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Verisign Plans DNS Changes
NetWizard writes "According to a recent NANOG post and an InfoWorld story, 'Verisign will change the serial number format and "minimum" value in the .com and .net zones' SOA records on or shortly after 9 February 2004'. They seemed to have learned their lesson, from the post: 'There should be no end-user impact resulting from these changes (though it's conceivable that some people have processes that rely on the semantics of the .com/.net serial number.) But because these zones are widely used and closely watched, we want to let the Internet community know about the changes in advance.)'"
God damn it ICANN, you need to take away Verisign's authority over DNS. Every time they change something it's a major pain in the ass for anybody that works in an ISP, web hosting, etc.
STOP FUCKING CHANGING THINGS!
But because these zones are widely used and closely watched, we want to let the Internet community know about the changes in advance.
The last sentence sounds like they want to emphasize that they're announcing this so early so the no one panics when all of a sudden something changes, I guess it's good that they're trying to rebuild trust.
What time is it/will be over there? Check with my iPhone app!
Inverted commas were used where sheech marks should have been. Speech marks were used where inverted commas should have been. One bracket was opened, but two were closed. Punctuation (fall stops) were inside the bracket when they should be outside.
ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
--
FreeNET user? Comfortable with the adverse selection?
And then they go and cite an example where there WOULD be an end user impact.
.COM and .ORG domain. I guess we're screwed, guys!" Then the brave tech raises his hand and says "You know, with my Dell laptop and wireless LAN, I can change the way the serial number is incremented from anywhere."
Although unlikeley, there is a potential for collateral damage here. Is there anyone at Verisign willing to post the logic behind making the changes in the fist place? I can't see where there would be a business case when someone would jump up and say "We could make a billion dollars, but only if we change the way we determine DNS serial numbers for the
I've been watching too many Dell commercials lately...
Blogging Weight Loss, Distance Education, and more at verlin.com
No-one cares what format the serial number is in, except those who have written software that relies on the current format (in disobedience of the RFCs...)
A serial number is just a 32-bit number, and is used to see if a domain has been updated. The specs. do not say anywhere that it should be in a specific format.
"Elmo knows where you live!" - The Simpsons
This announcement is important in that Verisign finally seems to recognize that they are part of a larger community, that those DNS records are not just some corporate asset sitting in a couple of computers in the corner.
Changes affect administrators around the globe. As part of a community, they have a responsibility to make their decisions transparent to the community, and to announce changes well-enough in advance that those who are affected have time to prepare.
This is not just a Verisign issue. The need for major Internet organizations to recognize the larger public as important stakeholders within the community is important. Awareness of the larger community should be followed by communication and actions that reflect that awareness, thus signalling a willingness to truly be a part of that community.
Verisign seems to be exhibiting a newfound awareness of community that ICANN seems to have abandoned.
I hope Verisign continues to be a good memeber of the community. Perhaps others can follow their lead.
------- "One of the joys of travel is visiting new towns and meeting new people." -- G. KHAN
The internet infrastructure should be managed and run by the community, and not driven by commerical proliferation of services offered to enhance a companies offerings. This change seems dubious at best, considering Verisigns previous efforts of domain sitting, which, would break applications lets ensure we keep them in their place.
2038 anyone?
Verisign will change the serial number format and "minimum" value in the .com and .net zones
Right, so when I fall on an unresolved address, I can't even return it under warranty because the serial number has changed, and even if they did reimburse me, they changed the value. That's just flipping great...
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
What would you need to warn us for? It is perfectly acceptable to add a wildcard with no warning - which resulted in many more problems than changing the serial number. You don't need to get any permission or review, just go ahead. If people don't like it, the most you'll get is a gentle hand-slap.
--
Pat Robertson says that God told him that Bush will win by a landslide.
The end of the world is already scheduled for 12/21/2012.
That is why the UN should have it.
The internet infrastructure should be managed and run by the community
Yes I'm sure that would work.
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
They're changing stuff? They can't even keep my DNS and contact information correct. I can't wait till this "little" change is done so they have one more thing to fcuk up.
A man goes to a bakers, asks how much the bagels are. Baker replies "twelve for a dollar". Man replies, "at the bakers across the street, they're fourteen per dollar". Baker replies, "Yes, but they're sold out, no?" "Yes", answers the man. "Well," says the baker, "when my bagels are sold out, they're sixteen for a dollar!"
Moral: Verisign can hardly do anything wrong with this serial number change, so it's hardly proof of goodwill. When they stop messing with other, more delicate things, they will get some credit.
Ceci n'est pas une signature
this really is funny as balls
From Infoworld: But the company did allow that "processes that rely on the semantics of the .com/.net serial number" could be affected.
For example, companies that have created scripts to monitor domain change on .com and .net will almost certainly need to make changes to account for the serial number change..."The damage won't be catastrophic, but some DNS servers could stop receiving updates,"
And they are planning to do this next Feb 9? Isn't that like too little time for organizations to update their systems?
I don't trust Verisign... the fact that they control such an important database accesed by millions of people around the world really frightens me. They screwed it once, they can do it again.
They should have that power removed from them. It should be on another organization (i.e. a non-profit one) that better serves internet community.
History, I suppose.
The internet infrastructure should be managed and run by the community, and not driven by commerical proliferation of services offered to enhance a companies offerings.
That was what the recent UN conference was about I suppose. But everyone wanted to dismiss that as being useless.
They will be changing their serial number from about 2004020900 to something about 1075680000 which according to the DNS system will be an older serial number because the difference is only 928340900 which is much less than half the range of a 32 bit number. They can make the change that they are planning if they make two changes with at least their cache interval amount of time between the changes. See RFC-1034.
With a TTL of 15 mins you have to generate a new zone 96 times a day to keep the zone visible during a whole day. I wonder if they want to speed up propogation time of new domain with this?
Doesn't the UNIX 'seconds since 1/1/1970' break in 2038 or so? I could be wrong. It's hard to remember all the various time/date glitch dates.
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
The boxes have to sit on someone's desk. "The community," disorganized and disparate as it is, is remarkably poor at doing anything. You'd have to invent some sort of hierarchy. Maybe have a General Manager of the Internet, and he could have a board of directors under him or something. They would be elected by the nation's population at large, and they'd have the final say on internet issues.
But it's be silly to give EVERYONE an equal vote in their elections, as the great majority of people have no clue how the internet works, and the campaigns for these positions would be totally unable to focus on real issues. They'd have to dumb it down and sugar-coat it so that sixpack joe can digest what they're saying, and at that level of simplicity, who could tell a good candidate from a bad?
Okay, so let's find some way of making sure only highly competent people can vote. We can't give a test, since we'd need someone to create and administer it, and the potential for corruption is too high. The only thing I can think of is selling the votes: that way, every vote is going to represent an informed citizen. After all, who would buy a vote if they don't understand the technology?
So at the point where we've got a CEO, a Board of Managers, and an equity market, we may as well package the whole thing as a corporation and name it VeriSign.
The means of production should belong to the working-class!
we want to let the Internet community know about the changes in advance.
theres no Internet community anymore, only a bunch of spammers and lots of frustrated people...
I got your international standard right here.
YYYY-MM-DD and YYYYMMDD are both standards-compliant.
Seriously, if you've never heard of this standard, read up. Whenever I need to stick a date or a time on something in text form, I just do it the ISO 8601 way.
Are there other queryable DNS servers maintained just by verisign for
I can understand what you're trying to say.
But...
Not so long ago in the US only male land-owners could vote, because it was felt only they had a vested interest governance. This seems like a similar thing.
I'm not sure an Republic of the Internet would really work. You'd create even more of a chasm between the technocrat and everyone else. I think people would be resentful of exclusion.
Also, I have always been very wary of trying to "centralize" the Internet. Yes, I know ICANN is sort of.. something.. but the Internet is still more of a rule by consensus for the most part. I create a technology, and as more and more people start to use it, it slowly becomes a standard. I can envision a day (in your Board of Directors scenario) when I can impliment nothing that falls outside of an Accepted Practices (unless I submit to a lengthy "approval process"). This is where I would see it going.
I am not saying what is in place is perfect. Hell, I hate the fact that an entity that finds itself in a powerful position (such as VeriSign) can make changes by fiat. But, on the whole, it seems better than any alternative I have heard to date
"This calls for a very special blend of psychology and extreme violence" - Vyvyan "The Young Ones"
I'd love to use that, though in the US people can't seem to grasp the concept...as easy as it actually is.
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
The time/datestamp should have always been this way; more to the point do you know of any other TLD that at least attempts to be this communicative? They don't do this because ICANN, or anybody, makes them.
.NAME ("oops, we were rooted") or .PRO ("Hi ICANN, I know we said we wouldn't sell SLD name but we're dying here, and we ask a second time can we sell SLD name pleeeeeeeease?") or .biz ("home of more spam since 2000! Yeah baby!!") or any of the cctlds that have (cough) lame servers.
.WS did it 3 years ago.
How bout
Bitch at NSI all you want, they're still the model of a well, if not best run TLD.
And spare me the crap about sitefinder, 22 other tlds did this long before NSI did,
It's reasonable to whine when they do a bad thing (like agree to ICANN oversight, you folks have no idea how close they were to the, um "alternative") but for things that have little or no effect you're reacting to the corporate name not the actual change.
So, put NSI under greater ICANN control? NOT. Frankly we'd be better of if they put ICANN under NSI control.
Hey, is this one of those thigns you can't say because it's hersey?
"Duh. Double duh." - Weemba
Need Mercedes parts ?
Yes, but your argument is fundamentally flawed in that VeriSign is a corporation not created to monitor and improve the internet, VeriSign is, like most corporations, created to generate profit for itself and improve its value for its shareholders.
Remember, they were the ones who wanted to "commercialize" the root DNS servers and take them "out of the hands of the academics".
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
It appears that they are gearing up to start providing far more than two updates per day. This could mean that sometime in the future you could register a new domain name and have it up and running within 15-30 minutes.
Seems like a positive change to me.
Natural != (nontoxic || beneficial)
Yes, it'll break a 32 bit counter which will wrap around in 2038.
If you're still using a 32 bit computer in 2038 you may as well right now, begin walking around with your thumb and finger making the shape of an L on your forehead.
Need Mercedes parts ?
Great! I vote for a TTL of 444ms.
My serial number format lasts longer than Verisign's, and I still get more than 100 updates a day out of it. In fact it will last until 07:06:36 Tuesday 2 October 2096 while staying in just 9 digits (which it has been since 15:06:40 Saturday 4 September 1982). After that it goes to 10 digits, but still remains a positive signed 32 bit integer until 12:56:28 Wednesday 16 March 2242, and if unsigned 32 bit integer works everywhere else, it will go all the way to 01:53:00 Wednesday 30 May 2514.
Instead of being the count of number of seconds, as Verisign plans to use, mine is 1/4 of that value. Basically, I take the system time() value and divide by 4. By treating that value as an unsigned quantity, I won't have the Y2038 bug, either. That logic will work until 06:28:15 Sunday 7 February 2106 (past the 9 digit limit). And I can do 21600 updates a day (one every 4 seconds).
dig linuxhomepage.com. soa
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
Third reason:
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
If all sysadmins want something they can make it happen. Remember when the internet filtered out that nasty verisign "helpfull search" yea, ISPs can fix the net and make big changes if they want to.
In reality Verisign isn't in control of "too much" if it came down to it we could all just start up our own registry database (mirrored from the existing) and make a transperent change in how computers resolve domains (OS developers would conform to the new standard). But right now I think they're doing fine and this issue shouldn't affect anyone anyway.
Why should we use four digits for YearNumber? You don't think anybody is still going to be using this in the year 2000? Dream on Jenkins!
The DNS protocol uses 32 bits for serial number. So what you should be saying is that we should be upgrading the DNS protocol before 2038, with enough lead time so all the network operators will have time to make the switch. That means we need to expand the DNS protocol to more than 32 bits (40 bits should actually be enough) by around 2008.
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
The UN is a government of governments, beholden only to themselves. THAT is why the UN shouldn't have it.
Do you even lift?
These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.
Let me do it. I'm not making any profit. I can run the root servers on my little Linux box. I'll just leave the phone dialed up all day long.
now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
It's amazing how well your comment translates to the current situation in America when you change just a few words here and there:
The laws have to sit on someone's desk. "The community," disorganized and disparate as it is, is remarkably poor at doing anything. You'd have to invent some sort of hierarchy. Maybe have a President, and he could have a Congress beside him or something. They would be elected by the nation's population at large, and they'd have the final say on law making issues.
But it's be silly to give EVERYONE an equal vote in their elections, as the great majority of people have no clue how the government works, and the campaigns for these positions would be totally unable to focus on real issues. They'd have to dumb it down and sugar-coat it so that sixpack joe can digest what they're saying, and at that level of simplicity, who could tell a good candidate from a bad?
Okay, so let's find some way of making sure only highly competent people can vote. We can't give a test, since we'd need someone to create and administer it, and the potential for corruption is too high. The only thing I can think of is selling the votes: that way, every vote is going to represent an informed citizen. After all, who would buy a vote if they don't understand the government systems?
Wouldn't you know it? I just implemented a vim macro that lets me easily update the yyyymmddNN value in my zone files (after years of manual tweaking), and now this. Typical. Just typical.
..wayne..
If you receive an unresolved address, you never got a serial number in the first place.
Even more so, when you request a name resolution for an address, they don't even (ever) give you a serial for it, just a TTL. (aka, no receipt required, we trust you, no refund,store exchange only within X seconds)
Visit CryptoGnome in his home.
Things have been working fine for years. Why the hell change this kind of thing now if it's not broke?
Their argument about "more frequent updates" is bogus -- when was the last time anyone had a problem because DNS updates weren't frequent enough?
Everybody knows that you need to have an overlap period where both the old IP and the new IP are operational during a switchover. More frequent updating won't change that basic fact, so why bother?
But more importantly, Verisign has proven beyond any doubt that they don't have a fucking clue what they're doing when they try to "improve" the Internet. There isn't a single competent Internet engineer in the entire world (not paid by Verisign) who thinks that NXDOMAIN hijacking is the architecturally correct way to provide a better user experience for 404 errors. Seriously, I challenge you to find even one competent engineer not paid by Verisign who would agree with Verisign on this issue after being presented all the arguments on both sides.
Verisign just can't be trusted to make changes like this. The evidence is plain and simple. ICANN needs to issue a directive to Verisign prohibiting any and all structural changes until their contract expires.
The fact that this got modded down to -1 is a good example of why Rosco is correct. "The community" isn't *necessarily* any more competent, nor any more interested in upholding standards that conflict with *its ideas* of Right and Proper, than anyone else -- as these examples (all pointing at stuff that some consider "part of The Community") illustrate.
The fact that Verisign abuses its position of power is not in itself an indication that someone else would do a better job. Someone else might, or might not. While I agree that Verisign should be stripped of its power, we should consider very carefully before handing that power to anyone else -- including "The Community". And just exactly to whom, or which part, of "The Community" do you propose to give that power? And who is going to finance it?
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
100 updates means "YYYYMMDD00" to "YYYYMMDD99"
so it is sufficient.
Of course, new scheme allows more than 100 updates
and I don't think changing the format a bad idea though.
A "full stop" is a limey term for "period" (i.e., ".").
And yes, he/she misspelled it.
Writing "bracket" instead of "parenthesis" is also an indication of his/her dentally-deficient status.
Sounds like a good idea to me. Why do you start going around, and telling the "community" that they need to start buying verisign stock... Pretty soon, the "community" will own and manage verisign.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant