Slashdot Mirror
India To Launch Its First GSLV Satellite
NeoCode writes: "Tomorrow, India will launch its first GSLV satellite using the Russian launchers. Its an amazing feat since they have built the satellite from scratch. If the launch is successful, India will become the sixth nation (US, Russia, China, Japan and the European Space Agency being the others) to build and launch a GSLV class satellite. Rediff.com has complete coverage on the story behind the making of this satellite. More details can found here @CNN, @TribundIndia.com and @Space.com."
I guess if you have to explain that, might as well explain "geosynchronous"
So what does geosynchronous mean?
Geosynchronous means in step with the earth's rotation.
When the satellite completes an orbit, it will be very close to it's starting location (relative to the Earth)
China without a shared sense of history? A post colonial entity? Your books on history must be very different from mine... I thought that China had been one of the prototype nation states, with a strong central government, for quite some time. But that's the european version of history. Your milage may vary.
Nice troll. ... include Canada and Mexico and North America beats Europe in GDP. ...
"largest economic area"? You're comparing a country to a region
"leadership of the French"? (try UK/Germany)
No "shared sense of history" in China? (Confucius et al)
And still modded up -- I have much to learn
(Must be the length of the response + use of terms like 'exosphere' and 'global government')
>The Chinese dropped the ball. If they had put any real effort into pushing their geopolitical boundaries into Europe, the British wouldn't have whipped their asses in the Opium wars, which led them into subservient colonial status for the next 150 years.
Er, wrong. It was the Manchus who dropped the ball (they certainly don't see themselves as Chinese, even moreso during WWII when they sided with their Japanese masters, forming Manchuko as a puppet state). You see, back in the 1600s, these people called the Manchurians were simply barbarians who managed to overthrow the Ming Dynasty (who earlier overthrew the Mongol dynasty) by colluding with corrupt gov't officials. After their conquest, the Manchurians forced their 'culture' (hairstyles, dress-styles, etc) on everyone in China and those who didn't faced severe punishment. Not only that, they erroded every part of the gov't, including it's military, to the point where the British and all other invading nations easily colonized China. If you want to blame someone for the fall of ancient China, blame the Manchus. They obviously had no concern for maintaining a stable nation.
>They'd stand a better chance of being a superpower now if they hadn't wasted so much of their internal energy on Maoism and crushing internal dissent. As it stands now their political and economic systems are grossly corrupt. Their foreign policy bent on selling destablizing technology to anti-American nations rather than actually working to expand their influence.
One of the chief goals of Maoism was to promote national unity (one of the many victims under Manchu rule). Incidentally, facing nothing but criticism from the West allowed the Communist hardliners to gain support by painting the West as anti-Chinese (when was the last time the West said anything positive about China?). As noted, some of those same hardliners are also those furthering corruption under the shadow of Western criticism (West criticises => hardliners gain support and abuses of power => more criticism for the West => more support for hardliners and more corruption).
We all inherited wheels - we didnt reinvent them all over. Its not stealing as some posts have indicated - its called knowledge-sharing as in open-source - come to think of it open-source should be exapnded to open-knowledge so more people can participate. The idiots who think somebody adopted a technology to build something are being as myopic as anybody can be. Indian sages thousands of years ago invented the number 0 and thus all scientific discoveries that follow are stolen from India ? Thats screwed up logic at best. Share the knowledge - rename open-source to open-knowledge - and see what the entire humanity can do.
According to CNN:
India is set to conduct the first test of a rocket to launch geostationary satellites this week.
India, which aims to launch a satellite with the GSLV after three successful tests, will join the United States, the European Space Agency, Japan, Russia and China as a member of the satellite launch club if all goes to plan.
Now according to this, it's a test of a ROCKET to put a satellite into geosync orbit (so it stays over the same point relative to the surface of the earth). After three tests of this rocket, THEN India will put a satellite up, presumably in geosync orbit.
OTAN and ONU are the spanish accronims(sp?) of NATO and UN, but I agree, is easier to use only one accronim(sp?) for each organisaion, regardless of the language.
Mexico: 100% conservative's America now!
Not only that, looks like a lot of slashdotters cannot read. It's clearly written that you posted the story, but almost everybody blame Timothy for the mistake -_- and forget the fact that readers post the stories and the editors select wich ones get posted.
sigh....
P.S. Good story =)
Mexico: 100% conservative's America now!
... former H1's who couldn't stay in America longer than 6 yrs and were replaced by inexperienced graduates in need of training?
> a shared military
:-) good connections to most nations on the earth (especially to most ex-east-block, arab and south-east nations), trading-, cultur- and military outpost all around the world (even including one or another old colony, which also makes the EU the only nation beside russia where the sun never sets :-).
There is no "united european army" because of language barriers mostly. But beyond smaller military baselevel-organisation there is a multitude of combined efforts. E.G. most administration and development is united, mostly at NATO-level, but also at european-level.
The european comission and parlament is a fourth level of government. While most federal countries only have three levels (county/city, state, nation), the EU is a fully qualified fourth level (county/city, state, nation, union). It has actual power in nearly all fields of european life, it can create laws and enforce them. I would call that a government, even when it takes ages just to define the shape of a class 2b banana.
I would also expect a stronger unification within the next decade. Some "not amusing actions" by the US made the nation-heads think... eg. espionage and privacy-violations, misusing standards or tradepower under US-control to apply political preasure, a very egocentric position in cultural and technological points (nice quote from a public servant in a newspaper "at least russia doesnt piss into our beer in public and expects us to say thanks.")
The political ways are quite clear: The EU will become the most important power within the next ten years: 500 Million citicens, a GNP way above the USA, a size nearly twice as large as the usa (ok, half of the size is located in grenland, but hey, most regions in the US are not very interesting either
"Life is short and in most cases it ends with death." Sir Sinclair
Disagree.AFAIK, spy sattellites are usually in lower orbit (so they can move over a lot of countries), hence can not be geosynchronous. In a geosync orbit (about 36,000miles which is too-far out to take a nice picture), the satellite stays in a fixed position relative to earth, and hence a the footprint is smaller.
Down with us? Why do you think the U.S.A. and the E.U. are "going down"?
Just curious.
I still don't get it... why do you think we're "going down" economically?
Recessions happen all the time, there have been a couple worse than the current one since I was born and I'm not that old. Or do you have other reasons for thinking so?
Canada is the best. But seriously, shouldn't Israel be on the list?
D
ELITISM: It's always lonely at the top. Uninvited company is rarely welcome.
You are wrong. You are closed minded and a bigot.
The only way any non-white country ever did anything technical is by stealing it from someone else, right?!
dimwit
ELITISM: It's always lonely at the top. Uninvited company is rarely welcome.
Please ask the Germans and British how they feel about the suppression of their political independence under this "United States of Europe" vision.
One thing the EU currently has in droves is an absence of security-related capabilities -- see Bosnia without US involvement.
I also do not see any European Union controlled nuclear weapons in evidence. Oh wait, the French have them, so that is the continent's nuclear deterrent taken care of.
Funny how a deployed and working missile defense system will invalidate it completely. And the Chinese arsenal is also likely to dwarf that of "Europe". Leaving the US and Russia (the dinosaurs) with the nuclear potential to destroy humanity.
And the "united europeans" standing on the sidelines. Kibitzing.
ELITISM: It's always lonely at the top. Uninvited company is rarely welcome.
It says it's payload is an experimental communications platform. What are the odds, that this satellite might just help in say, I dunno targetting nuclear weapons ? Or maybe it's a spy satellite. The former scares the hell out of me, but, I'm paranoid. 'Side, the GSLV is also in the same general area as creating ICBMs.
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Insert Witty Sig Here
EVERY sattelite is built from scratch. There is no sattelite manufacturing facilities, or sattelite junkyards. You dont go to Martin-Lockheed and ask, Where's your base line sattelites, I'd like to check one out, What kind of mileage does this one get?
The amazing thing is that here in the US, a bunch of non-scientists garage hack mechanics and engineers build several sattelites over the past 3 decades and had them launched. Ham radio sattelites. They're up there and running well.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Sorry, I should have specified economically.
You say you want a revolution....
Merely a figure of speech. Yes, recessions do happen, but in a country such as India that still has a staggering poverty rate, if the effects of our recession start to affect them adversly, it affects them much more severly, as, unlike us, most of their population still lives in third world conditions. A recession happens here, and peoples standards of living go down.
There, for most people, the standard of living CANNOT go down, they just die.
You say you want a revolution....
It is Interesting to take a look at India and see just where they have been going recently.
They are the Tech Powerhouse of SouthEast Asia, and that is a lot considering all of the tech in SouthEast Asia. Their Economy is on the upswing. They may just be the next economic powerhouse.
Or their reliance on US and British goods will bring them down with us.
Either way, only the future will tell.
You say you want a revolution....
GSLV=geosynchronous satellite launch vehicle.
I guess we all speak space jargon, so there was not need to put that on the front page.
-josh
Yay China, I guess, since I'm Chinese.
It's about time, too. It's sort of insulting, that one of the oldest civilizations on Earth is not quite a superpower, despite having developed and refined governement and buearacracy for the past 4000 years. Go team!
The Chinese dropped the ball. If they had put any real effort into pushing their geopolitical boundaries into Europe, the British wouldn't have whipped their asses in the Opium wars, which led them into subservient colonial status for the next 150 years.
They'd stand a better chance of being a superpower now if they hadn't wasted so much of their internal energy on Maoism and crushing internal dissent. As it stands now their political and economic systems are grossly corrupt. Their foreign policy bent on selling destablizing technology to anti-American nations rather than actually working to expand their influence.
The explanation I've always accepted was Chinese complacency led to a lack of expansion which in turn led to a lack of conflict. With no conflict you have no military advancement, hence British frigates easily sink the Junks and any hope of Chinese military power and political independence.
Arguing that critcism of China perpetuates Chinese abuses is a little specious, like arguing that critcism of Stalin is responsible for his purges. While perhaps it may enable Chinese propaganda, it neither justifies Chinese repression and corruption nor explains away their own responsibility for it.
How does it currently work with a country who doesn't have its "own" satellite? Are they rented out? What advantage is is to have your own GSO satellite?
Jethro
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
It's painfull to see so much BS on the front page of slashdot.
GSLV == Geosynchronous Space Launch Vehicle.
used to launch upto two-tonne(metric) satellites in an orbit 36,000KM from the earths center, where their revolution around earth is at the same angular velocity as the rotation of earth around its own axis. This is usefull for COMMUNICATIONS satellites. The distance is too large for this to be put to any military use except military communications.
India has been building its own satellites of all classes since almost two decades now. This is the next step in their LAUCH capability.Till now they used to have their geosynchronous satellites lauched thru the European Arienne Space. They have already succefully launched satellites in the polar (north-sorth) orbit, which is very usefull for remote sensing, weather prediction, and of course, spying).
While it is true that the GSLV scheduled to be lauched tomorrow is designed and built in india, it incorporates a critical component which is not of indian manufacture: The Cryogenic Engine, and engine which works with liquid hydrogen to provide the high thrust, but thus requires to do a lot of its functioning at a very low (below Hydrogen boiling point) temperature. Under a cold-war-era deal, the USSR agreed to supply seven cryogenic engines to india for its initial use, while simultaneously tranferring the technological knowhow to ISRO ( NASA for INDIA) so they could manufacture their own later. This later part of the deal, the tech transfer was later cancelled, under intense US pressure, as the US was worried about the ICBM-related uses of cryogenic technology.
So although this still is a big deal for a third world country to achieve, it is not true to claim that the GSLV is totally indigenous. To the credit of ISRO, they assert they will be ready with a completely indigenous cryogenic stage in the next 3-4 years. Thus the US-mandated ban could be a blessing in disguise for domestic indian R&D, repeating the success story of the Indian Supercomputer, PARAM, built from scratch indigenously, after the US refused the Indian Institute of Sciences, Bangalore, permission to import a CRAY-YMP from the US.
Sigura Non Grata
See the latest news:
There was some problem and the launch didn't take place:
http://www.rediff.com/news/2001/mar/28gslv1.htm
http://www.rediff.com/news/2001/mar/28gslv2.htm
Unix is simple. It just takes a genius to understand its simplicity. -Dennis Ritchie
For the benefit of L-T-R English readers:
OTAN=NATO
UNO=UN
This kind of Frenchification of abbreviations is exactly why "ISO" is not an abbreviation of "International Standards Organisation".. If that were the case, the French would spoil the standardization process by calling ISO OSI (Organisation de Standardisation Internationale).. EEk!
--
SCO employee? Check out the bounty
Wow, stop ! The Twelve stars don't represent countries, like the stars on the US flag do.
.eu as a ccTLD...)
The EU's Twelve stars (which have been twelve since the inception of this flag) are a symbol of completness and perfection (citing europa.eu.int from memory. Aaaah, when will we have plain
Them satellite images cost money, as does bandwidth. And it's adds to the "superpowers" bragging list. India has nukes, a blue water navy, subs, troops, satellites, etc. etc.
The real thing is to get a satellite up into geosynchronous orbit is a heckuva lot harder than to just get one into low orbit. Anyone with money to buy a SCUD missle can get something out of the atmosphere. Factor in the difficulty of space-hardening something that isn't explosive in nature, and is designed to last long enough to make a few bucks....
I'm not asking the moderators to mod this poster up (your own discretion).
However, I do wish to comment that this is a well-reasoned, well-written post. Quite enjoyed reading it.
Thanks for taking the time to write it.
If it's always preferable to be near the equator, Canada can find much sites way south of Kiruna (Just about pick any location at random in the country).
So French Guyana is in Africa? How fascinatingly clueless...
-- Colin
Either you are comparing apples to oranges : Europe[an Union] is tightly-bound politically and economically, which is definitely not the case in Asia in general;
or you just don't care about the numbers. The European Union is the biggest economic zone in the world (GNP, production, intra-zone/inter-country and inter-zone commerce, etc.). And, yes, bigger than NAFTA.
-- Colin
Modded offtopic eh? Of course moderaters don't understand a quick light jab at "funny" do they?
*sigh*
-PovRayMan
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Check out my blackbox styles
"Tomorrow, India will launch its first GSLV satellite using the Russian launchers.
GSLV is not a satellite. It is a launch vehicle - Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle.
Its an amazing feat since they have built the satellite from scratch.
India had been building satellites for two decades now. This is not her first indegenious satellite. In fact, the one on GSLV-D1 is an experimental satellite with few useful payloads that are not very critical to indian communication infrastructure.
If the launch is successful, India will become the sixth nation (US, Russia, China, Japan and the European Space Agency being the others) to build and launch a GSLV class satellite.
GSLV satellites? I guess he means the geosynchronous satellites. ISRO's previous launch vehicle series, PSLV was used for launching satellites in a polar orbit. The latest Indian Remote-sensing Satellites (IRS series) had been launched using PSLV rockets.
The GSLV rockets currently use some Russian cryogenic engines. It is still a major stepping stone for indian space industry.
There's a difference between geosynchronous (orbit period same as the earth's rotational period) and geostationary (orbit period same as earth's rotational period AND orbit plane is the same as the plane of the earth's equator).
The orbit plane of a satellite passes through the center of the earth. So a geostationary satellite will appear to sit over the same spot at the equator. A geosynchronous satellite would move up and down in latitude over the course of an orbit.
That's why orbital "real estate" over the equator is so valuable.
Free slurpees, get it right! :)
Indeed. India has been launching satellites since the late 70s - the INSATs, Rohini, etc. This is merely the test of a launch vehicle capable of reaching geosynchronous orbits (hence GSLV, as opposed to the polar orbits PSLV, the last generation, could reach).
OTOH, Pakistan already has missiles that can reach well into the Indian heartland, so sending up a few million people in a puff of nuclear smoke is not such a difficult task for them either. Especially when you consider that India has 1.02 billion people now.
"I will take the Ring," he said, "though I do not know the way."
I really hope europe is not getting the same ridiculus law suits as the US have.
The stars used to be for every EU country, but when they reached 15 countries they stopped adding stars and decided to settle on 12 as the number is good anyway :)
Since when do the French run the EU? It's really a Franco-German axis driving the thing, with the Germans usually more dominant.
It's more complex than that. Germany is usually dominant in economic and social matters, while France is dominant in military, diplomacy and cultural matters.
Oh wait, the French have them, so that is the continent's nuclear deterrent taken care of.
As do the UK. Although in a US vs Europe war they'd probably side with the US, just like they always do when a small trade-wars between the two giants appear.
Funny how a deployed and working missile defense system will invalidate it completely.
You are under the impression that the US has technology the Europeans don't. What makes you think they don't have anti-missiles too, and counter-measures against anti-missiles ? Last time I checked the Patriots were pretty loosy anti-missiles compared to the French equivalent. Also most (all?) European nukes (French/UK) are lunched from nuclear-subs, so it won't be as easy to shot down as a loosy north-korean missiles traveling accross the whole pacific. The US army has a huge weak point : arrogance...
I actually think the EU is one of the smaller economic areas, in comparison to the US or to the Asias;
Nope - the EU market is bigger than USA, both in population and in GNP. Of course if you add USA+Canada+Mexico, this might change, but then, USA+Canada+Mexico aren't united the same as the EU countries are. As for Japan+Taïwan+South Korea, they are way behind the two other behemoth.
do you remeber Japan, Taiwan, China, and Korea? They form a formidable engineering and technology quartet, with India rising quickly too.
The problem is, India is NOT part of the Asian block. I know for a fact that Chinese don't like Indian very much ("hate" would be a more adequate word), and I'm sure Indian have the same feelings in return. India and China will be both superpowers of their own, but definitely not together. Not in our lifetime at least.
I hope the US becomes a great force in this global govt, by assimilating and adapting all the relevent cultural forces and movements into itself,
I sure hope not - there are enough ugly McDonald's and KFC around the world today. And don't get me started on this loosy Hollywood "culture". One "Independance Day" movie is enough.
Under the leadership of the French? Maybe the Brits or the Germans, but the French? They haven't made any waves in civilization since the 1800's, except as Germany's punching bag.
Well then I guess the invention of radioactivity, the cinema and a bazillion of other stuff just don't count in your definition of "civilization". But then I guess you are probably leaving in a cave anyway...
Err, according to the respectable Webster dictionnary :
invent :
1 - discover, find
2 - to devise by thinking : fabricate
3 - to produce
Hence usage 1, although somewhat archaic, is correct. Marie Curie indeed invented radiocativity.
I'm dumb.
Geosynchronous means that if the sattelites TRULY are geosynchronous, then they'd NEVER collide, because they're (relative to earth) not moving and would never share a path.
do these sattelites ONLY orbit at the equator, though? I mean, if a sattelite is orbiting over, say, argentina, it would be travelling over a smaller "orbit" than a sattelite travelling over southern Mexico.
If they DO orbit only over the equator, then the math would be one dimensional, as you say, otherwise, my two dimensional (orbital plane) math is correct.. I think. (-: I'm a web developer. My math skills have been largely unused since school. (-:
[these numbers could be wrong... fair warning]
Geosynchronous Sattelite orbit is approx. 35,000km above earth's surface.
The earth's radius is at the surface ~6400 km.
So, the surface area (s) of of a GS sattelite's orbital plane would be:
s = 4(pi)(radius)^2
s = 4(3.14159)(35000 + 6400)^2
s = 4(3.14159)(41400)^2
s = 4(3.14159)(1713960000)
s = 21538238385.6
~21 _billion_ square kilometers is a whole lotta sky to plug up. AND, that's assuming that all GS sattelites travel on the same orbital plane.
BUT, assuming it's a plane, we have to worry about sattelites orbital paths intersecting at a time when both sattelites are at the intersection points of their orbits.
I'm sure that sattelite collisions are MUCH more more of a problem than "crowding the skies with junk".
Funny that, I thought the Europeans used to own the US. Must be wrong.
Germany and France? That's not the big news. The big news is that nobody has partitioned Poland for more than 50 years! (European History joke ;)
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Population equaled power a hundred years ago. Now its more of a nuisance than anything else. The problem is that the tax base doesn't grow proprotional to the population, since much of it is tax-exempt. Bangladesgh, for example (a small country next to India) tax-expempts 90% of its population of 120 million. If that population was around 20 million (appropriate for a country of that size) then the tax base wouldn't be smaller, and might even be larger because the average wealth of people would increase. That's why organizations like USAID (US deparment for foreign development) are working to spread birth control to third world countries.
PS> A funny tidbit. The US maintains several Pentium II computers each connected to its own private T-1 line to track US condom shipments to foreign countries.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
And sadly enough, I get it too... *sigh*
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France and Germany are both using the term "super-state".
And what strange bedfellows they make, considering their histories towards each other. I'm glad they're finally able to put their differences behind them; it gives me hope for the rest of humanity.
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The launch was aborted when flames were seen leaping up the side of the rocket shortly after the engines were ingnited.
Full story from BBC here.
India will become the sixth nation (US, Russia, China, Japan and the European Space Agency being the others) Israel had AMOS-1 (a GSLV) launched at 1996. India is at least seventh nation.
Sarcasm aside, Canada isn't geographically positioned very well to do launches.
The closer your launch site is to the equator, the more of a boost you get from the rotation of the earth, meaning you can launch a bigger payload on the same device. This is why the ESA generally launches out of Africa - not Europe.
Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just a netadmin, not a rocket scientist.
Oops... This feature is already there. My bad. Bye-bye, timothy. =)
What is a GSLV satellite? There is no such thing. India has created a launch vehicle, not a satellite. There are way more countries with domestically produced satellites than are on that list, because the list is of countries with launch capability.
Apparently, the employees of slashdot wouldn't know journalism if it bit them in the ass. (And, aren't some of them journalism majors? =) Why did fact checking not catch this? Because you don't do any? --
So, this leads me to suggest the following: A preferences feature that lets me add certain editors to an "ignore" list, so I don't keep having to read the false crap that timothy regularly decides is worthy of slashdot.
It was the Manchus who dropped the ball
So defeat by the British during the Opium Wars was the fault of the Manchu ? I don't really see that somehow - and look at a calendar if you need a bigger clue.
they certainly don't see themselves as Chinese,
Granted
even moreso during WWII when they sided with their Japanese masters, forming Manchuko as a puppet state).
"Sided with" is an interesting choice of phrase here. It's a little unfair (although common) to describe Siam as "siding with" Japan, but describing Manchuria in this way is ridiculous. They were invaded and militarily defeated by the Japanese, in a particularly comprehensive and brutal fashion. It's hardly "siding with", unless you'd also refer to Poland and the Ukraine in the same way.
Oh, that's right, he doesn't have one yet. That's why there's nobody telling the President that the budget cuts in science and technology are wrong-headed.
As more people get involved in reaching into space, the costs of getting something out there will decrease. However, unless something changes for the better, we won't be able to guarantee that our lead in space exploration will be maintained.
I hope India's project is successful. And I hope that it reminds some people that we used to spend money on improving our ability to go into space, and that our Space Shuttles aren't getting any younger!
Strike while the irony is hot! -- The Freethinker
BAH HAH HAH HAH ROTFLOL!!!!!!
Is that what you're learning in the KKK history books?
What else do you call a bunch of people with a shared currency, a shared military, a shared government and a shared space program?
France and Germany are both using the term "super-state". Meanwhile Britain is just sitting on the fence; too nervous to join, too scared to be left behind.
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Slashdot monitor for your Mozilla sidebar or Active Desktop.
Seth
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Take a look at the Puppy
Seriously, the Euro has fallen to a fraction of its original value. The European Union is a failure, and not terribly surprising at that, as language barriers are one of the most powerful dividing forces in the world.
"The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
The really sad thing about India is that it can afford to feed itself, but the setup of the country doesn't allow. The gap between rich and poor is too great, and despite democracy the richer city dwelling types are the ones who do the most voting. Besides- a GSV will only allow the country to become richer, and it's nuclear programme should hopefully ensure peace with Pakistan. It'll work out in the end- hopefully.
J-aims
--
Yo, whatever happened to peas? Join T( H)GS
The idea that Russia is more stable than India is stupid. India is a real democracy, Russia is a oligarchy run by an ex-KGB lunatic. Russia is a once proud country on the brink of collapse, and is desperate. India is a country that is picking itself up from the third world and colonoism(sp?) and is clearly making real progress. The cynic in me suggests you are meerly an ignorant racist
J-aims
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Yo, whatever happened to peas? Join T( H)GS
Oddly enough, you can go to Ball Aerospace and ask for just that... satellite buses
"If the launch is successful, India will become the sixth nation (US, Russia, China, Japan and the European Space Agency being the others) to build and launch a GSLV class satellite."
You mean Canada isn't even on this list?!... but they are the BEST at EVERYTHING. Surely there must be a mistake!
I just read about Markov chains in DDJ. What do you suppose was the input text before the output was generated? Because the output can't just be created from the aether, right?
Peace,
Amit
ICQ 77863057
[o]_O
Various organizations in India are already involved in projects for building supercomputing machines. I know at about least 3-4 publicly known projects. A lot of them are already in use (mucch before Beowoulf ...) Ckeck out the following links.
http://www.webspawner.com/users/SUPERCOMPUT/
http://www.cdacindia.com/
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/india/facility/hyder abad-drc-other.htm
Sattelites should not be a matter of nations but of the world. The sky above may be vast, but if it becomes too crowded, everyone will be affected. We need to form a global organization for the regulation of sattelites before our skies become too crowded with junk.
That said, I must also congratulate India on a wonderful advance. I hope that someday the manned exploration of our solar system will be picked up one day, and the involvement of other nations in space will further that hope.
Pax Digitalia
My map of Europe must be out of date, because I don't remember that nation...
Must be in the Balkans...
I would much rather be under the control of the European Parliament than Rupert Murdoch's latest puppet prime minister. But that's just me.
Unlikely that common sense reigns here. India and Pakistan hate each other with a passion that makes the cold war look like a slight disagreement. This could be another flashpoint in the region, just like Israel.
Except the launch part was a bit optimistic. Better luck next time guys :-)
The best thing I read about the ISRO was this.
I would really love to see some other nation reach the moon, whether it was India or even China. And if some day the Indians colonised the moon, at least you'd be sure of a good curry up there...
Hacker: A criminal who breaks into computer systems
"Information wants to be paid"
Ok, I'll go read the article now.
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There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.
"We have already shown the world that we can build successful commercial satellites," he continues. "Now if we prove that we can launch it correctly, it would be the next step."
The article says they want to be able to deliver a complete solution, build a satellite and put it in orbit for the customer. Hope they have a better success than the Chinese Long March failures.
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There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.
The launch failed! The BBC are reporting an aborted launch after the Russian engines ignited at the wrong end when fired. They also say that it'll take 3 years for India to develop their own engine. Personally I think it would be better for them to do that. Fresh ideas in the rocket arena wouldn't go amiss. Plus, knowing India, it'll probably end up being a fraction of the price of US, China or European rocket engines!
Yepee! Thanks for uniting us! We were already waiting for that! Yepee!
The only way any non-white country ever did anything technical is by stealing it from someone else, right?!
NO, but there is a history. For large progects like space and advance weps, things that we have done FIRST, tend to get riped off in other countries. My point was that the second( or sixth, seventh...) country to do something almost always watched the first and learned from them.
________
Does anyone actually have a Java program designed to control air traffic, or for the operation of a nuclear facility?
Those of you who think India is a novice at this stuff, take note of the following.
There is only 1 major company out there today which sells high quality satellite imagery, and that is Space Imaging. News organizations, governments, your favorite dictator, etc. buy hi-res imagery from them. Now, did you know that 4 of the 7 satellites used by Space Imaging are Indian satellites? Betcha didn't know that, didja! Don't believe me? Check it out for yourself.
India may be poor, Third World(tm), etc. etc. but it is making progress. Accept it, and we'll all get along just fine. No point wetting your bed at the sight of Indian rockets blasting off into space.
Why wasn't that mentioned in the article?
Cryptnotic
My other first post is car post.
SpaceDaily is reporting a scrub due to a fire on the pad.
TastesLikeHerringFlavoredChicken
TastesLikeHerringFlavoredChicken
After the USSR disintegrated, US using its diplomatic and economical clout forced Russia to stop selling Cryogenic stages to India. Everyone pretty much thought now India wouldnt be able to put anything on orbit, much less create launch nuclear warheads. Well these guys pretty much decided,if Russia aint giving it to us, and we kinda know how to make them, then what the heck..lets make them ourselves.
:)
This launch if it goes through successfully wont just be a triumph of india, but of every underdog out there who just didnt accept defeat when the odds were against them, but decided that "I am gonna do it myself ". Isnt this what Torvalds did ? Isnt this what each of us do someway or the other, that is not accepting defeat and building our future ourselves.
Cudos to India, and more over, Cudos to the guys who designed and built these cryogenic engines. These are the real hackers and deserves mention, not the politicians
Rapid Nirvana
GSLV is not a satellite, its the rocket thats going to launch the satellite. India has a very successfull satellite program with first satellite built in early 70's. Since the 80's it is building INSAT series multipurpose telecommunication satellites which were launched either by Russia, ESA or NASA. India's indigenously built remote sensing IRS series satellites rank among the best in the world. It is also launching these using PSLV rockets into the polar orbit. The only thing missing was the capability to launch geosynchronous satellites. Russia was going to supply them with cryogenic engines which are required to lift the payload to geo orbit, but US threatened sanctions and the deal was called off. The reason given was that India may use these for missiles!!! How about killing the competition, since India can launch satellites at much lower rate commercially for others. This would be a great boost for the third world, and NASA would loose some market. As an Indian, I am proud of it and wish all the success to ISRO. They have worked hard for years to achieve this. Thanks for listening.
Most guys seems to be fixated in pointing the obvious mistake on my part. GSLV is a launcher. Ok, so I made a mistake. Sue me! Instead of talking about the story, lets flame on this.
And please moderators, burn all the goddamn "offtopic"ers.
The fact is that India has the ability to build and launch satellites. And in a few years ISRO will give serious competition to US and Russia.
and I agree that there is much to do in a "dot-wearing" country of ours. I am sorry to say that some people can't think beyond that. Grow up and take your heads out of your asses for a change.
The world has changed a lot in the last 10 yrs. Russia, Germany, Internet are examples. And it will keep on changing. Go with it and prosper. Resist it and perish =)
They do have a lot of other satellites. The INSAT program and the PSLV satellites are comparable to the ones created US and Russia and even better in some aspects. You can get more info about the Indian Space Research Organization at ISRO's website.
China and India are building satellites, climbing the technology ladder rapidly, and have stable governments yet they are referred to "Third World" what do they have to do to get the title of "Second World" nation? Or at least no longer be bunched with less stable nations.
Hrmm, well, it was partially a joke post, too. I'm glad you enjoyed it =)
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GPL Deconstructed
Yay China, I guess, since I'm Chinese.
It's about time, too. It's sort of insulting, that one of the oldest civilizations on Earth is not quite a superpower, despite having developed and refined governement and buearacracy for the past 4000 years. Go team!
I wonder what you mean by the demise of the nation-state. A nation-state does not preclude the rise of geopolitical economic power structures, it just means that a nation-state has to be particularly large to achieve this. US is a good example of what could be potential 30 or so nation-states that collude and pool together to form a vaster, greater nation-state. So China already has that advantage, and the EU is finally catching up, in bits and pieces.
I actually think the EU is one of the smaller economic areas, in comparison to the US or to the Asias; do you remeber Japan, Taiwan, China, and Korea? They form a formidable engineering and technology quartet, with India rising quickly too. But this is an uninformed 'opinion' post, on my part.
I don't think America will be challenged by these entities at all. I think what will happen is that America will *assimilate* these entities. We've already swallowed a large amount of India's talent pool; when they go back to further grown India, they will have been corrupted by the influences of American culture(as we have been by their music, curries, and tandori chicken =). This is happening to China, to Japan, to Taiwan, and many other places.
As much as I want to see a global government, I don't think that will happen any time soon. Too many vast cultural divides exist for that to be possible in the near future. Heck, the Taliban still wages war on womanhood, how the heck would they coexist with great nations where women are prime ministers and leaders of technology, finance, and economy?
I hope the US becomes a great force in this global govt, by assimilating and adapting all the relevent cultural forces and movements into itself, and spreading it's own sense of culture and values (hopefully not at the expense of diversity!) into a global economy and existence.
Louis
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GPL Deconstructed
It was mainly a joke response to LA,T's post, more than anything else.
Anyway, to address your points, if you're being serious;
What is civilised or refined about a nation that shoots it's own students (Kent State)? or Murders it's people(Waco, Ruby Ridge)? Or kills babies (abortion)?
No, USA is not civilised or refined by any benchmark, indeed, it makes me wonder if you are just a fool?
Do you see what I'm saying? China breaking into superpower status is not tied to becoming a democracy. Being a democracy does not prevent a nation from being brutish or evil.
History has shown that it is ambition, greed, and desire that makes a state 'super'. Freedom and Democracy just make it a nicer place to live, for the people; in the case of the US, it *is* arguably the reason the people are here, and it is the people who make the nation 'super', nothing else.
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GPL Deconstructed
China is probably the world's oldest nation-state, with Japan coming in a close second. China's history spans more than 4,000 years, from one of the world's first civilizations, to being one of the world's first large empires, it's status unchanging until the 1800s. China has great pride in it's national heritage and history, and even though was set back by colonial ambitions of the West, China has a wonderful and colorful national history.
I also do not agree with your 1984 reference. You must be referencing the three nation states that are constantly in a state of war with one another in 1984. However, I cannot see why growing economic power means "challenges" to America and more space races. The basis of the world's economy today is through that fact that it is global. Having India and China become more powerful economic forces can only help to make life better for everyone there and incidentally, here, in the U.S.
I say that the world is changing for the better economic good for all, and not degrading into "outmoded ideas" as you say. And I welcome India as a modern space power.
Contrary to popular belief, I don't actually make my website for other people to look at.
The GDP of the Euro-Zone (which excludes the UK) is about 109% of the US, if the UK finally joins (likely in the longer term) the GDP will be about 140% of the US GDP. The introduction of the Euro single currency is expected by economists to increase growth and increase this gap.
I don't think America will be challenged by these entities at all. I think what will happen is that America will *assimilate* these entities. Challenged in the wrong way to describe these developments. The aims & objects of all modern democracies (Europe, America, Japan, Australia etc) are so convergent and tied into the growing global economy and shared interests that they are never likely to come into serious conflict ever again. Indeed they are so interlocked with Treaties and Alliances that it's effectively impossible. Indeed if any assimilate is to take place it will increasing be of those break-through nation you've mentioned.
What is civilised or refined about a nation that runs over it own people in tanks ? or Murders people for political dissent ? or commits genocide on tibetans ? or kills female babies ? or tortures confession from suspected criminals ?
No China; is not civilised or refined by any benchmark, indeed it makes me wonder if your are just a fool or troll ?
Until China makes the breakthrough to a modern democracy it will continue to be a third world nation. History has repeatedly demonstrated that it is freedom and democracy that makes a state 'super'.
Please ask the Germans and British how they feel about the suppression of their political independence under this "United States of Europe" vision.
The Germans are very pro increased european intergration. The British right-wing parties/establishment is very racist and anti-european. However the UK is still largely undecided. The majority of UK people accept the economic agruments in favour, and I think it's only a matter of time.
One thing the EU currently has in droves is an absence of security-related capabilities -- see Bosnia without US involvement.
Europeans are considerable less 'gung-hoe' than Yanks over military action. Do not mistake poltical reluctance for inability. Indeed the UK, Germany and France have first rate military, which in many fields exceeds US capabilities in quality if not quantity. The US had a bit part in Kosova and only political involvement in Bosnia. FYI Kosova and Bosnia are different nations.
I also do not see any European Union controlled nuclear weapons in evidence. Oh wait, the French have them, so that is the continent's nuclear deterrent taken care of.
The UK and French certainly have Strategic Ballistic Nuclear capability, they also have a ocean & theatre capability, IIRC the Germans battle field nukes.
Funny how a deployed and working missile defense system will invalidate it completely. And the Chinese arsenal is also likely to dwarf that of "Europe". Leaving the US and Russia (the dinosaurs) with the nuclear potential to destroy humanity.
The Russians have had functional ABMS system since ~72, and the Yanks have failed to get 'Star Wars' working since 80, indeed it's primarilya sop for the US Military-Industrial complex, who think equipment not training makes for a capable Military.
So really what this means is India can hit any place on earth there abouts - with a reentry capability.
In effect India has almost got an ICBM
(Inter Continental Ballistic Missile)
Anyone else slightly disturbed
I wanted a funny
"1999 was the year the Indian nuclear satellite went out of control. No one knew where it might land. It soared above the ozone layer like a lethal bird of prey. The whole world was alarmed. Claire couldn't care less."
scary, eh!
According to the BBC, the rocket caught fire and the launch was aborted.
We are seeing the demise of the nation state and the rise of geopolitical economic power structures.
The European Union we already know about - it has a lengthy history in space with the ESA, and this will only increase. Already the largest economic area on Earth, as it gains political cohesiveness it will come to challenge the mastery of America, under the leadership of the French.
China and India have never really been nation states anyway, being large multicultural post colonial entities without a shared sense of history. Nevertheless, they can be considered rising stars, already with resurgant middle classes and greatly increasing wealth.
America will be challenged by these new entities, and its time at the helm of the worlds power structure will surely pass. However, before that happens there will be a struggle for control of the exosphere through technology - I expect to see a flurry of satelite launches and space competition in the coming fifty years of history.
Perhaps the next round will involve the totla merging of these entities and the begining of a truly global government. Only then will space exploration be undertaken for its own sake alone.
The problem is that the USA in particular hangs on to an outmoded idea - the idea of the nation state. Hopefully it will see the light and not stand in the way of the new era.
--Anticipation of a New Lover's Arrival, The
Okay, I can't be the first to think that relations between India and Pakistan aren't exactly the best possible. Once one of those nations started to do nuclear tests, the other followed suit within a week or so. I would go so far as to say they have started their own cold war between them--using the US and Russia whenever possible.
The problem I see here is that Pakistan is going to want to match/beat the Indians. The Pakistanis will certainly be fearful (and rightfully so) if India can place a satellite into orbit but they can't. Medium range missles only get their warheads into most of India, and the surviving portion of India would retaliate and live on. Pakistan wouldn't last past the first assault.
Of course, I could have everything completely wrong...
Long, cute, or funny Sigs are just another form of over compensation, used by geeks, nerdz, etc.
Canada launches their satelites from the US AFAIK, correct me if I'm wrong.
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Three world powers in 2050: USA, China and India.
All have growing, educated populations.
Americans dont make enough babies,
but they let in lots of immigrants.
Russia, Japan, and old Europe are dying because
they dont make many babies.
Hasn't Canada launched a few Geo-synchronous Satellites, like a few times in the last 30 years?
There are 2 kinds of people in this world: Those who write in decimal and those who don't