Yeah, but who sired who? Did CA sire Microsoft, or did Microsoft sire CA? And why can't they just hang out in the corporate coven together like all the other vampires?
-- These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
Wrong. My college, for one, does. Students are "strongly encouraged" to use only Microsoft Word. This is for compatibility reasons, because all instructors must, by contract, use Microsoft Word. Also, they must use Excel, Powerpoint, Access, and Visual Studio. We've currently got an insane infestation of various Outlook viruses in our all-Windows computer labs. So don't you pull that "no-one's forcing you to use MS stuff" argument. Some of us *are* forced.
If you search the News and Observer site or their nando spinoff, you might find an article from a few days ago about "privileged options" and how some people who exercised those options early last year when the stock was selling for, say $50 per share and they had an option to buy for $10 per share, now owe taxes on that $40 paper profit even though they held the stock instead of selling it and it's now worth $6 or $8 on the open market.
--
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
All your misquote are belong to us
by
unitron
·
· Score: 2
Actually JFK's was "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" which isn't quite the same as the sig in question.
As I recall, the JFK quote (which was written for him by Theodore Sorenson or somebody like that) was from his inagural address, although I think I heard something about an earlier (by fifty or a hundred years) speech by someone else with a similar line in it.
--
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Sorry, my friend. if you don't know what it is, you have no business using it in a meeting or in any other way, for that matter. for great justice.
---
You only reported half the news.
by
Hanno
·
· Score: 2
Ok, let's take a breath and stop setting up conspiracy stories, ok, everyone?
According to this story on the ever useful German Heise News Ticker, Microsoft will loose a lot of money on this. They do this because this stock ownership is under scrutiny by the US Department of Justice.
Uh... you are getting Corel and Caldera confused. Corel bought WordPerfect from Novel and a bunch of Borland's office products like Quattro Pro. Caldera bought DR-DOS from Novel. Corel is a Canadian company, Caldera is a Utah company.
Re:shite this will kille Corel
by
Pope
·
· Score: 2
Alias|Wavefront Softimage Discreet FreeBSD
Yep, no software in Canada.
Pope
Freedom is Slavery! Ignorance is Strength! Monopolies offer Choice!
-- It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
don't forget their purchase of Kai Power Tools!
by
cpeterso
·
· Score: 2
I still don't get your argument. You state that renting office would cost you more in the long run then buying yet you still claim it would lower TCO. Did I read that wrong?
As for my upgrade when and if you need it point consider this.
In my office everybody uses office 97. If someone sends us a office 2000 document there is ONE pc with office 2000 on it. That person simply saves it as HTML and forwards it to the person who needs it. It rarely happens mind you because most people are reasonable and will send you the format you need. You don't need to upgrade the entire office just a few desktops to get compatibility. It's also important to be able to manage your upgrade schedule. If you have seasonal downturns or are suffering from a temporary downturn then you should have the choice to wait till better times to upgrade. MS will soon take that choice away from you. You WILL upgrade WHEN they want to not when you can best afford it.
How is investing in a company and buying non-voting stock "draining it of all it's worth?"
Microsoft invested in Corel which gave them some much needed cash. Corel's stock price fell since then, not because of, but inspite of this investment. My understanding of why Microsoft is moving to sell (note they haven't actually sold, just applied for conversion which they have to do before they can sell) is to avoid a DoJ investigation into what seems like a conflict of interest to invest in a competitor. (If you do anything that involves a computer you are a competitor of Microsoft)
-- Mmmm.. Donuts
But how does loosing $ get them out of trouble?
by
cworley
·
· Score: 2
It seems to me that if Microsoft was trying to dodge a bullet from the DOJ, then they should have removed the strings they attached to the $130M investment.
Remember the big.net agreement Corel signed to get the money? The DOJ would be more worried about that agreement than the money.
Is Microsoft going to end the agreement? The article didn't say.
So, I think Microsoft is doing what I did: getting out of Corel stock before they loose any more money.
It must have been appearant to Microsoft that once Corel had announced their "Integrate by Disintegrating" approach to Linux, that they would no longer be potential competition for Microsoft, and, instead, would continue chasing Microsoft's tail like all app vendors that make apps for WinDoh's.
-- When I die, please cast my ashes upon Bill Gates
-- for once, make him clean up after me!
I think this had something to do with something besides just the antitrust lawsuits which are pending. I believe that this was also somebody's PR move. If you're a multibillion dollar company, you don't exactly want to have your name come up when talking about a financially slipping company in which you have a large section of stock. -----------------------------------------
-- -----------------------------------------
Perversely greped and groped by PowerPenguin
Re:This is clear evidence of MSLinux
by
alexhmit01
·
· Score: 2
What are you talking about that Linux isn't the best Unix, it's more stable than Windows 98!:)
Yeah, it's a shame how much respect Linux gets compared to the actual Unixes. Linux makes Unix available to the masses, in a way the BSDs don't. If I hadn't been running a few Linux boxes for a few years, OpenBSD would have been impossible to pick up.
Besides, NT already has a POSIX layer, it's just incomplete. As we saw with Interix, getting a complete POSIX layer on NT isn't that tough, if they want to go down that route.
I mean, comparing Windows to Linux is silly. Windows is a desktop operating system where stability is traded for features. The comparison of NT to Linux is closer, but still silly. NT aims for a reasonable degree of stability but trades some for features. The software for NT massively beats out the "Linux" software.
The fair comparison of Linux is other Unixes, where Linux doesn't compare all that much. I mean, Redhat is a competitor of MS in the CE market for Kiosks, etc., but not on the desktop. MS really lacks a desktop competitor outside of Apple, which isn't significant unless OS X gets Apple really back in the game.
Server side, the only NT vs. Linux comparison is IIS on NT vs. Apache on Linux, the rest of the software is SO vastly different.
Microsoft: You're ours now.
Corel: Can we still make Linux?
Microsoft: No. Now, we want you to make-
Corel: Linux?
Microsoft: No, coreldraw for-
Corel: Linux?
MIcrosoft: Go away. ----
-- ADVENTURERS! - ANTIHERO FOR HIRE - CARDMASTER CONFLICT
Since that they owned such a big chunk of Corel, they were probably able got a good look at all the source code to the Linux OS! No wonder they are selling it off. They got what they wanted! Are they ever sneaky!!!
WTF is wrong w/ all these companies?
by
small_dick
·
· Score: 2
Any old farts out there? Remember when compilers, linkers, assemblers were like 1-2 thousand dollars? Everyone had a copy (and I do mean copy:-))
Borland broke the mold with Turbo Pascal...innovative, and only $49.00
I hope that ex-rock star running Corel would take a hint and put out really cheap cd's with a paint program, office suite, linux distro...maybe debian with nautilus and ximian gnome for something like $49.00
Economy of scale is the key here...I seriously doubt many people will pay $1500 for Borlands' Kylix.
I'd really like to see Corel recover. Weaning SOHOs and businesses off MS products, for something like $49 a workstation (w/ 30 days support or some such) would be a wise strategy.
--
Treatment, not tyranny. End the drug war and free our American POWs.
See my user info for links.
well, they were losing money pretty well before microsoft bought into them, so they probably didn't end up changing all that much actually.
Too bad, Corel was one of the first / most noticeable companies to embrace linux, and the fact that they are tanking now can be interpreted many ways, most of them bad, whether you take M$ into account or not.
________
Microsoft just doesn't know how to sell a company.
by
MongooseCN
·
· Score: 2
M$ is just so used to buying companies that they didn't know how to sell Corel and ended up selling it at half the price.
Re:shite this will kille Corel
by
nomadic
·
· Score: 2
Damn It was the biggest software company we Canadians had. I guess no one around feels like opening up a company in Canada and giving more than half of
their profits to the government?:)
Console yourself with the fact that you still have ATI... --
What killed Corel was an ill advised purchase of WordPerfect from Novell. Add to that the hundreds of millions of dollars Corel wasted on R&D for their network computer that never saw the light of day, the bungled Linux launch that never got off the ground, and what has got to be one ofthe most expensive support staffs on the planet to deal with the ridiculous number of bugs (they put MS to shame in the show stopping bugs that make it to release dept.) and the downfall of Corel was all but written on the wall. Corel needs to distance themselves from the poor decisions of Michael Cowpland and reconcentrate on what they got famous for, Corel Draw and the core suite of graphics applications.
Re:Microsoft Executive Says Linux Threatens Their
by
tshak
·
· Score: 2
...because people
in other countries who develop for Windows refuse to figure out how to
use CVS.
This is so true it's scarey... what's worse, is that most US winblowz folks here in the Seattle/Redmond area are pathetically afraid of CVS as well.
--
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
[I]f Microsoft sells all of these shares at the proposed price of $2.5625 per share,
then Microsoft would only make $61.5 million--a figure that represents half of the $135 million price
Microsoft paid for the shares in October, 2000.
Maybe they're willing to take a loss to reduce their taxes?!
Err, Microsoft invested in Corel, destroyed it and is leaving.. Seriously, so many people saying that - can anyone point to anything that's happened there since Microsoft came in?
Anyway, here's my refined theory: Microsoft needs to keep its competitors afloat and will intercede to rescue them, Apple being the most obvious example. Unfortunately, keeping Corel solvent is beyond even Bill Gates' power. When MS realized Corel was doomed no matter what, they decided to bail so they at least couldn't be blamed for being present at the death scene.
Smart business move...
by
wrinkledshirt
·
· Score: 2
Buy the company, tank it, sell the shares off at a loss, make Corel a laughingstock... And sabotage Corel's chances at providing an Office Suite for Windows AND Linux, thereby tying everybody that much closer to MS for office-software-related solutions.
Very, very smart...
--
--------
Bleah! Heh heh heh... BLEAH BLEAH!!! Ha ha ha ha...
What does this mean for .NET?
by
Gendou
·
· Score: 2
Is Corel no longer involved in the.NET crap? Are they going to back to more intense Linux development? This'd probably be the best move for them since they're kind of orphaned now. Question is: can we trust them? *squints*
We should be counting our meager blessings.
by
bellers
·
· Score: 2
If you will recall, one of Microsoft's stipulations when it invested its $130 million dollars in Corel was that Corel would have to implement MS's.NET framework whenever Microsoft said so.
Now, I'm no rocket scientist, but it occurs to me that people might quite possibly start snatching up copies of Corel PerfectOffice the moment that Office XP ships. The people who, rightly, dont feel too warm and fuzzy about renting software. Under the previous arrangement, don't think that MS wouldn't make that phone call to Corel about.NET as soon as they saw Office sales/rentals/subscriptions start to slip.
What I think that this boils down to is that MS realized that the Slash And Burn Dep^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H Corporate Acquisition Department realized that if the DoJ was *already* looking into the investment, before.NET even got off the ground, then they might have done too tidy a job of cornering the market.
Before you get too weepy-eyed about _The_Impending_Death_Of_Corel_, please remember that Perfect Office has been the hot potato of the software world for over a decade. Corel, Borland, Novell, WordPerfect Inc., that product has been second-tier for many years now.
And, dont forget that they also supplied what many considered to be the worst ever distribution of Linux. Buggy and insecure.
No, I dont feel bad for Corel. I like WordPerfect, but I never like CorelDraw or any of Corel's homegrown applications.
What it boils down to is that Corel will most likely fall by the wayside, but the last gasp of that dying company will be to sell PerfectOffice to someone with a little more capital. Perhaps Sun, perhaps Compaq.
Either way, PerfectOffice will go on, and I for one like the idea of a Perfect Office unencumbered by.NET far more than the alternative.
The question then becomes what technology did MS obtain as a part of the initial investment? They could have also used it as an opportunity to try to steer it down a dead end path ala OS/2.
IMHO, the real reason they probably invested in Corel is to give the appearance that they still have competitors (they did the same thing with Apple) in the shrink wrapped office productivitiy market. But now that this move has raised the attention of the DOJ, they're dumping the stock. This will certainly cause Corel's stock to dive even further. It would be really funny, if that would cause the SEC to look into the situation and have multiple agencies trying to take them to court. Wishful thinking, I know, but it would be fun to watch.
-- the good ground has been paved over by suicidal maniacs
> Now they can dump it on the market and watch Corel's stock price tank.
Might prove to be a major faux pas, if IBM decides to do what so many people have been suggesting.
--
-- Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Not at all surprising..
by
supabeast!
·
· Score: 3
Selling all of those Corel shares at a loss is probably hundreds of millions (If not billions.) of dollars cheaper than dealing with another antitrust suit. At least M$ is finally learning how to deal with DOJ investigations- Not insulting the prosecuters, government, american people, ignoring DOJ orders, etc.
ALL YOUR SLASHDOT ARE BELONG TO US!!
by
FunkyChild
·
· Score: 3
Yes, it's my own work:) (well except for the Zero Wing art:P)
And when they drain Bungie Studios of all it's worth, it too, will be discarded.
Why does Microsoft sound a lot like a vampire?
It drinks till it's full, then tosses the withered husk by the wayside.
(shudder)
-- -------------------------------------------------- ----
The man, the myth, the something or other.
This is clear evidence of MSLinux
by
Chuck+Flynn
·
· Score: 3
It all makes perfect sense. Why own shares in a competitor to your imminent product? They'd have to divest, and that's what they've done.
Antitrust law discourages companies in the same market from owning stakes in each other, but Microsoft and Corel could previously claim they're not actually in the same market, since their underlying software was different and they were aimed at ostensibly different audiences.
The only explanation for why Microsoft would dump its Corel shares (which have been doing well, lately) is to clear the field for them to bring MSLinux out. It makes perfect sense.
The big question now is whether anyone will buy a Linux distribution from Microsoft.
Microsoft Executive Says Linux Threatens Their Ind
by
Don+Giovanni
·
· Score: 3
Microsoft Executive Says Linux Threatens Their Industry Stranglehold, Competes With Windows
2/14/01 4:57 PM
Source:Bloomberg News
Redmond, Washington, Feb. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Microsoft Corp.'s Windows
bloatware chief, Jim Allchin, says that freely distributed
software code such as rival Linux could stifle Microsoft's innovative
ways of stealing, extorting, and gouging money from it's customers
and that legislators need to understand the threat.
The result will be the demise of both Bill Gates income and
the incentive to support the Dark-side of the force, he said yesterday,
after the company previewed its latest version of eX-Windows. Microsoft
has told U.S. lawmakers of its concern while discussing protection of
intellectual property rights.
Linux is developed in a so-called open-source environment in which the
software code generally isn't owned by any one company. That, as well
as programs such as music-sharing software from Napster Inc., means
the world's largest software maker has to do a better job of bribing
policymakers, he said.
''Open source is an stranglehold destroyer,'' Allchin said.
''I can't imagine something that could be worse than this for our
wallets.''
Microsoft distributes some of its programs without charge to
customers, although it never releases its programming code, except
for experimental research releases of its Research division's IPv6
implementation for NT Foow and Two-Kay, and it retains the ownership
rights to that code. Linux is the most widely known open-source product,
though other programs including the popular Apache system for Web server
computers also are developed the same way.
Corel Inquiry
Allchin made his comments several hours before Microsoft confirmed
that its $135 million investment in software maker Corel Corp. last
October is being reviewed by the U.S. Justice Department. MS/Corel said
last month it willl drop efforts to develop the Linux operating
system, though it will continue to make Linux applications. Corel _said_
it hadn't consulted with Microsoft before making that decision.
Brian Behlendorf, founder of open-source company CollabNet Inc., said
most companies that use the open-source development model do retain
the rights to some of their intellectual property.
''I think Microsoft is trying to paint the open-source community as
being fascist; that all software have has to be free, or none of it
can be,'' said Behlendorf, whose company helps businesses run their
own open-source projects.
Allchin said he's concerned that the open-source business model could
stifle blind ambition and greed in the computer industry.
''I'm an American, I believe in the American Way of beating down and
destroying your competitors at all costs,'' he said. ''I worry
if the government encourages open source, and I don't think we've done
enough education of policy makers to understand the threat.''
Linux Adoption
Some leading computer companies including International Business
Machines Corp. and Hewlett-Packard Co. are selling Linux- based
products and working on open-source projects, noted Jeremy Allison, a
VA Linux Systems Inc. software developer. He's also a leader in a
project develop an open-source file and printer server program.
Microsoft only began significant bribery efforts in the last few
years. The Redmond, Washington-based company also talks to lawmakers
about issues including the need for more visas for people with
computer skills and computer privacy and security, because people
in other countries who develop for Windows refuse to figure out how to
use CVS.
Linux is the fastest-growing operating system program for running
server computers, according to research firm IDC. It accounted for 27
percent of unit shipments of server operating systems in 2000.
Microsoft's Windows was the most popular on that basis, with 41
percent. But who's counting?
Despite Linux's success in some markets, Allchin says he isn't
concerned about sales competition from the product. Microsoft provides
support to change and develop products based on its operating system
software that Linux companies don't, he said. Companies that use Linux
in their products then must pay someone else for support, he said.
''We can build a better product than Linux,'' he said. ''There is
always something enamoring about thinking you can get something for
free.''
That last statement made this CNET editor wonder if he is a hypocrite or
just another foot-pedestal to the leader of the evil-empire, Gates.
I mean, if he thinks open-source is stifling their innovation and incentive,
then why did he say "We can build a better product than Linux"?
And why have they not yet done so? deerg!
In a related story summed up at the bottom of the original blurb (original link here):
"Alarm bells first rang when it emerged last October that Corel's mystery investor was none other than Microsoft. They should have rung louder... Now it appears the United States Department of Justice is taking a closer look at the antitrust implications of that transaction."
"To be brutally honest, I'm not going to shed any tears over the death of Corel's Linux distribution... On the other hand the passing of WordPerfect for Linux and WordPerfect Office for Linux would be more of a worry. Officially these products have not yet been dumped - but don't hold your breath."
"But there's another reason to worry about the demise of Corel's Linux offering, the company
has played a major role in the development of Wine. In January Corel outlined its business plan
in a press release. Wine isn't specifically mentioned, but the company says it will continue to develop Linux applications and presumably this means the Wine contribution will continue. This
means that a Microsoft controlled company is going to play a major role in the development
of Wine. Is anyone looking at the antitrust implications of that?"
While the original article is far more in depth, and goes on to mention that this is more likely a remnant of the previous administration, I can not but help start to feel like the republicans do about Clinton. It is hard. I try to control my dark side.
But MS..., each day one of its' minions goes and does something that just irritates the hell out of me.
I'm going to have to start painting MS in the pictures of royalist France or something. Or maybe Napoleon. They are really starting to irritate me.
-- "It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Microsoft knows how to sell companies? I had no idea.
Sabotage and Dump
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 5
Well, they got what they wanted. Corel is "out" of Linux distribution and no longer in competition with Microsoft. No need to hold onto the stock anymore. Now they can dump it on the market and watch Corel's stock price tank.
Sabotage and Dump.
HELLO GENTLEMAN
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 5
Microsoft: ALL YOUR COREL SHARE ARE BELONG TO US !!
Corel: WHAT YOU SAY !!
Microsoft: Ooh, whoops, I mean you can have them all. My bad.
Corel: YOU HAVE NO CHANCE TO SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME.
Microsoft: HA HA HA HA HA HA...
With 20 posts already, no one has mentioned the fact that the Corel acquisition was getting them into deeper trouble with the antitrust people at the DOJ. I don't know why they'd be bothered about that now and not before, but maybe they didn't think it would raise eyebrows. Anyway, that seems to be the most likely explanation for why they're bailing now.
For the people claiming "Microsoft invested in Corel, destroyed and is leaving the body for the vultures." -could you please elaborate on what they did to accomplish that? Persuade them that there was a meaningful Linux desktop market to target?
Slashdot Mirror
Yeah, but who sired who? Did CA sire Microsoft, or did Microsoft sire CA? And why can't they just hang out in the corporate coven together like all the other vampires?
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
Wrong. My college, for one, does. Students are "strongly encouraged" to use only Microsoft Word. This is for compatibility reasons, because all instructors must, by contract, use Microsoft Word. Also, they must use Excel, Powerpoint, Access, and Visual Studio. We've currently got an insane infestation of various Outlook viruses in our all-Windows computer labs. So don't you pull that "no-one's forcing you to use MS stuff" argument. Some of us *are* forced.
If you search the News and Observer site or their nando spinoff, you might find an article from a few days ago about "privileged options" and how some people who exercised those options early last year when the stock was selling for, say $50 per share and they had an option to buy for $10 per share, now owe taxes on that $40 paper profit even though they held the stock instead of selling it and it's now worth $6 or $8 on the open market.
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
As I recall, the JFK quote (which was written for him by Theodore Sorenson or somebody like that) was from his inagural address, although I think I heard something about an earlier (by fifty or a hundred years) speech by someone else with a similar line in it.
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Sorry, my friend. if you don't know what it is, you have no business using it in a meeting or in any other way, for that matter. for great justice.
---
Ok, let's take a breath and stop setting up conspiracy stories, ok, everyone?
According to this story on the ever useful German Heise News Ticker, Microsoft will loose a lot of money on this. They do this because this stock ownership is under scrutiny by the US Department of Justice.
------------------
------------------
You may like my a cappella music
3.Corel buys DR DOS, sues MS
Uh... you are getting Corel and Caldera confused. Corel bought WordPerfect from Novel and a bunch of Borland's office products like Quattro Pro. Caldera bought DR-DOS from Novel. Corel is a Canadian company, Caldera is a Utah company.
Alias|Wavefront
Softimage
Discreet
FreeBSD
Yep, no software in Canada.
Pope
Freedom is Slavery! Ignorance is Strength! Monopolies offer Choice!
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
Corel doesn't have a focused business model.
cpeterso
Dear Mr. Gates,
I've written the next killer app, a 3D Hello World program. Buy me out for half a billion, and I won't release it.
Eagerly awaiting your cash^w reply.
--
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
It sounded to me like something that could've originated from Pokey the Penguin (http://www.yellow5.com/pokey/), but evidently it isn't.
I still don't get your argument. You state that renting office would cost you more in the long run then buying yet you still claim it would lower TCO. Did I read that wrong?
As for my upgrade when and if you need it point consider this.
In my office everybody uses office 97. If someone sends us a office 2000 document there is ONE pc with office 2000 on it. That person simply saves it as HTML and forwards it to the person who needs it. It rarely happens mind you because most people are reasonable and will send you the format you need. You don't need to upgrade the entire office just a few desktops to get compatibility. It's also important to be able to manage your upgrade schedule. If you have seasonal downturns or are suffering from a temporary downturn then you should have the choice to wait till better times to upgrade. MS will soon take that choice away from you. You WILL upgrade WHEN they want to not when you can best afford it.
War is necrophilia.
Is not by anon. It's by JFK.
Best Slashdot Co
How is investing in a company and buying non-voting stock "draining it of all it's worth?"
Microsoft invested in Corel which gave them some much needed cash. Corel's stock price fell since then, not because of, but inspite of this investment. My understanding of why Microsoft is moving to sell (note they haven't actually sold, just applied for conversion which they have to do before they can sell) is to avoid a DoJ investigation into what seems like a conflict of interest to invest in a competitor. (If you do anything that involves a computer you are a competitor of Microsoft)
Mmmm.. Donuts
It seems to me that if Microsoft was trying to dodge a bullet from the DOJ, then they should have removed the strings they attached to the $130M investment.
.net agreement Corel signed to get the money? The DOJ would be more worried about that agreement than the money.
Remember the big
Is Microsoft going to end the agreement? The article didn't say.
So, I think Microsoft is doing what I did: getting out of Corel stock before they loose any more money.
It must have been appearant to Microsoft that once Corel had announced their "Integrate by Disintegrating" approach to Linux, that they would no longer be potential competition for Microsoft, and, instead, would continue chasing Microsoft's tail like all app vendors that make apps for WinDoh's.
When I die, please cast my ashes upon Bill Gates -- for once, make him clean up after me!
I think this had something to do with something besides just the antitrust lawsuits which are pending. I believe that this was also somebody's PR move. If you're a multibillion dollar company, you don't exactly want to have your name come up when talking about a financially slipping company in which you have a large section of stock.
-----------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------
Perversely greped and groped by PowerPenguin
What are you talking about that Linux isn't the best Unix, it's more stable than Windows 98! :)
Yeah, it's a shame how much respect Linux gets compared to the actual Unixes. Linux makes Unix available to the masses, in a way the BSDs don't. If I hadn't been running a few Linux boxes for a few years, OpenBSD would have been impossible to pick up.
Besides, NT already has a POSIX layer, it's just incomplete. As we saw with Interix, getting a complete POSIX layer on NT isn't that tough, if they want to go down that route.
I mean, comparing Windows to Linux is silly. Windows is a desktop operating system where stability is traded for features. The comparison of NT to Linux is closer, but still silly. NT aims for a reasonable degree of stability but trades some for features. The software for NT massively beats out the "Linux" software.
The fair comparison of Linux is other Unixes, where Linux doesn't compare all that much. I mean, Redhat is a competitor of MS in the CE market for Kiosks, etc., but not on the desktop. MS really lacks a desktop competitor outside of Apple, which isn't significant unless OS X gets Apple really back in the game.
Server side, the only NT vs. Linux comparison is IIS on NT vs. Apache on Linux, the rest of the software is SO vastly different.
Microsoft: You're ours now.
Corel: Can we still make Linux?
Microsoft: No. Now, we want you to make-
Corel: Linux?
Microsoft: No, coreldraw for-
Corel: Linux?
MIcrosoft: Go away.
----
ADVENTURERS! - ANTIHERO FOR HIRE - CARDMASTER CONFLICT
Since that they owned such a big chunk of Corel, they were probably able got a good look at all the source code to the Linux OS! No wonder they are selling it off. They got what they wanted! Are they ever sneaky!!!
Word game?
They bought it and sold it, which killed it.
You can't handle the truth.
Any old farts out there? Remember when compilers, linkers, assemblers were like 1-2 thousand dollars? Everyone had a copy (and I do mean copy :-))
Borland broke the mold with Turbo Pascal...innovative, and only $49.00
I hope that ex-rock star running Corel would take a hint and put out really cheap cd's with a paint program, office suite, linux distro...maybe debian with nautilus and ximian gnome for something like $49.00
Economy of scale is the key here...I seriously doubt many people will pay $1500 for Borlands' Kylix.
I'd really like to see Corel recover. Weaning SOHOs and businesses off MS products, for something like $49 a workstation (w/ 30 days support or some such) would be a wise strategy.
Treatment, not tyranny. End the drug war and free our American POWs.
See my user info for links.
Too bad, Corel was one of the first / most noticeable companies to embrace linux, and the fact that they are tanking now can be interpreted many ways, most of them bad, whether you take M$ into account or not.
________
M$ is just so used to buying companies that they didn't know how to sell Corel and ended up selling it at half the price.
Outdoor digital photography, mostly in New Engl
Damn It was the biggest software company we Canadians had. I guess no one around feels like opening up a company in Canada and giving more than half of their profits to the government? :)
Console yourself with the fact that you still have ATI...
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What killed Corel was an ill advised purchase of WordPerfect from Novell. Add to that the hundreds of millions of dollars Corel wasted on R&D for their network computer that never saw the light of day, the bungled Linux launch that never got off the ground, and what has got to be one ofthe most expensive support staffs on the planet to deal with the ridiculous number of bugs (they put MS to shame in the show stopping bugs that make it to release dept.) and the downfall of Corel was all but written on the wall. Corel needs to distance themselves from the poor decisions of Michael Cowpland and reconcentrate on what they got famous for, Corel Draw and the core suite of graphics applications.
...because people in other countries who develop for Windows refuse to figure out how to use CVS.
This is so true it's scarey... what's worse, is that most US winblowz folks here in the Seattle/Redmond area are pathetically afraid of CVS as well.
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
...we won't be seeing any of the long-awaited "Corel For X-Box" products?
Gates proclaimed that he would be buying Redhat next..
Rapid Nirvana
[I]f Microsoft sells all of these shares at the proposed price of $2.5625 per share, then Microsoft would only make $61.5 million--a figure that represents half of the $135 million price Microsoft paid for the shares in October, 2000.
Maybe they're willing to take a loss to reduce their taxes?!
sulli
RTFJ.
Careful, all the Chretien apologists will come out of the woodwork and berate you about how good Canada really is.
Canada SUCKS especially for IT which is why 66% of many graduating classes in Computer Science immediately head South.
--- Jump!! Fire!! Bullet time!! - Lego version of the Matrix
Come here and say that, you manky-toothed boiled food eating big-eared chinless inbred bastard.
--- Jump!! Fire!! Bullet time!! - Lego version of the Matrix
Anyway, here's my refined theory: Microsoft needs to keep its competitors afloat and will intercede to rescue them, Apple being the most obvious example. Unfortunately, keeping Corel solvent is beyond even Bill Gates' power. When MS realized Corel was doomed no matter what, they decided to bail so they at least couldn't be blamed for being present at the death scene.
Buy the company, tank it, sell the shares off at a loss, make Corel a laughingstock... And sabotage Corel's chances at providing an Office Suite for Windows AND Linux, thereby tying everybody that much closer to MS for office-software-related solutions.
Very, very smart...
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Bleah! Heh heh heh... BLEAH BLEAH!!! Ha ha ha ha...
Is Corel no longer involved in the .NET crap? Are they going to back to more intense Linux development? This'd probably be the best move for them since they're kind of orphaned now. Question is: can we trust them? *squints*
Now, I'm no rocket scientist, but it occurs to me that people might quite possibly start snatching up copies of Corel PerfectOffice the moment that Office XP ships. The people who, rightly, dont feel too warm and fuzzy about renting software. Under the previous arrangement, don't think that MS wouldn't make that phone call to Corel about .NET as soon as they saw Office sales/rentals/subscriptions start to slip.
What I think that this boils down to is that MS realized that the Slash And Burn Dep^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H Corporate Acquisition Department realized that if the DoJ was *already* looking into the investment, before .NET even got off the ground, then they might have done too tidy a job of cornering the market.
Before you get too weepy-eyed about _The_Impending_Death_Of_Corel_, please remember that Perfect Office has been the hot potato of the software world for over a decade. Corel, Borland, Novell, WordPerfect Inc., that product has been second-tier for many years now.
And, dont forget that they also supplied what many considered to be the worst ever distribution of Linux. Buggy and insecure.
No, I dont feel bad for Corel. I like WordPerfect, but I never like CorelDraw or any of Corel's homegrown applications.
What it boils down to is that Corel will most likely fall by the wayside, but the last gasp of that dying company will be to sell PerfectOffice to someone with a little more capital. Perhaps Sun, perhaps Compaq.
Either way, PerfectOffice will go on, and I for one like the idea of a Perfect Office unencumbered by .NET far more than the alternative.
COREL IS DEAD! LONG LIVE COREL!
This space for rent.
The question then becomes what technology did MS obtain as a part of the initial investment? They could have also used it as an opportunity to try to steer it down a dead end path ala OS/2.
IMHO, the real reason they probably invested in Corel is to give the appearance that they still have competitors (they did the same thing with Apple) in the shrink wrapped office productivitiy market. But now that this move has raised the attention of the DOJ, they're dumping the stock. This will certainly cause Corel's stock to dive even further. It would be really funny, if that would cause the SEC to look into the situation and have multiple agencies trying to take them to court. Wishful thinking, I know, but it would be fun to watch.
the good ground has been paved over by suicidal maniacs
> Now they can dump it on the market and watch Corel's stock price tank.
Might prove to be a major faux pas, if IBM decides to do what so many people have been suggesting.
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Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Selling all of those Corel shares at a loss is probably hundreds of millions (If not billions.) of dollars cheaper than dealing with another antitrust suit. At least M$ is finally learning how to deal with DOJ investigations- Not insulting the prosecuters, government, american people, ignoring DOJ orders, etc.
Yes, it's my own work :) (well except for the Zero Wing art :P)
/ slashdot_aybabtu.gif
http://members.optushome.com.au/geoffebb/misc/ayb
And when they drain Bungie Studios of all it's worth, it too, will be discarded.
Why does Microsoft sound a lot like a vampire? It drinks till it's full, then tosses the withered husk by the wayside.
(shudder)
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It all makes perfect sense. Why own shares in a competitor to your imminent product? They'd have to divest, and that's what they've done.
Antitrust law discourages companies in the same market from owning stakes in each other, but Microsoft and Corel could previously claim they're not actually in the same market, since their underlying software was different and they were aimed at ostensibly different audiences.
The only explanation for why Microsoft would dump its Corel shares (which have been doing well, lately) is to clear the field for them to bring MSLinux out. It makes perfect sense.
The big question now is whether anyone will buy a Linux distribution from Microsoft.
Read the rest of this comment...
Microsoft Executive Says Linux Threatens Their Industry Stranglehold, Competes With Windows
2/14/01 4:57 PM
Source:Bloomberg News
Redmond, Washington, Feb. 14 (Bloomberg) -- Microsoft Corp.'s Windows
bloatware chief, Jim Allchin, says that freely distributed
software code such as rival Linux could stifle Microsoft's innovative
ways of stealing, extorting, and gouging money from it's customers
and that legislators need to understand the threat.
The result will be the demise of both Bill Gates income and
the incentive to support the Dark-side of the force, he said yesterday,
after the company previewed its latest version of eX-Windows. Microsoft
has told U.S. lawmakers of its concern while discussing protection of
intellectual property rights.
Quote Snapshot
IBM 114.88 -1.90
HWP 33.06 -3.29
MSFT 56.69 -2.13
LNUX 7.53 -0.59
RHAT 6.84 -0.22
Linux is developed in a so-called open-source environment in which the
software code generally isn't owned by any one company. That, as well
as programs such as music-sharing software from Napster Inc., means
the world's largest software maker has to do a better job of bribing
policymakers, he said.
''Open source is an stranglehold destroyer,'' Allchin said.
''I can't imagine something that could be worse than this for our
wallets.''
Microsoft distributes some of its programs without charge to
customers, although it never releases its programming code, except
for experimental research releases of its Research division's IPv6
implementation for NT Foow and Two-Kay, and it retains the ownership
rights to that code. Linux is the most widely known open-source product,
though other programs including the popular Apache system for Web server
computers also are developed the same way.
Corel Inquiry
Allchin made his comments several hours before Microsoft confirmed
that its $135 million investment in software maker Corel Corp. last
October is being reviewed by the U.S. Justice Department. MS/Corel said
last month it willl drop efforts to develop the Linux operating
system, though it will continue to make Linux applications. Corel _said_
it hadn't consulted with Microsoft before making that decision.
Brian Behlendorf, founder of open-source company CollabNet Inc., said
most companies that use the open-source development model do retain
the rights to some of their intellectual property.
''I think Microsoft is trying to paint the open-source community as
being fascist; that all software have has to be free, or none of it
can be,'' said Behlendorf, whose company helps businesses run their
own open-source projects.
Allchin said he's concerned that the open-source business model could
stifle blind ambition and greed in the computer industry.
''I'm an American, I believe in the American Way of beating down and
destroying your competitors at all costs,'' he said. ''I worry
if the government encourages open source, and I don't think we've done
enough education of policy makers to understand the threat.''
Linux Adoption
Some leading computer companies including International Business
Machines Corp. and Hewlett-Packard Co. are selling Linux- based
products and working on open-source projects, noted Jeremy Allison, a
VA Linux Systems Inc. software developer. He's also a leader in a
project develop an open-source file and printer server program.
Microsoft only began significant bribery efforts in the last few
years. The Redmond, Washington-based company also talks to lawmakers
about issues including the need for more visas for people with
computer skills and computer privacy and security, because people
in other countries who develop for Windows refuse to figure out how to
use CVS.
Linux is the fastest-growing operating system program for running
server computers, according to research firm IDC. It accounted for 27
percent of unit shipments of server operating systems in 2000.
Microsoft's Windows was the most popular on that basis, with 41
percent. But who's counting?
Despite Linux's success in some markets, Allchin says he isn't
concerned about sales competition from the product. Microsoft provides
support to change and develop products based on its operating system
software that Linux companies don't, he said. Companies that use Linux
in their products then must pay someone else for support, he said.
''We can build a better product than Linux,'' he said. ''There is
always something enamoring about thinking you can get something for
free.''
That last statement made this CNET editor wonder if he is a hypocrite or
just another foot-pedestal to the leader of the evil-empire, Gates.
I mean, if he thinks open-source is stifling their innovation and incentive,
then why did he say "We can build a better product than Linux"?
And why have they not yet done so? deerg!
P2P Anonymous Distributed Web Search: http://www.yacy.net/
See The Register about it.
--
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
It's originaly from the *bad* translated japanese videogame "Zero Wing" to sega genesis. Look here for a nice flash sequence from the game.
"The best way to impress people is to be very efficient and organised. That shocks people everytime." - h4rm0ny
"A Million Bucks, Mach 7.6, Straight Down"
Heh, heh...
But MS ..., each day one of its' minions goes and does something that just irritates the hell out of me.
I'm going to have to start painting MS in the pictures of royalist France or something. Or maybe Napoleon. They are really starting to irritate me.
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Microsoft knows how to sell companies? I had no idea.
Well, they got what they wanted. Corel is "out" of Linux distribution and no longer in competition with Microsoft. No need to hold onto the stock anymore. Now they can dump it on the market and watch Corel's stock price tank.
Sabotage and Dump.
Microsoft: ALL YOUR COREL SHARE ARE BELONG TO US !!
Corel: WHAT YOU SAY !!
Microsoft: Ooh, whoops, I mean you can have them all. My bad.
Corel: YOU HAVE NO CHANCE TO SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME.
Microsoft: HA HA HA HA HA HA...
Sweet.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
You can't buy market dominance like that.
Oh, wait...
For the people claiming "Microsoft invested in Corel, destroyed and is leaving the body for the vultures." -could you please elaborate on what they did to accomplish that? Persuade them that there was a meaningful Linux desktop market to target?