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Announcing GNOME 2.4.0 for FreeBSD
Dan writes "FreeBSD's Joe Marcus Clarke says that GNOME 2.4.0 is now available for FreeBSD. Unfortunately, due to timing issues with FreeBSD 4.9-RELEASE, it will not make it into the official ports tree until after 4.9 is released (looks like early October right now). In the meantime, you can get to it from his CVS tree. For those without CVS access, he has periodic tarballs made, and are downloadable from the same URL. You should also download the marcusmerge script to aid in merging his ports tree with the official tree. If you already have a copy of the script, download it again because things have changed." Update: 09/18 15:25 GMT by M : FreeBSD's Joe Marcus Clarke says due to popular demand, but more importantly to the fact that 4.9-RELEASE has been pushed back at least two weeks, GNOME 2.40 has been merged into the ports tree.
Do people still actually USE FreeBSD? Wasn't it rendered obsolete by Linux YEARS ago?
BSD could be undead.
BSD trolls are rendered obsolete.
;)]
Take this! *KAPOW*
And that! *BOFF*
Holy schnikes, Batman! The Penguin is getting away!
Oh, no he's not, Robin! *BLAM*
[FreeBSD runs quite nicely on my laptop, thanks.
-- I'd say your post was about 3 monkeys, 18 minutes.
FreeBSD won't die if people keep porting software to it. So, cut it out people
If Mr. Edison had thought smarter he wouldn't sweat as much. --Nikola Tesla
WEWET A GNEW GNU GNOME GOING gIN un-GNU-FREEBESD!!@!@(&!@* WEWEWEWET
this gPost sponsored by gALEON
I feel sorry for the poor guy. If he knew how much GNOME licked crotch, he would be able to channel his talents in other directions.
Sad.
It is common knowledge that *BSD is dying, that ever hapless *BSD is mired in an irrecoverable and mortifying tangle of fatal trouble. It is perhaps anybody's guess as to which *BSD is the worst off of an admittedly suffering *BSD community. The numbers continue to decline for *BSD but FreeBSD may be hurting the most. Look at the numbers. The loss of user base for FreeBSD continues in a head spinning downward spiral.
OpenBSD leader Theo states that there are 7000 users of OpenBSD. How many users of BSD are there? Let's see. The number of OpenBSD versus NetBSD posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 NetBSD users. BSD/OS posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of NetBSD posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of BSD/OS. A recent article put FreeBSD at about 80 percent of the *BSD market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 FreeBSD users. This is consistent with the number of FreeBSD Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Walnut Creek, abysmal sales and so on, FreeBSD went out of business and was taken over by BSDI who sell another troubled OS. Now BSDI is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major marketing surveys show that *BSD has steadily declined in market share. *BSD is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If *BSD is to survive at all it will be among hobbyist dilettante dabblers. In truth, for all practical purposes *BSD is already dead. It is a dead man walking.
Fact: *BSD is dying
A marriage made in the graveyard!
*BSD is perfectly alive and well. Why else would the developers of GNOME bother to make a new version for it? You trolls can suck my big fat cock.
Repeal the DMCA!
Now if you had a tight pussy, good tits and a firm arse..
One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered *BSD community when IDC confirmed that *BSD market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all servers. Coming on the heels of a recent Netcraft survey which plainly states that *BSD has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. *BSD is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last in the recent Sys Admin comprehensive networking test.
You don't need to be a Kreskin to predict *BSD's future. The hand writing is on the wall: *BSD faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for *BSD because *BSD is dying. Things are looking very bad for *BSD. As many of us are already aware, *BSD continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.
FreeBSD is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time FreeBSD developers Jordan Hubbard and Mike Smith only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: FreeBSD is dying.
Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.
OpenBSD leader Theo states that there are 7000 users of OpenBSD. How many users of NetBSD are there? Let's see. The number of OpenBSD versus NetBSD posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 NetBSD users. BSD/OS posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of NetBSD posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of BSD/OS. A recent article put FreeBSD at about 80 percent of the *BSD market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 FreeBSD users. This is consistent with the number of FreeBSD Usenet posts.
Due to the troubles of Walnut Creek, abysmal sales and so on, FreeBSD went out of business and was taken over by BSDI who sell another troubled OS. Now BSDI is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.
All major surveys show that *BSD has steadily declined in market share. *BSD is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If *BSD is to survive at all it will be among OS dilettante dabblers. *BSD continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, *BSD is dead.
Fact: *BSD is dying
When features get added to *BSD, it always remind me of the way that a man's hair and fingernails keep growing after he's died.
and os detection is not even in the list of its top features.
PF is [Open|Net|Free]BSD. FreeBSD PF news.
FreeBSD homepage.
NetBSD PF news.
NetBSD PF homepage.
-- I'd say your post was about 3 monkeys, 18 minutes.
I remember once people on deadly.org praising the fact that GNOME 2.0 (or 2.2? I can't rememeber now) was easily ported to OpenBSD.
It's great that GNOME is easily and quickly portable beyond Linux and Solaris (where people is pouring money on it) - GNOME hackers are on the way to make a truly industry-standard desktop environment. Go GNOME!
Cesar Cardoso can be found at cesar at zyakannazio dot eti dot br (or at least I believe so)
When GNOME was Miguel Icaza's baby the code was written in a non-standard and non portable way.
Amazingly Miguel Icaza is considered a 'great coder', yet couldn't be bothered to write portable code.
Once Miguel Icaza left the project, the GNOME code started to become portable and the project adopted a motto of 'it don't ship unless it runs on Solaris/FreeBSD and other UNIXes beyond GNU/Linux.'
The real programmers took over and got the code portable.
For christ's sake!
It's a DAEMON, not a GNOME!!!
I really don't get the reasons behind putting version numbers on a mascot, but hey... whatever floats your boat.
Not Free(as in beer). Free(as in "I'm free to beat you over the head for being a dumbass")
Er. I think you're being trolled. I hadn't intended to come across as correcting whether pf is part of OpenBSD or not.
pf is a project of OpenBSD: True.
pf is now available to the other BSDs: True.
This is good for *BSD: True.
Cheers!
-- I'd say your post was about 3 monkeys, 18 minutes.
Does freebsd 5 use the same ports tree as the 4.x series?
Does it support as many ports as 4.x?
Will GNOME 2.4 be available in the next release of freebsd 5.x?
What We Can Learn From BSD
By Chinese Karma Whore, Version 1.0
Everyone knows about BSD's failure and imminent demise. As we pore over the history of BSD, we'll uncover a story of fatal mistakes, poor priorities, and personal rivalry, and we'll learn what mistakes to avoid so as to save Linux from a similarly grisly fate.
Let's not be overly morbid and give BSD credit for its early successes. In the 1970s, Ken Thompson and Bill Joy both made significant contributions to the computing world on the BSD platform. In the 80s, DARPA saw BSD as the premiere open platform, and, after initial successes with the 4.1BSD product, gave the BSD company a 2 year contract.
These early triumphs would soon be forgotten in a series of internal conflicts that would mar BSD's progress. In 1992, AT&T filed suit against Berkeley Software, claiming that proprietary code agreements had been haphazardly violated. In the same year, BSD filed countersuit, reciprocating bad intentions and fueling internal rivalry. While AT&T and Berkeley Software lawyers battled in court, lead developers of various BSD distributions quarreled on Usenet. In 1995, Theo de Raadt, one of the founders of the NetBSD project, formed his own rival distribution, OpenBSD, as the result of a quarrel that he documents [theos.com] on his website. Mr. de Raadt's stubborn arrogance was later seen in his clash with Darren Reed, which resulted in the expulsion of IPF from the OpenBSD distribution.
As personal rivalries took precedence over a quality product, BSD's codebase became worse and worse. As we all know, incompatibilities between each BSD distribution make code sharing an arduous task. Research conducted at MIT found BSD's filesystem implementation to be "very poorly performing." Even BSD's acclaimed TCP/IP stack has lagged behind, according to this study.
Problems with BSD's codebase were compounded by fundamental flaws in the BSD design approach. As argued by Eric Raymond in his watershed essay, The Cathedral and the Bazaar, rapid, decentralized development models are inherently superior to slow, centralized ones in software development. BSD developers never heeded Mr. Raymond's lesson and insisted that centralized models lead to 'cleaner code.' Don't believe their hype - BSD's development model has significantly impaired its progress. Any achievements that BSD managed to make were nullified by the BSD license, which allows corporations and coders alike to reap profits without reciprocating the goodwill of open-source. Fortunately, Linux is not prone to this exploitation, as it is licensed under the GPL.
The failure of BSD culminated in the resignation of Jordan Hubbard and Michael Smith from the FreeBSD core team. They both believed that FreeBSD had long lost its earlier vitality. Like an empire in decline, BSD had become bureaucratic and stagnant. As Linux gains market share and as BSD sinks deeper into the mire of decay, their parting addresses will resound as fitting eulogies to BSD's demise.
The *BSD Wailing Song
What's left for me to see
In my ship I sailed so far
What can the answer be
Don't know what the questions are.
And after all I've done
Still I cannot feel the sun
Tell me save me
In the end our lost souls must repent.
I must know it is for certain
Can it be the final curtain
As long as the wind will blow
I'll be searching high and low.
Who knows what's really true
They say the end is so near
Why are we all so cruel
We just fill ourselves with fear.
And heaven and hell will turn
All that we love shall burn
Hear me trust me
Inthe end our lost sould must repent.
I must know it is for certain
Can it be the final curtain
As long as the wind will blow
I'll be searching high and low
Final curtain
Final curtain
Also, the FreeBSD release engineering team consists of ten to twenty individually caged chimpanzees with WebTVs that are captured, infected with rabies, and replaced promptly upon death. If no chimpanzees are available, a core team member interested in streamlining the bureaucracy is used.
This is not a troll. This is the truth.
Hi. Allow me to introduce myself. I'm FreeBSD. A lot of you are saying I'm dead. I assure you that is not the case.
:-)
Dying? Definition 6. from http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=dying reads:
6. To become indifferent: had died to all worldly concerns.
Apply this definition to your constant bickering over whether or not I'm dead and I'll agree.
Over the last twenty something years I've been through a lot. But through it all I've been reliable and dependable.
Over the next few years I'm going to show you what the terms "scalability," "efficiency," and "security" really mean.
So shut your pie holes and keep coding. Maybe you'll have a hope in hell of keeping up with me.
Yours truly,
FreeBSD
1. You can not play games on it.
2. It cannot be used by my grandma.
3. It lacks a GUI of any note.
4. There is no support available for it.
5. It is an assortment of fragmented OSes.
6. It cannot be run on the x86 platform.
7. You have to compile everything and know C.
8. Support for the latest hardware is always poor.
9. It is incompatiable with GNU/Linux.
10.It is dying.
I don't want to start a holy war here, but what is the deal with you BSD fanatics? I've been sitting here at my freelance gig in front of a BSD box (a PIII 800 w/512 Megs of RAM) for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to copy a 17 Meg file from one folder on the hard drive to another folder. 20 minutes. At home, on my Pentium Pro 200 running NT 4, which by all standards should be a lot slower than this BSD box, the same operation would take about 2 minutes. If that.
In addition, during this file transfer, Netscape will not work. And everything else has ground to a halt. Even Emacs Lite is straining to keep up as I type this.
I won't bore you with the laundry list of other problems that I've encountered while working on various BSD machines, but suffice it to say there have been many, not the least of which is I've never seen a BSD box that has run faster than its Windows counterpart, despite the BSD machines faster chip architecture. My 486/66 with 8 megs of ram runs faster than this 800 mhz machine at times. From a productivity standpoint, I don't get how people can claim that BSD is a "superior" machine.
BSD addicts, flame me if you'd like, but I'd rather hear some intelligent reasons why anyone would choose to use a BSD over other faster, cheaper, more stable systems.
[ed. note: in the following text, former FreeBSD developer Mike Smith gives his reasons for abandoning FreeBSD]
When I stood for election to the FreeBSD core team nearly two years ago, many of you will recall that it was after a long series of debates during which I maintained that too much organisation, too many rules and too much formality would be a bad thing for the project.
Today, as I read the latest discussions on the future of the FreeBSD project, I see the same problem; a few new faces and many of the old going over the same tired arguments and suggesting variations on the same worthless schemes. Frankly I'm sick of it.
FreeBSD used to be fun. It used to be about doing things the right way. It used to be something that you could sink your teeth into when the mundane chores of programming for a living got you down. It was something cool and exciting; a way to spend your spare time on an endeavour you loved that was at the same time wholesome and worthwhile.
It's not anymore. It's about bylaws and committees and reports and milestones, telling others what to do and doing what you're told. It's about who can rant the longest or shout the loudest or mislead the most people into a bloc in order to legitimise doing what they think is best. Individuals notwithstanding, the project as a whole has lost track of where it's going, and has instead become obsessed with process and mechanics.
So I'm leaving core. I don't want to feel like I should be "doing something" about a project that has lost interest in having something done for it. I don't have the energy to fight what has clearly become a losing battle; I have a life to live and a job to keep, and I won't achieve any of the goals I personally consider worthwhile if I remain obligated to care for the project.
Discussion
I'm sure that I've offended some people already; I'm sure that by the time I'm done here, I'll have offended more. If you feel a need to play to the crowd in your replies rather than make a sincere effort to address the problems I'm discussing here, please do us the courtesy of playing your politics openly.
From a technical perspective, the project faces a set of challenges that significantly outstrips our ability to deliver. Some of the resources that we need to address these challenges are tied up in the fruitless metadiscussions that have raged since we made the mistake of electing officers. Others have left in disgust, or been driven out by the culture of abuse and distraction that has grown up since then. More may well remain available to recruitment, but while the project is busy infighting our chances for successful outreach are sorely diminished.
There's no simple solution to this. For the project to move forward, one or the other of the warring philosophies must win out; either the project returns to its laid-back roots and gets on with the work, or it transforms into a super-organised engineering project and executes a brilliant plan to deliver what, ultimately, we all know we want.
Whatever path is chosen, whatever balance is struck, the choosing and the striking are the important parts. The current indecision and endless conflict are incompatible with any sort of progress.
Trying to dissect the above is far beyond the scope of any parting shot, no matter how distended. All I can really ask of you all is to let go of the minutiae for a moment and take a look at the big picture. What is the ultimate goal here? How can we get there with as little overhead as possible? How would you like to be treated by your fellow travellers?
Shouts
To the Slashdot "BSD is dying" crowd - big deal. Death is part of the cycle; take a look at your soft, pallid bodies and consider that right this very moment, parts of you are dying. See? It's not so bad.
To the bulk of the FreeBSD committerbase and the developer community at large - keep your eyes on the real goals. I
It's interesting that BSD trolls always sound like they are trying to convince other people that BSD is dying, more than they believe it themselves.
Hrm.
The mind of a troll is a disturbring thing.
Once laws and bills come into place to deal with spammers. Trollers will be next.
Again, someone who takes the *BSD is dying trolls far too seriously. Heh I don't really believe it myself but it doesn't stop me posting ye trolls.
That is the thing about us trolls - we aren't logical, predictable and are always 100% serious about our subject material.
I can read the local paper now:
Man admitted in court today that he is behind the offensive "*BSD is dying" posts that have plagued a website Slashdot.org for years. The judge said that this type of trolling was a public outrage and caused emotional distress for many users.
The *BSD Wailing Song
What's left for me to see
In my ship I sailed so far
What can the answer be
Don't know what the questions are.
And after all I've done
Still I cannot feel the sun
Tell me save me
In the end our lost souls must repent.
I must know it is for certain
Can it be the final curtain
As long as the wind will blow
I'll be searching high and low.
Who knows what's really true
They say the end is so near
Why are we all so cruel
We just fill ourselves with fear.
And heaven and hell will turn
All that we love shall burn
Hear me trust me
Inthe end our lost sould must repent.
I must know it is for certain
Can it be the final curtain
As long as the wind will blow
I'll be searching high and low
Final curtain
Final curtain.
No proof, no examples, just a blatant ad-hominem against someone he hates
Where is the beef?
only FreeBSD is 20 years old but well nice writeup anyhow :)
I meant "smaller then sign" 20 years old (stupid slashcode), its actually 10-and-a-bit years old.
http://www.goatse.info/story/2003/9/13/234324/410
Thanks.
--Penisbird
Why drink beer? Because I can.
I don't know what drugs you are taking that make you so up tight. Anyway, I doubt that my ISP would be interested in a few off topics posts in Slashdot. There used to be an ISP I used where they got abused in a newgroup by their own members. The boss of the ISP concerned used to reply to such posts, no mentioned of banning people. If you made it personal (without being an obvious joke) then maybe that would be a different story.
I'm hardly disrupting this forum - there is a moderation and threshold system to stop that. Here is a hint: I laways post as an AC.
Of course free speech really only applies to public forums and private companies can certainly control things.
Er, by definition, trolling is always off-topic.
Keep smoking that weed bud! (P.S. That is in jest)
Sure, we all know that *BSD is a failure, but why? Why did *BSD fail? Once you get past the fact that *BSD is fragmented between a myriad of incompatible kernels, there is the historical record of failure and of failed operating systems. *BSD experienced moderate success about 15 years ago in academic circles. Since then it has been in steady decline. We all know *BSD keeps losing market share but why? Is it the problematic personalities of many of the key players? Or is it larger than their troubled personalities?
The record is clear on one thing: no operating system has ever come back from the grave. Efforts to resuscitate *BSD are one step away from spiritualists wishing to communicate with the dead. As the situation grows more desperate for the adherents of this doomed OS, the sorrow takes hold. An unremitting gloom hangs like a death shroud over a once hopeful *BSD community. The hope is gone; a mournful nostalgia has settled in. Now is the end time for *BSD.
The Year of Our Lord 2003 has been a particularly bad year for the "B"s,
- Bob Hope
- Buddy Ebsen
- Buddy Hackett
- Barry White
- BSD
This honored list of dead is but a small token of adieu from the many fans of the deceased.These dead were truly some American Icons. They will be missed.
Here is an idea. Why not post your trolls under your own name. Then, those of us who want to read the BSD forums in peace can add you to our enemies list, and those of us who want to read your rantings can. That way, everyone wins.
How stupid are you?
Just set your threshold to 1 or above and be fucking done with it.
Or perhaps you should realize that *BSD is indeed dying and you need to continue to get updated information from me and my fellow friends who have this valuable information.
Add Anonymous Coward as a foe ;)
The old AC is responsible for many a crap load of crap..
P.S. *BSD is really really dying.
Elegy For *BSD
I am a *BSD user
and I try hard to be brave
That is a tall order
*BSD's foot is in the grave.
I tap at my toy keyboard
and whistle a happy tune
but keeping happy's so hard,
*BSD died so soon.
Each day I wake and softly sob
Nightfall finds me crying
Not only am I a zit faced slob
but *BSD is dying.
dudes, seriously FreeBSD is dead, I have been sitting here for 20 mins while it copies a 16meg file from one folder to another and it still isn't finished.
:P
Oh wait..... that's not BSD that's nautilus using up all my memory....
I'm going to go back to hiding from billy goat gruff under my bridge now....
that Gnome is dying?
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
your cousin's name is furnace, he's a fucking dwarf
go ahead now .. give it a big kiss.
That sucka be dead.