World Solar Challenge Beginning

Stuart Bowden writes: "Today (Sunday at 8:00am Central Australian time) is the start of the 2001 World solar Challenge, a sort of alternative Cannonball Run in which the solar cars cost up to $10 million. Over the next five days or so thirty three solar powered cars will race 3000km across the Australia desert powered only by sunlight. The official site is at WSC and there is extra gossip, pictures and information at our site at the University of NSW. We'll be doing the web upgrades on the road by begging connections at roadside diners and the occasional satellite phone. The big problem is keeping up with solar cars that don't stop for fuel." Our previous story had more links.

Comments

Interesting.

[Anonymous Coward]

I love solar power! :)

World Solar Challenge Beginning????

[Anonymous Coward]

World Solar Challenge Beginning
[ Technology ]Posted by michael on 19:10 Saturday 17 November 2001

But it's night time!!!

Re:World Solar Challenge Beginning????

[zCyl]

But it's night time!!!

Not in Australia, mate.

Re:World Solar Challenge Beginning????

[Anonymous Coward]

Thank you Mr. Z-stating-the-bloody-obvious-Cyl

Hmm..

[glenkim]

How does a gasoline powered car do against these solar powered cars in a 3000km race? In my opinion, this is more like a marathon than a race.

Re:Hmm..

[Anonymous Coward]

A marathon kinda is a race isn't it?

Re:Hmm..

[Anonymous Coward]

No, it's a kind of chocolate bar.

Hmm..wouldn't that melt in the outback?

Re:Hmm..

[Man of E]

A gasoline powered car would run out of fuel :-)

Re:fp; Re:The first rule of /.

[hyyx]

We do not talk about Tyler DurdEn...

Disappointing.

[VA Software]

The World Solar Challenge is a race to motivate research and development into harnessing solar energy

I haven't looked at all the teams yet, but so far they seem to be aiming to improve performance by improving aerodynamics and reducing weight, not by improving the efficiency of the electricity generation.

One exception is the aurora team, but I can't find any technical details of the improvements they're claiming.

Re:Disappointing.

[Joe Decker]

On this page, they indicate that they purchased 20-22% efficient "space-grade" GaAs cells from an existing supplier, so it sounds like they aren't doing their own geenration improvements, simply purchasing existing known improvements. (Fine by me, just explaining how I read this.)

--j

Re:Disappointing.

[KingPrad]

The electrical systems of the car are commercial products and any possible tweaking would provide little or no benefit in performance.

Race speeds of the top cars are above 50 MPH. At speeds up to 45 MPH air drag increases on a linear scale. Above 45 MPH air drag increases geometrically and quickly becomes the main factor in car performance. Teams rebuild their car body if they find a way to shave a few tenths off the drag coefficient.

The new body on University of Missouri - Rolla's Solar Miner III (rebuilt after the sunRayce last summer) has a drag coefficient of about .09 compared to the previous body's stat of .12. As such, we should get an average speed of several miles per hour faster.

Other major factors are vehicle weight (obviously), battery type, and solar array type. Lithium ion batteries have much higher retention than older lead-acid batteries that some teams still use and are lighter as well.

The solar array varies from car to car depending on team budget. Teams with huge budgets have higher efficiency arrays and much more available power. More power does not translate into better performance, though, because over the long haul a more efficient body design with less parasitic power loss will perform much better even with less power.

KingPrad

Re:Disappointing.

[Anonymous Coward]

The team of my university (Delft, Netherlands) does use the triple junction solar cels. That should be the best there is, its still untested in space! Thanx to the European Space Agency and a very generous sponsor [~1M$] they finally could afford this. They even have a few square centimeters of cells that actually flew on Hubble! In addition to this they use Maximum Power Trackers that always load the cells and the battery at the optimum settings.

It seams to pay off: they currently lead the race!

Check it out at here [www.alpha-centauri.nl]

Re:Disappointing.

[dragonfly28]

I work at a chemistry department at the subject of photo-active molecule. Hence I have some background in converting solar energy to electricity. It is very difficult to get a higher effiency for the power-conversion (think max is like 30% at this moment) at a reasonable price. The currently used solar-cells are already mighty expensive

So in increasing overall effiency should be focussed on lighter and more aerodynamic materials rather than on higher photo-conversion yield systems.

There are some promessing molecule which can do a better job in light harvesting but these are still in experimental stages.
The main focuss point in these systems is to transfer to energy for the cell to the 'motor'.
for more info check to website of the chemistry department at the university lausanne-swiss.

Re:Disappointing.

[Anonymous Coward]

a famous game quote came to mind when I read your post:

"Information, the first principle of warfare, must form the foundation of all your efforts. Know, of course, thine enemy. But in knowing him do not forget above all to know thyself. The commander who embraces this totality of battle shall win even with the inferior force.

-Spartan Battle Manual"

Ah the solar challange.

[hool5400]

I live on the route, and if my calculations are correct they'de be caning (if 50-100km/h is considered caning) past me a couple of hundred meters away. It's such a bastard thing to be lazy. Maybe I take the coolness of it all for granted.

But alas, i've seen it all before, and in two years time, i'll see it all again...

Re:Ah the solar challange.

[hool5400]

Furthermore, I did tune the scanner in to pick up their communications. Alas the only ones I pick up is in Japanese, and i haven't spoken that for many lives.

Why the interest in Solar?

[LibertarianCrackSmok]

Why is everyone so interested in Solar power? Solar power is not gonna be the alternative fuel of the future, it just doesn't make enough power for pratical use. Fuel Cells and Hydrogen is the way to go. Go here for more info on fuel cells

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[Man of E]

Competitions of the same type in fuel cells would be difficult to do because (a) fuel cells require tons of research and (b) they're prohivitively expensive. Also, people can basically design their own solar arrays for this type of race, which makes it pretty fun, and it would be hard to find an analogue for fuel cells. So it's not that everyone is interested just in Solar - in fact, lots of people are working on fuel cells as well. Right now, neither solar cells or fuel cells are really usable for full-scale practical use, but wait a few years and some organization will likely humor you with a fuel cell race.

Of course, by that time you'll likely have read an article on portable nuclear power on Sciam earlier that day and wonder why everybody is so interested in fuel cells, when nuclear is clearly the way to go...

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[KingPrad]

Because after the initial investment the power is free and the equipment will work for 20 years. In countries like Morocco with 300 days of sun per year solar power makes a lot of sense. It doesn't have to do a lot, either: run a few light bulbs, a tv, an appliance or two.

Solar power isn't going to drive your car, but it will certainly power basic home services in many parts of the world.

KingPrad

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[Ainis]

Why is everyone so interested in Solar power? Solar power is not gonna be the alternative fuel of the future, it just doesn't make enough power for pratical use. Fuel Cells and Hydrogen is the way to go.

Yeah, right. Who needs wind turbines, lead acid batteries are the way to go :-)

You can't compare solar power with fuel cells. Fuel cells are great for storing and transporting power. They actually do not produce power, because it's powered by hydrogen, which has to be produced in the first place using some other power source like nuclear plant, solar cells, wind turbines, thermonuclear reactors etc. And there aren't enough natural sources of hydrogen.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[MobileC]

And racing solar cars would be totally out of the question.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[nomadic]

Probably not for transportation, but I can definitely see solar power being good fuel for certain things.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[imrdkl]

The question is not "why?", but rather "where?". Clearly, places that dont have alot of cars dont need alot of alternative fuel. Solar technology still has a ways to go, unless you want hot water, but at least some of the contestants in this race do attempt to improve the cell effeciency, I guess.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[mls]

Exactly....

The interaction of the Hydrogen and Oxygen that creates the power of the fuel cell would be irrellevant if not for a source of pure hydrogen.

Until you find yourself a free source of pure hydrogen (good luck, I doubt one exists on this planet), you are going to be stuck splitting Hydrogen from water. More or less the converse of the same reaction that creates power in the fuel cell. Which, those that understand elementary physics would know, even if the process were super-efficient, you would need as much energy as is produced from the fuel cell, to split out the hydrogen in the first place. In reality, you would need more.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[Anonymous Coward]

So use solar power to generate electricity to electrolyse sea water. You don't even need to use semiconductor solar cells - you can make a "solar chimney" - coat the desert in a plastic sheet, stick a chimney in the middle - convection currents form as the sun rises, turning a turbine in the chimney. Works fine, invented in the 80s. Every attempt to build them on an industrial scale either gets blocked by the oil companies, or environmentalists worried about screwing up the desert ecosystem.

Re:Why the interest in Solar?

[Tassach]

Yeah, fuel cells are great, but where do you get the hydrogen? And once you get it, how do you distribute it? We currently don't have a really safe and efficient way to manufacture, store, and distribute free hydrogen in mass quantities.

Using electrolisys of water to generate hydrogen is prohibitavely expensive -- how do you generate the electricty? Most current commercially-available fuel cells use a pre-processor to electochemically strip hydrogen from hydrocarbons. This is good because it is much more efficient than a traditional IC engine driving a generator, however it still has many of the same drawbacks -- it relies on a non-renewable resource and it emits greenhouse gasses (C02).

IMHO the most practical short-term approach is to improve the techniques for generating methane from biomass. In order for this to work on a commercial basis, the cost of producing biomass-generated methane would need to be close to the price of tapping fossil methane sources. However, any commercial biomass technique is amost definately going to require the use of genetically-engineered microorganisms, which raises a bunch of other issues.

Making Solar Cells a misallocation of resources.

[agotterba]

I've learned a lot about solar cells with the team at my school, including why development of new cells can be a poor investment of resources.

Solar cells have a theoretical maximum efficency of not more than 50%. Currently, triple junction GaAs cells will get you about 35% (pretty close to the limit). Such an array for a solar car (5m by 1.8 m) can cost in the neighborhood of 500,000 USD. Meanwhile, a 19% Si array can be had for 70,000, and a 13 - 14% array for 10,000. As you can see, the price of an array has something of an exponential relationship to the efficency. To inprove the maximum efficency, you have to have the money to play with some very expensive toys. Only a few companies can afford such equipment (such as Honda and Aurora) and no school that I know of has a suffcient budget. We can (and do) play with making cells, but to commit to designing them and trying various chemistries and encapsulations requires more money than we have. Our object is to make cells that at a given efficency are cheaper than the ones on the market.

Meanwhile, the only things that slow you down are rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag. Cutting weight usually requires nothing more than a lot of thought into material selection and structural design (not hundreds of thousands of dollars).

Aero is a little more interesting, as there are tradeoffs betweeen the effective efficency of your array and your aerdynamic drag (for example, a taller car can catch more sun in the mornings and evenings, but will have more drag). These tradeoffs are related to how fast you want to go, and the conditions of the specific race you are designing for (whether it is primarily from north to south or east to west effects how you handle these tradeoffs; a car sloped to a particular side doesn't help if that side never faces the sun).

Also worth mentioning is that all the American college teams that I know are in the WSC just came off competing in the American Solar Challenge. Teams that did not have large budgets in that race competed in stock class, where they were only allowed to spend $10 per watt that they expected out of their array (limiting them to silicon cells) and lead acid batteries. I do not know if any of those teams went to WSC, but that would explain their use of lower power cells.

Photovoltaic cell research is one of the mose exciting fields of renewable energy, but when it comes to racing cars, you're more likly to win by buying the best array you can afford, and improving the other aspects of your car.

Solar vehicles... what they really are

[mupi]

Solar vehicles are essentially electric vehicles but they draw their power from the sun's energy. The cars are typically two meters wide by six meters long and sit very low to the ground. They take on the usual, aerodynamic shapes of either a teardrop or a penis and their average weight is only 600 lbs (without battery). The array, which consists of hundreds of solar cells and beer cans, takes up most of the car's top surface. All of the sun's energy is gathered by the solar array, which can be removed from the car for recharging and during masterbation. To propel the car, the sun's energy is converted into an electric current, through silicon erectile functions, which charges the battery, powering the motor. The solar cells collect enough energy to power a 2 to 10-hp electric dildo. Because the amounts of power are quite small, energy efficiency and rubbing frequency is crucial. Although, on a sunny day, solar vehicles can average speeds of 70-75 km/hr for distances of 200-300 kms and can heat certain sensitive body parts to 100 degrees.

Re:Solar vehicles... what they really are

[jayant_techguy]

One thing you missed on on was they are pretty expensive.
Hey, imagine the critical fusion of hydrogen is attained at low cost and that is used to power a car then it will be capacle of moving the car speed of light, not to forget power it will give to all fields of life.

Just a tad expensive

[xenocide2]

My roommate is President of the Solar Car team at Kansas State University. His team recently finished 5th overall at the 2k1 American Solar Challenge. Since he's president I get to hear all about these things. Very few actual solar panel manufacturers enter, but rather sponsor universities. Sponsorship is why the University of Michigan, near the auto industry capital of the USA, is taking their car, and why we cant afford to ship ours over there.

As far as the actual electricity generation goes, I'd think its a bit beyond the capabilities of a group of freshman and sophmore (my roommate is a sophmore) undergrads to not only design a better grade solar array, but then manufacture it. Even if some kid did manage it, they couldn't afford the costs. I believe the cost of the current solar array is some 25k, which generates about 14 hp. That gets them up to about 75 mph max, but that eats of the batteries pretty fast.

Most solar cars don't use the latest and most efficient solar array. If I recall correctly, the latest car from KSU, CATalyst, uses 14 percent efficienct solar panels. The most efficient are gallium-cyanide (or something like that) that are extremely expensive (like 500k or so). Of course there are a few things that can be done besides simply upgrading the solar array. I've heard of shaping the solar cells in inverted pyramids at the near molecular level will increase absorbtion, but the return is expected to be on the order of .1~1 percent. In contrast, redesigning the body of the car gave us about 35 percent less drag. In addition, the concept of "regenerative braking," using the kinetic energy of the car to run the engine in reverse and charge the batteries, greatly increases overall effiency. Essentially, research into solar panel mechanisms requires extensive knowledge in both electrical engineering and mechanical engineering, which few people have, and of those who DO have that exp, few of them would put up with a university salary.

Yea, I can't spell efficiency, but who cares, I'm only a Computer Science major.

Re:Just a tad expensive

[VA Software]

Yes, I wasn't really expecting huge technological leaps from the teams that weren't solar cell manufactures ... it just that for an event whose aim is to promote solar power, I did expect some discussion of the advances since last time somewhere. Your pyramid thing, for example; if it works, doesn't increase cost and doesn't decrease yield - if this year's car got 15% instead of 14% that might make a difference.

Re:Just a tad expensive

[xenocide2]

The thing is, my understanding of it is that it does increase cost, because its a chemical treatment. And you could also think of it in oppertunity costs. Solar car has like 10 team members in all, not very many. With so few people you have to work on the more effective parts first.

Re:Just a tad expensive

[jjsjeff]

I guess I could verify some of this and add to it since I am the electrical team leader for Kansas State Univ.

As far as the solar array price of $25K goes....well that's close but I think we did better on price than that. We probably had the best price to perfomance ratio on American Solar Challenge this summer (as far as the array goes). You might be wondering how we keep the cost so low, but still produce an array that makes a lot of power. We encapsulate our own cells. As far as the 14hp number that is equivalent to 10444 WATTS! Sorry to dissapoint all you people out there, but it is not that high. Our array makes somewhere between 100 Watts and 2500 Watts, but that's all I can say. :)

No one really ever tells you the exact number the solar array makes anyway because it depends on the day, time, and whether or not you are on a rival team.

On a personal note: Michigan and Rolla kick some Aussie butt!

-Jeff

Re:Just a tad expensive

[JBowz15]

Does anyone have any idea why the University of Arizona's solar car, winner of the American Solar Challenge's stock class, is not entered in the Australian race?

Re:Just a tad expensive

[jjsjeff]

They couldn't afford it. Just like we couldn't afford it.

The paradox of solar-powered cars

[vlad_petric]

In order to be acceptable from a consumer's point of view, such a car would have to have batteries ... Even in a desert you still wouldn't want to be limited to day-only driving.

Batteries on the other hand are very heavy. They account for more than 50% of the weight of a regular electric car. The energy required to move the batteries makes such a solar-powered car infeasible.

As mentioned in another post, most of the teams only improved on aerodynamics & weight. So, I'm asking: what's the point of this competition ?

The Raven.

Re:The paradox of solar-powered cars

[xenocide2]

Just so you know, the solar cars all have batteries. Charge 'em up before ya race, and during the race you can put excess energy in the cells, in addition to the energy from braking.

Why not a competition?

[KingPrad]

The point of the competition is not the solar power aspect, but the engineering of the project as a whole, the balancing cost and performance. It gives college students hands-on experience building and designing, gives companies and universities media exposure, and is fun.

Learning and fun have always been the reasons for any competition. What did you expect was the reason?

KingPrad

star wars episode v: the empire strikes back

[Anonymous Coward]

STAR WARS

Episode V

THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK

Script adaptation by Lawrence Kasdan and Leigh Brackett from a story by George Lucas

LUCASFILM LTD.

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far, away...

It is a dark time for the Rebellion. Although the Death Star has been destroyed, Imperial troops have driven the Rebel forces from their hidden base and pursued them across the galaxy. Evading the dreaded Imperial Starfleet, a group of freedom fighters led by Luke Skywalker has established a new secret base on the remote ice world of Hoth. The evil lord Darth Vader, obsessed with finding young Skywalker, has dispatched thousands of remote probes into the far reaches of space...

EXTERIOR: GALAXY -- PLANET HOTH

A Star Destroyer moves through space, releasing Imperial probe robots from its underside. One of these probes zooms toward the planet Hoth and lands on its ice-covered surface. An explosion marks the point of impact.

EXTERIOR: HOTH -- METEORITE CRATER -- SNOW PLAIN -- DAY

A weird mechanical sound rises above the whining of the wind. A strange probe robot, with several extended sensors, emerges from the smoke-shrouded crater. The ominous mechanical probe floats across the snow plain and disappears into the distance.

EXTERIOR: PLAIN OF HOTH -- DAY

A small figure gallops across the windswept ice slope. The bundled rider is mounted on a large gray snow lizard, a Tauntaun. Curving plumes of snow rise from beneath the speeding paws of the two-legged beast. The rider gallops up a slope and reins his lizard to a stop. Pulling off his protective goggles, Luke Skywalker notices something in the sky. He takes a pair of electrobinoculars from his utility belt and through them sees smoke rising from where the probe robot has crashed. The wind whips at Luke's fur-lined cap and he activates a comlink transmitter. His Tauntaun shifts and moans nervously beneath him.

LUKE: (into comlink) Echo Three to Echo Seven. Han, old buddy, do you read me? After a little static a familiar voice is heard.

HAN: (over comlink) Loud and clear, kid. What's up?

LUKE: (into comlink) Well, I finished my circle. I don't pick up any life readings.

HAN: (over comlink) There isn't enough life on this ice cube to fill a space cruiser. The sensors are placed. I'm going back.

LUKE: (into comlink) Right. I'll see you shortly. There's a meteorite that hit the ground near here. I want to check it out. It won't take long.

Luke clicks off his transmitter and reins back on his nervous lizard. He pats the beast on the head to calm it.

LUKE: Hey, steady girl. What's the matter? You smell something?

Luke takes a small device from his belt and starts to adjust it when suddenly a large shadow falls over him from behind. He hears a monstrous howl and turns to see an eleven- foot-tall shape towering over him. It is a Wampa Ice Creature, lunging at him ferociously.

LUKE: Aaargh!

Luke grabs for his pistol, but is hit flat in the face by a huge white claw. He falls unconscious into the snow and in a moment the terrified screams of the Tauntaun are cut short by the horrible snap of a neck being broken. The Wampa Ice Creature grabs Luke by one ankle and drags him away across the frozen plain.

EXTERIOR: HOTH -- REBEL BASE ENTRANCE -- DAY

A stalwart figure rides his Tauntaun up to the entrance of an enormous ice cave.

INTERIOR: HOTH -- REBEL BASE -- MAIN HANGAR DECK

Rebel troopers rush about unloading supplies and otherwise securing their new base. The rider, Han Solo, swings off his lizard and pulls off his goggles. He walks into the main hangar deck toward the Millennium Falcon, which is parked among several fighters. Mechanics, R2 units, and various other droids hurry about. Han stops at the Millennium Falcon where his Wookiee copilot, Chewbacca, is welding on a central lifter. Chewie stops his work and lifts his face shield, growling an irritated greeting to his boss.

HAN: Chewie!

The Wookiee grumbles a reply.

HAN: All right, don't lose your temper. I'll come right back and give you a hand.

Chewbacca puts his mask back on and returns to his welding as Han leaves.

INTERIOR: HOTH -- REBEL BASE -- COMMAND CENTER

A makeshift command center has been set up in a blasted area of thick ice. The low-ceilinged room is a beehive of activity. Controllers, troops, and droids move about setting up electronic equipment and monitoring radar signals. General Rieekan straightens up from a console at Han's approach.

RIEEKAN: Solo?

HAN: No sign of life out there, General. The sensors are in place. You'll know if anything comes around.

RIEEKAN: Commander Skywalker reported in yet?

HAN: No. He's checking out a meteorite that hit near him.

RIEEKAN: (indicates radar screen) With all the meteor activity in this system, it's going to be difficult to spot approaching ships.

Taking a deep breath, Han blurts out what is on his mind.

HAN: General, I've got to leave. I can't stay anymore.

Princess Leia, standing at a console nearby, is dressed in a short white combat jacket and pants. Her hair is braided across her head in a Nordic fashion. She overhears their conversation and seems somewhat distressed.

RIEEKAN: I'm sorry to hear that.

HAN: Well, there's a price on my head. If I don't pay off Jabba the Hut, I'm a dead man.

RIEEKAN: A death mark's not an easy thing to live with. You're a good fighter, Solo. I hate to lose you.

HAN: Thank you, General.

He turns to Leia as Rieekan moves away.

HAN: (with feeling) Well, Your Highness, I guess this is it.

LEIA: That's right.

Leia is angry. Han sees she has no warmth to offer him. He shakes his head and adopts a sarcastic tone.

HAN: (cooly) Well, don't get all mushy on me. So long, Princess.

Han walks away into the quiet corridor adjoining the command center. Leia stews a moment, then hurries after him.

INTERIOR: HOTH -- REBEL BASE -- ICE CORRIDOR

LEIA: Han!

Han stops in the corridor and turns to face Leia.

HAN: Yes, Your Highnessness?

LEIA: I thought you decided to stay.

HAN: Well, the bounty hunter we ran into on Ord Mantell changed my mind.

LEIA: Han, we need you!

HAN: We?

LEIA: Yes.

HAN: Oh, what about you need?

LEIA: (mystified) I need? I don't know what you're talking about.

HAN: (shakes his head, fed up) You probably don't.

LEIA: And what precisely am I supposed to know?

HAN: Come on! You want me to stay because of the way you feel about me.

LEIA: Yes. You're a great help to us. You're a natural leader...

HAN: No! That's not it. Come on. Aahhh -- uh huh! Come on.

Leia stares at him, understanding, then laughs.

LEIA: You're imagining things.

HAN: Am I? Then why are you following me? Afraid I was going to leave without giving you a goodbye kiss?

LEIA: I'd just as soon kiss a Wookiee.

HAN: I can arrange that. You could use a good kiss!

Angrily, Han strides down the corridor as Leia stares after him.

solar engineering, a balancing act

[darkweb]

first, a shameful, kowtowing plug: http://solar42.umr.edu

solar car design and raycing is (for us uni and high-school persons)is primarily an endevor of engineering. you can't always splurge on the 34% efficient space-grade cells. sometimes you have to determine that you don't have the money, and you'd rather have a decent car overall than a boffo solar array on a wooden crate. if an engineer works hard enough at it, and has the right insight at the right time, many good things can happen...independent of the almighty buck. at UMR we have pretty good funding (how much is for me to know, not you all ;) ), but when we design a car, we know that there are teams out there that have 3 times the funding that we do. So, rather than sacrifice our budget for the nifty "one-item" improvements, we spread costs out to balance improvements. I would say that batteries, solar cells, and the motor are the three big ticket items in a solar car. sacrificing the quality of the motor and battieries that you can purchase for a really high efficiency solar array is bad engineering. in this way, solar raycing is kind of like taoism, everything must be in balance

go with LI+

[darkweb]

Lithium ion technology is something that is still fairly new to consumer products, but it has been around in the "experimental implementation" field for a long while.
the UMR Solar Miner III seen here can do close to 600 miles on a 68Kg LI+ battery pack, whereas a traditional lead-acid battery pack that would give us the same milage would be more than twice the weight

Engineering challenge

[DaoudaW]

Bunches of comments are being posted regarding gasoline engines are faster, fuel cell are the future, solar is impractical, etc. Totally correct. Totally off-topic.

These vehicles are not cars in any conventional sense of the word. They are an engineering challenge to see who can best balance weight, aerodynamics, PV efficiency and energy storage. They have to make strategic decisions. Last year the University of Missouri - Rolla team actually benefited from cloudy weather because they had a package that ran further on stored energy than the other cars. This actually slowed them down a bit compared to the other cars when it was sunny.

I think its great to get a bunch of engineering students together in a friendly competition.

Re:Engineering challenge

[danjerdanjel]

Actually (as I've pointed out before), the technology that is being used in these cars is being transferred into the mainstream. Things like Wheel Motors of efficiency ~96%, among other things, are making moden cars a lot more efficient.

i hearby...

[Anonymous Coward]

...claim this story in the name of troolls.

number of -1 posts: 45
number of all other posts combined: 31

w00t

Because solar energy is free

[burbilog]

and you will never have to refill it.

Modern solar cars used in such races can cruise at 90+ mph, max 130+ mph. Whoa. It's waaay more than enough for me! Give me sufficient night range (supercapacitors or whatever... 80-100 km on batteries will be enough... <rant>yep, 640k RAM IS enough if you do not use GUI crap</rant>) and such car will become my favorite transport.

The main trouble is NOT the price of manufacturing such car. Mass production will bring the price down. But even if someone invents perpetuum mobile and bulds a car running for free, western public will never buy it unless it has air conditioning, xenon headlights, cup holders, dvd player and all these tech gizmos for $20k -- and solar car can't have ANY of these because its power and weight is very, very limited.

What about the Drivers?

[evilviper]

The big problem is keeping up with solar cars that don't stop for fuel.

Well it shouldn't be that hard. In most situations, the fuel outlasts the drivers.

They can not be used for regular transport.

[spike hay]

A few problems with using solar cars for regular transport: 1. Solar Cars are expen$ive. You would have to shell out a couple hundred thousand dollars for a solar car. 2. They are not safe. Solar cars need to be so light that they would be way to weak to survive a crash. 3. They would be uncomfortable to drive. Most solar cars adopt a low profile for better aerodynamics. This makes it so the driver has to lie down. Also, it would only be a 1 seater. Solar cars are fun toys for universities, but they cannot provide regular transport. You could not design a solar car that would meet current safety restrictions.To meet current restrictions, it would have to have things like metal crumple zones. The solar panels needed to power something that heavy would be too large. With all of this, the clear answer for future automobiles is either hybrid gas/electric, or hydrogen fuel cells powered by hydrogen from clean nuclear power plants.

The Real challenge ...

[Tim12s]

... is if they race 3000km across the UK.

Today, yes. Tomorrow...

[burbilog]

A few problems with using solar cars for regular transport: 1. Solar Cars are expen$ive. You would have to shell out a couple hundred thousand dollars for a solar car.

Mass production will bring costs down.

3. They would be uncomfortable to drive. Most solar cars adopt a low profile for better aerodynamics. This makes it so the driver has to lie down.

Who knows? May be it's best position for the driver? Also when you lie down you can't get a whip spine trauma, can't fly through windshield, etc. It's a erognomics designer's task to make such posture comfortable.

Also, it would only be a 1 seater.

Why? If this thing can go 130 mph with one seat, it could go 100 mph with two seats, one behind another. Second seat will _not_ increase drag coefficient, only weight and vehicle length. Solar challenge rules limit solar cell area to the certain number, but you don't have to limit it when you build commuter vehicle. Second passenger compartment will increase vehicle power enough to compensate passenger's weight.

To meet current restrictions, it would have to have things like metal crumple zones

No. With weight about 200 kg and three wheels it will fall under "motorcycle" regulations in most countries, AFAIK at least in U.S. and Russia. Also it doesn't need _metal_ crumble zones for crash with another solar vehicle -- plastic crumble zones will do the trick for 200 kg cars. Your crumble zones in your car will never protect you in the crash against 18-wheeler, why mandate crumble zones against the same weight difference? Hell, there are tons of motorbikes rowing around the globe with NO airbags, crumble zones, seat belts and other measures, why these are not mandated to such ridiculous restrictions first?

With all of this, the clear answer for future automobiles is either hybrid gas/electric, or hydrogen fuel cells powered by hydrogen from clean nuclear power plants.

With hydrogen energy storage you'll depend on country economics and political situation in the world, like you do with petroleum. And with anti-nuclear craze you can't expect enough new power plants. We are still far, far away from building hydrogen supply stations everywhere, since we still do not have good hydrogen storage. And solar vehicle doesn't need these stations at all...

It's possible to build usable solar car today. But public will never buy it because they want luxury and "safety" and they are willing to pay $$ for petroleum.

Re:My Experience With the Dickheads

[Anonymous Coward]

Fuck these MSCEs are getting smarter and smarter! Did you go the whole hog or did you just attempt the upgrade exam?

You are a consultant for fuck all.

how about wind combo?

[doubtless]

any rules that prevent using the solar panels as wind sails as well? Dual powered car, with solar and wind, will probably be a little more promising.

Fuell cells do not generate power

[root_42]

Ever thought about the problem where the Hydrogen for the fuel cell comes from? Fuell cells only store power. And you could use solar energy to produce the hydrogen through electrolysis.

So the combination of the two together would be some real great renewable energy. Just think of it: Thousands of square miles of solar arrays in the Sahara, or some sunny place anyway, powering huge industrial style Hydrogen plants. Then the hydrogen for the fuel cells gets shipped into the whole world. That'd be cool, huh?

Re:Fuell cells do not generate power

[Anonymous Coward]

yeah, that would be cool! having that hydrogen supply would go a long way to solving our energy probelsm. we could put all the energy producing infrastructure somewhere sunny and barren like, say, the middle east. oh wait...

a sort of alternative Cannonball Run?

[Anonymous Coward]

Does this mean the winner gets to fuck Catherine Bach?

Mod this up!

[Anonymous Coward]

QED