Electronic Arts Shuts Down Origin Systems?

Damn... by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 17:44 · Score: 5, Interesting

Looks like Pirt Snikwah won after all.

RIP to the best of the old-school studios, from a former OSI employee and servant of the Crown.

Everybody else just made crappy games. We created worlds.

EA kills another great developer by scrain · 2004-02-23 17:46 · Score: 2, Interesting

Even though they lost their main talents, in 'Lord British' off to NCSoft's Lineage and Raph Koster off to wreck Star Wars Galaxies, I still had hopes for them to do something good. Looks like that's over now.

Re:EA kills another great developer by grumpygrodyguy · 2004-02-23 17:51 · Score: 5, Informative

Some Origin oldies but goodies.

--
The government has a defect: it's potentially democratic. Corporations have no defect: they're pure tyrannies. -Chomsky
Re:EA kills another great developer by DrMrLordX · 2004-02-23 20:22 · Score: 5, Insightful

Richard Garriot and Raph Koster were not their main talents. OSI's problem was that many of their main talents were their programmers, testers, and artists that they would frequently run off in various silly ways. I got to know a few of them on a strictly casual basis, and while I have always been "on the outside", I heard enough to remind myself of why I was glad to not be working at OSI.

In hindsight, though, OSI has been in decline since the U8 days. EA may have preserved OSI's existance by buying them out, but their managerial influence certainly did not seem to help the company. Everything else that went wrong in the company is, to me, largely irellevant compared to, or caused directly/indirectly by, the EA buyout.

Sadly, OSI's future probably rested on the success of Ultima IX. UO was good for them financially(or so I am told), but it obviously was not enough to make the dev house survive independant of the consolidated EA house. I still remember seeing Myst-like screenshots of the original U9 concept years ago(1995) before any serious work on UO had begun. I also remembered reading that the old U9 project was suspended to put work into developing UO, and that when focus returned to U9, the entire old project was tossed, forcing them to start anew(and then start over again and again as design concepts changes. Avatar Raider anyone?).

It would seem to me that, had they never made UO in the first place, or had they finished Ultima 9 first, the house might still be alive today. Maybe.
Re:EA kills another great developer by Moraelin · 2004-02-23 23:43 · Score: 4, Insightful

Either that, or they could have actually taken UO seriously. They pretty much owned the MMO market and genre, and still ended up number 3. How sad is that?

UO was released with just as many bugs as U9, and _stayed_ buggy. In fact, around 2002 when I last tried it, they were still blundering through patches which broke 2 things for each 1 bug fixed. I've seen patches released and rolled back within 4 hours... during which, they wrecked pure havoc upon those unlucky to download them. Patches which seemed to never have been tested at all.

UO also was released in a sad unfinished state, which since then has become the de-facto standard release for MMO games.

For starters, half the skills were either totally useless, or useless for anyone who wasn't playing a grief player. E.g., tinkering skill could only create trapped chests. Except no NPC ever opened a chest. So in effect the only use was to kill newbies.

The gameplay and game design itself was a poorly thought out catastrophe. Most of the issues were already known and tested for decades on MUDs, but UO just had to repeat every single mistake in the book.

E.g., it was dead predictable that someone will deadlock their original economy. The problem of people actually working hard to take non-renewable resources out of the game -- e.g., by stashing them in vaults or in the inventory of 100 non-played avatars -- was known on MUDs for ages. And blimey, who would have guessed? The exact same issue deadlocked UO's economy.

And how about listening to the customers? It took _years_ of screaming in anguish for a non-PK option, which Origin mostly just ignored. UO lost players hand-over-fist over that issue. Meanwhile Sony and Microsoft basically made "we're the place where you won't get repeadedly PK'ed like on UO" their _main_ claim to glory.

It was already known on MUDs that purely player-enforced justice does not work. Ever. RL justice works only because you do care about what happens to your RL self. But on virtual world you can _count_ on having a hefty share of players who just don't care about their virtual avatars. There is _nothing_ you can do in-character to keep them inline, because they aren't in-character to start with.

Etc.

Basically I'm saying that UO and U9 were both equally half-arsed efforts. Which one came first and which was delayed... does it even make that much of a difference? I believe that even if they came out the other way around, they'd still have been half-arsed. And still, basically, just a sympthom of the fact that something was already rotten at Origin.

--
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
Re:EA kills another great developer by PainKilleR-CE · 2004-02-24 00:14 · Score: 2, Informative

Basically I'm saying that UO and U9 were both equally half-arsed efforts. Which one came first and which was delayed... does it even make that much of a difference?

According to most of the interviews I've read, U9 development wasn't allowed to be stopped or slowed down for UO, because no one was sure that UO would work out. This explains the half-assed efforts on both games quite well, since OSI was pretty much dividing their efforts between the two games at a time when U9 really could've used the polish and UO really could've used more backing and attention.

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-PainKilleR-[CE]

This will kill Ultima Online. by DAldredge · 2004-02-23 17:46 · Score: 2, Interesting

This will result in the death of Ultima Online.

Well, it did have a long run.

Oh my by pHatidic · 2004-02-23 17:47 · Score: 5, Funny

Wow this has got to be true. After all, if you can't trust vague and unsubstantiated rumors what can you trust?!

Re:Oh my by yar · 2004-02-23 21:28 · Score: 4, Informative

I currently live in Austin, TX, and a friend of mine works at Origins. He told me about it this past weekend. According to him, this was open, but unannounced knowledged.

Who cares? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 17:47 · Score: 5, Insightful

OSI is just a name these days anyway. Very few of the people who currently work there are the ones who were responsiblef or all the great Ultima games.

Although it still sucks that some people will be losing there job. The PC gaming biz is grim these days.

I hear they've been outsourced. . . by nil5 · 2004-02-23 17:47 · Score: 4, Funny

Mumbai Computer Gaming Concern.

Ah well... by demonbug · 2004-02-23 17:48 · Score: 3, Informative

Origin used to kick ass. Then EA bought them. They pretty much sucked after that (surprise, surprise). Probably better this than EA releasing crappy games under the Origin name.

I have to say though, Origin had about the best tagline of any gaming company...

Origin - We Create Worlds.

Not anymore, I guess.

Re:Ah well... by Bob+Davis,+Retired · 2004-02-23 20:30 · Score: 5, Insightful

To me, the end of Origin was Ultima 9. The game was released in a non-running state, and after some halfhearted patching, was playable but not even close to finished. When the word from above was that there would be no more patches, I knew that Origin was dead. It may have taken a few years for the corpse to stop twitching, but now we can dig a grave, pitch a few fistfuls of dirt on top of Lord British, and put Sosaria to rest.

Ultima 7 & SI are still two of the greatest and most fun games ever invented in my book, though. Too bad U8 was downhill and U9 wasn't even done. I hope Mr. Garriot can afford to keep his house with the secret room and the 5000 watt stereo - it would be a shame for him to have to get creative and make a good game again.

Where is #1 and #2? by hoggoth · 2004-02-23 17:50 · Score: 3, Insightful

> Austin is the #3 location in the U.S. for game development

Where is the #1 and #2 location for game development?

--
- For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat /dev/random (may take some time)

Re:Where is #1 and #2? by barc0001 · 2004-02-23 20:53 · Score: 3, Interesting

I wouldn't be surprised if Vancouver's in there, or at least in the top 5.
About 4 blocks from my house is the huge EA Canadian headquarters (950 employees) where they do all the sports games, and then downtown we have Radical Entertainment, Relic, Threewave, Rockstar Vancouver, Barking Dog, etc...
Re:Where is #1 and #2? by selfabuse · 2004-02-24 03:47 · Score: 2, Informative

Yes, but Vancouver is in Canada, and would therefore not be one of the top 2 locations for US game development..

Origin, Bullfrog by Operating+Thetan · 2004-02-23 17:50 · Score: 2, Interesting

What other studios has EA gutted?

--
Worried you might not keep your virginity forever? Try new Linux(TM), guaranteed twice as effective as LARPing

Re:Origin, Bullfrog by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 17:56 · Score: 2, Informative

They've also gutted:

* Westwood Studios (Command & Conquer).
* Maxis (SimCity).
Re:Origin, Bullfrog by Slack3r78 · 2004-02-23 17:56 · Score: 2, Insightful

Westwood. It wouldn't really surprise me to see Maxis eventually suffer the same fate, either.
Re:Origin, Bullfrog by wo1verin3 · 2004-02-23 17:56 · Score: 2, Interesting

Yeah and they ruined the C&C series. Generals was the first attempt and they totally screwed it up. Very poor testing and it barely ran for some people until a few patches, still crappy net code. For long time C&C fans, they know the story line was an integral part of C&C. Generals had no storyline. the ZH expansion was only slightly better....

Will C&C ever be the same? Doubtful. :(
Re:Origin, Bullfrog by MachDelta · 2004-02-23 18:18 · Score: 2, Interesting

Maxis isn't toast yet. SimCity 4 w/ Rush Hour is actually not a bad game. And The Sims, despite not appealing to the same demographic as the rest of the industry usually does, is really a very good game.
As a game developer, i'd say Maxis is actually doing very well for itself. As Maxis being Maxis... yeah, I think they may have lost a little of their creative edge because of EA's meddling. But they still make good games for the time being.
Re:Origin, Bullfrog by Lux · 2004-02-23 19:29 · Score: 2, Informative

Some other people have posted the one-word version of this, but there's more to it...

Maxis got the same treatment. EA is closing down operations in Walnut Creek, and moving them to some place on the S.F. Peninsula.

Walnut Creek is about two hours away from there in morning traffic, AFAIK. Sucks to be at Origin more, but it sucks to be at Maxis too.

But the main post made it sound worse than I think it actually is. It's not like Origin is going away just yet. Who knows? They could pull through relocating across three states.

Yeah, OK, I guess they're screwed.

Not a surprise. by Visceral+Monkey · 2004-02-23 17:50 · Score: 3, Interesting

Having been to Origin Austin and seen their digs, there is no way a company like that could even justify the real estate costs they run up. It's crazy.

--
*Fortitudo, aequitas, fidelitas.*

Re:Not a surprise. by gotr00t · 2004-02-23 18:01 · Score: 4, Informative

However, do note that real estate like "that" is actually pretty common in Austin. All along highway 360, its pretty senic, and it has become almost a necessity for any self respecting tech company to locate a site somewhere in the Hill Country.
I, too, have been to Origin's site, and yes, it is very impressive indeed.
Re:Not a surprise. by Donut · 2004-02-23 18:07 · Score: 5, Informative

They own that building outright. Moved there in 1995. Bought it from Netware. Brent Thale suggested it to Robert Garriot as a joke, when we were out-growing the building up north.
Re:Not a surprise. by ruiner5000 · 2004-02-23 18:19 · Score: 2, Interesting

They were not ION Storm Dallas, they actually had some good games to afford a nice place, and I'm sure that would buy an apartment in San Fran maybe. I remember back in the day going over there trying to get a game testing job during college. It was a hard gig to get. Yeah, I remember shortly after EA bought them I was at Hula Hut on Lake Austin at the bar, and some guy with an EA shirt was there. It was after conversation that I figured Origin was screwed, and well, they are. It is a sad. No more Richard Garriot crazy ass haunted houses, no more Ultima. Oh well, Garriots stuff at the Game Conference over the summer was sweet looking. Where the hell is Robers after Wing Commander the prequel to Scooby Doo?

--
ignorance is bliss. googlefiberatx.com
Re:Not a surprise. by ansonyumo · 2004-02-23 19:41 · Score: 2, Funny

Yeah, they should have snagged 105 E 5th when they had the chance!

Why relocate to California? by cprincipe · 2004-02-23 17:51 · Score: 4, Insightful

Maybe I don't know much about the industry, but wouldn't it make more sense to move stuff *to* Austin where the cost of living, including office rent and utilities, is way cheaper than California?

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bun-fhuinneog agam!

Re:Why relocate to California? by Mike+Hawk · 2004-02-23 18:19 · Score: 4, Informative

#1 Lets see...Austin, TX or LA, CA? Score one for Cali.

#2 Activision, THQ, Vivendi, and a host of studios both publisher owned and independent are located there.

LA is the place to be in you are a video game maker who likes to buy all the talent, suck it dry as fast as possible and then fire that talent and start again. Whoa, did I just hear someone describe EA?
Re:Why relocate to California? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 18:55 · Score: 3, Informative

#1 Lets see...Austin, TX or LA, CA? Score one for Cali.

Actually, Austin is good for business.

Also, ordinary people can afford housing there, the quality of life is very good, and it's probably not going to be devastated by an earthquake anytime soon.
Re:Why relocate to California? by TwistedKestrel · 2004-02-23 19:11 · Score: 4, Interesting

Whoa, did I just hear someone describe EA?

That's EA to a freakin' T, and it practically brings tears to my eyes the projects and franchises they've run into the ground. Okay, namely it's just Ultima Online 2 that will never see the light of day, and it boils my blood that EA dropped the ball on that one! They're riding UO 1 like tobacco companies ride cigarette sales, and ... holy hell I hate them for that one. BUURRNNN!!!

Re:This will NOT kill Ultima Online. by flogger · 2004-02-23 17:54 · Score: 4, Informative

I was going to mod you down, but thought I'd reply instaed....

Read some of the articles.
This is not the end for Ultima ... Ultima Online will now be run from California, and development of Ultima X will continue on the west coast.
ultima Online will still continue. I'm sure it will change, especially if people take the sevrense package instead of relocating. But it will still be there.

--
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"First things first -- but not necessarily in that order"
-- The Doctor, "Doctor

Im suprised it took so long... by LordKazan · 2004-02-23 17:54 · Score: 5, Insightful

When EA bought up Origin I groaned because I knew it was the death of a good company, just like with THQ bought up Volition (not that Interplay was much better in that case).

After EA bought up Origion Wing Commander went into it's declining stages ending up with the catasrophe that was Privateer 2 on Erin's part and the nuclear holocaust that was the movie (On Chris' part). Thus died one of the finest and most groundbreaking gaming series in history.

I never paid much attention to Ultima but I knew it was a matter of time till EA did the same thing to it, I just read an article about after the success of EverQuest EA starting forcing Origin to make Ultima more Everquest-ish and less Ultima-like and thus removing and in forcing those changes it involved making Ultima un-Ultima-like thereby alienating Ultimas fans.

WAY TO GO ELECTRONIC ARTS - You have sucessfully killed two of the longest run and best gaming series there ever were. May you continue to spoon feed people things like Madden ever year with miminal changes and another $50 price tag.

---------------------

To the Origin Guys: Look to the community, we are with you, many would help you start anew to become what you once were. Weh ave confident in you guys.

--
If you cannot keep politics out of your moderation remove yourself from the Mod Lottery.. NOW!

Re:Im suprised it took so long... by TC+(WC) · 2004-02-23 18:47 · Score: 4, Informative

Yeah... Because Wing Commander was sustainable with the horrible finances OSI had! Without EA there never would have been a WC3 or 4, as there's no way Origin could have funded them.

I hope you'll also realize that the Wing Commander movie really had nothing to do with EA. When Chris Roberts left the company after Wing Commander 4 he negotiated for the movie rights to Wing Commander for a certain number of years. After that, there wasn't any EA involvement to speak of.
Re:Im suprised it took so long... by BRSQUIRRL · 2004-02-24 02:26 · Score: 3, Informative

I'm not sure that we can pin the decline of "Wing Commander" on EA alone...I think that the gaming public's taste for that particular genre (space combat/simulation) has been declining in general. The X-Wing/TIE Fighter series from LucasArts is another example. Those sorts of games just aren't trendy right now (which is a shame...X-Wing is probably my favorite PC game ever, and I would love to see what today's graphics cards could do with a space combat simulator like that now).
Re:Im suprised it took so long... by LordKazan · 2004-02-24 02:37 · Score: 2, Informative

You've been listening to Interplay and EA -- that opinion was a self fullfilling prophecy.

Gameing Publishers: "We don't think there is an audience" so they didn't spend enough of advertising to promot the game

There are still people who stubmle across FreeSpace 2 and are like "This game is awesome! why didn't I ever hear about it"

---------------------

FYI I am a member of the following projects:
FreeSpace 2 Source Code Project
FreeSpace 2: The Babylon Project (B5 total conversion)
Ferrium (founder, project leader -- in the forseeable future we will not be able to continue upgrading that spagetti code nightmare that is the fs2 engine - so we're starting to write a new one to take up the torch)

--
If you cannot keep politics out of your moderation remove yourself from the Mod Lottery.. NOW!
Re:Im suprised it took so long... by Art+Tatum · 2004-02-24 11:51 · Score: 2, Insightful

Here's your chance: get everybody you know involved in finishing Parsec. The thing is most of the way there now. As I understand it, the networking code is the only thing in an unfinished state.

play Ultima Online like its 1999! by DeadPrez · 2004-02-23 17:55 · Score: 4, Interesting

Before EA gutted the UO team and started taking it on a rambling development path towards an Everquest clone, Ultima Online was quite an amazingly complex and intriguing game. Despite contemporary wisdom 2d games have plenty of potential if not more than 3d games. UO of 1999-2000 is considered the greatest MMORPG ever for just about any play style besides ph@t l3wt collectors who hate risking said phat loot and even then it did ok.

There are a whole lot of UO emulated player run shards alive and kicking today. Many are attempting to recreate that era for UO which changed, like I said when EA gutted the OSI team. I have found www.preuor.com the best shard for that purpose. They have meticulously made efforts to recreate the small things that made UO great. Try it, you'll be surprised how fun a 2d game mmorpg can actually be and best of all its free (no monthly fee or game purchase required).

www.preuor.com

Re:play Ultima Online like its 1999! by DeadPrez · 2004-02-23 18:21 · Score: 2, Interesting

AC, you're refering to the wtfman server I believe. the preuor.com one has none of those problems.

Goodbye to the pedigree by Teahouse · 2004-02-23 17:58 · Score: 4, Insightful

Ogre, Space Rogue, Wing Commander, Ultima Online and so many others. Origin was one of the originals. I remember playing Ogre on my 386. Every few years these guys seemed to put out another good game. I remember playing Space Rogue, it was one of the first really good 3d space simulations. The storyline sucked, but you could fly your ship by inertia or on a "fighter tracking' style. Mastering inertia thrusters was awesome, and something I will never forget.

Killing Origin is just another sad episode in the tale of "EA Lames". We'll see more game console stupidity with John Madden screaming about football, but truly original game concepts are dying, as are the companies who made them.

I will lift a Guiness to my youth, and the hours of fun I had with Origin tonight.

--
"Curiosity killed the cat, but for a while I was a suspect."- Steven Wright

Re:This will NOT kill Ultima Online. by DAldredge · 2004-02-23 17:58 · Score: 5, Informative

First let me say that I currently play Ultima Online. UO appears to be a project that is being slowly phased out, I base this of the following:

1: The next publish (what UO calls updates) is mostly (90%) about the ability to move characters between shards (seperate UO worlds)
2: The event moderaters have been removed and will ,more than likely, not be back.
3: It is almost impossible to BUY THE GAME in stores anymore. Next to no brick and morter stores carry it and EA does next to no advertizing for it. So how does it attract new customers?

Re:OK. And... by Deraj+DeZine · 2004-02-23 18:01 · Score: 4, Insightful

You might want to keep in mind that their employees are not objects that can just be traded around, forced into retirement, and fired. They're people. I'm not saying this doesn't happen, I'm just saying that the few guys in upper management have a moral responsibility to attempt to not do such things to other people.

Most people don't feel too bad about killing chickens for meat since chickens don't appear to be persons. Unfortunately, many also see nothing wrong with ignoring the effects of relocations and whatnot on the people at the company.

--
True story.

Just what Austin needs by Lane.exe · 2004-02-23 18:01 · Score: 3, Informative

I live here and our economy is in the pits -- no one can find jobs. This is just another example of a company abandoning one of the most creative cities on the planet. It's really a shame -- Austin has a lot of talented people coming out of some of the best colleges in the region (Houston, San Antonio, Dallas, and especially UT here in Austin) in graphics, art, music and computer science. This isn't a smart move.

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IAALS.

It is true by Donut · 2004-02-23 18:05 · Score: 5, Informative

I have a friend that works there. It is true. Here are the details that I know about:

1. They are not done with UOX. It is in Beta. Origin Beta or real Beta, who knows. They think they can move development to california for the Earth and Beyond people to finish?!?!?!

2. There were 230 people working there.

3. The studio management may have known, but I know they were still hiring and relocating people to Austin several weeks ago.

4. This was the worst kept secret in Austin. Everyone knew last week. Except the employees.

5. UO support moving to california.

6. Origin owned that building.

I have been gone from there for almost 6 years, but I spent 10 there. It is a little sad, but not unexpected. EA tried to shut it down back in '99, but pulled back from the brink for some reason. Feel sorry for their new employees, especially the new GM.

-Donut, Origin Alumni 1990-1999
Ultima VI, Ultima VII, Strike Commander, Serpent Isle, Pacific Strike, Longbow, Longbow2, A-10.

Re:It is true by Dalcius · 2004-02-23 22:39 · Score: 2, Interesting

Donut --

As a number of posts above have covered, a community still exists around a game that's been dead for roughly 6 years (WC: SO was released in '98).

I'm willing to bet that I'm not the only guy who wants Privateer on Linux or a modern OS, or even a multiplayer version.

What are your thoughts on releasing the source to the community for really old timers like Privateer, Armada, etc.? I think there's a lot of potential for a community project.

--
~Dalcius
Rome wasn't burnt in a day.

Watch out (re: link in parent post) by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 18:06 · Score: 5, Informative

This site tries to install some very weird shit under IE6.

Re:OK. And... by corbettw · 2004-02-23 18:10 · Score: 5, Insightful

Have you considered that the upper management have determined that, if they don't move and consolidate, they won't be able to afford to keep the Austin office open, at all? Maybe it's better that some employees move than they all lose their jobs.

I'm not saying this is definitely the case, but while corporate management may be heartless, it usually isn't malicious. You make it sound like they're moving people just to have something to do.

--
God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.

Expected... by syrion · 2004-02-23 18:13 · Score: 2, Insightful

Origin has been a shell of itself since 1992. Ultima VIII was rushed by EA, Ultima IX was at least negatively influenced by them, and Ultima Online honestly bears little resemblance to the cardinal Ultimas. Sad, yes, but not really a disaster. Maybe Garriott's new company will accomplish something eventually :)

Here we go again... by Stone+Rhino · 2004-02-23 18:13 · Score: 5, Insightful

I'm sure I'm ridiculously redundant, but we might as welll put this all in one place.

EA has bought its way to the top. Bullfrog, Westwood, Maxis, Origin have all fallen before the giant. Eliminating whole divisions--even highly successful ones--is nothing new. Just ask the people from Dynamix who got chopped shortly after Tribes 2 became a hit.

Infogrames, er, Atari, is no better. They went a from a small publishing house to one of the titans of the games industry by buying everything they could. Adopting the name "Atari," plastering it over their corporate monolith as a relatively cheap facade (the company was only a few million dollars) is, to me, the most cynical thing I've seen from a gaming company in a long time. Yet, there is no media outrage, not even a notice that they're a completely different company that adopted the same name.

Creativity is dead. There are no more juicy steaks of games, no more Command and Conquers or Homeworlds, the games that bring gaming into a whole new dimension, at least from the major houses. Instead, we get reheated leftovers or ground chuck, tossed on a bun and served up McDonalds style. Yet another game in the same series, yet another Sims expansion back--Is this the future of gaming that you want? This is the future of gaming as in the hands of EA and "Atari." EA did not produce a new, original game in 2003--only rehashes and expansions.

Support an independent developer with fresh ideas, or support an open-source game. Look to the endless parade of closed studios and stifled creativity, sequels following the same pattern, only with few shiny new features. Is this the way you want your games? Or do you want something fresh and new?

--

Remember, there were no nuclear weapons before women were allowed to vote.

Re:Here we go again... by Dalcius · 2004-02-23 22:55 · Score: 2, Informative

I guess this is an appropriate reply...

I think I've seen more 'indie' games in the last few years then ever before. At least 'indie' to me, a lot of publishers these days I haven't heard of before.

To give an example that might interest folks in this thread (Wing Commander fans), I just bought a game I could call 'innovative' called "X2-The Threat", created by Egosoft and published by Enlight (or maybe I have that backwards). I've never heard of either.

Anyway, in concept take Privateer, give it Freelancer style graphics and allow players to own multiple ships. It's your normal "buy a fighter, travel to X, do missions, etc." game, except that it goes a little further: you can buy fighters, cargo haulers, corvettes, destroyers, carriers, you name it. You can build your own fleet... the computer will fly anything you're not.

Apparently you can actually pilot a carrier which can carry ships inside (haven't gotten that far myself). You can even go a step further and build your own factories (space stations) -- no limit on number.

I've been waiting for a game like this since I picked up Privateer and haven't seen one until now, hence I think of it as 'innovative'. Overall the game isn't as polished as possible and might underwhelm some folks, but the freedom, reality (dock your own ship) and power you have are awesome.

If anyone else is aware of innovation along these lines, I'd like to hear it, this is the first game of it's kind that I've seen.

Cheers

--
~Dalcius
Rome wasn't burnt in a day.
Re:Here we go again... by justforaday · 2004-02-24 01:21 · Score: 2, Insightful

Well, when you put it like that it sounds like you could be describing any other form of entertainment - be it music, movies, or teevee [as well as some others I'm sure]. Bland media empires being built out of the ashes and ruiins of once great smaller/independent developers. Yup, it all works the same. Remember, support the independents as much as you can in whatever way you can! They are the ones who truly shape and drive the landscape.

--
I'll turn into a supernova and burn up everything. Well I'll turn into a black little hole and you'll turn into string.
Re:Here we go again... by oolon · 2004-02-24 04:53 · Score: 2, Informative

Well before X2 there was Xbtf (X Beyond the Fronteer) that was the first game where you got to own factories as well as the trading ship you upgrade and fly arround in. Xt (X tension) with the 2.1 patch, you could own your own captal but it was only a transporter type with no guns, before that it was Xbft with ship swapping. X2 however you can own and fly the compete navy. You can also write your own scripts for controlling them! Egosoft have a history of patching far beyond their release date. You get that polishing you were looking for.....

James

Another X2 owner.

Ahh Ultima by Veramocor · 2004-02-23 18:26 · Score: 5, Funny

Ahh Ultima, the source of my online screen name Veramocor. I will miss thee. +1 karma to anyone who can tell me what the word Veramocor does in U4 and what it does in U5. (nota bene: I have no power to actually give out karma)

Though there are some great ultima projects being worked on such as the lazarus project

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Veramocor

Re:Ahh Ultima by Anonymous Coward · 2004-02-23 18:40 · Score: 5, Informative

If I recall correctly,

U4: word of passage that allows entry into the abyss
U5: allows entry into dungeon Doom in the center of the underworld

About you by DAldredge · 2004-02-23 18:27 · Score: 2, Insightful

Why mod it down? Because you didn't agree with it? That isn't the purpose of the moderation system and it is because of people like you that the system doesn't work as well as it should.

You should apply for a moderator position at freerepublic.com and/or democraticundeground.com as you moderation system fits in a lot better at those two sites.

Re:OK. And... by Deraj+DeZine · 2004-02-23 18:29 · Score: 2, Interesting

I think if all of the guys at the top took a pay cut, they could build their own office. That's exaggerated, but, seriously, they (management) don't deserve the money they're getting. The only reason they get it is that people are in such a hurry to get a job developing games that they don't care how corrupt or wasteful the company is and wind up selling their soul to the devil (I meant "corporation," of course). Not unlike music artists under record labels (except music apparently can't be outsourced as efficiently due to more pronounced cultural differences in music taste).

Additionally, they could probably save money and keep their current offices open if they used slave labor. Just an idea.

--
True story.

Origin's games by dtio · 2004-02-23 18:35 · Score: 5, Informative

Basically they have been cashing the Ultima and Wing Commander cows for years, complete list from IGN:

publisher

3DO, CyberMage, Super Wing Commander

Amiga
Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet,Wing Commander

Apple IIe/c/c+
Ogre,Omega,Ultima,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny

Atari 400/800/XL/XE
Autoduel,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar

Atari ST
Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet

Commodore 64
Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet,Ultima: The First Age of Darkness

MSX
Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness (Pony Canyon),Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar

Macintosh
Super Wing Commander,Ultima III: Exodus,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger

PC
Abuse,CyberMage: Darklight Awakening,Privateer 2: The Darkening,Shadowcaster,Ulitma IX: Ascension,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness (Pony Canyon),Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima IX: Ascension,Ultima Underworld II: Labyrinth of Worlds,Ultima Underworld: The Stygian Abyss,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet,Ultima VII Part II: Serpent Isle,Ultima VII: The Black Gate,Ultima VII: The Forge of Virtue,Ultima VIII: Pagan,Ultima Worlds of Adventure 2: Martian Dreams,Wing Commander,Wing Commander II: Vengeance of the Kilrathi,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger,Wing Commander: Privateer,Worlds of Ultima: Martian Dreams,Worlds of Ultima: Savage Empire

PlayStation
Crusader: No Remorse,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger,Wing Commander IV: The Price of Freedom

Saturn
Crusader: No Remorse

Sega CD
Wing Commander

Super NES
Wing Commander: Secret Missions

developer

3DO
CyberMage,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger

Amiga
Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet
Wing Commander,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger

Apple IIe/c/c+
Ogre,Omega,Ultima,Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny

Atari 400/800/XL/XE
Autoduel,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima: The First Age of Darkness

Atari ST
Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet

Commodore 64
Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima V: Warriors of Destiny,Ultima VI: The False Prophet,Ultima: The First Age of Darkness

Game Boy
Ultima: Runes of Virtue,Ultima: Runes of Virtue II

MSX
Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness (Pony Canyon),Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar

Macintosh
Super Wing Commander,System Shock,Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Wing Commander III: Heart of the Tiger

NES
Ultima: Exodus,Ultima: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima: Warriors of Destiny

PC
Crusader: No Regret,Crusader: No Remorse,CyberMage: Darklight Awakening,Strike Commander,Ultima Collection,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness,Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness (Pony Canyon),Ultima II: Revenge of the Enchantress,Ultima III: Exodus,Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar,Ultima IX: Ascension,Ultima Online,Ultima Online: Age of Shadows,Ultima Online: Lord Bl

Re:Origin's games by Durindana · 2004-02-23 19:52 · Score: 2, Informative

add AutoDuel for the Apple ][/][+/][c/][e (which rocked), and Abuse for Mac (which sucked)

Autoduel on the Apple II I still think was a killer game. PC and console games came kinda close to matching its mix of action/adventure/building cars - Twisted Metal meets Legacy of the Ancients, circa 1985 - but not quite. That's one title I'd love to see remade

ON THE MAC!

Origin WAS great, but what have they done lately? by mayns · 2004-02-23 18:37 · Score: 5, Insightful

Other than watching over UO and developing UO2/X what has origin done lately? I used to buy every one of their releases (as long as my system could handle it) but that was 7-10 years ago. I remember games like strike commander really pushing people's systems. And wasn't Origin the first company to go Cd-rom only for their titles? I remember that being a big deal. As far as i was concerned, Origin was the gold standard for dev houses in their era, along with Bullfrog. But I cannot think of one 3D-accelerated Origin title off of the top of my head (UO doesn't count, it started out 2d). Why are we mourning now for a dev house that hasn't put out a major release since I got a processor with three digits of mHz?

www.wcnews.com /.ed by ggvaidya · 2004-02-23 18:39 · Score: 5, Informative

The website's starting to go slow, so I'm posting the text of the epitaph from http://www.wcnews.com/:

Goodbye, Origin

For twenty two years Origin Systems set the tone for the computer gaming. Ultima, Wing Commander and dozens of others set the gold standard for which the rest of the industry could only hope to catch up. This era has finally come to an end as Electronic Arts readies an announcement that it will shut down the Austin-based Origin studio.

This is not the end for Ultima or Wing Commander. Ultima Online will now be run from California, and development of Ultima X will continue on the west coast. Hopes that another Wing Commander game would be developed in Austin were dashed long ago; the longtime belief that a California-based EA team would develop the next Wing Commander title may, ironically, be bolstered by this news.

What it is, however, is a tremendous moral loss on all fronts. Origin Systems will always be the ultimate symbol of gaming's greatest days, and its dissolution to a faceless corporate entity is, sadly, equally symbolic of the world today. Origin entertained, challenged and inspired our generation in a way that seems impossible today. Though the individuals who developed our games long ago moved on to greater careers, the very existence of the company itself continued to stand for something special; something amazing.

The CIC will continue to dedicate itself to Origin's legacy - we will redouble our efforts to archive anything and everything related to the company. We will strike to make the world remember what Origin meant. I wanted to end with a quote - something plithy and literary to express the meaning of such an ending. I came up with only this:

With your carrier destroyed, you drift endlessly through the void.

Instead... by natrius · 2004-02-23 18:44 · Score: 5, Funny

Instead of shutting Origin down, can't they just rename it Destination or something?

Re:This will NOT kill Ultima Online. by Tarrek · 2004-02-23 18:54 · Score: 4, Informative

Strangely, on #3, that isn't even that big a deal- This wasn't very widely publicized, but you can actually download it (Ultima Online- Complete including Age of Shadows, both 2d and 3d clients) *completely legally* WITH a 2 week free trial account from a few places online- Fileshack has it, I believe, past that, I don't know.

Here's some linkage: by Tarrek · 2004-02-23 18:57 · Score: 5, Informative

Source 1

Source 2

Here ya'll go! Free Ultima Online to mourn the loss of OSI with.

Re:This will NOT kill Ultima Online. by DAldredge · 2004-02-23 18:58 · Score: 3, Interesting

No, the AoS client that you download doesn't come with the code to enable the new AoS areas. I have a 4-5 page tech support ticked on this issue.

In the end they refused to get me a code. This are several postions on uo.stratics.com (the official UO boards) about this 'issue'.

Origin died when Garriot was forced out by Sivaram_Velauthapill · 2004-02-23 18:59 · Score: 4, Insightful

Origin died when Garriot was forced out. That was pretty much the end of it IMO. Their Ultima Online was kept going but nothing new really came out of EA.

Branding under one name, such as EA, is very attractive to corporations. Having "subsidiaries" with their own creative control is a big no-no for corporations. EA also pretty much ran Westwood Studios (famous for Dune, and C&C) down to the ground as well.

Origin may have died...but Ultima and Wing Commander will live on in our memories :)

Sivaram Velauthapillai

--
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Seeking the meaning of life... @slashdot of all places ;)

Get that weak stuff outta here by The+Tyro · 2004-02-23 19:04 · Score: 2, Interesting

I can still remember some of the moongate codes in Ultima III... yikes, how many years ago was that?

Just a general question: did anyone else pillage the city of Yew over and over to build up money and experience? (Note: it was the only city that didn't have guards, and the druids were easy pickings). Getting killed by orcs was humiliating, and I had to level up *somehow*

Origin will be missed... those games are unqualified classics.

--
Even if a man chops off your hand with a sword, you still have two nice, sharp bones to stick in his eyes.

origin. looking glass. why? by the_REAL_sam · 2004-02-23 19:15 · Score: 5, Insightful

I honestly can't say i've been all that impressed with the games EA has released. The worst was dungeon keeper.

Maybe they're making their living on the kind of games I've generally considered "beneath me" - sports, car racing games and the like. But that leaves me wondering why they'd buy out a company that makes games in a totally seperate genre. What genre? Hardcore geek - Intelligent - True cyberpunk - Worth the money because the game is absorbing. Examples that I've played: System Shock 1 and 2, Asheron's Call, anything by blizzard, Deus Ex.

Did anyone ever play system shock 1? It was made by looking glass studios back in the early 80's. EA bought them. I just replayed that game a few months back. (took weeks of hacking just to get it to run on a modern machine) It's 20 years old, made on low budget, and it's STILL better than anything I ever played from EA.

It sounds to me like EA needs to parse out its game planning into seperate departments, because there's alot of talent that they've wasted in the process of assimilation. If they're aquiring good geek companies and making crappy geek games, they're losing something major.

My first guess is that they've got a non-geek calling the shots in what should be their insular geek games department. And that ain't good, because the mindset that makes Indy500 entertaining is not sufficient to keep a true geek satisfied.

If I don't like it, I don't play it. So in a way it's not a problem for me, but it saddens me that EA has taken so many good programmers off of interesting game projects, and cubbyholed them into EA style games.. all the while forgetting that it wasn't just programming that made the parent companies good. It was vision.

I can't help but hope that somebody at EA reads this, and somehow fixes the problem. It would be nice to be able to say: "I remember back when EA games weren't any good. It took them a while, but they finally got their act together."

--
"Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us." -Jesus Christ The Lord's Prayer

Oh Good! by ABaumann · 2004-02-23 19:21 · Score: 2, Funny

Now EA will focus on making good games again, like this

EA is too powerful by superpulpsicle · 2004-02-23 19:22 · Score: 3, Interesting

1.) There was a study done. Literally on a ratio of like 3 to 1. For every 3 titles that come out EA needs to buy or sell one small company. EA buys away its competition.

2.) It markets the hell out of everything. NBA live for example has out sell Sega ESPN basketball every year. Soon competition from Sega might disappear and voila less competition again. They can keep the baskeball standard low for 5 years while they tweak their engine. Not good for consumer

3.) EA is losing quality yearly like M$ especially on the PC product line.

It all but happened years ago... by ilduce · 2004-02-23 19:31 · Score: 3, Insightful

The end of origin/ea's austin location really began after Chris Roberts was booted years ago. That was after Wing commander 4 came out, a year late and something like 10mil over budget (I think it costs 12mil total in the days when games rarely exceeded 1mil). They've been scaling back by attrition since then, and combined with the fact that EA long ago folded all of its disparate brands into the EA umbrella... This has been a long time coming.

Re:It all but happened years ago... by Kippesoep · 2004-02-24 00:24 · Score: 2, Informative

Actually, the budget was $12M, (three times as much as WC3's budget). I don't know whether it did go seriously over budget. Perhaps it just wasn't as successful as the earlier installments. I quite liked it, though.

Origin Haiku by SoLO · 2004-02-23 19:33 · Score: 4, Funny

Origin is gone
not soon forgotten by us
Long live Ultima

--
John Susek

It's still living outside our memories too by MoggyMania · 2004-02-23 19:37 · Score: 4, Informative

Actually, the Ultima Series is still living outside our memories as well. :-) Groups of dedicated fans are working on updating the original games with modern graphics/sound, rewriting U9 dialogue so that it's in line with the history within the Ultima universe, creating programs that enable the pre-9 Ultimas to run successfully under Windows, adding multiplayer/online abilities to older Ultimas, creating fan fiction & fan spinoff games, and all kinds of other fun things.

You mean, this is news? by Ironica · 2004-02-23 20:18 · Score: 4, Informative

I learned about this months ago. But maybe that's because I'm in an Urban Planning program, and it was big news that the Playa Vista Development finally found their office tenant.

This development has been followed closely by a whole lot of people. Environmentalists freaked out about it, because it borders the Ballona Wetlands. The protest caused them to completely redesign the site *and* include several acres of wetlands restoration (because Hughes Aircraft, the former owner of the site, was none too kind to the native flora and fauna). Urban planners and designers are fascinated to see if the site can work, because it incorporates a lot of new (old) ideas, such as a mix of uses, high-density development, and a range of income groups.

When they originally were planning the site, Dreamworks SKG had just formed up, and was going to move in as the big anchor office tenant. When the project was massively delayed, they backed out, and one of the big issues was finding another tenant to take over that huge, state-of-the-art space. EA finally anted up late last year. They're cashing out their Irvine, San Jose, and Austin locations, and consolidating everything there.

If they're paying moving costs, it's a pretty good deal for folks moving, especially from San Jose. Units in Playa Vista start in the low $200k range, and the complex has a *ton* of amenities (including its own childcare center, market, and amphitheatre). Every unit has broadband built in and I think even data jacks in the walls, and the complex has its own intranet for reserving rec rooms, checking out events, and so on.

Frankly, I wouldn't mind living there myself... my husband feels it's a bit remote, though (you'd never guess you're in the second-largest city in the country; Lincoln Blvd. looks empty except for Playa Vista). It's between Venice and Marina del Rey, though, just about 5-10 minutes in one direction or the other.

I'm sure that they're counting on the consolidation saving them on staff, and it sucks that some people will lose their jobs. Me, I'm not crying about them bringing a whole mess o' jobs into Los Angeles, since I live here, but I suppose it does suck for those in the locations they're closing. I don't know if it's a good business move for them... unless they're changing their (fraudulent) policies on MMOG billing*, they'll have no business from me for a while, so who knows? But it's an interesting development, to be sure, from many perspectives.

*Used to have an Earth and Beyond account. Discovered from personal experience (twice) and a guildmate's experience that E&B accounts *always* expire two days before they are supposed to (according to the date that comes up on the screen to nag you EVERY FRICKIN' TIME you log in, after you've cancelled). You have to call them, during business hours, to get it fixed. Sure, they'll fix it right up, but oh... you got booted in the middle of a battle and now you can't log in, but they're closed? Pay up or die. I chose to leave my account permanently expired.

--
Don't you wish your girlfriend was a geek like me?

Open Source old projects? by CAIMLAS · 2004-02-23 20:55 · Score: 2, Interesting

I wonder what the chances are of EA open sourcing old projects such as Privateer or any of the Wing Commander stuff; I'd love to see games built using some of that framework, even if it's old: you'd be able to have a complex world without too much hastle, as the framework is already available, and content creation could be focused on.

Probably not. Old games tend to just die, unfortunately.

--
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers

Re:Open Source old projects? by WWWWolf · 2004-02-24 02:40 · Score: 2, Informative

There are some projects that are remaking the Origin-developed framework. Exult is an Ultima VII engine remake, only needs the original data files to run.

Everyone who has ever installed Ultima VII on anything post-Win95 probably knows that having no ties whatsoever to original U7 codebase is probably a good thing =)

Exult has made U7 a very good and modern game. They've fixed many of the old annoying UI issues and such.

Exult even comes with near-usable map editor and script compiler, so you can use U7 engine to do your own adventures... at least in theory. Check out this funny screenshot... =)

There are some other engine remakes, I think. Not sure what they are or if they can be used for anything interesting though.

As for EA open-sourcing anything... no way. They're holding on their IP as hard as they can. They aren't even particularly happy about fan remakes of Ultima games, even if they're approved by Richard Garriott (or even approved while he was still in Origin).

Re:Origin WAS great, but what have they done latel by MikShapi · 2004-02-23 20:57 · Score: 4, Informative

The Ultima series died at 7.0
It's virtue lied in a combination of a HUMONGOUS open-ended, non-linear world with SO DAMN MANY non-generic niches, It was probbably the most replayable game in the world. I played 6 and 7 maybe 3 times each, and I just kept discovering more and more stuff I didn't find the previous times.

Then things started to go down. 7 Part II was nicer than 7 graphicswise, was as complex and full of niches as 7, but it was LINEAR. So much for a huge world you could explore at your leisure. You were now guided by the nose through the game.

Then came 8. Oh, the pain, the PAIN. Not only was it non-linear, it was DUMBED DOWN into oblivion. The game-world was no longer one large map.. rather, it was a series of "screens" you go from one to the other. 90% of the niches in the game unrelated to the plot were gone. Much of the gameplay was replaced by jumping puzzles that looked like a birdseye 2D tombraider-wannabe. And here, they put the good old Ultima atmosphere (with the mandolin music that followed when you were in the forest on the way to cove) to rest with 3 0.44 magnum shots to the forehead. Let's skip 8.

Enter 9. Gariott is no longer around. Still, 9 was a good try. Really, it was. The goal was in the right direction, and they were actually going for it. First, they put in the heaviest block, a 3D engine. Second, they got the atmosphere back, and they made an almost-successful attempt at bringing back the humongous world that was U7. But they fell short. There were no niches with side-quests and goodies to discover. There was no replayability. It was still linear. And there was no future - EA pulled the plug.

Then came UO, and EA decided they did not want me to be their client no more. They shut down all of Origin except for UO.

The genre was not completely lost though.
Two titles by other companies prevailed in my consiousness:

Elder Scrolls3: Morrowind made a shot at a humongous world. They did manage to get that right. But they went astray. There was no Garriot. No Lord British. There was no atmosphere. It was just an endless [beautiful] world of immensely over-recycled content, unbalanced gameplay, flat-as-a-plank characters and utterly boring [and endless] fed-ex quests that required spending too much of the game time on travel. The company who made it just wasn't Origin, it lacked a guide. And the game was a flop.

The one light that did indeed shine bright in the genre was Gothic. I truly salute the guys who made it. While it posed a slightly different atmosphere than Ultima, It was immersingly wonderful. The world was huge. The story thick, unpredictable, brutal at times. Real-world trust-noone and fend-for-yourself style. Main storyline put aside, the game world was accessible in an unlinear fassion.
And in a streak of genious, they took all the effort put into making the first game world, added a similar amount of effort to create a second, and had a world twice as big for Gothic II. Kudos guys.

Ultima genre aside, we come to the lancers. The wing-commander/privateer teams were stashed (and bought by M$), making Starlancer and Freelancer, games made by great devs, having the ability to soar, and trampled to garbage by executives with the intellect of a retarded coccaroach. Freelancer could have been a "Privateer 3", and could have borne the title proudly. It had it all. Graphics, missions, weapons, secret niches.
All but a decision to force down the plot on you at square one, drive you faster than you'd like towards its end, forcing you to finish it, then having you stuck in a beautiful humongous and largely-unexplored galaxy, with NO quests or goals of any kind save for random encounters and randimized generic missions to "go discover it" and make money you no longer need. Woohoo.
I'd love to meet the moron who made that call.
Or the one saying you can't take more than one mission at a time. DAMN. What was THAT good for?

I take solace in the fact that the team is still together, and maybe the executive

--
-

Goodbye. by Thanatiel · 2004-02-23 21:09 · Score: 4, Interesting

Origin's games were an important part of my fun when I was younger. I still remember the "Stones" music from the Ultima VII serie. And for various reasons, I still see the attack of Kilrathi Mang when listening Bach music. /tear

EA destroyed Bullfrog, Origin, ...
What do they sell now ? The Sims ...

--
Irrelevant news and morons using moderation to mod down what they disagree on. 2018 resolution: so long.

Some google cache links by cache_automaton · 2004-02-23 21:25 · Score: 2, Interesting

Google has some applicable cache hits.

Rap Sheet - Ultima Series
Rap Sheet - Wing Commander Series
Wing Commander CIC

--
It is my pleasure to serve you caches, for I am a bot.

Re:Ultima V Dungeon Siege Remake by Bluetrust25 · 2004-02-23 21:43 · Score: 3, Interesting

Just last week I bought Dungeon Siege, the first computer game I've bought in a year, just so I could play the fan-based remake of Ultima V featured on slashdot the other day. It was a neat concept to remake an old (but loved) game.

There's also a user created Wing Commander mod for Vega Strike.

I really dig the user-created remakes. They're just so crappy in comparison to the originals.

-----------
Since you're here, you should sign up for a banner / pop-up free website on AloofHosting.com. 50MB disk space, 500MB transfer, FTP, and a pissed off monkey comes with each free account.

* Monkey may not be available in your state. *

Losing another "back in the day" developer by ducomputergeek · 2004-02-23 22:12 · Score: 2, Insightful

I can't say I was into Ultima, but they did produce my favorite game of all time: Privateer. I can remember spending a few hours to get the EMM386 file correct in order to play the game. Honestly, it didn't work well until I bought the CD version at Sam's for $10 with both the speach and add-on campaign. Privateer was the first game I ever saw where there was a story line, but you could choose when to prosue it or weave in and out. I used to play it for hours in Jr. High and until Tie Fighter was released.

Privateer 2 was something else: it didn't even bear the wing commander name nor Universe. Privateer 2 was the last DOS game I ever bought and never did complete it...I lost interest and had other things going on in my High School years.

But, hey, Sierra killed of my other favorite developer from back in the day, Dynmix or something like that...the folks that made the Aces series of flight sims. It was the gold standard until Combat Sim by microsoft came out...

I don't buy games anymore for computers. For starters, I use Macintosh now, second off, just don't have the time. Although its a shame to see such an old vetern fade away...

--
"The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money" - Thatcher.

Goodbye old friend by jodunni1 · 2004-02-24 00:59 · Score: 2, Interesting

OK OK - so yes - we've known this was coming for a long time and it was obvious by their output (or lack thereof) that something was wrong with OSI but.....

That doesn't change the fact that U IV was one of the reasons that I got into computing in the first place - the power of that world - I mean honestly - what other game forced you to take notes!!!! Hello! I was a freshman in high school at had like 6 notebooks - one for each subject and one for Ultima.

In many ways, I think, it was the first departure from the true D&D style of the very early TSR games that was sucessful and paved the way for so many great games later.

Just because we knew it was coming doesn't make the final death knoll any less sad.....

Goodbye old friend

"Creativity is dead" by MMaestro · 2004-02-24 02:12 · Score: 3, Interesting

I agree, creativity is dead. Some people may think "oh well X game got Y features in its latest game." IMO thats not creativity, thats evolution. In another 5-10 years, unless we see some serious change, every game on the market not made by independent developers will be a rehash or a remake of another game.

Even things regarding a game's difficulty is being gutted. Whens the last time anyone here played the singleplayer mode of any game and actually had trouble with it?

Re:Damn it's true... by Jonah+Hex · 2004-02-24 02:53 · Score: 5, Informative

Some words from the UO Yahoo Group, slightly editted to cut out the crap /. didn't like... my thoughts follow...

Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:06:18 -0800 From: "Joshua Rowan" <joshua@stratics.com> Subject: Rumors of Origin Systems Shutting Down --- Rumors of Origin Systems Shutting Down --- Posted Monday, February 23, 2004, 12:50 PM EST by Joshua Rowan: Hail UO and UXO Fans, We are receiving information this morning indicating that something very serious may be hitting the news in the next few days (maybe as soon as today). So far, it is all unsubstantiated rumors, but with enough evidence behind them that we believe the information to be very close to the truth. For that reason, I am posting this to our news so that everyone can prepare for it in case it does come to pass..... With that said, the rumor is that Electronic Arts Corporate may be shutting down Origin Systems Inc (OSI, also known as EA Texas) and moving both the Ultima Online and the Ultima X: Odyssey projects to the California location. The hope is that as many current staffers (including dev teams) as possible will be relocated as well, but at this point we have no details on that. To say the least, our thoughts and hearts go out to the people that may be affected by this. So far, there has been no official comment from anyone at Electronic Arts or Origin Systems about this, but the second we do get it we will share it with all of you. Joshua Rowan UO Stratics Managing Editor http://uo.stratics.com

Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:51:01 -0800 From: "Joshua Rowan" <joshua@stratics.com> Subject: More Details about Latest CA Rumors More Details about Latest CA Rumors --- Posted Monday, February 23, 2004, 3:40 PM EST by Joshua Rowan: A bit more news to share with all of you about the latest rumors of UO and UXO being relocated to California and the Origin Systems Development Studio being shut down as a result. First, ( http://waterthread.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=1 774 ) Waterthread.org has posted some details based on a ( http://www.shermanventures.com/austinxl.html ) AustinXL News Mailing List that they belong to. As they explain, the following was posted to the newsletter today: QUOTE Electronic Art's Austin Unit Origin Systems to Shut Down Game company Electronic Art's is expected to tell it's Austin employees this week that the company will be shutting down Origin Systems, its Austin operations, according to sources. Employees will be offered an opportunity to relocate to California or accept a severance package. Company officials could not be reached for comment. Austin is the # 3 location in the U.S. for game development with more than 50 companies making major contributions to the game industry, including game development, publishing, tools and middleware and chips and hardware. In a related story about another Electronic Arts studio, Maxis (developers of The Sims line of games), Gamespot reported the following just last week, indicating that a consolidation of EA-owned studios may be becoming a trend. Here is what ( http://www.gamespot.com/all/news/news_6089213.h tml ) Gamespot's Article states: EA brings the Sims developers to its corporate headquarters. Today, sources at Electronic Arts confirmed what has been rumored for the past week: EA is folding Maxis into its central corporate offices. Currently, Maxis operates out of a now-cramped building in Walnut Creek, California. Their new digs will be in EA's Redwood Shores headquarters, some 30 miles to the east. "Maxis was running out of space at Walnut Creek," an EA spokesperson told GameSpot this morning. The current management team at Maxis, Luc Barthelet, Lucy Bradshaw, and Sinjin Bain, will relocate to Redwood Shores, as will most of Maxis' 300 staffers.

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Horror & SciFi Erotic Nudes

Story of a Game by stuffduff · 2004-02-24 03:07 · Score: 2, Insightful

In 1984 I took my son to see The Last Starfighter. A story about a boy who has a strange relationship with a computer game. In the movie, the game was a standard upright video game, like every other arcade game; except for it's graphics which were drawn by a Cray XMP-1 which was not actually released until the next year; and software by Gary Demos Digital Productions (check out that first image!) The graphics were beautiful, to say the least. And I longed to play that game.

In 1990 I was finally able to fulfill that longing in the rec room of the Tiger's Claw, where there was, you guessed it, a standup video arcade simulation. Before I ever flew a mission I got scores in the millions fighting wave after wave of Dralthi. From then until the fireworks at the end, I was totally absorbed in the world that was Wing Commander. For the next several years, every time an expansion came out I was there. Malcom McDowell, Mark Hammell, John Rheys-Daves and even Ginger Lynn Allen!

In 1996 Chris Roberts, the man behind the Eing Commander Universe left for two projects. One is Digital Anvil the other was an extension of the movie sequences.

When Wing Commander hit the big screen in 1999 Chris finally made it to the big screen himself as the pilot of the salvage ship that rescues 1st Lt Blair.

Chris went on to Freelancer and other games, and we've moved on as well. But Chris and the whole team at Origin will always be remembered as the ones who first brought true 3D space combat to a computer near us!

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"Can there be a Klein bottle that is an efficient and effective beer pitcher?"

Re:Ultima V Dungeon Siege Remake by Destoo · 2004-02-24 03:55 · Score: 2, Informative

For fan-based remakes of ultima, get neverwinter night!

We're in the process of rebuilding Zonker's adaptation of Ultima IV. We need more players!
We're missing a second DM and players for Dupre, Katrina, Jaana and Mariah.

Ultima Fans Allied on neverwinterconnections, an excellent site for player matchup and campaign management.

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Nouvelles de jeux et technologies en français. TC

Keep an eye on TKO Software after this... by Ayaress · 2004-02-24 04:43 · Score: 2, Informative

TKO recently bought up Asylumsoft, which already was comprised mostly of people who'd worked for Origin on the later-half of the good Ultima games (6 through 8, which wasn't all that great, but a lot better than 9), Wing Commander, and Crusader.

In addition to that, they've already scavenged a few Origin people before this happened, as well as picking up a couple Looking Glass developers. There's a rumor that they have a Black Isle guy, but he's been silent thus far, if he exists.

The whole plan is working towards developing Asylum's MMORPG, which is a lot like Ultima Online was before EA bought Origin and turned it into an EQ clone. I'm betting they'll try and pick up a few more Origin workers after this, which could be a good thing or a bad thing.

Re:This will NOT kill Ultima Online. by Golias · 2004-02-24 04:56 · Score: 2, Funny

Here's a quick tip for any fanboys awaiting sequels: The second they abandon the sequel number, expect the game to suck.

One notable exception: The follow-up to "Dead Or Alive 3" was named "Dead or Alive: eXtreme Beach Volleyball" and it was a masterpiece.

But then again, my opinion might be shaded by the fact that I'm a dirty old man.

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Information wants to be anthropomorphized.

Origin games from a different angle by NeoSkandranon · 2004-02-24 06:23 · Score: 2, Interesting

I never got into the Ultima series.

Crusader: No Remorse and No Regret however, were amazing. To this day I wish someone could figure out how to get them to run on WinXP systems (Installer refuses on non-win9x and no compatiblity didnt help) so i could spin through them again.

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If you can't see the value in jet powered ants you should turn in your nerd card. - Dunbal (464142)

Creativity is alive and well by Ondo · 2004-02-24 06:32 · Score: 2, Interesting

I agree, creativity is dead. Some people may think "oh well X game got Y features in its latest game." IMO thats not creativity, thats evolution. In another 5-10 years, unless we see some serious change, every game on the market not made by independent developers will be a rehash or a remake of another game.

That's silly. In the last several years we've got numerous creative games from major companies, and no reason to believe this will change. Animal Crossing, Dance Dance Revolution, Shenmue, Space Channel 5, Pikmin, and the Sims, off the top of my head.

Siege Perilous (re: Ultima Online like its 1999!) by tamnir · 2004-02-24 07:48 · Score: 2, Informative

To play Ultima Online the way it was supposed to be, you can play on the Siege Perilous shard. It is one of the official UO servers, but with a special "old-tyme" ruleset, designed for veteran players and to enhance player-to-player interaction. For example, no [Young] status, PvP fights are allowed everywhere (no Trammel), and vendors will not buy from players, making crafters having to directly interact with the fighting classes. Siege Perilous has a small but tight community, and there is material for everyone to enjoy, from the hardcore roleplayers, the assiduous crafters, and down to the berserk PvPers.

If you want to give Siege Perilous a try, I suggest you join NEW. It helps a lot until your character is strong enough to stand a chance on his own.

There is also a japanese equivalent of Siege Perilous: Mugen (page in Japanese).

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I code, therefore I am.

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Electronic Arts Shuts Down Origin Systems?

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