Slashdot Mirror
India Blocks Yahoo Groups Over Political Content
Ryan Barrett writes "In an attempt to shut down the Yahoo Group of a separatist political
movement, the Indian government's
CERT organization ended up blocking its country from accessing Yahoo Groups as a
whole. China's censorship of the Internet in the past few years has been
unsettling, but most people have accepted it as a by-product of China's form of
government. Given that India's form of government is clearly different, this is
much more chilling."
This obscure seperatist group is no longer so obscure. I'm interested to see how this pans out in a democracy. Will the people be so mad that they can't use yahoo that they will demand change? Will this actually increase the interest in this seperatist group?
"I can not bring myself to believe that if knowledge presents danger, the solution is ignorance" - Isaac Asimov
This government is doing nothing more than trying to please people. Many people will be pleased, and many will be displeased. They have blocked Yahoo Groups, but there are plenty other sources of criticism, probably many much worse, that will remain uncensored until they go to the extreme of blocking everything by default and only allowing the sites of their choice.
This is not only ridiculous, it's not feasible. Good try.
We can totally remove india from the internet just mirror the groups everywhere...
Got Code?
Over the past two weeks, India's dozens of Internet service providers have been notified by the government to block access to a Yahoo discussion group called "Kynhun - Bri U Hynniewtrep." The group, which has about two dozen members...
I bet they get more after this amount of news attention.
"Given that India's form of government is clearly different, this is much more chilling."
This is going to happen, sooner of later, in any nation which doesn't have some analogue of the First Amendment. Even in democracies like India, either the government will do it unilaterally or they will scare the people enough to push it through.
A Constitution like ours (US), however flawed, is a wonderful thing.
Can't you just use the Java Anonymous Proxy or anonymizer.com and still access it? Or someone can just write a script to copy the particular banned Yahoo group and mirror it somewhere else...
When are countries going to learn that the Internet can't be stopped?
India Blocks Yahoo Groups: Sikh and Wrong
Obliteracy: Words with explosions
I've been toying around with this idea for a while, basically all I have now is a hacked stupid ass script that decodes yenc encoded binaries from a paticular newsgroup, creates a .torrent hash on the message, then seeds the message with btdownloadheadless. (I did this so some friends on a different ISP that didn't carry the paticular group could reap it's rich rewards)
.torrent hash, seed.
Why can't the same principal with web boards be applied with bittorrent? Simply wget the page you want, create a
(runs off to script)
There's a wonderful quote (I'm not getting it word-for-word):
If we don't believe in free speech for people we despise, we do not believe in it at all.
It's very difficult to draw a line in the sand to divide what is and is not acceptible as free speech. And the most damage doesn't come from misplacing the line a little to the right or the left, but from placing the line to begin with.
India will now be forever locked in a debate over what can and cannot be accessible to the public.
On the upside, the more India is cut off from the internet, the better my job security.
Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
The Honchos sitting up there have no idea of the power of the Internet and the repercursions of blocking such a widely used site like yahoo groups. I did contact my friends in India. They said it was back online after a day or so.
Of course for a democratic nation like India free speech was taken for granted until today. The infamous declaration of Emergency by Indira Gandhi in 1975 plagues the Congress party even today. Funny, a lot of the leaders in the ruling party found themselves at the receiving end of the stick back then. Time really does make one forget I guess.
Anyway let us see how the "democratic process" pans itself out on this issue. The US found its own achilles heel in the Patriot Act. So moralizers beware.
--> Your Wisecrack Here
Bin laden, huh? That's not his him.
, Google, or MSN
MSN isn't mentioned in article. Hynniebinwtrep
More modification.
and prevent other sites from disclosing information about the ban,
Not present in original article.
Reporters Without Limits
Should be Borders
C:\>
Does it really matter what name the government is called? Wether it be socialist, communist, republic or democracy? Any form of government can be corrupt. Maybe we shouldn't be trying to bring democracy to other countries. Maybe we should be more intersted in governments that server the people. Any one notice that about 100 years ago people stopped refering to the US as a republic and started calling the US a democracy?
KARACHI, May 30: A Washington-based news website - South Asia Tribune - has claimed that the government has blocked access to its URL. A press statement issued by the Tribune on Friday said Internet access to their website, www.satribune.com, "has been blocked" by Pakistan Internet Exchange (PIE), the Internet backbone provider for Pakistan. But Federal Minister for Information Technology and Telecommunication Awais Ahmad Khan Leghari expressed his ignorance about the development when asked to comment about the alleged denial of access to the website.
I see the point about the freedom of speech and yadda-yadda. However, Yahoo groups (and - even worse - MSN groups) have never really been a healthy addition to the internet.
I only wish the British government would do the same - perhaps people will make *real* groups and/or websites.
h
The Mini Repository - more links
Good grief,the country has over 840 million people and it is worried about a Yahoo group that has 12 members (now 188 thanks to this news story). While it is easy to say "remember 9/11", remember reality too.
It is unlikely they need Yahoo in order to successful anti-government activists. If they do, then they are not much of a threat. It would seem this is like killing flies with nuclear weapons.
Perhaps this should be a word to the wise, as American companies continue off-shoring development. What happens when the shut down incoming email? Your corporate site? Or your ISP? It appears they have no concern for the outcome of their action, merely that they follow it, as their duty demands. However, it is _their_ country and as it said, it is outside the control of US laws, and by direct connection US protections.
democracy is nice
but so is strong government
a lot of people here come from cultural monocultures of western democracies with strong central governments
we're talking about an organization with at most a few dozen members that want a sliver of land in the northeast of india to be independent, in a country that is as about as culturally varied as the entire african subcontinent
this is serious stuff in a place where india and china still have serious border issues about sikkhim, kashmir, etc., not to mention active separatist groups like in assam
this is not the border of canada and the us, across which most people here on slashdot are posting, perhaps the most historically peaceful border in the world
this is serious stuff, this is not funny, this is not a simplistic civics lesson in sixth grade that is understandable in simplistic terms only
india has to take serious steps to protect the integrity of its borders and internal cohesion
blocking all of yahoo groups was a MISTAKE in trying to block this one small group
everyone involved admits that
germany/ france actively censors nazi interests, and we think of them as open democracies
that's a group a lot larger than this tiny unknown group
nobody's screaming bloody murder over that here
so please, ket's have not have all the knee-jerk over-simplifying chicken littles cry the sky is falling in india
let's have some perspective
this really is no big deal, except for this minor practically unknown separatist group, which now has won more pr than they could have possibly dreamed of
which is perhaps the real lesson here about censorship, after all is said and done: you often just wind up buying pr for the group/ work you are trying to censor
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Just one more reason why maintaining freedom of speech in the U.S. requires constant vigilance.
I find it funny that India did it considering their blooming tech outsourcing industry. What's next blocking the internet? That'd be good...for American jobs. ;)
At the next eco-hypocrisy-meeting, count the private jets used to get to the meeting. Should be interesting to see that
I was under the impression that Pakistan was much more free, despite being a dictatorship.
Being a democracy does not ensure a freer populace, that is for sure.
Chris
The Times of India has an article, "Big Brother turns gaze on debates," about this (dated Saturday). From the article:
Let's put this in context. Millions of Indians-- more than the entire population of the United States-- live in poverty. (Just because Fortune 500 corporations are outsourcing stuff there doesn't mean India is some sort of wonderful, prosperous Democratic playground. Jobs are outsourced to India because it's cheap.) And we're worried about which Yahoo! Groups they can read there? Many Indians are worried about how they'll feed their children next month.
So instead of ranting and raving on SlashDot about freedom of speech, write a letter to the appropriate ambassadors-- and then go and donate to a charity that helps poor Indians. It'll be more productive, and you'll help solve two problems, not just one.
Honey, I shrunk the Cygwin
So many people who scream first amendment forgot this crucial point -- the first amendment limits what the government can do. A DDoS attack against Al Jazeera by the GOVERNMENT is a first amendment violation. A DDoS attack by INDIVIDUALS is not - although it is illegal.
Gee, border integrity, cultural cohesion, other nations wrong-minded censorship, what's next, torture is OK, too, as long as someone else is doing it to?
In India, with their thriving economy and huge cash reserves, it's a different deal. Some journalist got one of the defense ministers on video while taking a bribe - they shut him down, put some of his colleagues in prison, and used any means they could to harrass him.
India has border disputes with just about every
neighbor. Indian political leaders are under a lot
of pressure to not settle any of these disputes.
Instead they have to fan these flames to win votes.
Maybe one day Indians will wake up and elect leaders
that will do something about feeding and educating
their masses rather than bickering with neighbouring
countries over land.
Communism is form of anarchy in which all workers contribute according to their abilities, and all receive according to their needs. In theory it is preceeded by a state known as "socialism" in which everything is owned by the working class (i.e., proletariat), but the working class is represented and governed by a dictatorship of the proletariat, which completely plans and organizes all economic activities. In the socialist phase, democratic rights are not respected, because they run counter to the central planning of the economy. Eventually, the dictatorship is supposed to "melt away" to form true Communism, but this has never happened in practice.
Pre-Communist socialism is not to be confused with democratic socialism, which has been practiced from time to time in various western countries. In this form of government, all major industries and resources are owned by the state. However, private businesses are allowed, and democratic rights are respected. Examples: pre-Thatcher Britain, pre-1990 Scandinavia
Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
Socialism is an economic system based on the premise that government should control of industries and businesses for the betterment of the people. It is not incompatible with democracy. Real world experience with socialism is that it is not nearly as efficient at maximizing the economy as a properly functioning free market capitalist system. Most nations are moving away from applying socialist principles to the general economy, but they are still useful in certain niches, especially those where public policy dictates that it is more useful to optimize for some other factor than maximum efficiency.
Communism is a political system based on the principal that a small group should control political power in the name of the working class, and hold that power through authoritarian means, in order to implement a socialist economic policy.
how come we didn't see so much outrage when US banned al jazeera in Iraq?
Documents don't hold much weight unless you have honest people running the place. Unfortunalty, it seems that the only thing your constitution can do is give people a clear goal to fight for.
This type of behavior would appear to be blocked by the lines: "LIBERTY of thought, expression, belief, faith and worship," "Right to Freedom," and " Cultural and Educational Right."
Although, the line: "To uphold and protect the sovereignty, unity and integrity of India," would appear to allow them to silence any opposition to their government.
Just some food for thought from a first time poster.
What is the correct, free response to such a scenario?
All your favorite sites in one place!
Logic such as this could have resolved the conundrum of the Confederacy by stating simply that the north had a right to invade the south for the sole purpose of giving slaves the right of self-determination -- and that the right of the Confederacy to secede was not the issue.
Of course, as the globe shrinks there are opportunities to violate the self-determination of a lot more of the people than ever before. Hence the real test of a sovereign's committment to human rights is its committment to expanding the ecological range of Earth.
Seastead this.
Claiming India is a democracy is an insult to democrats everywhere. India is a kleptocracy, a govt HIGHLY corrupt and serves only the elites. If India is a democracy, Zimbabwe is too...
India is one of the least democratic countries in Asia. This is a country that would let millions starve to death while implementing policies helping the wealthy. This is a country that will lock up political dissidents, censor films, and ban anything threatening to the establishment.
The only reason anyone even considers India to be a "model" democracy is because of US propaganda during the Cold War. USA spent tens of millions--if not more--initiating propaganda campaigns in order to battle the Communists. Needless to say, the "brainwashed" population of the world actually believed it. Now that the Cold War is over, very few consider it to be a democracy. It wouldn't suprise me if the US govt considers the Chinese govt to be more "democratic" than India now.
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Seeking the meaning of life... @slashdot of all places
India has traditionally been isolationist with both business and politics. From what I've read of Indian politics over the years it doesn't surprise me. It's similar with business. It is very hard for a foreign business to set up there because they wish to protect their own burgoning industries. Don't forget the modern Indian nation is only 60 years old and is showing the signs of insecurity that most new nations show. Paranoia, isolationism, protectionism etc. In fact very similar to a slightly less young nation over the pond.
You forgot the importing of foriegners to take American jobs through H-1Bs & L1s. Clinton didn't do much to help out during his term in the office of President. I didn't see him stopping in influx of foriegners through visa programs.
At the next eco-hypocrisy-meeting, count the private jets used to get to the meeting. Should be interesting to see that