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Quake For The iPaq

Posted by timothy on from the start-shaking dept.

hooded1 writes: "Although once considered a utopian ideal, it has now become a reality. Last night on January 20th Dan East released the alpha version of PocketQuake, the first successful port of Quake to any pda. ... Currently PocketQuake only runs on the iPaq." And Jacek Fedorynski points to this screenshot as well. Note that this only works for iPaqs running WinCE, not Linux.

42 of 148 comments (clear)

  1. I got 'em by Bomb+Regardless · · Score: 2

    Here they are: http://research.compaq.com/wrl/projects/itsy/movie s.htm

    Oh, & the Itsy runs Linux...

    --
    I'm a bomb regardless
  2. Cool. by seirei · · Score: 4

    This is a really ambitious port. I noticed it only runs on ARM based PDA's. Which is interesting considering Nintendo's new gameboy variation (called GameBoy Advance) will be ARM based. Specs of GBA: [http://www.gameboy.com/gbadvance.html] I wonder how hard it would be to port to this? I don't think the instruction set would differ too much. (unless they have some kind of custom cpu core) Though getting it on to a nintendo cartridge would probably be the harder part.(?)

    1. Re:Cool. by Raptor+CK · · Score: 2

      Tex.. that's it!
      (Note: when I say Wolfenstein, I mean "Wolf-like")

      As for Doomlikes, the non-orthogonal walls should be a cinch, but that's not what I'm worried about. It's that pesky y-axis (for those of you who don't know, we walk on an X/Z plane. Y is up. Or at least that's how I learned to do 3D) Without SuperFX, though? Nothing doing.

      Also, a retraction. GBA runs at 16MHz. Even slower. That makes the iPaq over 12 times faster, as it's running at slightly over 200MHz on another ARM variant.

      All in all, the FPS scene will exist, but it's looking grim. Unless they add a SuperFX gamepak at some point (which will suck battery life like mad), we're going to be dealing with something between Wolf3D and Doom, unless there are some major changes in 3d engine design for a tile-based system.

      Best of luck, though. I'd love to play a nice high-detail FPS on a handheld console.

      Raptor

      --
      Raptor
      "Procrastination is great. It gives me a lot more time to do things that I'm never going to do."
    2. Re:Cool. by Raptor+CK · · Score: 2

      ::Turns red::

      Ok, so I was slightly off. Slightly!

      Dark Arena's doing the Y-axis pretty well. I wonder if it's really handling floors and ramps properly, though...

      In short, I probably underestimated the system a tad *too* much. Kudos to Nintendo.


      Raptor

      --
      Raptor
      "Procrastination is great. It gives me a lot more time to do things that I'm never going to do."
    3. Re:Cool. by AaronStJ · · Score: 2

      This is a really ambitious port. I noticed it only runs on ARM based PDA's. Which is interesting considering Nintendo's new gameboy variation (called GameBoy Advance) will be ARM based. Specs of GBA: [http://www.gameboy.com/gbadvance.html] I wonder how hard it would be to port to this? I don't think the instruction set would differ too much. (unless they have some kind of custom cpu core)

      The GameBoy Advance uses the ARM7DTMI, which is a standard CPU, unlike the GB(C) which uses an almost standard CPU. Any code written for an ARM CPU should be portable to the GBA, especially if it is in C, since there is an excellent C compiler for the GBA. While GBA developement tools are only available toe registered developers, there is quite a homebrew scene built up around the GB(C) and the same is beginning to happen for the GBa already, so I expect to see this sort of thing for the GBA.

      Though getting it on to a nintendo cartridge would probably be the harder part.(?)

      Actually, I don't think that will be teh hard part at all. There exists numerous "backup devices" for the GB(C) that can read cartridges and also write to a flash ROM based cartridge. These devices are widely used among both hobbyist developers and also R0Mz kidz. Since backup devices for the GB(C) are so popular, it seems likely that we'll see them for the GBA as well.

      The "hard part" involved in writing or porting an FPS to the GBA is, like it's predecessor, it uses a tile based display system. The pixel are not individually accesable. While it is possible to overcome this with clever use of the tiles, it is still a hurdle to face and can create a bottleneck. On a system like the GB(C), getting around the tile based graphics has proven to be prohibitively difficult in almost every case. The GBA's graphics system, however, is much easier to manipulate, so I expect we'll see a couple of FPSes for it.

      --
      Stupid like a fox!
    4. Re:Cool. by Kreeblah · · Score: 2

      > Though getting it on to a nintendo cartridge would probably be the harder part

      Not particularly. You can get all the hardware you would need (including flash carts) at http://www.reinerziegler.de

    5. Re:Cool. by Raptor+CK · · Score: 2

      Well... not quite. Doom is one thing, Wolfenstein is another, even though both really require individual pixel access, or at least some really nice hacks.

      I *know* I've seen this before on ign.com, but I can't find the link at the moment. The GBC *can* do Wolfenstein (which is considerably easier, when you think about it), so I'll go so far as to at least *hope* that the GBA can run a Doomlike, given enough work, even though it lacks a SuperFX equivalent (SNES Doom used it, IIRC).

      Quake, however, is out of the question. There's a massive difference between a pseudo-3D hack and a full blown polygon rendering engine, and the GBA's 30-40 MHz CPU (again, IIRC) will not be up to snuff for that level of detail. Something like Elite, maybe. Texture mapping? High polygon counts? err... no. The only way I see it working is with vastly different level design, such as using a non-polygonal system for maps, and very low poly count models to fight against. I'll never go so far as to say it can't be done, but I'll have to say it won't be easy, and it won't be done the same way as its PDA/PC counterparts.


      Raptor

      --
      Raptor
      "Procrastination is great. It gives me a lot more time to do things that I'm never going to do."
  3. Re:Sorry, Linux zealots, this Quake is for WinCE. by deeznutsclan · · Score: 2

    I guess it was for the benefit of the moderators.

    --
    Those who can, do. Those who can't, post on Slashdot about it.
  4. Re:Quake for the iPaq? by mmontour · · Score: 2

    Ah but if I wanted to nitpick, I could argue that that is indeed not a CRT, because it doesnt employ an electron gun nor include a vacuum tube.

    There's vacuum between the electron-emitting structures at the back and the phosphors at the front. An electric potential accelerates the electrons across this gap, providing the energy they need to excite the phosphors. For me, that's close enough to fit the terms "vacuum tube" and "electron gun".

    The two main differences between this technology and a "traditional" CRT are:
    (1) cold-cathode electron emission rather than hot-cathode (from a heated filament).
    (2) One "electron gun" per phosphor dot, rather than a single steered beam.

    But the original question was just about a PDA form factor "CRT", not a "hot-cathode raster-scanned CRT"...

  5. No port for Linux? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    Give me 5 minutes...

  6. Damn ^3 by Ando[evilmedic] · · Score: 5

    It will never run on my Palm IIIc.

    It would feel more turn-based though. :-)

    - Ando

  7. Re:Quake for the iPaq? by MustardMan · · Score: 2

    flat CRT? I have never heard of such a thing. There are other viable flat-screen technologies, but I fail to see how a cathode ray tube could possibly be fit into a PDA form factor. Otherwise, I tend to agree with the rest of your points.

  8. Try one first by Zico · · Score: 4
    The iPaq's got a Sony-made, side-lit passive matrix display which is awesome, despite only having 4K colors. Here's what c|net said about it:
    Rather than being backlit like other color LCDs, the iPaq instead has small lights around its edge, which reflect off the screen and make it brilliantly bright, even when outdoors in direct sunlight.

    Secondly, how many buttons and keys do you think you need? The iPaq's got a directional control plus four buttons in front, and probably 3 or 4 along the side. So, I don't really buy either of your complaints.

    The glaring weakness of gaming on the iPaq is Compaq did a poor job of making sure that the buttons act independently of each other. The Cassiopeia handles this perfectly, though, so it's not some inherent problem with PDAs. If Compaq would quit being stubborn and fix that button problem in their next model, they'd have an even bigger winner on their hands than they do with the current one.


    Cheers,

  9. Poorly written software gets "ported" by QuantumG · · Score: 2

    why is this news? One truely has to ask. If the software was portable it would be easy to port and therefore a port of the software should be news to about 10 people who want to play quake on a PDA. Yawn. But because the software is hard to port we all stand up and cheer when they port it? Why? Shouldn't we answer this news with "uhh.. we port stuff to different platforms every day, that's what writing portable code is all about?"

    Not that I've played quake in the last 2 years. Bravo, you ported some software.. woo hoo.

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
  10. Re:It raises the question... by KupekKupoppo · · Score: 2

    I think you missed my point, and also turned my post into flamebait, which was not the intention.

    While what he did is an accomplishment in its form, I'm pointing out that the larger, group projects are what sets the Linux and OpenSource community apart. Think of how the Linux kernel is developed.

    If you took the effort on some of these smaller[1] projects, and took the group and devoted that time to making the bigger products that will finally replace M$ as the front market, well, then ...M$ would be replaced by the effort.

    1 - Although, upon reading some other posts (I.E. the architectural thread on the subject), the 3D engine aspect of it is great.

    Usefulness deserves consideration, as well. Games are good, and the geek factor is high, but this shouldn't be the crowning achievement you'd like to say it is.

    And next time, log in, AC.

    -k.

  11. Re:TI-86 port by Akira1 · · Score: 2

    FYI, the link to the doom port, not wolf3d or quake, but close is as follows:
    http://www.ticalc.org/archives/files/fileinfo/14 /1 451.html
    I remember my TI-85 back in high school, we used to play multiplayer games of pong via the link cable, and all the other various things. What im looken for is Dope Wars for the TI-85, I love that game =) and it looks like that is here:
    http://www.ticalc.org/archives/files/fileinfo/10 3/ 10384.html
    wow, now all I need to do is find my serial to calculator adaptor.

    --
    Food: It's whats for dinner
  12. Re:Congrats to the developers. by istartedi · · Score: 2

    cant this also be easily ported to Linux since Quake was GPL'd?

    This has to be one of the silliest things I've ever seen on /., which is saying alot. What, praytell does the license have to do with portability?

    --
    For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
  13. Re:Quake for the iPaq? by mmontour · · Score: 2

    flat CRT? I have never heard of such a thing. There are other viable flat-screen technologies, but I fail to see how a cathode ray tube could possibly be fit into a PDA form factor.

    Here's one way to do it, called a field-emitter array . Electrons are emitted from a microstructured silicon substrate, then strike phosphors and produce light just like in a standard CRT.

  14. GPL Violation? by SMN · · Score: 2

    I just downloaded the zip from the website, but saw no source code -- just the exe and a readme. Since the Quake source upon which this is based is GPL'd, shouldn't the source be included?

    --
    -- Imagine how much more advanced our technology would be if we had eight fingers per hand.
    1. Re:GPL Violation? by EvlG · · Score: 2

      That doesn't mean we should be tolerant. We, as a community, should demand source releases be timely. Waiting until code is in a "more stable state" could mean that we are waiting for weeks or months. That is unacceptable. The fact is, id gave the community a gift in the form of the Quake source. Why should some members of that community be allowed to be selfish, and take it all for themselves? They shouldn't, and we shouldn't let them.

  15. Board Meetings by OakLEE · · Score: 2

    Hehe, now instead of falling asleep at board meetings, me and the rest of the tech team will spend the entire time playing Quake.

    Boss: Great job gentlemen, all of you have your PDA's out taking notes I see.

    HUMILIATION!

    Me: Dammit! Er... um I mean, ya that's what we should do witht the leak in HR, dam it!
    Boss: Good idea man, you'll get a raise for that!

    _____________________________

    --
    The sun beams down on a brand new day, No more welfare tax to pay, Unsightly slums gone up in flashing light...
    1. Re:Board Meetings by SEWilco · · Score: 2

      This calls for an IR repeater to put in the middle of the table for everyone to point their PDAs toward...

  16. Re:This has potential by Cederic · · Score: 2


    Hmm, especially if you hook it up to a GPS. And maybe to the thing mentioned on (either /. or BBC News) that used cable and pipe plans to depict a model of the terrain under a road so that works would know where to dig to fix the gas/water pipes.

    Suddenly 3D models of the building you're walking towards could become possible.

    But we knew this - people have wanted this ability built into their sunglasses for years.

    ~Cederic

  17. Re:FINALLY! by Milican · · Score: 2

    Umm.. Palm PDAs adhere to the KISS principle. They don't jam in 32MB of RAM, 200+MHz processors, etc.. to make up for a bloated OS like Pocket PC PDAs. So there just isn't the power in a elegantly engineered 16MHz Palm to do this..

    JOhn

    --
    Campaign for Liberty
  18. Re:Wrong... NewtonQuake was first... by Skankmofo · · Score: 2

    If I remember correctly, this was a hoax, no one could get it to load on their newtons, though many tried, then someone took it apart and found that it was just a file with 2mb of filler.

    --
    "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep." --Saul Belloe
  19. Are you high? by rjh · · Score: 4

    That doesn't mean we should be tolerant.

    Right. Tolerance is for weenies. I must've missed that bit of social wisdom when people were teaching me how civilized human beings act.

    We, as a community, should demand source releases be timely.

    And the code release is not timely how? The fellow just released the code, and he's told people he doesn't want to release the code in this immature state, not that he will not release the code.

    Even RMS allows this sort of coding to go on. Take a look at early Brave GNU Worlds. There are references to RMS receiving binaries of a proto-bash, and the author saying "this is just to look at, there are a couple of bugs I want to fix before I send source".

    The basic underpinning of the GPL is the notion that individuals can agree to be friends. The GPL is not a legal contract so much as it is a social one; it is a social contract of openness and consideration.

    Now, if three months pass and this fellow still hasn't released source, then there's a need to say "hey, guy, I don't care how bad the source is, just send me the tarball". If he still refuses, then unleash the holy wrath of the GPL.

    But until such time as the fellow is no longer acting in good faith with the community, we need to give him full benefit of the doubt and believe that he'll be true to his word, with source forthcoming within a week or two.

    This is why, after fifteen years of believing in the ideals of free software, I'm beginning to get disgusted with the free software community. Too many zealots who believe that any transgression against the GPL, no matter how minor, is tantamount to treason against the community.

    RMS first wrote the GPL because he thought there was something wrong, something morally offensive, in treating your fellow users like serfs or faceless masses instead of treating other users like human beings, like people, like friends.

    Are you really living up to the ideal?

  20. GPL Violation? NOT!!! by |_uke · · Score: 2

    It is only a GPL Violation if he refuses to send you the source after you REQUEST it from him. He is not required to make the source easy to get to. He is only required to send it to you via some means if you ASK HIM for it. He could, if he wanted.. send it to you only on cdrom.. for the cost of the media. Just because the source is not directly availible does not mean its in violation.

    This information is in the actual text of the gpl. Its availible for anyone to read. Im tired of all these 'ohh but its violating the GPL' comments when there is no real violation. Come on guys :)

    --
    Luke
  21. Re:Network support would be easy by Russ+Nelson · · Score: 2

    It doesn't use any Win32 APIs. It supports Beame & Whiteside TCP/IP. Runs over Crynwr packet drivers. And a wireless connection rocks. I was a LPB for a while, until Clarkson shut down my back-door wireless T-1 equivalent.
    -russ

    --
    Don't piss off The Angry Economist
  22. Re:Wrong... NewtonQuake was first... by Bomb+Regardless · · Score: 2

    See the very bottom of the page at http://www.emeraldnet.net/~ravenous/NewtonQuake/fa q.htm

    --
    I'm a bomb regardless
  23. mirror in australia by jason+andrade · · Score: 2

    i've mirrored the pocketquake release at:

    ftp://ftp.planetmirror.com/pub/pocketquake/
    http://ftp.planetmirror.com/pub/pocketquake/

    -jason

  24. Hardware issue with ipaq by GlassUser · · Score: 3
    I believe the most serious issue here is the iPaq's inability to detect more than one hardware button press at a time. Personally, I like being able to fire AND move at the same time. Of course you could use on-screen widgets, but that would get kinda akward, at least for me.

    Apparently, this issue has been kind of buried, I didn't hear anything about it until after I bought my iPaq and started looking for accessories. The site linked is already being hit hard (late on a Sunday night, at least in Texas, USA, and we're already taking down servers - ph33r the p0w3r of /.).

    Ah, just very slow to load. There's no detail on the page about the hardware issue.

    More on the hardware issue - as far as I know, it's a hardware problem, and nobody knows when (if) it will get fixed. Compaq is running around like mad trying to meet manufacturing requirements, so don't expect too much soon there.

    --
    funny munging
  25. NOT the first Quake for a PDA! by 5n3ak3rp1mp · · Score: 2

    NewtonQuake

    Quake on the Newton MessagePad. It's been out for quite awhile. =)

    Poor Newton. A great platform, coining the term PDA, killed by bad P.R. and too large a form factor...

  26. Re:User Friendly, it just sucks. by Aunt+Mable · · Score: 2
    You forgot a link there, buddy,

    http://www.ufmedia.com/pressbox/pr-vast-jan15-01.h tml

    (yes I know, offtopic)

    -- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!

    --

    -- Eat your greens or I'll hit you!

  27. TI-86 port by bokane · · Score: 2

    What *I* want to see is a port of Quake (hell, even of Wolfenstein) for the graphing calculator, so that I can sit and play it in my Trig class and still look like I'm doing work.

    1. Re:TI-86 port by ShawnD · · Score: 2
      Quake on a Z80 processor. Somehow I don't think it's going to happen.

      But a Wolf3D style engine was done on the TI-85. I think it was called Deadalus. Check ticalc.org as mentioned above.

      Greyscale, 128x64 resolution and even a decent frame rate all on a 6MHz Z80 and 32k of RAM....

  28. And the point is...? by Dark+Paladin · · Score: 2

    As much as I love games, and while I think that kudos go to the technical team for having achieved this result, I believe that the results from this demonstration may be some time in coming.

    When I can play a game like Quake online over a wireless connection with the iPaq - with the same (or as close as you can get in the palm of my hand), then I'll be really impressed.

    Until then, good job - and let me know when you've got something more useful.
    John "Dark Paladin" Hummel

    --
    52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
  29. Doom's on Itsy by Bomb+Regardless · · Score: 5

    Itsy (DEC [now Compaq]'s research PDA, has had Doom for a while. (It's B&W, unfortunately.) Even better, though, is that the Itsy can be controlled by rotation (called 'Rock 'n' Scroll'), so you just turn the machine to move, & press the one button for shooting.

    There are some movies that show this, I'll have to find them.

    --
    I'm a bomb regardless
  30. Wrong... NewtonQuake was first... by vkulkarn · · Score: 2

    Checkout NewtonQuake... It runs on the Newton 2000 or better...

  31. Doom on iPaq over Ricochet 128kbps? by TheSync · · Score: 2

    Has anyone tried playing iPaq Quake over a Ricochet 128kbps wireless link? (picture of iPaq with Ricochet)

  32. Mirrors on the way...... by Canada_Chris · · Score: 2

    Hey, I'm working on getting a few "Official Mirrors" up for Pocket Quake... All I can say is that I wasn't expecting over 100,000 unique hits in one day :). Chris Edwards Webmaster and Co-Founder PocketMatrix.com

  33. This has potential by Kreeblah · · Score: 2

    If someone can get a small, powerful 3D engine on a PDA, coupled with a 3D accelleration chipset, this could lead to a very useful architectural tool, or perhaps something for sending messages R2D2-style (until there are widespread, portable holographic displays).

  34. later to night at a Company planing session... by slashdoter · · Score: 5
    hehem...

    Note 3 on the agenda for tonight, no quake on the company computers.

    *gigles* from table

    note 4, would the chairman for the PDA team present there report recommending what model we purchase


    ________

    --
    Does anyone actually have a Java program designed to control air traffic, or for the operation of a nuclear facility?