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Konqueror Compiled For Mac OS X; KOffice Next
scishop writes "Benjamin Reed has just compiled Konqueror for Mac OS X after porting the KUniqueApplication class. A screenshot of the running program can be found here. According to Reed's blog, 'next up is KOffice.'"
Konquerer Kompiled For OS X, KOffice Knext?
Can we get a KTHML compatible browser compiled for Windows? Konquerer or Safari, anything... make it easier to test web designs.
while I agree that it is odd, there were a good number of other browsers for OSX
MSIE, Netscape/Mozilla, Safari, Camino, etc.
I wonder if there's a platform on which you get more browser choice than Mac OS X....
'course, the number of Mac/OS X only browsers sortof makes it cheating...
Tweet, tweet.
Why bother? I seriously doubt anyone would go full-tilt KDE on an OS X box. Mozilla or Firebird are great browser choices.. Why bother to port Konqueror?
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have backups to corrupt.
But has anybody managed to get Linux running on it?
*ducks*
Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
Konquerer is my browser of choice on Linux, and it's cool that we've got another choice for browser. Yeah, I use Safari, but as this is one step to porting most of the KDE stuff, I can't help but wonder if this is a big step towards the holy grail of Linux-to-MacOSX conversions, OpenOffice.
-- Funksaw
..Is using the letter "K" in every program made for the KDE Environment overKill?
What a great idea!
That IS odd that they could not have ported
that to the Cygwin platform... I mean, X11
is available and all.
Wait, but isnt there already a port of KDE
to Cygwin?
iKant believe it!
This port doesn't use X11 at all. I have been on the maillist, and the stumbling block has been the X11 specific code(and a minor thing in QT-mac, reguarding extensions of shared libs). This is a real achievement, and rangerrick is to be greatly congratulated!
You should use AdiumX on your Mac.
Finall, a capable browser for Samba networks for Macs! Finder crashes and just plain doesn't work for me browsing Windows networks from my Powerbook running Panther. Whereas typing smb:/// in Konqueror just works like Apple claims Finder does.
This guy is way out there
As an example, I use gaim on FreeBSD because its tabbed interface is simply the best I've come across. I would love to use it instead of Trillian when I'm forced into using Windows. But the Windows port of gaim, which uses GTK+/Windows, works horribly. The GTK theme doesn't match my XP settings, widgets draw slowly and work clumsily (tooltips in particular seem to spontaneously appear and refuse to go away, even when the program is minimized!), and all in all it feels like a cheap Wal-Mart knockoff.
GTK+ widgets offer no benefits over standard Windows controls -- they draw slower, they don't match the environment, and Windows is just as themable as GTK is. Going back on-topic, this Qt/Mac port of Konqueror likewise eschews native widgets for the entirely out-of-place Qt look. All I can ask is Why? Wouldn't it be far easier for Qt/ and GTK/Windows or /Mac to simply wrap native widgets, rather than poorly ape them?
Loneliness is a power that we possess to give or take away forever
I'd say that covering platforms is important, because when someone says, but do you suppot Blah, you can answer that yes, indeed, you do.
Keep in mind that short term tactics are great, but strategy is what frequently offers tactical brilliance a place to shine. If KDE is everywhere, people will start to use it. That's useful. for KDE. See? Think companies, down the road.
-j, who really can't stand such heavyweight stuff.
I forget what 8 was for.
Konqueror, okay. But we've got alternatives to that all over the place. The Linux app I really want to see on Mac OS X is Ximian Evolution. I've used Apple's alternative, but I really like the way Evolution ties into Exchange, and soon to be Novell Groupwise.
Is porting Gnome apps that much more difficult? Programming-challenged poster here...
The porting of Konqueror to OS X is great news for Mac users, as they now have access to the fast, standards compliant KHTML rendering engine. Many users and developers prefer KHTML to the Internet Explorer or Gecko engines. I was wondering though...does anyone know of a KHTML browser which is completely OS X native? I mean, with a brushed metal skin and full integration into Aqua? It could maybe have other stuff too, like Google search field built-in or something. That would be cool! Anyway, in the meantime I'll just have to continue with Konqueror on OS X.
Can other browsers drag a file from a remote machine via ssh and drop it on another machine via ftp? Browse a digital camera? Connect to SMB shares? And of course, browse the Web - all at the same time, in different tabs and split screens?
No. Konqueror browses practically everything, not just the Web.
All that said, I do wonder if the kioslaves made it into this OS X version of Konqueror.
Yes, that's the whole point of what he did. You can already run KDE under X11 on OSX. (I've done it before). The thing that is special about this was that he actually *ported* it to OSX's Quartz windowing system.
There are no tiger attacks in my area and it's all because this rock I'm holding keeps the tigers away.
Qt can run without X. Take a look at Qtopia, for example. There's a Qt/Mac version too so presumably Konqi is running through Qt. Of course, if Konqi was using any pure Xlib calls, then either they are gone or this guy pulled some serious magic stunts :)
You're not misinformed, Safari does indeed use the KHTML engine. But the point of this appears to be to show the world that KDE apps can be ported to OSX in a manner that they won't require X11 (which a lot of the less-expert users shy away from). This means that these applications can be "first class" Mac applications.
I.e. someday soon, we may see grandmas everywhere running KOffice instead of shelling out hundreds for MS Office.
There are no tiger attacks in my area and it's all because this rock I'm holding keeps the tigers away.
Damn, that's some nasty kerning on that screenshot. Safari doesn't have that problem, I wonder why Konqueror does if it's using the same rendering engine?
I've made the transition from Mandrake on a Desktop to OSX on a Powerbook. Surprisingly, KDE has some apps that are very good and designed well enough to compliment an OSX environment.
Example 1: KMail! If you haven't ever tried this email client, try it NOW. It has some of the most killer email filtering speed I have ever seen in an email application. It nicely integrates with GnuPG. It has good keyboard shortcuts. It's set up not to download images from emails. It stores emails with maildir by default. It's pretty. Did I mention that it's fast? Up until 10.3's much improved mail.app, I would have killed to have KMail running naitively on OS X.
Ex 2: KOffice. I've never used it, but it's absolutely essential that OS X has a free naitive-running office package. Unless the OO.org aqua port gets back up, this package will likely be KOffice.
Ex 3: Konqueror is a very good file manager. While the OS X file manager is very good, there are a couple of areas that it misses. For example, I can use konqueror to select all items matching the file pattern '*foo*.bar'. In OS X, I have to drop to a terminal, and loose the trash can functionality, or switch views and sort by type, which takes longer. As another poster said, SMB apparently works better in konqueror than Finder (thanks, I'll have to try that!). If konqueror can run, then so can any other KDE app, especially when you consider that Konqueror is the most (featureful | bloated) app in KDE.
So that's why people bother. Props to them!
For the same reason that Apple paid people to make contributions to the KHTML project.
I also figured out how to get my favotite Linux game, Enemy Territory, to run on the Mac despite the fact that a Mac version does not exist, screengrabs here and here.
Of course this was cheating since it was over X11. Konq runs acceptably, but got 1-2 fps on ET.
Since you're apparently a Linux fan, I'd expect you to agree that a relatively small market share doesn't necessarily mean something is "also-ran." The fact that more people use Mozilla doesn't make Konqueror bad, and so on. I prefer Firebird myself, but that doesn't mean KHTML-based browsers are worthless.
Lighten up dude. Do you feel proud of your accomplishments wrt any of your hobbies? This guy is using his spare time to do something he is interested in. Any time a milestone happens in such projects, congradulations are in order. He should give himself a pat on the back.
Sure it's not rocket science but most hobbies aren't.
Two infinite things: your stupidity and mine. But I'm not sure about the latter. If my sig offends you, I'm sorry.
I see all the "Why bother" posts and have seen only one short paragraph with the obvious answer: KOffice.
The majority of OSX users may not need Konqueror, even though it seems to support many features only available on OSX through payable alternatives (GUI SSH and SFTP support with RBrowser for example), but it is a first step to getting KOffice ported natively to the Mac which could finally help OSX users drop MS software in a large number of cases.
KOffice is not where OpenOffice is but a native Mac port could spur development so that it becomes a first rate alternative to MS' Office X suite, and given that there is no guarantee that MS will ever make a Mac version compatible with it's new so called security features, this is an excellent idea.
If you don't like it, fuck off.
Konq isn't a web browser, or a file manager...it just happens to have KIOslaves that do these things (like KHTML for web browsing). There are other kio slaves I personally use in KDE 3.2 like smb:// fish:// audiocd:// and a few more...how many of them work? They are what makes konq powerful and useful and desired.
Unstable Apps: Our Android Apps Don't Suck
First, how much catching up Mac OS X still has to do in some respects to Linux. For example, one article in the German magazine "MacWelt" talks about defragmenting the harddisk (!) with Panther. There are all kinds of small things like multiple desktops that I can't seem to find (some of which are of course going to be due to my lack of experience). Of course, in some areas like multimedia Panther simply shreds Linux. When is there going to be a KDE version of iMovie, an Mac fan might ask with some justification.
Second, it is depressing to see how obsessed with money the Mac people still are. This is almost as bad as the Windows crowd. Going through the magazines, program after program is shareware, US$ 30 here, US$ 60 there. The sad part is that these programs are usually small, ridiculously simple tools that Linux includes for free. One good thing about getting KDE to run on the Quartz graphic engine is that it might give the average Apple user a clue to how bad greed is for software development.
Third, the lack of choice. You get one way of doing things with Apple -- a good, well designed, clever, well thought out, ergonomic way, for sure, but that is it. You have to get over feelings like "but where are the other browsers?" or "where are all the other desktops?" at the beginning if you have been using Linux for any period of time. Yeah, you know you're getting what you're getting into, but actually sitting there with one program of a certain time is still a shock.
Don't get me wrong -- I'm going to spend serious money for that iBook. Apple is on the right track here: Printing with CUPS, X11 now included, and bash as the default terminal, so I can go back to blackbox when I'm tried of all the bells and whistles. But when you get past the cool design and ignore the far, far superior multimedia tools, Tux can hold its beak high and proud. Apple is going to have to peddle really hard if they want to continue to want money for their OS.
Take a look at this...
:)
There are a few more screenshots, just go to the parent directory.. I hope it doesn't kill his server.
What time is it/will be over there? Check with my iPhone app!
You said it yourself. Konqueror is more than just a web browser, it's also a file manager, with a lot of very nice features. While the port is primarily more of a proof of concept than anything, it does have advantages over Safari.
Learn to Play Go
Kopete is one of them, and AFAIK it is (or will be?) the official KDE IM client. It supports multiple protocols and is based on a plugin system.
And just in case you're wondering for its name, Copete is like we call here in Chile to the alcoholic beverages (like booze), and the main Kopete developer and author is chilean.
Regards!
Articulos para gente geek: Poleras, linux, libros y mas
A .war file is just an ordinary gzipped tar file with all the relevant files (graphics and style sheets) in it.
You are a little bit confused over this one. KHTML is the Konqueror/Safari html rendering engine, like what Gecko is to Mozilla/Galeon/Firebird.
Articulos para gente geek: Poleras, linux, libros y mas
There are some apps that have less in the way of choice on the Mac, but with Fink and the now built-in X11, there's much more choice than say OS9.
:D
:D
In regards to browsers, there's Mozilla, Firebird, OmniWeb, iCab, Opera, Safari, Konqueror, and Camino. (My favorite being Camino...)
Mail apps? Plenty. Editors? Plenty. I have 6 right now, not including TextEdit (only two cost money.)
I'm glad to hear you're moving to the Mac. I did it a couple of years ago, and my Linux box has become a server....I won't go back to Desktop Linux for the foreseeable future.
Fear not, though....there's plenty of choice. (With the exception of Window Managers..but you can run your favorite X WM fullscreen if you wish)...
I don't think Apple will have to peddle very hard to charge for their OS, though. It's indeed superior in many ways to what's available for free, and it also encompasses choice, something that was Linux's sole domain before OSX. I like linux too, but my OS of choice is worth every penny. Forget Windows...
OSX just works....I can spend hours twiddling with it, or I can set up and go with no troubles at all. That's the beauty of OSX.
---
It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
"- it was designed from the ground up and is conceptually sound, unlike mozilla which was a hack job on top of netscape's browser"
Nope. They dropped the old code and started from scratch a long, looong time ago.
"- unlike other browsers (mozilla, IE), it was designed using 'mature' technology (HTML4, CSS, etc.) and does not have nearly as many compatibility woes as IE, nor as many add-on hacks, as the other browsers had, due to changing stnadards over the years (in other words: it's a newer, fresher code base)"
Nope. Konq doesn't pass basic CSS tests that I have written. Mozilla does.
"- unlike mozilla/firebird, I can use it for hours/days with many pages open (15+) without the entire affair slowing to a crawl and/or dying"
Nope in my case. I'm not sure your problem, but I have no problem with my 2-3 windows with about 7-15 tabs each, open for the entirety my computer is on. The average between reboots on my workstation is a month. I'll close Mozilla to update to a more recent nightly, but that's about it. My hardware isn't insane either --- XP 1700+ w/ 768mb RAM.
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Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
> You sound like a troll (nobody mentioned anything about a full-tilt KDE port on OS X, fool)
You call him a troll, yet you're name-calling?
> it has more/better features than mozilla (fish://, file://, ftp:// smtp://, etc. etc.)
Hold on, many people here habitually abuse MS for making the "browser the OS" and certainly can spot feature-creep a mile away, but when it comes to KDE's browser its suddenly okay? I like having a whole seperate browser for web and use Nautilus for file browsing. Keeping WAN and Local/LAN seperate is a big plus in mine, and many other's books.
>unlike other browsers (mozilla, IE), it was designed using 'mature' technology
How isn't Moz 'mature?'
>unlike mozilla which was a hack job on top of netscape's browser
This is just untrue. The Moz team gutten NS to the point where they were writing just about everything from scratch.
>unlike mozilla/firebird, I can use it for hours/days with many pages open (15+)
I can do this easily with Moz/Firebird on both Win and Linux. I average 20 tabs and half of them are auto-refreshing every few minutes and this is far from a top of the line machine.
Konqueror does all of that because it is not a file manager, web browser etc. It is a kpart embedder. It embeds khtml to do html rendering and other stuff for other things. I can embed kate, kword, kpdf etc for other things. It can speak all of those protocols because every kde app can. You can use sftp, smb, imap, pop3 etc from ANY kde application. Although why you would want to open a pop3 connection from kword I am not sure but it does work. Any file dialog box in kde can use any of the io slaves.
That also means that you can paste any url that kio understand into a file upload box in a webpage and it will deal with it and have the webpage the content of that url. That saves such a large ammount of time doing web apps and lots of other things. Give an sftp url to some data and just have it load it up.
Computer modeling for biotech drug manufacturing is HARD!
Macintosh as a platform would have died a long time ago if it wasn't for those greedy shareware developers you have such disdain for. Some of the best pieces of software available for the Mac have been shareware applications. Most of these applications don't force you to buy them in order to get full functionality. Some people want too much money for ridiculously simple applications but you're under no obligation to purchase or use them.
Besides Mac-only shareware there's literally thousands of OS programs available through Fink, GNU-Darwin, and Darwin Ports. If one of these free as in speech apps works better or as well as a shareware one use it instead of the shareware, vote with your wallet.
There's also plenty of choice in your Mac specific applications. There's several browsers, mail clients, IM programs, media players, editors, and whatever else you want. Not all of them are free or open source but your options are definitely not limited to commercial products.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
It's early, and I'm going to bed. This post will be semi-disorganized and probably a bit flaming. Sorry, I'm tired. However...
1) Files fragment. It happens in any file system. If your file system is well designed, it undoes this as possible. Panther does this. As a result, no appreciable fragmentation should occur (others can fill in the technical details). So what that article was trying to tell you is the file system is automatically defragmented every time an open() call is made.
2) Yes, there's lots of shareware. And a lot of commercial software. And a whole lot of freeware (check www.macupdate.com). Guess what - Linux has only the freeware category in any significant sense. And OS X can run that exact same free software via X11 in the vast majority of cases, just as you do on Linux today. Not to mention that the vast majority of shareware is $20 or less - only a couple things like GraphicConverter cost more. (Horrors, some people spend years of their life and just *don't* want to give it all away for free. They do exist.) Not to mention that Apple bundles a truckload of free software (as in beer, folks) that quite frankly kicks the butt of any open source software I've seen (I'm thinking iTunes/iPhoto/iMovie/iDVD at the moment, not Mail/Address Book). And if you want any of the other stuff, it's readily installable by fink or by compiling it yourself. I already installed my own customized wget and other things.
3) Lack of choice is deliberate. Yes, occasionally it's annoying, no doubt about it. However, I believe the excesisve choice is a major criticism of Linux (and the associated division of labor and lack of focus/coherence). As many have pointed out, why does KDE include several duplicate programs for each basic function, rather than provide a good default up front. You want choice, you can get it very easily on your own (whether by tweak, compile, or download). There are a lot of simple users out there that really, honestly, don't want choice. They want what's included to work and do what they want to do. Apple does that in spades.
I'm going to bed. grump grump grump...
I don't know what kind of crack I was on, but I suspect it was decaf.
My v3.1.4 correctly doesn't let the floatbox overlap the right-hand side border, but yours miscalculates (probably related to the on-going margin bug in Konq that's still there 2 years after I noticed it) and has overlap that shouldn't be there.
:-/
A disapointing regression
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Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
This IS a very good thing, IF we are ever going to replace X or if you would want to use KDE under your framebuffer you would be able to do this by using a QT version designed for it. so framebuffer qt/kde without X at all isn't that far away, it is also a goal for kde 3.3 to remove all X depenencies in kdelibs and kdebase, if that is archived go can run kde on anything that has a QT port. it is not only cool, it is also a very flexible and orginized way of designing apps. GOOD WORK.
-Benjamin Meyer
Do you changes clothes while making the "chee-chee-cha-cha-choh" transformation sound?
I don't think the important achievement is in the fact that the we now have another browser on Mac OS X, because there is enough choice out there, nor is the additional feauture set of Konqueror important to me.
What IS important is that some people have figured out how to isolate KDE from X11, which sets a precedent for porting other KDE apps to Mac OS X. Programs such as KOffice or Kopete do seems worth the bother to me.
Reblet
Apple does give back to the OSS community. They contribute to the GNU project (gcc), to KDE (KHTML upgrades for WebKit have been ported back) and they even provide kernel-level things (the HFS+ filesystem driver for FreeBSD comes from Darwin). Why should they give anything to Linux? Linux is just a kernel, and has contributed nothing to Apple...
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Though I'm pleased with the Konqueror port (for the geek value, if nothing else), I'm particularly excited about the intentions to port KOffice as well. I have a 15" PowerBook and I was dismayed to discover that there just isn't much in the way of free office suites for OS X :-/.
Sure, there's OpenOffice.org for OS X, but it feels more like a halway-port since it requires X11 and it's stuck with Unix widgets. Really, I like OpenOffice.org as much as the next guy -- I run it exclusively on my Windows box -- but it just feels halfway-finished on the Mac (and a native OS X port is only coming in 2006 or so).
So, after setting aside OpenOffice.org, I looked to other options.. and it appears that MS Office is just about the only other choice. And that's about $200 (and, no, I'm not going to cheat and buy the academic or government editions). So, a native port of KOffice to OS X would be a real breakthrough.
Alex Bischoff
HTML/CSS coder for hire