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Want To Playtest An Xbox?
drix writes: "Microsoft is recruiting people to playtest the Xbox!"
Someone over there has got to be reading! Let me have a crack at one guys! (Course, if they don't the conspiracy theorists will know why:
and don't say, "Rob Doesn't Live in Seattle" cuz that's too easy. Course who am I kidding: The Microsoft conspirators are too busy saying the xbox will the crappiest system ever without ever touching one. I just see it as Microsoft's way of saying, "We're not a monopoly. Promise!" as they attempt to swallow another industry. The system may very well rock).
come on folks. microsoft is the king of user-acceptance testing. if anyone had any doubt they'd do this, they aught to check their head.
and it's a dang good business decision too. any product should go through this procedure.
http://kered.org
The microsoft conspirators are to busy saying the xbox will the crappiest system ever without ever touching one.
Are you okay Cmdr Taco? It sounds like you're having a bad day :-)
yes. this is for the masses. you, too, can get your very own X-box before M$ ships them in stores.
to get one, simply call gateway, or dell, or one of your favorite x-box manufacturers and ask them for the X-box special. this includes:
a 700Mhz processor
a DVD player
a large hard drive.
nVidia GeForce2
no keyboard or mouse (those are extra)
whabam! you have yourself an x-box.
Bill Gates:"No, really...it's not just a repackaged computer. i fucking SWEAR!!!!"
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
Larry Elison is giving out Oracle8i Licenses?
Cool!
um.. I done, you can stop reading...
I am become Troll, destroyer of threads
Someone over there has got to be reading! Let me have a crack at one guys! (Course, if they don't the conspiracy theorists will know why: and don't say "Rob Doesn't Live in Seattle" cuz thats to easy. Course who am I kidding: The microsoft conspirators are to busy saying the xbox will the crappiest system ever without ever touching one. I just see it as Microsoft's way of saying "We're not a monopoly. Promise!" as they attempt to swallow another industry. The system may very well rock).
dear lord taco, lay off the coffee late after 5pm.
As I live in Seattle I figured I would just see if it would work. Oddly enough the "submit" button does not work in Netscape for Linux. Perhaps Mozilla? ;-)
Evil Empires always have better stuff its a proven fact. Look at Star Wars for example. Rebels are running around in comfortable clothing for the most part, while the stormtroopers have that cool armor stuff. And who did Boba Fett work for? EVIL EMPIRE Evil Empires always have better stuff.
Given a reasonably level playing field, who would win a fight between a bear and a shark?
Unfortunately Microsoft has infinate resources to throw at this... so unlike Nintendo, Sega, or any other of the bread-and-butter console players, Microsoft can keep releasing new products again and again, failing until they eventually get it right. If they fail long enough, they will bundle it with free high speed Internet/WebTV, or simply a free console.
No matter how great the short term loss, long term success is all they care about.
Even the design of the site with bright colors and flashy catchphrases (* Get FREE stuff!) If they were really looking for quality testers they would probably take a much more lowkey approach (probably contacting previous testers before making an announcement like this).
As good as Microsoft is at software development, they are even better at promotion.
Given a reasonably level playing field, who would win a fight between a bear and a shark?
The All-in-Wonder Radeon is a fucking awesome card. Great 3D (up there with a Geforce2 GTS), the best TV tuner i've seen, excellent video capture, excellent video out, wonderful hardware motion compensation, and even a coax digital sound out for good measure.
Crappy cards? Think again.
Actually, it isn't enough anti-MS bias. They look to be getting off of the Monopoly (tm) charge with a slap on the wrist. Even if they are broken in half, so what. That just gives them two monopolies. They need to be broken into about 20 pieces.
Now if you had said that there was no good reason to say the X-Box software would BSOD, that would be a different matter. One advantage of a totally new platform is that they don't need to maintain 8-bit and 16-bit compatibility, so they may well do a good job, or at least they have a pretty good chance. But it's nearly impossible to be too biased against MS.
Caution: Now approaching the (technological) singularity.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Everything we've heard so far about the X-box seems to indicate that it's going to be an ordinary console with everything that that entails in terms of tight control over software, severe manufacturer-imposed constraints on products, and ridiculously high licensing costs.
:-)
I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark on the basis of Microsoft's acknowledged ability to create markets for its products, and suggest that in practice the X-box will become the exact opposite of a conventional console as described in the paragraph above. Instead, it will become an entirely open platform, in practice.
Why do I think that this may be so? For a number of reasons:-
First, the console market is already fairly highly subscribed if not totally saturated, so the X-box will have to be pretty special to make a large proportion of gamers reach into their pockets again. All the other popular consoles are closed platforms. A way of becoming "pretty special" is ready and waiting. [The still-to-be-launched Indrema is doing something similar, albeit with a certification hurdle imposed, but hopefully this will not be a substantive barrier.]
Second, it just so happens that virtually all the big players in the console arena either have or will be bringing out new mega-powerful systems within the same time frame, so high technology alone may not be enough, especially since Microsoft is a latecomer to this market. A novel angle may be required to make headway.
Third, Microsoft knows full well that the popularity of Windows stems very largely from the massive buzz that was created by several years worth of unimpeded free-for-all copying of both the O/S and its applications. The official face of Microsoft may protest about "piracy", but unofficially they must know that in reality unconstrained access is an extremely powerful popularizing mechanism, vastly cheaper yet more effective than advertising.
These three things all point in the same direction: Microsoft will either make the platform fully open, or it will create an easy and inexpensive method for all and sundry to write and install games on the X-box, or it will turn a very blind eye to the cracking systems which will appear 2 microseconds after the machine hits the streets. Nothing is gained by restricting what can run on a platform (all the talk of controlling for "quality" is unadulterated rubbish --- people like to decide for themselves, thank you very much), but everything is gained by having thousands of products run on a console rather than merely hundreds.
We'll see.
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
I actually had a copy of Ready to Rumble by Midway that locked the Dreamcast hard. If I recall correctly Midway recalled thousands of the initial release of the game.
A large group of people who are appalled at the thought of being given free, state-of-the-art
Microsoft hardware in hopes that their help will make it better
are also...
A large group of people who are thrilled at the thought of being given free, state-of-the-art
Linux software in hopes that their help will make it better
The most interesting questions from my point of view were 1) What is the most important part of game design and 2) Who is the 'director' equivalent in a game.
We were having dinner at four separate tables, so we got four different groups of people answering the questions; but the answers were completely uniform. 1) The most important part of a game is the 'game-play', the way that the button presses influence the way the game works. Next is visuals, last is 'story'. 2) The 'director', as it were, are the game testers; the people who sit there and play the game all day, every day, as it is developed; to determine how it works and feels. We were quite surprised, and asked the question a few different ways; but the answer was always the same.
Now, Microsoft is not writing the games (are they?) but are building the boxes, so testers would have a different role there. Still, it's a very important one.
thad
I love Mondays. On a Monday, anything is possible.
I think Microsoft might be able to actually pull it off, though.
... hell, a very *scary* way. They really are like the Borg in some respects. One step at a time, relentless. Anyways, MS captured the software market only a wee bit at a time. They're not even there yet. All they've got is a iron grip on desktop software, and a good foot in the door on medium-sized servers. But they keep expanding. Windows CE on one end, NT+IA64 on the other.
Whether you're talking about Sun or Apple or what have you, they all tried to take on everything at once. Hardware, software, connectivity.
Microsoft, however, has done things in a very methodical
I don't know where it started, but they keep getting a bigger piece of the pie. Then they start on their neighbor's pie. One step at a time.
Damnit, they're fucking scary.
Dave
Barclay family motto:
Aut agere aut mori.
(Either action or death.)
Barclay family motto:
Aut agere aut mori.
(Either action or death.)
It's a cool concept but it's not based around Microsofts main objective. Are they palnning a business shift. Will they spread them selves over many areas and not really maintain the stability of one? (all mishaps to date aside) I thought that as a company that has generally ruined it's reputation, or shall I say, put a dent in it's status in the course of the last year, would have more interest in making up for lost respect. Aren't there isues to be dealt with in terms of the future of the compasny and it's ability to stay in the OS market? Not that I think they could even re-write the book for a better out come, but they could damn sure try. Instead they are targeting a narrow segment of the population in order to establish itself as a magical mystical being in the eyes of kids who are too young to understand what kind of mess Microsoft has piled up around itself.
.
As wacky as this might sound, the XBox might turn out to be a great opportunity for Linux gaming. Since all XBoxes will contain the same hardware, it's a cinch to put together a bootable Linux CD that has everything pre-configured for the known devices in the box. Load that puppy up with NVidia (or whatever) drivers, the sound drivers for whatever audio is in there, and lots of pre-configured settings, and you've got a Linux-based skeleton upon which games could be written.
... geek heaven!
Since I'm not a gamer, I have other ideas. If I didn't strongly object to giving $$$ to the evil empire, I'd pick one of these things up, load Linux on it, and use it as a home multimedia terminal connected both to my LAN and to the television and stereo. View web pages on the TV, play MP3's off the server, pick up streaming audio, control the lights in the house via X-10
And just think -- with XFree86 running on it, it'd be a real X-Box!
--
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PSX2 A Dissapointment? Christ. Wait 6 months. Wait longer. Wait for the *real* games. I fully intend to get this system just for the Square games anyhow.
-- dieman - Scott Dier
Atari followed the "let anybody build a game" philosophy, and got some serious trash games. Far more than what is available on today's systems. Having a gatekeeper seems to have worked well on modern (post-Atari 2600) consoles.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Two small problem with your arguement. The dreamcast bears a logo that states Compatible with WinCE, not powered by. Secondly WinCE games for the dreamcast are extremely few and far between. WinCE on dreamcast has a reputation for slow loading times, and wasting alot of resources.
The only game I can think of that runs WinCE on the dreamcast is some vegas gambling game. Think Shenmue, Jet Grind Radio, or NFL2K1 run WinCE underneath? Nope. Now, you are right, bsod's on dreamcasts are few and far between. But it has little to do with Microsoft. Prolly 95% of the games for it have nothing to do with WinCE, and wont load it. I'm all for giving Microsoft credit when they deserve it, but the dreamcast's success has little to do with them.
"My head hurts, My feet stink, and I dont love Jesus." -Jimmy Buffett
Personally, I'm amazed that they appear to be going through with it- X-Box will bankrupt them. The smart thing to do would have been hyping it to kill PS2 adoption, and then quietly let it die like Farenheit or .NET without spending too much. They may be actually trying to go through with it- I didn't think they were that stupid. I guess they mix the Kool-Aid pretty strong up there in Redmond :)
Haven't needed tech support yet, it's worked beautifully on my Athlon box. And, there's been at least 5 driver releases since I bought it two months ago.
:P
And, i bought it for less than a Geforce2 with video-in/out and no tv tuner at all. This card handles all the video needs I have beautifully. Replaced a Geforce + tv tuner + video capture card gorgeously.
Oh yeah, 2D is wonderful too
they'll probably have an option where you can change the color of the screen of death and market it as a feature.
Zetetic
Seeking; proceeding by inquiry.
Elench
A specious but fallacious argument; a sophism.
Copying of windows had precisely no effect on anything. Having Windows come with everything is what made Windows big - that, and running DOS accounting software.
My blog: http://www.seebs.net/log/ --- My iPhone/iPad app: http://www.seebs.net/seebsfrac/
Just to clear up some things about playtesting for Microsoft like the requirement of living in the seattle "area" and the free stuff. Pretty much you just have to live with-in driving distance of Seattle. My brother and I play tested Crimson Skies for them and you just have to make an appointment with them once they've called you to set it up then drive up there to play the stuff. Its not like a Beta test where they send out the CDs, you go in so they can poke and prod you while you play the game. As for the Free stuff you get to pick an item off of a list. When we went it was all computer games. Hope that clears up any misconceptions.
When you apply to be a Microsoft playtester, you are put into a general pool. Based on the information that you give during signup, as well as information gleaned from previous playtesting sessions (which involve alot of paperwork), they build a profile of your gaming interests and experience. When they want to test any given product, they build a series of ideal profiles for the testers which are then matched against existing profiles, and contact the individuals with the closest matches, with preference given to previous testers (already familiar with the system, know how to give meaningful feedback, etc). What this boils down to is that you sign up for testing in general, what (if anything) you are offered tests for will vary depending on what the needs are for any particular set of tests, usually separate groups for lots of experience in relevant areas as well as no real experience in the given area.
Democracy is dead. All kneel to the Commander In Thief.
Yes, it's always someone else's fault, never the poor design of the OS, which AFAIK doesn't produce core dumps, making it more difficult to debug errors on users' PCs and thus fix them more quickly and accurately.
I've seen WinCE crash on a workmate's HP Jornada, but no doubt it was HP's fault and nothing to do with the flawless software from Redmond.
Except for the EULA of course, barring you from using any other but Microsoft software.
That depends on whether they sell the X-box or just loan it out under a license. If the latter then you could be right, but if the former then the hardware is yours and you can do what the heck you like with it.
Of course, the previous point will be highly debated by lawyers what with DVDs and DeCSS and the DMCA and all that, but everyone will ignore such restrictions utterly because any possible law in this area would be unenforceable. Somehow I don't think that taxpayers around the world would be too happy if their police forces start dedicating their resources to raiding a million console users.
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
I don't see it. I see the media saying the sky is falling, and I see corporations failing to upgrade tens of thousands of machines (if not more) first because of y2k freezes, then because of hardware shortages. This year might show a turnaround... unless this silly pseudo-recession impacts the sales.
Nonetheless, I wasn't speaking specifically of PC sales. This is the strategy they've been using on the handheld platform too. Operating systems are still desparately required by corporations, as are perpetual system replacements, upgrades and license renewal.
Sony and Nintendo have oodles of power, but they have not locked in... the world?... to their plaform.
What do you mean by 'Culture of Economy?'
Ever heard of a good opensource game? Freeciv? LOL.
What about TOD? or Hampsterdeath? or Tux Racer? Or any of the many cross-platform Allegro games? Or the entire GNOME Entertainment collection? I forgive you for not having looked hard enough.
Tetris on drugs, NES music, and GNOME vs. KDE Bingo.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Sure, you could spend hours hacking around yourself to get Win98 working, but I doubt you're an example the average projected X-Box user. The nice thing about running Linux games on the X-Box would be that it wouldn't have to be hacked by users; *game publishers* could do it, putting a stripped-down, drivers-installed Linux distro on the CD configured to boot directly to the video game on the same CD. You can't do that with Win98, not without per-CD licensing fees swallowing your revenues.
The subject line is a joke that mirrors many of the posts under this story. The sad thing is that many of these neanderthals are SERIOUS.
The irony is that any Microsoft produced book on code design, code quality testing, management, etc., absolutely FLY off the shelves. I've had Linux anti-MS zealots recomment MS Press books that basically document the internal work activities at Microsoft. Doesn't anyone see the absurdity of this paradox? Any of you people who talk about the "notoriously bad code quality" of Microsoft code please ensure that you get rid of all of those MSPress books that line your bookshelves.
Of course the reality is that Microsoft is a benchmark for code quality in the industry, with some of the lowest failure rates per line of code in the field. Do I wish they did a better job? Absolutely! Most of us would love if the failure rate was 0.0%. I would love if Windows could run on any mixture of a virtually infinite combination of hardware with drivers of astronomically varying quality levels and auto-magically fix code problems in third party applications. I would love if they made their code immune to the meanderings of poorly written third party applications (i.e. DLL hell though it is largely immune to it as of Windows 2000). However we must dream on.
As far as anecdotal evidence there are always reams of people yapping about how they define the standards because on their system Windows 2000 BSODs once a day, and NT 4...it BSODs before you even start it up. Then again there are many people like myself that have run 2000 without a single BSOD...ever (have single applications failed? Absolutely...but never taking down the system). I manage heavily used NT4 SP6a systems that run several months on end perfectly until finally being rebooted to enact a new security fix.
Bah. I don't even know why I'm going down this path. The reality is that Microsoft produces code that is better than average in the industry. With a solid, target platform and minimal services running on the system (i.e. it's pretty damn easy for a PS2 to be stable when the game is _ALL_ that's running on the machine...the propensity for failure is geometrically proportional to the complexity of the system) I have no doubt whatsoever that the system will be rock solid. Of course the day a game by Basement Publications crashes it'll somehow be considered MS' fault.
It's very easy to support VBScript, in windows all you do is make IActiveScriptSite object, and create an IActiveScript object from the vbscript.dll. if you can support any script language, then you should be able to support VBScript no problem.
Also Microsoft has been known to license VBScript, the now defunked Chili!Soft licensed it so they could port ASP to *nix. Everyone says Microsoft policy is to "Embrace and Extend" this is true, but sometimes the extensions are worth while, I find VBScript a much easier language then JavaScript. the MS DOM makes a lot more sense then the Netscape DOM, people should support what Microsoft has done, even if the WC3 has gotten around to it.
-Jon
btw: i'm not trolling, I believe this
this is my sig.
A stray application should never, never never have priviledge to take a machine down, period.
No, it shouldn't. Who doesn't agree with that? However if that "stray application" interacts with a system `feature' in a way that exploits a flaw that exists in system code then it can take the system down JUST LIKE IT CAN IN ANY MAINSTREAM OPERATING SYSTEM. A lot of the video driver runs in ring 0 in NT & 2000, just like the drivers do in Linux, and if an application twiddles the bits just right yes it can bring the system down, though it's the system bringing the system down, not an application. Your moronic perspective that this simply shouldn't be possible is absurd (i.e. you're saying that all system calls have to be 100% stable under any situation and condition which is ridiculously naive) and the only OS that should satisfy you is QNX. I certainly hope you're not a Linux fan because an errant driver called can certainly take the system down. As far as me blaming third party applications I did in two ways:
As far as your claim that "Microsoft created their own ratsnest when they decided that the operating system should provide everything for everybody instead of clean". Let me give you a little piece of advice : You don't have to run DirectX games on your [mother's] server system(s). Oh, what's that? You're running your machine as a game machine? What's that : You're using shit video drivers from a crap vendor? Oh.... okay. Well gosh in that case yes Microsoft should march right over to your hardware vendor and give them a stern talking to! This is unacceptable! DAMN THAT MICROSOFT!
Dreamcast games that use WinCE will have a specail addition to the sega start up screen with the windows logo and i think it says powered by windowsCE as well. but to be honest, i've been avoiding the wince games at all cost, so i wasn't paying much attention. BTW- shenmue is *not* a WinCE game :)
The solution to that problem is to brand games 'X-Box Approved' (and trademark that) so that the public can tell which ones are MS certified. The rest just say something that isn't a trademarked phrase, such as 'Works with an MS(r) X-Box(tm)'. Much the same as replacement windshield wipers saying 'Works with Ford(r) F150(tm) and etc...'
The reason that MS wants to license games has sweet fuck nothing to do with quality, it's because they sell the console at a loss and want to make up for it with the game sales. And since they don't write the games, they want a piece of the games that other people make.
There's nothing (legally) that they can do to stop someone from sitting down and writing a game for the X-Box. In fact, reverse-engineering any piracy prevention measures to make your game work with them is about the only use allowed for under the DMCA (which would only hit US game companies anyways.) I'm sure MS would lie, cheat, and steal, throwing fake lawsuits at anyone who tried this, but then that's their tactic with everything.