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Virtual Keyboard
Archfeld sent a strange piece of technology called the Senseboard which
is a portable keyboard, except that there's really not any keys. Or a board. And it can communicate via RF for all your strange wearable applications.
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Cool, but I value tactile feedback. The lack of feeling of me actually *pushing* a button will just feel weird. I wonder if it's something you'd get over, though.
hmmm, i'll just type this up on my invisible typewriter.... do dee doo do do
oh yeah... and first post too
May you be touched by His Noodly Appendage. RAmen.
How cool would it be to play the piano on my desk? Someone may have figured out a way to make money on all of those people playing 'airguitar' everytime Led Zeppelin comes on the radio...
davejenkins.com |
The applications of this product are endless.
:) Itll up the usability and practicality of PDAs and wearable computers in real world situations.
Imagine if you were a mechanic under a car and needed to type up some sorta note or reminder into your computer.
No more grafiti for PDAS
Can't wait to get one.
"Talk about your vaporware!" :)
I need the clickity-clack feedback from my keyboard, I might get used to it, but I doubt this will ever catch on. Maybe it should come with a piece of paper printed with a keyboard. :P
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Oh bother.
Perhaps the "click-boing" of a Model M could be played with every sucessful keystroke.
Not all that long ago, if you saw someone walking down the street, talking to someone who wasn't there, and typing on a keyboard that wasn't there, you'd wonder what institution he escaped from.
Now, it's just an alpha geek talking on his cell phone and checking his email (with a monitor embedded in his Oakley's no doubt).
Also, without seeing the keys, how would I know if it is the long-backspace button, or the shorter button (which I hate!)?
Also, there is a definate tactile feel to pressing the keys; you can *tell* when the button is depressed. This feature is difficult to replicate.
This would really cause problems with respect to picking up the "board" and quickly working on it. Believe it or not, sight *is* important.
This device will never get off the ground, for my money.
... we can sell the Invisible Robot (TM).
That is all.
Wouldn't this be really bad on the fingers, since there's nothing for them to "bounce" off after each keypress?
...picture this - you're sitting in the boardroom, your boss to your left side, and the prospective multi-million dollar client across the table from you, and you're taking notes on your palm pilot...
PECKING AWAY AT YOUR INVISIBLE KEYBOARD.
And you thought the Sega Activator made you look stupid.
What happens if someone throws a pencil through the keyboard's on/off zone?
Smells very strongly of Vapor.... No details, and bogus claims of "Artificial Intelligence".
We can't do AI on big-ass supercomputers, you expect me to believe these little wristpade have AI in them?
I'll believe it when I see a product on the shelf.
just like you can't tell whether someone's talking on a phone, or just to their own personal daemons in the street these days .... pretty soon on the bus you wont be able to tell whether they guy next to you is working .... or having a good time
Great... if you can FULLY touch-type. What about the other 99.995% of us that can't?
Sure, I can type 80wpm without looking at the keyboard... until I need to use some weird character that I don't use 400 times a day...
I guess you could roll out a printed keyboard to use if you had to... I can just see someone carring around a dirty napkin with a keyboard scrawled on it now... q:]
MadCow.
I used to have a sig, but I set it free and it never came back.
This story does have a Python foot somewhere right?
Did Homer Simpson invent this thing?
So I just type where the keys would be if there was an actual keyboard under my fingers? Say I don't really know the layout of keyboard very well... would I carry a thin piece of cardboard?
Is there a guitar module?
I am still lokking for that foot. Where's that confounded foot?
This
Sensors in the units measure the finger movements and artificial intelligence and a language processor determine appropriate keystrokes or mouse movements. What kind of AI? If I type in my bosses name on the virtual keyboard, will it display "Brain Damaged Lazy Bastard"?
It seems a little weird. I mean it could be great technology, but there's just a sense of comfort in pressing shift-/ to get the ?. I like to press the keys and feel that I've pressed correctly. That instantaneous feedback helps me type efficiently. Without that physical feedback I think it would much more difficult.
~ now you know
Another step better: Instead of something in the palm of your hand, use small transmitters glued to each of your fingernails, so you can quickly switch back and forth between typing and doing something else.
Friends and I have always thought something like this would be nifty---something like a virtual keyboard you could type in the air---although when I saw this announcement I wondered if it would actually be as practical from an HCI standpoint. After all, there's no real tactile feedback to tell you if you've hit the right "key," as far as I can tell. This sort of feedback is important, moreso than visual feedback (since unless you can't touchtype, you don't need to see the keyboard: try typing in the dark), especially to avert Repetitive Stress Injury.
On the other hand, just to test the concept, I tried "typing" on a flat surface, and it seemed fairly intuitive. This is probably better in this respace than an "air keyboard", since you at least feel the contact of the desk. (Assuming you can't type in the air with this product, although there doesn't seem to be a reason why not, they say "any flat surface".) Now what would be nifty is a roll-up guide you could "type" on to get both visual feedback and a soft touch. This would solve hunting and pecking problems, too. :-)
I'd really love to have one of these, since they seem to solve most portability problems, and since it seems you can tweak the virtual keyboard's size (layout, etc.), it'd make the ultimate evolution in keyboards. (No more need for a "flex" keyboard, just mold a surface...)
Nifty.
Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage
^I habr onw, it id v3ry cppl. I an usinf it right noq! Bit I an mot a veru good tyoist. :-)
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
Ok, I see a wee bit of a problem with this.
A virtual keyboard based on finger movement would have to rely on a software learning mechanism that tuned itself to your physical idiosyncracies. I mean, without a physical keyboard to hunt and peck on, the little finger of your left hand is going to move a different distance between the imaginary A and Q keys than your right index finger is going to move betwen the J and U keys. A sufficiently good learning mechanism would probably account for tuning itself to your hand movements continuously, so that your error rate would go down even as your typing patterns shifted over time. (Of course, this results in equipment with function profiles in software that make it unusable by anyone else.)
Or not.
More likely, you will be the part of the equation that conforms to the constraints of the software. You will have to learn how to be very consistent in your finger movements, without a physical keyboard to guide you. After a training period (just as you would do for voice recognition software), you would have to be quite consistent, even in different positions, desk heights, and times of day (tired or not). This screams "RSI" to me. Repetitive motion in a guided environment is one thing, but having to make precise repetitive motions in free air or against a flat object that provides no feedback would mightily increase the stress put on your fingers.
Thanks, but I already have a surgery scar on one wrist that makes people think I tried to off myself, I don't care to repeat the experience. I'll wait until the Senseboard software is well-reviewed and proven to be continuously adaptive. (Then I'll have an excuse for wearing funny gloves and dark glasses with a piece of wire hanging off them, while playing pocket pool on the bus: "Oh no, Miss, I have a proposal due this afternoon...")
Jon
I think not...(*poof*)
...of having a virtual keyboard for a Palm handheld computer, if you can't hold the keyboard while you're using it?
Another cute idea, but I can't see it taking off. Either the popular folding keyboards or some modified Graffiti-ish entry system like Fitaly seem to work much more "handily."
Well all of you complaining that you need the tactile feedback and the clicking noise generated by it.. well think about this.. its QUIET so that means you can use it during class ( if youre a student ) so you could have your palm and this and be able to take notes on your palm quietly and not bother anybody else ( granted you'll look a little silly and probably have a coupla more errors in your typing than usual ) but its a nice data input device that will be able to type anyplace.. Plane sound good? dont have enough room in your seat to type with a full sized keyboard so this will work quite nicely.. its also compact so its easy to lug around too..
So I dont think all this bitching is warranted, granted you're going to have to have a keyboard layout in your head to type accrately and get used to typing without visual cues.. and if this is all its supposed to be then it'll be a very cool and useful thing..
What if I need to grab a drink? What if I briefly wave my hands around? What if I scratch my head because I don't know what to type next?
I'm not sure that the language recognition and "artificial intelligence" they proclaim this thing has would make it comfortably usable, even for short periods of time. Too many little inconveniences, and things you'd have to stop doing while having a keyboard permanently attached to your hands.
Ceci n'est pas une sig
-dwd-
This is something I've been waiting for, for a long time.
;)), but maybe noise or visual feedback would be enough...
I've been thinking about ways to reduce the footprint of a laptop while retaining efficient input. One idea I had was similar to this -- when your hands approached the screen, an on-screen keyboard would appear that you could type on. You wouldn't have any touch feedback (electric shocks?
Those laser displays that project directly onto your retina would be cool too. Imagine this combined with a device that actually projected the keyboard (with live feedback) onto whatever surface you were using to type on...
If they had a nice durable webpad with either of these kinds of input, I'd be very happy!
Senseboard + MIDI = Real air guitar
In the voices of Bill and Ted: "Excellent".
When will Windows be ready for the desktop?
Are you an engineer too?
No, I'm a moron. Common mistake.
-some Dilbert comic strip on similar devices
"The Emperor's New Clothes"
by Hans Christian Andersen
"What a marvelous technological advance!"
"What an engineering coup de grace!"
Doesn't anyone see what these Senseboard Technologies AB guys are doing to us?
Duh!
;-P
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
The mind boggles!
Edith Keeler Must Die
If you want to re-define your keyboard to be basketball shaped, have at it. There is some potential for great ergonomic improvements here.
Also, think of the potential for virtual instruments, art, the possibilities are endless.
Given all this, I hope they leave the interface open, so everyone can contribute.
- Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero.
This might be really cool for portable applications. Imagine how much thinner a laptop could be if there didn't need to be a keyboard. (Or a mouse for that matter--let's say they put a piece of plastic that doesn't get dirty against the display, and make that into a touch-screen. People like me would rarely use that anyway (mice suck, IMO).) Then get rid of the keyboard, making the laptop about 1/4 to 1/2 inches thinner. That would be totally awesome. Hey, why not get rid of the power button and put something like what the Apple Cube or whatever it was called--there was no button, just a place where you touch the case and the computer would turn on or off. There was even a light that gets brighter when your finger comes close to the thing. Maybe the "buttons" could be silk-screened onto a flat surface on the computer and all have lights behind them that get brighter as your finger gets closer. That would be like something out of Star Trek. And there would be far less mechanical components in the laptop, making it last longer. Hey, why not get rid of the mechanical hard drive and put a solid-state drive in there. Currently, such a drive will read at extremely high speeds (much faster than any mechanical drive) and write at speeds about as fast as a mechanical drive. (I read that in two or three months' ago Circuit Cellar, I think.) Each "page" on these drives wears out after 10,000 to 1 million writes, but normal hard drives wear out after a while too. The rule is the same: back up your data. Besides, some of the better drives out there will automatically distribute the write load around on the drive so that it will last longer and stuff. Well, back to the keyboard thing. Oh, I was talking about removing mechanical components. Imagine if you could take almost all mechanical components out of the laptop. (The only things I can think of that need to remain mechanical are the CD-ROM and floppy drives. And the speakers, perhaps, I guess those are mechanical.) So you'd end up with an ultra-quiet, ultra-light (and ultra-futuristic-cool) laptop that will probably last longer than what is currently used today. Oh well.
I saw the virtual keyboard on the comdex floor. It sounds like a great concept, but did not appear to function with a high degree of speed and accuracy. THe basic concept is interesting -- using neural networks to correlate the electrical signals from muscle movements with corresponding strokes on a keyboard, but more work needs to be done on the algorithms. The 2-man team behind the board is hoping to develop a product by march that could be used by anyone without training. But in the demo, only one person on the development team was able to use the keyboard, which seems to indicate that it will be more difficult to create a system that will work for a large population of users without training. That said it is an interesting concept that needs more work, and will probably require each user to train the keyboard for their movements, much like people do with continuous speech recognition programs today.
Ok, I am not a touch typist, but I'll give this a shot.
[plugs in virtual keyboard]
Qokw. rthsi isd xc00; IK KUV SD'Adeh@ jooiw kne,l klweok; osoi j ihkwe isdkl oidkl asjn trhs>? Nnkle.
Hmm. doesn't work too well. I'll go back to my old way.
[loads up speech recognition program]
Their, that setter. Eye ill just stack with speech recognition. It's just work batter. New paragraph. New paragraph. NEW PARAGRAPH!
I hate technology.
SIGFEH
I'm sure that everyone who reads /. knows someone who has or has had carpal tunnel syndrome. With this, you could literally type with your hands anywhere, so it should be relatively easy to find an ergonomic position.
In fact, couple this new input method with a dvorak keyboard, and you'd be rocking. They could even throw in a few additional chordal "sequences" to really get some additional functionality out of it. This is some neat stuff from a user-input side. Free your mind, folks!
Where the wind blows, the tumbleweed goes.
www.handykey.com
cheaper, better, easier, has mouse too.
Oh and two important things....
No drivers required(makes it 100% linux compatable)
and isn't vaporware.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Isn't this an obvious hoax.
There is no way the image shown can tell when I press a key, or indeed where my fingers are with any degree of accuracy.
I spent two years playing with human-computer interfaces and quickly came to the conclusion that short of something physical to 'press' then users wouldn't know where keys where, and sensors (particularly placed where the 'knucklebands' shows are) wouldn't know with any degree of accuracy where my fingers were.
The lack of an AVI or any kind of press review just adds to my scepticism.
*r
--- My dad's political betting
Reading through at +3, I see that most of the respondents have a pretty negative attitude towards this device. If it's real, then, wow...I mean, this is the sort of thing that webpads and the like need. Sure, a stylus is nice for most things, but if you need to write more than a little bit, you need a keyboard.
:)
What's more, I think, is that one of the big size-limiting factors of making laptops much smaller than they are is the need for a keyboard. Imagine if you had a webpad style laptop that had a built-in mechanism for propping it up, and you'd just strap on the virtual keyboard doohickeys and away you'd go. By losing the keyboard, laptops could be almost half the size and a little bit lighter (admittedly, laptop keyboards don't weigh much, if you've ever taken a laptop apart, the keyboard weighs just a few ounces).
Also, I'd like to point out that when stuff like the "Smart Dust" project gets posted, people rave about how this would make for a great virtual keyboard, but when this shows up, most of the responses are along the lines of "well, even if it is real, it would suck." What the heck?
Furthermore, to all those people complaining about how they can't touch type and therefore it would be useless: maybe you should take a proper typing class or get a copy of tuxtype or mavis beacon or something. Touch typing is a valuable skill. At the very least it'll improve your ability to use vi/emacs/whatever.
After a bit of searching, I found it-- the exact concept exists in _Einstein's Bridge_, by John Cramer-- came out in 1997.
Here's the bit that discusses the idea:
Thought it was a facinating idea when I first read it-- seems fairly useless without the "magic glasses"...
This subject touches on something that I saw at a local restaurant the other night. As my wife and I sat and ate the wait station was just behind us. Hanging on the wall at about average human eye height were two touch screens. One touch screen managed clock in and the other tables and orders (from what I could see). Throughout the course of the evening we saw waiters and waitresses wander by the station (had a prominent SQUIRREL logo on the display) and interact with the touch sensitive screens. The interesting part to see is how adept they were at navigating with either a pencil or their finger.
Personally I own and have used an ePods webpad for about a year now. It's not the top of technology and so the screens can be a little slow and response to commands lags. The one thing I have found though is that repetitive tasks are a breeze because I know exactly where the button is going to be before it shows up on the screen. This allows me to quickly touch through a series of commands without really needing to wait on the display to refresh. I thought that it would be skill only a tech head would pick up on. I was wrong.
Watching the wait staff that night I noticed about 6 of them, some taller and some shorter than the average height the screen was set to, breeze through screens just like I did. One very impressive girl spoke to another waiter while punching in her information. Most transactions were done and the wait staffer had walked away before the screens could go all the way through. That night I only saw one guy fumble on the screen and have to back step to hit the correct button.
My point is that there are all of these people here on the site bemoaning the fact that they learned to type by touch, and how do I remember where the special keys are, and what happens if I scratch my ass, and all of the other bullshit scenarios for why this tech will not work. I say it will work, I've seen similar things working already, I've used something similar myself. I also say it won't be the ULTIMATE solution. Just like QWERTY isn't to everyones taste and some people still have this bad habbit of liking Windows. Voice recognition is great but it's obtrusive in a meeting and non-functional in loud environments, Graffiti makes you relearn writing (shouldn't have to do), gestures are great but limited in use, and mind reading is still a ways away. So there are going to be times when voice is usable, and handwriting recognition is a good option, and times when a "virtual keyboard" is going to be much more than adequate.
Without the pioneering consumer the pioneering product will never be
"Do not be swept up in the momentum of mediocrity." - anon
Nothing new. A long time ago, I was standing in line at a supermarket, discussing the end game of Adventure with a friend. I forget the details, something about a bomb and an oyster. Got some interesting looks. Nowadays, of course, people would have known we were talking about a computer game, even if they didn't know which one. But back then... Got some weird looks.
it would be a good idea for it to have a learning ability (like voice rec software). you put them on and hook them up the the computer, then type on your regular keyboard for a few days and let the little guys figure things out.
I dunno about you, but I haven't lost much by betting that technology development ventures are usually lazy, sloppy, and cheap. Experience reinforces that view on a very regular basis. MAYBE they thought up something revolutionary, and I'd love to see it if they did. But it would be foolish to assume that this virtual keyboard (or any other whiz-bang doodad) is revolutionary.
Analyzing electrical impulses in my hand muscles? Riiight. Do you have any clue about the variability that would be involved in producing usable positional data and predicting intended movement? Would it work if I was sweaty? Agitated? Please. It'd be far easier to go with mechanical position measurement, and do the rest in software. Without knowing more about the device, the simplest answer would be a good bet. (Thank you, Occam.) As I said before, if they've done a good job of writing continually-adaptive algorithms, then I might be interested. But I won't hold my breath.
Jon
I think not...(*poof*)
>I spent two years playing with human-computer interfaces
I didn't and I still thought this was an obvious hoax. I mean, let's be honest here. There's a photo of a guy with wrist straps and a fifty-word blurb indicating that the straps perform some sort of magic.
What makes me sad is that the best score is 2 of anyone calling this a hoax. That leads me to believe that in the 12 hours since the original posting, not a single mod point was devoted to the TRUTH.
Go slashdot! Liberate me from marketroid tyranny!
Sheesh...this is one of the coolest input devices to appear in a LONG time. Look at what's on your desk right now: CRT, windowing GUI, keyboard, mouse, all tied together by a spaghetti of cables...practically unchanged for the last FOURTY YEARS! Awwww, you'll lack a little tactile feedback - wah. This is just a half-step forward (still a durn QWERTY keyboard) and you so-called "computer geeks" are whiny and fearful of the change. HMDs, datagloves, speech I/O, and other forward-moving tech, all merely niche fringe devices (only the PDA has moved us foward) lost to people glued to their CRTs. How disappointing...
Gimmie one of these nifty units ASAP! When's it out? Price? Need beta testers?
Let's move technology FORWARD, and not just refine nearly antique technologies!
Can we get a "-1 Wrong" moderation option?
Great idea, but unless you're aiming for the ruggedized computer market, there's no incentive to make a laptop with a lifetime greater than the time it will take for the model to become obsolescent. Which, for a PC, seems to be only two or three years, depending on your application of it.
I can see the fnords!
First Look: Senseboard Virtual Keyboard
-Kraft
Live and let live