Slashdot Mirror
Our Friend, The Meter
dbirchall writes "Upon hearing that SpaceShipOne reached 100km today, I did some hasty math based on the altitude in feet sttated by Scaled Composites in their press release, and was surprised to come up with a number under 100,000 meters. Fortunately, a friend pointed out that my inches-to-meters conversion was flawed. Some quick Googling determined that lots of people still have no idea how many inches are in a meter, even after some folks have had big problems because of conversion errors."
Why should I care how many inches are there in a metre (meter for some of you people). Everywhere I go today everything I see is in metric. Whoever uses inches anywa.... oh. *those* people. *sigh*
Maybe it's the time for the US to join the metric world. At least we wouldn't loose that Mars probe!
1 inch = 2.54 centimeters
It's fairly easy to remember, and everything else regarding length conversions can be derived from it. It also happens to be the official definition of the inch, since NIST uses metric internally.
No compelling reason to change. Same reason why we don't use 220 volts as wall current.
All employees must wash hands before seeking equitable relief.
It's just that everyone knows the standard/imperial/whateveritscalled units already. They're familiar and they work and we understand what it means when someone says it's 85 degrees in New York today. Switching over means everybody has to learn what everything means, intuitively, all over again. That's a long process that nobody wants to go through.
For you metric-using folks, think of it this way: you still use weird old fashioned seconds/minutes/hours. You know that 4:45 is almost 5 o'clock and your commute will take 20 minutes. Without thinking about it you know that you'll be home eating your microwaved dinner in 50 minutes, a little less than an hour, and you can leave that candy bar in your desk drawer for tomorrow.
Now suppose some aliens came down and gave us metric time units. 100 centihors in an hor, 10 hors in a day. Oh, and keep in mind that's a galactic standard day, which is actually 1.3 earth days. Now you have to start using these units. What time is your appointment? Oh, it's at 4:87. How long does it take to get to there from here? About 25 centihors. What?
It's practically meaningless, because you haven't developed a frame of reference. You'd have to convert it mentally until you got familiar enough with the new units to just 'know' what 4:87 means, and nobody voluntarily wants to bother.
Do you really think that our mind is naturally suited to 3s and 4s? Are you closed to the idea that it could be a much more complex source of interactions in your life that trained your mind to work that way?
.. etc. It's all socially constructed. Those numbers aren't inherently evil or more useful for one purpose or another, it's totally social pressure. Ditto for your ability to work with 3s and 4s in your head. Good on you, but it's hardly a firm basis for such a wide-ranging generalization.
Did you ever think that if you grew up in a metric environment, you'd have as much of a troubled time thinking in imperial? The website you linked to didn't think that. After all, naturally you'd be more adept at doing 3 and 3 times stuff in your head if you'd been doing it for all your unit conversion in your life! I've been doing metric in my head, as Canada is not silly like the brits (a brit whose site you link to) who don't sell things by the litre, or measure by the kilometre, or use kilograms as their unit of mass. British people are metric in name only: underneath, the sickening heart of ugly imperial units beats away.
Converting non-metric units in my head is hard, and I usually end up likening it to the ratio out of 10 because that's how I grew up. 5/16ths? Thas' really close to 4/16ths, which is 1/4th which is a weensy bit more than 0.25, so this must be smaller than the 1/2th one which is really 0.50. I don't convert the 16ths and 2ths to a base denominator, I convert them in terms of a 0 to 1.
The kooky site you link to is all about how counting in base-12 is the way to go. I mean, you can take a step back to the way Germanic tribes did it, but I think base-10 is the way to go. Metric's just an outgrowth of it. Imperial units were an outgrowth of kooky base-12 that was used by Germanic tribes -- it's why English uses eleven and twelve instead of oneteen and twoteen. Japanese people don't have this problem -- the go ju-ich, ju-ni, ju-san. Their problem is about 4s and 7s and 9s. Yon or shi? Shi means death! Shichi or nana? Nana is usually used for numbers only. Ku or kyu?
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
This advantage is real, but it's in no way enough to even begin to compensate for all the other advantages of metric.
I could give a long list of advantages, but instead I'll say this;
To accelerate 1kg by 1m/s you need a force of 1N. If you push with a force of 1N over a distance of 1m you've used 1joule. If you did this in 1s then your power is 1watt. If you prefer to have an electric motor doing this work for you, it can produce this 1watt by drawing, for example, 1A at 1V. For 1A to flow at a volate of 1V, this means your motor will have an internal resistance equal to 1ohm
Now you repeat that, in imperial units.
To accelerate 1kg by 1m/s you need a force of 1N. If you push with a force of 1N over a distance of 1m you've used 1joule. If you did this in 1s then your power is 1watt. If you prefer to have an electric motor doing this work for you, it can produce this 1watt by drawing, for example, 1A at 1V. For 1A to flow at a volate of 1V, this means your motor will have an internal resistance equal to 1ohm
Right. Which shows that for science and engineering, metric is the way to go. Jumping from that to saying we need to fuck up our road system and grocery stores is a bit of a leap, though.
Google confirms: Ruby is the world's most beloved programm
Kiwaiti
Member of the Legion Of Microsoft Haters
I think I can put a spin on this, though, like so:
"Why yes, I did learn in 2004 that I had been operating with an incorrect conversion factor for going from inches to meters. At that time I researched the extent of use of such incorrect factors, made public my findings, and of course corrected my own notes so as to avoid error in any further calculations.
"By the way, Mr. $BOSSNAME, I notice that $COMPANY's web site currently states that a meter is $INCORRECTNUM inches..."
Shouldn't be a problem at all, you see? And if that doesn't work, I can always say, "Look, at least I've realized I was wrong and found the right answer, unlike these teachers, professors, rocket scientists, engineers..." :)
Good for you. (No sarcasm intended.) But in my personal experience, admitting errors never evokes respect (no matter what your Sunday School teacher might have told you) and pointing out mistakes your boss has made is a mark against you, the more so if it's of the "potatoe" style obvious-to-a-schoolchild one.
To me, metric is much, much easier to work with since everything is in powers of 10. And it's a lot easier to keep track of what a milli-, centi-, deca- and kilometre is, compared to 1/32s, inches, yards and miles.
Metric is better for large-magnitude and small-magnitude measurements, also for converting between magnitudes (lop off or add 0's). Imperial, however, is better for medium-magnitude measurements and conversions that stay within one level of magnitude. Which is why I used meters and liters for physics homework, but I will always use miles on the highway and gallons in the kitchen.
This has nothing to do with culture. Mathematically, the funny multiples that Imperial measures work in makes it easy to divide without remainders. Likewise, using base-10 for number and measures makes it easy to scale up and down. The idea that the government should force us to choose one or the other for all uses is insane and illiberal.
Google confirms: Ruby is the world's most beloved programm
Obviously you would find it difficult to use metric if all the products you are using are made with imperial measurements that are "nice" numbers. Just bear in mind that other peoples products come with "nice" metric measurements.
Also, I prefer metric becasue I was born after it was adopted and it's all I know, certainly. But it does seem that if everything is ten more than the previous level it's a lot more consistent than imperial where the number of x's in y differs depending on what type of measurement you're talking about.
Daar is nie 'n lepel nie
every time somebody makes an argument against the metric system, they are essentially also making that same argument agaisnt the arabic (our) number system. to use a number system with a base of 10 and not use units with a base of 10 is illogical, and impractical where units with a base of 10 are much easier to manipulate using a number system with a base of 10.
Amazingly, you're speaking and writing English. So use the logically correct spelling, or change the way you pronounce it to match how you spell it. You fucking idiot.
I, for won, am exited tu help yu re-rite Inglish literachure, in yore new language. "The Nites Of The Round Tabel" iz so much better than chainjing the pronunsiashun tu "the kuh-nig-hets of the raund tahbluh"
How 'bout we all just calm down and realise that no matter how much you rant about one retarded system being better than another retarded system, English simply has fucked up spelling and that's that?
If you truly do feel passionately that meter is better than metre, then please "use your fucking brain" and start spelling table in a way that's consistent with label (as English and Americans alike pronounce it).
On the topic of units of measurement, please feel free to explain why this "pint" unit is still spelled like mint, hint, dint, lint, tint, vint, glint and any other word ending in 'int'. Yes indeed, the Americans have certainly got this spelling thing all worked out once and for all. Pity the rest of us haven't picked up the fantastic system work they've done.
...my Honda is metric, and I have a set of metric tools to deal with that.
...but again, it's lack of necessity. Lumber here is generally sold in "standard" units: an 8-foot 2x4 for example. It's an unnecessary difficulty to just decide to use metric units, when much of what you work with is non-metric. At that point it just adds an unnecessary (and potentially inaccurate or error-prone) conversion.
:)
I personally grew up working on American cars (GM, Ford, Dodge) and using the "standard" measurement system exclusively. As I got into engineering-related areas, I've found it necessary to learn the Metric system, and the appropriate conversions.
As well, I've gotten to like foreign cars (Toyota specifically -- you can't kill them!), and I think you'll find most auto mechanics -- and I am not one -- easily capable of converting millimeters to fractions of an inch. Regardless of their normal mathematical skills, by association and eventual familiarity, these things are easily picked up. Not to mention, most American cars I've worked on recently seem to use either all metric or -- worse -- a combination of standards (too often the engine is Japanese while the rest is American...)
But the point of that was that the conversions aren't difficult, and (despite what many non-US people tend to imply) Americans are perfectly capable of learning to convert, or learning a new system of measurement.
It's not lack of intelligence or lack of will, but lack of necessity, that keeps most US citizens from converting. We all realize that 100 km == 60 miles, if only because of the jokes commedians make about driving into Canada and seeing a speed limit sign of 100. Plus most cars sold here display speed in both measurements, though admittedly the km portion is usually much less prominant...
Granted, if the US government mandates the use of metric units, we'd have the necessary push. However, I suspect many would oppose a conversion being required by law in this country if it isn't shown to be absolutely necessary.
In the public (non-government) area, it becomes a "chicken vs egg" scenerio. No lumber yard is going to sell lumber measured exclusively in metric units, and no building contractor is going to ask for several 79mm X 157mm X 244cm boards to build a wall when 2x4x8' is the standard of measurement here in the US for such materials (I'm not sure my conversions were correct there btw).
Anyway, it's not a stupidity or laziness factor as many non-US people assume, rather it's that our current system is very much established and ingrained into our society that it's difficult to change without making laws to require the change, which most citizens would disagree is all that necessary. In engineering fields, it's a different story, and if you're an engineer you likely should know both systems (since you will likely deal with both). Even in electronics, some standard measurements are in "mils" (thousandths of an inch) while others are in millimeters...
Anyway I'm just ranting because I'm still awake for some odd reason.
BTW, this was not directed at the parent; the Honda/metric comment just inspired me to rant for a bit
NGWave - Fast Sound Editor for Windows
Uh... I'm all for metric, but your "example" is hardly an argument for metric. All of those 1s line up so nicely, because you're using units that are _by definition_ a 1:1:1 relationship. Imperial units would look just as clean, using ft, ft/s, ft/lb, etc. And of course, natural constants like pi, c, or G, look ugly no matter the unit.
the ten base system of our numerical system has no real place in the natural world
You mean besides the 10 fingers you mentioned? Anyway, please tell us where the base 12 can be found in nature.
:w!q
The only appropriate base system for units of measure is that of the number system they will be used in.
We work in decimal - base 10.
You arguments are a red herring, they are arguments for us adopt a number system that is base 12 system (which incidently, imperial is not) over the base 10 one we use at the moment, not arguments to have your metrics in a different base to the one they are used in.
In the computer world we work in binary instead of decimal, and relevent computer metrics are base 2 rather than base 10 because of this. Having 12 bits in a byte, 3 bytes in a word and 1760 words in a kb (or whatever) would just be daft, exactly as daft as the imperial system infact.
Also, using an imperial measure of angles to justify the imperial system is a bit circular.
I think you mean "car" rather than "auto" ;)
Not to put too much of a point on it, but the rest of the planet doesn't have to give a damn about how many inches there are in a meter, because they don't have inches anymore. Or stones. Or bushles. Or cubits. Or zentner. Or... This is a Yanks-only problem: even the Brits can think in meters, their problem is that they can't spell the word right.
You have two choices, my fellow American friend: Either convert to metric like the rest of the world in the 21th Century, or stop complaining.
As great as Slashdot is, this U.S. bias is getting to be a pain in the ass. It is beyond me why a simple complaint about the known problems of math education in the U.S. makes the front page.
They're not ENGLISH units, they're IMPERIAL units. Not only do you provincial fucknuts not understand metric units, you don't even know the name of the units that you use!
If we ever learn Planck units are slightly different than our beliefs now, we'd end up in quite a mess.
Someone set us up the bomb, so shine we are!
Or Deutschland into Germany? Or España into Spain? And what about la Suisse, I mean Schweiz, I mean Svizzera...
And don't worry, to people in Bordeaux, the capital of l'Angleterre is Londres, not London. <g>
cheers...ank
Still hoping for Gentle Treatment...
Mass doesn't ever change because of temperature or pressure or stuff like that
This is a true statement. However, what I wrote was
Thus for a fixed volume, so does mass.
As heat is applied (generally) the mass will expand, so if you are looking in a fixed volume container, there will be less of the substance in that original volume (original container, if you will) thus the amount of "stuff" in that container changes, thus does it's mass.
Rhymes that keep their secrets will unfold behind the clouds.There upon the rainbow is the answer to a neverending story
Suppose I do want to know how heavy a liter of petrol is. I look up the density of petrol in a book someplace, low and behold it's given in gm/cc. Now
gm/cc is the same as kg/liter. I've got my answer.
Now how much would a gallon of the stuff weigh. Being that the density is given in reference using the metric units (gm/cc) I'll have do do a conversion. After about 10 minutes of thinking, and knowing a gallon of water (density 1 gm/cc) weighs about 8.3 pounds, I multiply the density by 8.3 to get the weight of a gallon of the substance. Not too bad, I guess, but not as straightforward as the metric system.
Metric is more than just units and a self consistent system. It is also consistent with the fact that our numeral system is base 10.
Until the american stock exchanges converted to decimal, it was not immediate how $8 37/256 was comparable to $8 9/64.
So things are improving
The correct measure of a meter in inches has many more than four digits, but 39.37 is correct when rounding to four significant digits. Likewise, 39.4 is correct when rounding to three, and 40 is correct when rounding to two or one.
/.'ers will mod up any reference to Douglas Adams.
And although it has nothing to do with rounding, 42 is also correct when you're a karma whore who thinks