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What Software Do Cable Installers Place on Your PC?
{e}N0S asks: "The cable guy came over to install a cable modem at my Dad's house. As I watched him do his stuff I noticed he was installing something called Broadjump Client Foundation. I know you don't need software for a cable modem to work so I asked if it was necessary. He said he had to do his list of things, and we had to sign that he did his list of things, otherwise he couldn't leave it with us to use. Since I can always remove the software, I agreed, but I noticed while he was flipping through the install, he was clicking 'agree' on every EULA that came up. Doing a search on Google for 'Broadjump Client Foundation' comes up with some pretty scary stuff as far as what it does, like: 'Builds a database of subscriber demographics and buying behaviors to help evolve and refine marketing efforts.' Now, how does this affect us? Neither myself or anyone in my family agreed to the software; the cable guy did. And is there anyway to get cable companies to stop doing this as I can imagine since the cable company is a monopoly in this town, that the percentage of people who still have this software on their computers is pretty high."
I actually had him install it while i wasn't there and waddya know, the pc crashed 3 days later... so, i transferred it to my 2nd, didn't install anything and it hasn't glitched in 5 months
There is no
I use Mac OS X. The software that Comcast has is incredibly buggy for Mac OS. I refused to install it. I just signed the docs for the cable guy (as if I even needed him to come do the installation in the first place).
"I don't think it's selfish, to eat defenseless shellfish." -NOFX
Roadrunner let me pick up a self install kit, so no tech ever came to my house.
And no software needed to be installed anyway. Screwed the cable line into the modem, turned it on, attached it to the Linksys router, turned it on, attached that to the LAN port on my Mac, turned that on, and presto! A working internet connection!
And if you really don't want something done, assure the installer you will sign off on whatever, so long as he does what you ask.
All we care about is your autograph, if your happy and are willing to sign, im sure he wont have a problem.
alex
He stood me up the first time, then when he did arrive, he told me that I couldn't have a dedicated IP, despite them having promised me that I could have one. He did however configure my machine to use the cable company's proxy server, and use DHCP, etc... After he was done, I just reconfigured it and hard set the IP address. I haven't had a problem in the past couple of years. Except for when my machine was off for a couple of days, and I had to re-configure for DHCP,and "steal" another address, as my old one wasn't available any more...
-- -- Warning. Do not stare directly at the sun.
The Time Warner/RoadRunner guy simply came in, installed a new NIC, installed the cable modem, set up the new email settings in Outlook, and changed the IE homepage to their portal. I scoured the system when I got home from work (my wife was the only one here when he did the install) and was quite relieved that he didn't install any software.
It shouldn't be that hard, really. If there are anything in those EULAs you object to or don't feel comfortable with, cancel the service.
In that case, I hope your father didn't agree to some sort of contract.
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
I suppose it depends on your provider, but to my knowledge, you shouldn't need a damn thing. Wanna test it easily?
1) Borrow a laptop with an ethernet card, unplug the power from the cable modem (some of them will only give a DHCP address to one MAC address at a time, and need to "forget" what they have seen)
2) Plug in the cable modem
3) Attach the laptop
Didja get an IP? If so, I'd say you can pretty safely whack the offending software. I seriously doubt it's needed. A lot of things (like a lot of those "connection sharing" firewall/router devices) would fail to work if it was.
I wasn't asked if I wanted a self install kit, so a tech came out. I was watching over his shoulder the entire time. The only things he did were reconfigure outlook, and change my home page to rr.com.
I asked him about the home page switch and all he said was that it was policy and I that I could change later.
On Windows,
Press START, SETTINGS, Go into Control Panel, Select Add/Remove Software and remove the offending software.
If they complain, invent a ficticious "Computer Guy" who told you it was the reason your system was locking up all the time.
Mention that you have lots of games and Internet Explorer "add-ons" that you have downloaded and installed. Believe me, NO technician will want to muck about through a myriad of windows software installations to troubleshoot their spyware.
They'll go away.
.. Have you tried browsing to www.broadjump.com?
From their website:
Hardware makes broadband possible. BroadJump software makes it profitable. BroadJump solutions allow broadband service providers around the world to greatly reduce operating costs and seamlessly enable the delivery of revenue-generating content, applications, and services over existing broadband networks.
Windows 9x doesn't need to be rebooted either.
Run "winipcfg", select the ethernet adapter, click Release, then Renew.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
Since I run Linux, I picked self install. It is $75 cheaper than full install, and the technician came out, refurbished all the cable connectors, turned me on at the hub, and checked the signal level at the cable modem. He then let me configure Linux and check that I could ping various places.
You really can't argue with this policy. Some customers (most?) need the full service install. My only complaint with Cox is that they keep increasing the price (from $40/mo to $50/mo) and decreasing the upload cap (from 500Kbits to 200Kbits). The download cap is 1.4Mbits - T1 performance for a fraction of the cost.
I worked in the cable industry for 5 years as an internal systems administrator at a Systems design contractor. Most of those techs are trained on hardware that'd liquify your brains - installing software for some clueless customer is a very small part of their responsibilities.
Some of you people just need to get over yourselves!
Why isn't a DSL "box" a modem? It modulates digital data into analogue and pipes that analogue signal out over a PSTN line. Which is exactly what a modem does, just at a much higher frequency. Given that it works in both directions I would say it qualifies as a MOdulator-DEModulator.
I'm not flaming...just curious...it's perfectly possible you know something I don't
---- Den ene knappen er powerknapp, den andre er Bender voice knapp "Bite My Shiny Metal Ass"
Besides just uninstalling that software, there are some things you could and should do. Check to see if your local city government has a liasion with the cable company. If so, my first step would be to let them know about what you experienced. As someone else mentioned, check the service contract to see what it mentions about allowing the cable company to make you a party to other agreements (EULA). Though it could happen, I doubt a court would allow it to stand if you were unaware of what the agreements were about. It would be the same as assigning the power of attorney. The idea of needing a demographic database to offset costs could be true but should have been stated. Companies should offer the customer a choice: pay x amount for the product or pay a smaller fee but allow them to gather and use marketing info.
From this site: http://support.sbcglobal.net/legal/5071.shtml Is the following EULA language: # RIGHT TO TERMINATE NETWORK-BASED SERVICES: By using the Licensed Software, you acknowledge and agree that BroadJump and SBC Internet Services shall at all times retain the right to terminate any and all on-going network-based services that you receive pursuant to your use of the Licensed Software for any reason whatsoever, including without limitation your refusal to allow BroadJump and/or SBC Internet Services to install on your computer any upgrade or modification to the Licensed Software in the future. You better keep that 486 honeypot running with the Broadjump software!
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
I'd like to underline this. For anyone who hasn't learned by painful experience yet, never report anything to the interent suport people if you have TV from the same source.
Anything which goes wrong is in one of two classes, things shared with the TV operation and things their tech support stands no chance of fixing. The TV operation will be far better resourced, and the support staff know that you may have 5 children demanding cartoon network at your end and so not fixing things may result in you being driven insane and turning up at their call center with a chainsaw. Nerds just don't carry that fear factor:-)
Certainly when I had a problem which seemed to be at my end, my cable suppler (Telewest) quoted a couple of weeks for an engineer from the internet side and day and a half for a TV bod.
_O_
.|< The named which can be named is not the true named
Sorry, bub, but I'm a trained Small Claims Court Counsellor. You can't sue for emotional, time, or any other non-monetary kind of cost. If it can't be printed on a recipt, you can't sue. You can sue for time if it was part of an arrangement (i.e. plumber not getting paid for the job), but not for your time spent fixing this stuff. Unless he broke the machine and you had to have it serviced or replaced, there's nothing small claims court can do.
GL
Perhaps the good people at Lavasoft could add this kind of scumware to their list of Naughties?
Just a thought.
Trolling is a art,
ER - ADSL does use a modem. The signals transmitted are in the analogue domain and cross a number of frequencies - these have to be demultiplexed into a serial bitstream for use by your digital devices.
Just incase you didn't realise the DEM in modem stands for Demultiplexor.
When I was trialling DSL here in the UK I had a DSL router AND a DSL modem as seperate boxes. The DSL modem took the analogue signals and converted them into the ATM that they were a representation of. The router then translated the ATM into Ethernet for my local area network. Generally in the UK all ADSL is PPPoA.
Matt Thompson - Actuality - Insert product here.
The Actual Website is www.lavasoft.de which is still up and running just fine.
WikiAfterDark.com It's a sex wiki, go now!
Here's Broadjump. I found it through Hotjobs' listings for Canada, but it's just www.broadjump.com.
MacThe Time Warner people out here in Kansas City do not officially "support" Linux, but are in the LUG mailing list, have local usenet newsgroups for related issues, and the tech support people are very helpful. If only all ISPs were like this...
they installed all kinds of stuff, the IE on that image never worked the same again.
I've had that problem with DSL and cable. The stupid client software they force on you installs its own IE. Worse yet, the cable software uninstalled IE6 to install IE5.5
Apparantly Windows 2000 doesn't like having its IE6 taken away from it, because *nothing* worked after that... Windows Scripting Host was fux0rzd, Explorer was flakey, etc... Oh well... it was one of the last straws that switched me to Linux (which takes the cable without any problems or software -- eat *that*, Comcast), so I suppose I should be grateful.
All's true that is mistrusted
Please excuse any irregularities in the following post because I only got 3 hours of sleep lst night.
Apparently it's the first case beacause the company homepage is here. They mention that they deal with Adelphia, AT&T, Bell Canada, Bellsouth, Charter Communications, RoadRunner, SBC, Sprint, Telus (Canada) and Time Warner among others.
They seem to have their fingers deeply into this industry.
The software:a is/speedyPP POE/BroadJump/s /startup _full.htmt mlr s/www.iscentra l.org/%257Etcniso/main/cisp.htm
http://www.velocidadejusta.com.br/manu
More information (search the page):
http://www.pacs-portal.co.uk/startup_page
Broadjump's homepage:
http://www.broadjump.com/
Mention of Broadjump in Yahoo's EULA:
http://support.sbcglobal.net/legal/5070.sh
Information about the Broadjump Client (looks like it spys on whether you've overclocked your connection):
http://osiris.978.org/~brianr/mirro
Posting what will be a +5 informative as an Anonymous Coward:
Priceless
http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interes ting-people/200202/msg00164.htmlr esting-people.org/archives/interes ting-people/200206/msg00132.html
http://www.inte
A friend once had an old MAC that did not support DHCP which he used to loan to friends before the cable guy installed anything. The cable guy always said the same thing - Geez there are a shitload of these old MAC's around but I guess I have to give you a static IP address because these things don't support DHCP (Yippee!).
From excellent karma to terible karma with a single +5 funny post...
My wife is a producer for the largest NBC affiliate in the nation (and has worked for a variety of other affiliate outlets). Advertising is THE reason networks exist, and your local media outlet will NEVER run a story that may adversely affect the possibility of them generating advertising revenue. If they run a story that says company X is bad, company X will never advertise with them - hence negative story on company X will never run.
Now, your national outlets are a different story - Dateline or national news types will respond differently.
And if you don't want to "nice" the root servers, put your local ISPs nameservers first in your /etc/resolv.conf file:
nameserver 12.34.56.78 --your isp nameserver here
nameserver 127.0.0.1 --this is bind on localhost
The first nameserver will be the first on the list, and localhost is second, which will use bind to query the root servers.
This is true NOW. It was not true in August of 2002. They only just switched their policy recently. NOW, they only care about your cable modem's MAC addr. As recently as two months ago, however, they cared very much about your computer's MAC addr.
What used to happen, was you could get a broken DHCP lease, that only worked for registering with them. Connecting to anything else resulted in dropped connections. Oh, and the lease was only valid a short period of time.
Of course, this is the case in the Boston Area. AT&T Broadband exists in other areas, and may have different policies elsewhere, but I don't care about that, since I don't live there.
dont spread lies man.... it's not right.
Don't spread ignorance, man, it's not right...
There is no sig, there is only Zuul.
An Austin-based software company who targets their marketing to broadband ISPs. A friend of mine interned there last year while she was finishing out her journalism degree. Her job, if I recall correctly, was to write (like a journalism, not CS major would write) some of the webpage content and also press releases.
Essentially, their purpose is sort of like the giant installer CD that comes with your sound/video card. See, broadband ISPs, particualarly cable-based ones, don't really have their own install techs. Their guys are sub-contracted. In fact, Roadrunner's guys will have their company name and a "licensed subcontracter for Time-Warner Cable" printed on the side of their van. At least around here, there is a reasonable lead time for install, about a week, although I'm sure RoadRunner would like to speed that up, as it just leads to faster revenue/happier customers.
Anyway, it's like the Video/Sound card CDs in that it's a bunch of useless software in addition to an auto-install program that speeds up the tech's process. Rather than configure the windows PC to pull on DHCP via the NIC, and set the mail client and web browser up, the broadjump software does it for them. It also (like the vid/sound card disc) installs a bunch of other useless cruft. They allegedly had some sort of remote support program, and a MMORPG (Blood pledge, I think... It's really big in Korea) where if the customer signed up through the link on their desktop, the ISP got like a $3/month cut.
So anyway, that's their software.
- dig @a.root-servers.net . NS
That's all the above you anyone would ever need.If the original work order isn't signed - then there's no proof he ever showed up at all, and the cost of rolling the truck the second time comes outta his pay.
That's a sexy, but untrue story. It's illegal to make him pay for that second truck roll.
Now, will his bonus, likely correlated to percentage of second visits, be affected. Perhaps.
I'd recommend doing that anyway. Not because of them trying to extort more cash from you (although that's a damn good reason), but because a lot of the cable modem setups out there have the cable installer guy get the MAC address of your PC's network card to phone into the office. Why? So that not every jackass can hook up an off the shelf cable modem, fire up DHCP, get a lease, and run with it. The DHCP server only gives out an IP to the list of verified MAC addresses. Mine does this.
So if the guy had used the MAC of the router, I'd be unable to connect without the router in the loop. As it stands now, I hid the router (avoiding any cable guy questions), he used the MAC of the PC, and then later I changed the router's WAN MAC to be the same as the PC's MAC. Thus, if the router kicks off one day, I can plug that PC in directly and still have some connectivity for getting technical help on fixing it. Most all SOHO NAT router devices let you change the MAC of the WAN side. Linksys calls it "MAC Cloning" I believe.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
This is also true for Verizon (the Verizon dude told me about this last time he was here). The reason being most of their field reps now are not really Verizon employees, but are on a sort of outside contract.
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
I hear stories of how many weeks went by to get DSL working when I had Cable Model from RR ordered and working on the same day. I went to TW's RR location, picked up my Cable Modem with instructions, went home and installed it myself in 5 minutes. I've had RR's cable model for over 2 years, probably 3 by now, and I've used every Windows, Linux, and a few Mac OSes with NO problems. RR doesn't even care if you use a router, but they won't support you, which is fine by me.
I LOVE MY BROADBAND ROADRUNNER CABLE MODEL!
Well I work for an ISP that uses broadjump for our client install CD. Basically broadjump as a company specializes in making these CD's that automatically check the system and do any neccesary steps for getting your broadband connection working.
In our case the CD will install a branded internet explorer/outlook express but it's just something they whiped up with the IEAK tools so nothing too special.
The big step on our network is it will register the MAC address on our customer administration webpage. Broadjump basically builds the CD to the specifications the ISP asks for. They are simply an outsourcer that specializes in these things. On our CD there are basically 3 steps. First the CD checks the machine to make sure it meets the minimum requirements. So it checks the basics like CPU speed, free hard drive space and memory. It also verifies there is an Ethernet card and that it's bound to the TCP/IP protocol with the proper DHCP settings. If it finds any problems with these settings it will give the user the opportunity to automatically fix the error or a description of the problem so you can fix it yourself. The next step is it will install the internet explorer software. After this it does a dhcp release and renew to get an IP. It then contacts the customer administration website to register the MAC address so that the computer can get a valid IP. Up to this point the machine only has a 10.x.x.x IP address which only allows you to connect to the DHCP server, DNS server, and the online customer administration servers. After it successfully registers the MAC it does another release and renew which should give you a real IP address and it uploads a text file log of the whole process to an FTP site. The text file doesn't really contain anything terribly useful and nobody on the helpdesk ever bothers with the things. Nothing evil was included in our text file though I'm sure other ISP's may ask broadjump to include some system configuration details in their implementations. Like I said, for us it's just a log file of the steps the broadjump CD completed. If it got to the point where it succesfully uploaded the file then the connection is obviously working and at that point there isn't going to be much to say in the log file of interest.
All the steps this CD takes can easily be duplicated manually. In fact most of the time if a user calls the helpdesk because they cannot get their new connection up and running we just register the MAC address manually on the website for them. Registering this address automatically is the main reason we include the CD in the self install packages. I do recommend people unfamilear with DHCP and mac addresses to use the CD on our system, there isn't anything terribly mysterious about our broadjump cd though who knows what other ISP's ask them to implement.
In general there are only a few methods of broadband client access that users need to be familear with to get up and running manually without these CD's.
1. Plain DHCP or Static address. Most cable modems work on simple DHCP addresses. Usually the cable ISP will hack their DHCP server to only allocate a certain number of unique IP's through a single cable modem. I know the cable ISP I used to work for did this. After the first 2 IP's included in a consumer package it would just keep sending a DHCP offer of the second IP address to any additional computer that sent a request from that cable modem. The system programmer there hacked a neat little system together using SNMP and DHCP. SNMP trap would be sent to the DHCP server with the sequence number of the DHCP request and serial number of the cable modem.
2. DHCP with Mac address or hostname registration. The ISP I'm working for uses the MAC address to limit the number of IP's you can get. A web interface to register these MAC addresses is available and before you register you are assigned a private IP address in the 10.x.x.x range which only works inside a small internal network segment the DNS, DHCP, and registration server are on. I have also seen ISP's that use the hostname as a unique identifier. Usually this involves setting the name of the computer to be your ISP username to get a valid IP.
3. PPPoE. An extention of the dialup authentication model to broadband connections. Usually you will need some form of client software for these though most routers have built a PPPoE clients into their firmware. MacosX also includes out of the box support for this protocol. You will need to use a username and password to authenticate with the network to allow traffic to pass to the internet. Seems to be most popular with DSL providers probably because of their dialup heritage.
4. Custom client/logon. As seen in the roadrunner cable modem networks. A custom authentication method can be used that usually contacts a server to authenticate the user in a fashion similar in structure to PPPoE. In the case of roadrunner their client has been thouroghly reverse engineered so if you are running an alternate OS you should find a client available to keep you logged in. The proprietary method of authentication will probably become extinct as industry standard solutions are cheaper and easier for broadband providers to implement. If you are saddled by this method of authentication just check around for a third party client. It will probably provide some benefits over the standard client like automatic keep alives so your connection doesn't time out.
Hm, the physical layer of the DSL line can just be described as a MODEM kind of thing. But there are other layers in the DSL box. That's why it is a bridge and not just a modem. DSL is supposed to be able to carry many different kinds of traffic and there are many different bridging protocls that you can use with it, depending on what you DSL box can actually do. Most of the bridging is related to EthernetATM stuff. Also, PPPoE in some cases. And if your box supports an ATM outlet as well (not a lotof chance, unless you're the ISP), you are going to have to call your box a switch B}
I miss my rubber keyboard.(Homepage)
as an employee of (cable company name removed) i can tell you exactly what it does. it isn't spyware or ad-ware. i predicted when we were first told about this new tool that this story would show up on slashdot. hence i had several questions when i first got it, and even went so far as to contact a member of the development team about it.
the software has 2 major functions-
a) -secure software that allows technical support to connect (by proxy) to a remote machine to perform a myriad of tasks. it can push urls, view TCP/IP related (only) connection info in cases of slow-speed troubleshooting, and even has a function to allow the technician to troubleshoot further by using a remote VNC-like application.
this may sound scary, but read on. the software leaves no open ports, and cannot be remotely-accessed without the user activating the software (at a tech's request). the user must then manually connect to a closed server with an auth code that the tech gives. the tech connects to the server, and may be allowed any of the above tasks if authorized by the user. the customer is told clearly what will be done, and the tech explains what he/she is doing before proceeding. there are strict policies for the use of this software. the technician is not allowed to browse the hard-drive, download/install/troubleshoot any application that is not on the supported list, and is under no circumstances allowed to change anything on the user's computer without explicit permission. i can't stress this enough, in order for any kind of connection or action to take place the software will ask the user if it's ok to proceed with on-screen alerts! the user may break the connection at anytime during the process for any reason by clicking a button on the taskbar.
since the connection takes place through a single closed, proprietary server there is virtually no chance of this application being used as a backdoor. the software is hardcoded with the URL of the server, and can connect ONLY to that server and nothing else. even if someone malicious were to get a hold of the client software, without (password protected) access to the server to generate a short-time auth code for the user to type in, it's useless.
b) -a backup/restore application for tcp/ip and connection property settings. it's configured to save driver files for the NIC and USB modem devices, ip address/subnet mask and DNS property information (in cases where specified), and occasional pings and traces to the dhcp server, gateway, and dns servers along with netstat info. the software catalogues the information bi-weekly, and stores it on the hard-drive. none of this information (save the pings and traces) can be retrieved by anyone outside the system. it's mostly used for cases where the user breaks the connection by altering configuration. the backups allow the user to restore the connection settings to a previous known-working configuration.
that all.
this isn't a data-mining application. privacy was discussed in detail in software-training. i understand being cautious, (hell, i'll admit i was concerned as hell when it was first announced) but i can tell you in all honesty that the bundle on our 'easy installer' cd's contains no spyware. broadjump was contracted to write the software specifically for our use, and no 'add-on' click-tracking or cookie-scouring was allowed.
the client software is ONLY in the hands of tier-2 and above, highly-skilled, highly trained and QA/policy monitored technicians. the broad-jump software is a means to an end for technical-support. if you've had any experience supporting win9x systems you know that windows can be downright retarded when it comes to connection management. it has been an invaluable tool when faced with users who doesn't know their right mouse-button from their left. thus far it's been a huge success, customers seem to love it, it allows us to do all the work, while they just watch and keep tabs or relax as they see fit.
i knew there would be a few who flipped out over this application. but really, the only people who get up in arms about it are those who don't need it. if you're smart enough to understand what this software does, you should be smart enough to understand that there is a genuine need for it. it's the people who call tech support complaining about error 691's with their caps lock key on, or who've lost the address bar in IE who need it. if you're not comfortable with the application, uninstall it.
the odometer lives!
with some ISP's the install cd is their way of provisioning the modem so their dhcp servers will give you an IP, or let you route outside of the modem. Other ISP's just register the MAC of your modem and let the first 1 to 3 MAC's pull an IP. Sometimes it's called in by the field tech, other times it's registered with the cd
Now techs on the phone is another problem. Back when I had cable, I quickly discovered that the national helpdesk for RR was staffed by a bunch of dicks. I called them to let them know about a case of router flap that had been going on for over a week. They started giving me the wrong around about my "Windows" box being misconfigured. I informed him that I own no Microsoft products. To that he replied that everyone runs Microsoft. I laughed and said that I was one person that didn't. He asked what I ran and I replied I used a Mac. He then said something to the effect, "don't you know? Microsoft owns Apple". He also said that he couldn't see why anyone would want to use such a worthless operating system. I was starting to get a little pissed at this point. I asked if he'd say the same about my Linux boxes or my Suns. He said Sun is dead. Microsoft was buying them out. He also said that Linux was a hacker's tool and that he could have me arrested for using it. .... Now being a Mac user, I know what it's like to have my OS insulted. You don't insult a Mac guru's OS. You don't insult a Linux guru's OS either. You damned sure don't insult both in the same paragraph. If he had been there in person I would have firmly planted a Sun keyboard in his ass sideways. Since he wasn't all I could do was cuss at him and demand to speak to his super. He refused and hung up on me.
Well, I returned the favor. <g%gt; I always record my tech support calls. I dubbed a couple copies of the tape and certified USPSed them to Cox, RR, and my state AG. I also included a letter that indicated who all received a copy of the tape, summarized the coversation, gave a time and date for the call, back ground to counter the ill-informed knowledge, and finally notified them in writing of the router flap. About 4 days later, I noticed that the router flap had been fixed. A few days letter I received a letter from Cox apologizing for the problems and promising to investigate further. The next day I received a letter from RR apologizing for their employee's action and informing me that the tech was no longer with RR. Oh happy day. :-)
I've found a couple tricks when calling a tech support line that might help you. Always start off the conversation in a calm voice. Don't act pissed. Stay calm and collected. Ideally you would do this even if you felt you needed to ask for the tech's super. State your name, where you're calling from, and on behalf of what company. This is a good thing to do even if it's for you home line. Pretend the loss of access if affecting you at work. "My name is John Wayne; I'm the Network God at Such n Such Unv in Smallville, St; I'm calling to inform of that you have a case of router flap that is causing us problems downstream.". Be concise and to the point. If you think you need to drop some techy stuff to make them feel you know what you're talking about, drop big things only. Don't jargon-drop little stuff. Spend more of your time keeping everything else you say technically accurate. Don't let yourself slip up. Stay calm. Always stay calm. Say "I'm calling to inform you of a DDoS attack coming from one of your customers" not "You're DDoSing us! We're gonna sue! Our routers are melting. We're melting. ARGH!". The latter makes a bad impression. Try to maintain control of the conversation. Don't let them BS you into doing weird shit. State the facts up front. Tell them exactly what you've done to diagnose the problem. This is how I get hard drives replaced without all the reformatting bullshit. When I know the HD is bad I call them and tell them I've low-leveled it, checked jumpers, tried it in another machine, and run two bad blocks checks on it; here at the results. I've covered all their bases with the facts. All they have to do next is RMA it. Good luck!
My DSL box is a router :) It didn't come with a CD and my ISP supports linux. Ain't competition grand?
It was me, I did it, I moved your cheese
If you're concerned about spyware, be very careful about who's DNS server you list in your PC.
Should your service provider wish, he can capture Ethernet traffic specific to DNS inquiries and compile some interesting information without even needing you to install and use his client software.
We used this approach at my previous job (dealing with employee security and network use compliance... great job, eh? *sigh*) We had web proxy operating but had an occasional employee who bypassed the proxy and figured he could avoid detection as he surfed his favorite porn or gambling site. By tracking his DNS lookups (many of the sites had hidden references to sextracker.com which made it easy to spot), we'd take his URL of choice and map the DNS to monster.com or hotjobs.com - giving him the clue that continued use might be an opportunity to work elsewhere.
Sniffed properly, your provider will obtain an IP address and the Internet address being looked up (e.g. sextracker.com). He can insert the sniffer in line with the DNS server(s) to simplify data capture (rather than have to deal with inspection on a bigger network).
Should he limit DNS lookups on the same segment as his nameserver, you may be able to avoid this spying by operating your own DNS (e.g. on your dual-NIC Linux firewall) or by using an alternate DNS server.
*scoove*
1.) The Installer checks your cable lines to see what the forward and return levels are, to see if they'll work with your exisiting drop at your house-box. If everything's ok, they'll run an extra outlet, take it to the house box, and split it off as the first splitter in your box. If it's not ok, they'll re-hang or re-bury the drop, then run your AO.
2.) The Cable installer calls in the MAC address of your cable modem, so that DOCSIS can authorise your account.
3.) We plug in the cable modem in, and make sure that the Cable Modem actually lights up. Once that Cable Modem is lit, you can get a DHCP address with any DHCP client.
4.) We'd run the RoadRunner disk...it'd set up the IEAK Customizations, set up email addresses, and then do a series of tests to ensuer that everything was ok. This included a ping test, a DNS test, and tweak your TCP/IP settings for broadband.
Basically, once they bring it in, DOCSIS provides the authentication (if you're on a system that uses DOCSIS). They shouldn't need to run any software on your computer that provides authentication--it's hardware based.
I disable sigs...do you?
The point is that most internet users don't even know what an IP is
This is true, and I'll play devil's advocate a bit (since I don't see many arguing the service provider's view - even though I personally and professionally object to this level of intrusion, and also perceive an EULA to be rather unenforcable).
They don't care about linux, and they probably aren't even aware that there could be software doing "bad things" on their PC
Exactly. In fact, it gets much worse. They will demand you do things to them that are fundamentally bad... such as a medium-sized business we recently switched over that had been running a T1 with public addresses on every desktop, confidential filesharing servers (with public IPs) with IRC, RPC, NNTP, and thirty other services running, and absolutely *zero* firewalling/security/etc.
They got replaced with a rackmount Mikrotik router system and were immediately firewalled, RFC 1918 standard private IP network, etc.
Their response? Forget about thank you - nothing about complaints that they can't see things from home anymore (no, they won't buy VPN software - think cheap), can't run personal websites on desktops, open relaying on their Exchange server was "broken", etc. Oh, and to explain this to them? "We don't want to know about those details. We just want it to work the way it did before without spending more money."
Users will insist on being stupid about IP, security, etc. (I only mention this because it is part of the mindset you need to understand to see where the service provider is going to come from).
The tech did the EULA for them without consulting them
Come on... do you expect these folks to be experts about business policy? We train our guys to provide option A or B - A = installed our way, B = no install, goodbye and good luck. 90% of the customers are never an issue, but the 10% "I design websites, so therefore I'm a networking expert" types micromanage everything and work hard to screw it all up.
The contract demands the software to be installed. This is a serious problem.
Yes, and back to my clueless business example, here's why they insist upon it:
"Every time you users download something, reconfigure something, whatever, you dick up your IP settings and make me spend $50 per customer service telephone call to fix it."
By loading this software, I ensure that my configuration will probably stay on top of all the nonsense you put in there, and I can actually have a clue what is going on when you manage to screw it up still.
The alternative is $500/month broadband (minimum...), or zero support (which doesn't work, btw - people would still blame the service provider when a tornado obliterates their home, destroys their PC, and "their Internet doesn't work.")
Let's actually discuss ways to resolve it for everyone, rather than trying to make ourselves look clever.
It really comes down to one of two options:
1. Do it yourself. Know how to do all of this stuff as good or better than the service provider (and fake like you're an idiot customer with the spare Wintel box next to your connection for when you have to demonstrate the service provider has a problem).
2. Let your service provider do it all for you. Don't care to learn IP? Don't want to accept responsibility for screwing up your IP service when you load that stupid "dialup optimization" software you saw in a pop-up box, on top of a broadband PPPoE connection? (usually also spyware... ugh) Be my guest... but understand that decision comes with a price. And understand that price usually includes your service provider getting to capture all that data on you, in exchange for protecting you from your own stupidity.
The only other solution I can see is a Spyware-Free certification standard for service providers and software vendors. Establish a neutral entity, develop criteria for membership and verification, and allow people to promote that their product/service is compliant and recognized by the organization. Sort of a BBB approach to the issue...
*scoove*
Speakeasy DSL, if its available, is a good provider. They "allow" and support Linux boxes, and even provide their own gaming servers.
I haven't checked on their P2P policies, but I'd be suprised if they're draconian.
No OS or software requirements, self-install is an option, and the tech people have been very friendly, available, and intelligent.
And, currently, they're giving away an XBOX or PS2 with new accounts. Granted, you have to buy the DSL bridge for about the same amount, so its more or less a rebate, but still.
If you sign up, tell 'em Kevin Klinemeier (userid Klinemeiers) in Seattle sent you.
-Zipwow
And to clarify: NO I am NOT a Speakeasy rep. I just like their services.
I don't know which is more depressing, that 2/3 didn't care enough to vote, or that 1/2 of those that did are crazy.
We have been reading and discussing privacy in class at Portland State University. I ran across this and might give you an idea of what you as a cable subscriber could do to try to keep some privacy.
Check out
The Cable Communications Policy Act of 1984.
My book explains it this way; "A cable subscriber must be informed of any personal data collected (and when), and the use and availability there will be of such information."
I am no lawyer, but there might be something to this.. Since it is on the books.
The two things that PPPoE seems to accomplish are to give the telcos (or other CLECs) and ISPs a bit more flexibility about where to put routers - it makes it easier to terminate the PVC on a shared router at the telco POP instead of requiring either an ATM connection to the ISP or an ISP-owned router at the POP. The authentication features also makes it a bit easier to turn off service to people if they haven't paid their bills, for the case where the telco/CLEC is providing a shared router at the POP. (If the ISP has a PVC all the way back to their router, they can do the same thing by disabling the PVC in their router.)
Mostly it's ugly.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Here in SE WI, with Roadrunner, I've had it installed twice (moved once in there). The first time was a breeze, the guy was quite a geek, and we got to talking for almost an hour and he gave me all the "little extras" that a cable guy can do (and yes that did include free cable TV). Exchanged notes, and tweaked MTUs and such to make sure it was running 100%.
After my move, things went halfway to hell. First, the billing dept fucked the hell out of my account, and so my "old account" got shut off a week before it should, and they signed me up with a new contract, WITHOUT transferring anything accross. And then, the install gets somehow delayed a month, and I'm sitting on no net access for that time.
Anyways, the installer came by, and I showed him where everything was, (I had the cable already run from the drop, things hooked up and ready to go) and he took one look at my setup and flat out refused to install the service unless I disconnected my network. (which consists of 4 PCs spread around the house, guarded by a linux firewall... I just happened to use a linksys cable-router as a switch off that box -- nothing on the WAN port, but apparently he was trained to recgonize such devices -- "I'm not allowed to connect the modem to a router")
At first, he *insisted* on connecting the cable modem directly to my workstation, which has a ton of open ports/shares/would be completely vulnerable to the net. At that point I refused him all access to the machine by locking it. (he was getting impatient and starting to change settings against my judgement)
After which, he called his manager/supervisor, and went on how I'm refusing him to let him install, and ask if it's okay to leave (with all materials - cable modem) I said rather loudly that at no point did I refuse an install, but that installing with his method would not work, and would comprimise my PC in the process.
In the end, he reluctantly agreed to install to my laptop, at which point I was at the helm, and telling him that it does indeed pull a valid DHCP address (which he didn't understand, untill I went through his script step by step.. the number was the same) then he packed up and left in a huff.
So *usually* you can bypass the software installation, if you know exactly how to set up your PC beforehand, and can prove/convince the installer that the network is indeed active. All he wants from you is your signature on the contract, and not to get called in two days later from a complaint that he improperly installed a cablemodem. Some are just better about understanding "different" setups than others.
I have had experience with 2 Cable Companies(Comcast and Knology) and two installations of Bellsouth DSL. In each case, the installation was done as a self-install. Both of the cable installers checked to insure that signal was present, then let me hook it up to my linux box. One BellSouth was a new installation. They sent the modem via UPS, we hooked it up to a router that supported PPPoE, and connected after one call when we found out that they required the full email address as login name. No problems with additional software at any of these.