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Slashback: Newton, Wal-Mart, Eats
Honestly, where would they have unloaded that anyway? yorgasor writes "Yahoo reports that the stolen copies of Newton's Principia have been successfully recovered. The thieves are also suspected of other thefts from several Moscow and St Petersburg libraries."
They have everything. An anonymous reader writes "Looks like Lycoris joins Lindows and Mandrake in being preloaded for walmart.com: 'The new $199 Desktop/LX Certified MicroTel PCs include the Desktop/ LX operating system. Desktop/LX also includes the following incredible software features without any additional downloading:'"
Who needs a war? Krieger writes "I found this link to the definitive browser wars at HardOCP, where you get to play checkers to prove your browsers superiority. Taking the browser wars to a new high/low?"
Here's the hook, can you pass that sinker please ... JoeWalsh writes "According to this article, earlier this month RMS visited India and tried to convince them to use Free (as in freedom) Software. Then along comes Bill Gates this month, handing out free (as in beer) software, and suddenly India isn't interested in RMS's message. A choice quote: "We are a poor country. We cannot develop operating systems and platforms on our own." Did RMS tell them they couldn't use GNU/Linux, or is this more Microsoft propaganda at work?"
I'm very the stolen copies of Newton's Principia have been successfully recovered. I was having trouble around here without the laws of physics.
What they don't tell you in the advertising is that many of these cheapie Walmart PC's run a processor from Cyrix that VASTLY underperforms Intel/AMD chips of the same speed. Another example of how MHz/GHz are not a good measure of system performance. Also, another example of how there's no such thing as a free lunch.
I think India's rationale for going with Bill Gates offering over Richard Stallman's offering is fairly simple to explain: Bill's offering a finished product, no polish necessary, at no cost. RMS is saying you can have the greatest software in the world if you put your mind to it and pointing to a bunch of half-written software.
Which would you rather have? Just take a look at the statistics in the places where people can choose to pay for Windows or get Linux free to get an idea of why the opportunity is so tasty to India.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
play checkers to prove your browsers superiority.
/. and prove your webserver's superiority
or post on
I would like to add that i see nothing here about food. move along.
OH GOD, The Humanity!
...I wish I could convince an entire country that not paying for software is just too damn expensive.
I don't get it. Where are the "eats for the desperate computerist"?
I thought that this was a comment on something like the Dilberito.
Rustin
Data is the lever, rigor the fulcrum, brains the force that drives it all.
You know, /. has gotten things wrong before, but mixing up Checkers with Connect Four is a first.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
They are having some server problems so I have included portions from the article here
Via wins big Wal-Mart Linux PC order
C3-Cyrix-Centaur selling 300,000 PCM?
By Mike Magee: Tuesday 19 November 2002, 09:58
TAIWANESE SEMI firm Via has secured an order from massive shop Wal-Mart for two of its C3-Cyrix-Centaur X86 based processors. The Economic News reports that Via and Wal-Mart will create two budget machines running flavours of the Linux OS. There's also a plan for the chip company to make low cost sub $300 machines running Windows Eyecandy. The article claims that Medion is also set to clinch a deal with Via, while Legend and the Founder Group also use some of the C3 processors.
Help fight continental drift.
Maybe it's as simple as giving away disks with GNU/Linux already on them, verses just saying it can be downloaded. Having the disk that can be used (by anyone) to perform an install, is a lot different than having to first download a distros ISO, and burn it to a CD.
I don't know what RMS did on his trip, he may have actually tried to give disks away...
The problem is...it's probably easier to take the hand of someone offering what appears to be the quick fix, rather than reach for the life vest that someone else tossed you.
Give a hand, not a hand-out.
In a quote from the article, Bill says:
"We can save money in terms of speed of development or by being able to run on less expensive hardware."
So I guess that's why WinCE handhelds are less expensive than Palm pilots. Oh, wait, they aren't less expensive. Oh but then there is desktops. Oh wait, what about the $199 walmart PC running linux being less expensive than the Windows counterpart... Considering that Linux runs on just about anything, the "less expensive hardware" just is totally untrue. Let's see Windows XP run on a 386 with 8M ram. Nice FUD Bill.
OK, I'll supply one. Remember when that guy who draws Dilbert was going to launch a line of prepared food products for geeks... like Dilburritos, or something like that?
When things seem really bleak and hopeless, just think about what a total, colossal failure that must have been, and you'll be cheered up in no time!
- Have a picture
That article doesn't say that Wal-Mart is selling 300,000 Linux PCs per month. It says that Via is selling 300,000 C3s per month to buyers including Wal-Mart.
I hope those theves get there library cards taken of them and a 90p fine for each day they didn't return the book.
Walmart is the beginning of the end of American Middle Class. They kill a lot of small individually owned mom and pop stores when they move into a town. In the future we will all get to work for them at minimum wage and buy cheap crap from Asia. It is ironic that everyone is up in arms about M$'s behavior but is very passive about what is happening to small businesses. In my view both M$ and Walmart are predatory.
I grew up in the Fulda Gap, where did you?
Hiring (or promising) to hire a whole bunch of Indian programmers. Heck i would adopt windows on a couple of boxen if M$ decides to invest heavily in TI market..after all those people are not going to spend their whole lives working for MS...sooner or later they will move on, and presto! Inda has educated progammers with world class experience!
Live for the present, learn from the past, and dream of the future!
I don't understand how Walmart expects to sell this stuff. The price tag that is on this kind of computer will appeal to the Lowest Common Denominator customer. One that doesn't have money or the internet. So how are they supposed to buy it without internet access? And if they do buy one and when they can't run the lastest games(re:windows based games on it) they will return them. (Or pirate old copies of Windows 98 to run on them.)
Most people "in the know" would avoid them would they not? Most Linux geeks that I know would want high end equipment not cheap junk. I've got an old celeron that has trouble running X. How the heck is this going to run Lindows, lycoris or Mandrake 9?
So I can't figure out who this is marketed at? College students? First time "trailer home" computer buyers?
Some one there made a bad business move IMHO.If you have stock in Walmart I'd sell.
Slashdot, home of supporters of free software, free music, and free speech.Except for Moderators that disagree with you.
I went to that site to play a fair game of Connect Four in the hopes of getting a final answer as to which browser is truly better than the others. Unfortunately, hoodlums have logged in with multiple browsers to throw the game by playing poorly with one browser in the hopes of defeating a defenseless opponenent!
I mean, truly, who plays checker 3 to slot 1 when the opponent has opened with a classical Harvey the Wonder Hamster attack in slots 4,5, and 6!!
Outrageous! I see the only way this will ever be settled is through the time-honored (and FAR less unruly) game of Go Fish! Harumph, I'm taking my checkers and going home...
Mordor...a magical, mythical land where women are more rare than dragons--but where every man would rather find a dragon
A diplomat [or insert any M$ name here] is a person who can tell you to go to hell [or buy their products...all the same] in such a way that you are actually looking forward to the trip!
Live for the present, learn from the past, and dream of the future!
I'm = I am
The verb is present. The sentence is missing a predicate adjective/nominative. Not, as another Slashdot English whiz pointed out, an object. "To be" is not transitive (and thus taking an object).
----------
I am an expert in electricity. My father held the chair of applied electricity at the state prision.
Whenever someone says something like that I hear: "We are a very poor country. We are all dunces. We can't raise our standard of living. Therefore we will eat at the crumbs and wallow in our own pity.
It's a shame people don't respect themselves more. And it's not like php requires that much more development ability then ASP does.
-BrentSell a cheap machine and offer the possibility to several linux vendors to get their wares pre-installed. Let them compete with one another and get the best price for the software and the best software packages.
I've gotta hand it to Walmart, they have really figured out how this game should work. I realize that right now, they are offering 3 distros, but ultimately I suspect that, for support purposes it will be easier to trim it down later on. They can just let these guys fight it out for a while to see which one gets the best response from the public.
This sig has been temporarily disconnected or is no longer in service
You've foolishly overlooked a few key important points.
1. MS isn't going to offer this software to India for free forever. As soon as MS deems that they can suck India dry, they'll start charging. Now, they're simply trying to make India dependant on Microsoft, so that people there have to use MS Windows and MS Word. Later on, they'll start charging outrageous prices. Just like what drug dealers do: free to try, addictive, and then you get to pay through the wazoo.
2. Substantial costs of using Windows such as security, downtime, etc have been ignored.
3. The cost of dealing with the BSA and paying them off of they threaten to sue has been ignored.
4. If India needs Windows to do something it doesn't do, they're screwed. If they use Linux, all they have to do is hire a few programmers.
For what the government needs to do, Linux is fine -- perfect, in fact. It can install on many standard types of hardware, and it has some good GUI defaults (i.e., KDE/GNOME) along with good windowmanagers (i.e., WindowMaker). Office suites like OpenOffice are quite easy to use. If they really want MS Office, they can use CrossOver Office.
The most important point here is #1. MS is like a drug-dealer. Sure, they'll give stuff to you for free in hope of making you dependant on it. Then once they're sure you're dependant on it (and they'll do things to make you dependant on it through their updates), they start charging. Sort of like the MP3 FRAUD: let them use MP3's for free, then when everyone's using it and it'll be difficult to switch to something else, suddenly introduce royalty payments. THESE FRAUDULENT FUCKS ARE NO BETTER THAN DRUG DEALERS.
social sciences can never use experience to verify their statemen
Cartman: Tell them we'll have punch and pie.
Kyle: We're not gonna' have punch and pie!
Cartman: More people will come if they think we have punch and pie!!
- An orgy of clicking and death!
That reminds me... My Girlfriend blessed Bill Gates last night. I asked her why, and she said that He was responsible for the ubiquity of the mouse wheel and therefore for the extreme dexterity of the middle finger of my right hand.Sorry, but it's a true story.
Heh, scroll on my scrigidies. Goddamn Right.
There comes a time in every man's life when he must say, "No mother! I do not want any more Jell-O!"
..it's too bad walmart doesn't have these machines on the shelf, or at least one of them, one of the mid range models perhaps. The local walmart here you have a choice of one-an HP I believe-running xp. On the software shelf, xp. I don't see anything wrong with a low end budget computer. that's why these markets have terms like that, high end fulla blinkenlights and quad fans, down to these cheap systems. Something for everyone is a *good thing* methinks. Around here the few independent and white box shops offer almost the same low end config for around 600$ and up in a lot of cases and are getting it (when they sell them), mostly because people just don't know any better. Pickups they know, tractors they know, used or new 4 wheel buggys they know, computers, nope, microsoft=computer=it has to be expensive, and as such most people still don't have them. Just yesterday I saw one guy had a 486 bundle all used everything for 250$. I was incredulous, but I guess folks don't realize that out in the "heartland" there's not enough choice. That's the tradeoffs in a lot of matters. And it's hard to shop around and order online if you don't have a computer in the first place, yes?
I don't necessarily approve of walmart,it's business model in general, not really, but at least there's finally some effort to break the stranglehold of microsoft-only and expensive-only for computing.
My uncle wanted a computer as cheap as possible (as a 2nd PC in his house). I had him order a walmart PC with Mandrake. What he got was a decent PC with an AMD Athlon processor, 256MB Ram, 20GB hd and onboard video/sound, along with a PCI ethernet card and modem, all assembled. When I came over to help him set it up, I just plugged in the keyboard and mouse and monitor (which he already had). It was much easier than building him one, and it only cost $400. Then he said he wanted Win2k instead of Mandrake... well guess what. The walmart PC cam with a single CDROM that had drivers for all the hardware for every version of windows! So 40 minutes later, he had a full Athlon system. I didnt have to install any hardware or hunt down any drivers on the internet. Walmart is doing a good job with their PCs.
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
My "old" Celeron 366s on an Abit BP-6 have NO problem running X and generating more than 1000 frames per second when running glxgears through my Voodoo4 4500.
It's true that the Via C3 is not a modern processor design but it is PLENTY adequate for running Linux.
As for the target market for these machines, well who knows
My question is this
utter rubbish
Guess RMS didn't do his homework. MS actually got in trouble in India years ago for hiring so many Indian programmersand shipping them off to the states. India told MS their programmers are a natural resource and MS can't drain any more. So MS has built a large development facility in India. So RMS is asking India's developers to work for free, Gates is giving them paychecks.
Good job! We've recovered the loot, and placed the henchmen behind bars. Now, it's time to go after Carmen Sandiego, Gumshoe!
http://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
You see, it was like this. RMS came to our (non-descript, but *very* highly funded) university a couple of months back, evangelising on copyright misuse. The lecture theater was full to the brim of course and the audience, mostly consisting of CS grads, were quite taken by his rather impressive beard and his persistent plucking of his nose. Not to debase his talent or vision, but he has some very interesting stage-habits.
Fast forward to a couple of weeks back when Steve Ballmer made a stopover at our university. The theater, this time the largest available, was again filled to the brim. The university President shared the dais with him and we all had to register for the talk with our name and university IC No. The official reason for the registration is that seats are limited, which, in any case, was a sort of valid reason; seats were booked within two days of the announcement. Needless to say, everyone (that is, from all faculties) turned up to watch him speak.
I wasn't down at Mr. Ballmer's talk, but friends tell me that it had very little to do with the stated topic "Innovation and Entreprenuership" and more to do with X-Boxes and Tablet PC's. Ballmer's shiny scalp was, I believe, impressive, but apparently the audience found the X-Boxes and Tablet PC's more interesting.
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if someone told me that Bill Gates made a better impression on India than RMS.
More than mere navel gazing.
Think about it. This is WalMart telling Joe Sixpack that Linux is the way to go. In their words "Desktop/LX is an exciting new Linux-based operating system (OS) that offers a user-friendly, powerful and open alternative to Microsoft Windows." Hundreds of thousands of kids are going to be doing their homework on those boxes.
Cost of computer: $2500
Operating System: $40 retail
Broadband Internet: $50/mo
Owning Graphical Browsers at Connect 4 using a Text Browser: Priceless
As dubious as the origional poster's claim is... he still has a somewhat valid point. It is possible to make older systems functional under linux that simply would not be at all useful under the latest windows. Of course - Linux "cheats" - it doesn't NEED a GUI to operate.
I've given up on old 386 hardware, but I do have a 486 DX2-66 still running the latest Debian release (Unstable - currently with a Linux kernel 2.4.19). Its a very useful little machine for what I need it for. And the software is current - unlike the suggested DOS 6.22. Granted - this box could possibly handle Win95... but then, that is long past its EOL and is no longer developed. Unlike Linux.
Which brings up an interesting point. Its long been pointed out that Linux' GUI environment has had a bit of a disadvantage... XFree86. Granted, its a tradeoff. There are some advantages. But there has always been that hit on speed from a system like X Windows.
But I wonder if its beginning to not matter anymore.
As I traverse between my Linux and Windows workstations, I've always noted the performance hit for Linux. I'm a sucker for eye candy, so a great deal of that suffering is self-inflicted. But as my desktop hardware has become more powerful, and as the various cycle-sucking eye candy GUI components for Linux are improved, that difference is less and less noticeable.
The GUI is not the only benefactor here. Emulators such as VMWare and "compatability layers" like WINE/Transgaming/Crossover also enjoy the available spare cycles. Even when there is not a native port for the desired software package, running it under Linux is more often a valid option.
Sure, Microsoft has a well-deserved reputation for raising the minimal requirements for a desktop. And the mantra for Linux and its supporters has always been efficency. But in the end, it may be that Moore's Law is becoming more a friend to Linux than Microsoft.
Effecient design and constant improvement should continue to be a part of Linux development. And native applications are better than emulated environments. But it is less likely to be noticed when, for one reason or another, one is forced to rely more available cycles than the perfect ideal.
It should cause some gnashing of teeth in both the Windows and Linux camps. But the irony is that "good enough" has often been atributed to Microsoft's products. With more power in the avarage desktop, Linux may suddenly find itself the new "good enough".
MMX is integer SIMD (Single Instruction Multiple Data). These Cyrix/VIA processors have 3DNow! which is Floating Point SIMD in addition to MMX so they are more than powerful enough for playing digital video. I'd say that for a low-cost machine, they are pretty darn good value for money. BTW the 3DNow! outperforms the legacy Floating Point by a significant margin. In some cases by 300%. And no, I didn't pull that number out of my butt: libSIMD
Stick Men