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New Chips Enable 2.4 GHz Sensor Networks
mindless4210 writes "Oki announced today that the world's first fully compliant IEEE 802.15.4 and ZigBee chip has been developed. The technology promises to start a new generation of wireless sensor networks, utilizing the unlicensed 2.4 GHz spectrum. The new IC integrates the digital circuit-based MAC and PHY with the analog circuit-based RF onto a single chip. The company also developed a kit which enables fast production of sensor networks which could control air conditioning, lighting, fire alarm systems, and many other applications. The low power consumption of the chip enables multi-year operation with only dry-cell batteries."
The company also developed a kit which enables fast production of sensor networks which could control air conditioning, lighting, fire alarm systems, and many other applications. The low power consumption of the chip enables multi-year operation with only dry-cell batteries."
We have a motion sensor based security system here at home, and it goes off once a month when a spider finds its way into the body of the sensor. I'll stick with light switches thank you.
You'll have that sometimes...
In one way I'm scared for how this could be used to trample privacy rights, or abused in myriad ways. On the other hand, the implications for my home media, climate control, and the like is certainly enticing....
I guess it's just a matter of who makes it, and what it's made/marketed for....
Only the purest of souls seek enlightenment. Everyone else just wants power.
That's a good point.
And what the hell does PHY stand for?
Physical?
Whats really running thorugh people's minds is "does this mean that i'll have to upgrade my card if they upgrade their routers to continue stealing my internet from my neighbors?"
...if these will stall out at 2.4 GHz like Intel did.
BLING BLING. Meet the architecture that's changing everything.
The issue I have with slashdot is the degredation of quality of news posts and stories over the years. You used to come here and get insightful and important posts. Now half the stories seem to be based on tech news stories that are solely based on a companies press release.
What a nightmare that was. That crap only worked about 50% of the time... until my neighbor used their cordless phone, or my microwave ran, etc. etc. The ISP was continually tracking down sources of interferance, and installing new filters, amplifiers, etc.
I've now moved to a provider that uses (motorolla) equipment that runs in the 5GHz range. This stuff seems to work flawlessly.
Lots of companies have single-chip-2.4Ghz radio ICs. Like nvlsi.no or ChipCon. And NVLSI is better by a mile - quite literally a single chip 2.4GHz radio - make a sensor network in a few weeks .... if you find someone to help you solder the QFN pkg (goddamn SMD pkgs).Perhaps they bundle the ZigBee protocol within the IC ??
"...utilizing the unlicensed 2.4 GHz spectrum..."
Unlicensed? So basically if I use this device, the FCC could come knocking on my door?
-Imidazole2
I'm glad my WiFi network is 802.11a. If this goes into wide use there's going to be so much noise in 2.4Ghz that 2.4Ghz wireless is going to be really hard to continue using. (Heck, it already is)
As to the techno-babble, most 802.11a/b/g cards require a separate chip for the MAC (which handles the 802.11 level 2 protocol -- some chipsets do most of this on the host), the PHY (which handles the digital signal processing) and the RF section (which is black magic). Putting them all on one chip allows for smaller and hopefully less power-hungry devices.
Why can't we just have story moderation? Editors would simply approve/disprove stories for voting, obvious crap would get dumped, anything mildly interesting would get posted to the moderation page. logged in users would then have the opportunity to look through all the stories submitted (minus the total crap) if they wanted. People who only want to see the best would simply choose to only view the top X% of stories of the last X# of hours. It's not really that different than moderation and it'd be easy to implement.
I'd imagine some editors might not like it because it would reduce their ego, but it would make for a much better slashdot.
I can count to 1023 on my hands. Ask me about #132.
I had heard it used for Physical, but that doesn't seem to work in this article.
I'd just like to monitor temperature in my attic. I already have an ethernet network that I can plug into.
What's the cheapest way for a non-soldering guy to plug some cheap temperature sensors into an ethernet network, and monitor the sensors with debian (non-programming kinda guy also).
If the above can be answered, how about throwing in some info about switches that can be activated for turning fans on/off, or just turning an outlet on/off, which work off ethernet and can be monitored/controlled on debian?
I'm aware of the commercial remote appliances that can turn lights and other appliances on/off (can't think of the name right now). That's not what I'm looking for. Just some simple sensors and possibly controllers that plug into my ethernet network and are controlled/monitored from my computer, without commercial software.
People have trouble remembering to change the batteries in their smoke detectors now, imagine what will happen when their AC goes out because they forgot to put new batteries in it. :)
I hardly knew 'er!
I've been waiting for ZigBee hardware from Motorola for quite a while now. Several months ago, their web site proudly proclaimed that their HCS08 series chips would support ZigBee. I'm now using HCS08 chips, but all mention of ZigBee has since vanished from the product page.
Makes me wonder if there's some not-quite-working ZigBee RF hardware on the chip...
well.....
yes.
OSI layer 1. Physical link layer.
OSI Layer 2 is the media access control layer. ya'know. ethernet.
So this would be right for the "sensors in the woods" story from yestereday, right?/ 05/11/19 2235&mode=thread&tid=126&tid=158&tid=9 9
http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04
" The low power consumption of the chip enables multi-year operation with only dry-cell batteries."
great stuff... sounds more like Neal Stephenson's future than ever before.. now for the Feed.
I am a leaf on the wind
2.4ghz my nuts!
I've consulted the company and they have assured me that you will indeed be able to have 2.4ghz on your nuts with this chip.
-Jamon
I can count to 1023 on my hands. Ask me about #132.
That's called Kuro5hin.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
I agree...however we still come back...whyzzat ya think?
From what I understand, this is not really due to the spectrum itself, but the quality of components used when building the equipment such as your broadband modem. For example, a Microwave operates at 2ghz. If your hardware used cheap filters (like capacitors) when they contructed your device, these signals can interfere. If they spent the money up front on good components, they would not have this problem. It is really only a matter of a few cents when choosing components, but so many times - especially when dealing with the consumer market - there is price pressure on what the finished product has to cost. They shave in every area they can including the filters that make sure microwaves and cordless phones do not interfere. The same thing can happen at 5ghz as well if the hardware is not correctly specified.
News for nerds.....
Obviously not communications nerds....
A MAC layer in communications terminology is the digital protocalls involved with all the control functions, ergo, priority, identity, and similar.
A PHY layer is the "physical layer" that is the RF frequencies involved, the antenna, the RF bandwidth of the channel and similar.
802.15.4 is designed for really low duty cycle use. Turns on once in a while, does its thing briefly, and then turns off. Think thermostats without a wire connection, or a set of burgalar alarm sensors without wires back to the alarm system.
Because of the low duty cycle it lends itself to battery power pretty well.
The Zigbee alliance is here:
http://www.zigbee.org
And the IEEE standards committee behind this effort is here:
http://www.ieee802.org/15/pub/TG4.html
Actually getting the MAC and PHY layers (now that you know what they are...) onto a single chip is pretty good thing. Most groups split it into a big digital ASIC (the MAC layer) and then an RF front end chip (the PHY layer)
www.effectiveelectrons.com "chips that work" Analog, RF, Mixed Signal
I'd prefer a warning if your going to post a link like that. I thought I was going to hear what Drudge thought, not have to think about those pictures all night. Stop being an asshole. BTW, I don't look at the American war crime pictures either. I'll stick to porn.
Now we can do location and positioning with a potential high degree of acuracy.
like I noticed, tho, with my recent $20 purchase of the p5 glove, the technology may be there, but where are the applications? Aren't there developers out there, unemployed?
WiFiMaps.com is taking a stab at the location based computing, any interested developers out there?
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
The low power consumption of the chip enables multi-year operation with only dry-cell batteries.
Would it be possible, I wonder, to have solar-powered sensors, or even sensors powered by storing vibrational energy (for use in, say, air ducts)? Of course, sensors placed in easily accessible locations probably wouldn't benefit too much from never needing battery replacements. However, I can think of a few applications where you'd want to have a sensor in locations that are not readily accessible for maintenance. Perhaps even inserting the sensors during construction of the building, in locations that will be completely unaccessible once construction us complete.
Anyway, it's just a thought, and probably one that someone working on the project has already had.
woops...
I had actually been messing around with new sigs... thought I had put back my old one. guess I'll have to fix that
Casual Games/Downloads
The 2.4GHz band is unlicensed, so it's freely available for smallscale operators (individuals). Too available - it's getting crowded with different incompatible signals. The FCC uses licenses to prevent this problem, but they're too exclusive and expensive for the public to use. While the IETF uses published RFCs to allow interoperable systems, but that requires mutual compliance in unlimited signal spaces. It's obvious that radio developers won't comply with interoperability with existing signals in unlicensed bands: 2.4GHz is already the arena for conflicts among analog cordless phones, microwave ovens, WiFi, Bluetooth, and now Zigbee/802.15.4. Some central registry is necessary to resolve this situation. The FCC (and its foreign counterparts) would be the natural choice, if it weren't so obviously the slave to corporate interests at the expense of consumers - which is counter to the goal of resolving this problem with equal access to the spectrum intact. Where is the way out of this mess?
--
make install -not war
The new chip has several key bennefits, which include the use of synchronous serial interface when connecting to a host CPU, low-power consumption enabling long time operation with dry-cell batteries, and a 0.22 micron low-leakage process. The package is quite small at only 7x7(mm).
Just me or does this seem like the perfect chip for a subdermal implant. Seriosly, stick one of these babys next to a pacemaker and you can control your heartrate via the TCP/IP or encrypt the signal and have law enforcments firearms disable themselves in the hands of criminals (ala Judge Dredd ) Coupled with a proper set of sensors soldiers vital stats could be relayed to a central command unit without bulk transmiters, or just one transmitter ( Aliens (1986)
Maybe I shouldn't watch so many movies.
"It's all just meme meme around here"
Just what we need, more usage of the 2.4GHz spectrum, as if its not used enough. We need more unlicenced spectrum set aside for the ever increasing amount of wireless devices. 2.4 is pretty much saturated in most populated areas.
Now I can have fun remotely controlling my neighbor's air conditioner...
100
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I suggest you check out CocoonTech.com, it's a site dedicated to Home Autmation, Theaters and Security, This article got posted there this morning before it appeared on slashdot ;) Z-wave, which is 'similar' to ZigBee is one of the newer but fast growing protocols in the HA world. There have been many times where manufactures have said they have developped an x-10 killer protocol, but so far ZigBee & Z-wave seem to be ones of the few which might actually become widely accepted (or in some cases is being deployed already). Home Automation for the masses!
Make a subscriber-only service. That way Taco and friends have no excuse not to implement it.
In all probability, the only useful place for this is in amateur rocketry launching low-Earth Orbit (LEO) satellites with a life-expectancy long enough to make it worth the effort.
(Why probes? Because wireless can be lighter - no wiring - and doesn't tangle up so badly.)
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
Hell, I'll buy it if it allows me to control lightning. Start phoning in ultimatums... Pay me several million dollars or say goodbye to all your prescious broadcasting towers... Muwahahahaha
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
What about my post has anything to do with drugs?
I have an attic that was easily hitting 140 degrees last summer, with outside temperature in the high 90's. Due to poor design, or just old design, plus one of two vents being plugged up with insulation to prevent rain water from getting in, the current ventilation setup is not an option for continued use. The current top layer of roofing tiles have been layed over two older layers, most probably because the last roofer wanted to avoid an asbestos job for removing the old tiles. With temperatures hitting such an extreme, the roofing tiles aren't going to last the rated 20 years, they won't even last five years.
The cheapest option is going to be fan ventilation on the one small window. Since there are tenants on the second floor, I can't monitor the attic easily. The attic ladder opens into the tenant space. Instead of spending high hundreds to install an automatic fan that I still can't monitor, I'd like to throw a few sensors up there, plus an automated fan. Or just sensors, and I'll leave a fan running during high heat periods. And with a fan running, I'd like to have a smoke or fire detector hooked up as well.
I already have the smoke/heat detectors from an alarm setup. Or I can buy more.
Also, with high heat temperatures, the electric lines running in the attic get derated for amperage capacity very quickly. In an old house, that's a big problem. Further, in high heat, more current is drawn, for cooling, which makes the problem worse. My tenants have 4 air conditioners installed.
And as I stated, I have the ethernet installed already. It's there for reason. Future plans include a security camera setup with the camera server in the attic. I was only able to get one coax and one ethernet line installed, so I can't run multiple ethernet lines or coax from the attic. The coax is for the antenna. Two pairs of the ethernet are for voice for the tenants, the other two pairs are for fast ethernet. That's it. That's all that's available to me.
As for your joke or accusation, it's not funny. I have some friends that are dead & buried because of drugs. "Weed" was a contributing factor in one death in one case, and one injured friend that required the firemen to cut the roof of the car to get him out so they could perform cpr on him to save his life. He spent the next decade in and out of jail. It wouldn't surprise me if he's also dead now. And unfortunately, I have more cases of friends like this that I can cite.
Eventually, you grow up, and if you didn't come to the realization in grade school that drugs are a cop out and dead end, you hopefully realize it as you enter your adulthood.
Sure it will. It uses DSSS so the signal is spread across a wide range of frequencies. 802.15.4 was specifically designed to not be too harshly affected by the other wireless standards..
To my knowledge, there are A LOT MORE consumer devices that operatate at or near the 2.4GHz range as compared to devices that operate at or near 5GHz. Cordless phones are the perfect example. -- Thus, there is a lot more interference at the 2.4GHz range, and thus a lot harder for filters to actually do their job.
Hi. I'm your new neighbor and I've got a nifty new phone!
Who knows what the future holds, but I don't think interference will be too big of a problem. This is a low data rate technology and does emit too much RF. It's just for sensors.
My broadband is provided over 802.11b and I've never had any problems*. In fact, for $30 a month I get 2Mbps down and 256Kbps up!!
I guess maybe you were farther away from the station or didn't have as good of an antenna.
* Lightning hit the main transmitting station once and we were offline while all the equpment was replaced. But what can you do...
My other car is first.
chipcon has has a single chip zigbee transceiver for a while now (CC2420).
They claim "industry first"... maybe there was an earlier one still.
Please Mr Frederic Cee Cee (FCC for short)
Can we have another chunk of spectrum?
WiFi has changed how people use computers at work and at home. The experiment was a success. Can we have a bigger cup to sip from now?
This is not something that will be used from broadband access. It is a low data rate technology--it's for sensor networks.
Microwave ovens are at 2.4GHz, same as WiFi.
This isn't coincidence. The reason the 2.4GHz band was available for innovation is that regular spectrum users considered it unusable due to the industrial equipment operating there. It's called the ISM band, for Industrial, Scientific and Medical.
Microwave ovens are shielded for safety reasons but they start off ~20,000 times more powerful than a WiFi card. The noise is hard to filter because it's surprisingly broadband. The ultra-cheap power supplies drag the magnetron frequency up and down from resonance.
In general you're absolutely right, though. Most consumer RF equipment is too cheaply built to tolerate strong signals outside the intended operating frequency.
I done did my share of hot attic crawlin, and factory/shop ceiling and attic cable pullin... I also know there are a variety of "smart" automated homes websites out there.
Here ya go
Looks like a few possibilities on the first page there.
Also, there's low tech, ever see those roof turbines you can get? No motors, just vanes that spin, partially from wind, partially from just the heat wants to rise. Straight up is better than sideways for losing heat, all things else being equal. They work OK, put enough of them in, you'll get some exhaust action. What you have to remember though, is you not only want to exhaust heat, but you want to suck cooler air in somehow. If you go to a powered vent, perhaps pull the incoming air from the shadiest/coolest side of the house down close to the ground with some cheap ductwork.
Ya know what would be *nice*? One of those stirling motors using the waste heat to generate electricity. Maybe even stick all your apartments hot water heaters up there, zee-ro hot water energy bills for a lot of the year.
Sometimes in the summer it's wicked hot(aww heckk, it's already hit over 90 here in georgia, it's always hot in the summer), and I'm thinking "dang, wish there was way to store all this free heat up and use it next winter" and I'm thinking all this expensive high tech geothermal computerised doodads, then I get slapped back to reality and see the "stored solar" wood pile over by the well house, and go "yep, got it, check!"
Look at the Task Group's web page and note the security submissions from Certicom. In case you don't know, these are the mob who have extensive patents on elliptic-curve crypto. Guess what they are trying to push into the standard? Yet another standards body corrupted. Hopefully sanity will prevail and someone will force them to include RSA as another option.
This is probably the article someone in this thread made a reference to. Pretty neat
v en _art.htm
http://www.seattlerobotics.org/encoder/200006/o
Some of the tech that bluetooth was designed for and is now being use by 802.11 . Wide adoption was bluetooth failure and the ridiculous amount you need to pay for a bluetooth hardware and software development kit from Ericsson.
First of all Zigbee is no protocol for wireless sensor networks. The curently supported network topology is to inflexible and the maximum number of devices per subnet (255) is not nearly big enough that Zigbee is of much use for ambitious installations. There are better solutions for sensor nets and zigbees priorities lie in differentz directions than that.
Secondly neither 802.15.4 (The phy and mac layer) nor the Zigbee Protocol (network and app layers) are fully specified. The current specs lack important sections like flexible network topologies (currently only some kind of tree topology is supported), ad-hoc-networking, location of devivces and several other features which the Zigbee alliance proposed and announced but are not documented right now.
In its current form zigbee is not much more than some kind of "low power usb". You can network up to 255 devices with several kilobit/s datarate, but that is about all you can do. All the features that make up good sensor networks are either not yet specified or not even part of the proposed zigbee spec.
There are other and better suited projects for such applications and there are many other companies which have 2,4 GHz sulutions ready for at least to years now. Nordic VLSI for example with their nRF24E1 (www.nvlsi.no). Although in my opinion there are other frequency-bands better suited than 2,4 GHz. It might be licence-free but is much to crowded to be of good use. Because of that many companies also offer 868/422 MHz solutions.
These solutions might lack the zigbee ready logo, but there are numerous other projects which are in my opinion better suited for sensor networks. The most popular being at the moment tinyos (http://webs.cs.berkeley.edu/tos/) an open source os for sensor networks with an extensive library of protocol modules to use fpr your own sensor application. You can even download circuit plans for your own custom design.
Jeff
From a health-perspective ... 2.4Ghz is the "resonant" frequency of water (that's why this frequency is also used in microwave ovens). Since the human body consists of mainly water ... isn't it a better idea perhaps to use a slightly different frequency?
If Pandora's box is destined to be opened, *I* want to be the one to open it.
DVD+RW,-RW,-R,+R,DL,R,ROM ??!
802.11b,b+,g,a,bluetooth(+IEEE ver),firewireless(+IEEE ver),zigbee(+IEEE ver),3g(CDMA? UMTS?),
will some people just design simple, interoperable and scalable standards and reduce the level of fragmentation?
ZigBee sounds great, but will it survive?
Maybe I should get some of my swimmers frozen just in case I'm wrong?