Slashdot Mirror
Review of the Handspring Treo
axlrosen writes: "Walter Mossberg of the Wall Street Journal reviews the new Handspring Treo, and loves it. 'For the past week, I have been carrying around a new hand-held, wireless device that is simultaneously the best personal digital assistant I have ever used and the most capable cellphone.'"
another pointless cell phone. how about making the networks better before trying to make kick-ass phones?
Ack!
Evan - needs to hit preview before submitting
I think we have to work more on improving cellular and digital networks around the country/world before we get excited over some fancy new phone that can make a 5 course meal if you press *2211. What good is a phone like this if you don't have service? I live in Connecticut, and my StarTac doesn't work in my house, at my office, intermittently in NYC streets, and never in a subway train. Cool phones are great, but more service would be better.
I guess it's something like treading water until the boom comes back and everyone needs one of these again.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
It's sad to see something like this just coming out in the US. This and the VisorPhone, and the Kyocera palm phone are really the only PDA/Phone combos available here. I had the Kyocera, and it was terrible. This just pales in comparison to iMode, even without the buggy 3G enhancements they just rolled out. When will we get some decent wireless data service?? Japan has color, video, IM, web, games, and just plain awesome looking phones, and we get a cell/palm hybrid. yeah......
Where's my lobbyist? Right here.
The Treo is a world phone. It works on the GSM standard and is equipped for use in both the U.S. and Europe. In the U.S., it will work with carriers like VoiceStream and Cingular.
Yeah, GSM. So I spend $400-$600 on a cell phone/organizer, plus steep monthly fees for cell phone/internet access. And to top it off, I'm locked into GSM, which here in the USA isn't exactly the leading protocol.
The Gardener
--
My boss and I were looking at these this morning on handspring's site, and we came to the conclusion that they either look really good or really bad, depending on your point of view.
For PDA users, this is great because it's smaller than you're PDA and it's also a phone, so you don't have to carry another device.
Most phone users, though, don't have a PDA, so they won't get to carry fewer devices, and the form factor really sucks in comparison to the newer phones on the market. Plus, if a PDA was something they wanted to have, they'd have gotten one in addition to a phone already. Why carry something as bulky as my phone a year ago just to have a set of features I don't really want or need?
For me, this looks pretty cool. For most of the people I work with, it's just bulky and expensive.
Narrative
When will it be understood that this kind of phone is never going to be useful?
Too big to be a good phone. Too small to be a decent PDA.
It's a large clunky prototype of what is to come. I assure you the future isn't in handsets.
No metion of how well the PDA and native phone functions integrate. The Kyocera Palm OS phone is BAD at this, as you can't dial numbers out of synced contacts.
Anyone know how this unit handles this?
I think the design is very well done expect for perhaps the keypad. I don't understand why they continue to arrange alphanumeric characters in a QWERTY arrangement on such a small keyboard, when a different layout would make much more sense. The auto word complete feature mentioned though is a good idea (Windows CE had this). Also, the resolution of the LCDs used in these things are very low and it makes text readablity difficult. That is one reason I prefer the windows devices (240x320 resolution) over the palm models. Finally, I believe that the ability to be able to access a document or search for information from anywhere is very important. If I have a question, I want to be able to go to Google and find the answer within 30 seconds. Will this be possible with the bandwidth and limited screen space that this device has?
And still we have hands-free device laws in exactly zero states.
Not true.
--
Mod up a post Rob doesn't like and you'll never mod again
This wasn't funny as a comment on the 3Com story, and it's not funny here.
Do not fold, spindle or mutilate.
Note to Handspring (and whomever else):
Add voice recognition capability!
How many people have phones now that you can add voice tags to people's numbers? This should actually be rather easy to implement in the Treo, I'd imagine. (I didn't see it explicitly stated in the review.) Imagine just saying someone's name, and their business card comes up and it asks you if you want to dial their number. Sounds like a winning deal to me.
Other than that, add some Bluetooth or 802.11b capability in there. Then I can use this as an uplink for my laptop. Or I can beam business cards with RF instead of IR. Or imagine being able to zap someone your business card through SMS. That's another cool feature.
These devices are ALMOST there. We're almost to convergence, and I think I'll wait a generation or two and take another serious look at it.
Where the wind blows, the tumbleweed goes.
Treo: Great toy features
- hardware keyboard (Treo 180) OR grafitti (Treo 180g) but no sense of which is cheaper.
- 8 hour battery life: This seems short for either a cell phone OR a pda.
- only GSM network -- great everywhere but US, where it can be called "OK" at best.
It's not really there yet: only 16MB of RAM, not upgradeable, and no plans for a springboard module for EITHER additional RAM OR an MP3 player. Too bad: That would be useful integration!
Well what can I say, SPH-I300 vs. Treo. I should think that SPH-I300 easily tops most any pda/phone currently on the market. Allbeit the I300 is not compatible with 3G networks, but come on we barely have 2.5 networks... lets face north-america is quite far behind when it comes to cellphone technology. I live in canada, and we have only one major GSM provider.
I'd like to see this Treo mate with a SCP-6000 and see what happens. Also has anyone noticed the likeness between this Treo and the old Motorola I1000-plus phones. But its definately a step in the right direction.
Fighting for Peace, is Like Fucking for Virginity.
Fighting for Peace, is like Fucking for Virginity.
This looks like a nice, solid product.
I like the keyboard, I'm curious how the Graffiti works. Do you just write anywhere on the screen, or do you have to bring up a writing area?
It's too bad they don't have a springboard slot. If this could take my Soundsgood MP3 player and my GPS it would really sweeten the deal.
This looks like a great upgrade to my current Visor. I was going to get a springboard phone just before I ended up moving to North Dakota where Handspring didn't have coverage. If their coverage expands, this will let me finally stop having to carry a cell and a PDA.
And 16MB of memory, lord what will I do with it all? I'm doing great with 2!
obviously no deficiencies vs. no obvious deficiencies
I only wish that companies like Handspring would consider the impact of their actions before unleashing something like this on innocent commuters.
I do agree that driving while distracted is a bad thing. I curse at more cellphone yakking drivers a day than anything else. But to say that the manufacturers of the device are to blame? I can't abide by that logic. The devices aren't to blame, it's the stupidity of the user. I tried talking on a cell phone and driving ONCE...and I realized how my driving suffered, so I never did it again. It seems some people are unable to make that logical jump, or they're unwilling to sacrifice that "convenience" to possibly save their life or someone else's.
Aside from that part of the argument, I don't see how a Treo makes the situation worse. Cell phones already exist, as do PDAs. Any of the above behavior is already out there, and I don't think the Treo's audience is Joe Blow. Most average folk won't pony up $400 for a phone when (insert phone company name here) is giving them away with service. Two handed dialing? Maybe that'll make em realize how stupid phone use and driving put together are when they can't dial without releasing the wheel.
Electronic Frontier Foundation for online civil rights information
- While having a single standard is a good thing, having competition among multiple technologies is also a good thing
sPhMany US cell networks were built before GSM was created, and must provide legacy support for the older standards
In terms of voice quality, no system out there beats the original Motorola analog
While GSM is an impressive technical and political achievement, do remember that one of its unstated purposes was to prevent Motorola from dominating the EC mobile market the way it dominated the US, and to give Ericsson, Nokia, etc. a competitive edge. In this it succeeded, with assistance from poor management at Motorola of course
Uhh... first of all it's not out yet, so it probably hasn't been hacked, second, I (and I think most people) don't care what OS my phone/pda uses as long as it is easy to use and intuitive.
An operating system is just a platform. Who care's about the platform on something that only has a few functions? personally I would rather have it run Palm OS rather than linux because I know Palm has a very nice and stable OS, and there are tons of programs for the Palm. Why you would put linux on something like this is beyond me.
Moon Macrosystems. Sun's biggest competitor.
No state may have such laws, but many cities do.
And while I hate the idiots that are talking on the phone while they're driving, you also have to face the facts. Wish I could find a reference, but on the news around a year ago, I saw some statistics about the apparent causes of accidents. Number one cause was food, at 21%, I believe. Futzing with the radio was at 11%, methinks. Should there be laws against eating while driving, or having a stereo which has no on-wheel controls?
Working toward a usable PDA environment in the spirit of Newton OS: Dynapad
This, like many innovations, is just another step. Handsprings are slightly more modular than other forms of PDAs, while still having the minimal power consumption associated with palm pilots.
Many people, including myself, believe that the next frontier of technology is small, portable devices that communicate with each other wirelessly, though each device has a specialized function.
In order to make that happen, we need to start with devices such as handhelds - which CAN be easily specialized through software, and which have readily available wireless capability.
Its true that its "Just another handheld," similar to all of the other handhelds, but its more functional. Its not like another model car, which is exactly like the previous model, except that its "new and improved" (i.e. new and the current fashion); this is another piece of the puzzle.
And IT DOES MATTER that its slightly more functional. The advent of the 386 chipset allowed a whole new class of problems to be solvable that where previously too slow to do research - I know that this is the case for my field, which is computer vision. As time progresses, even more problems are being researched.
I'm looking forward to using technology such as this -perhaps even this model - in the near future (when it becomes pretty inexpensive - perhaps two or three years from now) as a module for home automation - it would be just about perfect for the purpose.
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!
You haven't been nice, according to my list.
Coal for you this year.
Dancin Santa
Its called the SL-5000D Zaurus PDA and is currently for developers only.
And yes, it does run linux (2.4 to be exact) along with PalmTop, QT, and Personal Java.
Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day.
Teach him to eat and he will fish forever.
Glock 21 .45ACP
at least that's on my list....
or
PS2
Grand Theft Auto 3
Metal Gear Solid 2
Yeah baby.
I just picked up the Samsung SPH-I300 avaliable with SprintPCS last weekend.
It's a color PalmOS, 8MB memory which is shorter and narrower then my Palm Vx, though just slightly thicker. It does have the ability to dial from the sync'ed address book, and all the usual PalmOS features.
And it's avaliable now, though you may have to search a little to find it at a SprintPCS store. From what I can see, it has all the features the Treo has and more, except the physical buttons
More information on the phone can be found at http://samsungusa.com/i300/
Or maybe they're just not your identical twin, and therefore handle it differently than you do. I'm sick of the attitude that just because you can't do something responsibly, no one else can, and therefore it has to be all or none for everyone. And it has to be legislated that way.
There's no doubt some people are unable to drive and talk on the phone at the same time, yet do it anyway. These same people are the ones who would find something else just as stupid to do, given the chance. Treat the consequences of their actions... if they get in a wreck because they aren't driving responsibly (phone or otherwise), arrest them for battery or something worse. Make the core of what's wrong with their behaviour something that they want to avoid, not specific manifestations of it. Radios, makeup, TVs, magazines, lunch, etc. can all be every bit as distracting and irresponsible (but don't have to be, either).
Some of us are quite capable of focusing our attention correctly, however, even while talking. Hell, I'm honestly a better driver when I'm on the phone, because I'm very conscious of the fact it could distract me and take pains to make sure it doesn't. And anytime the driving gets at all hairy, the phone goes on the passenger seat, no matter who is on the other end.
... is simple. It's what people are used to, and what they expect. I know exactly where to find a "A", or an "R", on a QWERTY keyboard. I don't want to have to re-learn this just for my handheld.
I can mostly deal with it being a GSM only device, and not have TDMA or CDMA, but calling it a dual-band world phone is pretty much an outright lie. Yeah, its a "world phone" if you never travel across oceans.
I still might get one if the service plans are good, but being able to go to the UK and stick a £10 Virgin pay as you go sim card in it would make the thing a true winner.
I hadn't heard it until I went to Handspring's web site after reading the article, but a color version is due "mid 2002." It's the Treo 270. No real details other than it has a color screen and will be $599.
Polls don't belong in comments. They belong in the... poll section. You're not funny. It wasn't funny the first time in the 3com article.
Moon Macrosystems. Sun's biggest competitor.
So did you actually read the article you linked to? It gives a few good reasons why cell phone usage in cars should not be banned.
Here's a ZDNet article from late October about Cingular's plans to do so; the article mentions that Verizon is considering doing the same:
fencepost
just a little off
Uhhhh.....I'm not good at math or english but that looked like two questions to me.
-- Find the Truth...
You can not actually touch type using such a small keyboard though and you are limited to looking at the keys and then pressing the letter you want. They may as well place them in a logical order. BTW I type exclusively in Dvorak, learning a new keyboard does not take very long.
My comedy teacher told me that one in every ten jokes are funny...so I still have eight tries left!
Maskirovka
I like jokes.
-Woz
tar -xzf /fridge/turkey.tgz / /proc/oven/preheat / /dev/oven
&& echo 380 >
&& cat turkey >
e Voila! dinner is done without me entering the kitchen.
And you're telling me you don't care!?
-- look, cheese ahoy!
Every Treo communicator comes with Blazer(tm)--the award-winning wireless web browser
:-)
Good thing: If this trend with 'web-browser in your hand computer thingy' catches on, perhaps sites starts providing pages which I can surf without resorting to Netscape 4.5:s "future proof" mode (view source, cut, paste).
Why Netscape 4.5? In digital unix you kind of take what's offered to you...
Open Materials Database
Please give some sources for the numbers quoted above.
Until then, I think a recent study at the University of Utah is getting to the heart of the matter. In short, they found that it's the interactive nature of conversation that's the real distraction. Tuning the radio, eating fries, etc, are just fundamentally different than
talking to people.
That said, the new Treo looks damn cool.
> Does anyone know how hard it would be to make a
> cell phone deactivate itself if it starts
> moving faster than 40 miles per hour? Could you
> perhaps triangulate the three nearest PCS
> towers?
Yeah, and when I'm on a train or am the PASSENGER in a car, what good is that?
Then again, on the train, i wish people would shut the **** up!
I think for their next iPod, Apple should add a couple features:
;-)
1) Cellphone that works with all the cell networks
in the world.
2) 802.11x or whatever that new superfast wireless
standard is that works with 802.11b, v.92 modem,
Gigabit ethernet, and the LCD backlight should be
able to blink morse code.
3) Military GPS accurate to 1"
4) A keyboard and also hand recognition (but not
graffiti crap, REAL hand recognition). And voice
recognition.
5) It's screen should be color and widescreen
format so I can watch my cracked DVDs on it.
6) It should run linux, but have virtual machines
so it can also run Palm and Windows apps. Oh, and
a gameboy advance emulator.
7) The battery should last at least a week,
preferably two.
8) None of this SDMI crap. I can put on and take
off anything. In fact, it should have a video and
audio in, so I can take input straight from my DVD
player into the device and share them with my
friends.
9) It should be the same size it is now, and still
use firewire.
10) Flash card, Smartmedia, multimedia card and
PCMCIA slots.
Oh, and I won't pay more than $150 for it.
That'd be cool!
obviously no deficiencies vs. no obvious deficiencies
And I reserve the right to castigate you for not selling your computer and disconnecting your ISP in order to divert the money to the homeless, as your doctrine apparently states you should.
;-)
When you're no longer posting on Slashdot I'll believe that you've lived up to the courage of your convictions
Marc Siry || interactive media professional, motorcycle enthusiast ||
Where did you see 8hour battery life? Here's the section from the article that you seem to have missed (as did the person who modded you up to 'Informative' it seems):
Battery life is adequate. As a phone, the Treo gets about 2.5 hours of talk time and 60 hours of standby time. With the phone function turned off, it gets about three weeks of battery life as an organizer.
60 hours of standby cellphone time is better than my current phone and 3 weeks PDA time is pretty darn good too.
Also, the Treo is meant to be pretty small, adding a Springboard on would add quite a bit of size and weight to it. If you want a Springboard slot, get a Visor.
Should there be laws against eating while driving, or having a stereo which has no on-wheel controls?
Actually, several cities are trying to do just that. Also, there are currently several unofficial restrictions to eating while driving. For example, try driving past a police officer while drinking from a container without using a straw. Believe it or not, in many places, you'll be ticketed. Food for thought; keep it in mind the next time you bring a coffee travel mug in the car while driving.
I can't find any good references right now, but I know for a fact that in my town and the areas around it, you will get fined if you are drinking from something like a covered mug or soda can while driving. They group it along with driver obstruction laws, such as having a radar detector attached via suction cups to your windshield, which is also illegal here.
<rant>
Why do cell phones and these things have external antennas? It's not as if the case is metal. I'm sure they could find enough room inside the case to place that stubbly little wart of an antenna if they really wanted to. (Say along the edge of the flip up lid.)
</rant>
"I'm not impatient. I just hate waiting." - My Dad
Bah. I'm not an extremist, just a realist. I said 'rediculous', didn't I? I see this gadget as a rediculous example. I don't see my computer or my internet access that way, because I've learned more from it than I learned in my 4 years of highschool. You'd probably agree that internet access is no more a luxury than a phoneline. Or at least, that it should be by being provided to low income areas and schools.
1) learn to spell
2) realize that you look like a typical leftist fool, deciding that the things that you have are "necessary" whilst the things that others have are "unnecessary luxuries".
North Carolina performed such a study. A take on it can be found on the Libertarian Party web site.
I'm not a Libertarian, but if they use PHP they can't be all bad.
..well, ok, they could use some help from the Demoronizer though.
I/O Error G-17: Aborting Installation
Well you've got it all figured out obviously. I must've spelled well enough for you to read what I was saying, and beyond that it really doersn't matter to someone who would use the name "Sarcasmooo!" (me). As far as being a 'leftist' with 'necessary' things, I'm a kid between highschool and college who can't afford luxuries. My dad bought me my TV when I was 15, and I bought my computer with money left to me in a will when I turned 18. This christmas I would be asking my family to spend money on charity instead of gifts for me, but I get antsy about looking self-righteous in front of pricks like yourself, so I just take what I get to the salvation army or wherever else it can go. And politics seems to be the last great haven for bigotry; I'm not a person with an individual mind and opinions, I'm a 'leftist fool'. Let's just cut the shit and go back to 'nigger, kike, etc' ok?
I tried talking on a cell phone and driving ONCE...and I realized how my driving suffered,...
I drive and talk all the time. However, I have both hands on the wheel (headset) and most all of my dialing is voice activated. This is no different then talking to someone in your front seat (which may be a distraction too!).
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
I'm sick of the attitude that just because you can't do something responsibly, no one else can, and therefore it has to be all or none for everyone. And it has to be legislated that way.
Unfortunately, until people in general are more intelligent about their limits and their actions, that is the way its going to be. Why should I be at risk in my car because the guy next to me won't admit to himself that he isn't a good driver while he is on his cell phone?
Also, it should be noted that just because you think you are a capable, responsible driver even when talking on a cell phone, chances are you aren't. Every distraction in the car, whether it be your hot cup of coffee, your cell phone, the amazing guitar solo that you have to play air guitar to with one hand, is just that: a distraction. Each one decreases your reaction time. Sure, if you are a person with good reflexes, that time negligible, but eventually it won't be. And at that point, you'll most likely be one of the people who isn't admitting their limits. And then the cycle repeats.
As much as I dislike the government dictating how we live our lives, things that become deadly weapons in the hands of irresponsible people most likely do need legislation.
You've never heard of an Internet Cafe? Or better yet, a Public Library with internet access?
You must be some kind of self-absorbed eletist to assume that everyone on the Net owns their own equipment.
Takahashi Rumiko made beats! DON, taku, DON, taku. . .
Fundamentally different, but still causing a lot of accidents. Talking to other people in the car was on that list as well, however, it was smaller than playing with the radio and eating. Wish I could find the citation- I believe cell phones were at a low 2-4%.
I'm not impressed by the Treo myself. Nothing against it per se, but I am not big on cell phones, or Palm devices really. As soon as I can get a card for my Newton or iPAQ that allows me to get real wireless net access for a low cost per month, I'll be impressed. Doesn't even have to be fast- I'll take 2KB/s. But as long as these services are expensive as they are, I just don't find reason to get excited.
Working toward a usable PDA environment in the spirit of Newton OS: Dynapad
Rant: Handwriting recognition. It'll never work. It can't ever work. People can't read my handwriting. I can't read my handwriting and consequently I've given up doing it for anything more important than a shopping list. And I usually fail to get something at the shops for exactly this reason.
I like that PDA's are sprouting keyboards, and I like the idea of attempting to use a Zaurus or similar for my email, but I'll probably be waiting for a Symbian based phone+pda combination. Once again, bring it on, the money's sitting in my bank account waiting for you to make things that don't suck.
Dave
I write a blog now, you should be afraid.
I have a Qualicomm QPC it never leaves the cradle and it hasn't had service for almost a year now. You know the Qualicomm phone with the palm pilot in it.
Battery life sucked, the unit expected to be placed on it's cradle 3-5 times a day (It will completely recharge in 30 minutes) and if you left digital land your freshly charged battery died within minutes on standby or seconds in a call.
If this unit cannot give me 2 days without needing a charge (which means within 3 months it will need daily charging due to battery life loss) It is worthless.
I really hope they have improved the battery life or at least offer a battery backpack for those of us that use a phone to death and dont sit at a desk most of the day.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Oh, puh-lease.
The accidents that can be shown to have been caused by cellphone usage are still a tiny fraction of accidents. Most studies I've read say it's something like 2%, which is far below a lot of other distractions. If you're going to outlaw cellphone usage, how about:
- Talking to others in the car. (I see people so into a conversation they're all over the road).
- Eating/Drinking.
- Fiddling with the stereo.
- Putting on makeup
- Shaving.
- Driving while tired.
etc...
Hell, you can buy a car with a fucking TV in it these days! How screwed up is that? And don't tell me it's just for the kiddies in the back seat, I've seen plenty of models where the TV is far enough forward that it could easily be a distraction to the driver.
How about people start taking some responsibility for their actions for a change? If you can't handle a phone and drive at the same time, then don't do it. I know that I can, as long as it's a short conversation that doesn't require much thought (i.e. I'm going to the store, need anything?).
Cell phone usage in cars when related to accidents is getting a horrible rap for 2 reasons:
1. Yes, some buffoons can't handle the phone and drive... then again, there's a pretty damn high percentage of people on the road that can't drive worth a damn even without distractions. I'd rather get those people off the road before outlawing cellphones.
2. The cell phone users are the easiest to see in comparison to most other distractions. It's really easy to see them holding a phone up to their ear for minutes at a time.
- My favorite error message: xscreensaver, running on an old Sparc 5 w/ 8bit color: bsod: Couldn't allocate color Blue
Cell-phone/PDA combos are a neat idea, but until there is a major advancement in display technology, either the phone is going to be too big or the screen is going to be too small. Not even the whiz-bang new Japanese phones address this.
This is probably the most interesting innnovation from the PDA market for a long time now. The launch of the new PocketPC from MS is not that nice to begin with, it was basically a non events.
Speaking of lack of Innovation, Palm has been doing nothing but staring at the wall for the past year, I am one of those that own a m505, it's cool but it is but no means innovative.
Palm was suppose to come out the Palm m705 (bascially a smaller form vector version of the illfated Palm VII), I am pretty sure they canned that thing probably because when they see Tero is going to murder it like crazy.
Tero is an innovative PDA/Phone hybird, not because they understand the lack of graffit, form factor, ease of use is the key for that market segment.
Now, I have a question to ask, unless you are a diehard Tero fan without a PDA, why don't you just get a really crappy cellphone then hook it up to your PDA? It's probably cheaper too.
kawai
Ring...
Click, conversation starts with Cisco...
*FUCK!*
Crashing noises as network guy tries to find batteries...
*FUCK!*
More crashing noises as network guy tries to mess with tiny plastic plate on back of Treo, beefy fingers dropping batteries and plastic parts everywhere.
*FUCK!*
Sounds of Treo being used as a hockey puck because when palm devices lose power, they lose really important things like your Cisco engineer's callback and trouble ticket numbers.
MORAL: when palm/handspring figures out that thing called flash or NV RAM, and comes out with easy to change batteries (like cell phones), then the product may become appealing in a work environment.
'Hail Eris, baby, hail Eris...pfffffffttt.' *cough* 'Yeah.'
My CIS teacher today was talking about using 802.11b in lieu of Excite@Home and what not (he may be getting cut off tomorrow.) That got me to thinking about an iPaq/Yopy (or any of the other linux/pocket pc capable PDA's), 802.11b PCMCIA/CompactFlash card and a VOIP application, all combined with a nice NAN (Neighborhood Area Network.)
About 5 linksys WAPS ($139 a Piece on Pricewatch) would cover our entire campus (I have my own personal one but it just covers the dorm.) Anyway, carrying around a little PDA (or using your laptop) would give you nice voice/video/data as long as you were in range, spread those WAP puppies around the city and that would be pretty pimp. Imagine roaming with nice speeds anywhere in town.
That brings me to the point where I am clueless. Can anybody help, how do you provide seamless transitions between WAPs? I'd hate to be downloading a file and wander out of one WAPs range, can another closeby pick me up seamlessly? (I know I can connect to either, but can it switch automatically without interrupting communcation?) Linux seems to usually be the most ahead in these types of bleeding edge apps... Anybody have any URLs?
worldLOG Connecting the lives of friends and family.
My sig, http://www.jdhodges.com
Except that it's huge compared to the Treo and has no cover for the screen.
What a dork, call this a flame if you want but have you even held one of these things??? Obviously not since you are complaining about how big it is. The Treo is a good bit smaller then the standard Nokia, which is the number one phone on the market. Heck, except for it's antenna, it's smaller then my wallet.
Get a clue before you post. Some fool might think you know what your talking about.
I've owned my Kyocera Smartphone for several months now and I really like it. They've done a good job at integrating a Palm and a phone. I couldn't care less about color, video, IM, web, and games. I also happen to like the look of the Smartphone.
If you reply, do so only to what I explicitly wrote. If I didn't write it, don't assume or infer it.
I hate to say, the last Newton Apple produced had excellent handwriting recognition.
I'd love to have a Palm with that code it in..
Note that you can store a limited number of voice-activated phone numbers with the Samsung i300, another phone/Palm alternative...
Twelve-and-three-quarter inches. Unyielding. This wand belonged to Bellatrix Lestrange.
> Except that it's huge compared to the Treo and has no cover for the screen.
:)
Emmm... no.
Treo: 4.3" x 2.7" x 0.7", 5.4 oz
I300: 4.9" x 2.28" x 0.82", 6.0 oz
I wouldn't say that it is huge compared to the Treo... 0.6" longer, 0.4" narrower and 0.12" thicker.
Though, yes, there is no cover for the screen. That's what screen protectors and cases are for
Of course, the I300 is avaliable now, while the color Treo is still half a year away
What we really need to do is have a bright red light on the back of all new cars that would warn others around them that they are talking on a cell phone. I would steer clear of anyone with the light on.
Slashdot.. Land of nerds, trolls, and FlameBait..
Actually, New York has become the first to implement a statewide ban
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
I'm going to have to disagree that it's the same as having a conversation with somebody next to you in the car.
Phone conversations are traditionally continuous and uninterrupted. We've all been trained to use them that way, and the people on the other side of the conversation expect it as well. Phone conversations take up higher priorities (re-nice'd if you will) in our brain than conversations with other passengers.
Other passengers are far more likely to accept and expect breaks in the conversation due to traffic and driving issues. They often will break the conversation themselves to warn of impending dangers. You don't feel bad about not answering for a while if something needs attention while talking to a passenger, as usually they know what caused the delay.
Phone conversations are inherently more dangerous because we're expected to and pretty much always do devote more of our attention to them.
"No, no, no. Don't tug on that. You never know what it might be attached to."
The high-res CLIE models (both monochrome and color) actually run at 4 times the resolution.. 2x in both dimensions.
- jon
Ganymede, a GPL'ed metadirectory for UNIX
I learned about it from the LP story here:e w& record=213
http://www.lp.org/press/archive.php?function=vi
Which references this report:
http://www.aaafts.org/pdf/distraction.pdf
Stats are on page 4.
-- Grey d'Miyu, not just another pretty color.
I agree, the future isn't in the handsets, its in the wearables.
:)
But I disagree that the size should matter.
Size doesn't matter, usage and implementation does.
I believe we will see even smaller devices that will succeed, but not just for any application or in any environment.
In the US and many other places you can forget about any 'real' data communication using a pda device until the service issue has been sorted out. But in Europe where GSM is good and you can almost smell the 3G networks, and Japan where the networks are extraordinaire, its the other way around. The service is there. We scream for devices that are not just a mobile phone with a game and some SMS features. Here the market are ripe, so if the American manufacturers wants some business, all they need to do is deliver the advances products and launch it here with the same initiatives they would have done in the States. But mark my words if they are not going for keeps they should rather stay away and leave it up to japs and eurotrash such as yours truely
Here we have the service and even if the device is the size of a wristwatch, if only implemented with the right applications to suit the environment, it will rock the blueeyed danish and swedish blondes panties off.
my favourite fantasy, should I have the opportunity, would be my own personal modified version of the wristwatch from IBM labs in Zurich which are equipped with microphone, bluetoothed earplugs, linux, sandisc flashcard, 1.3inches color display and camera combined with webservices applications for advanced management (and later on blessed with a projector or visor and 'virtual keyboard'). Even without the wishware in the parantheses you would have a client device that in collaboration with web services would give you so many new advantages to make you daily life simpler and more organized, that leaves you with more time for real fun.
imagine the applications with the programmable device connected to the internet utilizing administration and communication software that sorts and organize all the information and makes it available to and for you, on your command.
when the IBM wristwatch with linux was covered here on slashdot a while back I posted some of my fantasies as well and I made a small note about if IBM, Nokia, Ericsson should be interested, I would be happy to cooperate. Amazingly some good IBM professor from Zurich wrote me an email encouraging me to take contact. Greetings to you, if you should read this again. I would love to at least initiate some sort of communication regarding the subject. Unfortunately I lost your address when my thinkpad's harddrive suddenly said: NO MORE. so just to leave it up to mr. chance here is my address again: caspera@sophistic.com
Why did I just write all this again?
I don't know about bluetooth, but voice recognition needs a crazy amount of CPU oomph (to use a technical term). I could see it on an ipag, but on a 30something mhz dragonball? I don't want to say I don't believe it can be done, but I'm a little skeptical. Also, I seem to recall the PalmOS being designed for a PDA that would be running fairly lightweight, simple apps. Is that OS the right choice for a PDA if you want to do this? EPOC ER5 runs on PDAs with processing power similar to that of a high-end PalmOS machine, but also provides multitasking and better memory management.
Just my uninformed, ignorant, kneejerk responses (as I'm sure dozens of people will be telling me very shortly.)
I'm the stranger...posting to
but I agree coverage in NoVA, at least for ATT and Nortel, sucks with holes and drop-outs in the damndest places. (Like Tyson's Corner, a MAJOR office and retail development area that's basically an "edge city", or areas in sight of AOL and MCI Worldcomm.) I'm sure, however, that the coverage near congressional and FCC staffers overseeing the cellular industry is first-rate.
Sounds of Treo being used as a hockey puck because when palm devices lose power, they lose really important things like your Cisco engineer's callback and trouble ticket numbers.
You are right of course, but the palm does have a significant advantage over mobile phones. It can backup the info on your pc, so even if you lose it, you can retain all your info.
I picked up a Samsung SPH-I300 at my local Best Buy two weeks ago, if for nothing else because the sales drone offered me 24 months 0% financing and the Sprint rep was willing to throw in 2 free Palm M100s and a $30 rebate. It was a sweet deal for a sweet... phone... or is it a PDA? Hard to say really. And I think that's where these convergence devices are going to be stuck just until they figure out exactly what it is they want to be.
I'm not saying that I don't love my SPH-I300, because I really do. It's a really wonderful little Palm (160x240, Virtual Graffiti, slim form factor, weighs around 6 oz.) and being able to check my e-mail and have (albeit slow) wireless web access is really an amazing thing. But it certainly doesn't excel as a phone. It's not nearly as durable or as tiny as I like my phones and the virtual keypad is, well, not as good as a real thing.
It is, however, a good compromise for those of us that need a PDA and have very limited phone use -which, in my opinion, is really the only market for these $500 PDA-Phone combos anyway. If you're looking to buy one of these devices and are expecting to get a phone with PDA capabilities, you're bound to be disappointed.
DigiSquid Design.
"Should there be laws against eating while driving, or having a stereo which has no on-wheel controls? "
n ews/2000/10/07/nbot07.xml. Oh, and if you hadn't guessed, you're only allowed to use a hands-free phone when you're driving in Britain too.
In some places, it is illegal: http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/
As somebody who used to cycle to work, I can tell you who were the most dangerous drivers (i.e. the ones who scared the shit out of me the most and came closest to hitting me): really old people, and people on cell phones. Really old people are another story though: they're second only to 16 year olds in the US for causing fatal crashes.
I went through the McDonalds drive-through with a friend a few days ago. After the order the guy asked me if I wanted to try a Chocolate Sunday.
'twas the first time I've ever heard them not mention the word fries. Maybe it's just me not going there much. Maybe it's just new in NZ or something.
I was almost going to ask him if it was free, since he said try, as if they where giving them away as free samples or something. But then I remembered it's not a good idea to mess with the staff at food places when you buying your food there.
In NY, using a cellphone in a car without a handsfree kit is illegal, or at least that's what they say on those signs above the highways in the NY Metro area and points east. Of course, this is pretty much unenforceable since there are so many loons doing it (including NY State police!).
I do share the concern from a commuter's point of view, however. My motorcycle is my primary mode of transportation, and I've had my share of close calls from cell-phoning oblivious idiots. There's nothing like a 2-ton cage bunting you onto the shoulder to ruin that nice-day-life-is-great feeling on a sunny morning.
One other difference worth mentioning: The Treo is available ONLY as a GSM CancerPhone, while the Samsung and it's Kyocera cousin work with the much more biologically friendly CDMA.
(CDMA is also much better for mobile data connections because of its soft handoff capability, which allows the phone to "talk" to multiple cells simultaneously to produce a smooth transition rahter than the abrupt switchover used by other systems.)
"The future's good and the present is nothing to sneeze at." - Roblimo's last
The Treo uses an internal, rechargeable battery pack, not AAA's. Even with my ancient Palm III, though, I have never ever ever lost ANY data during a battery swap. Ever. As long as you get the batteries back in there within about a minute, you're fine. My friend once zapped all his contacts by installing the batteries backwards, though...so don't be a dumbass and do that. Worst case scenario? Sync the thing before you swap batteries...then it just doesn't matter if the thing zaps itself to hell.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
I guess it just depends on the person. It's the complete opposite for me. I'm a person who always gives eye contact. When I'm sitting next to someone, I have to really discipline myself so that I don't turn my head while I'm speaking with them. When I'm on the phone, I don't have the distraction of a physical person, and I'm keeping my eyes on the road.
It's all about mental priorities. Regardless of who you're talking to, or by what medium, you must learn how to focus on driving. Before the days of headsets, I actually found myself dropping the phone while driving because I needed to focus and use both hands (for a left turn, or something). It's not the end of the world if you have to call the person back or have them wait while you cross a busy intersection - it's just too bad most cell phone [ab]users don't realise this.
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
The numbers in the story on the libertarians page, here, are from all accidents by reason or contributing factors. Is anyone surprised that more accidents involved fiddling with the stereo than talking on a phone? If more people change radio stations than use cell phones while driving, which I'm betting is true, then this pretty much goes to follow.
The real question, and let's just narrow it down to these two groups radio users vs. cell phone users, which group had a higher accident rate (e.g. number of accidents / number of users)? Research tends to indicate that cell phone users are *more likely* to be involved in accidents than Big Mac eaters, cd changers, etc.
And really, this isn't an issue that I'm all that worked up over. I'm just taking issue with what are obviously the wrong numbers being bandied about as if they're meaningful.
cat turkey? I think I'll just stick with cranberry sauce!
A choice of masters is not freedom
Jerkin!
This tagline is umop apisdn.
Hrm, Treo is also a Danish pain killer.
Unselfish actions pay back better
Seemed ok. I agree with others that the networks around here need more improvement for these convergent devices to really take off.
My main rant with this is the keyboard - too small for my tastes. Perhaps it's big fingers, but it was *not* very ergonomic for me, and that lowered my impression of the overall product. I had to really concentrate to work the buttons. I would probably rather fight the Graffiti system (or tap a virtual keypad) then try and punch on that keyboard. But then again maybe if you have small fingers, or really sharp nails, it might work good for you.
I didn't see that new 'sideways' Nokia phone (at Comdex) with keys on either side of the screen (I'm sure it was there). But I would gather that *might* be better as the keys could be spaced a bit farther apart. Or, they could be close together and have more of them (which gives the same result). I'm not sure, I wish I spent the time to check that.
Anyway, some food for thought for those of you with larger digits.
- A non-productive mind is with absolutely zero balance.
- AC
I'd personally be pissed if they passed laws against eating and driving. I fucking work 60-80 hours a week, 16 hours a day, between two jobs. The only time I get to eat is on the drive between jobs and that usually consists of stopping at Wendy's and scarfing it down at red lights and straightaways. However, I'm also eating "one-handed" foods, I could see some argument against eating, say, a big bowl of chili or the like. From personal experience, I drive a lot while Drowsy (see 16 hour work days), which is even more dangerous than drinking. When I catch myself falling asleep at the wheel, I start looking for a parking lot to pull into, and then usually have to worry about the fucking rent-a-cops coming to harass me out. Bastards. It's not like anyone is shopping at 5AM and I usually need about 30 minutes before I'm fine enough to drive again. but that's another story.
If you were me, you'd be good lookin'. - six string samurai
The Treo is a really cool device, but you'll have to make some decisions: Keyboard or graffiti pad, get it now or wait for the color screen.
Probably i'll never get one, I'm from Holland and all of the cool stuff isn't available here: You can only buy an AIBO directly from Sony, I can't find the Kyosera Smartphone anywhere and my guess for the Treo is that I won't be able to get my hands on one.
He doesn't understand that there is anyone else out there besides him. Laws about hands free don't solve the crux issue which is his lack of morals. He's not thought about and understood consequences of his decisions...or he doesn't care.
I'm going to not talk on my phone because when I become distracted I might kill someone through my reduced reaction time
So while you might solve the preceived issue through legislation... you will not solve the issue which is that people don't think about the consequences of their actions when they are behind the wheel.
For Instance take these examples...
the guy who went flying around the curve on I-95 below Hanscom Field in the inside lane at 85 on my way to work this morning seems to have a similar problem...
Or the Saab who did the four lane sweep out of US3 onto 128...
Or the lady with her kids bouncing around in the back of her minivan on rte 62 yesterday afternoon...
Or the guy I watched eating a burger as we were both going through the Hooksett tolls on Saturday...
or mayhaps the State Trooper on the Pike last thursday who while seeming in no legal rush was flying West from Allston-Brighton at 80+ MPH suspicously close to shift change...
Or mayhaps the owner of the El-Camino with Maine tags I parked next to at Dunkin' Donuts this morning that had bald tires...
Or mayhaps the low riding, detailed out Ford Contour with the stereo pumping out the latest hip-hop jam I had the joy of sitting next to at a light in Woburn a week past on a warm day...
Laws about hands free don't solve the issue that these drivers got their licenses out of cracker jack boxes and obviously didn't learn the potential impact of their actions.
Personally I didn't really realize myself until years after I got my license. I mean I knew it intellectually... and I follow the law... but it did not sink in on that gutt level.
For me the transition from an intellectual knowledge to that gutt knowledge happened when I watched from a house in Castine Maine the Hancock County Mounties scrape a young kid off a guard-rail on Maine Route 166 when he tried to take his bike around a steep curve at 110 while inebriated. People just don't realize till it affects them. I really think we should make it a requirement for kids getting their license to help clean up one traffic accident.
So while cell phones usage while driving may be a great campaign issue for politicians in seach of re-election (calling Swifty). It side steps the real issue which is that many drivers on the road today (and not just those in New England) don't really have a sense of what the impact of some of their preceived minor actions might be, the loss of their lives or even more sadly some innocent bystanders
Since it's too much for most people to THINK before they post, i know it'll be impossible to get people to research before they post. NY has a hands free cellular law.
Slashdot, where strong opinion trumps logic and reason.
Imagine hooking up you PDA to your home/office computer network as just another system,. Imagine not only running the same commands, but the same programs you run everyday on your home/office computer on your PDA! And then imagine customizing your PDA to do whatever you want. You know that little pet peeve you have with the way the software works? The way this or that iss designed? Well, you can get rid of it!
I doubt it would be that hard since if you are going 40MPH you are probably changing cells pretty quickly and you can base it on that. However it is a bad idea. Why are you preventing the passengers from using the phone? Or the guy that got kidnapped and stuck in a trunk?
This WSJ article says "You can also run the organizer functions with the phone functionality turned off..."
You just have to convince the flight attendant.
Meow.
No, it means I took a few minutes of time to do research and I know type 20WPM faster than most people. I now spend less time typing than most people do. Try different things. It doesn't hurt.
I'm surprised that there is nothing out on the market for this device as well as any other wireless PDA that would allow remote control of a PC. Something like PC Anywhere running on a device like this would be very useful. I know Carbon Copy (now out of business) had a version that would run on Windows CE devices, but I never heard much about it. Does anyone know of any other programs that would allow wireless remote control of a PC.