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It's Official: MS Office 10 Subscription Version
F.Prefect writes: "Microsoft is going to be releasing a 'subscription version' of Office 10. This version will actually stop allowing a user to create new documents after the subscription period ends. Read their press release. Although they will still offer a non-subscription version for more money, I can't help but think that Office 11 or some subsequent software package will do away with non-subscription versions entirely ..." Seeding of the .NET "cloud of services" has officially begun, it looks like. Press releases, of course, try to make you want to buy the products they're pushing, but this one is a head-scratcher. It boils down to "It works like the regular version, but you get to pay for it again this time next year, too, or it breaks!" Won't IT manager types get tired of this?
The market is stagnant. What new/brilliant/whatever features has any word processor put out in the last five years? The only new things I can think of are import/export filters, and a new document format that's incompatible with the old one. Word processors are essentially a commodity product now. The only problem is, there aren't being charged like one. Microsoft isn't the only one to blame, either. All of the proprietary word processors are like that. Anyway, the upgrade cycles on these things are nuts, and totally useless anyway.
Engineering and the Ultimate
Maybe now they'll also allow it to stop crashing after the subscription period ends.
"I have not failed. I've simply found 10,000 ways that won't work." --Thomas Edison
I think this won't last long. You'll see the same type of apps build on top of Mozilla for free, and people will realize what they are missing....
-- Jason@mozillazine.org
Let the experiment begin.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Bundled.
The plan is not getting users to buy subscriptions. They'll sell this to computer makers, to be bundled with desktops and notebooks. This way, they force the users to either renew or buy Office after one year.
And this won't be a problem for the computer makers, because they won't _have_ any option. First, it will be cheaper, naturally. Second, Microsoft will railroad any opposing makers into accepting it. For instance, by simply not offering the unlimited version at lower prices.
It's brilliant.
/me pats pats his FreeBSD
(8-DCS)
I guess - if you pushed them - the posters in this thread would state their belief that they think MS has a big problem: why should users continue to pay to upgrade MS applications, when there is as near as damnit no difference between one Word version and the next. We guess that MS thinks, "a ha! if we can get the user to hire the application rather than buy it, we have revenue for life".
Even the press release - bless it - gives the game away. They speak of "at a lower initial cost" which begs the thought that the lifetime cost will be greater.
And the conspiracy theory? I think it is reasonable to speculate that MS would like to be a service company rather than a product company - especially in a marketplace in which the commoditisation of products is driving price.
We don't think MS is stupid. We know they are very clever indeed - especially at the business of business models. And the subscription business model is clearly more attractive than the "I'm happy with my Office 2000 and don't feel inclined ever again up pay to upgrade".
o A reasonable price would deter people from pirating the software
o It's an immense value-add for MSN
o It's the perfect entry for a "desktop anywhere" feature, which would put your documents at your service via ANYPLACE you login.
Here's the best part: make this available for X-Box users. Suddenly, the kid's toy becomes a VERY inexpensive replacement for the computer. AND Microsoft will get a handy stream of revenue. If they sell 10 million X-boxes in a couple of years... and even 5% of those end up with a subscription to MSN and Office at $25/mo, we're talking about $150million/year. US alone. AND they'll dominate the browser, 'cause it's their platform.
There's more: How fast can HP or Epson write a app for the X-Box to use their digital cameras with it? Scanners? Will it have a firewire port? How about hooking up the camcorder? DVD player, right? I've heard it's going to support HDTV resolutions - so if it's done right, it'll be on every videophile's list too, especially if someone writes their own HD-DVD format - just upgrade the software DVD player!
The possibilities really are endless with this one... by Microsoft creating the hardware, and the OS, they're doing what IBM wish they had done back in 1980-81 with the IBM-PC. By providing the subscription to the software, they're giving themselves a constant revenue stream for years to come.
It gets more and more interesting EVERY DAY.
> Open source advocates are always talking about the virtue of choice, but when MS offers choice, they cry foul. How convenient.
7 .html
So, either you can pay MS once, or you can pay them every year. Gosh golly Captain Wizzbang, what will they think of next??? Maybe they'll add a paperclip on crack as their next feature . . .
Being told ``you can pay us so much now, or you can pay us the same amount each year" is not a choice. Unless you are braindead & need more than 5 seconds to decide between the two options.
> And don't come out with the crazy conspiracy theory that "Office 11 will be subscription only". First of all, it attributes to MS a
> level of stupidity they simply lack. And there is simply not basis for that statement.
Interesting. Leaked memos have been available for a couple of years showing that Billg & Ballmer have seriously entertained this concept. After all, their End User Agreements state that you have NOT bought the software, just leased the right to use the binary. And if UCITA passes in your jurisdiction, be sure that they will change the terms of the contract.
And have you ignored the fact that MS requires companies with site licenses to pay for their software *twice*? Once for the concenience of having it pre-installed, & once for blowing it away so that the tested, & corporate-approved version can be installed. A quick search on Gogle turned up this URL: http://www.canada.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-242730
As for the charge of ``stupidity", I think the better word describe any company that stands squarely behind UCITA is ``venial".
MS is seeing the numbers of sales begin to slide; migration from NT to Win 2000 is far less than what Gartner & others predicted. So MS has to get the revenue from somewhere. Which means this braindead licensing choice. And if they DON'T force theri customer base to migrate to a subscription basis, then they ARE stupid.
Geoff
I think I see a trend here. Maybe for them it really would be easier to muzzle the entire internet than to produce p
Microsoft has been doing a pretty good job of tweaking their products just enough to get people (and businesses) flocking to upgrade even with very little new development. Windows 98 SE and Me upgrades from Win98 cost the same as the Win98 upgrade from Win95, but there is much less development in them. Same price, less work, higher profits. Nothing new. Although in many cases the "less work" usually comes with higher productivity (so the end product is the same quality), but it doesn't seem like this will be the case.
Anywho, the advantage of services instead of products for the consumer is that (theoretically) setup, installation, upgrades, support, etc. are easier. However, (as mentioned above) services come at a significant loss of "rights" for the consumer. Ownership is very powerful, and in many ways very desireable. When you rent something you loose control over it and it's no longer yours entirely. In the next few years there will be a major "shakedown" of what people choose to be services and what people choose to own.
Personally, I think the service model (for some uses) is very valid, but I also worry about the transfer of rights and powers from the public to the big corporations. I think that ultimately most people won't want to give up their ownership of basic software, and (perhaps more importantly) there will be a large base of free or purchasable software out there keeping the big guys' services in check to keep things from getting out of hand. I suppose we will just have to wait and see, but it's bound to be interesting no matter how it plays out, let's just hope it's not too interesting.
All righty then, Mr. Smarty Pants, why is it good? What extra service does the "rent" (vs. own) get you? What is it that would make me "buy" this rather than a version that doesn't auto-destruct? MS claims this is "an exciting new opportunity" -- for who? Their bankers?
There's exactly one reason this will be accespted in the market, if it is at all:
So, I get it cheaper, but I gotta pay next year. I suppose this is actually Microsoft trying to compete with the Warez market. They ship "works" with a lot of prefab PCs these days. So what happens then? I'll wager that, a lot of the time, people bring home Office CDs from work and/or get them from friends. For free. With no subscription fee. So, if they can go legal and get upgrades automatically for less than paying retail for the thing, then they might. Plus, I can see the MS playing out this way: "Computers are hard to keep working right! Upgrades, patches, work, work, work! Pay us and they'll always work right. Friendly MS agents will visit your computer through your spiffy DSL line and make sure you always have the latest, greatest, bug-free stuff." They'll turn "Windows Update" into a revenue stream.
I wonder what the per-seat issues will be for business and/or homes? Renewal is annual, not one number-of-documents, as far as I can tell. So, if I install in on my wife's laptop and my desktop, so I subscribe twice? I don't subscribe twice to cable, or the newspaper.
Open source advocates are always talking about the virtue of choice, but when MS offers choice, they cry foul.
Oh, puhlease. MS is offering the same software in either case, merely with two different payment options. One, the traditional "costs too much" payment option, and two, the "ransom" option. The whole idea of software as a service is sort of ludicrous.
________________________________________
Napster-to-go says "Fill and refill your compatible MP3 player", which is a lie. It's not MP3. It's WMA with DRM.
- When are Microsoft going to ship Office 11?
- What's the cost of a years subscription, relative to a full license?
- Where's the break even point?
- If I choose to subscribe to Office 10, do I auto-subscribe to Office 11?
- Can I subscribe individual components (say Word and Excel, but not PowerPoint?
Microsoft seem to be hoping that people won't work out how long they'll resubscribe for, and may make additional funding on the difference. You know many people aren't going to do the long term thinking here - they'll just see a lower initial price.See Rob's comments in Geeks in Space as regards rental of his TiVo - he's coming up against a break-even point of rental vs purchase - he'd hoped that a better version would be available so he could change for less money....
... and today's pet project has
Ah, but you see, the PC2001 specification will include a credit-card reader! The box will actually say "INSERT COIN TO CONTINUE" and will have a progress meter* counting down the seconds. You see, Bill actually wants to return us all to they heyday of computing he grew up in. That's right. The video arcade. .NET is actually "MS Return of Arcade," without pacman.
*counts backwards in years
________________________________________
Napster-to-go says "Fill and refill your compatible MP3 player", which is a lie. It's not MP3. It's WMA with DRM.
So day 1 you make an empty document of each type and archive it ..... from then on you just duplicate empty documents on the desktop rather than using office to make them for you .... or better yet - download those warez empty documents from the net ..... can you just see M$ going to court trying to ban the giving away of empty documents .... :-) "but your Honor - they're a device designed to 'subvert an access mechanism'" - "in rebutal - 'we made them with Windows - it's time it was banned'"
Microsoft operates as a series of individual business units. While that gives them the maximum flexibility to try new things, it also means they often have to learn the same lesson more than once.
Take subscriptions for instance. MS Visual C/C++ wanted to go that model, as many programmers here may recall. "Buy 4.0 and subscribe to MSDN, you'll get 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, every three months like clockwork." Well, the versions came out... 4.0, 4.1, slip, 4.2, slip, slip, slip, uh, 6.0!
By going to a subscription model, they give the user false impression that the product will continue to advance on a rigid schedule. There's no way to win:
if it doesn't come out on time, the customer will feel seriously jypped at the renewal dues;
if it DOES come out on time, the customer has to churn all those desktops' installations to keep step with the advances, or relegate the expensive updates to dusty shelfware.
If they use some sort of lockout like cheap nag shareware, a la "It's February, you can't use the Save feature until you renew your Office subscription dues..." some people will definitely find alternatives. They'll have to keep increasing the dues as the flock of docile sheep dwindles.
[
ARGH!
This is no different from the existing terms. In fact, it's worse. Now M$ can force you to pay an arbitrary fee, and the program (and thus access to your data) won't work if you don't continue to pay. In other words, they blackmail you with your own data, and worst of all this is actually legal.
This, more than anything, only proves that Microsoft must be stopped. They're advocating the very monstrosity they basically created: a model where you don't even own the software you buy. In the end, this is going to result in one of two things. In the most optimistic outcome, people finally realize what Microsoft is doing, and they abandon it. More likely, however, is that more corporations -and not just in the software industry- will adopt this model, and in the end we all become little more than a sort of slave class, except that instead of being forced to give them endless labor, we're forced to give them endless cash for something we've already bought and paid for.
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"This copy of MS Office failed to autodestruct. Check your Dial-Up Networking propertises and try again later."
Like so many things M$, the PR sounds good. In exchange for a fee, I get an easily updated, constantly state of the art office software product. As it is a 'lease' or 'rental' as opposed to a purchase, it is now a cost of doing business as opposed to a capital improvement (or that is my understanding of the appropriate tax law). In addition, if forthcoming improvements don't exist, I end the revenue stream from my company to them.
Problems:
It will probably be a dumbed down version, no matter what. Expect even worse 'support' for other file formats. Probably some lame requirement that my subscription can't transfer to a new machine without some additional fee. I expect it to be as easy to cancel your subscription as an AOL subscription (now we know what those two are REALLY cooking up;).
What would be most useful for my company:
Have M$ Word substantially cheaper than Office. A whole lot cheaper. We don't use PowerPoint or Excel. It would be nice to not have to pay 50% for 20% of the functionality.
Let us buy based not on time, but on the number of documents created. We don't even do much stuff in Word. Why pay that much for something used so infrequently?
(Yes, yes, Star Office, Abi Word, etc. We don't have the time/money to do the training on them. And I don't have the will or desire to support them, (I'd do it alone, whereas others in the office would be willing to install/support more commercial based solutions.))
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
So long as there still is an option to purchase at a flat fee for the retail customer, subscription licensing is a nice option to have. That's basically how most larger organizations (like mine) pay for Microsoft software today - and most of our other software, too.
I negotiate a price for the annual agreement, and the company, in turn, sends me discs (or gives me access to a download point) as long as the license is current. If we choose to extend the contract, we remain entitled to the product. If we don't renew it, we are legally obligated to get rid of it.
This is different from OEM licenses (which we don't get with our systems, since we have a Microsoft Enterprise agreement - so we don't have to pay twice) in that OEM software is licensed to the specific PC it enters the building with, and retail software which is generally allowed for a single PC, but you have the right to uninstall it and then reinstall it on a different system. Enterprise licensing is a flat fee per seat per year that covers Windows (any version), Office (any version Professional or below - not Premium), and BackOffice CALs to access the servers. If you subscribe to Enterprise and don't renew, you legally have to buy the software through other means (though the discs they send you aren't time-bombed) in order to keep using it.
It sounds restrictive, but it saves my company a lot of money, assuming I upgrade software every couple of years. It makes licensing a simple matter from a cost perspective, easy to track and predict, and the software we get already has product ID's burned into it so I don't have to use keys to install any of it.
In fact, my McAfee subscription works pretty much the same way (but for two-year terms), as do several of my other enterprise-wide products (and most of our mainframe applications). All this really does is extend the model down to smaller businesses and individuals who couldn't get on these type of plans before.
So I'd have to say I like it. So long as the traditional purchase option remains available, choice is a Good Thing.
- -Josh Turiel
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
Why would I pay again and again for a downgraded version (10) when I already own a much, much higher version (2000)? Isn't this kind of like "upgrading" RedHat 7.0 with Linux kernel 2.0?
Sheesh. Do they really think we're THAT stupid?
...is the messagebox that reads : "Please save your work. This copy of MS Office will autodestruct in 10,9,8..."
And don't come out with the crazy conspiracy theory that "Office 11 will be subscription only". First of all, it attributes to MS a level of stupidity they simply lack. And there is simply not basis for that statement.
Open source advocates are always talking about the virtue of choice, but when MS offers choice, they cry foul. How convenient.
Are you adequate?
...in about, oh, one year I bet a whole bunch of pissed-off IT managers move to StarOffice on a real (Solaris/Linux/BSD/HP) platform.
Sun should be working on an Enterprise-scale migration utility... afterall, the cutover date has just been made official.
--
Do daemons dream of electric sleep()?
Revolutionary hardware device offers home users and small-business a new choice for payment options
LAS VEGAS -- Nov. 13, 2000 -- Today at COMDEX/Fall 2000, Microsoft Corp. announced a new hardware option to accompany subscription services for Office 10®, Millenium® and Win2000® operating systems, Outlook®, Microsoft Mouse®; which will provide customers with an exciting new opportunity to subscribe to the world's leading software products for a per-usage fee. This new device will enable home and small-business customers to acquire the latest microsoft products without the troublesome one-time up-front fee while receiving product upgrades released during their subscription at no additional expense (installation and upgrade fees not included). Customers will be able to obtain usage of Microsoft® products via a hardware device that accepts coins and bills and attaches to their computer via the serial port. Microsoft Coinbox® promises users peace of mind that their software and hardware are properly licenced and accounted for at all times. Such unheralded freedom will revolutionize the way you and your company do business.
Here are some examples of Microsoft Coinbox in operation: Upon starting your PC, users will insert $2 to cover the licensing of the start-up sequence and the first hour of using their operating system. Users also have the luxury of pre-paying for operating system usage, up to 4 hours at a time. Being renown for our user friendly interfaces, Microsoft® includes a "parking meter" digital gauge to keep users informed of their time.
To properly keep track of Microsoft Mouse® usage, users will insert 50 cents. Coinbox® automatically deducts 1 cent for every left-button click, 2 cents for right-button. Users will rejoice!
The following rules will apply for Microsoft Office® products:
Reading an Office® document: 25 cents per access
Writing an Office® document: 35 cents per access
Reading and writing an Office® document: 50 cents per access(note the huge saving!)
Finally, Coinbox® will take postage for Outlook items:
Regular e-mail: 33 cents
Reciepted e-mail: 76 cents. Coinbox will save you annoying trips to the post office!
Access fee for contacts®: 5 cents per usage
Rent for Calendar®: 17 cents for a quarter hour, $4.80 for daily events (more savings!)
Once Coinbox is installed, users need not worry about its maintenance. Through the wonders of ActiveX® technology, Coinbox® will automatically contact Microsoft Collection Services over the World Wide Web everytime it's full. A friendly Microsoft Technician will come into your office or home after-hours to empty Coinbox®. It's that simple! Coinbox is simple, user freindly, and it's a Microsoft product so you know it's secure!
Also coming soon from Microsoft: ChangeMachine® for Coinbox®, and Coinbox® for Laptops (weighs only 15 pounds!)
Basically all they did was put a time limit on the purchase of the regular version. It will take M$ a few more years to get to the .NET level, where the application is delivered over the Internet. Personally, I like this model more than the .NET model, I still get a CD, control over how/when/where it's installed, and no questionable off-line support.
Think outside the... Hey, where'd the friggin' box go?
...of the many companies providing irritating cripple-ware to consumers. Microsoft's "innovation"? Paying the "registration" fee only gets you another year. Blegh.
www.code-fix.com
I think consumers will resist the software rental model strongly ... it has no advantadges and alot of disadvantadges ... and star office is always free
Free Techno/Jazz/DNB/MI Music by guys obsessed with monkeys!
An important question is, "Why is Microsoft doing this?" Who are they targeting with this offer: individuals, or corporations?
Individuals will be unlikely to see a subscription program as beneficial. However, we must remember that the average computer user isn't familiar with the concept of software licensing. Most people who purchase Microsoft Office believe that they are doing just that: purchasing Microsoft Office. Of course, these people aren't going to like the idea of subscriptions, because they will see it as 'renting' that which they can just as easily buy.
Corporations, however, understand the concept of licensing. They are quite familiar with exactly who owns Microsoft software, just as they are familiar with the fact that "bigger and better" is, in the software industry, rarely very far off.
If Microsoft really wants to push a subscription idea, they'll start at the corporate level, and consider what they want the model to be. If they're going to institute a subscription program, they have to think beyond the initial payment. They have to consider what will keep the subscriber paying. When Individual X rents an apartment, that individual's rent entitles him/her not simply to use of the apartment space for the allotted time, but also to certain duties on the part of the landlord. If Microsoft is prepared to provide subscribers with additional support -- if that subscription fee entitles the subscriber to more than simply use of the program -- then corporations may very well decide to participate in such a program.
Microsoft should, for instance, keep track of subscriptions and renewal deadlines itself. Leaving this burden in the lap of the customer does introduce an added difficulty, especially for companies purchasing multiple subscriptions. Microsoft should also not set a schedule for updates; instead, it should focus on maintaining operability for its subscribers, and simply provide updates and support when they become available. A magazine needs to interact little with its subscribers, who use its product once per month; a subscription for something which is used on a daily basis, however, requires regular attention. Microsoft cannot sit back and hope to collect fees once per year, but with a bit of effort they could present a subscription program that would look very attractive to some customers.
Executed prudently, a subscription model such as this can work.
crib
Please don't read my journal
Oh yes, IT departments do get tired of this.
Which is exactly why the company I'm working for is already getting ready to switch to Linux, first partly, if it works out they'll continue migrating to Linux (also for the Desktop!)
We have used NT servers for some years, they work fine (most of the time) but they cost a lot of money! Not to mention Win98+Office 2000 etc. etc.
Now we're already running Linux or FreeBSD on most servers, and documentation will be written in HTML instead of Word-documents. Add a word->HTML converter to be able to read Word documents sent by costumers via e-mail (in this case it usually does not really matter whether the layout exactly matches the original), and you're done.
The big reason why I'll be allowed to use Linux on my desktop? Licensing money!
Every expression is true, for a given value of 'true'
Of course anything that Microsoft proposes will immediately make the Slashdot crowd assume the idea is crap. What prejudice! This idea, of hosted services that a user pays a subscription or one-time use fee to use is excellent. I would much rather pay for Word on this model, rather than having to buy, install, and patch Office. This could work well for smaller software companies. No longer do you have to physically produce software packages and ship them to stores. Instead your customers can use their browser to access your program and pay you for it. This should make the industry much more competitive.
What a lot of Slashdot readers who think that open source free software is the only way to go fail to realize is that many people are willing to pay for software and pay for its continued development. Is it morally wrong for corporations and others to fund the Apache Foundation? Hell no. These entities have a vested interest in the continued growth of the apache software. Likewise for many offices that type up documents and do spreadsheets they have a vested interest in the continued development of Office.
Stuart Eichert
Stuart Eichert
If customers do not renew or install an upgrade product, they can still open, view and print their existing documents.
--
My God! Did ANYONE read the article!?
-Pete
Soccer Goal Plans
M$ will track documents by serial number and PREVENT YOU from opening documents written by someone who hasn't kept up with his Office 11 bill...
"Hey! How come I can't open the status report from two months ago?"
"Oh, apparently they went out of business and their license for Office was revoked. If we pay a $5 fee they'll let us transfer that document to our license."
--- Jump!! Fire!! Bullet time!! - Lego version of the Matrix
Do you not realize that profit = net income - net expenses? If you lower net income BUT lower net expenses further, your net profit increases!! If MS distributes Office over the Web only (not far away), then that saves a bundle of money on shipping/CD stamping/etc. Also, since people are paying on a per-feature basis, MS will quickly learn what features are profitable and which ones aren't. They then can stop spending time on developing features that people don't find useful enough to pay for...
I could not justify my existence if I were a turkey farmer. Would I terminate myself? Undoubtably, yes.
Office is expensive, I think everyone agrees with that. Office also works well, even though it is Microsoft.
:)
I use Office for a number of things that I just can't get done with Abiword or StarOffice right now. My publisher uses templates that only work in MS Word, even when I'm doing something on Linux which is a whole other discussion.
When a project comes up that requires MS Office something like this subscription model may work well. It may also help others that could use it, but don't want to drop $500 at one time on it. I'm not so sure how well this will be adopted to businesses. When our Internet connection goes down I hear enough complaining about no web and email, I don't want to have to worry about no Office apps for the marketing and sales department too.
Hundreds (perhaps thousands) are subscribed to the developer's lists.
www.openoffice.org
Yes.
With all due respect, it sounds like you don't know what the hell is going on, so I hardly think you're the best authority to claim "no-one is doing anything".
Sun coordinated with COLLAB.NET to make sure the launch of staroffice included mailing lists, CVS archives, bug trackers, build instructions, and working source. The 60 meg source downloads and builds with zero effort if you read the very clear instructions.
Of course, you didn't do any of that, and you didn't even bother looking at the source, but that didn't stop you voicing your damn ignorant opinion.