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Cobind Desktop Reviewed, With Interview
An anonymous reader writes "Cobind Desktop takes a remarkable turn from other Linux distributions by being one of the first to include Mozilla Firefox 0.8 and Mozilla Thunderbird in their first release. Though Cobind Desktop only uses XFce and not the more popular KDE, its entire design is based on a clutter-free workspace. Flexbeta.net took the time to write up a review and conduct an interview with David Watson, Co-Founder and President of Cobind Desktop. He mentions how the entire design concept of Cobind Desktop is based on a book called the Paradox of Choice, by Barry Schwartz, who is a professor at Swarthmore. David Watson believes that this concept can be applied to software design, and produce more usable products as a result." (We mentioned Schwartz's book earlier today.)
A third article on Paradox of Choice, and this is officially Google/Paradox of Choice Day on Slashdot. Perhaps an article on BOTH Google and Paradox of Choice would be a good one.
Seriously... So they included some new software. If you are into this, just run Debian Unstable.
To many choices make it harder to choose. So, introduce another choice.
There was a competition a year or so ago. Emacs won.
...chances are they're not going to be using IE anyway.
Hopefully this will encourage more people to move away from IE.
Only if these people were running IE on this Linux distribution. I don't think there are many people who will download and install a new distro because it has the latest, bestest browser.
Rock that crushes, Paper & Scissors that don't matter.
Wonderful. Another /. headline: "Combinddesktop uses XFce rather than the more popular KDE". Yet, of course, XFce uses gtk+, the screenshots ( http://cobind.com/desktop.html ) show firebird and GNOME/gtk+ apps.
Why would it? It's a linux distro. Most linux users already don't use IE.
The darkness... controls the music. The music... controls the soul.
XFce does look remarkably like XP, so a public computer running the software could certainly expose more people to alternative browsers without the fear of an unfamiliar operating system.
(They'll think they're in XP, so they probably won't panic.)
tasks(723) drafts(105) languages(484) examples(29106)
thousand of distro that have been around for a while. So much fanfare for a distro that was not even available for download yesterday, and SRPMS not available due to bandwidth limitations. (I wanted to test drive it after reading about it on distrowatch 03.26)
Suspicious, but then again, I might be paranoid.
It does look like it'd be a pretty slick Live CD distro (although I admit that I haven't tried it yet), so maybe that'll get some exposure. I know that a bunch of people here at my school have been exposed to linux via the liveCD idea (some of the helpdesk guys carry around knoppix or the like for quick diagnostics and file recovery). So maybe it'll get people to use firebird in that way - live CDs let people who don't use linux use linux. For about 2 months this year, i fooled around with knoppix and PCLinuxOS before finally installing a full HD-based distro.
because I am Stupid American
Most linux users already don't use IE.
I always never use IE.
What's the deal with the screenshots show off, where they show you how nice is gnome, gaim, firefox and openoffice? Shouldn't they show off what they actually wrote?
I've heard that, other than GCC, only Intel packs the required heat to forge the mighty kernel.
GCC hasn't had pre-compiled headers, which might or might not have any effect on kernel compilation, and also targets more platforms than one could shake a small forest at.
I wouldn't expect it to beat Visual C++ in a race, but that's like saying an M1 Abrams can't beat a Ford Escort in a drag race. If the idea of a cross-compiling suite of portable tools that you can crack open and freely do what you want with, and not have to pay the tax to the Malicious Satrap fails to grab you by the naughty bits, then, please, take the Ford.
here's a mirror: http://lm.pleaseeat.us/cobind_desktop_x86_0.1/iso/ desktop-0.1-disc1.iso
Umm, are you sure yuo're not thinking of XPde. XFCE is nothing like windows XP. XPde however is.
Since they are not a monopoly, their bundling is not illegal. It amazes me that people have problems with simple statements like "if you are a monopoly then ...".
The log in screen is somewhat confusing. You are asked to double click on the username, though when doing so, it results in clearing the log in box instead of placing your name. I had to actually click on the username several times before being prompted for what I believe was a password. Though I believe this is actually just a bug.
Well, if it's just a bug that must be OK, at least its not a feature.
How is this interesting?
Doh! You're right.
an ncurses interface *is* a GUI, it's got buttons, windows, etc. What he seems to mean is that it doesn't have gpm running during the install, nor does it use an X-window, directfb or similar program with the installer.
a non-gui interface would be one in which you use a command line and have to type all the arguements and paths there...
Actio personalis moritur cum persona. (Dead men don't sue)
Cobind Desktop takes a remarkable turn from other Linux distributions by being one of the first to include Mozilla Firefox 0.8 and Mozilla Thunderbird in their first release.
How is that remarkable? I'm sure if Firefox and Thunderbird were around when Slackware or Debian 1.0 were created they would have included them.
He mentions how the entire design concept of Cobind Desktop is based on a book called the Paradox of Choice
So this distro set's itself apart by including less packages, then allowing users to download any more that they want.
As far as i can tell from reading the article, it's based on fedora, but has less packages, and a few more bugs. It fits on one cd, and doesn't ask you to select packages.
I really don't see a niche for this distro. It seems like the bastard child of a Live CD and a full distro, not really doing either well.
What an uncreative troll.
Cobind doesn't own Mozilla, whereas Microsoft owns Internet Explorer and uses their desktop dominance to force the browser onto the ignorant masses.
Not a pretty site there. Something about the GNAA.
Surely you would want the best tool for the job, eh? If (and I said if) a commercial app gave you a superior result, wouldn't you go with that? Or would the OSS jihad insist that you work with an inferior tool?
It's like growing ALL your food instead of buying from a store.
OK, I'll respond to this outpouring of cranial rectalitis.
Bundling isn't the issue; it's the use of monopoly status to crush competition in the market that is the issue, booty-bowler.
Given your non-command of economics, recent history, and common sense, you probably thing BeelzeBill is your friend, asshat. To really just splice the living piss out of an infinitive, you, sir, are a moron.
Except the company/organization behind this isn't a monopoly. Monopolies are treated differently for good reasons. With the power of monopolies also comes the responsibility not to stifle competition.
Do you sometimes just not use IE, as a break from always never using it? Merely curious.
Dude, you have no clue. It is not illegal for any company to provide a complete browser/os/etc solution unless they are a monopoly and including a browser undercuts competition in a significant way because of the monopoly status of the company including the software (microsoft).
Before you start throwing around accusations of people being hypocrites, you should a least have some understanding of what you are talking about. Since MS does have a monopoly on the desktop, they are treated differently because they are in a position to entirely wipe out competition just by including a browser (or media player) even if their competition is better. There is no level playing field for browsers when ms is involved because their os is the playing field. That is why they must be artificially constrained in ways the other companies are not.
Get a clue, please.
This 0.1 version of the Cobind Desktop is an alpha release. That means that it has only been tested on a limited number of different hardware platforms and peripherals.
It seems there's a lot of "news" lately around software that's alpha and even pre-alpha. Maybe folks should remember that Linus never pushed Linux, it grew as small, incremental improvements were made.
It's easy to make a lot of noise about software you're going to write. It's a lot harder to be quiet and write software that will someday make a lot of noise.
Ruby on Rails Screencast
see first reply to previous thread, goober.
Who is this guy and why does he capitalize these words? Can I become President and Founder, too, just because I know how to recompile linux kernel and install KDE on top of it?
Two factors invalidate your claim:
Schwab
Blithely ignoring the Do Not Feed The Trolls sign
Editor, A1-AAA AmeriCaptions
Funny that I'm a member of the Western-Pennsylvania Linux Users Group (which serves Pittsburgh, PA... the home town of this distro), and this is the first I've heard of it.
Too bad they haven't been involved in the local *nix community so far as I can tell.
That should be:
Among the different desktops, KDE has to be the most cluttered ("featureful"), by design and by choice. Some people like that, I suppose, but XFCE is a reaction against that kind of approach to building desktop environments.
which means that some of us spend a lot of time figuring out what is meaningful difference and what isn't.
why does this make me think of the 2 party system?
Do you sometimes just not use IE, as a break from always never using it? Merely curious.
Yes, I never don't do that.
If you feel the evil Cobind is trying to commit acts of outgagious anti-competive acts in order to maintain their monopoly... then might I sugest you try a little known product from Microsoft called Windows.
Ask any structural or mechanical engineer. A unit is strongest when it composed of as little separate bolt-on items as possible.
Same goes with OSes. When an item is part and parcel with the whole, the entire product is stronger, and resists snapping. It can flex, and spring back.
Bolt-on methodology in software writing is flawed. The tenets apply, just like in metallurgy.
(This has been a Daily Show moment with your buddy, Tokerat)
CAn'T CompreHend SARcaSm?
Konqueror and Mozilla share the gecko rendering engine, which is a desperately needed step in the direction of the open source community focusing on depth, not breadth, in choices (applause).
They don't actually. Konqueror uses KHTML, which is a pretty nice HTML engine (Apple chose it over gecko for Safari). As both engines are very nice, I guess either the OSS community isn't taking desperately needed steps or we got enough people to work on a few implementations of things at the same time and make them good.
Having used both browsers extensively, I think the latter is true.
You can mod your friends, you can mod your nose, but you can't mod your friend's nose.
[100% ISO 646 Compliant]
SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.
uh Vector linux has been out much longer than this and its had Firebird AND its minimalist. Just cause the guys who made the distro didnt mention that damn book they dont get on the main ./ page. How moronic
Yes, I never don't do that.
wait, does that mean you always do that, and not just sometimes? so did you just reply yes, and then answer in the negative?
high-performance Linux platform designed with the average user in mind. Using XFce and Nautilus...
Nautilus being combined with the term "high-performance"? Are they on crack?! My experience with Nautilus is that it is anything but a performance application. I thought it performed worse than konqueror which is a beast as well. Both look great and are very versatile and useful. But they're pretty slow and unresponsive in general. Even if I call Nautilus with --nodesktop or whatever that switch was.
One alternative is a one-party system -- we all learned in school in the U.S. on how terrible the Soviet system was that they had only one party, and I grew up in Chicago, which with many other big cities really only had one party. Apart from the anti-Communist propaganda telling us how bad it is, what is does a political party even do when there is only one party? In Chicago, the one party was both a political party as well as a kind of social welfare system: kind of like Hamas.
In Soviet Russia (please, no "in Soviet Russia" jokes), I don't have any direct experience, but as far as I can tell it worked like some kinds of committee structures in an American university. The Party was not the government, it was not the military, it was not industry nor agriculture, and it was not a labor union, but it supervised all of those institutions to make sure that they were run according to "scientific socialist" principles. I imagine the Party was resented by people in government, military, industry, and other places just trying to do their jobs because it was a kind of oversight that a lot of people dedicated to their jobs could do without -- a lot like what takes place in universities.
The multi-party system, however, would have a Liberal Party, a Conservative Party, a Green Party, a Libertarian Party, a Labor Party, a Civil Rights Party, and so on. The problem with a multi-party system is forming a majority government -- think Israel where they have two major parties but they have to suck up to religious parties to form a government.
The two party system means that you stack the deck against minority parties to narrow it down to just two parties so one or other party is sure of having a governing majority. The two parties don't really offer much in the way of choice unless you think Coke and Pepsi represents choice. But on the other hand, the two parties compete for the center of the voting electorate, and the two parties act as critics of each other to expose gross wrong doing. Kerry and Bush are not really that different because they are all part of the same political culture, but they represent themselves as polar opposites to rally their respective core supporters, but they are careful to position themselves for the middle when they govern so having Kerry in office or Bush in office is not going to change all of that much. But that is the goal, to have a stable equalibrium of two parties competing for the center rather than the anarchy and travails of a multi-party democracy.
...you have one more choice: a distro with less choices.
And you wonder why sticking with XP for now seems like a sensible solution?
Information: "I want to be anthropomorphized"
I'd never really seen it before trying out the freesbie freebsd livecd. XFce combined with rox-filer for the desktop icons is a pretty slick combination.
One made out of a solid piece of metal, or one made out of 512 connected pieces? Which will impart the most prying pressure, before snapping?
Natch.
Let's see, a simple distribution that takes the most popular software and gives you that as a single choice. So instead of having Mozilla, Galeon, Konqueror, and such that I don't use, I have Firefox waiting for me. Same goes for Thunderbird.
...this is bad how? XFc3 + gDesklets makes for a very nice desktop.
Getting rid of the bloat of Gnome and KDE in favor of XFce4
So let's review here:
1 CD? check.
Basic software package? check.
Use yum to add whatever else I need? check.
Once Cobind gets a few more version updates under it's belt, I see it being very popular to those of us that prefer simplicity to the 4 CD monstrousity that is Fedora Core.
ce n'est pas un Sig.
Yes, multimedia is certainly something we'd like the desktop to do well. However, it's not realistic to expect comprehensive multimedia support from a Linux desktop today with open source software. It's a very difficult and costly problem to solve comprehensively. There are some positive signs, such as helix community, but you don't really have a single piece of software that does it all as well as the Windows variants.
Ummm...I'm not sure how to respond to this. How about mplayer? That has to be the best movie player I have ever used. And didn't it receive some sort of award recently? Or how about Xine?
Let's see...what else? The GStreamer framework is coming along nicely and will probably mature before the end of the year. There are several audio players available, some more usable than others, though. There are also more specialized programs like the Bedevilled Audio System. So I would hardly say linux is deficient in multimedia software.
On the one hand this doesn't sound like anything a seasoned linux user couldn't do for her/himself for free. I run icewm, some of what I think are the best apps, and only one app per function ( okay, I have 3 editors installed....but this is *linux* ). However for people who want to support OSS, try an alternative, don't have a lot of time for system futzing around, don't have a lot of tech knowledge, and don't like bloat this could be a nice solution. I see a similar niche for people who want to recycle old, small footprint hardware but don't have the expertise to make such systems work. If you don't know a lot about hardware/nix, don't have time to learn, or have higher priorties you are stuck with the bloat of the easier distros. Steve
Wow, that sure is revolutionary guys.
Lets take an already existing desktop, and include an already existing browser with an already existing mail package and an already existing file manager and call it our own. On top of that, lets not do any work beyond writing a few configuration files.
What an amazing innovation!
I hate windows. i use linux. but the distro i use right now is yoper cuz its got the least amount of bloat while still being a nice desktop (yes its pretty :)) this distro is great news to me cuz whenever i get a distro i remove all the other browsers (yeah all 12 of them) and put firefox on cuz it runs out of one directory. how simple is that. easy easy easy. i even use firefow when i'm in windows (which is rare, but provides with a consistant interface). i love KDE, but if can get all the prettyness of it without that damn Kruler, then count me in!
Do any distros support Centrino yet?
- One CD
- apt-get with pre-configured repositories
- multimedia (mplayer, xine, audacity, icecast, etc)
- gnome/xfce/blackbox
- galeon/mozilla
- peer-to-peer toys
- kickstart automajick installs
http://www.blagblagblag.orgWell, that is the whole point of a 2-party structure, that if you vote for a 3rd or 4th party (Green Party, Pat Buchanan Party), your vote isn't going to count for nothin' and you might get "the other guy" elected.
What you want is the multi-party system, your Greens would get their 3 percent of House seats, which might mean the Democrats could get the House back, but they would have to form a coalition with the Greens and anytime the Greens didn't like it that Tom Daschle voted for some logging deal because a union in his home state wanted the jobs, they would be in a snit and threaten to fracture the coalition.
Under the 2-party system, everytime some member of the coalition under the tent of a major party feels a minor slight, they tend to suck it up because they consider the opposition party to be far worse.
Under your multi-party system, think of what Jim Jeffords did to the Republicans by switching to "Independent" -- yeah, your Greens would get their 3 percent, but they would be pulling a Jeffords on the Democrats all the time instead of just sticking flyers on people's front doors.
The 2-party system is not meant to afford equal representation -- it is meant to provide stable government without being too stable in the manner of a 1-party system.
As the subject says...
Agreed. I might not run this on my desktop, but I'll for sure run it on my spare Celeron 333 with 8Mbs of video memory. Fast usability being the name of the game.
I'm running XFCE4 on it now, and coupled with Menu Maker, it's already a DRASTIC improvement over the lack of usability I was getting out of Gnome or KDE on FC1.
It might not fill a LOT of niches, but on that machine, it's perfect. I don't want to have to suffer with a source-based distro like Gentoo when I just really don't need the bloat of your typical modern distro.
-9mm-
Is it possible to metamoderate the moderation on (my) parent as redundant ?
#include "coucou.h"
Heres a torrent download:
. 1/ iso/desktop-0.1-disc1.iso.torrent
http://cobind.com/download/cobind_desktop_x86_0