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Announcing Cooperative Linux
evilmf writes "Well... I was on my daily "relaxing" read of the LKML when I've found an interesting announce about "Cooperative Linux", in this message from Dan Aloni. It allows you to run Linux on an unmodified Win2000/XP system, just launching another app. Dan says that Cooperative Linux is 'is stable enough (on some common hardware configurations) for running a fully functional KNOPPIX/Debian system on Windows,' and provides some screenshots in the project homepage."
Now the stability, Awesome user interface of windows, and games combined with the myriad of useful GNU/Linux apps!
I always thought that linux assimilating windows was better than windows assimilating linux.
Way back when I wanted to try linux. (now 2-3 years ago) I searched far and away to find this ability, because my dad would have gone bonkers should I have installed/booted another OS.
I get the question quite alot. "Can linux run in Windows"... To which I must roll my eyes and explain that it's another OS.
This is going to be very helpful in convincing people to run linux.
I can just picture myself booting knoppix to make my (Anti-PowerPoint) presentations at school.
Gr8 Stuff!
That's a good thing, IMHO. Too often, I have needed some tool or other while working on Windows machines, and there are no free alternatives. If Windows users can use really free software, they may be less inclined to download horrific ad-ware and spy-ware, too. I wonder how easy it is to share data between Windows and Linux apps? Guess I'll go RTFA now...
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
Hardly. This is a very interesting and useful project, with rather deeper implications for virtual server operation. Rather than requiring a pile of specialized code to emulate a machine, you just give the other OS a little private corner of its own, allowing the host OS to give it resources whenever they're avaliable (and how nice it is about giving those resources is easy to manage). Presto, huge performance increase.
It'd be a slow day if we saw, say, another article about SCO, an article about Microsoft 'blocking spam', some nostalgic whining about lack of innovation in games, a few drab articles about nothing in particular...
Kind of like yesterday.
This flies in the face of science.
for linux noobs like me, this is greeat news ! this will allow me to run a distro at work where xp boot is obliged. i hope they come up with an installation tutorial & extensive documentation soon (no docs for now on th website)
When will I end this grieving ? When will my future begin ?
...just got a whole lot less useful. ;)
"Give away the stone, let the oceans take and transmutate this cold and faded anchor." - Maynard James Keenan
Ideally, people would be running Windows on top of Linux. Otherwise, eventually we will have Linux... requires Windows Longhorn or higher on newer computers.
Well this is definitely Really Neat, after reading their homepage, I see that In its current condition, it allows us to run the KNOPPIX Japanese Edition on Windows. Unfourtunately as far as I can tell, that's all it can run without modification.
Also, coLinux currently lacks documentation.
If you don't speak Japenese, you might have some difficulties using this software to it's fullest.
Cygwin can't directly run linux apps. Sure, you can port apps to cygwin, but it's not the same.
Hier staat een stukje tekst.
What I want to know is, will it let me do 'dd if=/dev/fd0 of=/disk.img' on windows (which cygwin doesn't allow)
Windows 2000's horribly broken floppy support is *really* annoying.
When I wan't to use *nix tools under Windows I've always trusted Cygwin, but I can see how this project can provide a good alternative to Cygwin XFree86 as suggested in the roadmap. This could also provide an excellent solution for developers to test interoperability between Internet Explorer and Linux webservers - especially if they are limited to one computer. It could also be used to educate people on using Linux, it is a perfect match with Knoppix in this respect.
Wine developers could use this compare apps running natively and those running under wine side-by-side.
I saw this on LKML about an hour ago, and it interested me then.
What I am wondering about is quite how stable it is possible to get something like this.
We all know how Windows assumes it is the only OS installed, when dealing with things like disk partitions, MBR's etc. How does the Windows NT kernel like sharing Ring 0 with Linux?
Overall this is an excellent innovation for Linux to move forward. I suppose you could chart the increase of Linux "market share" as follows.
1.) Linus and his friends
2.) Early Distributions
3.) Redhat makes inroads
4.) Live CD's (Knoppix et al)
5.) CoLinux
You have gone from experimental boxes only, to dual booting to Live CD's to try Linux out (very slow...)
If this can come close to Linux alone in speed, then this is a major step forward.
No more lengthy installs with dual booting etc.
If a linux fan wants to show a Windows user what its all about then they can hopefully download one EXE and go.
Pity I haven't got a windows partition so I can test it.
Great All the bugs of windows, and the Linux User Interface. jebus sometimes we should not ask 'can I' but rather 'should I'.
If you notice, the X Server in use is actually Cygwin/XFree86 rather than something built in to this system. The actual system runs in console mode only, and thanks to the flexibility of X, allows apps run in the console to connect back to any X server running on the machine.
The point is, if you can find a rootless X server for MS Windows, you can do so. The only one I'm aware of is eXceed (although I don't keep up with them because I have no need for them). It's commercial, but is usually cheaper or free through a university or college.
Because the kernel has been ported directly onto the Windows API, this means that the kernel looks like a Windows program, yet is actually an encapsulated Linux system. This means that you can use whatever filesystem you wish. How they intend to solve the issue of getting data in and out of the encapsulated OS, I don't know - they aren't very clear on the website.
SCREW THE ADS! http://adblock.mozdev.org/ Proud user of teh Fox of Fire - Registered Linux User #289618
Yeah, but does it run on Windows?
Finally, installing Linux takes only one click!
In the future, please refer to it as GNU/Windows...
If thou see a fair woman pay court to her, for thus thou wilt obtain love
Crapware is the issue here. You do not need help setting your system clock. Bonzai (sp?) Buddy is not your friend. Real is not a good streaming media player. If you need help filling in web forms, use a browser that can do it for you! You do not need to sell your soul to some marketing devil in order to download music. $40 is not a bargain on CD burning software, nor is it a bargain on a good text editor. There are in fact decent mail-readers that won't bork your system and aren't spyware (cough *eudora* cough). I could go on, but you get the picture.
Users of Windows, you have nothing to lose but your chains!
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
If you have a look at the roadmap you will see that are planning to implement a frame-buffer device to replace the need to use Cygwin/XFree86. I wish them good luck.
When you send data to 127.0.0.1, which OS picks it up? This boggles my mind.
Cygwin can't run a lot of Linux apps directly. Most of the time they need porting, because libraries are not the same. Both try to be POSIX complaint, but both aren't, so the work is usually fairly minimal, but it's still work to be done. CoLinux allows it to all happen transparently with no source code changes. As such, it's much more useful.
Windows Services for UNIX also suffers from the same problem, it also tries to be POSIX complaint, but its POSIX defficiencies match neither Linux nor Cygwin.
... Windows will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.
"Consensus" in science is _always_ a political construct.
If this ever becomes stable and useful, OEM's who now have contracts with MS that requires them to pay so much per box to MS whether or not Windows is installed can now start providing Windows + a Linux distribution of choice, at the factory as an option.
The can advertise their box as coming with hundreds of free software programs by throwing in a knoppix cd.
Best of both worlds for the OEMs
Cygwin/XFree86 can be run rootless, and even using Windows as a WM for better integration.
From the Cygwin bash prompt, launch:
XWin -multiwindow &
There is a startxwin.bat that does that and that is bundled with Cygwin/XFree86.
We've had Slashdot stories about how many operating systems someone has got on one machine (by multi-booting).
:-)
We probably need a sweepstake for predicting when Slashdot will have the story on how many operating systems have been run virtually on one machine.
Linux running vmWare'd Windows which in turn is running a Debian distro under coLinux, which in turn is running Fedora as a user-mode Linux instance, in turn running FreeBSD as a Xen virtual machine instance... oh, the horrors
Oolite: Elite-like game. For Mac, Linux and Windows
Or perhaps, they believe they are saving the world:
http://www.ubergeek.tv/switchlinux/
Requires flash, but it's worth it.
/ \
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign for peace
x
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Why this does seem quite cool I want to offer a warning before you go and install this on your non-backed up mission critical server.
Many projects have attempted to achieve this goal. It's taken quite a bit of time so far. This project has taken a short cut though by simply letting the Windows kernel and Linux kernel run side-by-side in kernel mode. Traditional approaches don't allow this.
That's because if anything goes wrong in the Windows kernel, you risk trashing your Linux kernel the same applies for the Linux kernel trashing the Windows kernel.
Before you go and so Linux never crashes or Windows never crashes, what you're relying on is that this particular project has enough of an understanding of both kernels that they can cover every circumstance where there would be a negative interaction.
I'm not saying this can't work, I'm just saying I'd be very careful about running it on anything I cared about.
int func(int a);
func((b += 3, b));
According to the web site, the architecture of the software that makes this all possible is very portable and could be ported to Solaris, for example , allowing the running of Linux/Sparc on top of it, at full speed. I would love to see this ported to OS X. I love my powerbook and I like OS X, but running linux at the same time would be a huge benefit for me. I'll be following this project closely.
Emulation and virtualization are the coolest technologies I've ever seen.
Does it runs wine ?
...
Because some people want wine, so I wonder if it possible to run wine under colinux.
And, wait, what about colinux under wine ?
Ploum.net.
My understanding (and I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm mistaken!) is that cygwin provides a set of Win32 libraries that provide reimplementations of Linux functions that are necessary for a Linux app to run. Essentially, Cygwin is a platform that your app can be ported to (generally by simply recompiling), that happens to run under Windows.
What we're talking about with coLinux is the ability to run native Linux binaries as is with no need for recompilation.
*Release Name: 0.5.1-2.4.24
Notes:
This is a very preliminary source-only release.
It is mostly for peer review, but with some effort it can be compiled and run.
Please note that Cooperative Linux is not yet stable on some processors and hardware configurations.*
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
Yeah, this is informative, as in misinformative.
What is it that you need have Linux for that you can't already compile yourself?
I fought the corporate America, and the corporate America bought the law.
The newest version of cygwin/x11 http://www.cygwin.com/xfree/ can run in both rootless mode and multiwindow mode. The above comments are outdated. (I'm running kde programs from kde-cygwin right now)
It's closer to VMware then it is to cygwin.
Browse at -1, because trolls are often the most creative part of
My dad would have done the same - so I didn't tell him. I made lilo wait for 2 seconds at bootup, no prompt - he never noticed the delay (or the small decrease in the size of his hard disk ;-)) and all I had to do was press L-Shift "linux" and I was away.
It was extremely useful later on when I had to recover some data for him...
"'I pass the test,' she said. 'I will diminish, and go into the West, and remain Galadriel.'"
- JRR Tolkien.
I'll second that. I installed SFU to try it out, and found it to be so bad as to be endlessly entertaining. The high points of my interaction with it were this (the first line indicates my discovery that tab completion didn't work):... and the time I typed
Good times, good times. Also it broke cygwin's emacs-style line editing (presumably by changing some terminal-related DLL) and WinCVS (by setting EDITOR=vi systemwide). Fortunately both of these problems went away when I uninstalled it.