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The Best Colleges for Network Engineering?
viperstyx asks: "Ive come to that time in my life where I have to choose what colleges im going to apply to for my undergraduate degree. I'm very interested in Computer Science but I'm not sure if I want to major in Comp Sci, but I do have a high interest in networks. I hope to work on things like Internet2, or in a large business environment after college. I was hoping to find a college with a major, along the lines of Network Engineering, but I have yet to find one." What colleges have the best programs to prepare prospective networking engineers for the future?
You also forgot to add the part about the female to male ratio being 3:1 or so in your story... Just thought I'd be the first to correct your mistake. :)
It's about your own networks. People from unknown schools get onto interesting projects becuas hey know who's running them.
Get networking... with humans.
All you need is experience, alot of online resources for OIS, but get your hands on experience with a 3550, 4500, 6500, 7200 (from cisco) get a CCNA... A Dergee in Net Eng is useless if youve never actually implimented a network or worked with a network. Book smarts does not cut it with network engineering.. you need practical experience with both physical (wiring) and software (ois or what have you)... Nick D
Home Sweet Home Linux
RIT? I like the EE program, and a lot of CS students I know like it here.
Study CS in undergrad. Wait until Graduate School to specialize.
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Who are you? The new #2 Who is #1? You are #617565. I am not a number, I am a free man! Muhahaha.
I've heard Carnegie Mellon University is the shizzle. I applied and didn't get in, therefore they must be pretty damn good.
If your true to what you like to do, do it, even if the boat is already full. People that like IT for what it is will do better then most who are there to make a quick buck.
-Kilka
If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all. -Chomsky
Nowadays it would be very much to your benefit to be a jack of both trades (programming and networking) and master of a few more. You may want to look into colleges that have good CS programs and then either tackle networking on the side (start w/ CCNA or something), or see if you can get a job working with the university's networking department. Best way to learn networking is hands-on anyways.
-- Stu
/. ID under 2,000. I feel old now.
Not that I know anything, but this applies to everything: experience is vital. Go out and do consulting work to get your hands wet. If you know absolutely nothing start off in tech support somewhere - you will learn very quickly. I don't know about what employers are looking for, but I believe that experience would be way more valuable than a bunch of theory that you may have learned from some junior college prof.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, go into business for themselves.
Not to troll, but is that really a college-level degree? Unless by "work on things" you mean "analyze and design your own version of," I think a trade-school level degree, or some sort of MIS, plus the appropriate certifications might be your thing.
However, by sheer virtue of the fact that you "made it" through a more in-depth degree such as CS or Computer Engineering, you'll open yourself up to wider options, and possibly a higher pay. These degrees mean that, in addition to the basic knowledge, you're capable of handing large, complicated projects (if you have a good Capstone program at the school you look at) and have good problem-solving skills, things that aren't, necessarily, taught at a trade-school or 2-year level institution.
Of course, I'm biased as I'm about 3 months from finishing my B.S. Comp. Engr, and 1 year, 3 months from finishing my M.S. Electrical Engr (Yay, 5-year program!).
Posted Anonymously to protect the names of the (not so) innocent.
I really don't feel you have to focus on exclusivity to Network Engineering. I feel that most schools with programs in Network Engineering are not the most recognizable. I suggest you focus on a CS degree or a computer engineering degree. If you perform well in either of these fields you should be able to land almost any job in the industry. Recruiters look at your college record and see what kind of person you are based on your grades, difficulty of classes, and experience gained. The actual information learned is rather insignificant to the kind of person you are.
I've heard that UoB, University of Bangalore, offers excellent training, and good job placement;)
They have the entire range of Cisco certification classes.
You also may want to consider something in telecommunications as that covers a lot of networking as well.
And then you can still apply for work outside of IT.
I suggest you go with the college/CompSci degree, then spend another 6 months to a year in a certification-type place getting things like A+, Network+, Cisco basic certs, and some linux/unix sysadmin basic certs (the latter cause most linux/unix sysadmins know networking a lot better than most MCSE types since they are network-centric OSs from the get-go). And depending on where you go to college, many colleges let you take tests for *life experience*, so if you got some network-related certs while in college, you might be able to have them credited and not spend as much time.
I think college, in fact, is overrated in a lot of ways, putting yourself 60K in debt is not worth it. I'd recommend a cheap state school if possible, or community college for the first two years of college. Keep in mind, a lot of people change their minds after two years in college, and decide they want to do something else (or may just not like the field).
Moreover, I think technology is becoming extremely competitive. Better to try a field like nursing or maybe look for something in biotech.
In any case, if you want to do something in technology, be prepared to study hard and keep learning, tech is one of those fields requiring constant reeducation to maintain an edge.
The University of California Berkeley is an all around great school for computer and engineering related fields. Although, when I went there I didn't major in CS or EECS, many of my friends graduated from those programs, and then went onto jobs dealing with networking technologies.
I'm just about finished Communications Engineering at Carleton University. If it's really a professional engineering design degree that you're after, and not somethign with more of a technological slant, it's definitely the way to go. It was the first Comm Eng program in Canada (I'm in the third batch to graduate this year), and there's a strong batch of professors in the field. It also helps that Ottawa is 'Silicon Valley North'. Nortel headquarters is here, and various Alcatel and JDS plants, etc. Not to mention all the local start-ups.
We cover everything from distributed network programming, to coding techniques, to circuit design, to protocol implementation, to allocating resources for quality of service. It's great, once you get past all the math and science at the beginning. Introduction to Communications Software was my favourite course ever.
Disclosure: I am a CS professor (in comp bio, not networking), and my department (WUSTL) is well-known for networking-related research.
If you want to get into stuff like protocol design, routing architecture and algorithms, and the other "guts" of designing and building high-speed networks, consider a CS or Computer Engineering degree. Besides the obvious courses in networking per se, you will have the opportunity to study algorithms relevant to the area (e.g. minimum spanning tree, network flows, suffix trees and other fast string matching methods for routing tables); hardware design (for building gigabit-and-up routers and other cool network gear); and design of large software systems, including the principles behind distributed systems like the DNS and peer-to-peer networks.
Depending on where you go and what your interests are, you can also bone up on the underlying math (e.g. queueing theory for protocol design) and maybe even some physics/EE (signal propagation, etc).
Yes, you can probably work your way to a strong practical knowledge of how to build a network, and getting your hands dirty is essential to success. However, the point of a CS degree is (1) breadth in computing fundamentals, which I hope I've persuaded you are relevant to networking, and (2) quickly getting up to speed on how to *think* about networks, independent of any particular protocol or hardware standard.
Oh, and speaking of getting hands dirty... if you go to the right place, you might be able to get on board a networking-related research project!
I would have to agree with some of the other posts... Get an undergrad degree in CS or perhaps IT (I'd recommend CS) and then specialize in graduate school.
::thinking to self::...Maybe I should have gone to MIT...
Depending upon how good your existing skills in CS are (I'm talking about mostly programming and general computer knowledge), I can recommend NJIT as a recent (2 weeks ago) BS in CS graduate. If you happen to live somewhere near the NYC metro area, it's not a bad education if you go in with a good background and don't mind teaching yourself when you can't understand the profs (that happens at most tech schools from what I hear). I thought it was rather easy but then again I started really programming in 2nd grade - most of my classmates wouldn't have agreed with me on the ease of the program though.
Price is reasonable and if you have high enough GPA/SAT scores you could apply for the Albert Dorman Honors College - they paid for almost my entire undergraduate tuition, but I must warn you it is a lot of work.
One bad thing I must say though is the quality of campus life - it fucking sucks. ~85% men here and as for the 10-15% left of women... well, you get the idea. However we are about 10 miles due west of the financial district of NYC, about a 30 minute train ride right to Penn Station and there's *plenty* to do in the city, so it' really up to you.
# fuser -v
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Here's the real question: do you want to be a scientist or an engineer, or do you want to put stuff together?
Because if you want to STUDY or MAKE things, go to a good CS school: MIT, U of I, Purdue, Carnegie Mellon, University of Chicago (shameless plug, plus U of C will teach you more than just computers). Those are just the top schools off the top of my head, and are necessarily the best schools. I'm sure your own local schools might be good enough. My advice is not to look for a "networking school" as that amount of specialization is not what you want from a university education. See below.
However, if you want to USE things, then get yourself to a trade school, community college, or hell, just teach yourself and get the certification. No need to waste all that money learning about theory, writing papers, etc., when you can just study how to build and maintain networks.
Of course, I'm not saying that this is somehow a 'lesser' pursuit; instead you'll learn more specific skills suited to where you want to work: networking.
--Stephen
Did you ever notice that *nix doesn't even cover Linux?
I think that the question is about someone who wants to work in the design and engineering of new protocols, not someone who wants to use off-the-shelf tools. If all the inquirer wants is to just be another network tech in a server room somewhere, then he doesn't need college. If he wants to design applications that use all the features of IP:v6, then he should get maybe a Master's. If he wants to design the heir to IP:v6, then he should study a lot of theory and go for a PhD.
The trouble with Slashdot is that sometimes there's a lack of awareness of the gap between the tool-users and the tool-makers - the former, probably due to something of an inferiority complex, are pretty unaware of the realities of the latter.
Firstly, congratulations on wanting to go with a real degree before jumping into the networking field. Its the way to go if you want to have any future beyond "button pushing lackey". Your entry level CCNA job has already been shipped to India, shoot higher.
There may not be a specific "Network Engineer" degree at all universities, what you want is to study Electical Engineering, add in some Mathematics (queue theory, statistics), and top it off with Physics (optics, particle physics). All of these elements are required to actually understand what is going on with networks. Specific topics to concentrate on include circuit design, transmission lines, antennas, material science, compiler design, signal processing, queue theory, and statistics, lots of statistics.
If you want to be the guy who actually writes new RFCs to be used by everybody else, gets hired by companies like Cisco to create new routers or protocols, and be the chief designer on world spanning networks, ignore the certificates for now. Concentrate on getting the background information necessary to understand all the aspects of network design, like speed of light limitations, electrical characteristics of transmission lines, radio circuits and complex mathematics. Picking up a cisco certificate will then take a week of your time when you are ready to join the workforce, and you'll know not just the HOW, but the WHY.
There are a ton of CCIEs on the market today, those without university degrees are flipping burgers or repairing PCs. The interesting work, such as creating optical switches or ultra efficient routers, can only be done by people with advanced degrees. The cert holders sit in the NOC at 3 AM, working their way through a never ending stream of trouble tickets, wishing they had a real degree to get a real job.
That said, from my experiences with US university grads, I'd recommend UC Berkeley, Purdue, CalTech, or UoWashington.
the AC
who just let his CCIE expire, because its worthless in todays job market
Hemos is like...sci-fi fans;he thinks technology is cool, but he hasn't bothered to understand the science it's based on
This is a key point that no one in the Linux/Unix community seems to understand.
What's more transparent, a series of easy to edit text files with names that correspond to the program they control, or storing all information for all programs in one giant binary file?
UNIX is something that you don't seem to understand.
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One of the best things about going to a school like Harvard or Stanford is that many of your classmates are wealthy and connected. During your program at school you will have many opportunities to form networks with fellow students, their parents, and alumni who later in life will be able to get you a job.
Not a very well known school, but it's a campus of both Indiana University and Purdue. I suggest checking out the Informatics major. IUPUI also has a part in Internet2. I'm not sure of the details, as my area is bioinformatics, but there's something under the library :o).
Otherwise, you may also be interested in Purdue's CPT program. They offer a Network Engineering Degree. Purdue is perhaps the best engineering/tech university in the midwest, maybe even east of the Mississippi. In fact, maybe even east of California. And unlike IU, their football team doesn't entirely suck.
Plus, Indianapolis has lots of things going for it for someone in the industry. Plenty of large companies that need tech workers (the headquarters of Lilly and Conseco and Thompson Consumer Electronics North America and Simon Property Group - the world's largest mall owner) as well as many regionally strong tech companies.
Yes, I'm a little biased, but for good reason.
CMU is a good school, but you have to be ready for...well, you may not expect everything there.
(Note that I picked up a bachelor's in CS there and liked it quite a bit.)
I found that the school tends to be a bit racially cliquish. There are a phenomenal number of students from wealthy families overseas that attend, and a (surprisingly, to me at least) number of recent immigrants. I never really ran into any bad spirits (with the possible exception of a Saudi student who seemed quite put-upon immediately after September 11th), but Indians tended to hang out with other Indians, Chinese with other Chinese, etc. It *is* a neat way to pick up other culture -- I'm not a huge fan of travel or picking up other cultures other than my monthly National Geographic, but I really enjoyed some of what I learned about folks there.
CMU has a few *extremely* highly-rated schools. For example, their computer science program and their drama programs are both extremely good. This may *sound* really nice. However, it also has drawbacks. When you are going to university with these people, they are really, really, really good. They not infrequently have done decent work in their major. You can't just decide to pick up a drama double major if you're a typical computer science major, because (a) you would probably never be accepted, and (b) if you did get in, you would be decidedly out of your depth unless you had serious prior experience. CMU is a pretty awful place to be if you don't know, for Pretty Darn Certain what you want to do. Changing majors is generally a pain in the ass. (Note that drama is a particularly nasty case -- there are a very few classes for out of majors that generally have a waiting list many times the size of the class). All this *does* mean that you can generally get a very good education in the field you choose, but it is difficult to seriously explore other things.
CMU is not what you would call a party school. It is next to U Pitt, and, in any event, you can find friends on any campus, but I'd call it socially toned down.
CMU (at least CS and ECE) has a decidedly non-Windows bias, which is quite refreshing if you like working on UNIX systems. This takes root in a number of issues (Microsoft hiring a number of professors away, political issues, etc).
CMU is notable for a lot of different research. I'd say that their computer vision stuff is extremely prominent, as is their robotics works. There are some good language people there. Speech synthesis and recognition is big. The philosophy department has a strong AI/symbolic logic slant, which can be very good if you're into that, and bad if you like classical philosophy. They have networking work, but I don't see the network folks being as prominent as at some other universities. There (at least a while ago) was a significant project working on ad-hoc wireless networking. This is a pretty incomplete list. If you take CS up at CMU, be *sure* to take Professor Steven Rudich's Great Ideas In Computer Science class. It is, without compare, the finest class I've ever taken. It gives your brain a *throrough* workout, is a huge amount of fun, and is inspiring as all hell. Prof. Rudich also gives great assignments -- basically, he gives all the information required to figure some past significant idea in computer science out, then gives you the problem as an assignment. It feels *great* when you do it. I wish to God that more profs gave assignments like this. I and other people have even gone back to sit in on lectures he's given for classes we've already taken.
CMU has awful parking. A car will cause you a good deal of grief. Even in university terms, CMU has bad parking.
CMU is in Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh's average age is extremely high (expecially given the number of universities in the thing). There are a *lot* of old people there. This means that the city shuts down quite early. 24 hour grocery stores and similar are not common. On the other hand, Pittsburgh also has phenomenal
May we never see th