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Want To Write Your Own OS?
DJSlakoR writes "Looks like the Nocturnal Network has a tutorial on how to get started coding your own operating system. A very interesting read!"
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As someone, who has some experience in this field, I can assure you, that the correct answer to the question "Want To Write Your Own OS?" is "No, you certainly do not." Of course, it looks great at the beginning when you code a first working bootloader, then it's a great joy when your first single-tasking kernel can run its first process, et cetera. But as soon as you start working on the multitasking, decent scheduling, threads, multiple processes, file system, networking, writing an optimizing compiler and assembler suited for your platform, while constantly keeping security in mind, it soon becomes more work than using mature systems, like Open BSD or Debian, or even Gentoo. Don't get me wrong, I think everyone should write few toy operating systems, that's the only way one can learn the craft, but don't expect that your OS will soon become better than the systems already available, because they are bloated, while yours wouldn't be. This is a myth, and quite misleading at that, to say the very least. Still, this is great news (even if not actually new to anyone experienced).
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Often in college, my colleagues often joked about building a Porn OS. Many of the features they talked about resided strictly in the realm of the look and feel of course (X-rated buttons and sounds), so it could have been implemented in a window manager theme (making it truly X-windows) on top of an already-existing OS.
"...today consumers have been conditioned to think of beer when they see a bullfrog..."
Linus Torvalds perfectly realised that the name Linux was much too egotistical and simply unacceptable. We all agree about it now, but there's no point in comlaining, because Torvalds had already known that at the time of publishing the 0.01 version. "Linux" was only meant to be his private, temporary name of the OS on his own PC, before it has ever been meant to be made public. When he finally got to publish the first alpha version, he named it Freax, but the FTP server administrator renamed it to Linux. I just cannot believe, that even after twelve years, you are still so ignorant and completely clueless about that matter. These are just basic facts. You might want to educate yourself before you speak up next time only to embarrass yourself.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Hello everybody out there using minix -
:-)
:-(.
I'm doing a (free) operating system (just a hobby, won't be big and professional like gnu) for 386(486) AT clones. This has been brewing since april, and is starting to get ready. I'd like any feedback on things people like/dislike in minix, as my OS resembles it somewhat (same physical layout of the file-system (due to practical reasons) among other things).
I've currently ported bash(1.08) and gcc(1.40), and things seem to work. This implies that I'll get something practical within a few months, and I'd like to know what features most people would want. Any suggestions are welcome, but I won't promise I'll implement them
Linus
PS. Yes - it's free of any minix code, and it has a multi-threaded fs. It is NOT protable (uses 386 task switching etc), and it probably never will support anything other than AT-hard disks, as that's all I have
Message dated 25 Aug 1991
Thoughts on stocks, markets and trading
open4free
Someone who likes mensa belittling someone else's intelligence for no good reason? Surprise me.
With a name like that, I think people would have to wonder about gaping security holes.
THERE IS NO DATA. THERE IS O
You seem to have completely failed to understand my words... *sigh* But this was probably my fault, I might have written them in a too complicated way, which let me sincerely apologize for. But next time, please do try harder to understand words, which you are going to argue with. I hope you will avoid such an embarrassment in the future.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
In the article:
(2 sides/diskette) * (80 tracks/side) * (8 sectors/track) = 2880 sectors/diskette
should have 18 sectors/track
In the article:
(2 sides/diskette) * (80 tracks/side) * (8 sectors/track) = 2880 sectors/diskette
should have 18 sectors/track.
And when they got bored of fighting, use it to model space stations, automated traffic systems, and domestic droids. The idea would by to write the system as a pile of scripts running pseudocode. The trick would be to get everyone to write using the same language, that was really only useful for real-time processing.
My intent was also to develop "PPI" (Psuedo Programming Interfaces) that would act like device drivers, and translate a variable to, say, thrust on a rocket. Another PPI would translate position and orientation into an array. Still more would simulate the outputs from visual recoginitions systems, and so on.
If anyone has visited my website, they would see it presently exists as a paragraph or 2 of "coming soon speak." The project is probably waiting for me to be laid up after being struck by a bus or something.
Why go to the trouble of developing my own OS? Nothing really exists right now to comprehensively handle massive simulations. Yes you have protocols like HLA, but they are just message passing. Sure there is TCP/IP, but it's so neutral as to be of no help to someone starting out. I could develop a Java API, or a C++ library, but they are far too complex in some respects, and far too limited in others.
Frankly every operating system we have now assumes that you are structuring everything around files, documents, and static devices. At some point we have to do better.
"Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
--Dr.W.Edwards Deming
...as "Write Your Own OS/2".
That particular dead horse is still having a shallow pool of its putrid entrails beaten though.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
That's a bunch of bullshit. The kernel is the hardest part!
He didn't take GNU and write a kernel for it. The reason was that there was no GNU System at the time! There was a compiler, a shell, and some other stuff, but it wasn't anywhere to being close to an operating system.
Quite the opposite happened in fact. GNU looked at the fledging Linux operating system and started porting their stuff to it. Glibc was written for Linux, not the other way around, for one example.
GNU was not an operating system that merely lacked a kernel. When RMS says that Linus merely dropped in a kernel, he is lying. Otherwise it wouldn't have taken Debian years to get Debian HURD bootable. It wouldn't have taken them years to get a Debian BSD to boot. I don't know how anyone can consider Debian "The GNU System" when it took crowbars, sledgehammers and ripsaws to get it to use The GNU System's own kernel. Yet Debian is closer to what RMS means by "The GNU System" than anything else out there.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
My friend and I are trying to develop a special C function library that will allow people to make their own customizable O/S. By using a single function... called the doOperatingSystem Function. Prototyped as follows:
void doOperatingSystem(char *name,char *color);
Pretty snazzy huh?!
WHORE!
And, I suppose, insulting a woman, calling her "pretentious jerk," while cowardly hiding behind your anonymity, does make you look good, right? *sigh*
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Personally, I feel that women deserve both the same rights and the same responsibilities as men. One of those responsibilities is courtesy. Unless someone has shown themselves to be unintelligent, don't accuse them of it. It's not too hard. If you think I called you a "pretentious jerk," you misunderstood. I said you were acting like a pretentious jerk. You may or may not be a pretentious jerk, but from what I've read of your comments you certainly act like one.
It's a fallacy of relevance if you think whether I post anonymously or not has any bearing here. There's a name for it. It's called an argumentum ad hominem.
Posting from my real username, if that makes any difference. I have karma to burn.
Certainly, disagreeing with me doesn't imply stupidity, indeed. Agreeing with me, but still arguing because of failing to understand my words â" does. After reading your comment, posted as an answer to my explanation of this very matter, I do not even hope you to understand that, though. As a sidenote, I might add, that using invectives hidden behing acronyms, does not strengthen your argument even a slightest bit, no matter how "adult" this might seem to make you feel.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Glibc was not written for Linux; today it only supports Linux and the Hurd, but originally it supported many other systems. This was necessary in order to create as much as a free system as possible as long as there was no kernel for the GNU system.
The problem with creating a complete (Debian) GNU/Hurd distribution is not at all that it's so hard to port those packages to the Hurd (it isn't). It's simply the fact that the Hurd (due to its much more nonstandard design than Linux) hasn't reached the level of maturity of Linux yet.
Emacs did
Table-ized A.I.
Let's see, Linux is released, someone rewrites the utilities lickity-split to run on Linux instead of writing them from scratch, then it is claimed that Linux wouldn't exist without these tools. Sounds pretty dodgy to me. It sounds like the GNU system operates as a big land-grab---port your tools to any new system first and claim ownership (after pushing out the ones who were there first).
On the other hand I'm sure the Attorney General is proud of you. There are absolutely no reasonable reasons someone would want to post anonymously. Only cowards and terrorists would want to post this way. And if we let them, then they have won.
Take your misogynic paintbrush to some other forum and wield it there; we are an open-minded lot here.
Boy, if you are going to create a new account and put "Mensa" in the name and URL just to inflate your karma you should really learn to write. It is crap. A bunch of $5 words rammed together willy-nilly with an overabundance of commas and relative pronouns. I hope that you stay in a technical field when you grow up because my guess is that a writing career will be an uphill battle.
Are RMS' systems still running FreeBSD? I'd bet many of them are...
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Glibc was not written for Linux
Not originally, but to quote from RMS:
"Putting them together sounds simple, but it was not a trivial job. The GNU C library (called glibc for short) needed substantial changes." [Linux and the GNU Project]
In Mr. Stallman's own words it was glibc that was written to fit Linux and not the other way around. That glibc kept its cross-platform nature does not diminish from this fact.
It's simply the fact that the Hurd (due to its much more nonstandard design than Linux) hasn't reached the level of maturity of Linux yet.
Then what about Debian GNU/BSD? They've been working on that for years, and only managed to get it working about a week ago. According to the GNU mythology, that should have been a piece of cake. The BSD kernels are standard, robust, traditional, etc. GNU itself used proprietary systems with similar kernels during its development, so it should have been easy.
p.s. I'm suspecting that the only reason they got a Debian GNU/FreeBSD system booted last week was because the FreeBSD kernel has a builtin Linux compatibility mode...
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
While you're at it, try not advertising Mensa. It is generally known to be for dumb, arrogant shites.
Really?
There's no really hard parts in a functionally complete OS kernel, as can be seen if you look at a simple OS like Minix or Xinu. The device drivers are kinda tricky, of course, but that's mostly because there are so damn many of them.
I'd estimate that it's about an order of complexity harder to write, say, an optimising retargetable C++ compiler. (Though it helps if you have a retargetable C compiler first.) Or perhaps something like Mozilla, though once again it helps if you already have Mosaic and Netscapes 1 through 4.
sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f(q{sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f});
ROLL!
but what to do for that? any guidence n e one of u know :)...Dont tell me i cant, i can and i'll cuz i must!
I love you, troll babe.
Insulting a woman? I thought "Mensa Babe" was the really smart pig in that movie...
No, but, pointing out, that you, among others, use, from a certain perspective, far too may commas, is. :p
lol
"...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
If we're not careful, we might ALL be running FreeBSD soon. Remember, even though WE know the SCO suit ought to be won by IBM, that doesn't mean a JUDGE will know. In fact, I'd say it's completely impossible to predict the outcome of the case. Remember OJ? Remember the Microsoft "trial"? Remember Enron's executives getting away scot free?
:)
This is America, where every day is "anything can happen day".
FreeBSD is there for us; it is our exit strategy. Mock not the exit strategy! For it may save our butts one day...
Farewell! It's been a fine buncha years!
Funny - out this way, it's known more to be for sad, pathetic losers.
Maybe not, if they could get Rick James to endorse it:
It's a very geeky OS...
The kind you don't install for mothe-rrrr
It'll never bring your system down
Once you burn it on CD.
It's super-FREAX, super-FREAX, it's super freeware, yow!
>;k
Well, thank you... I just don't know what to say... This is very sweet, that you say, you love me. Unless it has some kind of hidden sexiest meaning, because in that case, I would say, that it is not sweet at all, if you ask me. I hope, what you meant, was a platonic love. If you did, then thank you very much indeed.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
I'm terribly sorry, if you find punctuation confusing, but I cannot write incorrectly, just because some people, who are less fluent in the language, might have problems with understanding my words, but I will try to keep your advice in mind, though, thank you.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Great, another person "disagreeing" (quote, unquote) with me... *sigh* Please read this comment, written by TheAwfulTruth, for intelligent explanation, and you will clearly see the awful truth (pun definitely intended).
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
I'm sorry, but my post (very original, indeed) was being directed to people, with no reading difficulties. Next time, I will try to write short paragraphs, with very few simple sentences, built with only single-syllable words. Will you be satisfied then? Because, as I clearly see, you are all attacking me in every imaginable way, except talking about the meritum, which I find annoingly immature, to say the very least.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Speaking of gaping holes...
Fix your sig -- should be '... of which I am a member' instead of '... which I am a member of'.
Guess there was no grammar section in the verbal part of Mensa entrance exams.
The comma is a punctuation mark that must be used only in certain cases. You cannot just throw them around like they are salt at a feast. I somehow detect from most of your posts that you rewrite your sentences multiple times. First, you write a simple sentence. Then, you decide how you can add words to it. Then, you add parenthetical expressions to make the sentence even longer. On top of that, you frequently mix up the proper order of your words. Let's look at an example from the last post:
It is very reassuring to know, that there are indeed some intelligent people on Slashdot, even if we are in minority.
The first comma is entirely uneccessary. You made the clause that was a very important part of the sentence a parenthetical expression, something that either defines the previous term (like this part after the comma) or can be dropped from the original sentence. Your sentence reads as if you had typed "It is reassuring to know even if we are in the minority".
Twain once said, "It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear an idiot than to open it and remove all doubt."
It is very fascinating how often those who expose the weaknesses of others expose the very weaknesses they possess themselves.
I have to disappoint you, Mr. Freud, but your psychoanalysis, even if somewhat entertaining, is indeed wrong. I write my posts once, from the beginning, to the end. Sometimes I read it and correct some mistakes, but not very often, which explains my typos you all are so kind to point out. Nonetheless, I find it very amusing, that you sacrifice so much of your time, to analyze my writing patterns. Unfortunately, I don't sacrifice so much time to write my texts, which you then read with so great attention.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
You are a very mature and intelligent preson indeed. Would you please try to argue with me about meritum, instead of reading all of my texts and waiting for some mistake, which you could then point out? Thank you.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
You are just not going to stop insulting me, are you?
Have you ever stop to think, that complex sentences might actually have more meaning, than the simple ones? Do you think, that intelligent people don't talk like little children, just because they want to sound "cool"? You are very wrong.
Please read this thread carefully, and you'll see, that those "others," whom I consider as intelligent as yourself, are only insulting me, instead of intelligently talking about the meritum, again, just like yourself.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
I think you have a right to think that, however upsettining it might be to me, I am unable to put my ideas in an intelligent form. Fair enough. That's your right. But I am not quite sure why do you use so much of your time, just to insult me. Is that entertaining to hurt women's feelings? I hope it was worth all your trouble. I wish you good luck with insulting other women. I am sure they will be very pleased by your nice attitude.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
How convenient. You encourage me to stop, while you have the last word. Bravo.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
You didn't have to say that. If you think that I am the worst woman on Earth, then why on Earth is it so important for you to keep insulting me, one time after another? Do you enjoy it? Don't you have a life?
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Didn't anybody read the article? It's not about how to write an operating system. It's about how to write a boot block for an x86 PC.
And of course you'd like me to not defend at all and let you insult me however you like? Truely amazing. I must congratulate you for the most convenient attitude I have ever seen in my life.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
Layman's perspective? It looks more like a lamer perspective to me... *sigh*
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
I have to say that this is one of the more fun areas of development (having been involved for the last 3 yrs or so). To anyone wanting to get started I would highly recommend the newsgroup alt.os.development - many of the members there also have very informative pages.
(sorry for posting kinda late, I was busy working on my OS!)
As someone, who has some experience in this field, I can assure you, that the correct answer to the question "Want To Write Your Own OS?" is "No, you certainly do not."
As someone else who has some experience (including in-depth university classes) in this field, I suggest a better answer would be "Maybe." As with any software, it depends on what you need it to do. I'm completely in agreement that thinking that you can whip up a revolutionary new OS in a month to beat down everything else out there is way wrong, but I also don't think there's no room or reason to start a new OS, particularly if it's aimed at a particular niche or use.
As an example, while not nearly on the same complexity level, my server at home uses quite a bit software written by me from scratch--mailreader, HTTP server, SMTP server, other more minor things--all designed to fill exactly my needs without the bloat (and associated security problems) of mainstream packages like Pine, Apache, or Sendmail. I'd never claim that my own software could replace those packages in a general sense, but within the limited context of "what I need", they serve quite well.
Along the same lines, I think there are still contexts in which writing a new OS from scratch would make sense. Aside from niche environments, there's the issue of stability, especially considering how software design practice has changed over the last 10, 20, 30 years; is it easier to audit 10,000,000 lines of old code or write 500,000 (or 5,000,000) lines of new code? (I don't have the answer, but I don't think it's clear-cut either way.)
I just cannot believe it! Is it your hobby to search for old threads, read them and, if you don't find them "funny," insult women as your revenge? Don't you have more important things to do maybe? Don't you think that every woman would find such words extremely offensive? You might consider finally growing up.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
"This is very sweet, that you say, you love me."
"I hope, what you meant, was a platonic love.
"Re:You apparently have too much of free time."
Ugh! For a Mensa babe your English sure does suck.
I'm willing to bet your natural language is not English.
#1 You tend to overuse punctuation. People who simply type badly or are not well-educated tend to avoid the use of punctuation - sometimes entirely. People who speak English as a second language use commas to indicate a pause in the flow of their speech. Commas can be used in that manner, but have specific places where they are appropriate as such (unless you are taking creative license with a fictional character).
#2 You tend to misplace adverbs, participles, and leave out possessives and other 'supporting words'. People who speak English naturally will often 'dialectize' these (i.e. 'hiz', 'hurz', 'da') words, but do not typically omit them entirely. You do, because your natural language may not have separate words for the ones you tend to omit. In Latin (and some Latin-based languages) the possessive is indicated by the declination of the object being possessed. Also, Latin has no words like the English word 'the', so the omission of that word in a couple of your posts gives me the idea that you may speak a Romance language (Spanish, French, Romanian, Italian, etc).
Quit claiming to be something you most likely are not. I doubt that the MENSA organization created tests without English Grammar evaluations. If the Mensa tests don't have such evaluations, then no wonder most of the people who have met a Mensa member thinks that they are pricks. If you cannot communicate effectively, you might as well not communicate at all.
You, Sir, apparently know how to recognise a pure genius.
I hear it every songle day... No. Get lost.
Wow! Is this message authentic? Anyone could confirm its exact source?
Looks like an exceptionnal piece of history. At least for me, Linux being my favorite OS and having a business based on it.