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AOL Lays Off 450 In California
bmarklein writes "AOL has laid off 450 in California. The former Netscape campus is going from 675 employees to 300. The San Francisco office, which they obtained when they acquired Spinner (now Radio@AOL), and which housed Nullsoft after their acquisition by AOL, is being closed along with an office in San Diego. 100 employees have been offered jobs in Virginia or New York. No word on how this affects products like WinAmp. Justin, are you out there?"
That has to be a good .03% of their workforce.
Slow day already?
Hardly a surprise given their sudden lack of enthusiam for non-microsoft products, now they've kissed and made up with Redmond.
Anyone would wonder if Winamp and Netscape were just tools to help them get their way.
Go mozilla...
Q: What do you call 450 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean?
A: A good start.
"What we're doing is actually moving some of our projects into teams in other facilities."
Sounds to me like winamp will have a distinct bangladesh feel to it next version
675 - 450 = 300?
Two Nullsoft employees (Brennan and Aus) were yesterday. Winamp will continue though.
Somehow even if AOL was stupid enough to lay him off, I am sure the creator and lead for WinAmp would have NO problem finding employment. In fact, I bet a certain company in Redmond, WA wouldn't have any problem in picking him up.
AOL started out in the dial up industry which from what I can tell has gone right down the shitter for them, however they still managed to merger with Time-Warner before they figured out. Now what have they got? Certainly dial up won't get them anywhere, and the broadband service they offer is just a piece of seemingly annoying proprietary software. Where can they go from here ?
If the dollar is an "I owe you nothing", then the Euro is a "Who owes you nothing." - Doug Casey
So does this mean I can expect a reduction of AOL cds in my mail?
I heard from a friend who works for AOL - their entire internal support staff is being moved offshore (to india).
i have no idea if this is the same layoffs though...
675 is the number of employees at the netscape campus that is being reduced to 300. == -375 jobs
as you point out. but that is only 1 of the 3 california offices being hit with layoffs in California. 450 refers to the number of total jobs lost in the entire state.
This leaves the balance of the 450 lost jobs (the 75 missing from the nestcape-alone tally) to come from the number of non-re-located employees from the sanfran complex (housing spinner and nullsoft), and the san diego offices.
// "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
Hello!
You got laid off!
Goodbye.
%$##@!
Vos teneo officium eram periculosus ut vos recipero is.
So do I. I remember people talking about them being "the next Microsoft", and not in a flattering sense. I remember the incompatible tags they introduced. I remember the appalling mess of Netscape 4 and CSS.
And then there was the <blink> tag...
I can remember distinctly when I switched to IE, and at the time it was because IE was better, not because Microsoft forced me to. I can also remember switching back to Mozilla (and then Firebird), again because the browser was better.
I would argue that the glory days of Netscape stopped at Netscpe 3, took a break and restarted in the present time due to Mozilla. I'm not certain now what percentage of Mozilla developers are ex-Netscape, but I imagine it's still high enough to be called Netscape-in-another-form.
Cheers,
Ian
In fact, I bet a certain company in Redmond, WA wouldn't have any problem in picking him up.
NINTENDO OF AMERICA'S GOING TO BUY WINAMP? GASP!
AOL acquired Nullsoft a long time ago. Well before their version 3 release... which coincidently is said to be their worst release ever. Hmmm. Maybe you have a point.
You've got a pink slip!
Goo goo g'joob.
No actually it's an increase that's coming in the future. They've actually laid off a brewing anti-"cd shipping" group within the company that was distributing propaganda to eliminate the cd's that we enjoy getting in the mail. Thank God they shut these guys down. Now I can finish building my house of CDs...egg-cellent.
___ Shout Central - Crushes your nuts!
Tis the Christmas Season, I got my notice yesterday,
though I don't/didn't work for AOL.
That drops our ratio of UNIX admins to UNIX servers
from 1/200 to 1/400.
"The last thing I want to do is deal with a bunch of people who want something."
Major Major
Oh well, it can be worse. You could get ranked and yanked, like I did. When that happens, they paper your file, rake you over the coals for a few months and fire you individually. It looks great. In my case, my supervisor made sure he nailed me on my birthday. Another great and integral part of rank and yank is bonus incentives for those not fired. The company was talking about bonuses as high as 15%, knowing they could split the salaries of the people they planned to fire. It's strange how no one but supervisors were excited about that.
Look forward to getting the usual communist propaganda from the company by mail for a while. The idiots in HR sent me a big fat glossy book, personalized with my own numbers, about what great benefits the company has for it's employees. The only thing they missed in the personalization was the fact that I was fired. How sofisticated, the company really loves me.
My company was big, but Time/Warner is much bigger. I wonder if the Netscape people are going to have it that much worse than I did. Nah, it's hard to get worse than fired, no matter how the jack-asses dress it up.
Welcome to the great suck that is the "recovery". I've been out of real work for more than a year. I'm not really happy to have lots of company.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
I for one was expecting this. Considering that earlier in the year AOL Time Warner decided to change its name back to just Time Warner. It is common knowledge that they have been losing thier clients to other ISP services like MSN and Comcast. When your user base shrinks the company must as well to keep from losing to much money on having to large of a workforce for thier userbase.
-Certified TechnoWeinie
So do I. Though only as an event in history. Netscape Communicator is gone. Dead. Arising from its ashes, however, is a top class browser that leaves netscape communicator and internet explorer coughing in its dust. Let go of netscape. AOL had no problem doing so.
ibhear
If I remember correctly, Justin quit Nullsoft a while back. Ah, here's the link.
It's: Winamp, it is really whipping the elephant's ass!
Somebody tell me that little icon fscker running man was included in those layoffs, and also will some of their users be laid off ...
source http://www.antioffline.com/aolstory.html
Confident with the US government's standing on its purchases, AOL announced today they will purchase themselves in a hostile takeover move in an effort to ensure they don't compete with themselves.
Time Warner an AOL subsidiary backed AOL's decision with the company's spokesperson stating "We as a company are please to announce that customers will have the ability to choose between AOL and the new line of products titled XAOL which simply translates to eXtended AOL which will feature more robust happy face icons with a slightly higher 102 megabyte overhead of icons and sounds.
"In addition we are now ceasing the abilities of hackers by bundling XAOL with the latest in our very own firewall which features will include packet filtering, AOHell punters for our chatters, and SpamGod v.1 for our users who send bulk mail."
As for the takeover plans include an overhaul of the technical support group which will now have mandatory classes at Romper Room and a new set of AOL for Dummies, Internet for Idiots in 21 days for Dummies, and The Internet Who'd of Thunk it, books in order to facilitate their skills.
"Customers will also have new screen names to keep up to date with the changes of the net, so a user named billybob will have all aliases associated with that name to keep AOL as hip as ever. BiLLyBoB, xXxBiLLyBoBxXx, b1llyb0b, are some of the combinations available at this time." states Justin Case CTO Operations.
Along with these added new functionalities in AOL, monopolies will be built around Time Warner's existing empire and the entire cast of the WB's popular will fill chat rooms from 6-9pm and the cast of Buffy the Vampire Slayer will also join popular chatroom channels such as DesperateAndDumbHousewives.
Investors are delighted to this deal and are pouring millions of dollars into this new venture in hopes of someday being able to interpret anything related to technology. "As long as its on the Internet it must be profitable, so we filled out portfolios and dumped our life savings into this wonderful idea."
Phil McGroin analyst Meryll Lurch
MoFscker
Both NYTimes and slashdot jumped the gun there, he certainly does still work for AOL. Read his .plan.
Personally I don't want Winamp 3 because every version I tried was horribly unstable and I had to end up uninstalling it. The only really cool thing about it was the media library and that ended up in 2.x. So, I never saw any need to migrate.
Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
'You've got dole!'
'You've got a P45.'
'You've got food stamps!'
. Any more? I suspect said ex-employees will be finding out if you can build a house out of AOL cds.
They have also layed off people at their Tucson, Arizona support site...so that should be up to about 2.2% of their work force. So you AOL'ers have a longer wait time on hold for your 7 minutes of support now (;
Yuma, AZ...You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious.
The napkin makers got over it. So should you.
The problem with your analogy is that the napkin makers still get paid. McDonald's pays napkin makers so that a McDonald's customers can have free napkins. And more likely then compared to textiles and gasoline, napkins are probably made in America, which puts money back into Americans pockets.
The main issue with more and more industries going overseas for workers is that less money is being given to the American public, yet people are still in the constant-consuming mindset. And they are going into debt over it, so that they can have that nice car and the big projection TV and the cell phone. Just like all the commercials tell them they deserve.
Although the tech industry has really brought this upon themselves during the boom. I recently read an article (saw the link on Fark, too lazy to look it up) about a guy who started a consultant company. While looking for workers he decided to try something novel (to him and most tech workers it seems, but not to someone like me who's lived this). He decided to offer positions for the same wages that Indian programmers are offered: $45,000 a year. Being a Canadian who hasn't bothered with looking for work in the US, I was personally shocked by this. If the only reason US tech workers aren't finding jobs is because no one is willing to offer a good wage (not extraordinary, buy-me-a-Lexus-and-an-SUV kind of wages, but good enough to live modestly), then I feel no pity for companies at all. The guy who offered those wages was flooded with resumes. People are obviously willing to work, despite not having the huge paychecks. But they have to be given the chance. Companies have to realise the value of hiring locally at fair wages.
Now as for textiles...everyone but the main "Promotional" companies (i.e. Nike, etc) is getting screwed on that deal. People really should be upset over that entire industry...
I hope that their layoff comes with a nice deal, like maybe getting an AOL CD in the mail.
30% Troll, 50% Underrated, 10% Interesting
Score:5, Troll
Oh grow up. You're putting words into my mouth that are utterly without basis from what I posted. I think any job loss is bad news, and 450 is really distressing. I've been in situations where I've put my shirt on the line for a company I believed in and, in some cases, just wriggled through, and, in other cases, paid the price with my job. And, hey, guess what? In one of those cases I was the sole programmer at a company that ended up struggling and decided to cut me loose first.
If you read my direct quotation of the 2% figure as being somehow trivializing, then you're deliberately trying to spin it. 2% of a company's workforce is, to me, fairly substantial. Getting rid of innovative people such as the undisputedly talented programmers under discussion here is a very real and serious action.
Looking at your other post on this topic, it looks like you've got a chip on your shoulder, but it's certainly justifiable. Unlike you, I'm not going to wish you ill or gloat, because I've been there and know how much it sucks, and it's just not worth it to spread the bitterness. I really do hope you find a job soon.
The idiots in HR sent me a big fat glossy book, personalized with my own numbers, about what great benefits the company has for it's employees. The only thing they missed in the personalization was the fact that I was fired. How sofisticated, the company really loves me.
That sounds sadly typical of the people who work in HR departments. A few years ago, my mom was laid off from an insurance company after they decided to close the office she worked at. Several days later, they called her at home to do an exit interview, and one of the questions they asked was "why did you leave this position?" - which made her start crying.
Come to think of it, this was just after Christmas - I was home at the time on Christmas break from college. The timing may have been more a fiscal calender that conincided with the calender year, but it still seemed kind of harsh.
I have blog like everyone else
Jobs going overseas allows other people a chance to own houses, computers, cars and televisions, but more importantly allows more tax money to go back into their own economy, which is then reinvested so that water can be treated and delivered to where it is needed, infrastructure put in place for better markets, better medical aid, better roads. "Buy American" is a great ideal, but it's far far from the trade deficite truth Americans live in. unless Americans are willing to do the same work for a lot less, it's not going to change, and that won't happen until Americans curb their appetites for just about everything. Mark my words, unless there is some incredible breakthrough in technology, the excess we currently live in wont last much longer, or will become available to fewer and fewer people, as the dichotomy of classes increase.
As a side note to my second paragraph, I wonder if its accidental that the US arms race, as well as its pressure on other countries to increase their military might, is not just to make sure that less money goes into infrastructure that would make those countries a better place. But thats a whole other ball of wax.
I'm a writer, a poet, a genius, I know it. I don't buy software, I grow it.
His .plan has a link to a picture of Winamp being used on the space station. woot.
Ronald said nothing. He flung himself from the room, flung himself upon his horse, and rode madly off in all directions.
If anything, AOL Time Warner sued Microsoft. Sure, AOL shouldn't have settled their antitrust case, but large institutional shareholders have been pressuring the board to start cutting costs and reducing debt (kinda funny how AOL Time Warner has $25 billion in debt and shareholders are complaining yet Comcast has a debt of $30 + billion and its JUST a cable company) and they didn't have the stomach to continue fighting Microsoft which probably would've lasted in court another 5 years. So instead of winning a $10 billion case, having the damages trippled to $30 billion and then having to fight Microsoft on appeals for several more years, AOL Time Warner took the $750 million settlement and "promised" to look at Microsoft's Windows Media technology.
Since then, AOL has been aligning itself with Apple. Instead of using WMA files, AOL has been shifting to support the iTunes Music Store. Big loss for MSN. Sure, AOL has been cutting out Mozilla development, but they haven't snuggled up to Microsoft either. I would be willing to bet that AOL Time Warner was embarassed to fund Mozilla once Apple brought Safari to market (I'd bet money AOL would offer a Windows-based "Safari" if Apple made an official port). Check out that AOL PC. AOL is rebundling Star Office as "AOL Office." That's not exactly endearing themselves to Microsoft. AOL also gave lipservice in the settlement to AIM/MSN interoperability, but nothing has happened on that account (I'd expect to see AIM/Yahoo Messenger interoperability before that). AIM is now available on all the major mobile phone services in the U.S. (Cingular just signed on).
So where exactly is the so-called Microsoft-love? AOL is still fighting Microsoft, although it is more special ops style than overt displays. And if AOL cuts Nullsoft, it isn't because of Microsoft, its because of Apple's iTunes... After all, Steve Jobs pretty much praised AOL in that interview with Rolling Stone, plus anyone with a Mac with Safari as their browser knows that the Netscape/Apple webpage is the default homepage for nothing...
ps. Oh, I completely forgot about AOL and Apple's cozy relationship with iChat...hmmm...
"Right now, somewhere in this world, Scott Baio is plowing a woman he doesn't love," - Peter Griffin, *Family Guy*
You've touched on a big beef of mine. Bay area housing at $250-$400/SF and up is not substantially different than Roanoke, Virginia housing at $100/SF, except you get more land under the building.
I bought 8 acres of hillside with a view that even God would be envious of for about 50k. Sure, it's ten miles outside of Blackburg (Virginia Tech), but that's not too far to drive. I even have DSL and CableTV (though I get my video via DirecTV).
I started a company that relies on the building industry, so I have to be somewhat close to civilization, and I'll be generating real income in under a year...starting from scratch.
Why is it that high tech firms believe that they must locate in big, expensive cities? How many of your programmers have to make face-to-face visits with clients on a weekly basis? You could just as easily move to Newport, Pembroke, or Pearisburg, VA and set up shop for nickles on the dollar. Would people have to relocate? Probably. Can you live on $45k? Comfortably. And you'll know your neighbors, and everybody will wave to you when they see you. Go to www.gilescounty.org, call up Chris McKlarney and he'll set you up. He's got space for new businesses that's just now coming online.
Me? I rent space in an historic building downtown for under $5/SF. 768kADSL to my business runs $44/mo. Electricity is $0.05/kWh. VaTech is right down the road - good for interns and p/t workers, plus the research library and all the attractions of a big state campus.
Locating a non-geographically sensitive business in a big city is about as smart as equiping an accounting firm with Aeron chairs, solid mahogony furniture, G5s with 23" 16:9 LCDs, and a couple of DS3s. Sure it looks nice, but it's ego-fluff that will likely kill the business financially before it ever has a chance.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
It's also the iPod, the mac, and the PS2. And the TV, and the games for #2 and #3, and the music CDs, and the 2x a week you drop $60 on dinner for you and your SO, and insurance for your car/apt/health/life/cat, and TAXES.
It's not just the car, although that's a good percentage of it. It's the American lifestyle. It's a trap. Don't fall for it. If you work for a living, you become a slave. Not to the company you work for, you become a slave to your paycheck. It's tempting to spend your paycheck on all these little niceties, but if you spend that paycheck tomorrow, you'll be spending your paycheck for the rest of your life. If you do, then that's fine, but recognize that some people make ends meet with far less money. It's a lifestyle thing though. If you're stuck in it, and you're not happy, then change.
If you want to spend less money, itemize everything you pay money for in a month, and realize that you could ELIMINATE 95% of it if you absolutely had to. People do. Not that you should, but you could. And if you did, even for a couple of months, you'd probably realize that it's not too bad, and that if you're going to spend your life working, you'd better have something more to show for it than enough money for an iPod and to pay the bills. Because if that's all you have, then WTF are you doing it all for?
I suspect it's because you don't know another way. It's the American lifestyle. It's a trap.
There are other ways.
.
And as for the subway system, there are plenty of cities in America that are perfectly accessible by bicycle and bus (you can put your bike on the bus, you know). Or if you live too far from work, buy a scooter, pay $20/year for liability insurance, and enjoy the 60MPG you get. Parking's easy too.
Synergy is your friend
In my snail mail. AOL 9.0 in a tin box. I wonder how much they spent on these tin boxes. I also wonder if it was worth the jobs of 450 people. The idiocy of some corporations new cease to amaze me.
-- kortex "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts"
That's where I used to work. 475 Ellis St. Now I work at NASA, literally down the street from the Netscape/AOL campus.
AOL took the "Netscape" logo OFF of the signs facing the street. The Netscape flag is gone. The parking lots are almost always empty and there are several "FOR LEASE" signs dotting the campus.
Meanwhile, the *old* Netscape building houses Verisign and the old Netscape fountain has the %$#@! Verisign logo on it.
It's really sad and depressing.