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Java Media Framework Drops MP3
realinvalidname writes "Sun had stopped downloads of its Java Media Framework about a week ago due to an undisclosed 'licensing issue.' Now we know what it is, as they've removed MP3 encoding and decoding from the JMF that's downloadable now. Of course, this isn't surprising given recent news about
new MP3 licensing terms."
I prefer to just scroll through the 1's and 0's and decode them myself anyway.
Anyone who cannot cope with mathematics is not fully human. At best he is a tolerable subhuman who has learned to we
Do they already have Ogg? Was it added? Or will they be adding it? --clambert
mailto:<?=implode("@", array("chris", implode(".", array("php", "net"))))?>
I'm a big Java supported, but this is unfortunate. It will only serve to make Java less relevant. You'd think that Sun could have worked out something with donating the licensing fees and made it a 'goodwill' guesture towards the Java community. Oh well.
Cat, the other, tastier white meat.
Then why not add in something like Ogg Vorbis? I'm sure I'm not the only one to hink of this. Seriously though, wouldn't any available, comparable quality codec fill in instead of mp3?
Maybe someone should check out this article first:
"Thomson has never charged a per unit royalty for freely distributed software decoders. For commercially sold decoders - primarily hardware mp3 players - the per-unit royalty has always been in place since the beginning of the program," a spokesman said"
"A Thomson spokesman told NewsForge's Robin Miller that it was a ruse by Ogg Vorbis advocates to get publicity.® "
http://www.theregus.com/content/4/26153.html
Fortunately, there is an open source Java MP3 decoder, JavaLayer that I've found to work quite nicely.
The problem isn't one of being able to get linux running on your proprietary bioware implants. The real problem is going to be deciding which distro to use. I personally vote Caldera, since it's reportedly so simple that even a trained monkey could install it. Once the OS religious war is settled, the next major problem is going to be of establishing network connectivity between the primates. Given the nature of your project, I believe that it would be most effective to implement an 802.11b wireless network, with access points strategically tied to various trees about the area. Personally, I think it might be more cost effective to implement a traditional hard-wired ethernet network, but installing an ethernet card into a simian could prove to be problematic (IE, loose connections and such. It's reliability vs. useability and cost, I guess.)
If you would like to recieve more feedback, please submit this question to Slashback, and possibly to the Slashdot Polls. I'm sure that if we all knew what CowboyNeal would do, we'd be able to better decide a course of action.
Oh, you mean the recent news that you irresponsibly covered, without amending the original post, resulting in much ado about nothing, as basically nothing changed?
m l
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/26893.ht
Next time, when you post a story that's clearly going to cause paranoia and misunderstanding, try to be a bit more adult about it. Mod this down as far as you like - I like Ogg, too, but if this is what it takes for it to gain widespread acceptance, something's wrong.
That one non-open technology gets rid of support for another non-open technology.
I already pirate music.
Why should I care if I have to pirate the codec as well?
In case you're wondering, yes, I really do board boats, rape the women, kill the crew and take all the CDs on board. So there.
Um..try reading what the License says, not what a suit says. Remember when push comes to shove that's what Thompson and a court of law will be going by.
Besides why take out the passage from the license if it already agrees with a policy?
Adding support for Ogg Vorbis and Tarkin is bug 4499904 in the Bug Parade. This seems like a good time to vote for the bug and add your comments.
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
I thought it was already decided that the "changes" weren't new at all to the MP3 license terms.... I could be wrong though but thats what I thought the follow-up said....
"The saddest words of mice and men, are not those which were, but should have been."
Mod parent up!
This post was generated by a Cadre of Uber Monkeys for Monkey-Man2000 (603495).
So now the Java programs I wrote last year --those "write once run everywhere" programs-- cannot be run on today's JVM. The only way to make them run will be to insist the user installs an old JVM. Like that's gonna happen.
Hey Sun, take a page from the W3 and don't add standards to your standard that you can't depend on for reasonable licencing terms.
To each, mine.
I lied, it isn't n/t.
Cheapies...
Seriously... Shell out the cash and give us the code... How lame (no pun)...
If Sun was as big and powerful as MS, we'd be making Sun-of-a-bitch jokes just a Micro-soft penis choices...
Cheapies...
Tournament Management Online &
The licensing fee DOES NOT apply to software decoders, only hardware decoders.
From the Register article:
A Thomson spokesman told NewsForge's Robin Miller that it was a ruse by Ogg Vorbis advocates to get publicity.®
Hmmph.
No one should EVER deal lightly with intellectual property issues. They must be explicit. :)
Anyway, if they don't feel like explicitly stating their 'policy' anymore, that is different from never stating it. It took effort to add ambiguity. They did it for a reason.
no, taco (whoever the fuck taco is) does not say that in that link - someone else attributes it to him (her?)
They'd be hard-pressed to add support for Tarkin, since it's barely even started, and not currently under active development (the Xiph coders are currently working on Theora, which is a project to integrate the VP3 codec -- which was originally closed-source and patented but has been donated to the Ogg project by the owners -- into the Ogg file format). Tarkin is still on the roadmap, but it's a long-term "what we'll do when we're done with everything else" goal with no timetable to completion.
10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
This link is carrying the story. Apparantly thomson has also said that they never said that this was applicable to software mp3 players! They blame it on rumours by vorbis group. At newsforge thomson has said that ogg is trying to get publicity and attention etc., they actually never had any restrictive terms for software mp3 playeres... no royalties for those.
My Aurora : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o91ZsGwJYyg
FB : https://www.facebook.com/TanveersPhotography
You know, if they left in the MP3 code, every time you wanted to use the Java Virtual Machine, you would have to insert your three quarters...
JOrbis is a GPL'ed Ogg decoder. Maybe the developers and Sun can work something out to reuse that code (GPL probably won't be OK with Sun for JMF).
Mod parent into oblivion!
then point that out. and as to taco, well i don't know too much about this site, and i'd like to keep it that way. some people around here don't seem to have a life outside of slashdot. sad.
And beyond!
But, I decided to flip on the tube and catch the TechTV deal with Taco and Gamara,
It's only in the second fucking line.
and as to taco, well i don't know too much about this site, and i'd like to keep it that way. some people around here don't seem to have a life outside of slashdot. sad.
Your UID is in the 200000s. That's like saying you don't know that Alex Trebek is the host of Jeopardy. Why don't you try fucking clicking that "About" link on the left?
In the beginning there was no Slashdot. Bored and confused geeks would scribble "First Post" in the sand. Grits were strictly for consumption and there wasn't a place to get nerd oriented news. Then in September of 97 Rob "CmdrTaco" Malda changed all that. With the help of Jeff "Hemos" Bates and others, Slashdot has stumbled forward with the simple mission to provide 'News for Nerds. Stuff that Matters'.
BTW, Taco, I love the "first post" comment.
Caldera Linux is no more . Ransome Love is an anti opensource fanatic who actually wanted to charge a per seat licensing scheme for a free OS. What a joke. I believe their acquisition of SCO changed his mind on opensource. I am sure SCO Xenix is just going to come back from the coffin and beat out linux. NOT.
Caldera Version 1.2 lite was my first linux distro years ago and it will now be my last. It felt like a real unix with just fvwm and opendesktop file manager. It was so weird and the desktop was so alien compared to today.
http://saveie6.com/
so someone claims to have seen something on tv. the question was where did taco say that and it sure wasn't that slashdot comment.
yes, of course i know who taco is - if i was too subtle for you, well that makes me smile.
so someone claims to have seen something on tv. the question was where did taco say that and it sure wasn't that slashdot comment.
yes, of course i know who taco is - if i was too subtle for you, well that makes me smile.
yes, of course i know who taco is - if i was too subtle for you, well that makes me smile.
The fact that you're a complete moron was not subtle to me at all.
well i'm in good company here
I guess this is redundant, but Sun should start implementing ogg! I am a java developer, and I hope that Sun implements ogg in the next version of Java!
ogg is to mp3, what png is to jpg?
I want my rights back. I was actually using them when our government stole them after 9/11.
Basically Thompson have said they currently don't plan to sue anyone making a software decoder but they don't grant you the right to use their patent either. Nobody selling or planning on selling software can use their patent without risk of infringement (and compensation pays triple if you knowingly infringe a patent) and being sued by Thompson in the future.
What some PR flack said doesn't change that. It's only what's in the licence that counts.
Next time when you are clearing posting to spread misinformation and crap, try posting as you so you can get modded down for it.Nerd: Derogatory term typically directed at anybody with a lower Slashdot ID than you.
Don't like it? Don't use it. Stop bitching about it.
An ogg vorbis player is an application, not something that should be included in a language specification. It will just make java more bloated. Should we also petition to add ogg support to C++? If you want ogg support in java, why not just write an ogg player/encoder in Java? It can already be done in standard Java.
dude, you are really making my head hurt, you are so smart.
Just because the licensing page doesn't mention free software en/decoders doesn't mean there isn't a free licensing scheme for it - it may simply not be mentioned. The original poster is right though - this is just a scare.
Really now? You might want to take a look at the link provided in that very same article you lifted the "publicity" quote. The licensing specifically lists prices for "PC Software Applications" as well as "Hardware Products".
Aren't you the little brown noser eh ?
The Register has an article which claims the fees have not changed at all and are for Hardware Decoders only.
m l
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/26893.ht
Hrmph. The MP3 format has lived long enough. Like PNG is slowly replacing GIF, Ogg Vorbis should replace MP3. Do any of the big-name players support Ogg Vorbis out of the box yet?
Stop the brainwash
Well maybe they're not about to go bankrupt -- but given that they seem to be too cheap to buy a license to distribute the MP3 decoder element of their software you have to wonder don't you?
I noticed that they'd "temporarily suspended downloads" of the JMF when I went to download it a couple of weeks ago -- although no mention was made at that time exactly which license was the "issue" involved.
Having co-authored a book about Java, having got the tee-shirt, having collected the coffee-mug, and having the Java-cap in my closet, I have to admit that I'm disappointed with the way Sun have screwed up what could have been a beautiful thing.
Either they're going to sink enough resource into Java to fix the bugs, create a more programmer friendly GUI classlib, and compete head-on with Microsoft's offerings -- or they're going to nickle and dime the project all the way to the grave. I fear the latter is more likely based on events of the past five years or so.
Sad really -- I like Java.
As you can read here the license terms have not changed at all. This is all bullshit!
I have some land in Florida you might be interested in. Failing that, would you like to buy a bridge?
If it is not mentioned in the licencse (The full licencse), then the exemtion does not exist. It is up to Thompson to clarify the exemption. If what the PR flack says is true, I see no reason why Thompson cannot change their licencse back to specifically include an exemption for Free software decoders.
" Just cause something "disappeared" doesn't mean it doesn't still work that way."
I'm certain a court of law will take that into account when they read the revised license.
I've noticed no one has answered the question of "Why the removal of the exclusion?"
Java is a language, but it's also a platform.
And Java the Platform is what we're talking about here...
Advanced users are users too!
http://www.theregus.com/content/4/26153.html
I read an article about JMF not going to support mp3 anymore. An inch below: "Visual Studio .NET! Try it out now!". If you didn't know better, and had watched too much X-Files, you'd think it all was a clever marketing scheme from a Slashdot/Microsoft conspiracy to get developers switching to .NET. :-)
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
That's not a bug. It's a feature! (collective groan)
(Here's hoping the lameness filter doesn't trip)
The website is informing potential applicants for licenses what licensing options are open to them. It's not actually setting out the terms of the license. The license is what the companies get, and sign. The tariff is something entirely different, and the licensing for free software is, shall we say, a dish which is available, but not listed on the menu.
So why the hell is everybody freaking out? I agree, just like GIFs, the MP3 format is encumbered by patents, and it's probably a good idea to start transitioning to a format that doesn't have this problem. However, the sky hasn't fallen yet.
-J
saw the article here as well.
Here are different sites that offer the old files. For those of us who are willing to pay the license fees only, of course.
1
2
From Sun's JMF site: "If and when licensing issues can be resolved, we plan to return MP3 functionality back to JMF."
If Thomson really does not intend to charge for free software decoders, as its PR department is loudly proclaiming, then the MP3 decoder should be very soon added to the JMF again.
You fucking moron.
Java Media Framework is just another API.
Does OpenGL make c++ more bloated?
:o)
No, Ogg is to MP3 what PNG is to GIF. I think JPG counterpart is JNG, but I'm not sure. And yes you need all of MNG to "consume" all of the GIF features (PNG lacks animation). BTW what about FLAC? FLAC is to MP3 what PNG is to JPEG in the sense that FLAC (and PNG) are lossless, while MP3 (and JPEG) are lossy. Is FLAC (going to be) supported by these Java codecs?
"I'm never quite so stupid as when I'm being smart" (Linus van Pelt)
ROTFLMAO!
This exchange of ACs at the top of the posts had made my day- good stuff.
graspee
"OggVorbis is the future."
...
... getting ... smaller !
... everywhere !
Help! I'm living in the future and the future is blocky !
My music is compressed, my films are compressed, my digital TV is compressed
How soon before trouser presses become trouser compressors ? Hey, they look like shorts but they were sold as slacks !
Everything
Artefacts
HlpMePls!
graspee
If i was more paranoid id say it was a secret plot to move us all to DRM-ized formats.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
So.. this is probably way off topic.. but.. what do people recommend for converting a huge mp3 library to ogg? I don't want to have to re-encode all of my CDs....
Where is the old version downloadable? I'm sure someone has the download of the old version, where is it?
If you care at all about sound quality, just re-encode, and consider it a lesson for not having listened to all of us license nazis for the past few years. (:
Seriously, taking an mp3 stream (with its artifacts), decoding it to PCM, then re-encoding to Ogg Vorbis format (with its artifacts) will give you inferior sound quality. I don't know how inferior, not having tried this, but be warned. (And, of course, don't judge the quality of the ogg codec by such results!)
If you still think it's worth trying - well, cook up a shell script using mpg123, oggenc and your favorite id3 tag reader. In fact, I'll do it for you...
[one hour later] OK, try mp32ogg. Requires perl, id3, mpg123 or equivalent, and oggenc from vorbis-tools. Tested on Debian Linux 3.1pre ("sarge") - may require tweaking on other OSes. No copyright, no warranty, etc. (:
"How can you claim that you are anti-crack, while still writing a window manager?" — Metacity README
jpg is a lossy compression scheme and png is lossless, so png is much more of a replacement for the lossless gif format. =)