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The Scar

ajm writes "The Scar is China Mieville's second novel set in the world of Bas-Lag. His first, Perdido Street Station, has already been reviewed on Slashdot. However, The Scar is not a sequel. Though the events it describes take place after those in Perdido Street Station, they don't depend on them. The setting isn't the city of New Crobuzon, and the story of Issac Dan der Grimneblin, Lin, and Yagharek is not continued in The Scar." Read on for the rest of ajm's review. The Scar author China Mieville pages 638 publisher Del Rey rating 9 reviewer ajm ISBN 0345444388 summary genre-breaking steampunk fantasy - a must read

I'll try not to reveal too much of the plot in this review. It doesn't spoil the book if you know what's going to happen next (I've read it a couple of times myself), but watching it all unfold through the language of China Mieville is far better than reading my bland precis here. I'll just say that it's gripping enough to make you want to keep reading, and to linger over the marvelous settings. It's also a more straightforward narrative than Perdido Street Station, so if you found the twists in that one a bit confusing don't let it put you off The Scar. To get my biases and preferences on the table, I'm normally a straightforward science fiction reader of the usual suspects, for instance William Gibson, Neal Stephenson, some David Webber, Peter Watts (you've got to read Starfish), Ken Macleod, and Richard Paul Russo.

Bas-Lag, the setting for The Scar, is a strange world. Physically it's not clear it's even spherical. Technologically, it's steampunk, with punch card-driven calculating engines, steam-powered heavy industry, and airships. Magic, referred to as thaumaturgy, works in this world, but the understanding of it is like late 19th Century physics. The scientists of Bas Lag know there is a physical underpinning to thaumaturgy, and they understand some of the particles and forces involved. It is manipulated by calculation and machines, not spells and wands, but some are more skilled in its use than others. The inhabitants themselves are of many different races. Some (the beetle headed kepri, the cactacae, and the remade) will be familiar if you've read Perdido Street Station. Others, for instance the ab-dead, the anophelii, and the grindylow, are new. None seems out of place in Bas Lag, and all have a part to play in the story. The richness of the setting, with all of its excellently described details, really brings Bas-Lag to life.

The story is told mostly from the point of view of Bellis Coldwine, a linguist fleeing New Crobuzon on the first vessel she can get passage on, a prison ship taking a cargo of remade prisoners to one of New Crobuzon's colonies. She and the other main characters in the book are interesting -- not just for their strangeness, but for how they adapt themselves to and deal with the situations they find themselves in. For instance, there's Uther Doul, born in the city of High Chromlech, where the reanimated high-caste dead rule over the living; Tanner Sack, remade in New Crobuzon's punishment factories with tentacles grafted to his chest; and the Lovers, the scarred rulers of the most powerful part of a very strange city.

As in Perdido Street Station, China Mieville uses language wonderfully, particularly descriptive language. All the small details have the perfect names, from pubs called "Unrealized Time" and "The Clock and Cockerel" (now isn't that an excellent name for a pub?), to ships called "Grand Easterly" (shades of Isambard Kingdom Brunel) and "Terpsichoria," to the Witchocracy, Hive of the Jet Sorrow. His descriptions of places and characters are just as good. In other reviews of his work, you'll see comparisons to Charles Dickens and Stephen King, and in fact just about every other descriptive writer you could name.

For me, the main theme of the book is scarring -- physical and emotional -- what it means and what its effects are. All of the main characters in the book, and even the land of Bas-Lag itself, have been scarred. For some, as a chirgeon says, "Scars are not injuries, Tanner Sack. A scan is a healing. After injury, a scar is what makes you whole." For others, like the Lovers, scars are a source of power while for the scabmettlers they are protection.

I'd highly recommend The Scar to just about anyone, apart from hard-core space opera fans perhaps. It's an enjoyable read, but it's also a good book in a larger sense. The first two thirds are perhaps superior to the last third but when it's all so good who am I to quibble? It has great descriptive passages combined with a interesting plot involving compelling characters, set in a fully realized world. The only problem is, how is China Mieville going to top it in his next book?

You can purchase The Scar from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

118 comments

  1. Informative by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The scar is an excellent read. Take note of the latter chapters, as one can learn a lot from them.

  2. more reviews by kaan · · Score: 2, Informative

    Here's the amazon link which provides a bunch of formal reviews as well as the usual customer reviews.

  3. Perdido was horrible. by kid+zeus · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Unreadable, actually. I forced my way through a hundred pages before I had to toss it down and move on to something well written. It's overloaded with gratuitous 'ambient detail' in an effort to give it this crazy, unique world feel. Unfortunately it ends up resembling a mish-mash of just about all the modern fantasy fan fic on the web. Which is not a complement. The characters and the situations just don't read true. Everything's way too contrived.

    No way in heck I'm trying the sequel. I wish I could get my money back for the first.

    1. Re:Perdido was horrible. by kid+zeus · · Score: 1, Redundant

      God forbid I post an unflattering opinion on the book and explain why I felt that way. I didn't realize having different tastes was grounds for Flamebait.

    2. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree... if it's any consolation to you, I meta-moderated this mod as Unfair.

    3. Re:Perdido was horrible. by zhevek · · Score: 1

      I can't believe the parent got flamebait either...

      I read about half of Peridido. I also did not like it enough to finish it. Though some of the concepts were neat, the characters were totally unbelievable and I never empathized with any of them.

    4. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What do you expect? People here claim the Similarian was a good read.

    5. Re:Perdido was horrible. by GoofyBoy · · Score: 0, Redundant

      Why is this "Flamebait"?

      I think its an honest, well-reasoned opinion which is somewhat close to a real review.

      I would mod it as "Interesting" because it has a different view point worthy of reading.

      --
      The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
    6. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      small minds would have trouble with it.

    7. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Chasuk · · Score: 1

      kid zeus,

      I personally found Perdido one of the better written books that I've ever read. However, for me, the pleasure is all in the manner of telling, not in the story. Yes, I am a form over substance guy when it comes to fiction. I thrive on the ambient details. Some of my favorite authors: Gene Wolfe, John Crowley, Peter Straub (only for Shadowlands and Ghost Story; I detested Floating Dragon), Thomas Wolfe, Philip Pullman, Mary Gentle, Sheri S. Tepper, Garth Nix, and Ray Bradbury.

      My list of least favorite authors is just as revealing: Christopher Stasheff, Piers Anthony, Alan Dean Foster, R.A. Salvatore, Marion Zimmer Bradley, and Dean R. Koontz. These authors might be capable of concocting great stories, I don't know, because when I read their works, I feel like I am eating cold, lumpy porridge, so I ultimately push the books away.

      Everyone reads for different reasons. I read to be hypnotized by textured prose. My wife reads to be engrossed in a story. Truthfully, a combination of those characteristics is my preference, but I find it seldom.

      Note that I don't consider one motivation for reading to be "superior" to the other, but I do find the diversity of opinion interesting.

    8. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree that Perdido was not a great book.

      I love China Mieville, I think he's a really cool guy and I want to be just like him when I grow up. He's smart, really, really smart and totally fun to listen to.

      But I thought Perdido was just really boring. I ended up putting it down one day and never getting the urge to pick it back up. Some cool ideas, some cool concepts, but ultimately following characters doing things that I just was not interested in at all.

      If China ever writes non-fiction, I'll be first in line at the bookstore...

    9. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Coryoth · · Score: 1

      I have to say I had similar issue with the book - I made it further through, about half way if I recall, before it all got to be to much effort. All the "fantasy" elements just seemed far too forced. Rather than seeming to fit together in some nice semi consistent world it felt more like a mishmash attempting to place lots of artificial detail in. Detail alone does not create a well constructed fantasy world. Consistent well thought out detail - well now, that helps a lot. Perdido just seemed very much like a hodge podge of other fantasy all squashed together rather than a new fantasy vision.

      Jedidiah

    10. Re:Perdido was horrible. by bitrott · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Horrible? Even if you didn't like it I think that's far too strong of language. Sounds more like it overwhelmed your imagination and you found yourself incapable of enjoying the story being told. There's this word see, "zeitgeist" roughly it refers to something that's the made of the best of everything popular or of quality. Perdido is such a book. And please, it's a damn fantasy novel. The characters will find themselves in "fantastic" situations, having "fantastic" adventures. Noone read LOTR for it's "realistic" character developement. Meiville wrote an amazing adventure in a far more illustrative way than anything I've read.

    11. Re:Perdido was horrible. by foniksonik · · Score: 2, Informative

      The Scar is much faster paced than Perdido.. borrow it from the library if you're concerned about getting ripped.

      I read Scar first and was moderately disappointed by Perdido.

      I also had trouble getting into Perdido and getting through it though I kept reading hoping to see some of Scar come through in his writing and it did but not until 2/3rds of the book was behind me.

      --
      A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.
    12. Re:Perdido was horrible. by kid+zeus · · Score: 1
      I am glad you think so, but I used the word 'horribe' because that's exactly what I meant. I'm entitled to my opinion and to not having assumptions made that I'm completely uneducated. I hated the book, and that's pretty rare for me. I honestly felt it was extremely manipulative and poorly written. Thanks so much for your condescension, by the way. My imagination's just great, thanks. That's why I love so many great authors who actually challenge said imagination instead of trying to flood it with an overload of uninspired, clumsy prose. Perdido didn't challenge me in the least. It wasn't imaginative. It wasn't original. Not for me, at least. To me the writing was utterly sophomoric.

      As for the issue of 'real', what I said was that it didn't ring true. Even fantasy stories need to have elements of truth to how the characters feel, otherwise there's no way to begin to associate with them (or against them) in any serious manner.

      Don't get so huffy because I think something you cherish is crap. I'm sure there are examples that go the other way. If you were secure in how truly great Perdido is, you wouldn't be so sensitive.

      And try reading anything by Joyce, Nabakov, Burgess or even Philip K. Dick if you want to see how fantastical environments and unconventional writing can be suffused with meaningful truth. Even Tolkien managed some of that, although I think the LoTR is largelybloated and boring, with it's reams and reams of gratuitous Norse-style histories. I completely agree that Melville was a far greater author. The Hobbit, however, was a beautiful, tightly written and compelling children's story. And there are a number of fantasy writers (though far fewer than 'straight' fiction I'd say, and I grey up reading the stuff 24/7) who manage to pull it off as well. Try Lethem if you don't believe me.

    13. Re:Perdido was horrible. by kid+zeus · · Score: 1

      My bad. I thought you said Melville in your last sentence. As in the Moby Dick guy. Though I may not think all that much of LotR, I think it was a hell of a lot more compelling story than what I found in Perdido. Just my opinion.

    14. Re:Perdido was horrible. by Kevan_moran · · Score: 1
      I thought both books were wonderful and bought and read King Rat ( his first book ) as soon as I saw it in the shop.

      King Rat is not IMHO in the same league as The Scar or PSS but still worth a read.

      I am not surprised that some posters couldn't get on with these novels though.

      Mieville's style is really quite unusual and extreme.

      In a way his writing reminds me of Jack Vance. The books are worth reading simply for the language and the bizarre plots, characters and ideas are a bonus.

    15. Re:Perdido was horrible. by bitrott · · Score: 1

      I wasn't insinuating that you're uneducated. Yes, you deserved the condescension. You put out an obtuse opinion and used obnoxious language to get attention. I'm not being 'sensitive' because I challenged your opinion. It seemed to me that 'horrible' was unreasonable by any measure, and that you were just being contrary for its own sake. Which very well may be true. I always find that a contrarian's first defense is to belittle the debate.

      I never found the prose to be clunky. Verbose, but maybe you had problems with some of vocabulary that others didn't (read: big words, ha, cheap shot). He's an "illustrative" writer. If you prefer a more minimalist style, fine. This wasn't written that way. You wouldn't confuse P.K.Dicks' idiom with that of Perdido. Why would you? The story just isn't told that way. It fits the scene.

      China wrote a big bold story and was very specific about what images he wanted you to see. This isn't the kind of sci-fi that makes you fill in the holes your self (like Gibson). It wants you to see it his way. As with the scenery it was the same with the characters. But then, you were too busy trying to relate with the characters to let him tell their story. Had a hard time? I found it refreshing. I don't read sci-fi for the archetypes. Those get boring. Try to picture myself loving a bug-headed woman? Alright, there's a challenge I'll take.

    16. Re:Perdido was horrible. by kid+zeus · · Score: 1
      Belittle the debate? I took you to task for condescension. Which you still haven't validated, since your only real arguments are that a) you don't agree with my assessment of the quality of the language and b) that fantasy shouldn't be expected to be realistic, which is a complete straw horse since I never said that..

      As for the extreme language you don't like, I'll repeat one more time: I hated the book. I thought it was grade F horrible. I don't say that to be contrarian. I say it because I believe it. Once again, you are making jackass assumptions of my intent and using that as your argument. If you want to debate the language, the structure, the characterization... fine. But don't give me this crap and then try to make out like you're taking some high road or that you are possessed of superior critical skills when you couldn't even read a simple sentence like 'the characters don't ring true' and then perverted that into me saying the book wasn't realistic to try and make your irrelevant point.

      I didn't attack anyone for liking the book. I simply said I hated it and explained why.

      Once again you drip with condescenscion as you state that I must be some imagineless slave to archetypes for not getting into the bug-headed woman. Once again you show what a small mind and a thin skin you have. Characters and situations like that are scattered over the net, wherever collections of fan fic can be found. The fact is that I read so little fantasy now because I'm too busy with actually challengin literature, and the examples of those in modern fantasy are few and far between. You want true originality? You want ecstatic writing that actually stimulates the brain? Go and pick up almost anything Joyce, Nabokov, Lethem, Morrow, Vonnegut, Heller, Borges, and a thousand other authors have put out. You want radical? Try Jeffrey Eugenides Middlesex. These are books that defy (or set) the conventions that less inspired writers have to resort to. They play with language in incredible ways, challenging ways and present characters far, far from 'normal' life, yet they elucidate feelings and problems and issues that 'normal' humans have. Thankfully, they also do it in incredibly fascinating and original ways.

      My own opinion, which isn't forced on anyone else and which still hasn't been used to attack anyone who likes the book (my attack on you is for your asinine, unprovoked behavior), is that Perdido is a hack job. What you call wanting to see things His way is what I (and a hell of a lot of truly great authors, including the folks I listed above) call Bad Writing. It's cheap, manipulative and shows a distinct /lack/ of imagination and writing skills. It's vomiting on the page.

      But please, tell me once again how I simply don't have the imagination or the faculties to read this book. Make yet more assumptions about how I must just want to drive people crazy, something rich coming from a guy who took a critique on a book (and only that) and turned it into an ad hominem assault on my intentions and my ability to read very simple writing. It's doing such a great job convincing me just how wrong I am.

    17. Re:Perdido was horrible. by nightgeometry · · Score: 1

      This doesn't really addd anything to the discussion, but hey, why should that stop me.

      Well, I loved Perdido, better than The Scar, in my opinion. But I'm glad to hear your opinion kid zeus, I can agree with you entirely, on most of your points I am with you.

      There was just something about PSS & The Scar that made me enjoy them entirely, not sure why, which in itself annoys me :)

      Apparently the style is similar to that of Mervyn Peakes Gormenghast novels, but they are still sitting on that shelf waiting to be read, taunting me, damn things...

      But it's good we don't all like the same things, so good on yer mate.

      --
      The best is the enemy of the good
  4. Ha! I just read this!! by Fux+the+Penguin · · Score: 5, Interesting

    How come /. only reviews books I've already read? Oh well. Still, I have to say, while Perdido was an excellent book in its own right, I was impressed by how much better The Scar was. Mieville has an excellent ability to make you want more by throwing out snippets of descriptions of people and places and civilizations inhabitaing bas-Lag that invariably made me want to learn more.

    One of the creepiest and most striking images from the book was Doul's description of his home city of High Chromlech, with its quiet streets full of shuffling high-caste dead, with their lips sewn together. Only a fine writer could pack so much imagination and imagery into a few short pages, and The Scar is full of this, It's part Dickensian (though less so than Perdido), part Lovecraftian, part Moorock, but transcends all those sources. The main character is a bit of a dud (the supporting characters are far more interesting), and the ending fizzles just a little, but the ride getting there justifies the trip. I really enjoyed it, and I highly recommend it to Slashdot!!

  5. not a space opera? what a drag... by supercooled32 · · Score: 1

    I'd highly recommend The Scar to just about anyone, apart from hard-core space opera fans perhaps

    Damn..

    well that pretty much counts me and all MY friends out...

    1. Re:not a space opera? what a drag... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Both of them?

  6. $3.75 cheaper at amazon by zontroll · · Score: 3, Informative

    Starting today, I will be posting non-referral links only...

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0345444388/
    Amazon has this book for $3.75 cheaper than bn
    Spend $11.75 more to get free shipping.



    If you want to support my efforts to provide prompt Amazon pricing information, add ccats-20 to the end of the above URL. Thanks.

    1. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by BadCable · · Score: 1

      Why bother with Amazon? It's $8 on Half.com

      The Scar on Half.com

    2. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you want to support my efforts to provide prompt Amazon pricing information

      Um, how much effort does it take exactly to go to amazon.com and type in the book's name in the search box?!?!

    3. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you know that people are too lazy to do that...in fact, I'm too lazy to finish typing this message..

    4. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Starting today, I will be posting non-referral links only...

      It's not the referral links that are annoying, but rather the fact that you incessantly spam the boards with "cheaper/same price/more expensive at Amazon" messages. Removing the referrer ID doesn't change this.

      Get a clue.

    5. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      some of us (read: sane people) like to know the price of the book being reviewed.

    6. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      > some of us (read: sane people) like to know the price of the book being reviewed.

      It's sad you don't know how to use the Internet effectively. Here's a quick tutorial, since you're obviously incapable of discovering this on your own.

      1) Open your browser. That's the program you use to connect to the Internet. You'll probably see it as a big blue "e" on your screen.
      2) Click the address bar. That's the big line near the top of the screen that has a funny looking line of text starting with "http" or similar. Delete this text by pressing either the delete or backspace (backwards arrow) key.
      3) Type "http://www.amazon.com" in the address bar, then press Enter. It might be called Return on your keyboard.
      4) Amazon's page will load. There will be lots of brightly-coloured things that might be distracting, but you want to look for a text box (a wide rectangle) in a "Search" box on the left. This is where you can search for books online.
      5) Type the name of the book you want to locate, then press Enter (Return) or click the "Go" button with your left mouse button. You only need to click this once, unlike some of your Windows icons.
      6) A page will appear with search results. Find the one that most closely resembles your book, and click the link. The link should be underlined, so you can figure out what is text and what is the link. Again, only one click with the left mouse button is necesssary.
      7) A page will appear with information about your book. Price will be one of these things.

      To order the book is beyond the scope of this tutorial, and is left as an exercise to the consumer.

    7. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      if you'd rather do everything yourself than have people do it for you, then I suggest you cut off your power and attach a hand crank to your computer to power it and also cut off your indoor plumbing and carry your waste out in buckets

    8. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd never suggest we do *everything* completely on our own, but at least I wouldn't be spamming Slashdot every day to try and catch a few wayward dollars. But thanks for playing the "try to twist my argument to justify my means" game. Shame you can't see how misapplied it really is. Oh, wait, I forgot. You think you're providing a *service*, don't you?

    9. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Only a true Linux user would believe a seven step process is somehow better than a one step process. Since you're such a fan of seven step processes, here's one for you:

      How to become a better person:

      1. Try showering and shaving (known to some as 'grooming').
      2. Wash the pizza and mountain dew (and other) stains from your clothing.
      3. Try getting out and exercising once in a while. Masturbating (especially anything involving a greased yoda doll) does not count, unless of course you do it outside.
      4. Get a job. A paying one. N.B. According to this restriction anything that has anything to do with Linux is not a job.
      5. Stop reading Slashdot.
      6. Throw away your anime collection, you fucking pervert.
      7. Move out of the basement.

      HTH. HAND.

    10. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's pretty funny, but it was much funnier the first time around. Or the second. And even still a bit chuckle-icous on the third. But it's a bit stale now, my trolly friend. Your only come-back is a cut-and-paste from months back? Guess that says something right there, now doesn't it?

    11. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by devilsadvoc8 · · Score: 0

      Or you could try addall: http://www.addall.com/ Its bot gathers the best price including amazons and Halfs of the world

      --
      B O R I N G
    12. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      contrary to your psychotic beliefs, I am not the author of these responses.

    13. Re:$3.75 cheaper at amazon by c4ffeine · · Score: 1

      Yes, but some of us are too lazy and would much rather click on a pretty clicky link than follow 7 steps. 7!!! And I could do it in 1 thanks to him!

      The horror, the horror! 7 steps instead of 1! Oh god, the horror!

      I really am that lazy, too...

      --
      "73% of quotes on the Internet are made up" -Ben Franklin
  7. Don't forget to go to your public library by Trolling4Dollars · · Score: 4, Insightful
    My local library has it.

    Remember folks, we wouldn't all be geeks if there wasn't a public library around. Support your public library. Support library levies. The more money they make, the better materials and services they can have.

    1. Re:Don't forget to go to your public library by kfg · · Score: 2, Funny

      Support library levies.

      I make a point of always returning my books late.

      KFG

  8. Not Amazing by TwistedSquare · · Score: 2, Interesting
    While The Scar does have some original imagery, you should be warned that none of the main characters are very sympathetic so it can be tough going unless you really love the world around them.

    Then again I bought this (hardback) for 4 quid in a bargain bookship to held prop up a bowing bookshelf, so I didn't mind!

    1. Re:Not Amazing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Then again I bought this (hardback) for 4 quid in a bargain bookship to held prop up a bowing bookshelf, so I didn't mind!"

      Not surprised, as you seem to be completely out of yours.

    2. Re:Not Amazing by TwistedSquare · · Score: 1

      While I admit that sentence does look crazy, it was only one letter out (held -> help)

  9. I speak to you from my heart. by Saeed+al-Sahaf · · Score: 0

    As I have said many times, those that read incontinence into the frail pages of your poor attempt to speak about the subjects that you so wistfully grasp at, I assure you that your view will be reduced to spring water contaminated with cheese.

    --
    "Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
  10. China Mieville is one of SF's new wonders by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    We've been losing so many of the original generation of Golden Era SF authors. It's a common lament among my friends whenever we read another obit ( I think Hal Clement died recently).

    The only thing that cheers me up is seeing that every now and then another amazing writer hits the scene. China Mieville is one of those, IMHO.

    His stuff is just about the most original I've seen in the last 10yrs, at least. I can't even put it in a genre. The reviewer mentions steampunk, but that's not complete... there are so many elements and .... aaiigghh... I love authors that can show me something NEW !!!

    It's not for everyone. One poster mentioned he couldn't read the book, and set it down after 100pp.

    I actually think that might be a common reaction. There are a lot of folks who seem unable to read stuff that's written in a original style, (i.e. not blandified for mass readership)

    Reminds me of a friend that I loaned Samuel Delaney's Dhalgren to. He gave it back a few days later, and said he coldn't make it past the first 10pp or so, because it was messing with his head too much.

    Of course, that guy (my friend) had a tendency to have bad trips, so it may not entirely have been Delaney's awesome writing.

    1. Re:China Mieville is one of SF's new wonders by kid+zeus · · Score: 2, Interesting
      I can read Joyce, Faulkner and have lapped up generations of Sci Fi writers who dabble in stream of consciousness and radical visions.

      Not being able to read 'truly original work' isn't the problem here. The problem I found that Mieville was far more interested in proving how 'utterly charming' his world was than crafting a good story. I don't need (or even prefer) traditional narratives. What I need and prefer is good prose instead of the amateurish stuff I found in Perdido. As well as characters who's actions are more than an attempt at showing just how damned cool they are. Perdido didn't strike me as original in the least. It glommed bits and pieces from a number of closely related modern fantasy environments using what I find to be very clumsy descriptive ability, and it tried to do it by overwhelming with volume instead of quality.

      As for messing with heads, this doesn't even rate on any kind of scale that includes the likes of Philip K. Dick. That's messing with heads.

      You want original worlds? Try Jonathon Lethem (Gun With Occasional Music, As She Climbed Across the Table, Fortress of Solitude or almost dozen others) or James Morrow (Blameless in Abbadon, Towing Jehovah, This is the Way the World Ends and a dozen others.)

    2. Re:China Mieville is one of SF's new wonders by nightgeometry · · Score: 1

      Second reply to you in about 15 mins...

      As is ay above I like PSS and The Scar, and respect your dislike. And I absolutely lurve Gun With Occasional Music, wonderful little book. Maybe both sides of the debate should read it.

      Well, that was about as pointless as my last comment, but I felt I needed to say it.

      --
      The best is the enemy of the good
    3. Re:China Mieville is one of SF's new wonders by kid+zeus · · Score: 1

      No problems here with your posts. I definitely respect diversity of tastes and I don't mind people not agreeing with me. I just wanted to put my two cents in as a dissenting opinion, but then was amazed that some people just wanted to discount it as some kind of sour grapes that must come from an underdeveloped brain. Hell, I've been known to watch pro wrestling at times, so I'm definitely not one to cast aspersions on the quality of other people's taste.

  11. I snortled your chir-blek! by Fnkmaster · · Score: 3, Interesting
    A long, long time ago, in a zilblex far far asnog, a chir-blek named Firby snortled a zamphod.


    Sorry, I'm not attacking the book, since I haven't read Perdido, nor any work by this author, but if the review is an indication, this falls into the category of sci-fi author who feels the need to throw strange terminology out there to make it feel "different". In my experience, this is what happens when an author can't make the story compelling enough on its own merits - I mean, every sci-fi or science fantasy work has strange, inexplicable elements. And, sure, some of them will have odd and unusual names. But it should be done where it's important to the plot, the storytelling and the characters, not just because it sounds cooler to call it a "sneebleblex" than a "car". And generally nonstandard words that at least convey an image to the target audience are substantially better than random combinations of non-standard phonemes.


    Anyway, this isn't intended to be a flame against this author, just a general gripe I have with a type of sci-fi. I'm going to go back to snortling my chir-blek now.

    1. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, I went off SF/Fantasy when I got old enough to
      realise what quality writing was (not that there
      are no quality SF books, just that they are very very few and far between). My current fave has to be
      Fingersmith ...like "The Sting" meets "The Sopranos" in 19th C. London - with a bunch of Lesbo sex thrown in for good measure :-)

    2. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by GoofyBoy · · Score: 1

      I think that Nightfall had this sort of disclaimer to address this at the beginning of the book. Even though it was about an alien world, earth terms like hours and miles were used for readability sake.

      --
      The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
    3. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      "A damning critique of Victorian moral and sexual hypocrisy"

      Ok.

      So a dyke of an author is evangelizing for her favourite perversion. Congratulations. You fell for por... eh, real quality there.

    4. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by qengho · · Score: 4, Interesting


      this falls into the category of sci-fi author who feels the need to throw strange terminology out there to make it feel "different".

      Not at all. The "strange terminology" is used mainly to refer to alien species. The rest of the language is ornate, but based on English and Latin derivations for the most part. The milieu of Perdido Street Station is so odd and wonderful that the author could refer to the various races by numbers and still the city of New Crobuzon would dazzle readers.

      I was a bit disappointed by The Scar, mainly because it didn't give me the same Shock Of The New that PSS did[1], but it's a far better work than most of the stuff in bookstores.

      [1] I experienced the same let-down when I read Gibson's Count Zero, because Neuromancer was a hard act to follow. When I re-read his cyberspace triology, however, I realized that the other two books were every bit as good as the first.

    5. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by ajm · · Score: 1

      To some extent your opening sentence indicates the problem. There really is a world of difference between the words you've invented and the words, especially the names, China Mieville invents. Sure, it's easy to parody, just as it's easy to parody the names Dickens used, but it's very hard to get right. Anyway, it's really not the biggest part of Mieville's appeal. The words he chooses certainly do convey an image to the audience though.

      Give the books a try. If you approach with an open mind I think you'll enjoy them.

    6. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Uhhh... yeah. Wouldn't want to get C-R-E-A-T-I-V-E now would we? Imaginative?

      Gee, I guess you'll be stuck reading history books... er... wait, they are often more creative than Tolkein.

      Silly person. The POINT of this book is to read it with a suspension of what is REAL, or at least to have an open mind - to - THINK outside the box.

    7. Re:I snortled your chir-blek! by danlyke · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I read Perdido Street Station and although the language was often alien, I thought that this was one of the few places its use was justified. So often when SF writers try to write about creatures that are outside of human experience they end up being humans in other guises, but Perdido Street Station managed to make some of those characters the best realized because they were so strange.

      Unfortunately, I found I didn't care enough for the more human characters to give a damn what happened, so in the end I thought the story was weak enough that I don't recommend the book, but the dense prose builds the best Giger-esque world I've read about.

      So, yes the prose is dense, but it works. I won't be picking up the current version because I think that the story skills aren't up to the storytelling skills.

  12. I really liked Perdido Street Station by puppetman · · Score: 1

    Reminded me of a more poetic/descriptive Gibson/Sterling in the Difference Engine.

    I'd ordered it, and then read some of the Amazon.com reader-reviews, and wondered if I'd made a mistake. I didn't - was an amazing book.

  13. Set where? by American+AC+in+Paris · · Score: 1
    The world of Bas Lag?

    Is that where all the LPBs come from?

    --

    Obliteracy: Words with explosions

    1. Re:Set where? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The world of Bas Lag?

      I can't avoid reading it as "Gas Bag"

  14. Ah yes, and 10% to you? by Saeed+al-Sahaf · · Score: 0

    We are not so stupid that in the headlights of your machine we can not see the truth. Spam can not be eaten by true Islamics!

    --
    "Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
    1. Re:Ah yes, and 10% to you? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      we are not so stupid...

      wtf? you sure sound pretty stupid.
      maybe "the truth" is that you're a huge dumbshit.

  15. pathetic by Boromir+son+of+Faram · · Score: 1, Funny

    The setting isn't the city of New Crobuzon, and the story of Issac Dan der Grimneblin, Lin, and Yagharek is not continued in The Scar.

    Anyone who got past this nonsense has my bemused respect. No wonder nobody reads sci-fi. Yagharek indeed.

    --

    Boromir, son of Faramir, King of Gondor and Minas Tirith
    1. Re:pathetic by Sulihin · · Score: 2, Funny

      I have to say, I hope the wonderful irony of this post is intentional. Boromir indeed.

    2. Re:pathetic by DLWormwood · · Score: 1, Offtopic
      Anyone who got past this nonsense has my bemused respect. No wonder nobody reads sci-fi. Yagharek indeed.

      Let's see, in honor of your .sig and handle...

      "The setting isn't the Shire, and the story of Gandalf The White, Frodo Baggins and Samwise is not continued in The Simarilion. Balrog indeed."

      (-:

      --
      Those who complain about affect & effect on /. should be disemvoweled
    3. Re:pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Boromir, son of Faramir, King of Gondor and Minas Tirith

      Pathetic, indeed.

    4. Re:pathetic by ahdeoz · · Score: 0

      Actually, only Tolkien gets away with making up such gibberish. Why? Because he was a real linguist, back when they had them, and he spent 30 years coming up with 'Boromir' and 'Frodo' and has volumes of notes about why he called them that. And he still calls a sword a sword, a horse a horse, and tobacco pipeweed, so he's not violating the principle anyway.

  16. Re:Ha! I just read this!! by danigiri · · Score: 1

    Yeah, I have just read both Perdido Street Station and the Scar and I have found both volumes to be very interesting indeed.

    Mieville manages to do a mixture of genres an ideas without falling for the old cliches of "to find something new, just mix some of the old". Surprisingly enough, the author manages to surprise the reader with a few snippets of worlds not yet visited, of tales yet untold.

    The ideas seem to have been trimmed down just for the sake of being too large to fit on the book and have crumbled out of the pages to perhaps surprise us in the not too distant future, with more novels to come.

    Another interesting thing is that Mieville has not resorted to the too common fashion of forcing multi-volume series on the readers, just to please editorals. Luck? Dunno, but it is somehow surprising how C.M. has managed to overcome this being a relatively new writer and not so well known after all.

    I sincerely hope that Mieville is going to write about a totally different subject for one novel, just to prevent ending up as a soap-opera former-genius writer, falling into the lure of Bas-Lag for 5 novels or so. After that creative hiatus, a couple of good histories set up in the same world would be greatly welcome! Yeah, whatever, but I absolutely hate the Robert-Jordan-esque eternal feet-dragging, that's my op.

    C.M. is about to join my small list of favourite writers, name inscribed in golden letters, just alongside Gene Wolfe, Julian May, Dan Simmons, Linda Nagata and a few others...

    dani++

  17. What's the Similarian? by FatSean · · Score: 1

    Never heard of it...probably why it stinks.

    --
    Blar.
    1. Re:What's the Similarian? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


      FS: it stinks.

      AC: It's a Tolkein book.


      Looks like FatSean had it right the first time.

    2. Re:What's the Similarian? by Creepy+Crawler · · Score: 1

      I knew some moron who had to write notes to keep track what happens in that book. He was also the one that said Tolken was a genius writer. Course when it comes down to real sci-fi, it sucks.

      Damn, plenty of these people here think that the LOTR crap is Sci-Fi..

      --
    3. Re:What's the Similarian? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      snip ...Course when it comes down to real sci-fi, it sucks.

      Damn, plenty of these people here think that the LOTR crap is Sci-Fi..


      Sci-Fi is 90% of Science Fiction. Unfortunately.
      (AC-bowdlerized version of Sturgeon's Law)

      Praise Jeebus, I read SF.

  18. Re:Ha! I just read this!! by Fux+the+Penguin · · Score: 1

    You have written much about the narrative and writing skills inherent in The Scar. Essentially, those who read "traditional" fantasy will struggle with the ambiguities that present themselves. We never find out the answers to some very pertinent questions (although we do find out some). What Mieville has done is transformed the story structure of fantasy. For some, this "new structure" is not new. It is a common theme in the traditional stories of many Indigenous Peoples. It is, however, something quite daring (although I am sure some detractors will say it is pretentious), for the target audience of the aforementioned traditional fantasy.

    Gene Wolfe you say! The only author I can honestly say who has made a career defying expectations with brilliant writing is Gene Wolfe. Wolfe, however, stayed true to the essence of his mythic source material. Although the Scar is a better book then the excellent Perdido Street Station, I do believe that Mieville has not yet reached his full potential. One interesting plot thread running through both of the Bas Lag books involves a key scientific principle. What is interesting is that it is presented in two diametrically opposed theories in the books. One is true and one is not. We don't know which one prevails. Goodness knows what will come next, but I'm hoping that Bas Lag will be revisited.

  19. Re:Ha! I just read this!! by chef_raekwon · · Score: 1

    How come /. only reviews books I've already read?

    so that you may post comments about the book. otherwise, it may say 5 of 10 comments. 5 of which have been moded down troll or flamebait. the other five, focused on the day's SCO story,goatse,soviet russia, and welcoming our new overlord of the hour. (2 links to goatse.)

    --
    We're like rats, in some experiment! -- George Costanza
  20. Others in genre? by arsinmsn · · Score: 1

    I see it in the same class as some of Iain M. Banks & Jeff Noon. I'd appreciate suggestions of other similar writers from /.ers who have read these three.

    And for those have to get a joke in: what is the name of this subgenre?

    1. Re:Others in genre? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      China Mieville (who has the biggest arms I have ever seen) seemed happy with "slipstream fiction" last I heard.

    2. Re:Others in genre? by Peganthyrus · · Score: 1

      I'd call it "good". Genre is bogus.

      I haven't read any of Noon's work, but I've read all the Banks I can get my hand on (don't forget the 'non-M' books, published under the name 'Iain Banks'; they're not inevitably SF as the 'M' books are, but they're also rich and surprising). Also, I'd suggest Michael Swanwick and Tim Powers. Both write similarly convoluted and packed novels.

      And of course you've read Vernor Vinge's 'A Fire Upon the Deep' and 'A Deepness in the Sky', right? Those are also pretty heavy, with the realm being a major character...

      --
      egypt urnash minimal art.
  21. Re:Ha! I just read this!! by lolife · · Score: 1

    Yup, The Scar is better than Perdido St. Station. It's a great read.

  22. The Scar by Avada+Kedavra · · Score: 0

    Isn't this the title of book 6 in the Harry Potter series?

  23. Thanks by eggmit · · Score: 1

    You know, I thought I might make it through this life without actually seeing tubgirl. Thanks.

  24. Son of Faramir? by revividus · · Score: 1, Offtopic
    Since we're all referring to the .sig anyways, here... Uh, Boromir was the son of Denethor. So was Faramir. They were, like, brothers.

    Right, then.

    But his post explains they .sig; I guess he didn't read LOTR, either.

  25. My review by Hobbex · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I wrote a short review of The Scar for my blog. Here goes:

    This is something as unusual as a fantasy book that I enjoyed reading. Except for Tolkien I postively loath fantasy - all that Eddings and Shananananana crap - which seems mostly to be stupid D&D induced masturbatory escapism recorded and published for God knows what reason. Interestingly, I read something by Mieville describing how much he hates Tolkien - I love it, especially The Silmarillion, but I can see why disliking Tolkien is probably a necessity for producing good fantasy.

    This isn't about kings and dwarves and dragons, but rather set in a fantasy world with technological level fixed in early industrial, rather than medieval, times. Mieville uses this as a basis for a fastasy in the true sense of the word - not just picking off Tolkien and folk stories, but imagining a completely different world what I've read anywhere else. He has fun doing it, and so does the reader.

    Still, there are things about the book that don't work out completely. Some things about it aren't really credible (most of the book is set in a floating city made up tethered ships - at times you are left wondering why one of the characters doesn't just light a match and say goodbye to the whole place. There is a reason fireships were feared in maritime combat when most hulls were wooden). The main character achieves very little, which is fine but ultimately she is completely forgetable, which is unforgivable. And while I don't mind that the book doesn't come to a text-book conclusion one is left wondering by the end of the six hundred pages why one didn't just stop reading two hundred pages earlier. It doesn't help that Mieville writes out the most compelling characters much earlier.

    1. Re:My review by kirkjobsluder · · Score: 1

      This is something as unusual as a fantasy book that I enjoyed reading. Except for Tolkien I postively loath fantasy - all that Eddings and Shananananana crap - which seems mostly to be stupid D&D induced masturbatory escapism recorded and published for God knows what reason.....

      This isn't about kings and dwarves and dragons, but rather set in a fantasy world with technological level fixed in early industrial, rather than medieval, times.


      Isn't this rather like criticizing science fiction by dismissing Star Trek and Star Wars novelizations? Or criticizing contemporary horror as an endless string of vampire novels. (I agree with you on Shanara and Eddings BTW.) A large chunk of fantasy has nothing to do with kings, dwarves and dragons. Urban Mythic Fantasy writers like Gaiman, DeLint, Bull, Shetterly, Crowley, Pullman and Windling are probably better representatives of the genre as a whole. Mieville's first novel, King Rat is a good example.

  26. The city was the main character (you idiot) by thnmnt · · Score: 2, Interesting

    claiming perdido street station was horrible and the characters lacked development is just silly. had you paid any attention you would have realized that the city was the main character of the book and everyone else was supporting cast.

    i, for one, immensely enjoyed his longish descriptions of new crobuzon and the myriad species that lived there. comparisons to dickens in this regard would not be unjustified.

    to classify perdido, or the scar as SF is really the heart of the problem though. mieville himself refers to his style of writing as 'weird fiction' - which i think is much more descriptive. many people also feel that this could have been classified as 'horror' which i can also see.

    as much as i enjoyed perdido - the scar was better. it's a monumental book and will be looked back on as being seminal.

    i'd read a napkin that this guy had written on.

    --
    Go read some bible: nubible.com
    1. Re:The city was the main character (you idiot) by kid+zeus · · Score: 0, Flamebait
      Weird Fiction. Whatever. Call it by any name, it still smelled of crap to me. And I -know- the City was the main character. You idiot. I just thought his descriptions were stultifying. Clumsy prose and no poetry to it at all.

      Read whatever you want, but get a grip. Just because you cream over something doesn't mean everyone else has to. And if they don't agree, it doesn't make them morons.

    2. Re:The city was the main character (you idiot) by Rational · · Score: 1

      New Crobuzon is basically Ank Morpork minus a sense of humour.

      --
      "Be nice, veer left, and never stop thinking" Iain Banks - Walking On Glass
  27. Wow...talk about wooooosh.... by FatSean · · Score: 1

    It's Silmarillion, not Similarian. Thought you nerds loved those lame jokes! :)

    --
    Blar.
  28. Iain M. Banks by MikeCapone · · Score: 1

    You haven't read Iain M. Banks yet, have you? Highly recommended, start with Consider Phlebas and work your way through to his masterpiece, Use of Weapons.

    1. Re:Iain M. Banks by kid+zeus · · Score: 1
      When I first discovered Banks, I went on a huge jag, reading all his sci fi books. Some of them are really great. I think Excession is truly fantastic Sci-Fi. Player of Games is a great read as well, if not quite as creative in my opinion.

      If you like Consider Phlebas a lot, I'd recommend the first book by a fairly new author. It's called Altered Carbon, by Richard K. Morgan. Great hard-boiled style. In fact it's the book I picked up when I put Perdido down, and it washed the taste right out.

    2. Re:Iain M. Banks by Rational · · Score: 1

      Iain M. Banks is arguably the best living SF writer, and (minus the M.) one of the best mainstream fiction writers in the world right now.

      As for "Perdido Street Station", I found the world to be wonderfully realized, but the unrelenting nastiness pretty much wore me down, the same problem I had with Peter F. Hamilton's "Night's Dawn" trilogy. And this considering Iain Banks is not averse to pretty strong imagery himself.

      --
      "Be nice, veer left, and never stop thinking" Iain Banks - Walking On Glass
  29. Less visceral than Perdido Street Station by goodmanj · · Score: 1

    Perdido Street Station impressed me with its well-crafted descriptions of unique places and characters, but what really impressed me was the way it sucked me into the story and made me feel the horror, anguish, and excitement of the characters. The monsters in the story were truly terrifying, and Lin's situation hit me especially hard.

    The Scar has much of the same ornate yet gritty texture as PSS, and the prose is equally well-crafted, but I didn't have a strong emotional response to it. I found the bad guys and monsters more ordinary than those in PSS, and nothing in the book really scared or excited me.

    The Scar is still worlds better than most of the sci-fi I've read recently, but it seemed somehow shallower than Perdido Street Station.

  30. Richard Morgan by MikeCapone · · Score: 1

    If you like Consider Phlebas a lot, I'd recommend the first book by a fairly new author. It's called Altered Carbon, by Richard K. Morgan. Great hard-boiled style. In fact it's the book I picked up when I put Perdido down, and it washed the taste right out.

    We seem to have similar tastes; I finished reading _Altered Carbon_ a week ago and loved it.

    Have you read Morgan's other book set in the same universe, _Broken Angels_?

    I hear different, in a good way, and *even better*!

    1. Re:Richard Morgan by kid+zeus · · Score: 1
      Sorry to say I didn't think it matched up. Not that it was bad, mind you. Just not Altered Carbon good. You may like it more, I dunno. But you may want to keep your expectations a bit lower, so it doesn't come off as a disappointment. Second novels seem to have difficulty following first ones it seems.

      But another one you may really like is Jonathon Lethem's first, 'Gun, With Occasional Music.' Very similar in certain ways (gritty future, hard-boiled styled detective story). Not as exciting, but even more creative. Certain elements feel like Morgan, and others like Dick, and some like Chandler. But Lethem's a genuine monstrous talent on his own. Here's what Kirkus had to say:

      Conrad Metcalf is a p.i. (Private Inquisitor) with more than the usual problems: he's switched nerve endings in his sex organs with his absent girlfriend; he's running low on the karma points that keep him out of the state-ordained deep-freeze; and he keeps asking questions in a futuristic world in which mind-numbing drugs are pandemic and curiosity is rude at best. When Dr. Maynard Stanhurt, the Oakland urologist who'd recently hired Metcalf to tail his wife Celeste, is killed, the postmodern p.i. fights to clear karma-poor Orton Angwine, brother of Celeste's housemate Pansy Greenleaf, from the freezer as well. Slinging cyberspeak and tags from Raymond Chandler with equal panache, waggish Metcalf holds his own against a pair of tough Public Inquisitors, babyhead Barry Greenleaf, and a variety of genetically enhanced rabbits, kittens, dogs, and a kangaroo enforcer named Joey Castle. But it isn't until after his own karma runs out and he emerges from a six-year freeze to an incomparably bleaker world--memory is now illegal--that Metcalf finally puts the pieces together. A first novel whose mix of genres and voices (``Tell him next time he wants to talk to me, don't send a marsupial'') comically focuses a nightmare hash of yesterday, today, and tomorrow

    2. Re:Richard Morgan by MikeCapone · · Score: 1

      Thanks for the Jonathon Lethem recommendation, I'll check it out.

  31. Re:Ha! I just read this!! by Chimera252 · · Score: 1

    Same here, its one of the few books reviewed here that I have actually read and love. The thing I love about The Scar and Perdido Street Station, are the settings. PSS is set in a gargantuan, stinking, almost Victorian city interlaced with railways and skyrails. The Scar is set on a flotilla of vessels, kind of a patchwork city of boats, ships and pontoons. Each is so beautifully imagined and described, it is difficult not to imagine what it would be like to live there. Take Bellis Coldwine's house for example, a 2 storey house in the chimney of a ship :) I also love 'The Tain' by Mieville, set in post apocalyptic London (which has been done many times before) but Mieville makes it new with a very very original menace to the remaining survivors. FYI, His next novel is due out sometime next year, entitled 'The Iron Council'. I wonder if this has anything to do with the Construct Council in 'Perdido Street Station'?

  32. Perhaps better in a different medium by robotbug · · Score: 1

    Fair or not, when reading _Perdido Street Station_ I couldn't help but think about how, in both structure and style, it seemed to have the sensibilities one would appreciate in a graphic novel. Some of the things that I found tiresome after a spell -- e.g., baroque descriptions, indulgently detailed environments, thinly-drawn characters -- would actually work quite well in an illustrated trade.

    --
    To know inauthenticity is not the same as being authtentic.
  33. Perdido was brilliant by g8oz · · Score: 1

    Perdido Street Station was brilliant, an aggressively ambitious and inventive work. Don't listen to the naysayers, give it a chance. I haven't read something so original in a long time.

  34. Pictures in the mind.... by Slashamatic · · Score: 1
    Both Perdido Street Station and The Scar contain a lot of detail, as you say it has been "baroqued". I had thought about how it could be excised. Really it can't be because it adds texture to the book. You come out of it with a feeling for a complex and deep back story which you only glimpse here and there.

    The characters in The Scar were somewhat thinner, but I wouldn't say that of Perdido. Even the Slake Moths had character there.