A Monocultural Alternative: TheOpenCD

GooseLiverPate writes "Computers and Composition Online has an article by Dr. Paul Cesarini concerning the risks of a Microsoft monoculture in education. He describes the relation between Open Source and Microsoft as: "one of gnats swarming around a large, slow-moving beast." and emphasises the lack of innovation in Internet Explorer and MS-Office. He suggests TheOpenCD as a possible bridge for schools and universities to Open Source, and includes a review of the newly released version 1.2."

Comments

Schools not the best candidates for change

[shystershep]

In advocating resistance to the Microsoft "monoculture" in schools, Cesarini is aiming at the wrong target. Public schools will probably be the very last to "resist" and switch from Microsoft. The "widespread budgetary woes" and "ever-increasing licensing fees" don't effect them. Microsoft gives its products to schools for free or at a steep discount, and is more and more likely to do so the more viable the competition becomes. I don't have any hard data, but I imagine that a transition to Open Source would be more expensive for most schools than hanging on to the goodies from Redmond. And if anybody wonders why MS is so generous to schools, it's not because Bill is such a swell guy - if kids spend their school careers using Windows, Office, Outlook, Exploer . . . well, the first one's always free, right?

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[monkeyfinger]

Schools have to provide children with skills that they will need in the real world. They teach them how to use microsoft because that is what they most of them will use in the workplace.

Once Linux becomes a major player in the business world then schools will start teaching it. You cannot change schools until you change business.

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[randall_burns]

I'm working at a large public school district. I've been successful at getting some Open Source tools in use here(CVS, Python, cygwin). Although there are academic versions of some of the Microsoft products, sometimes these aren't quite the same as the commercial versions. Also, event he discounted cost of some of the development tools is prohibitive.

This district is in fact heading towards Linux-the big reason is that they are heavy users of Novell--and Novell is moving towards Linux in a substantial way. That is how Linux is getting its foot in the door here.

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[jc42]

...basically schools used to use only Macs and clung to them until recently when they started switching to PCs.

When true, this is rather damning for a school.

Schools exist to educate their students, after all. A "black box" system whose inner workings aren't available to students would be the last thing you'd expect a school to use. It would be proof that the school isn't interested in teaching their students to understand the computers.

It used to be that the Mac was the most extreme black-box computer, with "no user-servicable parts". But Macs have been converted to a unix base in recent years. Not just unix, but a rather open and accessible version of unix. So the Mac has gone from being useless for education to being one of the best.

If a school reacts to this by switching from Macs to MS systems, it is clear proof that they don't want their students to become knowledgable about computers. If they were truly trying to educate, why would they switch to what is now the most closed system on the market?

This would be much like, say, a school offering driver's ed, but not auto shop. Or if they had auto shop, not allowing the students to open the hood and start taking a car apart.

People with kids in school should investigate, and if your school system is using closed, proprietary computers, you should complain loudly. Keeping the students ignorant of how computers work (hardware or software) is not a good way to prepare them for the world that is coming.

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[deacent]

Schools exist to educate their students, after all. A "black box" system whose inner workings aren't available to students would be the last thing you'd expect a school to use. It would be proof that the school isn't interested in teaching their students to understand the computers.

In many cases, this is exactly the point. Schools switched to using MS because "everybody knows that's what's used in the real world". Never mind that it probably bears little resemblance to what will be used in the real world when that kid graduates from school. Many schools are not thinking about teaching IT to the majority of their students. They're thinking of teaching them word processing, spreadsheet, and research skills. These skills are really platform agnostic, but that's not generally recognized.

A lot of schools used to use Apples (not just Macs, but Apple IIs as well) because Apple gave enormous discounts to the educational sector. There was a point in time in the dark years when it started to become a foregone conclusion in some people's minds that Apple would be out of business soon, so you might as well get with the winner. Sadly, I think this had the effect of driving up the long term costs to maintain their tech which they're still paying for today. Like business, they have simply accepted that IT has to be expensive, but it's a necessary evil to stay competitive.

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[jc42]

Sadly, I think this had the effect of driving up the long term costs to maintain their tech which they're still paying for today. Like business, they have simply accepted that IT has to be expensive, but it's a necessary evil to stay competitive.

You're probably right. But they may well be wrong. After all, this was the same reasoning that, back in the 1970's and early 1980's, led many schools to install IBM equipment. Those schools then found themselves paying exorbitantly to stay in what turned out to be a backwater. The future was in desktop machines, not mainframes.

It's risky trying to be a prophet, but there's a good chance that schools using this reasoning will find themselves in a similar situation. As with biology, the computing future has pretty much always belonged to the small, agile beasts. The big and powerful might look dominant, but they eventually lose out to the little guys. Some of those little guys evolve to big, powerful beasts, and then the pattern repeats.

A school that wants its students to be winners should always bet on the smallest, most versatile computers. This especially means computers which are programmable by individuals, not by huge IT departments. This should be easy, because these are usually the cheapest computers. But this probably won't happen in many schools.

But there's an ongoing question of how much actual education most of our schools are really interested in. There's a lot of evidence to support the theory that schools' basic function is socialization, and education is mostly a side effect. One of the better pieces of evidence is the widespread use of closed, proprietary computer systems, which don't qualify as "educational" except in the most minimal sense.

Oh, well; computer education has always been mostly at the college (and trade school) level. Very few high-school graduates have ever been able to write even a "Hello, world" program in any language. But we've managed to turn out a small population of computer wizards anyway. Maybe it doesn't matter all that what the public schools do.

Re:Schools not the best candidates for change

[deacent]

But there's an ongoing question of how much actual education most of our schools are really interested in. There's a lot of evidence to support the theory that schools' basic function is socialization, and education is mostly a side effect. One of the better pieces of evidence is the widespread use of closed, proprietary computer systems, which don't qualify as "educational" except in the most minimal sense.

Not where I live. We have a very rigorous education system around here. I know the parents of one kindergarterner who were told by the school that socially, their daughter was right where she should be, but academically, she was too far behind to go to 1st grade. The matter of advancing her to 1st grade was completely out of the question. And this child is not what I regard as a slow learner.

The state that I live in (Connecticut) recommends that students be able to do the following before they enter school (I'm still working on a few of these myself.):

• Use and understand many words.
• Speak in complete sentences.
• Ask lots of questions.
• Say and notice words that rhyme in stories.
• Make up and share personal stories about his or her interests.
• Select familiar books and tell why he or she likes them. Retell favorite stories from books.
• Hold a book upright.
• Identify letters of the alphabet.
• Recognize letter sounds.
• Recognize, copy, and print his or her first name.
• Hold a pencil and write with it.
• Recognize and count up to ten items.
• Recognize the number symbols 1-10.
• Describe and talk about objects that have different sizes, colors, shapes, and patterns.
• Sort items by "same" and "different".
• Use the words "near", "far", "top", "bottom", "under", "first", "second", and "last".
• Sort objects from smallest to largest, shortest to tallest, and lightest to heaviest.
• Understand and participate in conversations.
• Stay involved in a directed activity to its completion.
• Follow routines and directions.
• Work and play together with other children.

Perhaps, my college had the right idea. They are an engineering university located in an inner city adjacent to a high school, along with a few other colleges and univeristies. Ten years ago, these higher level institutions joined forces to change Newark, NJ's image into a college area by creating a better environment for their students and the area residents. Here's the good idea: this group wanted to create a science high school (stuff like engineering, computer science, medicine, architecture, etc.) adjacent to my school. Volunteer college students would be available as tutors to the high school students, creating a mentoring program. It looks like they're estimating that the high school will be complete in 2006. For those who care, you can read more about it here.

I disagree.

[H.G. Pennypacker]

Open source is about choice. People should be able to stay with Microsoft if they want to. Why does anyone still on Windows have to be pestered by a swarm of open source gnats about their choice of OS?

Re:I disagree.

[oobob]

Open source is about choice. People should be able to stay with Microsoft if they want to. Why does anyone still on Windows have to be pestered by a swarm of open source gnats about their choice of OS?

I agree - people should be able to choose what OS and programs they run, which is why I'm so against OSS ninjas sneaking in the labs and my house at night, installing their versions of the software I love to pay for.

When you say pestered, I think you mean exposed to. How many non-techies do you know who've heard about OpenOffice or Firebird? After introducing most of my friends to tabbed browsing and pop-up blocking, there was no need to fall back on any OSS rhetoric. They saw that the program had useful features and decided to use them instead of the MS alternative. And as a former English major, I can say that many a starving artist loved the idea of a free word processor.

The OpenCD project is more a drive to make OSS as accessable to people who aren't that interested in computers as the MS alternative. Since so many MS products are "essential" to Windows, most people are introduced to Windows Media Player, IE, and other proprietary programs before having a chance to check out the competition. Since they can use these immediately, why would they find an alternative, especially when that requires researching an area that they're not particularly interested in? The open cd provides more of a fair playing field. Sadly, since MS is so insistent on bundling everything they have to force out competition, there's still a long ways to go.

Formatted Article

[Anonymous Coward]

A Monocultural Alternative: The OpenCD
Dr. Paul Cesarini
Assistant Professor,
BGSU College of Technology

A Brief History of The OpenCD / Resisting the Monoculture / The Future / Conclusions / Works Cited

Introduction: A Brief History of The OpenCD
In April of last year, Henrik Nilsen Omma was discouraged. He and other enthusiasts of freely distributable Open Source Software (OSS) such as the Linux operating system grew increasingly frustrated at the lack of widespread appeal of this and similar software, beyond the so-called "techie" crowd. They knew the problem was not with the software itself. Free software such as the excellent Mozilla web browser was feature-rich compared to its often-patched, yet feature-bereft Windows counterpart. The same could be said for OpenOffice, a full-featured, free office productivity suite that included many standard features unavailable in then-current versions of Microsoft Office. Nilsen Omma voiced his concerns in an article on Newsforge, one of the premier sites devoted to Linux and related OSS. In this article, titled An Idea for a Free Software CD, Nilsen Omma argued that:

"there are many hurdles when persuading people to switch to Free Software. Most people will not change their entire operating system just for fun; it's too unfamiliar, and they will lose the use of all their favorite programs at the same time. ...The key, as I see it, is to encourage people to use the high-quality Free Software now becoming available in the OS they are already using" (Nilsen Omma, 2002)

The article generated a great deal of interest from the open source community. At that point, Nilsen Omma set up a basic site for the project, dubbed The OpenCD. The goal was simple, if complicated: Create an Open Source showcase, where "new users can try out Open Source software in the comfort of their own, familiar operating system, rather than having to take the drastic step of reformatting their hard drive to install Linux". By focusing on showing the benefits of Open Source Software to a broader audience than that which typically uses it, Nilsen Omma hoped to encourage its adoption. (TheOpenCD, 2003)

Numerous volunteers joined and a considerable amount of time was spent debating the focus and scope of the project, coordinating tasks, and writing documentation. The group decided on releasing a CD, rather than just creating a site with download links to the respective programs. This decision was based on the fact that such sites already exist, and that the targeted demographic for the project -- those new to OSS -- might generally prefer not to have to download programs, and might instead prefer simple CD-based installation.

The result was the 1.0 version of The OpenCD, released as a freely downloadable ISO CD image, last December. Nilsen Omma acknowledges that going with an ISO is somewhat of a necessary evil, in that such disk images are typically meant for more technical users. However, the general assumptions is that these users will "download it, make CDs and give them to their less technical friends."

The criteria for determining which applications were included on the CD image were and still are fairly detailed, and involve a nomination process where testers review potential applications for quality, usability, and related factors. These testers then post their findings in forums on The OpenCD site, where further discussion takes place. The only "hard and fast" rule is that the CD image will not include two similar applications, even if bothare good. This is done to help reduce any likely confusion among the target demographic for the CD. Nilsen Omma considers this one of the projects best strengths. He asserts that their job "is to make difficult choices so that the user doesn't have to." (Nilsen Omma, personal communication, September 18, 2003)

While specifically hoping to attract "non-techies" to OSS, secondary and higher education institutions are also a key target group for this project. They have kept

I prefer to see us as ...

[burgburgburg]

fire ants, who through our concerted, stinging, burning efforts, have forced the slow-moving stupid beast to drop to one knee, confused and infuriated by the pain. If we redouble our efforts, hopefully we'll soon be feasting on big, dumb Microsoft carcas soon.

Similar to ...

[nicodaemos]

... relation between Open Source and Microsoft as: "one of gnats swarming around a large, slow-moving beast."

Funny, I would have described it as "one of flies swarming around a large pile of shiat."

mirrors

[millette]

Here are a few mirrors: http://www.mirror.ac.uk/sites/gd.tuwien.ac.at/pc/O penCD/ ftp://ftp.mirror.ac.uk/sites/gd.tuwien.ac.at/pc/Op enCD/

I've verified it's the newer version, dating yesterday.

Re:Mirrors

[cant_get_a_good_nick]

How'd this get modded up when every one of his www links fail? as the sign says...
Use the Preview Button! Check those URLs!

When I was in school...

[BagOBones]

They taught word processing, and how to use a spread sheet. It really didn't matter what system it was on because the schools never taught anything but the general concepts.

Innovation in office products? Don't you mean bloat.

Word already does over 100 things I don't need it to do when I am writing a paper. You think it needs more?

A similar offering

[cos(0)]

A software compilation to the OpenCD is the

Open Source Software CD

...which is updated monthly with the latest versions of the most popular, high-quality open-source software out there.

Anyone can download it via BitTorrent.

Be sure to check it out.

Not I.

[aaron_ds]

Most schools are immersed in a Windows monoculture.
My highschool was quite the opposite, Most of the computers ran MacOS, with a few running win98/xp, and none running any kind of open/free software.
It's great that a CD like this was made becasue people need to be given a chioce. However, I hope this doesn't become a war of dogmas (free/ proprietary). As nothing good can come of that.

Choose Windows?

[freeweed]

I'll play devil's advocate here:

Most (and by most, I mean pretty much 99.99%) Windows users do not use Windows because of choice.

They use it because it came with their computer. They've become familiar with it and figure it's the best there is, because "hey, it sells the most".

They use it because they've never heard of anything else. If they have heard, they're too scared to try. If they've tried it, they've gone back to Windows because there is no viable alternative for them.

They use it because their workplace makes them use it, and a surprising number of people take work home with them.

They use it because their ISP only supports it. Or their hardware only supports it. Or, little Jimmy down the street who is "good with computers" supports it, because he can click more efficiently than they can.

I think I've met maybe 5 people in my life who actually CHOOSE to use Windows, when presented with viable alternatives for what they do.

No one in the OSS movement (well, no one sane) advocates forcing people to get off of Windows. What they do advocate is educating users so that they CAN make a choice, which in most cases, is currently unavailable.

Re:Choose Windows?

[Kenja]

Your right, they dont advocate forcing people not to use Windows. They, like you, just claim that anyone using Windows must be being forced to do so and should be liberated. I choose to use Windows becuase (are you ready for this) it runs the software I want to use. Linux, BSD, Macintosh, Solaris, IRIX, BeOS, Palm etc do not. Yet I get Linux advocates telling me I should use Linux all the time. Dispite it not running the apps I want and in many cases dosn't have anything even close to what I need a computer to do.

Re:Choose Windows?

[Hermione Kestrel]

I'm a Gamer.

I choose Windows.

Re:Choose Windows?

[q.kontinuum]

This might be right for You and the Software You need. For most schoolars its not. They could do pretty well with OpenOffice, Mozilla and stuff like that. For the most technical subjects there is enough educational software available as well, plus some software development tools for programming lessons, a data-base and a better networking support. Why should a proprietary, expensive (well, not expensive for the schoolars, but expensive for those who are blinded for other choices later on) System be the default? If you need so special Software which is only for MS-Windows available (btw: I do as well, my PC at work runs Windows because I need a cross-compiler which is only avalable for MS-Systems) you are probably flexible enough to change to Windows for that purpose.

Re:Choose Windows?

[t0ny]

You say most people use Windows because they arent 'given' choices. I have dealt with TONS of users, and I have a quite different opinion- they use it because they have adequate skills using it, and because they dont CARE to know anything else.

Why should a doctor, lawyer, CEO, or even secretary have to learn all the ins and outs of a new OS? THEY DONT CARE!!! They are too concerned with being doctors, lawyers, CEOs, secretaries, etc. These people arent computer geeks, and for the most part they arent even the slightest bit interested in knowing how the OS works.

If it does what they need it to do, they are happy. They arent computer geeks, and they dont concern themselves with the fact that Linux can make their word processor work 10% faster than WinXP/OfficeXP. They know how to use it, and thats all they need.

Another point- every time I see one of those silly "d00d, I used WinXP for xxx days, and HAT3D IT!!!1111" articles that pop up here every so often, the first thing the (BSD, Linux, OSX, MacOS, etc) user starts whining about is how the interface isnt what they are used to using, the browser doesnt work the same, they dont have some custom app they are used to working with, etc. You know what? They are acting just like the doctor, lawyer, CEO, or secretary in my example above. They are complaining about the fact that WinXP doesnt function as the OS they are accustomed to using.

Anyway, as far as choice goes, people are free to use whatever OS they want. If they are so desperate to have an OSS OS on their machine, Gates isnt going to come to their house and bitch-slap them for installing it. Saying they dont have choice because it isnt a pre-install option is a weak, cop-out answer. Most people, given the choice, would just stick with what they already know. Which is, in the majority of cases, Windows.

Re:Choose Windows?

[Peaker]

In KDE 3 they just click the MP3 files for them to be enqueued in their Noatun application.

In KDE 3 users can organize their separate tasks into separate desktops. In Windows they have to take the time and effort and download one of the (half-assed, if I may add) desktop support applications. Windows today takes time and effort to get the functionality that usually comes without any help on their part on KDE 3.

Re:Choose Windows?

[cmacb]

I don't think the issue is so much with individuals and what software they choose to use. If you are an avid game player and have to have Windows to run your games that's fine. Do so at home, with my blessing. In business and government, it's another matter, particularly in government. Here are my two first hand experiences... compare with your own...

At the Department of Energy I worked with a group of 100 or so OS/2 users. This was back in the early 90s. They loved OS/2 and had no desire to change. As an autonomous department, they technically could run any software they wanted. However when it came time to upgrade their PCs to a newer generation of hardware they were given an ultimatum: Switch to Windows or keep your old PCs. They eventually switched.

At another well known federal agency there is a group of people who love IBM computers and operating systems. There is also a group of people who hate IBM and anything connected with them. More importantly these two groups hate each other and are in constant conflict. Since their systems have to talk to one another there is ample opportunity to stab each other in the back... cause something to fail (or just wait for a natural occurence) and then try and blame the other group.

Many years ago the anti-IBM crowd decided to build a system based on Wang mini-computers. The system basically sucked, but it wasn't a good career move to say so. The only reason they migrated off the Wang systems was that Wang went out of business. In fact they ran the system out of used parts for quite a while before declaring the situation an "emergency" which meant that huge amounts of money were spent for a quick conversion effort that should instead have been carefully planned.

They picked Windows as their new target architecture. I'm not sure that this was necessarily a bad decision, and in fact there were parts of the "plan", such as it was, that tried to encourage the use of "standards based" softare. This means that you write your programs to use, to the extent possible, generic SQL (for example) rather than Oracle, DB/2, or SQL Server syntax. Because it was an "emergency" however, these sound business concepts were ignored and the system became locked into specific DBMS/Compiler/Operating system ways of doing things. Seven years later and the system is still buggy as hell. The application is written in a now non-supported programming language, but the only fix for this would be another total re-write.

At one point a group I was involved with was asked to recommend some statistical analysis software to allow for ad-hoc queries of this 7 years worth of data. Using live data the analyst compared several potential products and rated them. As part of the summary he pointed out that while several of the proposed products were quite capable, he had noticed during the tests that almost no column of values in the database had sufficiently enough valid data points (both missing and mangled values) to draw any statistical inferences, no matter what product they picked. Both analyst and report were "shuffled off to Buffalo" never to be seen again.

I was there for another year or so after that. There was begrudging talk about the lack of wisdom in continuing to rely on non-supported components. Jokes about the similarity to the Wang systems were getting too common. They went to one of the top consulting firms for independent outside advice (a very good idea in my opinion). After months of study, they issued an analysis of just one of the many applications there. Not surprisingly they said it was too dependant on the quirks and features of a particular DBMS. It also was using outmoded client/server methodologies and of course the non-supported compiler was full of bugs as was the resultant application. They also threw in some concerns about Windows security, which was just starting to show up on the radar for large geographically dispersed organizations (network dependencies).

I was encouraged by the

Re:Choose Windows?

[t0ny]

Maybe they shouldn't be using computers anyway. A typewriter is much easier to use than Word (oh, never mind, you have to spell correctly... no squiggles when you 'mispell' a word), a notebook stores notes quite nicely. If you're *typesetting*, then a computer is essential, but for memos it is a waste. Computers are good at doing math. Computers are good for writing computer programs. That's what they're for. Quake and Word are bastrdizations of the microcontroller.

Actually, I recommend we issue each person an abacus, and clay tablets so they can just write in cuneiform. We can also replace our plumbing with wooly mamoths, and make our cars with two large round rocks connected by logs, which we power buy 'running' under our car.

WILMA!!!!

Innovation lacking in Open Source as well

[cmorriss]

and emphasises the lack of innovation in Internet Explorer and MS-Office.

So often Microsoft is decried as unoriginal with all its products and with this I certainly agree. However, and I'm not trying to troll here, rarely have I seen Open Source software do anything but the same.

Most innovation comes from small closed source companies that have an idea and want to make some money off of it. Microsoft moves forward by either emulating these companies or buying them outright. Open Source software seems to move forward almost exclusively through emulating these innovative companies (Either directly or indirectly by emulating Microsoft).

Almost all open source software provides a piece of functionality already provided in closed source or non-"free as in beer" software

This all begs the question, why doesn't open source encourage more innovation? I really don't know why. Does anyone else have an answer to this?

Re:Innovation lacking in Open Source as well

[An Onerous Coward]

Okay, I'll bite.

First, I'll admit that there isn't a whole lot of fundamental innovation when it comes to end user desktop software. Gnome and KDE take a lot of their interface decisions from Windows and Macintosh. Mozilla's interface is comparable to IE. GIMP has a totally different interface from any other image manipulation system I've seen, but from a functionality standpoint, it's not doing anything too far above and beyond the call of duty (unless you can master the Lisp-iness of their filter language).

A lot of this "lack of innovation" is due to the fact that people have come to expect these applications to behave in a given way, and the applications have to live within that framework. Another is due to the difficulty in discerning just what new and wonderful features can be added to the system. For example, I can't think of a single thing that I could suggest adding to Microsoft Word that would be gratefully used by more than a few percent of the user base.

Where the real innovation occurs is in niche applications and other small projects. BitTorrent, anyone? FreeNet, Wiki, Slashcode... all strike me as impressive, non-trivial ideas. The Linux kernel is constantly adding new features, and the development methodology is about as innovative as anything I can think of in the computing industry.

Finally, a lot of "innovation" is simply programmers implementing what the users suggested. If you have an idea for a nifty new feature in a software project, drop the developers a line. If it's not something of the "Sharks with friggin' laser beams" variety, they'll probably be grateful for the interest.

GNUwin

[spartro]

I have always been a big advocate for open source at the schools, but most of the big education software is win/mac only and most technology coordinators at schools are hesitant to give the K12LTSP a shot. This week Igave a speech to a bunch of other school technology coordinators about the GnuWin CD. Plenty Open Source for Win. I downloaded at the Open CD once and found GnuWin to be more comprehensive. I guess I should take a look at the new version. Most schools were highly interested in OpenOffice and AbiWord, so the foots in the door here.

Compliments from MS

[Melissa Bra]

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,4149,1331169,00.as p "Addressing several thousand attendees at the Worldwide Partner Conference, he took a swipe at Linux, open source and StarOffice, saying, "they simply accept the view that what they have is good enough. That view does not foster innovation. Being where we were with Office 1997 is not good enough for us," he said." Microsoft admitting that OO is already equal to something they spent millions and millions on and also happens to be much more widely used than Office XP is the best thing they could have said. I mean that. Office 97 is still very popular. One of the biggest challenges MS has is moving people off that since many businesses find that Office 97 is all they need. The fact they think OO has met the quality level that most of world thinks is "good enough" is excellent news. Congrats to the OpenOffice.org team and thanks to Microsoft for the marketing material.

The Open CD?

[Anonymous Coward]

Disc not inserted. Please close tray and try again.

OpenOffice 1.1, the perfect choice.

[Anonymous Coward]

As I am no way in hell able to afford Microsoft Office, I can only use it at College, not at work or home.

OpenOffice 1.1 has saved my life. Even complex presentations, with Animations, Transitions, Pcitures and Sounds are imported flawlessly in Version 1.1 and it is very fast.

Many students I also know are starting to use it. OpenOffice, together with KDE is perfect. I admit OpenOffice 1.0 was a bit slow and ugly, but version 1.1 is perfect.

Re:So...

[Citizen Gold]

From the About page;
"The Open CD project aims to introduce users of MS-Windows to the benefits of Free and Open Source Software (FOSS)."

Don't you think users of an OSS OS would already be aware of these benefits?

Uhhhh......no

[spartro]

The "widespread budgetary woes" and "ever-increasing licensing fees" don't effect them.

That is why I was told to use the leftovers from last years tech budjet to buy enough toner cartridges and ink cartridges for this year and next. We have already been told that the money isn't there. After many years in school systems, the only time I believe it when people tell me about future money is when they say it isn't there.

Microsoft gives its products to schools for free or at a steep discount, and is more and more likely to do so the more viable the competition becomes.

Could you please point me to where this is available for schools? All my MS products are at a marginal discount. At best.

The OpenCD for Closed Systems.

[mmcguigan]

gnuwin.org has not released a new CD in some time now. I'm glad to see a new CD like this from another group. I have not downloaded this CD yet and I'm sure they have spent a lot of time trying to package these programs up neatly for end-users. I love giving people choices in what software they can use, but why do all of these so called Open CD's that contain sofware for Closed Systems contain software that can only be found on that closed platform?

I really like FileZilla, but it is not based on Mozilla as one might think and it is not available on any platform other than a closed one. Once you get them hooked on this excellent FTP program, what do you say for yourself when the only reason they won't try another system is because their favorite FTP program is not available there?

Is this CD really open?

Try again...

[forevermore]

Are we so quick to forget incidents like this one, where Microsoft started going after schools for license violations? Microsoft and the Gates Foundation may give away a lot of stuff to schools and libraries, but it's rarely enough to make a dent in the budgets of most schools (I still send a number of old computers to my mom's classroom - running linux or old versions of macos - because her school can't afford to give her the computers she needs).

Re:Try again...

[tshak]

On the contrary. If MS is giving away so much software to schools, and giving schools a _steep_ discount on their software, it's a slap in MS's face to be pirating their software in schools. I'd go after them too. If the school can't afford the software, don't pirate it, use a cheaper alternative. I have no problems if a school determines that Linux will work, I do have a problem when a school determines that MS is a better solution, and then pirates $10 copies of WinXP.

Here ya go...

[Seraphim_72]

The pricing my school gets is obscene - I have made the pitch to the head of technology about open source - then he showed me in real dollars what we pay for the entire campus for MS products - think everything but servers for a 500 seat computer set up - $14000 a year. Oh, and we are looking into it, but it probably includes free student versions of VS.Net for any student enroled in a .net class.

Here are a few links to get you started
For programming stuff

For OS agreements w/MS

Re:IE and Office

[CommandNotFound]

What's painful about OpenOffice? If you want more fonts and clip art, buy StarOffice, which uses compatible file formats with OOo.

I thought using a computer...

[ErnstKompressor]

was the skill one had to learn, not pre-disposing kids to using MS software. The greatest fallacy I hear is how different 'other' OS's are from Windows...what a crock. Kids would be better served if they were taught word processing and spreadsheet skills independant of branding their skill-set as being profecient in 'MS Office.'

Hell, the majority of working-age adults cut their teeth on Apple II's, and they seemed to transition to Windows units without much trouble, so I think the 'wisdom' of teaching kids to use Windows is really just marketing spin and 'lock-in tactics.

Re:I thought using a computer...

[Fancia]

I definately agree. I'd never used Linux for more than a few minutes, I must admit, until buying my AmigaOne, which had Debian preloaded. I can't claim to be an expert in it, but the transition was extremely easy. KDE controls like Windows, but nicer, and learning anything new I needed to wasn't very difficult. Transferring skills you've learned on one OS to other OSs isn't too difficult anymore.

Re:Joke?

[Zaiff Urgulbunger]

Open office is a 3 year out of date copy of MS Office.
MS Office hasn't changed that much since Office 95! There *are* changes but since most people use Bold, Italic, select fonts, maybe insert pictures sometimes and save, email, print, any changes make little difference to most people.
[snip].. or don't want to pay for MS Office.
Seems like a good reason to me!

I'll say it again -- most people use a small number of features which OpenOffice more than caters for. So, yeah you *can* pay MS if you're charitable, but really OpenOffice does make a lot of sense.

Easing down the road

[wed128]

That's just not the point...OpenCD seems like a great idea to me...

Show windows users (not you defensive knowledgable ones, i mean schoolkids and people in libraries) that they have an alternative to the software they use, and they may become very receptive to it.

soon they may open their eyes to the fact that there is an alternative out there...some of them may become interested, and progress, and eventually move away from propriatary software all together. Some of them might not care.

I really think OEM's ought to push this as a default install on windows computers, and then offer office, photoshop etc. as upgrades (or sidegrades, seeing as it is equivelent software).

After using free software, people might see that moving to a completely free platform isn't so scary afterall.

I have yet to meet someone who, after using linux for a while, wanted to switch back. This includes some very non-technical friends of mine.

Consumers Choose Windows.

[tshak]

The seperation of an OS and a computer is ludacrious from a consumer standpoint. It's like seperating the OS of your cellphone and saying that the consumer did not "choose" the software/OS of the cellphone. The consumer chose Windows just as much as they chose the computer in which they purchased. You can purchase Apple computers, in which part of that choice is choosing OSX. What's different about the x86 hardware platform is that it's more open and therefore has many OS's that run on it, but that doesn't mean that a consumer needs to be aware of that.

The software, particularly the OS, is the interface to the consumer. That's a huge part of what they see when they go to make a purchase decision. The other factor is of course the hardware "specs" that they know little to nothing about (eg: p4 3.2Ghz, 1Gig RAM, etc.), but just make decisions based on "bigger is better". Nevertheless, you have to treat a computer as a whole product.

Finally, Windows95 was one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) _retail_ software launches in terms of sales, ever. So, people who already had computers made the choice to go spend an extra $90 to upgrade their machine.

Re:Consumers Choose Windows.

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree, but then you come to the next hurdle - MS punishing any company who tries to diversify into linux/x86 machines, and MS punishing any hardware OEM who releases specifications to linux developers.

Great Christmas gift

[hey]

I gave the OpenCD to manty people for Xmas last
year. Its cheap and they seemed to like it.

practical obstacles

[bcrowell]

I've been trying hard to make open-source inroads at my own school, but the devil is in the details. Examples:

I teach physics lab courses, and would like my students to be able to use OSS to do their graphs. (E.g., it's a drag when they save their Excel file, take it home, and find out they can't read it with the older version of Excel they have at home.) Unfortunately, Open Office is missing some critical features, like the ability to fit a line to the data and find the slope of the line. (Or maybe the feature is there, but I couldn't find it.) There's other OSS that can find the slope, of course, but my students need something with a familiar-looking UI.

We have lab equipment that we interface to, and the software doesn't run on Linux.

I've tried using Samba to print on the shared laser printer from my desktop FreeBSD machine. Unfortunately, the postscript files I generate have a tendency to cause an error which stops the queue. My co-workers are not happy when that happens, so now I print at home, or, if I have to print at work, I transfer a PDF file to a Windows machine.

Our instructional computing staff is undermanned. They already administer two operating systems (Windows and MacOS). I can't really blame them for not wanting to administer three.

There is no critical mass of faculty members who want to use an open-source OS or open-source apps. The typical reaction is that Linux sounds hard to use. And you know what? They're kind of right. Try explaining to most people -- even the science geeks I work with -- about shared library conflicts, or explaining to them why cut and paste doesn't have consistent behavior.

Microsoft K12 Pricing

[amemily]

http://www.edtech.wednet.edu/purchasing/

Link to the WSIPC price list for Microsoft products is somewhere on that site.

Prices are for Washington State school districts though.

Insight into a Linux User

[Dalcius]

Hey buddy, I'm really sorry for the Linux newbies who are still fawning over Linux, but don't lump us all up with the idiotic zealots. That's just as much of a logical fallacy as to say nobody uses Windows because they like it over all the other alternatives.

Any true Linux user is all about choice. That's what makes Linux great.

If Windows suits your needs, then so be it. That's great! I'm honestly happy for you. I wish Linux could provide that, maybe someone can help fill that need. It's the same thing I tell the folks I know: Linux isn't for some people.

If there is one piece of advice I can give anyone to understanding the rants of a Linux person, it's this:
Most Linux folks don't care what you use. They found a system that is elegant, suits their needs and let's them tweak things to their exact preferences. They found a system that is very in tune with the way they use a computer. And they want to share the gem that they found. This can start the rabid zealot rants, especially from a new Linux convert. I used to fall in this category; then I got over it, realized that not everyone will do best with Linux and moved on.

NOW, my biggest thing is education. It hurts to see someone down-talking Linux when they know little to nothing about it. I enjoy showing people Linux as most people don't know what it is -- maybe they'll enjoy it as I have. It's when people start spewing misinformation that I get mad.

This has been my experience. I sincerely hope that Linux folks can be a little less rabid and I hope that Windows users will be a little less defensive.

Cheers

As a Public School Teacher, I Think This is Doomed

[dbn3]

I teach for a very large school district in Texas. This past year the district purchased laptops for all the teachers. The laptops ran $1050. The license for office was $50 a pop. That is an amazing price, but the district refused to pay. Instead they bought a district support contract from Sun for StarOffice.

No one uses it. Attachments still all show up as .doc (or .pdf) files, never the StarOffice format. In addition, many teachers I know are not very good at using computers. They have a hard enough time learning how to use MS Office without learning StarOffice, too.

Yes, its the same functions in a slightly different interface, but that's not the point. Teachers are never interested in doing extra work that they do not see will have a direct impact on their classroom. Its just too easy to ask the tech teacher for a copy of MS Office and install it anyway.

Re:How is this different than Knoppix?

[toddestan]

Nor does Knoppix.

But I think I get the idea behind the CD. People are willing to try out free software. Many are not willing to give up Windows just yet though.

So give them a taste of what's out there via free software that runs on top of Windows. Once they get used to the idea and see how great the software is, then they will be more willing to take the plunge and switch to running Linux.

Re:OS the little private Elementary School? Though

[gentgeen]

I would say - Give it a shot. At least on a small scale (ie. one classroom at a time) I am a teacher at a small charter school in Pittsburgh PA. I used a current DELL (shipped with XP) and installed K12LTSP. The dumby terminals and switch was all donations from the local LUG. It cost the school 1 computer (that they already had), and now I have 8 student computers in the class.

Best of all is when a student comes in from the lab (all XPs) and asks to use "my lab" cause they like it better. Some say it runs faster, some say they have less problems, some say they just like it. I really don't care why, it is just great!!

Now I even have a science teacher wanting me to put one in here room.

vietnam again - lin-cds kicks (MS) butt

[h0lug]

... just building a bit on both this story and the earlier slashdot conflag' entitled Vietnam goes open source

Two great new Vietnamese language Linux CD-distros are now available -- and make great toys for loading up Windows or Linux partitions straight past most file security most people apply:

01 KDLC 9.2 rc1 - Mandrake/Gnome based, ftp iso download

02 knoppix 3.3 caugiay - Knoppix/KDE based, ftp iso download

We're approaching fully localized OSS OS's and Office suites for the vast majority of the 80 million plus Vietnamese who can neither speak English nor afford MS's global one-price policy for licenses.

NB: MS promised an effective Viet-localized Windows/Office release back in '95. But, to date, nothing they've delivered has made a dent in the pirated US-English MS Vietnam-market-share (90%+).

Viva la HeteroISCult[TM,01]!
Down with HomoISCult [02].

All the best from,
The h0z at h0lug

Notes:
[01] heterogenous info-systems culture
[02] What does inbred pitbulls and an MS-monopolized IS infrastructure have in common? They're both crazed and dangerous.

Microsoft easier in education that OSS

[master_p]

It's easier for a teacher armed with Windows to teach computers to small children than using Linux, because Windows have a more consistent GUI and the need for diving into the command line is less often.

On the other hand, children are like sponges, they learn much quicker, and it's far more likely to become experts in Linux rather than their teachers; something most teachers would like to avoid.

There are also economical reasons (i.e. MS giving away Windows and Office) for MS dominance.

So, I don't expect MS to be replaced with Linux anytime soon.

Re:Microsoft easier in education that OSS

[pandrijeczko]

>>Windows have a more consistent GUI and the need >>for diving into the command line is less often.

Please justify this statement. Linux has a large number of GUIs admittedly but those considered to be most "Windows-like" (i.e. that include a number of built-applications like text editors, email programs, etc.) are Gnome and KDE. Both desktop environments have application menus on a button in the bottom left of the screen, a taskbar to which windows are iconified, etc. Added to this, applications within each are compiled to specific Gnome or QT libraries giving a consistent "look and feel" to the applications.

I therefore do not see how the "consistent GUI" argument can be applied.

Also, I would be grateful if you would explain under what circumstances a standard user using Gnome or KDE might need to resort to the command line? The only time I can see this happening is that on some occasions it's necessary to run a "which" or a "find" to find the location of an application so as to create a shortcut icon to it on the desktop - hardly a great problem.

Also, try to perform network diagnostics on a Windows PC without having to resort to "ipconfig", "nslookup", "ping" or "tracert" on the command line.

My concern here is that you are a Windows-oriented user - that's fine, use what OS you are comfortable with and whatever applications you like using. However, please do not decry Linux until you have tried it to a much greater extent than you already clearly have done - you argument is based purely on supposition, not on fact.

Why do we continue to get Windows people who have never used Linux thinking they know all about Linux? If anything, the Linux people on Slashdot (including myself) are always well-informed about Windows also so can put up intelligent arguments - most Windows people use many of the same old tired arguments that they've read elsewhere on the Internet that frequently no longer apply to Linux due to its maturity now.

Re:Hacking the high school network..

[Doug Loss]

OK, here are some starting points for Linux in Arabic:

http://www.arabiclinux.com/
http://www.arabeyes .org/
http://www.linux-me.org/
http://www.linux4 arab.com/ (you need to read arabic for this one)
http://www.langbox.com/arabic/
http://www.l inuxarabia.com/
http://www.iraqilinux.org/

Those should do for a start.