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Corporate KDE
roomisigloomis writes "This article at CNET shows some headway being made in KDE development with aims at the corporate desktop. It's cool that it's funded by the German government."
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This is the same one that ousted M$ some time go, isn't it? I like that government... at least on the outside.
>the great Microsoft apps like Office, IE, and Photoshop
The greatness of IE and Office is highly debatable, and Photoshop isn't even made by MS, you moron.
is somebody else's socialism. Thank you, People of Germany, for supporting my computer updates with your tax dollers.
Good to know that there are responsible governments who make a lot better use of their taxpayer's money.
The Raven
Except for the included David Hasselhoff theme.
3.1 was very nice. Kplan looks good. But for the love of god could they please drop the name "Kroupware". Its too bad Magellan and what ever that offshoot program was didnt work out the way it was planned. KDE really need evolution. Kplan looks like it might work if only we didnt kmailcool. Yes i know Kmail is mess but why do they expect us to download another app which does the exact same thing?
The war with islam is a war on the beast
The war on terror is a war for peace
Ingo Klöcker says,
- 3.1-release-plan.htmln /en/html/index.html
Hi everybody!
The C|Net article claims that "the first elements [of Kroupware] have appeared in the new KDE 3.1"[1]. That's (unfortunately) wrong. As you can check yourself cvs was "frozen for feature commits that are not listed in the planned-feature document"[2] on July 1, 2002 while the Kroupware "project began in September."[1]. So it wasn't possible to include anything from the Kroupware project in KDE 3.1.
In particular the article claims:
"Two elements of the client work are in the new KDE 3.1, released Tuesday: the KMail software can handle encrypted e-mail attachments, and the KOrganizer calendar software can communicate with Exchange 2000 servers."
Both elements are not part of the Kroupware project.
The KMail improvements, i.e. support for PGP/MIME (RFC 3156) and S/MIME, were made by the Ägypten project[3] (which incidentally also was ordered by Germany's agency for information technology security).
The KOrganizer plugin[4] for connections to Microsoft Exchange 2000® servers was written by Jan-Pascal van Best completely independant of the Kroupware project.
Anyway, you can all look forward to KDE 3.2 which will include most (if not all) of the client side elements of the Kroupware project.
Regards,
Ingo
[1] http://news.com.com/2100-1001-982816.html
[2] http://developer.kde.org/development-versions/kde
[3] http://www.gnupg.org/aegypten/index.html
[4] http://korganizer.kde.org/workshops/ExchangePlugi
Time for a name change, I propose Germany be renamed to Kermany :).
Must send e-mail to the Kerman Kovernment.
StarTux
heh they forgot aetherea
which looks like a nice outlook clone
The war with islam is a war on the beast
The war on terror is a war for peace
I have tried 3.1 betas and release candidates, and I'd say it's definitely coming along as far as desktop usability. I've been using it as my primary desktop at home for a couple years now.
But, with 3.1, it has been an easy switch to convert my entire household to it. This conversion includes my barely computer literate wife, my 7 year old son and 3.5 year old daughter.
The Kroupware project is what will make it ultimately challenging to MS to compete. Replacing Exchange is the turning point for most corporate uses.
KDE...Kraut Desktop Environment?
-Waldo Jaquith
Looks very nice, but I'm sure that the comments are going to be flooded with comments claiming that KDE is only trying to be more like Windows. However, what people fail to see is that Linux isn't trying to replace the desktop metaphore, the conventional UI. What I've thought of Linux to be is an open, reliable, stable Windows. One created by anyone with the skill and time, for anyone. Started on the server, it didn't need big buttons and pretty colors. However now that it is being developed for everyone, the way KDE is developing just showes that it's moving in the right direction. Towards an open, stable Windows.
Does anyone else see the possibility that major OSS and specially the Linux OS will end up being managed (or controlled big time) by governments? The level of funding a government can have surpasses that of copmanies or donations. Will this have any impact on the direction development will take? Can this have any negative impact on the long run? (of course it is all advantage for the forseeable future)
the KMail software can handle encrypted e-mail attachments, and the KOrganizer calendar software can communicate with Exchange 2000 servers.
This is huge. At least for corporations that use Exchange (and not Lotus or something similiar). I've been waiting anxiously for these products to appear. I always thought the exchange-outlook component was the hardest one to break for the linux/alternative workstation OS.
I don't use KDE, so let me ask: are Korganizer and Kmail integrated so they can work together- within a same interface? Like that of Outlook?
Also...doesn't Evolution have these capabilities. I remember once reading that it would. I do use Evolution, but our company does not use Outlook, so I cannot test this.
They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself
KDE, and by ex tension the rest of Linux, is all about creating choice. When I install KDE on my Mom's old desktop, that's creating choice. When I eventually have a girlfriend, get married and have kids, all of them will use KDE--more choice! And when the German government man dates the use of KDE, once again that's more choice being created in the marketplace.
Of course, you can have both.
Don't trust the Germans, they make potato cannons.
Trolling is a art,
Hate to say this, but on a corporate desktop, I don't want to see linux. windows 2000 is very stable here at work and it is very manageable from the administration end. Plus active directory is something we use so that people from all over the country can go to any other facility, log in, and have everything work just as it did at their desk.
Anonymous Cowards - Oh God, How I hate you
People need to be careful here since US trade laws
could be used by MS against Linux with KDE since the product could be claimed to be Govt. subsidized.
There were some reports earlier that MS did exactly
this to put a stop to the NSA adding strong
security features to Linux.
Mm. I'm liking the sound of this "kiosk mode" that can disallow users of a public terminal to change settings. You wouldn't believe how often I hear someone in the university library complain that their browser has no "back" button because someone's gone and switched it off. Twelve million pounds (almost $20million) on a new library full of free-use machines, and they're all running Win98 *cringe*
KDE still can't get the Desktop menu right, though. *grins*
And don't forget that the important part - the server stuff - is of course desktop agnostic; you run kmail or evolution or whatever client you want (including outlook for windows holdouts) that supports the relevant protocols.
That is really the big part of this story; clients we have already, and others are coming along, but a free server for the small to medium organization has been sorely lacking. Let's just hope the devels realize this fully and do not do something silly like tie the server to just the KDE client stuff, or require X and KDE on the server for management.
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
I think I would consider myself an average KDE user. Most of my apps are KDE. The one thing I don't understand is those who push using GTK apps in KDE. Why reinvent the wheel? Because these wheels look and feel much better. GTK apps are some of the ugliest I have ever seen. Sure, a few, very few, seem to have all the features I may want in an app, but they look horrible, especially intermixed in a KDE desktop.
So, let's see:
evolution - absolutely hate it, kmail (particularly kmailcool) is so much better.
gaim - nice app, but I like kopete better. Heck, I even prefer Psi to it. Just for the integrated look, if nothing else.
Matter of fact, about the only non-KDE app I use on the desktop regularly is XMMS. Haven't tried it out yet, but if they remembered to remove that last lingering debug element from Noatun, I'll be using it from now on as well.
I'm sure gnome and gtk are great for some, but I can't stand the immature look and feel of them.
You might be interested then to learn of the history of photoshop
An app which was only picked 'up' by adobe due to a contract dispute after it had become succesful
before adobe photoshop 3, Microsoft obtained development of photoshop in versions 1 and 2. You can look it up if you like.
Besides, photoshop was a simple ripoff of dpaint, a program that had been released on Amiga quite a while before. interesting where the real innovations were.
windows 2000 is very stable
This I'll agree with... I haven't had any problems with Win2k at my current job.
very manageable from the administration end
Shrug... I'm not an admin, but if you can administer the entire desktop from a remote location it's certainly not apparant to our admins. Otherwise they wouldn't have to login to our PCs to install new software. Frankly, however, most of the TCO studies show Unix requiring fewer admins for a given number of machines, and Unix was built from the ground up for remote administration.
Plus active directory is something we use so that people from all over the country can go to any other facility, log in, and have everything work just as it did at their desk
Wow. Nice to see that Microsoft got that done... twenty years late.
I don't think Linux is ready for the desktop (home or corporate) yet myself (although I'd like it on mine... sigh), but not for the reasons given. Application availability and usability are bigger issues still. The latter is improving steadily, and the former is highly dependant on what you need.
Now I just need them to release KDE 3.11 for WorkKroups!
*modifies his splash*
In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
For a little insight on the KDE-Germany connection, here's a snippet from http://ktown.kde.org/~nolden/kde/README, a readme by Ralf Nolden, one of the people responsible for building KDE for debian:
The main reason to set up this repository is, amongst others, that I'm working at credativ GmbH, located in Juelich, Germany since September 2002. We are contracted to set up KDE 3.1 together with the Aegypten project (http://www.gnupg.org/aegypten/) on Debian GNU/Linux 3.0 (woody) by the BSI (Bundesamt fuer Sicherheit in der Informationstechnik), the german governmental agency for security in IT-technology. The Aegypten project itself is a development effort contracted by the BSI to enable governmental authorities to use S/MIME certifications for email communications with KMail and Mutt as email clients. The graphical user interface for Desktop use is the primary goal behind the project. The same is valid for the Kroupware (http://www.kroupware.org) project, wich implements a groupware solution for KDE with two components, the kolab server as the group-ware server component and KMail, KAddressbook and KOrganizer as client-side components. The Kroupware project is currently under development by the according companies and will be merged into KDE 3.2.
The article is wrong: the german government did not fund work on KDE, a t least not directly. A number of companies have been contracted to extend KDE for the government. As the code is GPL, they have to release it to the public.
Moderators, please be gentle...
You are obviously a troll.
Your post is well-suited for April 1, 2003.
Linux is a platform that many for-profit people have contributed to. Linux is a non-profit contribution that "fertilizes a medium" to allow a for-profit application of any software that operates upon it. Think of Linux as a system where everyone is in different branches of software development and client usage, and people can choose to contribute their software-work to be of benefit from eachothers work: linux is a form of people being KIND to eachother.
I administer computer networks, I use pppd as well as various utilities and tools licensed by GNU and XFree86. Time is an investment; because you see no physical money doesn't mean you see no ivestment. When companies like IBM, Sun, SGI, and the uncountable others begin merely *L@@KING* at Linux, they are actualy *INVESTING* their time (money) into it. Microsoft, I believe, has invested MORE time in Linux than any company alive! Microsoft knows its enemy: it is Linux; and they are studying it for weeknesses and obviously Microsoft has decided to slander and publish libelous documents on Linux because they see it as a verry PROFITABLE MEDIUM for software growth yet it is young in its acceptance of the CASUAL DESKTOP MARKET which is where Microsoft has dominated by monopoly-tactics. Just as Ghandi has prophetized to the world...
First they ignore you,
Then they laugh at you,
Then they fight you,
Then you win (3. PROFIT!)
But I'm sure you already Gnu that.
Shouldn't the title of this post be "Korporate KDE"?
Get Firefox!
If you've never used a fully integrated GUI environment, it will be hard to appreciate what KDE is trying to accomplish on the desktop.
KDE's strength is in the integration. KDE is not about being yet another window manager, but was meant as a holistic answer to the desktop problem. A KDE desktop is meant to be a collection of integrated applications with predictable, uniform behavior. You will see the same file dialog (with URLs and bookmarks), print dialog, toolbar editor, font chooser, color picker, help infrastructure, address book, and predictable cut and paste. Sharing of components means familiar behavior throughout, such as the file manager embedded in the file open dialog or the image viewer embedded in the file manager. When you open a file, the dialog remembers the bookmarks and frequently used directories you used in other KDE apps. In other words, the KDE experience provides a uniformity, familiarity and predictability that goes well beyond mere theming or toolkits. This is good for beginners.
What you get when you mix apps is the usual jumble of X apps doing their own thing in their own way. Apps do not remember your favorite colors, your print settings, your favorite directories. It's the familiar X desktop: a Frankenstein collection of apps not quite fitting together. Red Hat 8's superficial skinning does nothing about this. "KDE" is reduced to being an oversized, slow window manager: nothing more. It is not really KDE. Why would anyone want to use that?
I'm under no delusion that KDE is quite there yet. But some day, the major KDE apps will be merely good enough for everyday use. If they are merely adequate, the overall integration will offer a major advantage over non-KDE apps that can put them over the top for all practical purposes.
Another excellent article that includes a tutorial on the new KDE kiosk framework:
http://www.linux-mag.com/2002-11/kde_01.html
Very well put. This is the true shining star of the KDE project. I find it funny that RedHat would relegate KDE to a regular window manager when the RedHat developers are very involved with the GNOME usability standards which emphasize the benefits of all desktop applications working and feeling the same way.
> Is KDE feeling their testicles squeezed by Ximian pushing gnome on the Desktop?
Hmm.. KDE is not a company. KDE developers (usually) work on what they like to hack on.
> What does the German Goverment get out of this anyways?
Perhaps a complete workgroup solution?
Things like evolution are cool, but it's far from a complete solution. It only provides the frontend. This project provides both the frontend and the backend (servers).
I guess that's what the German Government needed.
Of course, what you say would make a modicum of sense if KDE (or GNOME) had the goal of "put[ting] in place a gigantic, sluggish infrastructure and try to force everything to use the same libraries".
Since they don't, your comment is basically handwaving.
The goal of these desktops is to provide the infrastructure needed to make application development simpler, nicer.
For example: Suppose Quanta was not a KDE application. Now imagine a webmaster wants to use Quanta to edit pages on a website.
Since that is a very necessary feature, Quanta would have to implement some sort of ftp client. And perhaps also a scp/sftp client, a webdav client, and so on for every mechanism it wanted to support.
But... luckily Quanta *is* a KDE app. So, it got all that for free. And if tomorrow someone writes a mechanism to access any other remote site, Quanta will get it too.
Mind you, that is only one example of many, showing how infrastructure is sorely needed. Lack of it leads to poor applications.
If you are running the gentoo build of KDE3.1 there is a good reason why the media player(s) don't work. There currently is no updated version of the Xinelibs in portage which is required by KDE3.1 Therefor it has been disabled. (See the ebuild file, or forums.gentoo.org for more info.) I was kinda bummed about this, but look forward to when I can try this functionality out.
A couple of people have said this, but I can't find anything in the GPL that says the code has to be released to the public. It's only if you distribute binaries that you need to also include the code.