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A Condensed History Of The Keyboard

An anonymous reader points to this overview of old (good) keyboards versus the cheap and nasty kind which begins "Today's keyboards aren't what they used to be, no sir! Back in my day, we had our BS technology; our keyboards had chassis's which allowed 'em to be thrown off a 3-story building and still work - barely dented. Yes those were the days." Not a lot of new information, but some good visuals.

105 of 567 comments (clear)

  1. I miss those teletype printers... by heironymouscoward · · Score: 4, Funny

    In those days, 'audiovisual feedback' actually meant something. Long rolls of dead tree recording every single charxxxacaaxxxx ^h^h\H^H^H/d/d ^C^C^Q^Deof.DAMN...

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une signature
    1. Re:I miss those teletype printers... by BrokenHalo · · Score: 5, Informative
      I remember them, but I don't miss them... In the days when I worked on Burroughs B3700s, (when the Earth was newly-cooled, and Real Programmer were Real Programmers etc...) the only real keyboard interface was through a teletype, which had a key action something like a 1930s typewriter. The data entry chicks had much more sophisticated keyboards on their tape encoding machines (remember those?)

      But the only way to get your code in reliably was to use a 029 card-punch. When I wasn't trying not to get eaten by dinosaurs, that is :-)

  2. I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by zubernerd · · Score: 5, Funny

    Quoting the story: Key caps allow one to reconfigure their letters without actually prying off the keys from the keyboard. This was implemented due to the aforementioned QWERTY/Dvorak controversy.
    I loved the ability to remove the cap keys, every few weeks I would remove all the cap keys from my keyboard and clean each one by hand using a bleach solution, inside and out. It's great for all us obsessive-compulsive cleaners.
    The other great thing about them was the ability to play practical jokes, all one had to do was change around a few 'key' keys and watch all the non-touch typists in a computer lab get pissed off at the computer. And with Windows 2k, I'd change the insert and delete keys around, (makes it hard to use CTRL-ALT-DEL to get to the login screen)

    --
    Accentuate the positive, don't waste your mod points on the negative.
    1. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by Squareball · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What we need are the _[]x window buttons on the keyboard so that we can minimize, maxamize and close windows with 1 push of a keyboard button.

    2. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by blibbleblobble · · Score: 4, Informative

      "What we need are the _[]x window buttons on the keyboard so that we can minimize, maxamize and close windows with 1 push of a keyboard button."

      In Windows:
      Alt-Space N
      Alt-Space X
      Alt-F4

    3. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by Delta-9 · · Score: 3, Funny

      "Alt-Space N
      Alt-Space X
      Alt-F4"


      I think you missed the point, let me quote it:

      "with 1 push of a keyboard button"

      We all know that windows leusers can't remember more than one key at a time and it has to be labelled.

    4. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by G-funk · · Score: 3, Funny

      X11 puts extra keys on your keyboard? Cool!

      --
      Send lawyers, guns, and money!
    5. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by bigman2003 · · Score: 2, Informative

      I've got a Microsoft (yeah, yeah, yeah) keyboard that does that.

      The function keys have an extra modifier that is turned on by default. F6 is close and I've reconfigured F5 to minimize. Haven't thought about doing maximize. (Most programs remember the state of the last window you opened, and typically for me that was maximized, so this is not an issue)

      These keyboards are actually pretty nice, with buttons for Windows Media Player on top, and a bunch of other gay little buttons I never use because I forget about them. But it is nice to have the 20 or so totally customizable buttons available when I need them. And for the other users on my computer, hitting the 'my documents' button is easier than finding their files any other way.

      Of course, I always forget about the calculator button and that would actually be the one to save me the most time.

      Keyboards are like a lot of other technology out there- you would be amazed at what exists, if you are willing to try it out.

      As for quality- I've got no problems with this at all, in fact it has a good feel (in my opinion) it's also wireless, which was my number one requirement. I've got too many damn cords behind my computer!

      The only complaint I have, is there is no caps-locks indicator. Maybe they were trying to save battery life or something, but it is nice to have the little light- at least when you are typing in passwords...

      --
      No reason to lie.
    6. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by kisrael · · Score: 3, Interesting

      In a similar vein...does ANYONE find that "context menu" key useful, the one to the right of the righthand windows key?

      And now that I think about it, how insiduous is it that like every damn PC keyboard made these days gets its own dose of Microsoft branding? That's pretty creepy when I stop to think about it. (I remember my first PC w/ Win95 didn't have that key, so sometimes "ctrl-esc" still comes in useful, like on this one laptop that weirdly moves that key to the top right of the keyboard.)

      --
      SO YOU'RE GOING TO DIE: The Comic for Dealing with Death
    7. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by Rude+Turnip · · Score: 2, Informative

      "In a similar vein...does ANYONE find that "context menu" key useful, the one to the right of the righthand windows key?"

      The context menu button is, IMO, the best thing to happen to keyboards in a long while. For Christ's sake...it's effectively a "right click" mouse button! However, it's on your keyboard - so it's one less reason to take your hands off the keyboard. Brilliant!

    8. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by nosfucious · · Score: 2, Informative

      Well, seeing as we've plenty of nationalities where I work, I had to insist on a US keboard. (Which is the same as my 'native' Australian keyboard).

      Mostly around here we've Swiss German/French, French and a few Belgian keyboards. Everyone seems to prefer they one they grew up with. Personally, alphabetic characters never bothered me, but I occasionally miss the positions of /\$@ and a few others if I don't work with a US keyboard. I'm fine whether I use VNC, SSH or Terminal Services. Users of other keyboards sometimes find that there are remapping problems, which are either from the application or the OS itself.

      Of course, company std dictates that "US English" be the standard install for NT/2K, at least on a server level. VNC doesn't work so well for a non-US keyboard.

      Drives the French guys nuts trying to hunt and seek for an obscure character combination that I've used in a service password. (Driving the French mad is of course, like 'wiping your arse with silk').

      --
      Q:I was listening to a CD in Grip and it sounded horrible! What's up? A:Perhaps you are listening to country music
    9. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by kisrael · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The context menu button is, IMO, the best thing to happen to keyboards in a long while. For Christ's sake...it's effectively a "right click" mouse button! However, it's on your keyboard - so it's one less reason to take your hands off the keyboard. Brilliant!
      Are you being serious? I hardly find the focus is on what I want to right click on! And usually it's much easier to use the mouse to give the thing the focus than to wrangle the arrow keys and what not...

      Seriously, could you name a few examples of when you're saved from having to reach for the mouse, or when there's not another, more convenient keycombo to get the job done?

      --
      SO YOU'RE GOING TO DIE: The Comic for Dealing with Death
    10. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by jafuser · · Score: 3, Funny

      I keep all my keys on my Model M at work switched around fairly randomly in what has come to be the "ICOLQZ" layout. Even my boss nor the network admin can use my keyboard, since they both can't touch type.

      So far over the past few years, nobody has messed with my computer, and in the few times that the network admin had to do something, he has me sit down at my computer and do it while he told me what to type =D

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    11. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by jafuser · · Score: 2, Funny

      I can atach commands to so the one labelled Web/Home opens up Mozilla, the Messenger one opens Yahoo!Chat &c.
      You realize that by not opening IE/MSN Messenger with those buttons, that you are probably violating the DMCA in some way =P

      --
      Please consider making an automatic monthly recurring donation to the EFF
    12. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by I(rispee_I(reme · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The big example is macros. Much harder to script mouse movement.

    13. Re:I loved the IBM model M keyboard key caps... by belroth · · Score: 2, Informative
      In explorer I use it to rename files, also lets me used my customised 'send to' to choose which editor I want to use on the file (usually emacs or t.h.e. depending upon task). As my editing is done text-only wherever possible it is very useful.

      I also use a nifty little utility called WinKey which allows you to assign operations to combinations with the 'windows' keys in addition to the standard, e.g. I use win-X to open Excel, win-Z to open mozilla, win-1 to win-0 open explorer windows on network pcs - it all helps me not to use the mouse any more than I have to, and makes my wrists/hands more comfortable.
      Many years ago I wrote an INT19h C hack to assign functions to alt key combinations in DOS - I love coding to save drudgery later. Now you can add shortcut keys to items on the start menu too, the problem is finding ones that aren't used by apps. CTRL+ the numpad keys are usually a safe bet - I use ctrl+numpad to invoke cygwin. I really am a keyboard kind of guy and hate it when I haave to use the mouse, except when I use the wheel to scroll through /. pages :-)

      I have to say if anyone is developing a USB 'natural' version of the Model M I'd be quite happy to test it for a few years...

      --
      I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
  3. Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by ACK!! · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I loved mine and I am still looking for one of those old clickity clackity huge heavy monsters with their wonderous tactile feedback feel.

    Anyone else in the same boat?

    At least I still have my Logitech 3 button mouse.

    What is your favorite keyboard type?

    --
    ACK /ak/ interj. 2. [from the comic strip "Bloom County"] An exclamation of surprised disgust, esp. i
    1. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Havokmon · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I loved mine and I am still looking for one of those old clickity clackity huge heavy monsters with their wonderous tactile feedback feel.

      I picked up 3 or 4 of them at GoodWill last year for $1.50 each.

      --
      "I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
    2. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by stanmann · · Score: 5, Informative

      Go to ebay type in IBM Model M in the search. buy keyboard. or search your local goodwill/Salvation army stores. I've got two, both from goodwill. like a rock.

      --
      Food not Bombs is a nice platitude but it breaks down when you notice that the Bombees are usually well fed
    3. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I believe what you're looking for is the replacement for the Northgate Omnikey. Lueck Data Systems makes a replacement and still has a few of the old ones available. Function keys on the left, where god intended them. Or function keys on both the left and top, for those unsure about life. A heavy metal chassis. Clicks rather than mush. http://www.lueckdatasystems.com/en-us/hardware/key boards/

    4. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Havokmon · · Score: 4, Funny
      Function keys on the left, where god intended them.

      heh, 10 function keys, 10 commandments.. that can't be a coincidence :P

      --
      "I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
    5. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Warpedcow · · Score: 2, Informative

      Check out www.pckeyboard.com - they have it all! I bought a lexmark mini-clikey-key keyboard a few years ago and I'll probably buy another pretty soon.
      ________________________________________

      I loved mine and I am still looking for one of those old clickity clackity huge heavy monsters with their wonderous tactile feedback feel.

      Anyone else in the same boat?

      At least I still have my Logitech 3 button mouse.

      What is your favorite keyboard type?

      --
      moo
    6. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by His+name+cannot+be+s · · Score: 4, Funny

      I am a die-hard M Fanatic. So is a buddy of mine.

      We scour local flea markets, garage sales and auctions for people getting rid of them.

      This year, I scored three at three seperate garage sales. $5, $2, $2 !

      I've got about 10 now, and I put one with every computer I use.

      My co-workers used to rile me about the noise, but after I started hitting them over the head with it, they stopped complaining. :)

      --
      "...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
    7. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Greyfox · · Score: 4, Informative
      You still run across them from time to time in IBM.

      Logitech makes a pretty good keyboard, too. I picked one up after deciding that the split ergonomic keyboard I'd been using 1) sucked and 2) was making my wrists and hands hurt more. I'm on a logitech flat keyboard now and am loving it. It's nice and clicky, stands up to abuse and I can type about a third faster on it.

      --

      I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

    8. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Zathrus · · Score: 5, Informative

      I'm utterly amazed that in the 14 replies thus far, nobody's given you the right answer.

      If you want a true, original IBM PC keyboard then go here. They make the originals, complete with massive weight and key klacking, plus modified versions that have the Windows key, integrated mouse, college mascot/color inspired ones, quiet versions, etc... yes, they're pricy by modern day keyboard standards, but if you want a keyboard that will live somewhat longer than all of your descendants there's no other option.

      I actually have two original IBM PS/2 keyboards, bought from used computer stores nearby... but the noise annoyed the hell out of my wife and I recently switched to a Memorex multimedia keyboard. It's really not all that bad, and every once in a great while I even remember to use some of the extra keys on it.

    9. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by Grishnakh · · Score: 3, Funny

      There were originally 15 Commandments.

    10. Re:Who else misses the old IBM keyboards? by peu · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I don't miss mine, I'm using the same keyboard since 1985 (18 years), every now and then I remove all the keycaps and clean one by one with detergent. The only modification I made is to replace the original upper side of the keyboard with one from a ps/2 with the status leds.

      If I ever need a 'rug' most of my hair is in between the keys... :-)

  4. Not a lot of new information? by Soft · · Score: 5, Funny

    No new information in a history of something? How surprising!

    1. Re:Not a lot of new information? by EpsCylonB · · Score: 3, Funny

      By definition, history is comprised solely of OLD information.

      Well donbe for killing the joke einstein.

  5. Old Keyboards by Matrix272 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Ah yes, the keyboards of old could be thrown from a 747 into the middle of the Pacifac, and when they washed ashore, they would still function... but they didn't have an E-mail button. After all, what good is a keyboard without an E-mail button?

    --
    "It's better to have a gun and not need it than need a gun and not have it." ~ Christian Slater, True Romance
    1. Re:Old Keyboards by Jeremy+Erwin · · Score: 3, Interesting

      An email button? That's nothing. My keyboard has a "shopping" button. (I think I have it set to open up freshmeat, but even so, I never use that feature.) Plus it has a scroll wheel, fast forward, rewind, play, and stop controls. It's not quite as rococo as those new Microsoft "Office" keyboards, but every time I sit down at my desk, I feel like I'm really using one of these Vroom, Vroom !

  6. Bad layout by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Thing I never understood about modern computer keyboards is the staggered layout of the rows -- presumably a throwback from old typewriter days, but I think they'd be far more efficient if the keys were arranged in a proper grid (ie the H directly beneath the Y, and not slightly to the right).

    1. Re:Bad layout by Confused · · Score: 5, Informative

      You obviously never had to type on a grid keyboard. If you're built like the average human, when the fingers of both hands on the keyboard, the arms are at an angel (45 to 60 degree) relative to the keyboard.

      Staggering the keys allows you to reach the keys on the other rows by simply extending or moving back the finger. No rotation is necessary for most letters. With perfect grid layouts, the finger movement is far more complex and the chance of hitting the correct is greatly reduced.

      So called ergonomic keyboards try to solve the problem by splitting the keyboard and rotating the halves.

      Except for very crude typing requirements, nobody in his right mind uses a grid layout.

  7. You Tease by tomzyk · · Score: 4, Funny
    Back in my day, we had our BS technology; our keyboards had chassis's which allowed 'em to be thrown off a 3-story building and still work - barely dented. Yes those were the days." Not a lot of new information, but some good visuals.
    Was anyone else expecting to see pics/vids of keyboards being thrown from the rooftops?
    --
    Karma: NaN
  8. back in my day by Lord_Slepnir · · Score: 2, Funny
    our keyboards had chassis's which allowed 'em to be thrown off a 3-story building and still work - barely dented.

    They also weighed more than the CRT, and easily drowned out my Adlib soundcard when I went up to 60 wpm.

    1. Re:back in my day by nycsubway · · Score: 2, Funny

      I think you are thinking of the AT keyboard, or the old terminal keyboard, with the F-keys in two columns on the left side.

      I remember those... solid steel back, cast aluminum casing. Painted a dull beige, with a cord as thick as a 3-prong extension cord. And large plastic knobs on the sides to turn the keyboard props up in the back.

      I had an opportunity a few years ago to take one home and play with it. Well, I didn't use it because the plug was an AT style, so I decided to put it to the test against an IBM M-style keyboard. Head to head to see who would win. You know who won? The terminal keyboard.. beat the ever-living crap out of the M-style. Dropping the M style onto the terminal from a height of 5 feet did nothing to it. Dropping the terminal from the same height depressed a few keys irreversibly on the M keyboard.

      The old terminal keyboards are built like tanks! you could probably bridge a gap and stand on it without it breaking. Too bad they're not very useful anymore.

  9. just a few years ago by kguilber · · Score: 2, Funny

    we used to have keyboard sword-fights with DEC terminal keyboards.

  10. IBM Model M by badasscat · · Score: 4, Funny

    You can have my IBM Model M when you pry it from my cold, dead hands.

  11. full text of article (sans images) ... by ih8apple · · Score: 4, Informative

    Today's keyboards aren't what they used to be, no sir! Back in my day, we had our BS technology; our keyboards had chassis's which allowed 'em to be thrown off a 3-story building and still work - barely dented. Yes those were the days. Now we've got these newfangled Wireless Ergonomic E-Mail button membrane keyboards. To heck with them, I say!

    This article really entails two things: The history of the Universal or QWERTY keyboard layout and a comparison between BS and Membrane technology used today in keyboards, one of the most used interfaces to the computer at present.

    QWERTY keyboards are known as Universal keyboards - they are the standard by which keyboard manufacturers produce their keyboards today. It was named this due to the q,w,e,r,t,y pattern in the upper left hand corner of the keyboard. QWERTY was originally designed by Christopher Sholes to slow typing down.

    Wait a second why would we be using a keyboard layout made to slow us down? Let's look back before keyboards - typewriting. In 1868 Christopher Latham Sholes was awarded the operative patent for the typewriter. After receiving this patent, Sholes still had many 'bugs' to work out, and spent a good deal of time with the machine, working out the kinks. One of the kinks in the machine was key jamming, which was prone to happen often and could hurt the machine. If a typist typed two letters one after the other too quickly, the hammers would hit each other; the typist then had to dislodge the hammers and that could get a bit messy. So, Sholes came up with a keyboard layout that would place letters which would be most likely struck closely in succession on opposite sides of the layout.

    Eventually, due to the ability to touch type with QWERTY efficiently [first demonstrated when in a typing contest a QWERTY typist managed to type quicker than someone on a stenograph-styled machine] it became the standard.

    In 1936, August Dvorak patented his Simplified Keyboard - DSK. It was designed to balance the load of typing more evenly - those letters, which would be stricken most, would be under the strongest fingers. The credibility of the claims that the Dvorak is faster is outside the scope of this article. If one is truly interested, I recommend reading an informative article at: http://wwwpub.utdallas.edu/~liebowit/keys1.html. However I do believe that Dvorak perhaps is the better layout - although due to my experience with QWERTY I still stick with it. For those of you who think Dvorak is a legacy item no longer used, you will all be pleased to know that all windows versions greater than 3.11 are Dvorak compliant, and a simple setting can change the layout setting.

    On to the Keyboards!

    To this day I still use the IBM Model M keyboard. This keyboard was released with the original IBM PS/2 computer. It is known for it's weight, feedback, and distinctive keystroke sound. There are some Model M's which are branded by Lexmark on the back - Lexmark bought the design from IBM in the late 1980s.

    Model M's are 101 key keyboards, and still comply with all ps/2 requirements [read on for Pentium 4 possible incompatibilities and fixes.] What makes this keyboard so special?

    The first aspect that is most obvious upon actually typing is the sound and feel of the keyboard. There is a noticeable and quite prominent 'click' which is not as high pitched as some Chiconey keyboards (which are quite nice too,) the sound is not soft and mushy. The Model M's keys also have a bit of resistance to them - not so that it's hard to push them down, but just a tad bit more pressure is needed to fully depress a key. Now, for those of you up late at night, or up in the wee hours of the morning, perhaps this is a disadvantage for you. Also, many people prefer not to hear the keystroke - companies like Dell, IBM, and hundreds of others have manufactured (or sub-contracted other companies) to make quiet keyboards. Let's take a look at why these keyboards are quiet, and w

  12. Mirror by dknj · · Score: 2, Informative

    Mirror here for the PS/2 modification for operation with some p4 motherboards

    -dk

  13. The M by sparkhead · · Score: 5, Funny

    This is quickly going to turn into a lovefest for the IBM M keyboard.

    I have several of them stashed away on the off chance that the one I've been using for the past 13 years breaks. Which it hasn't. Hoping to sell it on "Antiques Roadshow" in about 40 years.

  14. You guys have it easy by dcw3 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Back in my day we chiseled everything on a stone tablet

    --
    Just another day in Paradise
  15. Microsoft by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I will probably get totally flamed for this but I think the best keyboards I have owned have all been made by Microsoft. Right now I am using the Office Keyboard and I love it. The action is great and the extra keys actually serve my purpose (I work in Excel and Word all day).

    1. Re:Microsoft by darthtuttle · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I have heard that Logitech makes Microsoft hardware which would explain it's quality. I've been using a Microsoft Natural keyboard for ages, and just love them. Now that Logitech sells them under their own name I buy them.

      What gets me is the new layout of the keys above the arrow keys, and the arrow keys. Some things shouldn't be messed with, and they are my insert and my arrow keys!

      --
      Darthtuttle
      Thought Architect
    2. Re:Microsoft by Jonsey · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As long as you don't get the "Elite" version, I believe microsoft is still making the full-size natural (like the original one, that I still have, love, and use)

      Changes to the Elite included stupid shortcut keys, regrouping the Insert Delete Home End PU PD block, and making the arrow keys into a Diamond shape group. Ew.

      The original MS Natural Keyboard rules... /me runs home to cuddle keyboard.

      --
      I assert that my comment is only my opinion, not that of any employer, past, present or future.
    3. Re:Microsoft by TheAncientHacker · · Score: 2, Informative

      Nope. There's no longer a full-size Microsoft Natural keyboard with the full layout. The last one with the full set of keys in the standard layout (well, standard besides the split keyboard) was the Natural Keyboard Pro that dropped off the list last year. The Natural Multimedia Keyboard is close - it does have an inverted-T cursor pad - but the 9 keys above the inverted-T cursor pad have been rearranged.

      Microsoft Keyboard info is available at Microsoft's keyboard site

      (and, yes, I bought a backup Natural Pro when I saw it dropped)

  16. Microsoft keyboards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I know M$'s OS is crap, but their keyboards and mice have always been built to a very high quality.

    Expensive, but well worth the money!!!

  17. Re:My favorite keyboard by JeanBaptiste · · Score: 2, Funny

    I just bought a new, out of the box original XT style keyboard... (XT style because the keyboard is built the same way, except it has a PS/2 style connection instead of the original connector).

    5 bucks... and I was more than happy to send my plasticky dell keyb to the closet...
    They are great, you can spill beer on them and they survive, and heavy enough to use as weapon if needed...

  18. Differences by Mr_Silver · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Today's keyboards aren't what they used to be, no sir!

    Indeed. Today's keyboards can be picked up for less than a fiver. Try picking one up for that price back in the "old days".

    There are plenty of good keyboards out there, but because the PC market is often dictated by price, you see more of the cheap ones than you do anything else.

    --
    Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
  19. Anyone Else for a New Keyboard??? by TSMABob · · Score: 2, Informative

    I don't know about the rest of you, but I enjoy the quiet touch of my laptop's keyboard while I'm coding... its so much easier to fly across the keys without having to slam each one home... just my opinion

    1. Re:Anyone Else for a New Keyboard??? by gughunter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      To each his own. I prefer the buckling spring keys so much that using a "mushier" keyboard is almost distracting. Also, one benefit of the buckling spring keyboard is that the little click corresponds exactly to a keypress. If you heard/felt the click, the computer got the data; if you didn't, it didn't. With rubber dome keyboards, on the other hand, you have to keep an eye on your text at all times. Between the uncertainty and the overall mushy feel, rubber dome keyboards have at least two strikes against them in my book.

  20. changing views of computer parts by pytheron · · Score: 4, Interesting
    it looks like good keyboards (i.e the early ones) were more components of the computer systems, whereas cheap keyboards are peripherals of said systems.

    This only reflects the movement of the computing model, and the seperation of what is regarded as essential to what is regarded as an accessory.

    --
    "I am not bound to please thee with my answers" [William Shakespeare]
  21. QWERTY -Slow typists down? Wrong. by sparkhead · · Score: 4, Interesting
    From the article: QWERTY was originally designed by Christopher Sholes to slow typing down.

    That's simply wrong. QWERTY was designed to speed typing up by spacing out the most used keys to different sides of the keyboard.

    QWERTY was designed as he states to reduce jamming of the hammers, not to slow typists down. Even without hammers QWERTY was still faster due to the use of both hands for common letters.

    1. Re:QWERTY -Slow typists down? Wrong. by His+name+cannot+be+s · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Very True.

      As a matter of fact, many studies show that QWERTY, while not the *MOST* optimal, is many times more optimal than either randomly ordered keys, or linear ordering.

      Given that the punctuatuion characters are gravitated outwards, and that the Z,X and Q characters are placed on the non-dominant hand, on the edges, seems to corroborate that. If indeed you wanted to slow someone down, drop those into the middle of the keyboard!

      Now, for left-handers (often reffered to the more proper 'Spawn-of-the-devil' ) are probably at a disadvantage, but heck, what can you do ? :p

      --
      "...In your answer, ignore facts. Just go with what feels true..."
    2. Re:QWERTY -Slow typists down? Wrong. by Fluffy+the+Cat · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But a fairly small number of words contain the sequence "rt" or "tr". Absolute frequency is irrelevent - what matters is how ofter you use them in combination.

    3. Re:QWERTY -Slow typists down? Wrong. by Dun+Malg · · Score: 2, Insightful
      What he meant was that it is meant to slow down the typing of common letter combinations.

      If that's wht he meant, he's still wrong. It wasn't meant to slow anything down. QWERTY was meant to put the HAMMER BARS on the Sholes typewriter farther apart for common digraphs in order to reduce the likelyhood of jams. That's all.

      'er' and 'ty' being pretty common...

      You obviously don't know how the original Sholes typewriter worked. The 'E' and 'R' hammer bars weren't next to each other. In fact, there is another aspect of the qwerty layout that hearkens back to the Sholes typewriter, and it shows how the bars were laid out. Look at your keyboard. Notice how the rows are slightly staggered, with the 'Q' a little to the left of the 'A'? On the Sholes typewriter the letter keys were on the end of long levers and (since two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time) those levers have to be offset slightly. If you take a ruler and set it vertically next to the '1' key, then slide it to the right and note order each key crosses the edge of the ruler you get the order of the hammer bars on the original typewriter (sort of-- there was no '1' or '0' on the original). Try it. I bet you get "qa2zws3xed4crf5vtg6byh7nuj8mik9,ol0.p;". Notice how ER and TY aren't next to one another?

      --
      If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
  22. designed to slow typing down (NOT) by threeturn · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I am sure I am not the only one to spot the mistake.

    The QWERTY keyboard was not designed to "slow typing down", buy rather to reduce the number of jams in a much more elegant way. It avoids having frequent adjacent letter pairs activating levers that are close to each other on the typewriters mechanism. This means that jams (which occur between adjacent levers) occur less frequently when typing FAST!

  23. Space Cadet! by OctaneZ · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Get your self a nice Space Cadet Keyboard. Nice action, plus you never know when you will need triangle, meta, super, or hyper!
    Actually this is something I have been trying to hunt down for a couple years, quite a nice piece of equipment.

  24. The best keyboard I ever used... by timbck2 · · Score: 2, Informative

    ...was made by Wyse, attached to a Wyse 286 PC I used at work many years ago. It had neither an XT nor a PS/2 connector; instead, it attached via a modular phone (RJ-11) style connector. It had a very light touch and a nice sound. I wish I could get one for my G4.

    --
    Absurdity: A statement or belief manifestly inconsistent with one's own opinion. -- Ambrose Bierce
  25. Northgate OmniKey 101 by yAm · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I am writing this with a OmniKey 101 from my first computer which has long since died. I take this keyboard from job to job and it's really funny to see the look of the "kids" that look at for the first time.

    Weighin' in at over three pounds, tactile, removable keys (not that it's ever been cleaned...) and it sounds like an M-60 in full auto when I'm furiously typing.

    I love this thing.

    By the way, does anyone know of a old-style keyboard connector to USB changer? I have a feeling that my PS/2 connector is about to out moded...

    --

    Chris

    So Buddha walks into a pizza parlor and says: "Hey, make me one with everything."

  26. IBM M type and P4 fixing by hbackert · · Score: 2, Informative

    Google cache of the article how to modify an old IBM keyboard to work on a new P4 computer.

    I had no such problems though. Maybe it's because I have an Athlon...

  27. Todays keyboards aren't what they used to be by 32bitwonder · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My favourite keyboards were the one for the PCjr (not the chicklet one) and the one for the Atari PC1. They both had a very light, non-rubbery feel to them.

    I've just spent an exhaustive search for a replacement desktop keyboard and was absolutely dismayed by the garbage keyboards out there. What I really wanted was one that had key switches similar to my old IBM T23 laptop, the best keyboard ever IMHO. I eventually found one, and it is close, but not quite as good as the IBM.

    For those interested, you can see it at Precision Squared. Look for the PSK-5000 model. For touch typists, I highly recommend this keyboard. Mac users can find its equivalent with the MacAlly IceKey which appears to be a re-branded PSK-5000.

  28. Sometimes it's just wrong by squiggleslash · · Score: 3, Interesting
    The nicest, easiest, "just right", keyboard I've ever used was also probably one of the cheapest. Back in the 1980s, Sinclair released a "revolutionary 32 bit machine" called the QL, where every cost had been pared to the bone. It used his stringy-floppy drives (called Microdrives, no relation to IBM's tiny winchesters), an 8 bit version of the 680000 (internally 32 bit, but with a similar bus profile to the 8088, 20 bit external address bus, 8 bit external data bus, etc), and a membrane keyboard that used plastic keys pushing on a rubber sheet to provide some sort of feedback. To give some idea of how pared to the bone it was, the keyboard didn't have a delete key. The OS required you hold down CTRL and LEFT-ARROW to correct mistakes. There were five function keys and that was it.

    But, some how, the membrane keyboard was just about right. Keys had feedback, because the rubber mat was just about perfect. The keys were just where I needed them.

    Sinclair released a cheaper version for his flagship Spectrum system a little later, which had virtually no feedback and which was so poorly built that if you turned many of the machines upside down, all the keys would fall out...

    --
    You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  29. I had to fix my keyboard Monday by Asprin · · Score: 5, Informative


    What a coincidence -- I actually had to take my work KB (a new IBM mush-model similar to the one in the article) apart to fix it Monday because the 'p' key was getting less and less reliable, and my typing was steadily getting worse.

    When I popped the 'p' key off and looked underneath, the rubber contact mat was off center, like it had been stretched underneath so the contact didn't line up under the key. I pulled a few screws, blew out the dust and the rubber spring mat that lies on the contacts was misaligned by, like, 1/4 inch in areas. I pulled it off and tried to re-align it properly when I realized that the plastic/mylar/whatever contact sheet on the bottom wasn't flat either - like a rug that wasn't quite cut the correct shape for a room, there was a hump in it. I loosened the screws around the contacts to the PCB and I was able to then flatten the contact sheet and retighten, then realign the rubber springmat and reassemble.

    Voila! Perfect. I want to point out three things.

    1) It's still not a model M. If you find an old one GET IT, even if it's missing a few keys. Your neighbors' neighbors will hate all the clicking, but your fingers will be very, very happy. I personally have one of these as well as an original Northgate Omnikey Ultra purchased by me from Northgate Inc. in 1990 which was in use until March of this year. I replaced it because I bought a new PC and wanted a wireless KB. Every collector's shelf should have a Northgate on it, too.

    2) This new IBM has way more contacts inside than keys. I realize this is so they can produce one electronic assembly to support 15 languages, but I wonder what the other contacts would do if I hit them. Maybe I'll get bored later today.

    3) IBM's subassembly quality control has really hit the can. I realize this is a $5 keyboard, which by its design expects a certain number of defects, but if you could see how badly aligned the springmat was in this thing... SHEESH!

    --
    "Lawyers are for sucks."
    - Doug McKenzie
    1. Re:I had to fix my keyboard Monday by ayjay29 · · Score: 4, Funny

      What a coincidence -- I actually had to take my work KB (a new IBM mush-model similar to the one in the article) aart to fix it Monday because the 'P' key was getting less and less reliable, and my tying was steadily getting worse.

      When I oed the 'P' key off and looked underneath, the rubber contact mat was off center, like it had been stretched underneath so the contact didn't line u under the key. I ulled a few screws, blew out the dust and the rubber sring mat that lies on the contacts was misaligned by, like, 1/4 inch in areas. I ulled it off and tried to re-align it roerly when I realized that the lastic/mylar/whatever contact sheet on the bottom wasn't flat either - like a rug that wasn't quite cut the correct shae for a room, there was a hum in it. I loosened the screws around the contacts to the CB and I was able to then flatten the contact sheet and retighten, then realign the rubber sringmat and reassemble.

      Voila! erfect. I want to oint out three things.

      1) It's still not a model M. If you find an old one GET IT, even if it's missing a few keys. Your neighbors' neighbors will hate all the clicking, but your fingers will be very, very hay. I ersonally have one of these as well as an original Northgate Omnikey Ultra urchased by me from Northgate Inc. in 1990 which was in use until March of this year. I relaced it because I bought a new C and wanted a wireless KB. Every collector's shelf should have a Northgate on it, too.

      2) This new IBM has way more contacts inside than keys. I realize this is so they can roduce one electronic assembly to suort 15 languages, but I wonder what the other contacts would do if I hit them. Maybe I'll get bored later today.

      3) IBM's subassembly quality control has really hit the can. I realize this is a $5 keyboard, which by its design exects a certain number of defects, but if you could see how badly aligned the sringmat was in this thing... SHEESH!

      --
      Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated up.
  30. PCkeyboard.com keyboards -- so good! by willith · · Score: 4, Informative

    I've got one of the keyboards mentioned in the article--specifically, the 101-key Customizer, from www.pckeyboard.com. It weighs about five pounds, and feels like it could be used to bash in an intruder's head if necessary. Plus, it doesn't have Windows keys, which is a boon when I'm gaming--no more accidentally dumping me out to the desktop during heated Battlefield 1942 matches!

    It's buckling-spring and loud as hell, though it doesn't sound quite the same as a Model M. Still key response is crisp and exactly matches what I want out of a keyboard. It is easily the best computer-related purchase I have ever made. After all, what part of your computer do you physically interact with every time you sit down?

  31. The One True Keyboard by cybermace5 · · Score: 3, Informative

    A few weeks ago I killed my Ortek keyboard. It wasn't a great keyboard; it had the "silent" mushy-keys and plenty of useless "internet" and "media" chiclet buttons. The Enter key broke and I'd fastend it with a small screw (which surprisingly didn't interfere with typing). It died in the most cliched way possible: direct coffee spillage.

    The same day I drove down to Office Max to get an emergency keyboard. Everything was pretty much worthless, even compared to my old keyboard. I finally settled on a Logitech media keyboard solely on the feel of it.

    I used it for about a day, then heard someone commenting on IBM Model M and Northgate keyboards. I remembered the little worthless 486 test server I had sitting in my closet, and remembered the keyboard attached to it was a Northgate. I walked over and pressed the keys...click click. Smiled, grabbed AT-to-PS/2 adapter, and replaced the new Logitech.

    I'll never go back. In fact, I surprised I used anything else, because that old keyboard used to be my main keyboard back in the day. When it dies, I'll get an Avant Stellar, which is a remake of the original Northgate using the original design documents and manufacturing processes.

    Every key has a perfectly balanced snap action. It provides just the right amount of force before the key clicks in, and once you hear the click you know the key has been pressed. It might sound like someone with a clicky keyboard is really pounding on it, but ideally it allows you to flit over the keyboard without having to mash every key down to the bottom to ensure it was pressed. You learn to hear each keypress, and can often catch an accidental extra letter by ear.

    And now you know why all the old laptops had a "key-click" noisemaking feature, sometimes in the BIOS.

    --
    ...
  32. Kinesis keyboard by cerberusss · · Score: 4, Informative
    Just thought people might find this interesting:

    A year ago, I got myself a Kinesis Contoured keyboard. It took me two weeks and a couple of hours of TuxTyping to get used to it, but since then it's great. I've never had any real RSI, but the Kinesis makes you sit more comfortable. You sit with straight arms; horizontally as well as in a straight angle.

    It's quite expensive, though. :-/

    --
    8 of 13 people found this answer helpful. Did you?
  33. Slashdotting? by barnaclebarnes · · Score: 4, Funny

    "Today's websites aren't what they used to be, no sir! Back in my day, we had our caching technology; our wesites had redundency which allowed 'em to be slashdotted and still work - barely dented. Yes those were the days."

    --
    [Please type your sig here.]
    1. Re:Slashdotting? by PetWolverine · · Score: 2, Funny

      I like the comparison of the /. effect to being thrown from 3 stories up onto concrete. Very appropriate.

      --
      I found the meaning of life the other day, but I had write-only access.
  34. BS technology by YeeHaW_Jelte · · Score: 2, Funny

    Until he finally explained on page 2 that BS technology is an abreviation for Buckling Spring technology, I was reading Bullshit technology every time.

    --

    ---
    "The chances of a demonic possession spreading are remote -- relax."
  35. The other article... by TrekkieGod · · Score: 3, Interesting
    I got this link from the article, where it's mentioned that ergonomic keyboards aren't all they're cracked out to be...and it's a hilarious piece of work.

    To the lazy people, lemme reproduce the link:

    What I find funny, besides the comment that what causes limb disorders is the stress of deadlines and not the keyboard (citing gamers who supposedly don't have any problems, hah!), is the author's choice of pictures. I guess I can understand lara croft, but what's with the cat? And look at the caption on that picture...I don't know, I have a weird sense of humor, maybe it's just funny to me.

    --

    Warning: Opinions known to be heavily biased.

  36. Apple used to make the best keyboards... by artemis67 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    before they got all artsy-fartsy. Now the keyboard is the first thing I toss when I buy a new Mac.

    I loved how the caps lock actually locked down at half-height on the old Apple Pro Keyboard, so you could tell by touch if the caps lock was on.

    1. Re:Apple used to make the best keyboards... by Large+Green+Mallard · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I rip the caps-lock key off my keyboards as soon as I get them out of the box.. it annoys me greatly and I never use it.

  37. ModelM by gregRowe · · Score: 2, Informative

    I recently bought a Model-M for work. It's brand new (but was built in 1999, as can be seen from the sticker on the back).

    www.pckeyboard.com sells them. If they are out of IBM model-Ms you can buy buckling spring keyboards made by unicomp. For an extra 5$ you can get "cap and stem" which is removable keycaps.

    When I bought from unicomp it was a pleasure. They keyboard arrived very quickly.

    --
    There\'s no place like ~
  38. Apple Extended Keyboard II by mccalli · · Score: 3, Informative
    Still the best I've ever used. Cost me £124 in about 1992/93, and worth every penny. That last point is relevant - so many people take a keyboard for granted that they're unwilling to spend extra on better quality. Thus they end up sticking with whatever rubbish arrived with their machine (don't they, IBM Netstation customers...?)

    I've used many keyboards since of course, and whilst I seem to have settled on Microsoft keyboards these days I still haven't found anything nicer than the ancient Apple. Co-incidently (or not, as the case may be...) the keyboard on the 12" Powerbook is also extremely nice.

    Cheers,
    Ian

  39. All my input... by WeeLad · · Score: 2, Funny
    ..is voice rekonishun u insensssitive klod!!!

    --
    Seriously, Don't take anything I say seriously.
  40. If you want a good keyboard by Gherald · · Score: 2, Informative

    Check out the Logitech Elite there at the top. Best keyboard made.

    Alternatively, if you just need something simple for office use, or to purchase in volume, the Mitsumi KFK-EA4XT is a solid no-frills keyboard. I use it on all my secondary systems.

  41. Condensed? by gilesjuk · · Score: 2, Funny

    DoesThatMeanTheyHadABrokenSpaceBar? :)

  42. IBM keyboards still for sale by MavEtJu · · Score: 2, Informative

    Have a look at http://www.pckeyboard.com/.

    Asked them one time how much it costs to get one shipped to .au but euh... I wasn't happy with the price. I've asked them again, maybe the price has dropped a little bit.

    --
    bash$ :(){ :|:&};:
  43. Price and innovation by UnknowingFool · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The author notes how durable keyboards used to be and easier to clean. But back then keyboards were designed to a different standard. The were desinged to last and sometimes to be repaired. Modern computer accessories are almost designed to be disposable. That extends to the computer and electronics nowadays. I mean when was the last time anyone actually took a TV to be repaired. More often if a TV or radio breaks, people just buy a new one. Computer are to the point where most people simply replace their old ones instead of upgrading. Ordinary mice and keyboards are in

    Although he doesn't mention it, but how much did they cost back then? Adjusting for inflation, they probably cost more than new ones cost today. One thing it interesting to note that most of the functionality hasn't changed. Sure newer keyboards are wireless and have additional buttons, but older ones work just as well.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  44. Useless keys by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Newer keyboards have all these keys that I don't use but I don't mind them too much as they are optional from manufacturers. The one useless key that I hate is that damn Windows key. It always gets in my way when I use CTRL and ALT. As far as I can tell it's completely useless for most everyday functions. Incidently, I've noticed it's in the exact position as the Apple key on Apple keyboards. But on the Apple it is better spaced to avoid conusion and it is used for shortcuts.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
    1. Re:Useless keys by dasunt · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Er, what do you mean the Window key is useless? There are several shortcuts associated with it (a Short List), and its useful to map to other apps as well. For example, Win+Z|X|C|V|B is set up on my MS Windows machine to control winamp, regardless of whatever app is focused at the time.

      Its possible to use the windows key in a similiar fashion under XFree86, hotkeying combos to certain actions.

  45. I look forward to the day ... by JSkills · · Score: 4, Funny
    I look forward to the day when there are no need for keyboards. What a ridiculous way to communicate for people who can speak and think.

    Don't get me wrong - I code for a living, so I can certainly appreciate the value of the keyboard as a user interface peripheral. A good friend of mine who had RSI in his wrists really bad switched to using Dragon speech recognition software exclusively. Listening to him attempt to code (in Perl) was pretty funny, e.g. saying "twiddle" for "~" and such.

    Mod me down for being off topic, but I cannot resist mentioning the Star Trek (#4 - with the whales) movie where Scottie attempts to use the computer from the past by talking to it.

    "Computer, please calculate the mass of ..."
    "No Scottie, you have to use this" (pointing to the mouse).
    "Oh, okay". He picks up the mouse like it is a policeman's radio and begins to speak into it "Computer, please calculate the mass of ... ".

    It just goes to show how far off we are in terms of a truely intuitive user interface.

  46. Re:All this talk of the best keyboards ... by skurk · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Stavr0 wrote:
    For this, I nominate the ZX-81 keyboard WORST KEYBOARD EVER.

    Funny, I just mentioned the ZX81 keyboard in a comment I just wrote under the same subject.

    And yes, I agree. In 3rd grade at school, we had an optional course called "Basic Computer Programming", where we were tought how to program on the ZX81.

    Now, when these computers were brand new, the keyboards were "fine". But since every school has its bullies, and bullies tend to use more physical force than required, these keyboards wore out after a couple of weeks. To compensate for the worn out keyboards, we had to press even harder to have our keystrokes registered...

    Oh, the sore fingertips we had..

    --
    www.6502asm.com - Code 6502 assembly or.. DIE!!
  47. Re:All this talk of the best keyboards ... by ivan256 · · Score: 2, Funny

    I still have my Sinclair, and I agree about the keyboard. It was like little bubbles that you depressed. The "L" bubble is worn through on mine, so I can't load programs anymore! Talk about shitty...

  48. Want an IBM Model M? by mblase · · Score: 2, Informative

    Apparently you can find them for sale, albeit in limited quantities, here (as well as on eBay, natch).

    There's a site all about the thing at www.modelm.org, but I can't get to the server right now, so here's a Google cache instead.

  49. PCKeyboard.com by jkujawa · · Score: 4, Informative
    You can buy both reconditioned original IBM Model Ms at PCKeyboard.com, or the Customizer, which PCKeyboard is actually manufacturing.


    Quality, Durable and Flexible These words best describe Unicomp's Customizer keyboard. Based on an award winning design, the Customizer combines the same quality and crisp tactile feedback as its IBM and Lexmark predecessors. The Pearl White Customizer (shown here) is available in either enhanced quiet touch (EQT) or buckling spring (BS) technology The enhanced quiet touch style is great for noise sensitive environments, and the buckling spring model offers a touch that is unparalleled. Once you've experienced the touch of this keyboard, you'll be sold.


    They have it in black now, too. Unfortunately, they still don't have a USB version.
  50. IBM PS/2 keyboard? Pshaw..try these... by wandazulu · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Though they only worked with terminals, the *real* manly keyboard in a world of manly keyboards was the IBM 3270/5250 terminal keyboard. Twenty-four function keys across the top, ten special purpose function keys on the left side, arrow keys actually laid out in a diamond shape instead of the common upside-down T, a numeric keypad, and a keyboard cable so thick it could be used to support bridges.

    Add to the fact that it had a metal casing similar to the original IBM keyboard whereas the later model keyboards, and all the PS/2 keyboards are plastic. Tough plastic to be sure, but I still was able to chip and crack one.

    With all that you had a keyboard that weighed two pounds!

    I rescued one from a dumpster, but couldn't figure out the pin configuration to make any kind of whatever-to-ps2 adapter.

    Even stranger were the IBM 3278 terminal keyboards..they had a weird form of tactile feedback that has to be used to be believed. They were more conventional in terms of layout, but were packaged into a case that, while detached from the terminal itself, was a massive block of metal that weighed in at 2+ pounds.

    The strangest keyboard I think IBM ever made was a keyboard for the Chinese; it was big (I think it was about two feet square) and was laid out like a giant tablet; the left side was a massive set of overlays and "mushy" buttons" with individual characters, and the right side had conventional keys a la the 3270/5250 keyboard. I wish I had some pictures of it...it was in IBM's computer exhibit at the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago for years and years, but that exhibit has long since disappeared and with it the keyboard.

    You gotta hand it to IBM...they built their (mainframe) equipment to last. I fully expect to be sitting at the Social Security office when I'm 70+, complaining about my measly $2.53 check with a person sitting in front of an IBM terminal with one of those massive metal keyboards. Fun!

  51. Morse code keyboard by ch-chuck · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Here's my antique keyboard it punches morse code tapes.

    --
    try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
  52. I agree completely. by HFXPro · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I used to have problems with my hands hurting after coding all night (for my own fun) with keyboards of the normal type including the IBM model M (I have 3 anyone want one). My outfingers joints would ache, and my hands hurt from twisting my hand into contortions attempting to press all of the special keys which get used quite often while programming.

    I went through several keyboards looking for one which would make it less painful to do something which I really enjoyed. I never wanted to admit to buying anything of an ergonimic keyboard especially one from Microsoft. However, after working on a friends all night, I didn't notice the pain from using it. I ended up ordering a simple Microsoft Elite with the parts for a new computer.

    Since using the this keyboard I find my fingers have rarely hurt unless I'm typing really fast for extended periods of time. Other benefits of this keyboard is that it is reasonably quiet (I don't wake up the house with my typing now) and it feels really good. I don't plan on getting another keyboard anytime soon. The only company that I can say comes close to Microsofts keyboards and mice (I've tried several also) is Logitech (whose mice I usually prefer)

    --
    Reserved Word.
  53. Leading Edge by bzant · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I have 2 keyboards from Leading Edge 286s. These keyboards are a joy to use. Everytime I see one at a garage sale, or Goodwill I snap it up. I have given them to friends and family, to spread the joy of "real" keyboards.

  54. Q: where do I find a true programmable keyboard??? by orim · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Hey folks,

    since we're talking about keyboards. I am surprised nobody mentioned programmable keyboards yet. Does anyone use/can recommend any good programmable keyboards these days?

    The one I've used is Gateway's model... I think it's called AnyKey kb. Had four extra buttons in the top right, Program Macro(sticking a series of keystrokes into one key press), Remap(remapping a single key), and an extra column of function keys on the left hand side.

    In any case, in my programming duties, I often find myself needing to do things like reformat 50 lines in an identical fashion. Like take out first four chars on a line, indent, put AAA there, go to next line.
    So with this kb, you didn't have to use software, you just record a macro, use it 50 times, and you're done! Life saver for the fingers/wrists/carpal tunnel.

    Any info appreciated!

    --
    "If you could only see what I've seen with your eyes..." - Roy Batty
  55. Avant Stellar by Animus+Howard · · Score: 2, Informative

    It's funny that I never see the Avant Stellar (http://www.cvtinc.com/) mentioned in these discussions about keyboards. It has a significant flaw (see below) but it's still my favorite. Great "clicky" feel, very firm, 100% programmable, macros, two sets of function keys (so you can reprogram the ones you don't normally use)... Lots of good stuff!

    The problem is that their programming software doesn't work on NT/2000/XP, just 95/98/ME. It's not a problem for me because I use a KVM switch to connect six systems to the same keyboard/monitor/mouse, and one of my systems is Windows 98, so I just run the software on that system and switch to it when I need to change something.

    I have it programmed so that some of the unused function keys have macros that tell the KVM to switch to different systems. Single-key switching from Windows 2000 to Linux...

  56. windows dvorak support by lordlod · · Score: 2, Informative

    "... all windows versions greater than 3.11 are Dvorak compliant, and a simple setting can change the layout setting."

    As a user that normally runs dvorak and occasionly windows I can assure you this isn't quite true.

    I've used a dvorak mapping in windows 98, 2000 and XP and all have buggy implementations, though they are getting slightly better. The catch is that the remappable keys seems to have been a tacked on feature, some programs will work, some programs will work for a while and some seem to use direct keyboard access, ignoring any mapping.

    For example I recall I was working with a notepad session and a command prompt. After a while the command prompt decided it would start running qwerty, so everytime I switched between the windows I had to pause to remind myself which keyboard mapping I was using. Games are also really bad, Half-life for example uses the dvorak mapping in the menu but uses stardard qwerty layout in the game. This makes key binding from the menu a wonderful activity.

    I've been running dvorak for about 8 months now and its not about speed, its all in the name of comfort.

  57. Better than the IBM "M" keyboard by senahj · · Score: 2, Informative

    was the Northgate Computer Systems Omnikey.

    For those of us who learned to program before the
    advent of the IBM PC, they have the "correct" layout
    (the layout for which and with which vi was developed)
    with the control key just to the left of the 'a', As God Intended)*
    Buckling spring, Alps switches, removable keycaps, steel base,
    fully programmable key assignments, DIP switches for common
    configuration options. Indispensible and indestructible.

    I have two, and they continue to work perfectly after
    lo these many years, and there's a brisk market for them
    on ebay (lots of old hackers treasure them).

    But they're no longer made.

    Fortunately, CTI makes a close copy. The Avant Stellar
    is by all accounts superb, and bears the Tibor Polgar seal of approval.
    Buy a couple while they're still made, and you're set for life.

    The Customizer seems to be similar, but I have no experience with this keyboard.

    * and if you're one of those people like me who has spent the
    last twenty years cursing IBM for screwing up the layout of
    ASCII keyboards for all time by fiddling with the the
    One True Layout (with the control key to the left of the 'a'),
    then you may be happy to know about the superb small program
    ctrl2cap from Systems Internals, which makes the
    usless never-to-be-sufficiently-damned caps lock key
    into a control key. Tiny, slick, sophisticated, open source, free.
    Check it out.

    --
    Wait a minute. Didn't I say that on the other side of the record? I'd better check ...
  58. BS? Give me the Hall Effect by ratboy666 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Back in the day (before "PC") we had REAL word processors. the MICOM P2000 came with a keyboard that had magnets in plungers, and solid-state pickups for each of the keys. A spring completed the key assembly. Very weighty keys, slowed down the typing nicely. Since switches, etc. were not involved, dishwashers were routinely employed to clean them. And these keyboards were servicable. And they weighed in at 15lbs (7 kilos). Which made them a VERY formidable weapon.

    Before that I used an ASR-33. WHACK WHACK WHACK. Very satisfying. Built up my finger strength. Problem is, now I punch holes THROUGH these new "girly-man" keyboards. Such posers.

    Seriously, the IBM BS keyboards are my favorites. A bit noisy, but the tactile feedback is worth it. My current keyboard (some "no-name" thing) has the nasty habit of "vibrating" at the bottom end of each keystroke. Feels nasty.

    Ratboy.

    --
    Just another "Cubible(sic) Joe" 2 17 3061
  59. Re:Q: where do I find a true programmable keyboard by yoyodyne · · Score: 2, Informative

    This is nice:
    http://www.monu-cad.com/keyboard.htm

  60. QWERTY wasn't about slowing the typist! by jgoeres · · Score: 2, Informative
    The idea that QWERTY was designed specifically to slow users' typing is a myth. It was designed to prevent key jamming, but the way it accomplished this was through a key arrangement that made it likely that the hammers for commonly paired letters would come from different parts of the bank (not necessarily opposite sides -- just sufficiently distant from each other).

    Of course, the side effect of that was sub-optimal typing speed and accuracy, but it certainly wasn't done just for that reason.

  61. PCKeyboard.com by retro128 · · Score: 2, Informative
    When my old clicky keyboard broke down I searched far and wide for a replacement. I didn't want el cheapo keyboard for $10 from the corner corner store...I wanted a brick, like the first IBM PS/2 keyboards. Eventually all paths lead to PCKeyboard.com. The blurb from their webpage reads as follows:

    Unicomp is a keyboard manufacturer located in the heart of Bluegrass Country, Lexington, Kentucky. Yes, we are a new company; but if you know IBM or if you know Lexmark International, you already know a good bit about us. Unicomp was started in April, 1996 when we purchased keyboard technology from Lexmark International. You may recall that Lexmark manufactured the high quality keyboards for IBM computers and terminals prior to 1996.

    In other words, these things are about as close to the original IBM keyboards as you can get. I've owned mine for three years now and I love it.
    --
    -R
  62. Condensed history? Yeah right! by shrikel · · Score: 3, Interesting
    This isn't a condensed history! It's a two page paper on the difference between two IBM keyboards, and a little commentary on why he likes the old keyboards better. Oh, plus two paragraphs on why the qwerty and dvorak keyboards were invented.

    Which is BS, by the way. It wasn't to avoid jamming the keys by slowing the typist down, but by making sure the commonly-used key levers weren't close enough to each other to jam. And I think that the dvorak layout was designed to put the most commonly-used keys right under the fingertips, not just within reach of the "strongest fingers." Geez, like you need really STRONG fingers to type faster.

    I have no problem with talking all you like about the differences between keyboards and why you prefer one over the other. Reminiscing is fun sometimes. But don't tout it as a "condensed history of the keyboard." Just call it "One guy's ideas about keyboards."

    --
    Any sufficiently simple magic can be passed off as mere advanced technology.
  63. Fable of the Fable by cryptoluddite · · Score: 2, Interesting
    The site mentions Liebowitz's article that contrary to common sense and empirical data the QWERTY layout is better than the Dvorak one. Lieby claims Dvorak (the man) used special texts designed to make his keyboard look superior, but you can try it yourself on virtually any text and verify Dvorak's numbers.

    Dvorak users consistently report less effort in typing and that it just "feels" better, but they must be wrong since QWERTY is better. QED. Even though the fastest typer uses dvorak and other dvorak typers cleaned house in competitions, these results are all faked or "suspect". Even though all reason points to markets acheiving local maxima, just like theory says they should, Liebo insists that if one just defines the value of technology based on what the market has chosen then it proves that the market always right.

    And oh yeah, therefore Microsoft never had an OS monopoly.

  64. Re:My favorite keyboard by smilingirl · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I love my Dell QuietKey keyboard. I don't understand why everyone is raving about those old IBM keyboards. Not only were they loud, but it takes a little more force to push down on those keys, which hinders my typing speed. I type *extremely* fast on my Dell QuietKey and it is very comfortable for my tiny fingers. I have very small girly fingers, and a smaller keyboard with easier-to-push keys is great for me. Plus, it's quiet, which is nice for my poor roommate in the old dorm room. And its smaller size means more space on the tiny desk in the dorm room. Those old IBM keyboards are so archaic.

    But maybe that's just me.

    --
    The Present is the point at which time touches eternity. - C.S. Lewis
  65. Re:Q: where do I find a true programmable keyboard by orim · · Score: 2, Informative

    I agree with your sentiment on those useless volume control-multimedia keys. What a waste of kb space.
    However, when it comes to recording short macros, I prefer mine completely on the kb-side.
    1) They're faster
    2) OS-independent
    3) Easier to record
    4) Sometimes applications read keystrokes "more directly" than the macro-recorder/playback software. Can't explain it better than that, except that the software solutions don't always work in all the apps.

    --
    "If you could only see what I've seen with your eyes..." - Roy Batty
  66. key debouncing story by bzipitidoo · · Score: 2, Funny

    Once had a keyboard with a minor defect. The '6' key (the one above the letters, not the keypad one) felt normal, but would usually spit out "666" each time it was hit. All the other keys were fine. Got pretty annoying typing "6^H^H" to get a 6. I finally donated it to a Christian charity.

    --
    Intellectual Property is a monopolistic, selfish, and defective concept. It is "tyranny over the mind of man"