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More on the Samsung Linux Handheld
Max von H. found the
following on PalmStation: "It seems Samsung is about to ship out a Linux PDA this summer, and it will be called Yopy. Neat, isn't it? " A little slow link, but definitely more interesting then most of the other data on the Samsung devices we've seen in the past. It looks like it's mimicing a lot of the wince stuff... also appears to have a camera option. Nifty stuff
tho.
http://www.sem.samsung.co.kr/eng/product/digital/p da/index.htm
According to this picture, it plays mp3s and has support for wireless email. No voice recording, though.
It does look pretty nifty. Beats WinCE any day. *And* it plays Ricky Martin songs, so you know it's good!
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auntfloyd
That looks really cool, with the web browser and the integrated video. It also apparently does e-mail and plays mp3s and whatnot, but I'd still want an xterm mode. :)
Anyhow, here's the picture with the specs. It's got a 200Mhz ARM chip (probably for low power consumption) and 32MB RAM. Anyone have more info on this?
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pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
Well, I can't really comment too much on how I think this is going to revolutionize Linux, and push Linux over the top, but I'm sure somebody will. What I have to say about this is ... wow ... That thing looks slick.
... wow ... I'm impressed.
I'm basing this totally on aesthetics right now, as it definately appeals to my sense of what a palm-held device ought to look like. I think I've found MY next MP3 Player. Looks like ARM has gone a long way since the last time I checked its progress. Way to go.
Taken from the specs page
Strong CPU of High Performance
Is anyone able to narrow that down a little bit??? I'd kinda like to know what I'm up against if I'm to use this thing for anything other than appointments and MP3s. I'd also like to know how much storage space is available on those "CompactFlash" cards anyway...
Also, anybody have any idea why they chose to create their own 'Yopy browser'? Seems like after going to all the effort to port the OS and get ARM going, they'd just use one of the browsers readily available to choose from. The Linux scene is definately hopping with them.
Again,
Now, on the poster in this picture, it mentions voice recording as a feature. Silly me.
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auntfloyd
This is cool too: Samsung and Lineo Press Release.
Samsung is falling into the same pitfall as the manufacturers of WinCE devices before them. Trying to cram an entire desktop operating system into a handheld is simply ludicrous. Admittedly, Linux is pprobably better suited for these purposes than CE, but it doesn't look Samsung did a whole lot to tune the interface for a PDA. As a user of both Palm and CE devices, I much prefer a simplified GUI like the Palm. It seems like this would have been possible with Linux, but the screenshots still show the dreaded Start menu. Alas, a good idea shot down by poor implementation.
How hard would it to put a word ignore in our prefrences? With defautls of "Natalie Portman", "hot grits" and "beowulf", and an excessive caps ignore? If a post contains any of the words, it doesn't get displayed, regardless of the score.
Then I could read the couple decent AC posts without having to read at +2 and hoping some poort sap that reads at 0 or 1 moderates them up.
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Finally, someone came out with a PDA that has a button arrangement for playing games. :) Very similar to a gameboy...
The reason I ask, is it would be pretty easy (?) to run the distributed.net client(s), and if it has a reasonably fast processor, it wouldn't be a waste.
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon?
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon? :P)
(If you can't figure out how to E-Mail me, Don't.
While a Linux handheld would be cool in its own right, I see very few references to what applications this thing is going to run. Have they been developed by Samsung? If this is going to be a useful PDA, then I hope they are going to have to have some decent PDA-style applications to go along with it.
I'm a little suspicious that none of the screenshots are showing any scheduling programs or other PDA-mainstays.
--
enjoy 10 Mbit
yopy mirror
So does this mean Samsung's got a handwriting recognition client for Linux? I wonder if they'll GPL it.
...without a keyboard?
Questions I have:
1. Does a keyboard peripheral exist or is one planned?
2. Can you get beneath the desktop? It would be great if they allowed the user to customize the interface. They could even create new interfaces later and let you switch between the one you want.
3. The battery is listed as 1400mA Recharge Li-Ion. Has anyone heard any estimates of how long it lasts? (esp. when used as a continuous MP3 player.)
4. I want the power! Can the user trash features they don't want to make room for features they do? (If I don't get the camera, I don't want the baggage.)
5. Okay, if I do want the camera, am I stuck with just one choice? Price?
Nitpicking aside... looks way cool.
Work as if you don't need the money,
Love as if you've never been hurt, and
Dance as if no one's watching.
So, rather than appear foolish afterward, I renounce seeming clever now.
I would assume the compact flash slot in the top is different than storage space, and thus you can swap out compact flash just like removable storage. i.e. one for apps, one for games, one for mp3's, etc. This is one of the things I really liked about the Newton, it had two pc card slots for extra swappable storage.
When you hear about something like this, you really have to ask yourself, is it practical? Linux is a UNIX. No matter how slimmed down, it still carries a lot of UNIX baggage. It still has a lot of complexity that a PDA really doesn't need. MS has fallen into the same trap by shoe-horning windows into PDAs and ended up with the monstrosity that is WinCE. Even in text mode, Linux needs about 4 meg to run comfortably. Thats great when you have a 32 meg RAM PC, but think about it, that 32 meg is mostly going to storage for apps. So in the end, you really end up with about 8 meg or so, and if half that is taken up by the OS, that leaves precious little for the OS. PDAs are in a strange position. They are too big for a PalmOS type OS, but too small for a desktop or laptop OS. Instead of shrinking the desktop OS, doesn't it make sense to enlarge the small OS? I would think that a better starting point for a device like this would be QNX. The kernel is 32K, includeds networking, and Photon is really small and fast. Of course you still have the problem that make WinCE handhelds a pain to use. The desktop metaphor reeks on a 4" screen! Ideally, you'd have a taskbar with a start menu type thing, and would switch apps just by clicking on the taskbar. Throw out the rest of this desktop metaphor. There is a reason that palms are so popular; the interface fits on a PDA. It seems to me that Palm, GeOS, and Netwon are the only ones who ever "got it."
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
It's got a start bar. Please tell me you can disable that...
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
(although I get a feeling that the first 100 off the line will be going to VLNX/ADVR and
Excuse me, but it is hard to type with all the drool gushing on my keyboard....
www.eFax.com are spammers
The way I see it, it all comes down to what you can do with it. You could put linux on a toaster if you wanted to but what would be the point? If you can actually use it LIKE linux, on this pda then that's great, but I think realisticly that all the os is probally going to be on a rom somewhere leaving you with no customization maybe meaning that you are stuck running KDE, Gnome or what ever they want you to.
Now as for all this talk of playing quake or other games, I don't think it would be very good just for the fact of the strange resolution that it probally has, and that there are only two buttons and a directional type pad, would make it bad to play.
All I have seen on this is the pictures on the link from this story, and the info on samsung's page, but from what I can see, it looks just like Samsung is trying to hop on the Linux bandwagon.
It does look like a nice palmtop though, so it might be a good product. I'm just worried about the actual customizability.
-DNS
I couldn't help but notice--not only does the GUI look exactly like WinCE, even the hardware looks like a WinCE PDA (judging from what I've seen of my friend's Cassiopeia). Most of the buttons seem to be the same. The select dial and escape but are identical, right down to the labels, to those on the Cassiopeia.
From all that I can find on ARM's and Samsung's website, it appears that the CPU in the machine is some member of the ARM9 family, probably the
ARM9E-S, because it includes DSP instructions. The spec sheet for the PDA says it has a 3D audio codec (probably dolby because the ARM9 dsp can handle that) plays MP3s and MPEG video, all of which the ARM9E-S is perfectly suited to do. You can go too this website http://www.arm.com/Pro+Peripherals/Cores/ARM9ES/
to find out some more about the CPU. Its a really nice CPU, puts out about 200 something MIPS and uses about 1.3 or 2.5 mW/MHz depending on the what voltage its running at.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
But it looks gnarly. Pretty close, better in fact, than my Ultimate Gadget I made last year.
_ .:*~*:._.
I wonder how much my car is worth...?
.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:._.:*~*:.
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ASCII art?? I thought it was a REGULAR expression
Hi!
It mentions USB port in specs. I am wondering
does this USB port allows only to connect this
PDA to computer, or does it also allows to
connect various devices to PDA?
Connecting USB keyboard or ZIP drive
could be pretty cool option!
it is submersible!
metatr0n.net - the digital divine
Just wondering, how did this post get rated -2?
Well, if you take a good look at his post, you'll see that he mentioned both Internet Explorer and Windows 95, yet he did not even make one juvenile anti-Microsoft comment. You see, we're at Slashdot, and that kind of behavior is just unacceptable here. Hope this helps.
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Just thought I'd share a couple of ideas with you about what I think the ideal features of a PDA are, and what samsung got right (plus a few things they got wrong).
First, a PDA should definately run Linux, or maybe NetBSD. These are pretty much the 2 most scalable OSes out there (at least in the downward direction) that don't sacrifice any of the functionality or compatibility you get on larger systems. Having a unified platform between the desktop and the handheld is important for developers, and neither wince or PalmOS does this.
Plus, Linux is extremely stable, which is very important in the embedded market. Think if you're on a vacation and your PDA fails. "Darn honey, my handheld just crashed. I've lost the road map, our music for the car, the photos we took at the grand canyon, and my notes for my meeting on Monday." Not a good thing.
Secondly, the interface should not be a "desktop-clone". Multiple cascading menus are far too much clutter for a PDA screen. The UI should be simple and intuitive and targeted for handheld applications, not desktop ones. PalmOS does a very good job of this. Wince does not. It's my opinion that PDAs should use some version of X so that development is easy, but none of the current window managers are going to do very well on such a small screen, so a new interface is necessary.
Thirdly, the device should have advanced multimedia and productivity capabilities. It should have things like an MP3 and movie player. It should have a word processor and a spreadsheet. It should definately have a graphical web browser. Wince has these things, PalmOS doesn't. It's my belief that a Linux PDA should have all of these applications, but they should have a much simpler interface than their desktop cousins.
Anonymous Luddite: "What do you think of the dehumanizing effects of the Internet?"
Andy Grove: "Not Much."
This is great BUT!
-Will it sync with Linux?
-When/Where can i get the source?
-looks a good deal bigger than my PalmVx.
-seems more aimed at portable multimedia than PDA
If i bought one it would not replace my palm. It would however complement it nicely. Although Yopy can do PIM stuff, it would seem more useful as an MP3, portable video, radio, and internet device. BTW, i like how it will use a mobile phone to connect to the internet instead of requiring that you buy a new device and pay exorbitant prices for mobile internet.
Opinionated Law Student Strikes Again!
And that button should take you into EMACS.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
The GMate guy at CeBIT expected the price to be in the US$400-600 range, depending on memory size (16/32MB or 32/32MB RAM/Flash). BTW: This 1400mAh battery is said to last about 10h ... Mali
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Cebit is still on, go there - see the Ericsson palm sized Epoc device with bluetooth, GPS etc. See Psion demo Quartz in their stand, see Symbian demo Quartz in their stand.
it's in my head
The crinkly bits compared to a palm are:
The pictures on the original page indicate that Linux will run out of 32-megs of ROM and 32-megs of RAM. It also looks like SAMSUNG is going to try to take advantage of all the chip's features (the disappointing thing about Palm is that they didn't take advantage of all the Dragonball's features).
The thing to remember is that Samsung is like only putting together a reference design from Intel with a reference implementation of Linux (probably from Lineo) and standard off-the-shelf apps (like MP3 players) with minor modifications. The PDA-style apps are probably the Lineo PDA suite. Getting all this to work well in a limitted power budget will be tough enough. The first version will probably not contain any wizbang features beyond this.
The burning questions I have:
Don't forget that you could stick an IBM Microdrive in that CF slot instead :)
-- qube
If this little whizbang is indeed running Linux (and, I assume, X as it seems to have a GUI) then there shouldn't be anything stopping us, the community, from getting in there and enhancing/replacing whatever we don't like.
Don't like their GUI? Great! Write an X app to replace it.
Makes me wonder what they're using on top of X for window management...
I'm hoping eventually to see palmtops with just a connector for some virtual-reality glasses. Then, you can have as complex a desktop as your electronics can support in a portable package, and without constraining the actual computing module by the shape of the output device.
Of course, the proper input device for such a beasty is probably still under debate. If you have a complicated desktop possible, then one of those handheld cording keyboards would probably be more efficient than a stylus arrangement.
You may be surprised at how cheap small color LCD screens are.
LCD's get exponentially harder to build as the size goes up...
this means tiny ones are dirt cheap, and big ones are really expensive.
a 1 inch color LCD screen is a only a few dollars.
Thank you for your interest .
our product would be available by the end of May in US and Europe.
Thanks again.
Best Regards.
Paul H. Yoo
Sales & Marketing
G.MATE, Inc.
E-mail: paulyoo@gmate.co.kr
Tel: 82-342-738-1241
Fax: 82-342-738-1212
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Littlefield"
To:
Sent: Monday, February 28, 2000 8:50 AM
Subject: Linux PDA
> Looks Like a winning product.
>
> Where can I buy this?
>
> Thank you
>
>
They use W-Windows, which is GPL'ed. Soon they will release a toolkit with an interface similar to gtk.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist
Yes, if you read the specs, it says that it has an FM radio built-in.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist
I just registered yopy.org (G.Mate has yopy.com and yopy.net). Once it hits the root nameservers, I'm gonna make a mailing list for would-be Yopy owners. The email address for subscriptions will be discuss-subscribe@yopy.org, but that won't work for another day or so.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist
I'll disagree with this vehemently. It is precisely because of good AC content that I don't set my threshhold at 1, way too many times have I seen good or funny AC quickies. I've even shot off a few myself from time to time. Trolls suck (except for the good ones, you know who you are), but it's the good ACs that cause the problem.
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+&x
http://yopy.org. Go there. Sign onto the mailing list. Do it now. Be happy.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist