You can't hold onto the past forever.
One of these day's I'll dig out my password.
I'd Nearly Sell my soul (Forgive me Father) to work for an ethical company. Having worked for the Likes of AT&T (now NCR), GE Capital, and another Large Multinational I won't name.
I can say that it's hard, damn hard to find a company that actually has a *soul*.
R&D is always scrutinized, employee empowerment suspect (and usually just plain ignored) and us IT guys looked at like we're stealing the companies last dime when we ask for funding.
Sigh....
time to go browse geekfinder...
Tadghe.
Themes, Freshmeat, and Slashdot each started as community sites run on an all volunteer basis. Yes, in other words: "Ha-ha. We're making money off other people's work now."
I've been reading /. less and less lately, and now I'm out of here. Yes no one is "holding a gun to my head" to read this, and I'm not going to. Andover was a media company. VA is a hardware company. We're in a whole new game now.
I have lost my religion. Long gone is beat up Volvo that adorned the "it's not for breakfast anymore" bumper sticker I bought at computer literacy -- or fatbrain.com as they call themselves now. The idealism of my college years is becoming a distant memory. I use and support free software because it makes good business sense. Yep it's all about the almighty dollar boys and girls.
This is most important thread in whole freakin' discussion. Malda can't agree with this decision. If has agreed then there is only on reason. There is absolutly no way he can maintain his integrity now. It will always be suspect.
/.
$$$$$
I'm so done with done with
God, when will this moronic first-posting frenzy stop? "Wit is the epitaph of an emotion." -Nietzsche
it all seems sad. Why not spend some of the billions on improving linux. or Buy a commercial advertising linux to the masses or something if you want to dump some of that cash.
A cheap attempt to buy "the community" no other possible explaination.
oh look, something negative about VALinux, wonder if I'll get moderated to troll now? no change... heh. sure.
rant
I feel much better now
IIRC slashdot is _already_ running on VA hardware, and has been for some time.
Geez, how many times a day can Slashdot post an Andover/VA Linux piece? Nothing will change when Slashdot is bought? Think again! Before Slashdot was bought, rarely was there an article about Andover.net or VA Linux. Now that money has changed hands, stories galore.
Can someone spell, S E L L O U T ?
I think a lot of us are getting sick of this.
start a new site, hell even base it on the /. code, and if it's better, we'll go there.
Hmmm... that's up 260% in less than 2 months... OK, so it's down from the 12/9/99 open of $300, but most investors I know wouldn't be too disappointed in +260% in 53 days. (I'd be happy. I wanted in, but E*TRADE wouldn't do it, so I'm just an outsider looking in.)
The rest isn't really a direct response to Animats' posting, but it's been building up in me as I've been reading all the other posts about the imminent demise of the editorial integrity of /.
Sigh. Why do some people assume that what's good for a business is bad for the (your name here) community? Why is anyone w/ a mortgage and the corresponding paycheck a "suit"? Why is someone who is successful instantly distrusted? I suppose Gates & Co. had a lot to do with this, but I'd like to think he's more the exception than the rule.
I program computers. I get paid for it. If I didn't, I'd be waiting tables or fixing cars or washing dishes (and getting paid for that).
You don't have to turn your bullshit detectors completely off, but a little trust and hope ain't always a bad thing.
I'd refuse also, in order to give the community companies a lift or rather an advantage over the big guys. I'm a strong believer in @ least letting people compete. I heard a Wall Street analyst say VA was not worth buying solely because IBM was larger. I debated and said "The success of VA is heavily reliant on gaining acceptance by those in this field. Not just companies who need hardware with Linux." Companies listen to the community as to what to expect and to where to buy because we are the ones to introduce this to them in first-place. ] Quality is as quality does... -- Bill Gates
That's because he ran a little SQL on the slash db to make himself a karma whore.
So shut up & get to work developing it already.
if slashdot is so great to valinux, how come he didn't answer the interview they sent him?
Maybe VA can find moderators that can think.
Another example of moderators sans clue.
I thought that was just me.
we need a new site run by the fans for the fans with no corporate interests "peeing in the punch"
This place contradicts it's own existance now.
LOL hehe 8)
Wow, this is an excellent point. Time to moderate this one up.
The posters against business and open source artn't into open source.
The posters against VA Linux must hate open source cos this one company has given a lot to us.
SourceForge is excellent and everything they have done has been good.
I am posting anon as this sort of thing looks like trolling to alot of mods, but wake up smell the coffee VA are paying wages to hackers.
dear bruce twicker: please broker a merger between my pants and a bowl of hot grits. thank you.
There is some prior bias towards VA as I know that IBM offered to send the guys some nice hardware and they flat out refused.
IMHO Slashdot is no more.
Just because VA sells Linux stuff, why should they be monopolizing traffic? It gives them a disproportionate voice.
It looks like Red Hat, Corel, and VA Linux will be cornering the Linux market - consolidating to three major players in the US in a few month's time. Sheesh.
I the subject `Usenet dying' I told ya that some folks are POLLUTING the internet.
So them VA/Andover people took my message seriously and are doing something about it!
Good move!
The next move is:
Establish private (but open) internets over the current internet.
For example all the linux distributions could throw PPP links over each other and make their own TCP/IP with 172.16.xx.xx addresses. This `net over the net' will be clean, undestryoable (since it doesn't have physical connections - if you change provider you simple announce your new real-IP), and nice like the good old days.
Don't fool yourself. That's what microsloth would do anyway. Make their own companies-network which is not like the `Dirty Internet'. Then you company will just have to join the microsloth private companies network...
I deserve my score:10000 for the brave anonymous.
Technically, any time one company buys another company and integrates the operations of the two companies, it is a merger of two companies. The term "buyout" refers to a merger in which one company is much larger and wealthier than the other, and dominates the post-merger new company. VA did buy out Andover, but the term "merger" still applies.
-God
Yah, but Kurt has always had that special +2 bonus. He just started posting crap with his bonus one day - Before he even really knew anything about slashdot.
Yeah? And how many ads for the Superbowl on ABC did you see on Fox?
Hi Kurt, what a wonderful representation of your company. I also really dig that automatic +2 bonus that you have on all of your posts. Even the posts that would easily be considered "Flamebait" or "Troll". This is the kind attitude that the slashdot readers as a whole hate. Thanks for telling the truth.
Larry Augustine, is on Board of Directors of VA. He must by law maximize his shareholders value. If he can use slashdot to do this he must BY LAW or he may have a law suite on his hands.
Therefore, slashdot is NOT independent of VA no matter what any contract says. If a shareholder finds out that slashdot is helping competitors by posting press releases on VA equipment run by VA employees, then they have a right to sue VA.
The people who decide what stories get posted on slashdot have incredible power in the market. Selective rejection of VA competitiors will ALWAYS BE ASSUMED unless every part of slashdot is opened up (i.e story submission queues). But then VA must make tha case that this serveres to maximize shreholder value.
UNTIL SHASHDOT TAKES STEPS TO ENSURE OPEN REVIEW OF STORIES, THEY CAN BE CONSIDERED NOTHING LESS THAN A SHILL FOR VA
Posted anonymously so I do not get fired.
Good Point!
Is this true? I had no idea. (If true, I've been missing out on something I thought wasn't worth the bother to me (or my readers).) Those in-the-know please confirm and give us some better numbers and maybe a little info on the red tape and other headaches involved in setting things up.
"In the future you guys will be under a LOT of pressure to post positive things about VA"
/. has been buvkling to pressure for a while now.
This is already true. No offense, but if we ignore the "trust us blindly" postings, it becomes clear that
Their editorial integrity is toast - of course, they were ALWAYS seriously biased (anti MS and anti Intel), but it has become pretty clear they are now fully in pursuit of the best for their corporate masters.
Just keep an eye on it... you'll see.
&sign($AC[0]);
This is why Usenet is a Good Thing. Nobody "owns" it. Nobody can buy it.
That post brings up an interesting fact that dosen't seem to have been broached yet. How much are CmdrTaco and Hemos worth ? Not as in how much cash do they have in the bank..but as site developers ? The greater challange may not be from V/Andover but the fact that Rob & Co. are now a proven site development team. Look around at the main "name" players in Linux/ Open Source. Once they were exposed to the business world, they all used their talents to further their personal career. ( Note : THIS IS NOT A BAD THING ) How long till some publishing VC comes a'knockin'with a wad of cash to lure Rob & Co. away to start a new site for a different audience. Face it.. the name Rob Malda is worth money.. or will be soon . Personally I am keeping my original Password E-mail from Rob in hopes of listing it on E-bay.
Yeesh. Looky here: First, they get to see who's doing what; don't you think that has something to do with who they hire? They see the smart people first, and quietly send a "that was cool, maybe you wanna work with us, ne?" Second, note yesterday's Sourceforge comments where they own the compilation copyright on the fora.
VA's cool, they even carry *BSD stuff on their servers.
Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap.
"3) No, I DO have less of a guarantee. Corporate-ownership has ruined many a good thing in the past, therefore there is reason to doubt that corporate-ownership in the present case will be a good thing. Without out something to counteract that doubt we feel more uneasy. A guarantee is only as good as the holder feels about it."
/. in the past - that corporate ownership of something is INHERENTLY bad. That corporations will ALWAYS work to the detriment of the "common man".
It has been a point of faith - feuled by
It is interesting that now that they are firmly embedded in the corporate machine - driving nice, shiny new cars, that this is somehow no longer true.
All we have to do is "trust them".
Right.
&sign($AC[0]);
In fact you've got considerably more than what Rob started with, because you even get to use Rob's code.
I enjoy /., but I am under no delusion that I somehow own it. If I want to own something then I put work into it.
How much real freedom are we expected to think still exists when the reality of where your corporate chain of command runs through is so widely known? Would a true report that over 50% of VA coders use some kind of illegal drug get posted? Tech articles criticizing VA or bad financial reports aren't the only issue here.
What summed it up best was the exchange at LinuxWorld when you told VA you wanted that huge flat-panel. Everyone laughed, but in the end you now know who the check is signed by, and it's a stupid horse that doesn't consider where it's food is coming from.
It's not that we expect things to be overtly different for VA, but even that implied (admit it or not, it doesn't matter, it's obviously still there) filter should and does make some of us feel uneasy.
Do slashdot, yourself, and (in the end) VA a big favor and (at least for an initial period... one not related to an IPO for a change) by being overly critical of them for a time. Any issues VA has with this can come out into reality now while things are still fresh in everyone's mind (like the $1e9 he spent in Larry's mind)
If VA says nothing, you've gotten a little respect back from your readers and ensured smoother roads in the future. If VA pipes up, you'll be overly aware of the coffin your cash has built for what was left of your editorial soul.
FWIW (to ppl reading this) I do have an account but don't want to bother with the procmail recipe to filter out the flames this will cause.
Somebody had best do some tampering. /. has several glaring problems, as I see it (in no particular order):
And those are just off the top of my head.
These kinds of things were acceptable, and quite understandable, when /. was a part-time hobby thing run by some college kids in their spare time. But why Andover continued to countenance it long past its acquisition of /. is rather puzzling.
If VA continues to abide by it, it will be even more puzzling.
As I recall from quite a while ago (pre Andover/VA IPO's and /. being sucked up) VA donated the current server and associated hardware.
rodent...
rodent...
Tactical nuclear weapons are a viable alternative!
Now that VA owns /. and has somewhere around 100 million dollars. /. has been named as a John Doe defendant in the DVDCCA vs The World lawsuit. Will VA join the community in the fight against the Media Monopolies? What about a counter-suit, they seem quite populair with american businesses.
I'm sorry, but preexisting contracts take priority over Augustin's obligation to make money for shareholders. He's required by law to make money for the shareholders, but he is NOT allowed to break any laws/contracts in the process.
In addition, Augustin can make a clear case that interfering with Slashdot will be detrimental to VA, as any interference will destroy the site and nullify its value.
Lastly, at IPO time companies can specifically specify things they will not do to make money. Not doing those things is legal because the investors know what they're getting into. Sorry if I'm not giving too many details here, but I believe RedHat specified in their IPO that they will stick to open-source, and if a shareholder has a problem with that, too bad. (Among other things...)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
- No anonymous posting. Period.
- All Windows clients would be blocked.
- Flames would not only be scored down but deleted.
Am I unprofessional? Yeah probably. I'm only a programmer here so relax. In case you can't tell I have no influence over this web site. I'm a flamer goofing off at work like you. So mark me down. Tell me to get back to work? What are you doing that's do important?I'm done flaming for today. Back to work. Keep watching the skies. I'll take the +1 bonus off this comment to make at least a few whiners a little more happy.
What has happened is I've been reading Slashdot for the past few years (not I'm not trying to brag -- just offering my perspective) and more and people seem to be whining about how biased the content is since Andover bought the site and I just don't see it. I'm was sitting at our booth at LinuxWorld watching people ask Rob the same questions he has already answered in the FAQ (ie. why don't you make the submission queue public?), and I just don't have the zen patience Rob does. I'm sorry and you're right.
Overall I believe in straight talk and and if I'm out of line then please mark me down and I'll get the hint.
These aren't conspiracy theories, they are the lines between the lines in press releases. If someone doesn't trust/believe you, they don't trust/believe you. It's really very simple in that respect.
/. talk recently, it's beginning to get very, very, hard to believe you when you say 'We care about what we do.' or that the stories you post aren't at all influenced by andover and soon/now VA linux.
/. than to you, Kurt.
From CmdrTaco's irritability, the way i've heard people like you from
As much as I enjoy a good old "Love it or Leave it." Statement, I must refute you and remind you that the reason one would mention that he or she feels the quality of the stories has declined is because they care to some degree.
Yes, bots suck, but lets face it, compared to alot of sites you don't have to deal with half as much spammy DoS type crap. (I Imagine Microsoft, yahoo, and Viacom's various congolmerates get more of that crap than you guys do.) Theres no point in complaining about something that comes with the territory. That goes more for people who complain about lag to
Next, you are not Authors, you are editors. There is a large diffrence, and trust me, you are not an author unless you actually write something, not just edit things people submit. By the fourth paragraph I must say that your writing has totally collapsed to a point where it is hard to understand you. Concidently there is always something a parent company can do when a media outlet spreads crap about the parent company. I find it hard to believe that there are no options on your contract that would allow andover or VA Linux to simply pay you a percentage of your contract and kick you out of the Andover/VA Linux borg.
In conclusion, Control via being your pipeline (i.e. you may be inclined not to post a story about VA Linux because that would hurt your earnings indirectly) is still control. To say that VA Linux/Andover or their money has no control over you whatsoever is a blatant lie. Theres nothing wrong with that, just don't try to pretend you're more saintly than you are.
-[ World domination - rains.net ]-
If that happens, then _VA_ has broken the contract, and slashdot reverts to CmdrTaco and Hemos. Remember, both parties have to honor the deal, or it becomes (NULL && (void *)).
(forgive the bad attempt C-geek humor, there...)
If only "common" sense was actually that common...
MySQL may not handle large databases as well, but it's a whole lot faster than Oracle. This is NOT intended as a dig at Oracle - it's good at what it does, but for quick-response database service for Web sites, it has way too much overhead. For data warehousing, full SQL-92 support, etc., Oracle's great - but it's not as good for the backend to a Web site... Right tool for the job. That's all I can say about it.
Sam: "That was needlessly cryptic."
Max: "I'd be peeing my pants if I wore any!"
Just thought I'd mention, Freshmeat and SourceForge don't even cover the same sort of territory - that's what Server 51 (afaik) is supposed to do: provide a hosting platform for open-source projects. Figured someone should make the point...
Sam: "That was needlessly cryptic."
Max: "I'd be peeing my pants if I wore any!"
Wow. What are you, around 12 years old?
Get over it. Get over this. Ignore it and move on. Just please stop littering your +2 flames into the discussion.
--
I'm not convinced, and being told about the wonderful fruits of the internet doesn't make me think that the CEO's are hip and with it.
The consequences of the Andover sellout have already been felt. When Appwatch opened up they were blackballed by slashdot. Appwatch competes with freshmeat, but that doesn't mean that freshmeat should be the endorsed site from slashdot.
I think someone this weekend had a great idea with regard to allowing all posts to be seen and voted on. I challenge the uber-moderators of slashdot to really open and let the readers vote on the stories which matter to them, along with being able to read what is rejected.
-- Solaris Central - http://w
you would think there would be enough money to hire a copy editor/proofreader. TO graduate from an ordinary amateur news digest to a credible and profesisonal news site, Slashdot severely needs to do something about spelling and grammar.
I must admit, it /does/ sound good, VA seems to care, and Andover has already pretty much proven that they have a hands off approach. I really don't think we have much to worry about, besides, if we don't like what we see here we can also go to another site right? right.
Stop going to the pub at lunchtimes, Kurt. You know you can't handle it. Just because you're old enough to drink alcohol doesn't mean you have to: it's not big and it's not clever. OK?
I have never had trouble getting the source code for mysql.
That does not make it open source.
Besides, I was not claiming whether MySQL is better or worse than Oracle, just pointing out the fact that MySQL is not open source.
--
bgphints - internet routing news, hints and ti
Note the one now appearing in the index was _not_ the original post of the article - look at the posted time...10:16 AM whereas the original here was posted at 9.11am.
Ie at it was pulled then reposted. At the time I posted it was pulled... like I said, maybe it was a coincidence...
That's all I said, so the rest of your rant is a little offtopic - I'll just say this - for me Slashdot is just one site amongst many and I think that if they want to keep that 1 billion or so valuation then being 'yet another' site is not an option - probably the reason they are sooo keen to parade their editorial independance?....
To misquote the bard...
Me hopes they don't protest too much....
Gab
The article is here....
Corel takeover Inprise Gab
Slashdot WILL remain independent. The reason is simple...
:)
It is above all the gathering place of a community. It will be independent as long as we're here, and as long as we write the majority of the content people come here for.
Which we do.
Slashdot is indistinguishable from any other "weblog" or other site without us and the interactions that go on. Rob & Hemos would have a hell of a time conjuring up a good "Slashdot Effect" by themselves now, wouldn't they?
What is the Slashdot owned (now) by VA? Nothing more than a collection of links to stories, usually accompanied by a short summary. Once in a while they do their own articles (features, interviews, etc) also, but these are by no means the majority of postings.
There's hundreds of sites just like that. Maybe not as good, but still the same concept. And most aren't worth a whole lot. On this level, Slashdot just happens to have a lot of hits. So what. Where is the VALUE that makes Slashdot different?
That's to be found in the community here. Every single on of us posting, ranting, theorizing, and even trolling down here in the guts of it all. And the interaction between the people running the site and the community boiling around it. They set things up, and we knock them down. It's their baby, and they give it the "feel" that it has. But we're the guts that make it work.
Now... it'd be pretty difficult to buy off the whole Slashdot community. They're welcome to try, though
Journalistic integrity might be an issue if Malda and Bates ever actually WROTE STORIES about something.
At its worst, /. is a tawdry Church of Open Source Truth, and posters are genuflecting parishioners. Unfortunately, this is the very core value of /. to Andover and now VA. They value /. because it is a thriving locus of the open source community. Underwriting /. gives VA legitimacy it couldn't possibly buy or build on its own. Sure, VA is perfectly willing to give you free reign -- knowing that you are an avid Open Source True Believer. There is absolutely no reason for them to question your motives or tactics. You' re values are perfectly aligned. The rest follows naturally.
Why is this bad? This place is supposed to be for geeks, not for religious converts. Geeks are not fixated on demographics or fashion or subjectivity,... or any of the things that lead VA to value SlashDot. Geeks are all about rationality, science,.. and hopefully about open minded inquisitiveness. Some of us feel like the Open Source mob is subverting geek values, and that your succession of corporate owners is indicative of this subversion.
Your humility and deference to the free /. community underscores my fears. As a non-linux professional geek, I would hope you don't give a rat's ass what the community does or says. I would hope that you remain dedicated to uncovering and discussing interesting developments affecting all geek engineers and scientists. Instead I see a tide of Open Source hordes overrunning the forum while you feed them a steady stream of linux fodder for them to fawn over.
If you'd be so kind, please humor the rest of us with occasional non-linux bones to chew on. I still like it here. Except for the Holy Wars crap.
I would disagree. Linux.com's site is too busy text-wise for my taste, and too rectangular.
Slashdot's style is now classic- there are imitators everywhere, and I personally find it easy to read.
That's nothing, they even host Windows stuff on their servers.
-BrentIt's easy to remake the slashdot website, but the slashdot community is a completely different story. You can't simply "create a new website" and have the community follow you. That's exactly why Andover was purchased for the amount it was purchased for. That's why Yahoo is still a hot property... People get stuck here.
Even if you made a site exactly like slashdot with only the stories that *I* liked, I'd probably not think about visiting it if there were only 50 hits a day there. There just wouldn't be much of a point to that.
probably not for long.
Nice, no?
So very true. There is also something about my piece that should be noted: As the phrase 'editorial independence' was thrown around, of course I had to attack that. In reality (and this only occurred to me afterwards) I didn't want to question their editorial independence as much I wanted to question their integrity, for no publication is ever without a bias.
So, VA Linux will have its effect, and Slashdot is going to change, whether its moderators want it or not. What direction this change will take, and whether it is good or bad, I cannot comment on.
10 tera bytes
The more idiot-proof you make it the smarter the idiots get.
Hmm.. now you've got me curious - I'll actually have to watch some TV tonight and see who's advertising on who. (needed an excuse..) I'm curious as to whether the cable networks advertising on broadcast channels are the same ones associated with the broadcast channel owners. Needs research :->
I wish they would use Oracle, and then maybe they wouldn't have to flush all the past stories and comments (i.e., the whole database would be searchable). I would imagine the reason they do that is that MySQL is not known for scaling up to large databases.
This is something of a myth... MySQL can actually handle very large tables quite well. It's problems are with lock contention... Instead of page or row level locking, it uses full-table locking which creates a bottleneck. This however has more to do with volume of users than volume of data.
Now, I'm not sure why Rob purges the old data, except perhaps as a matter of "hygiene" because properly designed MySQL databases would have no problems handling it. At least, if one is using the latest versions of MySQL which support >2GB tables on Linux...
Oracle on the other hand is as much as 14x slower than MySQL, and has serious performance issues with things like connecting to the database. You absolutely must use database connection caching to get acceptable performance. Not to mention the obscene pricing...
Even DB2 which is orders of magnitude faster than Oracle, and orders of magnitude cheaper than Oracle is not neccesarily well suited to a Slashdot style system...
MySQL is actually really good for many web applications... And it's few problems can be overcome (like splitting your tables up -- x becomes x1, x2, x3, etc...) in most cases...
MrJoy.com -- Because coding is FUN!
A site like /. is more than a "I got mine, you got yours, now let's both leave" transaction. It is a relationship.
/. community and replace it with a risk-analysis engine: "If I read /. I will get a potential 10% bias in reporting. ZDNet has a 60% bias, but the plants are easier to spot. I think I'll try the Register today."
When you have a SO that starts drinking heavily and staying out late, do you say to yourself "He/She owes me nothing. We both received value from the relationship. Now it is time to move on."? No.
Same here. I read and contribute to Slashdot. In many ways I AM Slashdot. But Slashdot ain't what it used to be. My gadfly-ism is attempting to change that but comments like yours only serve to take the heart out of the
--
Java banners:
Bad for users because Java kills Netscape
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
I don't think it matters. If Slash.dot ever was to start reeking of corporate control, someone will simply download the source code and create another community that was more in line with what the members wanted. That is one of the strengths of opensource: if you're not happy with the product being offered, grab the source and roll your own. I'm sure the people at VA understand that.
In short, I don't think this is an issue that we need to worry about. As long as there are people that care about this community, there will always be a slash.dot in some form or another.
Ed
Ok... We've all heard the news, the rumors, and the FUD. But does anyone know when this all takes place? When ANDN becuase LNUX? Thanks.
Quack
Dude, or chick, whatever you are,
This opening does not bode well...
f you'd bother actually loggin and using your login you too would soon become a Karma whore.
Flaming an AC for being anonymous is chldish.
Assuming everybody with a login is a "karma whore" is even more silly.
Notice my account ID is 935. I created my user account and have been posting with it long before Andover even acquired Slashdot. I just recently chnaged my screen name to show that I work for Andover in the spirit of full disclosure.
Bragging about your status as an "old-timer". Sad. Your account ID has nothing to do with the AC's comments about
Try logging in sometime you'll like it
Againg, attacking the AC for staying anonymous. Rude, childish, irrelevant, and totally uncalled for.
Don't worry we won't tell anyone that you're behind the microsoft.com firewall
Are you implying that this AC is a "rebellious" MS employee browsing /. while at work? If that is the case, I say "kudos to the AC"! If instead you are claiming that this person who disagrees with you must be an astroturfing Microsmurf, this comment implies a definite unjustified sense of paranoia, along with a sad attitude of "if you disagree with me, youmust be from THE ENEMY". This primative, warlike mentality is truly distressing in a self-professed Andover employee.
and using IE5 to browse here.
What is wrong with that. I myself often use IE here. When I am stuck at the windows box at work, IE5 is a far better browser to be using than the Netscape 4.x series. True, I grab the Mozilla daily snapshots, but IE is my second browser after Moz breaks. The right tool for the right job, and screw the wartime propaganda.
It feels weird to be 23 years old and telling Kurt to grow up but here goes:
Even programmers need to consider the consequences of decisions.You say that you would disallow anonymous posting. This is a valid position, but I would like to point out that ACs do sometimes add value to our community. Some very intelligent people (especially in the crypto world) are rabidly paranoid and would REFUSE to post here if they could not do so anonymously.
You would also block all windows clients. This silly piece of rabid *nix bigotry would do more harm than good. Many people here, myself included, use windows machines at work. Some intelligent people here may CHOOSE to use a windows machine for various reasons.
In my opinion, the "good" arguments (as opposed to flamewars) are the most enjoyable part of the /. experience. Start banning people who disagree with you, and the community gets sterilized very fast.
You also suggest that flames would be deleted. I think this is definitely a bad idea (allowing people to filter based on moderation catagory instead of just raw score, however...). Once you start deleting the extremely rude argumentative comments, you have entered a treacherous realm of deciding which comments to delete. The legal issues involved with actually deleting content are extremely thorny, and probably over my head. I have the impression that once you start deleting some content, you take some responsibility for the remaining content.
Like you, I am "only a programmer". The difference is that I realize that my decisions, my ideas have some affect on other people. If my ideas had no influence, I would quit my job. Since my ideas affect other people, I try to think them through.
I see from your user info that you are a "network/server admin". I assume you are good at what you do. You wouldn't blindly install software packages onto a production server without considering what consequences the package would have on the rest of the system. Similarly, if you are serious about wanting /. to be different, even if you are nearly powerless to get your changes implemented, you should consider the consequences to the rest of the community here.
By the way, I respect your decision to take off the automatic +1 and let your comment stand under it's own merit. If I could make one change to /., it would be to allow a user preferences option to automatically disable one's +1 Bonus. It get's annoying to check that box every time!
Good! Maybe you can get OctobrX to spiff up the graphics around here! (No offence guys, but compared to Linux.com this place looks like html 2.0...)
What if it is just turtles all the way down?
MySQL may not handle large databases as well,
define "large" for me.
+&x
If I were VA, I'd want to own Slashdot and Freshmeat because I'd want to take advantage of all that IPO capital and do some diversification while I still could.
Wouldn't be funny if two college geeks just opened up todhsals and did the exact same thing, but, "like the old days".
I'd wake up and instead of typing slashdot.org, I'd just reverse it. It'd be like bazaaro world or something.
Now that VA and Andover involved and slahsdot is going soon be as stupid as altavista.
I like that slashdot is slow and sometimes down. It reminds me that it's run by a couple of geeks like me.
There was also no mention of "paridigm shift"(with or without a clutch), or even "leverage"...
"It's tough to be bilingual when you get hit in the head."
You are reading the appropriate RFC now, yes?
Companies
Network Providers
Everything Else
Slashdot is not misfiled, eh?
-- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
Would AV have bought Andover if Andover had not bought Slashdot?
Jeroen
Good companies that take care of their employees (HP) that throw money at R & D (Xerox) and make their innovations/contributions public (Redhat) *do* exist.
While past history certainly warrants pragmatism, given quite a few bad apples, there is a significant chance, this all could be for the best.
So VA Linux wants to make some coin. They also make a good product. Consider /. and Freshmeat their form of corporate philanthropy. Instead of strictly attaching it to the CEO (William H. and Melinda Gate Foundation), they are willing to write the checks from the corporate ledger.
Consider the following VA has donated servers to kernel.org and slashdot. They are donating a much more trivial amount to my areas local Linux Users Group. What's in it for them? They get to feel good about helping the community (gift culture ref, see Cathedral and the Bazaar). We get higher end hardware than individual maintainers would otherwise be able to afford. VA Linux gets mindshare. Given the choice, how many clued in Linux sysadmins are going to recommend Compaq over VA Linux if all things (on-site support, price, config) were equal? Let's see, VA Linux has a stake in the community.
As for investors, I suspect many invest on the basis of the company's philosophy about how they make money, not just whether they make money. Otherwise, somebody please explain the value of Amazon's stock to me. If you think this isn't true, please ask yourself why you're so cynical. If this wasn't the case, S-1 filings would probably be less important. As long as VA is upfront about what they do for the community, and write it into standard corporate practice, investors understand and support them by owning their stock.
--Humpty Dumpty was pushed!
But does slashdot still control the ad process? (this isn't a flame, i'm genuinely asking).
An open bidding, ALA Ebay would be about the only was of pleasing those who suspect - what say you, cmdrtaco?
-Docvert converts MSWord to OpenDocument, clean HTML
I've been reading the site since (approx) the begining, and I agree with Kurt. (And no MR/MRS Conspiracy Theorist, I am not employed by andover or VA Linux!) Yes, there has been a slight change in the stories, but it is because Rob et al have changed and grown, just like the software industry has. It's natural.
/. No I am not refering to those who insist that /. has changed! Wipe that hurt look off your face.
As for the site being slower. It's definately faster than 9/20 when I first started using the company's T1. Then I would have to wait 5+ minutes for a page, now the time is inconsquential.....
The only thing that has really changed is that there are _more_ emotionally stunted individuals reading
I am refering the individuals that break into conversations with meaningless trolls, ads for their company and/or statements like "free the source"/"Free hacker Y" and so on. And indivduals who are coming here only to be "proven right," no matter how wrong they are. But, really if you think about it, as long as you set your threshold right, these people are usually not even visible.... So when you get down to it, there isn't that much of a problem.
Myddrin
Soylent Green is Penguins!
IT'S PENGUINS!
Work for Change & GET PAID!
Actually I believe the correct phrase is "ecky ecky ecky pitang, zoompow, uwozan. Spelling understandably may be wrong.
Non gratis rodentus anus
Oh Kurt you're so smart. I always enjoy your wonderful comments. Please don't ever change your programming ways. Stop this everyone . . . I can't take anymore Kurt bashing.
Hmm a news article about a potential competitor to VA linux was replaced by this article aobut editorial independance... probably just a coincidence.....
/. page currently.
Try hitting F5 on your browser, or reading more slowly. The Corel buyout of Inprise is at the top of my
Really, all of you who are bleating about Big Business slowly corrupting the editorial integrity of our little forum here need to gain a sense of perspective, stat. This is the nature of a free-market economy. Do you really think that Malda and Bates would have been able to keep the site running forever on banner ads alone? Or that they could have spent the time needed to improve the site and post stories if they weren't making *some* money at it?
So they agree to sell the site to Andover, provided they retain total editorial control. It's really that simple. VA Linux's buyout of Andover does not change that, unless Malda et al sign a new contract. VA/Andover gets to add a high-profile open-source forum to their stable, and the rest of you are free to continue trashing the company for invading your online Utopia.
If you *really* want a truly independent forum, then grab the new Slash code and start your own damn site, and let's see how long you last with a few stupid ad banners for revenue. Welcome to the new reality of the Internet. Get used to it.
I can really understand concern about this change -- there are already reporters such as Andrew Leonard over on Salon (who has been a good friend to open source) who believe that at least the appearance of editorial independence has been permanently compromised.
But I can understand some other things as well. Slashdot has always basically been the web site that Rob and Jeff and friends have kept going with bailing wire and Perl for similarly minded crazies. As one of those crazies, I have always tried to be a little grateful to the guys for letting the rest of us come in and play too.
It is very easy for the average slashdotter (many of whom are students) to urge: "Don't touch that Evil Money -- stay pure and poor, just like the good old days!!!" I know no better way to kill something that to try to prevent it from changing. Some of the most pathetic "sights" on the net are those whining that USENET, or GOPHER or whatever is just not what it was and is being "ruined" by all the changes that the newbies bring (I have lived through the imminent death of USENET about three times now) that we need to ACT NOW! to "save" it. Anything you can save by keeping it fron changing is only good for taxidermy.
Slashdot (along with the grits, MEEPTs, firsts, and Natalie Portman) continues to evolve, and the bridge crew here has to evolve as well and make the best lives for themselves that they can -- and that is what we are talking about here. Jeff and Rob and so forth risked their own resources and time to get this thing started, and it is up to them and their buisiness partners to work things out the best they can. So cut them (just a little) slack, OK?
And at the end of the day, the future of Slashdot is not really up to them, it it up to us. If Slashdot ceases to be independent, we'll know fast enough -- things generally aren't that subtle. The slash tarball is available, there are more than one or two Perl hackers around and we haven't run out of bandwith or IP addresses yet. If it is time to move on, we will find somewhere to go, or build it ourselves, in good open source fashion. Just like many of us moved from USENET to here.
I just can't get this taste out of my mouth...
Criminalize spam and telemarketing!
That sounds like the reliogn talking again. I have never had trouble getting the source code for mysql. I have had lots of trouble getting mysql to scale, and I have to make a lot of datamodel compromises to get more speed. Oracle has nothing to fear for at least five years with respect to 8.05, and by then they will still be very very far ahead. The majority of opensource/gpl zealots continualy underestimate the power of their rivals.
So basically they can cut your pay to $0 until you quit and slashdot is theirs?
You don't have to trust VA Linux. And maybe you shouldn't. They are a vendor, an important part of the very market that Slashdot covers. So by all means treat them with a little suspicion. But let's face facts. They are not, say, LinuxOne, or Microsoft. They have been a very above-board and up-front with the community, and their record thus far has been beyond reproach.
Could they suddenly turn rogue and try to unduly influence Slashdot's content? Perhaps. But that's why we have Rob and Co. You don't have to trust VA Linux, you just have to trust the editors. They are still in charge of the site.
Even if their carefully worded contract isn't worth the paper it's printed on, if VA Linux tried to compromise the integrity of Slashdot, I have full faith that Rob and Jeff would walk, probably saying a lot of nasty things on the way out. At that point, owning Slashdot would be a lot like owning a used piece of toilet paper.
So I'm counting on a few things.
First, I count on the integrity of the editors. Second, I count on the integrity of VA Linux. They've always been an asset to the community and I think they will continue to be in the future. Third, I count on the intelligence of VA Linux. Even if they are weasels (and I don't think they are), if they piss off the editors by interfering with the site's integrity, I think the editors would walk, and Slashdot without CmdrTaco and Hemos is like a peanut-butter and jelly sandwich without peanut-butter and jelly. To protect their investment, VA Linux must keep Rob & Co. happy, and to keep them happy they need to keep their hands off the site.
HipNerd
Hipnerd
i just want to know, what EXACTLY does Andover.net do, besides buying up linux-related web sites? Are they simply buying them up to give them more sites to sell their advertising to? what gives? a co-worker of mine has suggested they change their name to HandOver.net, much more applicable to their business practices.
According to this Upside article, Andover started out as a software retailer and switched to buying up "techie" websites and living off the ad revenues when the Internet started to get big. When Linux became the next big thing, they started buying up Linux websites.
Does this
wow, a response from an employee of Andover, this I wasn't expecting. Thanks for the response Kurt, i'm glad someone could clear this up for me.
ERiAN
-
-
This Post has been brought to you by the letter "E".
Not all of us are worried. I for one think this is great. I like VA Linux. I know they are out to make money, but it really is possible to make money and still uphold your values. VA Linux will be selling both hardware and advertising. They will have two major sources of income. With the current popularity of both linux and /., they should be able to not only make money, but make enough that they could be choosy about what companies they allow to advertise through the various sites.
/., the /. crew (you, Rob, et al) would leave and start a new site (maybe ". or {. or /,), and we, the avid /.ers would follow.
If all else fails, I have full confidence that, should ANY company ever try to control
"Anyone who can't laugh at himself is not taking life seriously enough." - Larry Wall
it doesn't sound like The God of /. is very thrilled about being part of a mutually benificial community merger. "And VA is smart: they know not to tamper with Slashdot."
Fist, I wanted to thank you guys for all you've done for /. and the Open Source Comunity. Second, I'm very pleased that you intend to keep /. in in it's present state. But what if? Do you have a contingency plan? What if VA decides to do something crazy? From what we know, they're intelegent sound people, but what if.... It certainly would be a shame to loose such a news outlet such as SlashDot.
Are you dumb? Don't be dumb. THINK!
Of course things are going to change. I haven't seen a merger (or acquisition) that didn't change the way things worked for _both_ parties.
/., Freshmeat, linux.com, Sourceforge et al. better. I have a lot of faith in Larry and VA, they have shown us all constantly that they are committed to Linux and the OpenSource community. They show us time and time again where their priorities are, and those priorities aren't always just money.
:) for at least 2 months. It takes a while to let the business stuff settle down before anyone can really look at making major changes.
:)
The challenege is in making things better. Change doesn't have to be a bad thing, there are lots of things that we can do to make
Having been through a merger recently I know how tough it can be, especially with competing divisions. The focus should be on making each better, on integrating what you can, and improving whatever you keep as solely your groups realm. Trim the fat, get rid of some of the redundancy and make everything you can as good as you can.
I think we will see some interesting changes at Andover and VA, but I bet you won't see many of them (besides the new servers
I wish VA, Andover and Slashdot the best and hope that things do change
forge
Don't worry we won't tell anyone that you're behind the microsoft.com firewall and using IE5 to browse here.
Wow, you wouldn't be trying to intimidate someone with the implication that you can find out where they're posting from, simply because you work at Andover would you?
I didn't think so.
Grow up and go back to work. If this is the kind of infantile crap we're going to see from the people at Andover, I fear for the independance of Slashdot.
Slashdot is Open Source's internet poster child. Don't change it. One word of advice to Slashdot. . . Never completely trust ANYONE when money is involved. (in this case, a lot of money) Not to be a pesimist, just cautious.
As a hardware vendor it is clear how VA adds value to a free and open platform, Linux and its associated tools. Now they want to help out the developer community. It is nice that they want to help nature open source development, but something in the back of my mind just has to wonder, what's in it for them?
The obvious thing that is in it for them is quality software for the hardware they sell, and at a very low price. It's a win-win situation. Developers get the help of financial backing (although in most cases the backing is indirect), and VA gets developers for cheap (again, indirectly).
When will Windows be ready for the desktop?
Andover is fine, IMHO. Be thankful that they don't want their logo on every page (is their logo anywhere on Slashdot? I know it's on Freshmeat) like other acquired sites.
As for rejected stories, I have submitted several stories only to have the opposite of what I thought would happen actually happen. Well anyway, why not keep some stories "in queue", especially if they are not breaking news? There have been several days recently where new stories were scarce, and then several days where I almost missed something new because there were so many stories. Just because you can't post it today doesn't mean it should not be posted ever. Basically what I'm running in circles around is that stories, unless they're total crap, should never really be rejected. Maybe "set aside" would be better. Then, on boring days, we can eat leftovers.
With such an incredible amount of traffic on Slashdot, I often wonder why Slashdot never gets Slashdotted. If only 25% of readers actually click on off-site links, and that other site gets /.ed, that means that the Slashdot servers must be able to handle more than 4 times as much traffic. In some cases, the number of images matters. Slashdot has a relatively small number of images, compared to most sites. (quick nslookup shows that the ad server is on a different site in the Slashdot subnet.) You have the story topic icons (most of which are probably in the user's cache anyway), the Slashdot logo (ditto), and a few bullet-type graphics (ditto). The end result is that probably 99% of the traffic off of Slashdot is text. But most (all?) is dynamic, in some way (even static pages like the FAQ are server-preprocessed). So huge server load but not tremendous bandwidth (relative terms!). Look what I've done: I answered my own question again.
About users: how many users have not logged in in years? I know of no way for a user to get off of Slashdot. So maybe you have twice the uids, but do you really have twice the users?
I didn't know before I got introduced to Slashdot that Perl scripts could ever emulate albino elephants (or albino monkeys, or uber geese (or circus geese), not to mention orange squirrels). Excellent scripting, Rob!
Can I have some of your trained squirrels?
btw, cool site, but I'm sure you've heard that before...
Yea I was thinking of that
Who ever clicks on the reply button first should get there name posted in a box with -6 font under the story.
God, root, what is the difference?
If you were VA, why would you want to own Slashdot and Freshmeat so badly?
:-)
Looking at it from a business perspective I would want Freshmeat and Sourceforge espescially, because they facilitate new developments on which VA thrives. VA doesn't make money from the sites themselves as much as from the new GPL-programms it helps to evolve. These new programs can be used as NT-killers and sell more boxes. The funny thing is that companies like Penguin Computing also will benefit from it, because they can make use of the same programs
Slashdot is great because it lets the community discuss stuff and draws people into the community. I am still running Windows 98 and I can't code. But through Slashdot I am now considering to get Corel Linux on my system. If I ever become a 'suit'. I am much more favorable to Linux. Do you see the pattern evolving
Use Adsense for Charity
Dave
We're here to serve the open source community. Period. If we ever fail or fall short in that mission, please don't hesitate to remind us.
Believe me, we will
All this paranoia is worse then any FUD the -*insert your favorite big bad corporation*- could do. Yes, it is prudent to know where the strings are being pulled from, but there are some positive reasons why hardware companies like VA Linux and SGI are making major contributions to Linux. It's because they want to ride the success wave of Linux, and sell us the hardware which runs it. The more they do to help Linux succeed, the bigger the market they have to sell to. This is not just some idle plan; there is serious money being put into the linux comunity. True; not all of this money is being spent to enrich the comunity. Some companys are spending lots of money making closed sourse ports of their applications for linux. But others are putting lots of money and research into projects which will benifit all of us; Slashdot, Freshmeat, OpenGL, XFS.
If you take a look at who is doing what, I think slashdot is in pretty good hands.
I tend to agree here, whether or not it is possible; I do not know but I believe that Slashdot needs to be free (beer & otherwise:)
Ripping an new rectum in the fabric of spacetime.
The Linux (and OSS in general) community needs to be diversified across different organizations, such as Universities, SIGs and commercial companies. This has seemed to have provided a certain degree of 'checks and balances' so far.
In summary: if VA always does the right thing, all will be good, but the opposite happens - Linux sinks.
Rob,
/. is acquiring more servers/bandwidth, it seems a shame if more content (i.e. stories, not necessarily more trollspace) couldn't be hosted.
I beg you to hire more albino elephants and turbo chickens!
Or, at least get some more unpaid interns...
If
ti_dave
VA sucks, VA sucks, VA sucks...
- ------------------------------ Apache/1.3.6 Server at linux362.dn.net Port 80
Hmmm, at least it is still working. If for some reason you do not see this post, then something has changed. If something has changed, you may not see this post.
VA sucks, VA sucks, VA sucks...
This is sucks, after making this post, I received the following:
Internal Server Error The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request. Please contact the server administrator, malda@slashdot.org and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error. More information about this error may be available in the server error log. -------------------------------------------------
Everybody needs to learn their slashdot history. If you would kindly go to The Archives and listen to the interviews etc, you would know that VA donated the equipment a LONG time ago (before Andover acquired /.)
Tune in next time to learn why Rob Malda chose the name::: CmdrTaco.
Munky_v2
"Warning: you are logged into reality as root..."
Jay
That is unique hits, The site has around 5 times more than that that actually go to it in a day as returns trollers etc. etc. It is real dynamic and database driven ColdFusion + SQl 7.0... *ahem* We have a T3 on sprint and this site pays for 90% of the T3. It has.. hmmn two IIS servers and one Big ass SQL 7.0 Server sitting on it. It is targeted at a very specific audience and it gets more hits than any other site like it. We have some very nice contracts with various products related to the site which nicely pay for it. Perhaps its a bit over priced but not by much if you consider the click-thru rate they get and the number of impressions served. I am not going to provide hard core statistics because that is not my place but I can tell you that web advertising can be pretty lucrative. Oh and Ive tried and tried to get the bosses to convert the site to Php3 (I even could do most of this in like 2 days) Oh well.. I dont much mind reboot the NT servers once every day or so scream at them go through patch hell and a day of downtime every month life goes on.
Rofl, im so sorry. :-) that is like 10K hits / day!!!! ROFL Sorry.. Sleep deprevation kicking in I did not even notice till I posted my response.. *sighs* *kicks himself* More mt dew more mt dew. We also have a few other sites that advertise that are counted into the equation of paying for our net connection AOKAY? Im not a loon :P
Editorial content, Not advertising content. Read between ze lines :-). Andover got out of this one mother of an advertising site. My slashdot hit counter says 200-600K hits per day as an average. I have a site that gets just 9-10K hits / year and it pays for the T3 it sits on! Its stupid to screw with editorial content anyways because they lose the one thing they really are gaining from this deal because it will lose many hits and thats losing advertiseing.. Calm down it doesnt matter because you can always choose not to visit /. if it goes to hell in a hand basket which clearly is NOT going to happen :-) If anything this is good for slashdot as a whole becuase I wont get !connect and timeouts.
Ho humn, back to my world of VB and the Win32API *sighs*
Jeremy Allen
jallen@idminc.com
- The article starts bragging about internet and Linux is a child of the internet blabla... It gets me the 'Al-Gore feeling: I invented the Internet!'. This is kinda weird and not on it's place IMHO
- First Linux is mentioned as a prominent subject and then OpenSource comes to the table, the OpenSource concept is important, but what's the link with naming linux in this picture (besides it's an open source project) ?. Seems to me for VA Systems Open Source == Linux, while it's not, IMHO. Linux is just a product of the Open Source community, just like my small ASE parser is.
:) - I think they should change the slogan 'news for nerds, stuff that matters'. There are a lot of nerds who are not using linux but are still proud to be a techie, a nerd, a geek. With the 'Linux' word mentioned more than once in the article, a true nerd who is not using linux BUT open source software is going to feel him/herself a little orphaned by this site. Don't shout this is a Linux site, it's especially an open source site. read point 1.
To me, the discussion element is part of the sitesystem, not part of the nameIf there are any left, where geeks and nerds of all different OS-es and programming languages can discuss the stuff that really matters and which is not typically fitting in a (VA)linux world...
Never underestimate the relief of true separation of Religion and State.
What about the advertising? Will Slashdot and Freshmeat still accept (under reasonable terms) advertising from VA's competitors?
/.
Does Time accept advertising from the Showtime Cable channel? Of course.
When a company over influences the content of a subsidiary, it is glaringly obvious. Who can not tell that Disney owns ABC?
Subsidiaries each have their own P&Ls and have to justify the Return on Equity that the parent has invested in them. Good management holds the managers of each of their sublines responsible which means that the management of Slashdot is not going to skew the coverage toward VA hardware sales just because they have a few shares in the parent.
Because *if* it happens, it will be obvious to us all and we will all flee
Anomalous: inconsistent with or deviating from what is usual, normal, or expected
Anomalous: deviating from what is usual, normal, or expected
Canard: a false or unfounded repor
Yeah? And how many ads for the Superbowl on ABC did you see on Fox?
Not a one, but I didn't see any ads for the Superbowl on ABC either. I only watch TV from the VCR and I fast forward through all ads.
But, you miss the point. ABC and Fox are direct competitors. Now, the parents of ABC and Fox are also competitors, but you find both networks advertising the other's movies.
Anomalous: inconsistent with or deviating from what is usual, normal, or expected
Anomalous: deviating from what is usual, normal, or expected
Canard: a false or unfounded repor
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. ~Martin Luther King, Jr. from Birmingham Jail, 1963
Personally I don't think the new management is going to try to mess with the site's actual content, if they read any of the comments to any story dealing with censorship they'd know they would just shoot themselves in the foot if they tried anything to alter the content.
So I guess Slashdot is going to be running under VA Hardware eventually? .. This does put us (the readers) in a difficult position as we must trust the journalistic integry of Rob Malda and Jeff Bates, Which we have never had to do before since there wasn't a major coporate Linux Corp backing Slashdot.org until now. This also puts pressure on them in that anything they do with regards to VA/Linux news may cause them to come under fire as being 'biased'. This deal while good for Andover.net, may make life alot harder on our friends here at slashdot, for both sides of the fence.
So, when is /. going to drop the .org and get a .com domain? Don't you think it's just a teensy bit dishonest to pretend to be a nonprofit?
- grow the size and share of our dominant Linux/Open Source position
- facilitate and guide the transition of Windows developers to Linux/Open Source
- expand our e-commerce offerings to our targeted, high volume traffic
- acquire complementary Linux/Open Source web sites
- expand the number and participation of major advertisers
- strengthen the Andover.Net brand.
Boy I particularly like that last one. Surely being swallowed by VA will build your brand. Oh ya, the one about acquiring is nice too. I'm just glad I didn't buy any of this stock on the first day of trading. Talk about taking a bath. You have to wonder whether the heads of some of these companies (like Andover) are really interested in OSS or just cashing in. It certainly looks like Twickler is punching his ticket.I'm sure /., like tree-based magazines and papers, have a policy of 'editoral discreation' which means that no matter who advertise or who owns them, they write their stuff. In magazines this is done by totally keeping editoral and advertising departments seperate and I'm sure /. have a similiar setup. If (and it is a big if) VA do try and put pressure on Andover who try and put pressure on /., I'm sure the news will leak out and big a very very very big PR mistake for them. Whereas, if they were to support /. no matter what (ie if /. were to 'rubbish them' for some reason) then it'll be good PR. Good PR=happy customers=more customers.
RIchy C.
--
Yeah, Red Dwarf is really cool too. Anyone smell peanuts?
Appology accepted! Dwarf rules!
Trolls flourished because it was born into the Slashdot world. This was a world of global, instantaneous communication, a world in which a flamebait community could explode from dozens to hundreds in a matter of weeks, and from hundreds to millions within a few years. That naked and petrified community made possible the incubator we know now as the karma whore development model.
But Trolls also flourished because the Slashdot into which it was born was a small enough place for MEEPT!s'' voice to be heard. The Slashdot of 1998 had fewer flamebait posts. Those first post trolls had little difficulty finding each other.
Today's Slashdot is a vast place. Whether it will be a vast resource or a vast obstacle depends on our ability as karma whores to organize. We need a place to bring trolls together, to enable flamebait to find one another. But to call it a portal greatly understates the challenge. We're aiming for nothing less than the hub of services that accellerate and empower the next generation of karma whore development. We need a gathering place to:
Bringing together Andover.net with VA's Infrastructure Business Unit gives us a great opportunity to empower the trolls most important community site. We are also bringing their story full circle. Natalie, Grits, and First Post! each started as community trolls run on an all volunteer basis. We're giving them an opportunity to work together once again. More than that, we're giving them the resources to play an enduring central role. By bring Andover together with VA, we're assuring the future of these important community trolls.
This group is a separate business unit, because it will live independently from VA's core systems business. VA has proven this can be done in Trolls.com and Slashgrits.com. Andover too: Slashdot never stopped receiving posts about Open Source Man even while Andover was building Server 51. What matters to the troll community gets posted, regardless of where it comes from.
In this new structure, the VA trolls will plug into the Andover management team, and the whole group will report to Larry Augustin directly.
We're here to serve the karma whore community. Period. If we ever fail or fall short in that mission, please don't hesitate to remind us. Thanks in advance.
Larry Augustin, CEO, VA Trolls Systems (lma@vaTrolls.com)
Bruce Twickler, CEO, Flamebaait.net (bruce@flamebait.net)
seen any mention of CopyLeft on slashdot ever since andover bought ThinkGeek? i rest my case.
Well I saw the word "empower" but I didn't see
"synergy". I'd give it a 50, Dick.
Your PHB
I post occasionally... just statistically very rarely. I've posted over 4000 stories, but less than a thousand comments.
But I get a bonus point when I post. Haha. Its my little reward for writing all this damn code ;)
This morning my Karma was 32. Now its 36. I whored myself up 4 karma this way. Muahahahahahahah!
(The reality is of course that this story means a lot to me. My usual reply to 'do you post comments' is no... unless I'm qualified. On most subjects I'm simply not... but on this one, well. I'm probably the most qualified person in this whole damn discussion to talk about Slashdot and how it will be affected by the merger ;)
Pants are still optional, but recommended for you.
VA won't change Slashdot because changing it would hurt it. Hurting it would hurt their standing in the community. Leaving it *alone* gives them a revenue stream via selling ads... plus the added bonus of supporting yet another community project.
Pants are still optional, but recommended for you.
that's really funny. I like that line - I'm going to have to appropriate it.
Yeah, I'm that guy.
Excuse me for being skeptical, but do you have any evidence for your claim?
And just to irk you I'm going to Karma whore this comment too. Try logging in sometime you'll like it. Don't worry we won't tell anyone that you're behind the microsoft.com firewall and using IE5 to browse here.
The "go read something else" comment is not just my feelings but just about everyone at Slashdot who has to deal with flame mail telling them that they sold and Slashdot is controlled by big business and yadda yadda yadda. Now obviously it is counter productive for us to piss off our audience and make them leave, so we aim to please but from this side of the fence I can't help but speak up when I see people ranting about the Andover mothership sending signals to Slashdot's brain implants telling them what stories to post. It's not the way it works, and if things do start to go in that direction due to business pressures then you won't be seeing my rants posted anymore because I will stop reading this web site, and delete the bookmark and I will let management know that they have ruined a good thing. From here within the mothership I don't see that day coming anytime soon. If you think that day is already upon us well whatever, it's really not up to us, it's up to the Slashdot authors to make this site interesting, that is what they are paid to do.
In short we provide the infrastructure to keep these sites running and grow.
>For instance: What about the advertising? Will Slashdot and Freshmeat
:) ]
>still accept (under reasonable terms) advertising from VA's
>competitors?
[Gee, I don't have to toss off disclaimers when I post as an economics professor rather than a lawyer
They really don't have a choice in this type of industry. Look at televesion. When the big 3 networks still dominated, it made sense to stay separate--If NBC ran an ABC ad, NBC would lose about half as much as ABC gained, making the price of an ad prohibitive (since NBC would need to cover its losses).
Now look at the world with most people having cable. Cable stations regularly advertise on one another--the station running the ad gets the revenue, but only a small fraction of the people watching the advertised program would have been watching that station anyway, so the loss is minor.
The web is closer to the second situation. Yes, VA could lose sales from a competitor's ad, but the lost sales get broken up among VA, IBM, Dell, etc.
[Note: this is not Microsoft bashing!] On the other hand, if Microsoft bought andover, it would make economic sense (though violating antitrust law) not to take adds for Red Hat, etc.--each copy of Linux shipped preinstalled due to the add would pretty much mean one less windows sale.
Yes, thereis the common ownership. But you regualrly see adds that cross it, or ads for cable on broadcastchannels, etc.
Then again, there's the Disney channel, which is a 24/7 infomercial for the Disney Empire, which breaksfor 34-40 minutes of programming/hour
Now the up-to-date slash code is (finally :-) available, there is no way anything can stop /. from existing. Yeah, the site at slashdot.org could die, and Rob/Hemos/JonKatz/whoever might stop writing for it, but that wouldn't matter too much. Rob et al. put a lot of work into it, but I think /. was mainly the result of a web site being in the right place at the right time. If someone (VA/Microsoft/whoever) took this site down, another one would spring up very quickly, particularly since it is obvious that you can actually make money doing this, as well as having fun and serving the community.
Paranoia isn't an infectious condition, it's a way of life
As far as clicking through for the good of the supporters, I think that you should maybe redirect your good natured visiting to the community projects we'll put into rotation.
Chris DiBona
--
Grant Chair, Linux Int.
Pres, SVLUG
Co-Editor, Open Sources
Open Source Program Manager, Google, Inc.
Promoting OSS and the community in general boosts VA's bottom line. You see, it's in their best interest for OSS software to succeed.
;-P
1) General PR boost for sure.
2) VA doesn't just sell hardware. They also deal with SUPPORT. Lotsa free software, and they can offer charge support.
3) They consult. They consult *BIG* time. They offer solutions using software that's free to them, and pretty much just rake in the cash for doing so.
They do have something in it for them, it's just not as simple as, get paid for doing this. It indirectly affects their other sources of income.
Example. They'll probrably be one of the first vendors to release an IA64 system, simply becouse of their funding of IA64 capabilities in the Linux kernel. No one paid them to do it, but in the end, they make alot of cash for it. They also get looked at as the 'experts' in the areas.
It's all in the residuals, man..
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Slashdot is still an independant entity, and will always remain so. They can't just 'change' or 'eliminate'. It'd be breach of contract. Now, I'd love to see a copy of this contract, becouse yes, there has to be something in there for them, but based on what Rob & Hemos have said, they can't change slashdot.
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Ever since Andover bought Slashdot, the quality of the articles and of the comments have dropped dramatically. Perfectly valid and interesting stories are being rejected in exchange for stories relating to Linux and Microsoft. There would be at least 100 comments in the 0 and -1 range.
:)
The only change I've noticed is that there've been far fewer quickies posted (which is a shame; I liked those). Whatever changes you may have noticed aren't Andover's fault anyway; they have no editorial control, remember?
The server's performance has also slowed. It would be frequently be down and would take a long time to get any sort of HTML back from them.
Here, you have a point. However, the reason behind that is the same reason for the increase in trolls. Slashdot's simply getting more famous, and because of that more "good" people are coming on, but so are more "bad" people. Slashdot is by definition Slashdotted every day, but as the crowds keep getting bigger even Slashdot's servers won't be able to hold up forever. That's when it's time to get new ones, and Slashdot will be getting those anyway.
Geez; eventually Slashdot will probably have to run on a Beofulf cluster of servers
If VA gives Slashdot some servers and some more bandwidth to host it on, and at the same time help with making the environment over here cleaner, then go ahead. Otherwise, I think both Andover and VA have overstated their welcome, and Slashdot should split off from the combined company and run indenpendently, just like the old days.
VA is giving Slashdot new servers, and I'd imagine more bandwidth too. But how can they make the envorioment cleaner? There are ways to do it, but no one here at Slashdot seems to want to take those steps.
And Slashdot is rune more or less independently anyway. Come to think of it, I can't figure out what Andover ever got out of the deal, besides being able to say that they'd bought Slashdot.
The whole idea behind editorial independence is that advertising and editorial are unrelated. So I'm not worried about Rob and Jeff suddenly becoming VA 'stooges' - I trust them to keep the site's content on target and fair. I expect they will show bias towards some stories, that's inevitable with humans deciding what gets posted. But I think that the bias will be the same personal bias they have already (Rob'll post anything about Pete Townshend, for instance - and Jeff is a nano nut. And expect more AIBO stuff).
Advertising is a different case, but if VA wants revenue they'll take ads from all comers, including Copyleft and Penguin Computing. Because if they only take ads from VA and ThinkGeek, they're not affecting what we read per se, or the editorial side of Slashdot at all. They're only affecting the ad sales folks, and VA's overall revenue. Remember, they serve ads at semi-random, with Adfu (last time I checked). Unlike the dead tree publications, there asn't really any association of ads with stories. If I load the same page twice, I'll get two different ads. If I open up PC Week to the same page twice, I get the same Microsoft ad each time.
Think about it, folks - it really just means more money for VA if they take ads from all comers, and less if they don't. But that's not Slashdot's problem until and unless Rob and Jeff leave (and even then it may not be an issue) - and then some Slashdot clone'll pop up and take their place immediately if Slashdot itself goes down the chute.
- -Josh Turiel
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
That's the big problem with embracing a religion, rather than embracing "the best".
Uhh, choosing always to embrace the best is a religion.
--
Ian Peters
Unless /. were run by robots and had no ISPs to offend, it has always had constraints. If they hadn't sold to Andover, they'd have to be their own business managers and would have had less time to handle the geek side of /., so the Andover buyout preserved the geek side of /.
/. to stay static, never changing. You'd guarantee the geekiness and lose the future. You'd lose relevancy as the world changed, and /. would become worthless as a resource.
/. equivalent for the telegraph age that refused to change when the telephone came in.
If you think the Andover buyout was teh beginnig of the end, then you must also want
Imagine a
--
Infuriate left and right
I wish they would use Oracle, and then maybe they wouldn't have to flush all the past stories and comments (i.e., the whole database would be searchable). I would imagine the reason they do that is that MySQL is not known for scaling up to large databases.
Unfortunately, Slashdot probably feels they need to use Open Source no matter what, even if that means using inferior software. That's the big problem with embracing a religion, rather than embracing "the best".
Interestingly, MySQL is not open source.
--
bgphints - internet routing news, hints and ti
I remember back when you could suggest that something be changed or mention something you didn't like without someone throwing a fit at you from the parent company to go read something else.
<RANT>
And I remember back when you could come to Slashdot without the posters throwing a fit about the integrity and honesty of the people running the place after every little thing they did.
These complaints are neither suggestions to change or even just mentions of things disliked... they're full out attacks on the guys at Slashdot because they decided to sign on to a larger mothership so that the wouldn't have to stand in line at the unemployment office or bag groceries.
I mean, I see all manner of conspiracies and garbage about how Slashdot is under mindcontrol now, but I don't see the evidence. "Watch and see what stories *don't* get published," I'm told. Well, what the hell kind of evidence is that? There are hundreds of stories the mainstream press miss every day. Blah blah blah...
What it comes down to, I often think, is that these guys are making money and you're not. What's wrong with making money at something you've done right. Yeah, yeah, you were here in the beginning and where's your check. Well, sorry, you didn't start the site, you didn't maintain the site, you didn't have the idea, and you didn't take all the flack. I think these guys deserve what they got.
And as for Slashdot getting warped by the mothership-- don't you think that if that happened in any real noticeable way, that it would sink in a week's time, if not sooner? Live by the open community sword, die by it.
And if you can agree with that, don't you think that *possibly* someone at Andover and now VA might realize that? And if you can agree with *that*, don't you think that the people who bought the site might want its value to continue to be valuable, even if they're greedy bastards (not saying they are)? And if you can, finally, agree with that, why should Slashdot change for any other reason than that the guys in Holland, MI want it to?
</RANT>
Great to see a non-profit organization do so well for their bottom line ;?.
Seriously folks, Linux is BigBinis(TM) now. This is not your happy home hacker OS anymore. You all may say 'oh but it's open still,' and you would be right, but that's not the issue. The suits are reading Slashdot.ORG reading sites that have some open app development and think 'how can I make money off this?' And they are; and...they...are...
Believe it...
So what are your happy home hacker OSes? GNU/HURD, OpenBSD and a few others in the background. FreeBSD and Linux are now officially suit fodder.
What's my point?
Don't be suit groupies...
David Letterman used to really rip on General Electric when they bought NBC. He would call them pinheads, and quite a few Top 10 lists bashed GE, albeit in a somewhat humourous way ("They new guy invented a longer lasting lightbulb - lets kill him"). Perhaps this will be the same situation.
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
slashdot.com isn't really being used for anything, it only redirects to www.liason.com.
Bah. Can you say "cybersquatting"? I think we should encourage andover to sue. This is *not* like the etoys case.
Consciousness is not what it thinks it is
Thought exists only as an abstraction
Yeah. Ten years ago, eh? That was about the time they ruined it (IMHO) by making too complicated with all that [sys0.syscommon.syswhatever...] clustering stuff.
The classic version 4.2 was the best I reckon. Smooth and simple. Running on a big bulky VAX 11/750 with a couple of huge RA81 drives. You could fry your breakfast on those mothers!
Consciousness is not what it thinks it is
Thought exists only as an abstraction
A buyout *is* a merger. It's virtually impossible for two companies to have identical valuations, so one company is always larger than another. Stock from one company is swapped with another and sometimes cash is paid as well.
/.?
This was not a *hostile* takeover and the board of both companies approved the merger. Board members from both companies will exist on the new company.
Why aren't you screaming everytime someone refers to the AOL/Time Warner merger? Or virtually every other merger reported on
-- Don't Tase me, bro!
Andover bought Slashdot, the quality of the articles and of the comments have dropped dramatically.
/. got more popular, it attracted it share of trolls and whiners. /. for quite a long time now, and I haven't noticed much of a difference in the content. Sure their tastes have changed slightly, but I don't remember any massive change since the Andover announcment. What I HAVE noticed is an abundance of whiners that came here somehow expecting that every story would interest them, then going off and bitching everytime someone posted a story that they didn't think belonged here.
First off, I would love to hear the logic behind the conclusion that Andover somehow made comments worse. I would say that as
Second, I've been reading
Perfectly valid and interesting stories are being rejected in exchange for stories relating to Linux and Microsoft.
Hate to spoil your illusions, but this site has been running storied about Linux and Microsoft since it's birth. Perhaps we WANT to see stories about Linux and Microsoft. Perhaps that is why it's so popular...
The stories were interesting and valid to YOU, and perhaps others as well, but the maintainers of this site didn't think so, and chose other stories instead of them. You will just have to live with that kind of disapointment in your life, as NO news service reports EVERYTHING it gets.
The server's performance has also slowed.
Or perhaps the site has gotten more popular and the server has been dishing up more content? Nahhh, there must be some conspiricy. I'll be Andover.net forced them to move everything over to old 486s so their CEO could have all of Rob's server hardware.
Slashdot should split off from the combined company and run indenpendently, just like the old days.
Since you seem to remember the old days so well, could you please enlighten me as to what has changed so drastically that you take exception to?
Finkployd
I agree with most of what you have stated, but I would submit to you that slashdot has NEVER been completly without biases (indeed, I don't know if anything EVER has been). Rob and Co. have always had their own agendas, interests, and beliefs. This is not a bad thing, in fact it has made slashdot what it is today. They have always defended some companies and groups, and I have yet to see them do anything inconsistant with they way they operated before (ie, some inexplicable about-face on some issue)
Finkployd
Will slashdot move to a .COM domain? It has been a long time since slashdot could claim to be a non-commercial organization.
He made a point to sell slashdot to a non-linux company... specifically rejecting VA, so I understand.
And, no matter how much he says that he has a solid contract, people are now going to be questioning the integrity of his site, and of him personally, because of this.
VA probably won't make money directly with this "fusion" of the open-source world. However, VA does make money off of open-source software. So, anything they can do to help make that software better improves their business.
Juiced? Or Not?
You own nothing.
In fact, you own less than nothing.
Glückwünsche, haben Sie Slashdot ermordet, indem Sie zum korporativen Druck beugten und Subskriptionen einlei
Ever since Andover bought Slashdot, the quality of the articles and of the comments have dropped dramatically. Perfectly valid and interesting stories are being rejected in exchange for stories relating to Linux and Microsoft. There would be at least 100 comments in the 0 and -1 range.
The server's performance has also slowed. It would be frequently be down and would take a long time to get any sort of HTML back from them.
If VA gives Slashdot some servers and some more bandwidth to host it on, and at the same time help with making the environment over here cleaner, then go ahead. Otherwise, I think both Andover and VA have overstated their welcome, and Slashdot should split off from the combined company and run indenpendently, just like the old days.
US businesses that currently accept chip and PIN/signature
Ever thought of switching to Oracle as the database engine? I haven't tried it myself, but I've heard it's being used in several large Internet portals to great success. It's not free howerver :(
:)
If VA gives you a raise you can go ahead and buy it for Slashdot. Slashdot using Oracle if very unlikely, as it's closed-source and I know how everyone goes nuts at closed-source products.
Just my 2 cents
US businesses that currently accept chip and PIN/signature
.. with the cable advertising analogy: The ownership structure of cable channels differs fundamentally from that of traditional broadcast (VHF 2-13 in the US mostly) channels in that many cable channels share common ownership. So, seeing an ad for, say, TBS while watching CNN isn't really a case of CNN's management accepting an ad from a competitor - it's all Time Warner. They may have some internal accounting thing where "money" moves, but it's not a competitive relationship from management's point of view.
I can't recall an instance of seeing, say, an ad for an ESPN program (Disney) during, say, a segment of CNN/SI (TimeWarner).
The ads that local cable operators can sell may subvert this a bit as they'd see anything that promotes more viewing as a plus - I don't know - in my area, TW owns the local cable operator too so I wouldn't see this behavior if it exists.
Not just your browser. Also check Kit's user info. He's posted 5 comments or so in the past few weeks, and all of them started, and ended (so far) with +4, with no moderation attached.
It's a bit suspicious. I dunno. Paranoia paranoia paranoia.
To the comments that +6 is a bug, it's not, per se. There have been other +6 comments in the past (only 1 that I can remember) and the user preferences page specifically mentions the possibility of -2 (or lower) posts. So -5s are also quite plausible (Lots of people just keep moderating down the same post).
But....what about this one? +4, with no reason?
It seems unlikely. The other ones were the result of extreme moderation on each end, this one seems to have absolutely no explanation behind it.
I know it's quite easy to set this up (it's a single modification in a mysql table), since I've given myself an automatic +51 on my own slashsite before. So someone explain it to me. Does he have access to the slashdot mysql tables? It's not modifiable through backslash (at least not in the distributed slash code), and as far as I can tell, it really does require access to the MySQL server.
Is Kit Cosper a l33t haX0R?!
Or was he given access to the tables? Or did Rob&Crew just give him 4 by default?
Somehow I doubt a VA employee would be exploiting a bug, if one even exists.
Just my thoughts...
-Ed Fisher
this
Let me start by saying THANK YOU for reading and responding to a comment. (actually, you may always read--but there's no way for us to know that if you don't respond). You need feedback frm us to know how the site is working, but we also need feedback from YOU to know that we make a difference.
As for the specific items:
1&2) Editorial control. I note that you DON'T say whose idea Roblimo and Emmett were. I'm sure you guys will have veto power as provided in your contract, but as others have pointed out that doesn't preclude bias.
3) No, I DO have less of a guarantee. Corporate-ownership has ruined many a good thing in the past, therefore there is reason to doubt that corporate-ownership in the present case will be a good thing. Without out something to counteract that doubt we feel more uneasy. A guarantee is only as good as the holder feels about it.
4) It will be interesting to see what (if any) difference there is among how you'd like Slashdot run, how VA would it run and how it actually ends up running. I urge you to think long and hard about how equitable your relationship with VA is (or any owner for that matter). This applies especially in the case were you are an independent business unit. The question boils down to: "If we're so independent, why do they want to own us?"
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Java banners:
Bad for users because Java kills Netscape
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
So Larry and [Insert Andover Drone's Name Here] have a "vision" of how "the community" should work, eh? Great. And if it doesn't work out that way, what happens to Slashdot? Or what about if their "vision" changes (or gets clouded by money)?
Let's face the facts here: Slashdot is a business unit. If that unit doesn't serve it's purpose, it will be changed or eliminated. The current (stated) purpose is as a forum. What happens when the (primary) purpose is to make money? Or advertising?
Sure, Slashdot has a contract to keep "editorial control". Has a lawyer looked at this contract? Does the contact guarantee that you get to choose the editors? (for instance, where did Roblimo and emmett come from?)
Most importantly: what contract/guarantee do we have that our interests are being served?
A better plan, IMO, is for VA Linux to spin-off Slashdot into it's own business. That keeps the media out of the hands of the corporations as it should be. If they (or anyone) is concerned about how Slashdot will support itself, they (or anyone) can contribute money to a (blind) fund. This solution is fully compatible with the letter we just read, so if the plan is rejected we know there are ulterior motives.
--
Java banners:
Bad for users because Java kills Netscape
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
Advertising revenues.
They may not be able to control what is posted, but they do own the site, and they will make money from that little banner ad at the top of the page.
LL
"If you are falling, dive." -Joseph Campbell
.
+&x
In short, the reason Slashdot has "changed" is because the authors interests are changing.
/. expands and gets aquired repeatedly it seems as if new "editors" or whatever you call them keep getting added. Who gets added after VA takes over?
/. has lost its editorial independence, at least in theory. You said it yourself "Times are changing", /. has moved beyond unbiased story posting. CT even mentioned it in the Andover takeover, paraphrased "We wanted to sell out to a non-Linux company." Too bad Andover didn't have the same sense of independence.
Aren't the authors also changing? I saw something posted by ?HeUnique? the other day. As
And you just showed one of the problems about ranting, freudian slips..
I case you haven't noticed there have many things posted here that upper mamagement would rather see posted but what can they do about it?
I'm guessing you meant to put a "not" in there somewhere...
The simple fact is that
Until I see strong evidence (quite a bit more than AC postings) of problems I won't let it bother me and I'll still reload, if only to add my voice to the cacophony of crap that eventually lead to some decent discourse. But you guys aren't media virgins anymore, you've been around, you have stock options on the compaines you report about, they also pay you monthly.
At the very least we in this country should have learned to be suspicious about where we get our news and how much to trust it. Now I just have to add another level of b.s. detection and hope you guys fight the good fight.
+&x
As an investor, let me assure you that I'm quite pleased. VA's revenue streams now include hardware sales, advertizing and e-commerce through Think Geek. But that's not the important part. The reason I'm an investor (and that I keep kicking myself for passing up The Letter) is that they're doing all of the right things to build the community. They're trying to be the next Sun Microsystems, and just take a look at what Sun's done over the last 10 years....
Personally I think this guy has got it right, not for the content, he could have raved about Natalie Portman or ranted about M$ (well, he did) or whatever, what he has done, perhaps in not the nicest way but certainly one of the most convincing, is assure me that people at Andover are human, they're people, they rant, they act like kids, just like me sometimes (possibly right now :/
The point is, they're not out to rule the world any more than I am. Actually, thats a scary thought. They're probably out to rule the world less than I am. They're young, probably idealistic, certainly in this case, and therefore not likely to swing for the "whatever it takes to get money" etc garbage that the world-weary find all too easy.
The most confidence a company can give me is that they're just like me. I know what to expect then.
You can't win a fight.
It's an advertising thing.
We're a growing community of geeks with decent income. Most of us are probably able to afford systems from VALinux, so, I bet their plan involves us seeing how well the VA systems work for our favorite website.
You don't see people going crazy like this when Compaq donates many machines to schools and libraries.
Have Taco and Hemos screwed us over in the past? No. If they do, then we have every reason in the world to badger them, but until then, lay off. Give them a chance.
The bonus applies to anyone with a karma over like 25. (I have it, but don't use it usually, I'm using here to show you that I have it too even though I work for a company unrealted to either company.) It is not any kind of special perk.
Myddrin
When she whines, everybody hears it. And Mom and Dad are none to happy with you.
Jack Valenti and the MPAA are to technology as the Boston strangler is to the woman home alone
I can really understand concern about this change -- there are already reporters such as Andrew Leonard over on Salon (who has been a good friend to open source) who believe that at least the appearance of editorial independence has been permanently compromised.
But I can understand some other things as well. Slashdot has always basically been the web site that Rob and Jeff and friends have kept going with bailing wire and Perl for similarly minded crazies. As one of those crazies, I have always tried to be a little grateful to the guys for letting the rest of us come in and play too.
It is very easy for the average slashdotter (many of whom are students) to urge: "Don't touch that Evil Money -- stay pure and poor, just like the good old days!!!" I know no better way to kill something that to try to prevent it from changing. Some of the most pathetic "sights" on the net are those whining that USENET, or GOPHER or whatever is just not what it was and is being "ruined" by all the changes that the newbies bring (I have lived through the imminent death of USENET about three times now) that we need to ACT NOW! to "save" it. Anything you can save by keeping it fron changing is only good for taxidermy.
Slashdot (along with the grits, MEEPTs, firsts, and Natalie Portman) continues to evolve, and the bridge crew here has to evolve as well and make the best lives for themselves that they can -- and that is what we are talking about here. Jeff and Rob and so forth risked their own resources and time to get this thing started, and it is up to them and their buisiness partners to work things out the best they can. So cut them (just a little) slack, OK?
And at the end of the day, the future of Slashdot is not really up to them, it it up to us. If Slashdot ceases to be independent, we'll know fast enough -- things generally aren't that subtle. The slash tarball is available, there are more than one or two Perl hackers around and we haven't run out of bandwith or IP addresses yet. If it is time to move on, we will find somewhere to go, or build it ourselves, in good open source fashion. Just like many of us moved from USENET to here.
And then there are you guys, who are a part of the community. You can be quite churlish at times (see the whole "I smack bitches who mail asking for source" thread ;-), but you guys do go "into the trenches" to answer our questions (witness now).
:-) :
My greatest (and pretty much only) complaint related to slashdot has to do with the incompotence of whomever was responsible for the webcast of the beanie awards
I wish you'd had 3 camera guys at the Beanie awards. Your camera director needed to be faster on those transistions, you needed to get the robot a microphone, and you needed to have better instructions to the men.
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Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
I'm remineded of a few days ago when a certain slashdot bug which let the img tag through (and led to image trolling), led to a lot of -5s.. More than 45 comments were below -1 ;-)
Another time was when someone had a +6 remark, back in December. Perhaps a burp on the part of one of the webserver's ram chips, or a genuine influence?
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Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
"If these stories have no interest to you then please go read something else. No one is putting a gun to your and making you read this web site."
/. and this really isn't about them I guess. I remember back when you could suggest that something be changed or mention something you didn't like without someone throwing a fit at you from the parent company to go read something else.
I wasn't going to complain about
Actually it looks like they ahve a running gpl or the most recent out of date version (something like 2 versions behind the current one).
penguinicide... when jumping out a window just won't do.
......is when he says "*we'll* accept advertisers who are competitors.....". Up till now I've been under the illusion that Rob, Hemos et al have been the ones choosing the advertising, and it always seemed that they were choosing well, perhaps even stuff that they endorsed or thought was interesting. I can't say that every ad interested me, but they all seemed to compliment the idea behind /. quite well. While personally I have a non-click-through policy I would occasionally click a banner on /. to support a site that I love. Now that they don't need the revenue and I've built up in my mind the idea that it's not endorsed stuff so much as bought adverts I don't think I'll ever click-through again.
"Share your knowledge. It's a way to achieve immortality." -- Dalai Lama
Oracle is faster than you might think. You do have to architect it correctly, however, and that primarily means keeping connections open. I agree that starting the gears turning is a slow process, but once you've got them spinning, it can really move data.
--
Interestingly, MySQL is not open source.
Hmmm; you are correct. I forgot they only GPL'd a very old version. I wonder if they stick with MySQL out of some sort of momentum, or if they would consider using Oracle?
--
Oracle on the other hand is as much as 14x slower than MySQL, and has serious performance issues with things like connecting to the database. You absolutely must use database connection caching to get acceptable performance. Not to mention the obscene pricing...
I agree on connections, and really agree on the price, but I have to say the 14x thing is pretty exaggerated. As usual, it depends on what you're doing, and I wouldn't be surprised if you can find a slew of operations that Oracle is 14x faster than MySQL (large databases come to mind).
The fact is that Oracle is pretty much the standard for very large web sites. I mean, I wouldn't use MySQL for a "real" web site where I cared about the data (like an e-commerce application), since MySQL doesn't support commit/rollback.
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I wish they would use Oracle, and then maybe they wouldn't have to flush all the past stories and comments (i.e., the whole database would be searchable). I would imagine the reason they do that is that MySQL is not known for scaling up to large databases.
Unfortunately, Slashdot probably feels they need to use Open Source no matter what, even if that means using inferior software. That's the big problem with embracing a religion, rather than embracing "the best".
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everything is proceeding as i have forseen....
mergers are good in some cases, bad in others. this one looks like a good idea.
jon
-- http://www.cerastes.org
Your purchase of Andover and thus Slashdot has turned into a giant publicity problem for your company. What's more, it's called our attentnion to something we didn't realize before: you also own freshmeat, themes, and sourceforge. You are buying up Open-source community infrastructure, and by the simple fact that you are a publicly-traded company, you are obviously doing this because you want to profit from it! I shudder to think of how.
If you want to serve the open source community, and in so doing garner lots of positive publicity for yourselves, I advise you to do the following:
- Arrange for a well-publicized second release of Slashcode, while you still own Slashdot. This will make you perceived as a company that favours the open-source idea, in that you're publicly releasing some of your most valuable IP, and in so doing, giving news sites that compete with this one a head start.
- Sell Slashdot to Rob & company for $1, and keep the rest of Andover for yourselves. This will make it abundantly clear, even to those who do not read or trust corporate-lawyer-written contracts, that you have no intention of controling the OSS community's news organizations. What's more, it will be so dramatic as to once again distract us from your ownership of lesser infrastructure like Freshmeat, Themes, and Sourceforge, which can thereafter be more freely manipulated toward your own ends, given your company's rock-solid reputation thereafter for respecting the freedom of OSS infrastructure.
No doubt we will continue to read more of your PR department's consoling press releases on this site. Meanwhile, I anxiously await a tangible response from you to our community's concerns.One thing that I think needs work is a bit of feedback on the submission rejected process. We toss an article at you, and see it later as "rejected" the next time we go to post a story.
If we knew WHY something is rejected, we would have a better opinion on whether it was being FAIRLY rejected. Rejected articles should show in our status page, and should at least have a checkbox of rejection reasons or possibly commentary by the reviewer.
Then we could decide on whether you were being biased in story selection.
Personally, I consider Red Hat legitimate but overvalued, LinuxOne a scam, and VA Linux somewhere in between.
For those of you in Silicon Valley, the authors of "The Internet Bubble" are speaking at Kepler's Books in Menlo Park this Wednesday evening. I recommend this to anybody who thinks investing in this outfit is a good idea.
Anyway, take it as a compliment that /. is so popular, you guys have done a good job. We are here now because we enjoy being here. As you said, we do have a choice, If the attraction goes away so will we, we know you know this, but hopefully you also realize that being flamed by the staff is not what keeps us here.
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
Didn't you sort of slide around the question?
As long as you and Rob are here. . . Seems sort of non-commital.
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
I agree. Although I've only been around here for about 18 mos, My perspective is that the whining level has gone down (the troll level has gone up), and I guess one of the pitfalls of having a popular site is that the communication spreads to each extreme. Even with the increase in negative posts, I think the positive posts have increased at the same rate.
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
Haha, are you insinuating that we are a bunch of whiney spoiled brats, who scream and yell when we don't get are way?
We are.
Thanks for the update.
More race stuff in one place,
than any one place on the net.
you know it! ;-) was waiting for someone to see that long-forgotton error message style ;-)
last time I touched a DEC box was over 10 yrs ago. that's about the time I switched over to unix - and never [seriously] looked back since.
still, VAX/VMS holds a lot of nice memories for me. I still miss the inherent versioning in the filespec format ("filename.ext;version"). and the fact that any file can be prefaced by its nodename, so sort of an 'automatic NFS' kind of reference:
node::disk:[dir.dir.dir]file.ext;ver
man, I really miss all that. but unix is a nice close second ;-)
--
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
yup, 4.2a to be exact; the last 'true' vms. before all the license 'pak' crap.
otoh, clustering is now making a come-back. it was way ahead of its time (15 yrs ago) and you can argue that even the most advanced unix-like systems still don't do failover and clustering (and cluster aliasing) as well as was architected in VMS.
--
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
now back to your regularly scheduled unixTalk..
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
at any rate, I'm at a loss to understand why my post was moderated down as flaimbait! it was clearly meant as humor.
ok - so I won't quit my day job and go on the road, touring comedy clubs. but still... ;-)
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
As long as you guys keep yakking, you keep us honest. We can't reject the ideas of the community because you have the freedom to say what you please right here in the comments. The fact that this debate is occuring out here in the public proves that that Slashdot can continue to be open and independant.
As long as people continue to post on Slashdot, that'll be true. It has very little to do with anything that I do.
Pants are still optional, but recommended for you.
/. is not now what is was and it never will be again, just as Linux is not now what it was. The main thing here is that that doesnt matter. That that they have grown into is also interesting, although less so to me.
What's important is this:
If they grow in a positive way, we'll all stay here and hang out.
If they grow to suck, we'll bail. We'll make another one just like it.
A bad change in editorial policy would be seen as censorship, and as we all know, the Internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it.
%phrase-e-overquota: system quota exceeded on use of OpenSource term.
Aha! A VMS geek! You poor fellow...do you realize the damage you are doing to your career? You have to escape from this baroque cul-de-sac of computing while there is still time. Before you are forced to cut down the tallest tree in the forest with...a herring!
Consciousness is not what it thinks it is
Thought exists only as an abstraction
So, VA just wants to do all this for the OSS community for free does it? How does it plan to make money doing this? I am sure that their investors will want to know.
As a hardware vendor it is clear how VA adds value to a free and open platform, Linux and its associated tools. Now they want to help out the developer community. It is nice that they want to help nature open source development, but something in the back of my mind just has to wonder, what's in it for them?
-josh
~> whois slashdot.com@whois.networksolutions.com
[whois.networksolutions.com]
The Data in Network Solutions' WHOIS database is provided by Network
Solutions for information purposes, and to assist persons in obtaining
information about or related to a domain name registration record.
Network Solutions does not guarantee its accuracy. By submitting a
WHOIS query, you agree that you will use this Data only for lawful
purposes and that, under no circumstances will you use this Data to:
(1) allow, enable, or otherwise support the transmission of mass
unsolicited, commercial advertising or solicitations via e-mail
(spam); or (2) enable high volume, automated, electronic processes
that apply to Network Solutions (or its systems). Network Solutions
reserves the right to modify these terms at any time. By submitting
this query, you agree to abide by this policy.
Registrant:
Chris Richardson (SLASHDOT-DOM)
345 S. Mathilda Ave.
Sunnyvale, CA 94086
US
Domain Name: SLASHDOT.COM
Administrative Contact, Billing Contact:
Chris Richardson (CR2220-ORG) crichardson@2WIRE.COM
408-205-8643
Fax- 895-1335
Technical Contact, Zone Contact:
hostmasterpacbellinternetservices (HO1937-ORG) hostmaster@HOSTING.PACBELL.NET
877-494-7261
Record last updated on 10-Jan-2000.
Record created on 17-Nov-1996.
Database last updated on 6-Feb-2000 16:13:57 EST.
Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.HOSTING.PACBELL.NET 216.100.98.11
NS2.HOSTING.PACBELL.NET 216.100.99.11
To those worrying and windging about VA's ownership of /. - settle down. We have the Slash code, don't we? If things go down hill too far, I'm sure someone will light up a new community with the same format, on a different server, under different editorial control. That's the best thing about open source - it keeps everyone honest. Those with a vested interest are going to be even more scrupulous, since it protects thier investments.
"Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm." - Anonymous
In the many decades that I have been visiting /. ('bout a month after it changed from Chips n Dips, if memory serves correctly) I have *never* seen Rob respond to an article (that's not to say he never has, I just don't recall seeing it).
The one time I met Mr. Malda (summer 1998 Durham NC Linux Expo) he said, in response to a rabid fan/groupie as he autographed her backpack "All I do is post articles." Note that he never said he responds, just posts.
Flash forward to today. The High Commander has posted 5 (!) articles. Of course, they have all been moderated up. Which leads me to believe the following:
The VA Linux annexation of Andover was planned by an insider at Andover. Who, you ask? None other than Robert Q. Malda himself!
But what was his motive? I'll tell you. He needed an excuse to post a rely to an article. He knew this would get enough stirred up to justify his replying. So he coordinated with his secret operative at VA (I can't tell you his name, but I'll give you a hint: Geek with gun!) to leverage a synergistic buyout.
But the question remains--why would Malda even want to post a reply? High school, my dear Watson. If you've noticed, ALL of his posts have been moderated up (no doubt the work of that hemos person). I submit to you that CmdrTaco, aka Rob Malda, aka the Speaker of the Puruvian House of Commons, is a KARMA WHORE! Bwaa haa haa haaaaaa.
J.L. (feeling the energy from the 10 Penguin mints he downed courtesy of the fine folks at ThinkGeek)
Letter to the Community on Andover/VA Merger /. belives their own press. I'm saddened to even think they could assume so much power over the rest of the world.
For CHRISTS SAKES!! AGAIN I remind you big-headed average Joes that it was NOT a merger but a freaking buy out.
This is pretty sad when
This is rather sad...
If you lika me like I lika you...
Anybody else notice that the comment by the VA Linux guy above is scored to 4 without an "sum of moderation" remarks attached to the post?
Is it possible that "Kit Cosper", a VA employee, has the ability to score himself up to 4 without moderation?
Or, is my browser somehow dropping the information?
-konstant
Yes! We are all individuals! I'm not!
-konstant
Yes! We are all individuals! I'm not!
Subject pretty much asks it all... I understand that the contract keeps slashdot separate for now, but does it expire ever? What happens in VA wants to take control?
i just want to know, what EXACTLY does Andover.net do, besides buying up linux-related web sites? Are they simply buying them up to give them more sites to sell their advertising to? what gives? a co-worker of mine has suggested they change their name to HandOver.net, much more applicable to their business practices.
ERiAN
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This Post has been brought to you by the letter "E".
I think the key element to remember here, is that Slashdot is not being made by VA Linux, Hemos or CmdrTaco. Yes they facilitate the discussion, but Slashdot is only what it is because of the community around it. Microsoft could buy Slashdot, Hemos and CmdrTaco could leave, but the very moment the essence of Slashdot "News for Nerds. Stuff that matters" changes, the nerds will vote with their feet/mouse and leave. Then this community would die and the value of it would turn to nothing. Jeff and Rob will get a couple of warnings from us and if they don't comply, we would leave... We would take the source code and start over somewhere else. This has been shown in the 5 years that I am on the Internet now. There is no one that can pressure us to come here and as soon as the essence of Slashdot changes no one will. Therefore if VA knows anything about shareholder value they won't change a thing.
Why did they buy Slashdot then, you ask? VA thrives on the efforts in the community. The only reason they can exist, is when the community keeps getting cooler stuff out. This is the only way to play catch up with Microsoft. Slashdot and all the other sites are a great way to organize the community and to make sure it has places to go to and discuss and focus its energy. You can see it in the letter..
Use Adsense for Charity
Five years later, both the WELL and the River continue to operate. The WELL is larger than the River, but the River keeps the WELL honest; if the WELL's management gets out of hand, its members can move to the River, which, by design, offers very similar services.
This strategy could work on Slashdot and Sourceforge. In fact, since the software behind both is open-source, cloning them would be easy. (The WELL ran a proprietary conferencing system, which made starting the River much tougher.) And the hardware is cheaper today.
So I suggest that someone who's into running servers look into bringing up the Slashdot and Sourceforge software, as an alternative to this new media conglomerate. A modest-size but stable operation would be enough to keep this new open-source media conglomerate honest. Take a look at the River and the Well, and see they did it.
Good questions - I can answer them: /always/ accept ads for competitor's to VA. Slashdot and the rest of the web sites are going to be in their business unit, and we're going to operate in much the same way. Frankly, the way the web advertising operates we want to get everyone we can, because we have all sorts of ad space to sell.
We will
Yeah, I'm that guy.
I was debating on posting this, but reading some of the posts below, I have to post this..
Guys, stop being so *DARNED* paranoid. VA is *NOT* buying Andover.net to control the media, in any sence of the word.
No, I'm sorry to tell you, there is no secret consiracy to control your minds, no smoke and mirrors, no implants in your brain to allow VA to control what you read on slashdot.
Why is it that at least half of the posts regarding any sort of corperation being involved in *ANY* sort of OSS boils down to "What's in it for them".
The major complaint that many OSS proponents have is that the 'suits' just don't get it, and their way of thinking is dated, and should be changed. It seems to me, that people asking the 'What's in it for them' question are using the same thought process that they claim to dread.
Did you ever maybee think that 'What's in it for us' is a sidebar?
OSS and it's surrounding community *CAN WORK HAND IN HAND*. That's right. The goals are not different. As a matter of fact, they overlap a whole lot. Companies want to get paid. If they can get paid for providing services someone else provides, and use those funds to enhance the comminity, so they can make more money, LIFE is GOOD for EVERYONE..
No, Mulder, that's not a little green man.. It's a little kid in a Halloween costume. Put DOWN the GUN..
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
I think the motives are are much more subtle than that. The most likely short term reason why VA wants to own these sites is that it brings them positive PR. Being associated with them, particularly if they can allow the creative freedom to continue, is a big win in terms of credibility with the developers.
The big problem I see is that inevitable merger actions will likely happen over the long term. Linux.com is a competitor to /. and Sourceforge is a (IMHO superior) competitor to Freshmeat. Others will argue that there are differences between each pair but they both target similar markets. Money is insidious and as those that have profited lately from being aquired move on, I see linux.com and sourceforge becoming the more important.
While Hemos and Taco are quite vehement about keeping things the same, its important to note that thats people in mergers always say. These guys are young and they've now got lots of money. Over the long run, they'll start to have problems with their mgmt, probably small at first, but they'll build over time. Some day, it will just get to be too much and they'll strike out on their own again.
/. is not now what is was and it never will be again, just as Linux is not now what it was. The main thing here is that that doesnt matter. That that they have grown into is also interesting, although less so to me.
Frank W. Miller
Everyone keeps wondering... "How will slashdot cover VA fairly, now that VA will own slashdot?"
It seems to me that slashdot has a very large contingent of vocal readers, who seem to either 1) not understand US law or 2) refuse to accept US law.
How can things be made any more clear? Slashdot would never have been sold, except that Andover signed over all editorial control. And, now that VA is buying Andover, VA inherits Andover's assets, liabilities, and contractual obligations. VA can do no more under the law than Andover could.
If VA weren't obligated to abide by the terms of Andover's contract... then neither would Malda and Bates be obligated to give them their site. Don't you think that if corporate law allowed for one-sided nullification of contracts in a merger, someone would have noticed before now?
Example: See those slashboxes on the right side of the screen? Don't you think that, if Andover had true editorial control, that slashboxes for all Andover sites would be turned on by default?
In summary, don't be silly. It's unreasonable to think that anything will change editorially, because of this merger. If you don't trust that the contract selling slashdot to Andover is sound, then I don't really see why you sould trust anything at this site to begin with. Either you take Malda and Bates at their word, that their lawyers won an iron-clad contract, or you don't.
I know a bunch of you are worried about what will happen, and whether this is going to change things.
It will.
We're getting new servers. Seriously, things are going to stay the same - the backend will get some more power, but I'm still going to post Athlon stories, Red Hat stories and whatever else strikes my fancy. You know how to get in contact with us if soemthing seems out of place to you - and I trust that you will do so.
Yeah, I'm that guy.
For the most part, the Slashdot community is very bright. If they sense that something's up with the stories getting posted here, you can bet they'll either A) criticize the hell out of them, or B) go elsewhere.
I can't help but think that Rob was dragged kicking and screaming into this one, having rejected an earlier takeover offer by VA.
The thing that turns most people off is probably the money. In our unique community, there's more grassroots and community support/acceptance for a site run by a struggling college student and his friends than there is for a site run by a for-profit corporation. People like to side with the little-guy.
Like Rob said, VA is smart. I like to think that the community is smarter. If VA screws this one up, the Natalie Portman, grits, and Don Knotts guys will be the only people left posting here. I just hope VA is smart enough to realize that.
For instance: What about the advertising? Will Slashdot and Freshmeat still accept (under reasonable terms) advertising from VA's competitors?
Look, I know a lot of you think that this is a non-issue -- you either use ad-blocking software or ignore them or whatever. The reality is that advertising is still a powerful influence in the buying habits of a vast majority of the population -- again, why are Coke and Pepsi so big when Jolly-Good is less expensive? Ads can be effective, and your business cannot grow well without them.
I bring it up because it's a subtle way that VA could shift things in their favor. Frankly, I'm not worried that VA will start submitting their own articles or influencing the editors -- that would be way too obvious, and we'd see through that in a second. If they are going to influence what we see and hear in any way, it'll have to be something subtle like this.
Ideally, I would like to hear that a non-vested party (who owns no VA stock and who is not directly controlled by anyone save Cmdr. Taco) was put in charge of ad sales. Again, let me say that I'm not accusing VA (or any of the /. of Freshmeat crew) of having this planned, it's just something I could see happening. Ask yourself this, though: If you were VA, why would you want to own Slashdot and Freshmeat so badly?
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Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
In short, the reason Slashdot has "changed" is because the authors interests are changing. The world is changing. Times are changing. Holland Michigan was aqcuired by Microsoft/AOL/TimeWarner/VAndover/Viacom... whatever you want to believe.
Is Slashdot slower? Yes. No. Maybe. I don't know. We're always working on that. We're Slashdot junkies like you and we are just as many hops away from our servers as you and we are just as unhappy when Slashdot does not load fast so we're always working on making it faster. Maybe if some bozos would stop running bots to post psychotic fantasies about a certain actress the site would perform even better, but we strive to work around that.
In short if you don't trust that Rob and his gang really are controlling this site then you haven't been paying attention. I case you haven't noticed there have many things posted here that upper mamagement would rather see posted but what can they do about it? Not much. If the Slashdot authors think it is newsworthy and/or just plain amusing, then it gets posted despite managments uneasiness about it.
I'm sorry to rant but I can't help but let people know that the mothership here is not determining what gets put on Slashdot other which ads to run. Most of our VPs don't even read Slashdot. I realize most of you out there understand this already but for the few who don't I post my little rant.
I'll start with a few examples - the best is by the CEO of F-Secure (that produces F-Secure SSH, for example), Risto Siilasmaa. At a recent presentation, he talked about how they talk about their vision to their employees (even temporarily hired folks like telephone operators) . If the vision is believable, the people will buy it, and spread it forward (!) and even defend the company. Thus, it spreads like a virus. Is this a bad thing ? Not necessarily.
I, too, realized, that a certain vision has been sold to me. I used to work at Nokia - where the mantra "Nokia values" is highly valued. While I no longer work there, those "values" are the one thing I remember best. Have I been brainwashed ? No. It is simply that when you see these values applied to your workplace, you can see that they work. Regardless of whether those values are true or not, I nowadays speak positively of my former employer, and I am definitely biased.
Another example is, of course, our favorite software company - you know it - Microsoft. I might not like their vision - but they do have one. And you might have noticed that there are Microsoft employees that fiercly defend their employer.
So, we enter Andover.net and VA Linux. The latter is certainly doing brilliant stuff (well, the former doesn't really exist anymore) and certainly has a bright future ahead. I like that, and I am sure Rob, Hemos and folks like it too. But, taken into account what I said above, they already see things the VA Linux way. Knowing what is happening inside the company, some of the criticism that flows around seems very invalid. And they defend VA Linux. A little switch has been flipped in their brains, and it cannot be flipped back.
I do not think Slashdot will become a VA Linux marketing bulletin, but Slashdot is not, and will never be, independent.
%phrase-e-overquota: system quota exceeded on use of OpenSource term.
so as penance, you'll have to instead use the phrase:
ecky ecky ecky ecky pitang, zuboing!
instead of OpenSource.
I'm sorry, but it had to be done this way. we'll check back in a month to see if your problem is cured; and if so, your system quota will be restored to its previous value.
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."