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Star Wars Galaxies
Bastard0 writes "There are some new screen shots today from the new Star Wars Galaxies massively multi-player online game on " The pictures are looking really good. If the game is less boring the Everquest, then they may have a hit on their hands. Meanwhile I'm beta testing the diablo 2 expansion, and for the first time in like 3 years, I have 'CmdrTaco' as my nick in a sizable online system.
Well, I've heard this one before.
There is some truth to what you say, but not entirely. The game is but a set of rules under which the players operate and gather around: It is something they _all_ have in common and something that ties them together to do something.
...However, that is not to say that the game itself isn't important. Players will find ways to enjoy themselves even in a very poorly done game; but with time it will impede, wear down, and otherwise destroy the communities it has created. I have seen this happen many a time, and usually those once players find out they really don't have all that much in common afterwards. Oh well.
The thing is, a game encourages doing certain things over others, and it helps shape the community that way. It gives patterns, ideas, methods, things for the players to _do_ or ways for them to think about what they're in. Essentially, bringing form to this mass of players that has come forth to have fun.
It's kind of sad since the MUD community has known all this for some time now, and most of the MMORPG designers that were out for the first few generations did all the newbie mistakes. (Or, in some ways, were forced to by management. Sigh..) Only now are they starting to understand, but they're dragging all of us through the mud in the process.
UO was the best of the lot at the first point, but it was screwed up progressively more as time went on. Oh well..
Uhm, yes. Upwards of 500,000 extremely computer-savvy geeks just read about Diablo II. Their target audience. Blizzard could not buy that kind of publicity for millions of dollars.
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I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
I think they're wise to do that, good for them. It seems to me that the alternative, to even give the slightest suggestion that they are interested what their fanatical following sends them, would give a tremendous amount of false hope to the many people who are heavily invested emotionally in their intellectual property. It would also bury them in email. The Star Wars fanbase is in my opinion way, way past the point (in gross fanaticism) where there's the possibility of a healthy two-way relationship. Please don't take this personally; it's more a reflection on the most vocal and arrogant fans that I've bumped into, and it's certainly not a problem unique to Star Wars (see any MMORPG).
Fair point there. I was talking about Lucas's policy in general. I really haven't read much on the subject, but the challenge of defining a play experience in an MMORPG is awesome and I'm sure good feedback is essential. Of course, the structure and degree of that feedback is the question. There are interesting ideas out there like A Tale in the Desert, but who knows if they'll work out. Anyway, EQ's strange restrictions on naming etc. seem pretty silly to me, primarily because the time wasted imposing them could be spent on more useful pursuits.
Here's something I didn't see in the FAQ. How do they plan to do ship to ship combat, or getting from planet to planet? One of the coolest things about running around the starwars universe is the ships. I don't particularly care to play a jedi, but getting into the rogue squadron or trying to out run/fast talk imperials as a smuggler, would be really cool.
--locust
The title sequence for Battle for Naboo (wait til it's $15) starts with Jar Jar walking onscreen, and being crushed by the title. His cry of pain even sounds like "I'm sorry". I'll have to see about some sort of screen capture.
I really hope the games are canon.
Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1992-1951
That was a problem with the old Star Wars MUDs that I used to play. Everyone wanted to be a Jedi
I don't know about MUDs, but with the tabletop RPG, there were some popular alternatives, such as bounty hunters.
Although in my case, I played a psychotic shaved Ewok with brain damage. Yubyub!
They've been petitioned countless times, to no avail...and their attempts to show that they listen to their customers turned out to be nothing but back-patting sessions for themselves.
And if I sound bitter, it's because I am. +)
Neocron is a cyberpunk/postholocaust first-person shooter MMORPG that's been in development for over two years and built up quite a huge fandom, even with no playable demos during that time. All indications are, it's gonna rock. :)
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
That's incorrect. Diablo II can be played on a Mac.
This insightful reply points up the counterpoint to the obviously overreaching observations that I made -- in part, to make the point. I agree that a sucky game (in some measures) will ultimately kill a community. But the "game" I was referring to as unimportant deals with issues like "way-cool graphics," "size of the world," "presentation of plot and story," and "detailed physics." These things don't matter.
What matters is that the game be "deep" enough to sustain a long-lasting relationship with the players. Chess is a deep enough game. Tic-tac-toe is not. War in the East was a deep enough game, but way too complex to permit decent interaction. Moving from board games to story-telling, I note that the biggest, most important traits of a game design be this:
1) It not impede player-player interaction, and affirmatively encourages and rewards it;
2) It's mechanics are simple and malleable, so to permit evolution with the needs of the community;
3) It's game balance, particularly the issue of clarity v. depth, be as close to perfect as possible, and that the game evolve in accordance with (2) driven by this concern over all. No additions to the game should be made without focusing on this point.
The archetypal best repeatable multi-player game, combining Depth and Clarity, is a game akin to Diplomacy. The archetypal games for role-playing are the real-time, real-space games, such as those outlined at larpa's web site.
These games focus on the interaction and gaming experience more than on the game itself. Technology *IS* a serious impediment -- it gets in the way of the people-people communications. THIS is the key technological challenge of a networked multi-player computer game, not the game design or the prettiness of the screen. It gets even trickier for a massively multi-player game, however technology provides some WONDERFUL solutions to that problem -- I just have yet to see that done, let alone done well.
Anyway -- it is this challenge that makes the differences at the end of the day, not the packaging. Packaging gets folks in the door, but it isn't enough, not by a far cry. Gaming does require a game, but I will tell you this: a solid, interesting multiplayer variant of "rock, paper scissors," will entertain far longer than an on-line version of War in the East. FAR, FAR longer.
If the game is less boring the Everquest, then they may have a hit on their hands.
Don't you get it? The game doesn't matter at all! If you get 100 people together with the idea that they are going to have fun, guess what? They will have fun to the extent that the game DOESN'T GET IN THE WAY.
This is the lesson of the real-time, real-space role-playing business; of the entire fantasy-role playing game business; indeed, of the entire entertainment business as a whole. People do not have fun because you have MADE THEM to have fun, but because you have found a way to facilitate their own pleasures and enjoyment.
The biggest problem of most multi-player games is this: the computer gets in the way. The network gets in the way. And if there is TOO MUCH GAME, the game gets in the way.
The problem with most massively multi-player games is this: the community gets in the way. Unless you naturally break out the community into solid sub-communities with which people can interact, all you have is a complex game with really good AI's. Not bad for a complex game, but nothing like the potential of an interactive game.
People-people games are fun, exciting and interesting. When I used to gamemaster large real-space games at conventions, the lesson we learned was that the most important thing to do, both in game design and moderation, is to get out of the way. Let players interact, and interact well. Control them subtly only, and let their minds entertain one another.
That's the real deal: the game doesn't matter. It's important to some extent, of course -- in that it is the putative reason a community comes together to game. But the game itself isn't the thing -- the people are.
I wish I could find that great article by a well-known hard SF writer who slammed EpI for this (and other) reasons. One of the great things about the original movies, he said, was that anyone could aspire to become a Jedi. Old Ben even offered to teach Han Solo (who just scoffed).
Suddenly, with Episode I, you have to be born with the ability to {become a Jedi, inherit the throne, lead your people}. No fair studying and meditating; it's either the true blue blood or nothing at all.
You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
Acording to the SWG boards that is basicly how it will work, but with a very large element of chance when it comes to who can be a Jedi and is also tied closely to how your char behaves from the moment he/she enters the game. The idea is to not put a hard limit on how many jedi there are in the game and at the same time keep them VERY rare.
I had an old ISA SB16 in my dual celerons 2 years ago. I upgrade to the PCI SB Live and my framerate jumped 2x ! Why? Because the PCI bus runs at 33 Mhz compared to 8 Mhz ISA. (SB Live was using just a fraction of the CPU)
So while the orginal poster is incorrect about ping = frame rate, older hardware using less efficient protocols vs new hardware can make a difference.
Courtesy of Fargo at Gamespy (who is a very, very funny man).
Preparing for Star Wars Galaxies
Personally, I'm waiting for Neverwinter Nights
Moller
What kind of ass could C-3PO possibly kick? What's his special weapon--bitching at people till they die?
More likely they just took a bunch of shots from whatever FMVs they use. This seems to be the universially agreed upon method of marketing your games. The actual graphics you see for 99% of your game play will probably be slightly better than the original space invaders.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
I'm not interested in this because its Star Wars or a MMORPG. Thats fine and dandy but what really makes me happy is that they are not using a D&D based 4-6 attribute level advancement system. Woo Hoo! Finally online roleplaying might get out of the dark ages that pen and paper left years ago. I am so hoping that this will set a trend towards good points based roleplaying systems in future RPG computer games. Not that 3rd edition rules aren't a big step forward from the 2nd, but you're still stuck with character classes and the like.
As for the whole what will keep everyone from becoming a Jedi question, I believe the limiting factor is the cost. Anyone can become a Jedi, but to get to the point where it becomes practical and survivable is tough. Its a very costly character advancement path. Hence being a bounty hunter or a smuggler may be a much better choice.
So far I've gotten all my Karma from telling people they are wrong... :)
More people use Windows than Linux as well, but that doesn't neccessarily mean Windows is better.
Last night I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got in my pajamas I'll never know.
I did the beta test of EQ, and quit in a matter of hours...it was the most boring game I have ever played. I played UO for like 8 months and that was the best game, with fairly simple graphics. I think companies now are more concerned with graphics than gameplay. UO was more concerned with gameplay than graphics, and it was a huge it and still is.
No, the real reason for camping is because of poor game design by Verant. EQ relies far too heavily on making items rare by putting them on infrequent spawns where you could wait hours or days and not see them. Spawn rates should be increased significantly or there should be alternative ways to obtain most items such as via quests. Unfortunately Verant doesn't want to work for its money - it's easy to edit the spawn rate field on some monster than develop a quest.
Nope, I'm not. I'm actually looking forward to be a Jawa. Killing rednecks in Tatoonie with my ion-gun, stealing thir droids and bringing them to my massive Sandcrwaler for trade. Utinni!
i remember way back in the day when lucas arts put out an old game, "Rebellion", which, although at first, was a crappy game, once playing it in about 20 minutes, was maddeningly addictive. I remember borrowing it from my friend for "a night"....6 months later he had to pry it from my hands. I'd suggest picking up a copy and playing it to tide you over.
This looks to be almost an extension of the game, except that you (i'm assuming, if it's inline with everquest) play as one charicter and you play the part of a single thread in the intracate tapestry of the star wars universe, influencing it in your own miniscule way. The graphics look amazing, I sure hope those are actual ingame graphics....I've been dissapointed by previous releases of games. B&W had some amazing "screenshots", and almost delivered with that kind of detail. I'm just afraid that the sys req.'s of this game will prevent too many people from playing it.
I'm hoping to see this ported to the X box and PS2 in the future, that would definatly help the initial bit of having enough human players to make the world interesting and not boring.
moox. for a new generation.
Maybe they will at least let you maim him a bit, or kick him around... even if you cant kill him. He can always 'recover' from a solid beating, thus keeping the continuity of the universe. Maybe they could have jar jar wrestling as a mini game or something even. Of course, then you would have an empty universe because everyone would be camping the jar jar wrestling facility....
Time for some tasty Shiner Bock!
Well, for all the people shouting for a Linux MMORPG, you can always go visit the nice people over at Worldforge.
They've made a lot of progress recently, and there's an updated status report and some screenshots for those of you who like eye candy.
What would Lemmy do?
I guess Slashdot doesn't count, then?
Friends don't let friends use multiple inheritance.
That limitation probably won't work, because people will just keep creating & deleting characters until the random generator gives them one that is well-suited to be a jedi. I bet with in a month the game will be crammed with 12-year old kids playing jedi knights.
Let's face it, a lot of people are bound to say "f* this. If I can't be a jedi, what's the point in playing it?"
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Well, he's at least right on the "precise" part. Precision doesn't necessarily imply accuracy. The fact that the stormtroopers consistenly miss implies there's a degree of precision going on. However, since precision generally requires skill, it's obvious that stormtroopers are, in fact, expert marksmen, but that the suffer from all having their gun sights misaligned.
5.06 Will I be able to set my blaster to stun and kill, and change the color of its blasts?
This Question should have read:
5.06 If we get to shoot blasters in the game - will they be a *lot* more accurate than they are in the movies?
"CHEWY! Lock in that auxillary power!"
I'm betting you'll need a godly connection to be able to get those kinds of graphics.
Yep, I'm sure you'll also need a pretty good video-card to get the full audio experience. And I'm sure anyone with a cheap soundcard will get terrible pings.
Number one - No ingame jedi bullshit, you were born a jedi you die a jedi no getting there inbetween. Maybe there should be a lottery for newbies, every 1000 get a slightly higher amount of jedi skills.
Number two - you should be able to in the least; pick your skills, your trade, and your secret society. There should also be a control panel of sorts to show you your personal possesions your greater posessions and the lot.
Number three - No getting promoted from XP UNLESS you pass tests. Nuthin hard just get quized from a master level character or greater (possibly AI) in the area that you want to advance. That makes for greater game play since this forces you to know what you are talking about. (especially good if you are a travelling merchant)
Number four - xp should be given out for a number of situations, not just conquest in battle... Sell a hijacked star destroyer get a million xp and the chance to become a rebel admiral.
Number five - and most important try to remember to always stay in character, this game is going to be very popular and alot of people will be playing that just dont know how to act in a rpg let alone one with alot of other people around.
rrdejay
Gone but not... ummm
If it lets me kill Jar-Jar-Binks at 1280x1024 resolution with GeForce 3 enhanced lightsaber effects, I'll be happy.
First, there aren't any "levels" or "maps", or perhaps I should say the world is one huge level. There are things to attack and kill all over the world, there are things to pick up and use just like in an FPS. The world is persistent, and you can enter and leave the world, but it doesn't stop just because you leave.
The main difference is that you keep your character. When you log in and do stuff, you become better at using certain skills...like for example from an FPS, maybe aiming would be a skill, fast loading, resistance to damage. Every time you get into combat, you use skills, so you get better at them over time. So, an old experienced character with mediocre equipment could destroy a newbie with the best player in the world with the best reflexes and hardware and client cheat upgrades. What it does is make it less of a "player skill" game and more of a "character skill" game by letting you build up your character over a long time.
There are also other things possible. You could go out and mine for ore and take that ore and make items out of it. You could chop down trees and make furniture, if this has been coded. So, there are other kinds of things you can do if that's what interests you. If the game is set up correctly, you should be able to play without engaging in combat much at all, if you so choose.
The pace IS slower than an FPS, but when things do happen, like fighting a big monster, or seeing 10 people walking up to you to pkill you, you get the same kind of rush. The big difference is that if you die, you lose your equipment, maybe some of your skills, but you can work on those skills and get that equipment back, and your character isn't set back to absolute nothing. The learning curve is pretty shallow to start, but generally there's lots of depth and you can't possibly explore all the things to do in only a few hours. If they have it set up correctly, you should be able to get tutorials and introductory maps to starting shops and simple places to learn skills, but if not it can be difficult.
So, there you go...it's kind of like an FPS where there's one huge map representing the whole world, and people can enter and leave the map when they want, and as you kill things on the map, or do things, you get skills that improve that make your CHARACTER better, so that you aren't so reliant on your PLAYER clicking/aiming skill over time.
Best. Comment. Ever. Enjoy!
all of those were great games that did an excellent job of keeping the money rolling in while they were between movies, but now that he's back into the SW movie saga there are brand-names to be milked.
nice gouraud shaded sand back there!
Hey, I remember when Tie Fighter first came out they had Gouraud shaded starships and it was frickin' awesome. And I think that it probably looks a little better than having to texture all that background space, not to mention being considerably faster.
But then again, I'm not a 3D artist/programmer.
I dunno...it could be almost an entirely different game. If you figure that they'll probably release the original with all the planets and allow you to travel between them via spaceports (just no in-space sequences), then you still get most of the functionality in the initial package. But then beyond that you could create a game where the space travel part of the game becomes a primary activity, allowing you to play a smuggler, or rebel/imperial pilot, pirate, mercenary, etc.
You could almost work in an entirely new game like X-wing vs. Tie-Fighter, only opened up to allow more players simultaneously and allow for a wider variety of ships. Imagine, you've managed to get a ship to transport you from Tatooine to Coruscant. On the way you pass by a dogfight where a merchant cruiser is being attacked by a band of pirates. You could jump in on whichever side you favor and be the heroic rescuer. Or you could just keep going and not worry about it. Or perhaps you could save the merchant ship and then be offered a reward or future employment with the merchant company (perhaps only to be swayed in the future by a pirate gang).
Or perhaps you could make a career as a pirate-hunter, bounty hunter, or even repo man who specializes in hunting down starships. You could have an opportunity to take out PK's and other (even high-level) characters/NPC's without having to worry about him having twice the XP and mana points that you do, because it would all come down to your ability to actually dogfight in a sim-like environment. No worries about whether you've got enough skill points to take someone on.
You really could make an entire other game with a MMO space combat sim that integrates into SWG. That would be sweet!
Let's face it, a lot of people are bound to say "f* this. If I can't be a jedi, what's the point in playing it?"
This is true. Game developers always have to delicately balance fairness, gameplay balance, and player interests. Hopefully they will design a lot of other equally interesting professions. Otherwise we'll be stuck with 100,000 Jedis complaining about how there's too many Jedis in the game.
Of course, the Jedi is just pretty much like the mage class in most fantasy-based MMORPGs. I rarely play the mages, I like being the brute warrior type myself. And there are plenty of other people who don't play mages because they find elements of other professions more interesting. So hopefully this will be the same with the Jedi class. If you look at a game like Ultima Online, people play non-mages (or non-warriors or whatever) because EA has made it similarly rewarding to play other classes. As long as they can do that with SWG, they ought to be OK.
That was a problem with the old Star Wars MUDs that I used to play. Everyone wanted to be a Jedi, which isn't exactly true to the image of the series. One solution I saw was that everyone had a class (like figher or trader) but could also become a Jedi. I didn't think it was a good solution, but I can't think of any good solution.
Nope. Its an MMORPG. Like Everquest or Asheron's Call. No single player game.
How much is this going to cost? or is it one of those servers that it costs to connect to?
Probably about the same as EverQuest or Asheron's Call -- $50 for the game (at first, will drop to $30 or so quickly), and approximately $10 per month in subscription fees to connect and play.
The graphics look kick @SS, but, how will it look on my P2 400 with Voodoo3?
Probably like (plain old) ass. But oh well, there's only so much that can be done with a P2/V3.
Do you have to play an actual character from Starwars, or can you create your own (ex. Slartibartfast, or something)
You HAVE to play as your own character. The game features races that appear in the movie, but since its a huge online game, not everyone can be a real character from the movie. From what I've read, the movie characters will pop up but as non-player AI characters, or as admin-controlled characters.
Is every character in it played by someone, including Shop keepers, Drunks, etc?
Doubtful, I'm sure lots of the characters you encounter will be AI controlled, as in other online RPGs.
How expansive of a universe comes on the cd? Everytime you go to a new planet, do you have to download maps?
From what I've read the initial game will be pretty big. I'm not sure whether they will use the Asheron's Call model of expansion (free downloads every month that make the world bigger) or the Everquest method, which forces you to buy expansion packs at $20-$30 a pop. Probably the latter since its worked fairly well for them in Everquest (this game is being developed by the same company, Verant/Sony).
Granted, it's not with GF3 enhanced lightsaber effects, and it makes the game harder to finish with the karma system in place, but man, talk about satisfaction.
I have been fan of Star Wars well before I can remember, the 1st movie came out when I was two. I have have been waiting for something like this game for a terribly long time. Of course I have also been wating for a MMORPG with a Super Hero Theme as well, but hey who cares about that?
Anyway, the only issue that I have with the game is that it is not planned on being like Neverwinter Nights in the aspect that everyone can create their own stories and run their own servers. Of course I understand that the game is grander in scope than just about other MMORPG that is currently in existence and it would more than likely tax the heck out of anyone's home built server.
Regardless I would still like to be able to put into existence some of the grand stories that I put together when my friends and I were younger and had the time to spend the entire weekend playing the Star Wars Role-Playing Game.
Even though there are a few things that I dislike about the game, I will more than likely still be one of the first to line up to buy a copy, like I did when the original movies were rereleased with the extra footage.
One more gripe than I am gone. What the heck is with releasing the interstellar travel portion as a dang expansion? Don't they think that they will make enough money with releasing the whole game for 59.99 and then charging 10 bucks or whatever a month? This greed thang is just a little to much for me.
If you ignore the other uses of a tool, does that make the tool less useful, or you less useful?