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Palmtop NetBSD
BSD Forums writes "'Of course it runs NetBSD.' NetBSD is fantastically portable, but that doesn't make it supremely easy to install on oddball hardware like a Dreamcast or a palmtop computer. Michael Lucas demonstrates cross-installation with the HP Jornada."
For something... but I don't know what, and I don't think that matters to them, either.
BSD is alive an well. Why does everyone keep saying it is dying?
Does anyone know of a linux or BSD based distro that will install on an old Palm Pilot? Not the III or V lines, the original lines. I've got one just sitting around. I've already got a replacement for it I just want to play around with it. Does anyone have any links for instructions on installing Linux (or any other OS) on them?
"For a successful technology, honesty must take precedence over public relations for nature cannot be fooled." -Feynman
Palmtop NetBSD
/usr/src/sys/arch/hpc/stand/binary/ARM/hpcboot.exe .uu. If you have trouble with uudecode, Google led me to a variety of places from which it could be downloaded. Get the boot loader hpcboot.exe and save it for later. Don't worry about the kernel linked from that page; we'll build our own kernel.
/usr/src ./build.sh -m hpcarm -T /
by Michael Lucas
06/05/2003
In my previous article, I discussed building the latest NetBSD-current and installing it on your system. Today, we take things a little further and use NetBSD's cross-building abilities as a tool to install it on a rather unusual platform â" specifically, the HP Jornada 728 palmtop, which comes with Windows CE (WinCE) embedded. While HP no longer makes this device, you can pick them up used or on auction sites. The process discussed here uses examples from the Jornada 728, but with some tweaking will work on many other types of hardware. You could even install onto standard PC hardware in this manner, if you wanted to be masochistic about it.
Setup
This method requires that you already have a NetBSD machine that can physically accept the disk device you want to install onto, and that has the same sort of disklabel(8) as the Jornada, which means that you need the same endian hardware. You're probably best off running standard X86 hardware for this type of installation on this type of palmtop. In this example, I use a Toshiba laptop running NetBSD-current 1.6P to install NetBSD-current 1.6P on my Jornada. I'm using a 512MB flash card to run NetBSD, and am using a PCMCIA adapter to attach the flash card to the laptop during the installation phase. If you're using a desktop, you could use a USB-to-Flash adapter.
Running NetBSD on your Jornada will erase all data from the WinCE operating system. That's OK, because you'll never boot back to Windows once you discover the joys of palmtop UNIX, right? Still, you might want the WinCE data some day, so be certain to back up your device before starting this install! Some people who switch boots between WinCE and NetBSD use the backup tool that comes with WinCE to back up their data to the FAT partition on their flash card. If you do this, be sure to use only the backup tool that came with the Jornada, not a newer version.
NetBSD runs on a whole bunch of hardware that was never intended to run UNIX, so this install isn't really anything special. Each of these unusual platforms has its own unique requirements, which are generally documented on the appropriate port page for that architecture. Check the port page for an instructions document, which in this case is the Using NetBSD/hpcarm page. The directions may be partially obsolete, as code development frequently outpaces the web documentation. Still, it's a good place to start. Also search the mailing list archives for your chosen platform for other people's experiences installing and running NetBSD on that system. Lastly, you'll want to be certain that NetBSD runs on your system â" for example, while the Jornada 720 and 728 are well-supported, the Jornada 820 isn't yet.
Bootstrapping
The how-to-use page for hpcarm shows that you need a kernel and a boot loader that runs in the WinCE environment. At this time the page also mentions a root filesystem image, which is not yet available. The only piece you really need to get at this point is the hpcarm boot loader, which is available as a uuencoded file in the NetBSD source tree at
Now go to your existing NetBSD system. We covered the basics of building NetBSD in the last article, including getting the source code and using the build.sh building system. As each platform has its own compiler requirements, make(1), and so on, we need to start by building these tools for the hpcarm architecture. Here, we use the -T flag to specify where to put these tools, and the -m flag to specify the type of machine for which you're building.
# cd
#
When will somebody port it to my TI-89 calculator machine. It has a MC68k processor in it.
People have done similar installations on Windows CE devices for awhile. For example, I run NetBSD 1.6 on my IBM z50, also with a 512MB Compact Flash card. The only difference is that this installation was done entirely from a NetBSD mothership while I installed from a FreeBSD ftp server I set up.
See, this is the thing I've never understood - why would you install *nix/BSD on a palmtop? Most of the apps out there are not designed for such a small screen - I've experienced the pain of XWindows on a 640x480 screen - And there's such a huge base of apps out there already. Mind you, I prefer the Palm OS over WinCE, and 99% of what I want / need in a PDA is already available.
I can't see the benefits of this. In my mind, it's like tearing out the upholstery of your car, and replacing it with gravel. Sure, the car's still usable, but it's not comfortable to use, and it looks like crap.
-- Karma is for people who think they matter.
When asked to comment why he wanted to install BSD on a Palmtop, Michael Lucas responded 'The Devil made me do it'
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You couldn't fit the kernel into ram, much less enough to do anything useful.
If you want it bad enough, steal the PDP11 UNIX source from SCO and port that. BSD or Linux will never fit.
You can't judge a book by the way it wears its hair.
For those of you out there who own a Compaq/HP iPAQ, and would like to run an Open-source OS on it, it is currently possibly to run Linux on it, thanks to HP's Cambridge Research Labs, and of course many contributors around the world. For more, please visit Handhelds.org. (For what it's worth, I am the person who is porting Linux to the iPAQ h1910 - and no, I am not paid by HP.)
~pi/joshua/nontoxic/whatever
Here is an IBM z50 with 265mg cf preloaded with NetBSD!!! Instant WarDriving!!!
A link on the page leads to the z50 serving a stats site under apache!!!!
projects @ http://spectechnologies.net
But I don't see how it's as portable as it claims. It's nearly impossible to build a cross-compiler for Linux from netbsd, especially if you don't have the libraries and headers already compiled for you. I've been trying fruitlessly for several years now.
:)
Palmtop NetBSD isn't that desirable for me, because I'd have to sacrifice using a Linux distro if I wanted to do cross-compiles. Of course, if I'm wrong, I'd love to know it.
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!
NetBSD supposedly supports the Hitachi PERSONA HPW-230JC, which is the 32 meg version of what I have, a Phenom Ultra. But, the funny thing is... the bootloader program is only for Windows CE 2.11, not 2.0 that the machines come with (so, I can't even test it). I've gone through hell trying to find an open source operating system to run on this thing, with no dice. Anyone have one of these things?
You can do the same thing with Linux you can do with BSDs.
It is how they do it that is different I have found that once you know how a bsd system works I can quickly cut out a system that does what I want and nothing that I dont.
For me BSDs a cleaner simpler and just as powerful as any free or commercial Unix out there on a few processors.
I have a IBM z50 running NetBSD and X11 and a webserver on a 265mg CF!!! and I know every process that executes and why.
projects @ http://spectechnologies.net
I'm curious.. has anybody tried porting this to the Sharp Zaurus (SL-5500g is what I have, but any model)? And if not.. how hard would it be?