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PowerBook, Because Lives Are On The Line

WCityMike writes "Major Shawn Weed, an intelligence planner with the Third Infantry Division, eschewed his Panasonic Toughbook because it wasn't fast enough in processing giant satellite and reconnaissance images. He put in a requisition for and received a PowerBook G4, the only Apple currently being used in the entire Middle East theater. 'Frankly, lives are in the balance here, so the quicker I can get stuff done accurately, the better,' Weed says."

49 of 150 comments (clear)

  1. Bullet Proof by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    AND you can stop bullets with the case!

  2. You think Apple's prices are high? by Nipsy356 · · Score: 5, Funny

    If the military can pay thousands for a toilet seat, imagine what they paid for a PowerBook.

    1. Re:You think Apple's prices are high? by rampant+mac · · Score: 4, Insightful
      "If the military can pay thousands for a toilet seat, imagine what they paid for a PowerBook."

      Oddly, I'm going to attempt to explain this...

      Most of the equipment that the Armed Services pay "too much" for aren't your run-of-the-mill items. It's not like they can run out to Home Depot and pick up a crapper capper.

      We have tie hooks that are rated at 2 or 3 thousand pounds, yet are made of titanium, to keep weight down as much as possible.

      Imagine designing that same item in your garage. How much would it cost if you had to make such item from scratch, with a guarantee that the item would work as intended, under such extreme circumstances? Factor in the engineering, labor work, logistics, and planning and see how much a "simple" item like a titanium tie-down hook (with a 2k weight rating & MTBF rate of 1000 flight hours) would cost.

      --
      I like big butts and I cannot lie.
    2. Re:You think Apple's prices are high? by Nipsy356 · · Score: 5, Interesting
      I can understand inflated prices on aircraft parts. I can understand inflated prices on boomers. I can understand inflated prices in missile control silos.

      However, aside from the fact that the initial post was intended to be humorous, the military spending is still out of control, and full of pork.

      From: Price Trends for Defense Logistics Agency's Weapon System (GAO November 2000), which found that between 1997, and 1998, prices of 2,993 different spare parts purchased by the military increased over one thousand percent, and 14 percent of the total spare parts ordered from defense contractors increased at least 50 percent in price in that one year. Contractors have been underbidding the prices, then jacking up the prices upon time for billing. Parts like a bolt, initially quoted at $40, ended up being $1,887, or a self-locking nut, quoted at $2.69, ended up costing $2, 185. These are not nearly the worst examples of cost increases . . . A linear microcircuit, original 1997 price $0.11 cents, cost $5,788.76, thermal insulation that really cost $1, ended up costing $3,390, or the boss nipple, costing $1, cost the US military $1,498.48.

    3. Re:You think Apple's prices are high? by nettdata · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Also, there are SOME projects that don't even have a budget so they don't show up on the radar screen, if you know what I mean.

      The costs for these "other" projects are absorbed and hidden by other purchases in some cases.

      This means that when they're paying $1,000 for a $20 hammer, they're only paying $20 for the hammer, and the rest is being used elsewhere.

      --



      $0.02 (CDN)
  3. It's not ruggedized. by More+Karma+Than+God · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The article says it's been fine so far, but sooner or later the lack of military-grade durability is going to be a factor.

    --
    Go here to create your own Slashdot dis
    1. Re:It's not ruggedized. by C0LDFusion · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Perhaps you guys missed the demonstration where the Powerbook G4 was run over by an 18-wheeler, then it backed up (over the powerbook) and ran over it again...then someone walked up, picked it up and started it up fine? I've seen it done, and I've never met anyone who has had physical damage disable a powerbook, except when the LCD was directly struck (while it was open).

      --
      Only in slashdot are posts of solidarity modded at -1 Redundant, while posts of antagonism are modded as -1 Flamebait.
    2. Re:It's not ruggedized. by Tumbleweed · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It depends on what kind of environment the guy's using it in as to whether it even needs to be ruggedized. If he's in a nice C&C type area, there's precious little need for a ruggedized computer. I'd say the guy probably knows his needs better than anyone on Slashdot does. As mentioned in the article, the military buys computers in bulk, rather than specific to individual needs, so I'd bet a great many of those ruggedized machines aren't needed in a ruggedized form factor. Which also means they could save some money if they used a bit more fine-grained needs analysis. But hey, that's the military for ya. Sure, the regular machine may only be a PIII-800MHz, but it'll stop a bullet! :)

    3. Re:It's not ruggedized. by usr122122121 · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Yes, but remember that Iraq is a desert. Do you want your military equipment to end up like this? Baked Apple
      Considering it still booted just fine after being stuck in a 400 oven for 20 minutes, I think it can withstand desert temperatures for longer...

      then again, who knows.

      --

      -braxton
    4. Re:It's not ruggedized. by jericho4.0 · · Score: 4, Insightful
      In the desert, it's not about heat (although that is a problem) it's about sand.

      Sand and dust gets into every single nook and cranny. The non-moving parts might last a long time, but his DVD drive will be toast if he uses it too much. Same with the hinge of the screen.

      --
      "A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
    5. Re:It's not ruggedized. by C0LDFusion · · Score: 5, Funny

      his DVD drive will be toast if he uses it too much.

      New Army officers directive: Do not watch pr0n during sandstorms?

      --
      Only in slashdot are posts of solidarity modded at -1 Redundant, while posts of antagonism are modded as -1 Flamebait.
    6. Re:It's not ruggedized. by lightflyer · · Score: 5, Informative

      I have had a Ti G4 for about 8 months. It has not stood up to travel and mobile use at all well. It has had the CD unit replaced (under warranty); currently it does not charge the battery and that will be fixed when I get back to somewhere that has a Mac repair facility; it did not do at all well to operating in high temps; the case is malformed, the paintwork does not stand up to normal use and the hinges are fragile, plus the screen ripples (despite being carried inside its own protective case inside a large carry-on and always carried with me). Overall, it is a good looking but quite fragile piece of kit.

      On the other hand I had a G3 Wallstreet for 5 years and it looked and operated as good as new at the end when I passed it on. I wish sometimes that I still had it with me.

      Apple puts out lovely stuff but sometimes design flair and form is not sacrificed to necessary function. I will have to think very hard before I spend so much money again on a Mac beauty. And don''t get me started on function versus form of the iPod. I'll wait until a degree of everyday ruggedness is built in again for my next Mac laptop.

      I wish the US military all the best and hope they go with Mac. But . . .

    7. Re:It's not ruggedized. by usr122122121 · · Score: 2, Informative
      Stuck in a 400 degree oven that was turned off for 20 minutes, you mean.
      RTFA. The oven was on.
      --

      -braxton
    8. Re:It's not ruggedized. by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I've had TiBooks for two years (a 400 and a 550) and they've both stood up fine in travel and mobile use.

      In fact after 1 year of using the 400 everyday at home and work and transporting it back and forth, and taking it back and forth across 1,500 miles in MR-2s and United Airlines 737s the person I sold it too thought it was brand new.

      I've always used either a Burton DJ bag - http://www.burton.com/gear/pr_bags.asp?productID=6 51

      Or an Oakley Computer Bag - http://www.oakley.com/ostore/apparel/spring_02_com puter_bag/

      I also use a piece of foam between the keyboard and screen.

      After two years my laptops have gotten a few little scratches.

  4. Military Intelligence by Kalak · · Score: 5, Funny

    Major Shawn Weed, an intelligence planner with the Third Infantry Division

    So he's in military intel? Isn't this among the most famous oxymorons in existence? The jokes are too numerous to mention, all with Apple or the Army as the brunt of the jokes.

    I can see the switch ads now...My name is Shawn Weed and I find Iraqis in the desert.

    btw, I'm not trolling. I'm writing this from a TiBook using an Airport, behind a Linux server.

    --
    I am, and always will be, an idiot. Karma: Coma (mostly effected by .hack)
    1. Re:Military Intelligence by apple-marc · · Score: 3, Funny

      So he's in military intel? Isn't this among the most famous oxymorons in existence?

      With "Microsoft Works" coming a close second...

  5. Is this a good idea... by cuyler · · Score: 4, Funny

    Although I'm an avid mac fac I always thought the glowing apple on the back of the LCD screen would be a bad thing in the field.

    1. Re:Is this a good idea... by dhovis · · Score: 4, Funny
      Two words....

      Duct Tape!
      --

      --
      The internet is the greatest source of biased information in the history of mankind.

    2. Re:Is this a good idea... by doooras · · Score: 3, Interesting

      funny thing about duct tape... this is from an article i read last week in either the NY Times, WSJ or USA Today, don't remember which.

      Duct tape was originally developed for military use to keep water out of ammo cases, and it was called "duck tape"

      It wasn't called "duct tape" until the 70's when some company advertised it as such, and it stuck.

    3. Re:Is this a good idea... by quintessent · · Score: 4, Funny

      Don't worry. They replaced the apple with a glowing camouflage design.

  6. Heh, Weed by Satan's+Minion+666 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Would you trust an intelligence officer named 'Weed?' Heh, no wonder he wants an Apple product.

    --
    I am Law! You are Crime!
    1. Re:Heh, Weed by bjpirt · · Score: 2, Funny

      surely the dude would get a dell

  7. Army vs. Navy by MrWa · · Score: 2, Funny
    This quote definitely makes me regret my decision to join the Navy over a dozen years ago:
    "The problem with computers in the Army is they are bought by the gross and not necessarily purchased to accomplish certain functions. The Army doles out laptops in the same way we dole out boots, tents or any other class of supply."

    In the Navy, the only they doled out were annoying uniforms and silly hats.

  8. With my luck... by (H)elix1 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'll be the one pulling the laptop out from underneath the Major's corpse trying to figure out where the heck is the second mouse button went. Faster/better/different is great until you have to take over someones job unexpectedly. More of an occupational hazard in his area... though the Valley is not much safer (job wise).

    1. Re:With my luck... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Fortunately, Macs are damn near infinitely easier to figure out how to operate than PC's. Seriously, the chance that a rear eschelon intelligence officer is killed and some random soldier without the wits to launch Photoshop will take over for him is pretty slim. In the mean time, he's going to get his work done quickly enough to save lives (US soldiers and Iraqi innocents.) Any replacement qualified to interpret satallite imagry has their own equipment. In a pinch, anyone qualified to interpret satallite imagry is a little more capable with a computer than your average potato peeler. As a former US Army Ranger and RATT rig operator, I'm not comforted that your platform bigotry extends so far that it has you placing more importance on some tired two button mouse arguement than on people's lives.

    2. Re:With my luck... by befletch · · Score: 2, Informative

      OT, but...

      I'll be the one pulling the laptop out from underneath the Major's corpse trying to figure out where the heck is the second mouse button went.

      Then just plug in a standard USB two button mouse and be done with it. I'd recommend a scroll mouse, personally.

      I'm using a Logitech optical scroll mouse right now on my iMac. No drivers to install or anything. The right button brings up context menus on just about anything, and AppleWorks is the only program I have that doesn't respond to the scroll wheel.

      I love the look and feel of the Apple 'Pro Mouse', and I'd pay Apple $50 for a two button scroll wheel version, but I'm perfectly happy to put up with this one piece of ugly beige plastic to get its superior functionality.

      --
      If you say, "now I'll be modded down because of X", I'll happily oblige.
    3. Re:With my luck... by Twirlip+of+the+Mists · · Score: 2, Funny

      I'm pretty sure if you don't already know how to use a Mac and the relevant software, the best thing you're going to be able to do with that PowerBook is brain the nearest enemy soldier with it.

      In which case, yes, the Panasonic would have been a better choice, being that it's both bigger and heavier than the PowerBook. But you've gotta make some compromises, you know?

      --

      I write in my journal
    4. Re:With my luck... by (H)elix1 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Fortunately, Macs are damn near infinitely easier to figure out how to operate than PC's.

      That was not the point I was trying to make - for Photoshop on a laptop, it is easier and faster than most of the alternatives - but it is different - menu behavior specifically. I traveled with a Tadpole (sparc based laptop running Solaris) for a while. We all ran the same app server / ldap / database, but most of the SE's were lost trying to start things up as soon as they saw it was not Windows (or Linux for that matter). With gobs of RAM I was able to get more work done than the others who had to drag around multiple standard issue Dells that had a physical limit of 512M RAM at the time. When I got pulled into another project leaving my environment (which was a fair mimic of the production system), chaos ensued. Solaris was just enough of a curve ball to miss the deadline. It is not like they were not qualified, the tools were just a bit different.

      In the mean time, he's going to get his work done quickly enough to save lives (US soldiers and Iraqi innocents.)

      This is a bit of a straw man, but I'll bite. The reality is the US Forces have a limited budget. More lives could be saved by having better satellite uplinks, better lenses on the recon equipment, tanks that went faster on less fuel, more powerful targeting lasers... the list goes on and on. Every standardization is a compromise somewhere down the line. You are a former RATT operator, so why did they not hand everyone an updated set rather than tuning both the old and new series so they could co-operate? Budget would be my guess. I suspect your CO would also have you peeling potatoes if you swapped personal equipment for older gear 'because it would save lives'.

      I'm not comforted that your platform bigotry extends so far that it has you placing more importance on some tired two button mouse arguement than on people's lives.

      Again - this is not about mac's sux, bill rulz! In an environment where you have to work with a fluid team, you cannot always select what you consider the perfect tool for the job.

      Damn mods smoking crack again...

    5. Re:With my luck... by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As you say, you cannot always select what you consider the perfect tool for the job.

      This case, however, is an exception, one of the times where Weed *could* select what he considered the perfect tool for his job.

      You have to trust his judgement, since he's the one out in the desert doing his photo-manip stuff (probably), and as such, if his need for a PowerBook will let us win, and the military agrees, it's really out of our hands other than to backseat drive.

      The issue here is that we're comparing a 1.8GHz (max) P4 to a 1.0GHz G4, where the speed delta is small enough that cache, ram, Altivec, and code optimization might make a difference. I mean, we don't know how fast the Toughbooks they can get, they may possibly get 1.3GHz P4s, or 1.2GHz P3s, in which case the performance/benefit analysis is much different than if they could get 3.0GHz P4s.

      Also note, I think there's ram limitations; a G4 can get 1.0GB, I don't think the Toughbooks can. And a Toughbook actually costs more, to the public, than a G4.

      Now, could he have gotten a Dell instead? Sure. However, he is also most comfortable with a Mac; he *knows* he can get his job done with the PowerBook-at this point then, we have to trust him that he is performing his soldierly duties, and performing them well.

  9. It does make some sense... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...to have at least one of the computers different from the others. When a virus written by some 9th grader wipes out the Windows boxes at least the PowerBook will be up and running.

    Or vice versa...

    It also kinda goes with the whole "Power of One" ad campaign the Army has going on.

    Used to be SSG Nichols

  10. Hey, it still worked. by Hanji · · Score: 2, Informative

    I think you may have just proved yourself wrong ... The Baked Apple still worked after being baked, so the PowerBook should be able to easily stand up the much lower temperatures of the desert.

    --
    A Minesweeper clone that doesn't suck
  11. Re:I sure hope he's using MacBibbie... by crhalpin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Oh yes, and we also all know that benchmarks are the be all and end all of performance evaluation. Especially those benchmarks that conform to no known standard, and aren't terribly well documented.

    Please, spare me.

    Benchmarks can give you a general idea of how performande might compare if you used exactly the same programs, input files, OS configuration, network load, other running processes, etc...

    What are the chances that the military uses Photoshop for their image processing? I'd think not very high (unless there's a series of photoshop plugins I am unaware of that will process an image looking for convoys of trucks, bunkers, and other such things that the military cares about satellite images for). If he is not using photoshop, then the benchmarks you're getting so excited about are meaningless.

    MacBibble has shown us that a Macintosh can perform quite well on image processing, if you run optimized code.

    Benchmarks are just that, benchmarks. If this guy finds that for his application a Macintosh is faster, then let him use a Macintosh.

  12. Mac fanatics take over the military! by Smack · · Score: 3, Funny

    "In a room full of ugly, ruggedized Panasonic Toughbooks running Windows 2000," he said, "the glowing white Apple against the titanium skin of the G4's lid draws looks from everywhere, and acts as a magnet for the closet Mac addicts serving with the Third Infantry Division."

  13. Ok serious question by Holi · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If the military is using intel equipped notebooks running windows 2000, then changing from his too slow but rugged notebook to a powerbook I would tend to think he is using some off the shefl commercial app. Why? because I really doubt the military would spend the time or effort to redevelop some custom app for processing satellite images just so one Major can run non-standard equipment. Infact it is rare that the military will let anyone use non-standard equipment in a critical position. So I tend to think this guy is probably not in a critcal position and may actually be in some PR department in the army where he may be using Photoshop or the like to touch up images for dispersal to various news organizations.

    --
    Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
    1. Re:Ok serious question by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 4, Interesting

      There's no reason he couldn't be doing imagine manipulation, enhancement, and analysis using Photoshop; so long as the image is in a standard image format (and why not?), it's just pixels and filters.

      I mean, even if it's just simple stuff:
      Overlays of two images taken in different spectrums (IR and visible)
      Time-lapse animation (multiple layers transformed into an animation, not unlike an animated GIF)
      Edge detection/feature enhancement
      Cropping to remove useless data
      Rotation, perspective, and skewing to transform poorly captured or framed images into more easily understood images
      Overlay of before/after shots (perhaps using difference blending)
      Comparison of two different photos with an identical feature (perhaps identifing buildings, known vs unknown, performed again with overlays and blends)
      Scaling of a photo so a comparison to a similar photo, taken with different settings, can be accomplished
      Enhancement of a photo to compensate for low light levels (levels, etc)
      Normalization of a photo (perspective, levels, colors, scale) so comparisons between two different photos can be accomplished

      All of those are trivial with Photoshop.

    2. Re:Ok serious question by nettdata · · Score: 3, Interesting

      And of course, I just thought of something...

      It'd be interesting to see what software he's using since he can do the same job on both the Winows 2000 and the OS X platform... I wonder if it IS photoshop that they're using, of if it's some internal military app?

      If it was some internal, special app, maybe it's been ported to both Unix and Windows, meaning the OSX box just had to recompile it.

      Maybe all he did was install Fink and then recompile the thing, and now it works. Wouldn't THAT be a story!

      In a way it'd be kind of boring to think that all he did was use Photoshop. *sigh*

      --



      $0.02 (CDN)
    3. Re:Ok serious question by BWJones · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I'll answer this for you.

      You certainly *can* use Photoshop for many of these functions and I know/have used it for these purposes. Photoshop is one of the most powerful applications in the history of computing for its intended purpose. In addition, there is other software that performs specific GIS functionality (image classification, image registration etc...) on OS X. Some of it written *by* folks in the U.S. Army, the NRO and NIMA.

      --
      Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
  14. What's the guys address? by krray · · Score: 2, Funny

    Poor lonely guy in the field. I'd be more than happy to send him a Disney covered DVD with prOn. He'll work late every night too!

  15. Durability, then vs. now? by JMZorko · · Score: 3, Interesting
    A couple of years ago, my brother called me up and said "do you want an iBook?" I said "Sure, what's up?" His story was that a friend of his got it when he enlisted in the Army, he was discharged early for some reason and got to keep it, and he needed $$$ so he sold it to my brother, who gave it to me. I don't know if this story is true, but the iBook had OS9, 96MB RAM and the Airport card. This was the original tangerine 300mhz model.

    So I pose, if this is true, and the Army buys computers in bulk for general-purpose use without regard to what applications they might be used for, a.) why they chose the iBook then, and b.) why they didn't this time. Are the old iBooks somehow more durable than the new (they're definitely a lot heavier)?

    Regards,

    John

    --
    Falling You - beautiful
  16. Re:actually, its a moot point by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 4, Informative

    Um... well, the fastest Toughbooks out there are like 1.8GHz P4s.

    If he's utilizing Altivec optimized code (quite possible), it's quite possible that his 1GHz PowerBook can outperform a 1.8GHz P4.

    Which tasks are Altivec optimized? Photoshop, for one. Certain encryption/decryption tasks are another. Certain video tasks, as well.

    It's certainly within the realm of likely possibility, given the description that "Weed declined to specify what he does exactly, but said he works with giant satellite and reconnaissance images,"

    Sure, a P4 is fast but when you're talking about a 800MHz difference, the other things (like cache, registers, Altivec, pipeline depth, etc) make more of a difference.

    Now, if they were talking about 2.4GHz P4Ms or 3.0GHz P4 (desktops), that would be different. However, Toughbooks don't scale that fast (yet).

  17. Not the only... by Dak+RIT · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Actually it's not the *only* PowerBook G4 being used here right now. I've got an 867MHz PowerBook G4 I bought back in July 2002 that I am using while stationed in Camp Va, Kuwait. I use it for very similar reasons to Major Weed, although I had to purchase mine myself.

    1. Re:Not the only... by mcwetboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I've got an 867MHz PowerBook G4 I bought back in July 2002

      Very interesting, since the first 867-MHz PowerBooks were released in November 2002. Or did you mean 800 MHz? (Hate to nitpick, but you did mention these details.)

  18. The New iPod Fatigues by Cheesewhiz · · Score: 3, Funny
    This is what I've been telling people all along -- Apples save lives.

    We've got to get our troops as many of these new uniforms as we can. Do it for little Jimmy American on the front lines, darnit!

    (Nothing like a little ruthless self-promotion to get a day started right!)

    --

    -----
    "Cogito Eggo Sum: I think, therefore, waffle."
  19. matched set...best choice by djupedal · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think what you've 'seen' is anecdotal.

    Since we don't know exactly what his 'mission critical' tasks are, exactly, we have to take his word for why he chose a G4. It sounds like this guy already has reason to trust his choice. After all, it's not just the hardware nor just the software...it's the combination, and in this case, they are strictly made for each other. I know of no other examples that come close...

  20. Apple makes it easy for the govt to buy by daveschroeder · · Score: 4, Funny
    Q: If the military can pay thousands for a toilet seat, imagine what they paid for a PowerBook.

    A: About the same as Apple's academic discounts!

    Apple Federal Home Page

    How to buy for federal agencies and miltary - Includes:

    Using a GSA SmartPay purchasing card

    Apple Federal Store (for SmartPay) or Apple Retail stores

    Federal Employee Purchase Program, via Apple Federal Employee Purchase Store or Apple Retail stores at Tyson's Corner, Clarendon, VA, or Towson, MD

    Any number of various federal, GSA, and military contract resellers

  21. Major Weed / Mac by BobWeiner · · Score: 4, Funny

    Cool that he's using a Mac. If Saddam's forces defect over to our side, will that make them switchers? :)

    Bob

    --
    The PC Weenies: 11 Years of Online Tech 'Too
    1. Re:Major Weed / Mac by Trurl's+Machine · · Score: 3, Funny

      Cool that he's using a Mac. If Saddam's forces defect over to our side, will that make them switchers? :)

      The muezzin, he sounded like weep, weep, weep. I wanted a drink and I couldn't have one. Islam is a dry religion. It was kind of bummer. Now I respect the American Way Of Life. And I have better drinks. My name is Osama and I am a logistics consultant.

  22. Beauty of the Mac... by MacAndrew · · Score: 3, Funny

    If you used it to brain your enemy, it would STILL work AND would be simple enough for the debrained enemy to operate.

    So there. :)

    I'm most impressed not that this guy wanted a Mac, but that he actully got one. The military is rightly known for a plodding mentality, and what's he going to do if he needs an extra battery? Steal it from CNN? Of course, had the guy simply called Apple to say, hey, I'd like to place the first Mac in the field, they would have sent over ten gratis.

    Clicking away on my deweaponized iBook...

  23. Lives are "on the line"? by Zhe+Mappel · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Excuse me?

    Most of the planet is up in arms about this invasion of Iraq and the declared intent by Washington to make no part of Baghdad safe (at the inevitable expense of untold numbers of citizens). And this trained killer says lives are "on the line"?

    Correction: lives are about to be wasted, made trash, disposed of, terminated. Let's at least be honest about that much.