Slashdot Mirror
Mozilla 0.9.3 Released
nexex writes: "Shamelessly ripped from Mozilla.org, "Talkback data shows that recent 0.9.2 branch builds are more stable than Netscape 4.78 and we expect even better results for 0.9.3. Now is the time to try Mozilla again if you've been waiting for stability to improve." Translation: Mozilla is better than ever. Get your copy here."
I've been using Mozilla as my main browser for months. 0.9.2 is great (except for a tendency to crash while writing a K5 diary for some reason). But the mailer absolutely *sucks*. I've never seen anything so slow. It takes literally a full minute (or more!) to do "compose....type addresses, type subject". Has that improved at all?
324006
Dude - save yourself the headache. Grab the full installer and use that. I run Ximian, use Red Carpet often. But I install Mozilla with the installer in /usr/local/mozilla all by itself - clean directory. Never had a lick of trouble.
I love RPMs and Red Carpet - they save me time and trouble, but sometimes its just not worth it. Grab the installer and have a go at it. Just make sure you install it as root, run it once as root (good time to grab teh Java plug in which also must be installed as root) and then quit. You should be able to start it as any user after that - works great here.
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
text sizing:
CTRL+
Or
CTRL-
to enlarge text or make it smaller. great feature
Keywords:
edit bookmarks, pick a bookmark and pick properties, add a keyword. say 'sd' for slashdot.org. then type in the location box (ctrl L gets you focused on the location box) type sd and hit enter, you'll be whisked away to slashdot.org.
SideBar Tabs:
A great way to have quick acces to web tools like mapquest or an online dictionary. see the sidebar directory at:http://dmoz.org/Netscape/Sidebar/
"The Most Fun Possible on 4 wheels" is at SunBuggy in Las Vegas
Don't know about other platforms, but on Linux, you can just download the jdk (jre might work too). It contains a plugin directory. Inside the plugin/i386 directory, there are two directories: ns4 and ns600. Each contain a java plugin. Just make a link to the ns600 plugin to your mozilla/plugins directory. Works for me.
Je ne parle pas francais.
I still say that gecko, the Mozilla-engine is mostly way faster at rendering than IE. In some specific cases there might be a different story (possibly also attributed to bugs rather than design-issues), but generally gecko renders faster. Of course this is almost always subjective, I haven't seen any real hard facts yet.
Typical FUD - I use both Mozilla and IE6 - Honestly as long as the browser serves up web pages properly and quickly and the associated email client doesn't suck (I prefer Mozilla Mail over OE anyday) who cares what it 'looks' like - its not art.
While I've always felt IE blew Netscape 4.x away, in this case, MS may have hurt themselves by adding too many things to IE6. The pirvacy thing, while a good idea, seems useless so far - privacy polcieis in cookies? Yeah right. Honestly, IE6 seems no differnet than IE5 to me - it works, so I'm happy. Same goes for Mozilla, it now works great and I'm happy. I honestly use Mozilla instead of IE because of the Mail client - beyond that, I could care less, except for the fatc, of course, is that it allows me to use one less Microsoft product :)
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
Opera and Galeon are both faster than IE. They actually start up about as fast as IE, without being preloaded on login.
I happen to like the download-on-demand installer, where you pick the components you want to download and install. The odd thing about this is that it's completely tied to the version available when you click "download installer." The Mozilla installer for build 2000073108 looks and works exactly like the one for build 2000073109, but each one has the version number pre-written in the .ini file. Can't there be an option "download latest version" instead? That way, instead of downloading and untar'ing a new installer every day, I can just run it every day and let the installer I already have do the work.
For more information, click here.
Its just you ;)
Seriously, they have a detailed Roadmap outlining their plans. Their dates have slipped some but they've been holding pretty well to teh schedule. Currently plans call for Mozilla to go 1.0 with what WOULD be 0.9.5 if it is deemed ready . They are just using a differnet scheme for release, vs the beta to release candidate to release. Its all in teh naming. So if all goes well (and it sure seem to be finally) I'd bet they'll make v1.0 in the beginning of the fourth quarter. But even if they don't make it till 0.9.7 which is December timeframe it'll still be a huge accomplishment.
Top Most Bizarre/Disturbing Error Messages
RPM's seem to work great under Linux... (RH 7.1)
5 minutes so far, Seems good!
-- You can't idiot-proof anything, because they're always coming out with better idiots.
I've actually been using the standard Netscape Flash plugins in 0.9.1, .2, and .3 now, and they all work great. There was some scratchy sound at one point, but that was an unrelated kernel bug with my sound driver. What problems in particular have you been experiencing?
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
On days like this when the server is busy, this network installer crap is useless. Where's the 9MB installer download, eh? I've had to run setup 15 times because it keeps timing out on the download of individual packages. I've basically run the installer once or more for each individual package. The setup program doesn't remember my settings from the last run, so I have to go through modifying every screen of the wizard every time. And after all that, I've still got to manage the downloaded files which aren't where I want them so that I can install on other machines easily.
I got around it by blowing away the existing Mozilla folder and then unpacking the new one fresh.
rm
Sci-Fi Storm
Bugzilla 44787 has been marked as a Won't Fix. It was originally entered as a bug (as in Bugzilla) and has been established as a minimum requirement. "The linux builds are built on RedHat 6.0 systems which use glibc 2.1. Therefore, the minimum required version of glibc is 2.1. Builds have been known to work (occassionally) when built under glibc 2.0.7 but they aren't officially built nor supported (due to known race problems with the 2.0 dynamic loader). "
Actually, yes, I've been giving it a try too. /rocks/. :)) into Windows as a widget control, you could probably replace the IE HTML engine with Mozilla's in that widget. It would be neat. :) The good thing is that it looks the same everywhere. The bad thing, well, is that it makes it a more bloated piece of code. Gaelon, on the other hand, uses the Mozilla rendering engine in a GTK browser; it could be what makes it noticeably faster than Mozilla, and it's most probably what makes it lighter. :)
Well: it
What's funny is that Galeon points out both Mozilla's biggest strength and, IMHO, its biggest weakness. Its strength is a smart API, that you can use to embed Mozilla into applications. It's how Komodo works, for instance. If IE wasn't commingled (such a nice word...
But Mozilla also has a feature that can count as a weakness: it has its own interface toolkit. It doesn't use Qt nor GTK nor anything of the like: it comes with its own thing. Unless I got it completely wrong, of course, which is also a possibility.
But enough ranting! I use Konqueror, Mozilla, Gaelon or w3m, all four of them, depending on my mood, and I've never been so happy about the freedom of choice that comes with free(-speech) software!
-- B.
This sig does in fact not have the property it claims not to have.
I'm thoroughly impressed, at this point Mozilla never crashes on me, and rendering is instantaneous. Great job, guys!
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
Still not quite as fast as IE, but with the Enable Quick Launch feature checked, Mozilla is finally becoming competitive
Maybe it's just the type of system, but on my box, the with quick launch enabled, it starts up sooo much faster than IE. I click on the icon in my quick launch tray and the window just displays, about as fast as if I just had it minimized (roughly 1-2 seconds from click to start page displayed). Clicking the the IE icon in the quick launch tray takes a while to load, well, the window displays instantly, but it still takes a few seconds for the start page to display (roughly 5 seconds from click to start page displayed).
Without quick launch enabled it takes about as long to load as IE from click to start page. Granted that with IE you get the window instantly and then wait for the start page, and with mozilla you wait for the window while watching the splash screen, but when the window displays the start page displays immediatly.
Things you think are in the Constitution, but are not.
Just wait until you see IE 6 in XP - it is so much nicer than the "Modern" theme. With all the Luna goodness (minus the messed-up scrollbars - haven't tried RC1, might be fixed), it's really quite a pretty browser.
MUCH nicer looking than Mozilla, more colorful, better CSS support (well - as far as I can tell, I haven't done a detailed analysis, but so far I haven't run into too many bugs) - P3P support, image blocking support - it's really nice.
NS6 doesn't stand a chance against IE6.
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
Well, you could go to the Roadmap and see for yourself. The number of bugs left before they're ready to call it 1.0 is declining quite nicely.
The only one left that bothers me is ATM smoothing. Total deal-breaker for anyone using postscript fonts. Luckily the bug is now understood and is scheduled (hopefully) for 0.9.4
The flash plugin will crash it hard and fast.
and Macromedia said that it will never release a flash plugin for it.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Please update the mozilla graphic, I note that the nose is not depcited correctly given the latest reasearch data.
:)
mark
It'll be 1.0 when it's ready to be. This is a mature approach. Contrast that with taking a 0.8 build and calling it a 6.0 build and getting ridiculed about shipping a steaming pile of crap. I'm sure some MBA can explan why that was a good idea...
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
"wintendo" I guess that about sums it up, except my nintendo never blue screens on me!
"The Most Fun Possible on 4 wheels" is at SunBuggy in Las Vegas
There might have been some internal API changes in Mozilla that galeon uses. You might want to recompile.
This is good news (and on the same day as beta 2 of Evolution - who said the Linux desktop was dead?)
:)
I use Galeon, but until there's a Moz 0.9.3 optimised release I've decided to use Moz again for a while, and I honestly can't get over how much faster this release is to start and to render than 0.9.2!
Also seems to be using less memory (based on my unscientific approach of looking at my bubblemon_applet) which has to be a good thing.
It's also nice to be able to upgrade version without it killing my chromes. Even skypilot is running fast.
So, the race is on - what'll reach 1.0 first, Mozilla or Evolution?
Listening for the sound of the coming rain...
Has anybody gotten that to work yet?
BTW, in addition to everything they tell you to disable in javascript on the compenent security page, I've also disallowed the irritating window status changes (remove the space after 'status'):
user_pref("capability.policy.default.Window.status ", "noAccess");
Mozilla doesn't currently have spellchecking (it used to be that you could install Netscape 6's spellchecking into Mozilla, but that no longer works). So, if you're interested in spellchecking, please vote for bug 56301 (of course, you'll need a free Bugzilla account to vote).
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
Every new release of Mozilla fills me with both joy and dread. Joy because it genuinely gets better each time, dread because I'll have to fight with Ximian Redcarpet and Galeon RPMs to install it :-( Why does Mozilla have to be such a crucial part of Ximian? Mozilla's being developed much quicker than Ximian is, but those of us lazy folks who use packages have to wait for the Ximian distribution to catch up before we can try the latest Mozilla builds. Which sucks.
non-talkback builds? just get a nightly, I always go that route and it hardly ever bites back. Nightly build directory: http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla/nightly/latest/ mozilla-i686-pc-linux-gnu.tar.gz
"The Most Fun Possible on 4 wheels" is at SunBuggy in Las Vegas
Yeah, on my P5@200MHz, Mozilla is *slow*. I don't have IE, but if you want a fast browser on UNIX, try Galeon or SkipStone; they both use Mozilla's embedded rendering component, and esp. the latter is nearly as fast as Lynx (really! ;)
Cons:
The slower-bit is offset if you use Galeon as a frontend. Which buys you a lot of speed, and somewhat better desktop-integration, on the expense of portability and library-count.
Both Mozilla and Konqueror are good browsers, but Mozilla is more technologically advanced, and the portability issue means a lot for it's acceptance and possible market-share.
Because they use Bugzilla to track all issues with Mozilla. Since people complain daily about the symptoms that turn out to be glibc problems, it's best to include the info in the bug report and just point people there.
That's also the place to debate the issue.
There are plenty of "bugs" that aren't, including feature-requests, user error, bad HTML/websites (e.g. the TLS mess), et cetera.
One simple rule for its versus it's
The only real thing stopping me from using Mozilla as a primary browser is its lack of support for secure connections. It simply won't connect to some bank and credit card sites.
I'll give it some credit. It now works (more or less) with my my two most frequently accessed accounts. But still, one of my primary bank accounts won't let me log in
What annoyed me most was reading the comments on the related bugs. Developers saying that ABC Webserver doesn't support the exact SSL specification here or there. That's life! Slight incompatibilities exist all over the internet. You have to work around them. Emailing the webmaster and having them upgrade their software is NOT the bug fix. Patch, kludge and work around the problem, please! Then, I can start using Mozilla instead of dumbass NS 4.78746372...
While I have Mozilla 0.9 installed I've found myself dropping back to using Netscape 4.77 most of the time. So I jumped at the chance to try out the new 0.9.3 build, maybe it puts right all the things that make me uncomfortable with Mozilla!?
So I have a look at mozilla.org and see that there are some nice spiffy new binary RPMs available for RH7.x, excellent, don't even have to bother compiling it. Download and install, open a new window, rehash, and, err...
Oh well, I guess I'm going to have to compile it after all...
Al.The Daily ACK - Eclectic posts by yet another hacker
I'm hoping that this version starts to work faster than previous versions. I've done some simple benchmarking of IE vs Netscape vs Mozilla on both Windows (2000 Advanced Server and 98) as well as Solaris 9 2/01 build. I click open up a new page in the browser that's not cached, and start the stopwatch. I do this for all 3 browsers for the same site. Not surprisingly IE spanks Netscape / Mozilla on both Microsoft platforms, but it also ourperforms them on Solaris. I really like a lot of the mozilla stuff, and if they can get the speed down, its going to be the premier web browser. As of right now, Lynx is the only browser faster than IE.
I'm going to download the new Mozilla build in the next few days, I still have my fingers crossed.
Clinton made me a Republican. Bush made me a Libertarian. Trump is making me question reality.
Please don't use such non-specific references as "the parent of this message". There may be one true parent message, but it may be difficult to find without browsing at lower thresholds, especially if it gets modded down. And it becomes almost impossible to determine after the thread is archived.
Anyhow, I didn't say Mozilla wasn't stable. I said NS 4.x was so unstable that it was meaningless to say Mozilla was more stable. Most of the Mozilla builds since around 0.8 or so have been very stable for me under W2K at work. (And I have a 90+ day uptime on that W2K box, too.) The only problem I have had was right after I installed 0.9.3 it crashed twice. So I uninstalled it and re-installed with talkback and it hasn't crashed since then. Note that I do NOT install Mail/News/Chat because I don't believe in using web browsers for anything but web browsing. (And I wish I had the option to disable the freaking HTML editor too!)
To the person who said "turn off everything including images and it's great!", I say at that point you might as well be running Lynx. To the other person who says NS 4.x is stable for him, I suppose he might still be a modem user. I gave up NS 4.x when I got DSL and could crash it every two minutes. And to the person who says "just learn how not to annoy Windows 98", I say get a real operating system!
But I wish they hadn't broken auto-completion of URLs. (in 0.9.2, I think) Sure, the menu pops up, but it doesn't complete the URL that you're typing into.
--
"Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
"Open source is evil." - Microsoft
Does anyone know if there is a way to get Mozilla
to send ie's user agent code so that it can access those stupid ie only sites?
The difference between Canada and the USA is that in Canada healthcare is a right and gun ownership is a privilege.
Flash works fine for me. Mozilla 0.9.3 (Build 2001080104), Shockwave Flash 5.0r47.
:-)
Macromedia said they'd never support Mozilla, they never said anything about not supporting Netscape 6, and Mozilla uses the same plugins
----
Open mind, insert foot.
The question is, why is this called a bug? It seems that requiring glibc 2.1 is fairly common in other programs. Library dependencies are normal, as later versions have APIs that earlier ones lacked, and expected. (Also, annoying if you are not warned, but here we are)
So, why is a dependency a bug?
Best Slashdot Co
Another trick for improving both speed and stability in Netscape 4.x is to set the Cache setting to never compare the current page with cache. It literally loads twice as fast.
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
I like it. It doesn't crash. It renders pages quickly and correctly. In Windows I can use the "-turbo" command line switch to get IE like startup speed (I hope this makes it to the Linux builds too). But the biggest improvement over 0.9.2 is in my opinion that a window that is done loading doesn't steal my focus any longer! Previously you couldn't really have a lot of browser windows open because they constantly kept stealing the focus from each other.
I also like that you can open a link in a new window with the middle button. It's always worked like that on Linux, but it now also works in Windows. It's definitely ready for daily use IMHO.
I seriously hope this was sarcasm. I'd like to find the child who designed the Luna interface at some point, and teach him or her how to actually design interfaces, minus the crayola.
I do it this way so that I can do it conditionally depending on whether I am at home or at work with my laptop. My ROX app scripts simply look at my hostname and do the proper thing accordingly.
Could we please, just once, not have all the dull 'This is late posts'. I could understand them if in the time between Netscape 4 and 6 IE had leapt ahead, and left Netscape in the dust, but the fact is there have been minimal facelifts in that time. In fact, every time someone says 'But IE isn't stable!!!' and someone says 'IE5.5 / 6 is very stable' they just prove the point, that Mozilla is up to speed with the current iteration of browsers. And with the speed (and yes, it is there) of improvement recently of Mozilla, I have every confidence that built on these secure, stable foundations, whatever they come up with next (e.g. 2.0) will be way ahead.
So sit back, download, and enjoy!
I'm thinking of switching to Mozilla. I'm interested in the basics. How is it on blocking pop-over/pop-under ads?
You can't ride two horses with one ass
Mozilla essentially decided to write everything from scratch from graphics libraries to bugzilla to the browser and so on (which slowed down the project to no end). But now that all the peices are almost fully worked out, they should be able to get done soon.
My guess is that it will be ready around december. It would be a nice "community Christmass present". My predictions are: 0.9.4 will be great but still have things wanted done. 0.9.5 will be probably a good candidate release. They will probably do some more final cleanup which will lead to release 0.9.6 which will cleanly become 1.0.0 when people say they are happy with it.
I have no insider information but I have been following this project for a long time (downloading since Milestone 13) and this "feels right" to me. I always thought people were too optimistic about when the release time for Mozilla would be considering the scope of the project.
I miss the Karma Whores.
That isn't saying much. It is my experience that nitroglycerin is more stable than any version of Netscape 4.xx.
--
"Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
"Open source is evil." - Microsoft
This may be the one enabling both my wife and I to chuck the famous IE/Outlook Express combo.
A lot of attention on this site has been on the Linux, etc. platforms, but Mozilla 9.2 on Windows is pretty good, too. Still not quite as fast as IE, but with the Enable Quick Launch feature checked, Mozilla is finally becoming competitive. Perhaps 9.3 will be about equal.
And the Modern theme is very nice and durable, which makes IE look very tired. Great work by all involved!
There is no need to use a SlashDot sig for SEO...
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
Yes you can access banks. Mozilla does 128 bit encryption, SSL, the whole 9 yards, and it even does it properly. (or at least as properly as any other browser...) I'm fairly confident reason you are having trouble with the banks is not because of the browser. It is because of the banks. I have been using Mozilla nearly 100% of the time for close to 5 months now on both a Windows 2000 box and an SGI Octane. (and a lesser percentage of the time since M16) Yes I've run into problems with some of my banks but since version 0.9 the problems were because of the bank. They didn't parse forms correctly, or they programmed circles around the Netscape 4.x oddities but never updated it when Mozilla/Netscape6 started doing it right or other issues.
Now granted I'm just one person but I have yet to be able to trace any problem with secure connections I've had to Mozilla since version 0.9. It has always been bad coding on the other end. YMMV obviously but it does work and works pretty well if the folks who designed the website have a clue.
Mozilla doesn't play well with a couple of proxy servers. Do you have junkbuster or something like that? have you tried disabling that?
--Asa
And it supports ESD properly now too, so I don't have to disable my esound daemon just to go check out joe cartoon when I need a laugh.
I've been playing the joecartoon stuff on mozilla all day, no problems :)
http://www.joecartoon.com/
Here's the BeOS port:
mozilla-i586-pc-beos.zip
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire
For the longest time, I couldn't stand looking at those crummy Netscape buttons. I like the themes option. Extremely customizable.(I realize this has been around for a while)
;)
:P Not sure my RAM-poor laptop can handle that.....
And it does seem to live up to the promise of "less crashes". (I've had it running a whole 15 minutes and it hasn't crashed yet
But there are drawbacks. On Win32, running Mozilla wants 33MB from my heap. That's almost 3 times what IE wants for rendering the same page
A nice surprise: Mozilla properly handles true alpha-masked PNGs.
But hey, kudos to the mozilla folk for making a stable build!
--
#include <malloc.h>
free(your.mind);
from:
mozilla.org/releases/mozilla0.9.3:
Proxies
Mozilla needs to be configured to work properly with proxies such as Junkbuster that do not support the most recent HTTP specification. By default, Mozilla tries to use HTTP 1.1. To use Mozilla with a proxy that only supports HTTP 1.0, edit the HTTP Version from 1.1 to 1.0 in Edit | Preferences | Debug | Networking. (Bug 38488)
Does anyone know where I can find a higher resolution, or (hopefully) a vector based version of that pic? I think it would look so damned kick ass on a t-shirt, that and the commie-moz-star...
got drum'n'bass?
http://mp3.com/vitriolix
The people doing the comparing have hard numerical data (average time from startup to crash for a large number and decent variety of users across multiple operating environments) for Mozilla and NS 4 but not for IE. So comparing to IE would be based on hearsay and anecdotal evidence only.... and the comparison would be next-to-meaningless.
1) No matter what I set my default search to, I always get that annoying netscape site when using "? keywords" in the address box.
2) <input type="file"> objects still have rendering problems when applying a style to it.
Still, I'm going to make a couple of tweaks to our Intranet in order to support this build, and try to get people at work to try it out.
Unfortunately, everyone I've talked to so far wouldn't even give it a try. They have no problems with using IE. I don't really either, but if me using it somehow supports their effort, then Im more than happy to.
I anyone able to browse http://localhost? I am not able to do so :-(. It just redirects me to Netscape search.
I'm running Suse 7.1 on Intel.
This is your sig. There are thousands more, but this one is yours.
If it tries to run without the required libs being present, it is a bug.
Surely there is sonme way for the program to determine this at startup?
I do hope that you filed a bug for this, otherwise i am afraid you are the weakest link... goodbye!
Meaning it only crashes every FOURTH time you load it, instead of every THIRD time, and there's only a 33% chance that your settings will be trashed when that happens.
Sorry, waiting two years for a project this big and bloated wasn't worth it.
Honorary Member of Jackie Chan's Kung Fu Process Servers
TROLL? WTF? I asked a valid question and I get moderated a TROLL? I guess someone working on Mozilla just happened to get mod points today.
XML teledildonics.
...asking too much?
Honorary Member of Jackie Chan's Kung Fu Process Servers
How is mozilla for news? It appears that netscape has an O(n^2) algorithm for sorting messages in newsgroups, and very poor multipart support. Things like this are important in the post napster age.
and padding on the ol/ul will work fine in both browsers.