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Progeny Releases Beta 1 of Progeny Debian 2.0
Jeff Licquia writes "We just released the first beta of Progeny Debian 2.0, Developer Edition. This is intended to be a showcase of our Componentized Linux project for building customized Linux distributions, something that's been talked about here before. We'd really like people to give this a whirl and report any problems they have. For more information, Progeny's Platform site has the details."
There don't seem to be any torrents or mirrors for this stuff, alas.
Some useful information from the site regarding what this Componentized Linux is:
http://platform.progeny.com/archives/000011.html
Toward a new kind of "Linux distribution"
There's no denying that "Linux distributions" have played a central role--arguably the central role--in the evolution of Linux from hobby project to mainstream technology.
However, even as Slackware, Red Hat, and other distributions became "Linux" to millions of users, one inescapable fact remained: that unlike their proprietary OS cousins, which contain technologies developed (or licensed) by a single organization to fit into a single, integrated product, Linux distributions are merely convenient packaging around a loosely knit collection of thousands of independently developed technologies.
Even today, Linux distributions continue to be developed from the top down as monolithic wholes, as opposed to bottom up as collections of piece-parts, a model that would be a much better fit with the nature of every distribution's (common!) constituent elements. Even newer distributions built by seasoned veterans have tended to follow the top-down model (and, I would argue, to their detriment)--I'm thinking here of Red Hat's Fedora (which, although called "Fedora Core", hardly seems a "core" at all, weighing in at 3 CDs) and Bruce Perens' UserLinux (which appears mired in endless discussions about which technologies should be included and which shouldn't, with predictable results).
For the commercial Linux-as-product distributors, it is a sensible strategy to portray their distributions as monolithic wholes, as this allows them to position the distributions as platforms unto themselves and, thus, pursue traditional OS business models based on locking users in to a platform (I've argued before this will be a losing strategy in the long run, but that's another topic).
However, for those who view Linux not as a product but as a platform on which to build their own products, the monolithic nature of the typical distribution is a particularly bad fit. The typical Linux-as-product distribution optimizes for breadth--because it is "one-size-fits-all", it needs to include a huge assortment of features and technologies to satisfy the widest possible audience, only a few of which may be important to any given project (and the few that are important will always vary). Ideally, for Linux-as-platform users, a distribution should optimize for depth, i.e., to excel in those few features and technologies important to the project at hand.
To allow optimization for depth, a new kind of distribution is needed--a componentized distribution from which users may build platforms from the bottom up, including only the features and technologies their products require. Progeny is building such a distribution, which we call (cleverly enough) componentized Linux. Furthermore, we are building it in the open as a community project in the hopes that others will be intrigued with the concept, collaborate with us on the component infrastructure and underlying open-source technologies (Anaconda, APT, etc.) and ultimately build their own components too.
If this sounds a lot like Debian, that's because it is in many ways: the end result is more of a collection of software than a distribution, and we hope the open development process ends up fostering the same kind of inextricable developer community that has sprung up around Debian. Importantly, the componentized Linux is a layer above an existing distribution--or, more properly, above an existing collection of packages. Our components are currently based on Debian sarge, and we are planning to support Fedora-based components as well in time. Our LSB 1.3-certified core runtime is available today. More components and a component-aware, Anaconda-based installation mechanism will be added in the coming weeks.
Posted by Ian Murdock | Permalink | 2004-01-26 16:10:00
And the release
This flies in the face of science.
Didn't they already try something like this? Or is this just the installer?
Whoever gets this downloaded should set up a torrent and submit it to suprnova.org
M$ Lawyer: But `gcc
To allow optimization for depth, a new kind of distribution is needed--a componentized distribution from which users may build platforms from the bottom up, including only the features and technologies their products require.
But isnt this one of the key ideas behind Gentoo? Either way I think I'll have to check this out more. Good to see more of this over the "just bundle everything with an i386 build" approach.
StrategyTalk.com, PC Game Forums
Haven't gotten through the article yet, but does this concept of modularized linux distro's include the notion of doing it across any kernel-supported arch?
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
apt-get it?
A computer makes it possible to do, in half an hour, tasks which were completely unnecessary to do before.
Someone mentioned that there is no torrent or download link. A very cursory examination of their website reveals an HTTP download location:
8 6/ 20040710/
http://archive.progeny.com/progeny/linux/iso-i3
Come one people, RTFA.
Ads? What ads?
forty rabid /.ers all claiming that this redundant in a world that contains Gentoo ...
"The dew has clearly fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning"
"Fedora Core 3 Test 1 Released" goes in the developers section, but "Progeny Releases Beta 1 of Progeny Debian" a "developers edition" doesn't show up there. I really have to stop trying to understand /.
"Componentized"??? - IMHO that's an anglobstipation excessively gratuitous even for you transatlanticated verbalizators. '-)
It doesn't appear they have any useful documentation on their site, only market speak.
You had me at "dicks fuck assholes".
There is also Rocklinux.
---- MISSING MISCELLANEOUS DATA SEGMENT --- [sigdash] trolololol
Now if only there's a straightforward way to share your customized distro with other people; as in, I make a distro that runs on some embedded processor, say a 486 clone, that a ton of people use. Is there an easy way for me to simply share my configuration with other people in the same community?
It seems like if this is done right, you could create automagically updating distrubtions easily enough that 'customer bases' even in the 100s or 1000s can simply support themselves.
----------------
Freedom or Evil: www.freevil.net
GWB says, "You decide!"
OTOH, here's an article from 4 years ago about Progeny. It looks like the vision was the same then, but they haven't gotten very far.
This could be useful for Universities or companies wanting to manage their own customized distributions. I know my lab would certainly appreciate the ability to customize our linux installations heavily and make those customizations manageable across several machines.
This could also be handy for groups wanting to build custom hardware solutions.
How do the Progeny components differ from the standard Debian metapackages?
"I may not have morals, but I have standards."
... they elected the verbalizator governor of kaliforny!
On the other hand, I think LSB really misses the target. Early versions required X11 to be installed! LSB 2.0 specifies RPM as the packaging system. I think it's pretty clear that this specification is tracking Debian/Progeny/Componentized Linux, and is hence no standard.
Rather than challenge distribution makers to come up with business models that better match open source processes, I would instead challenge sysadmins to quit drinking from the commercial distribution teat. Take a dip into Linux From Scratch, learn what little work there is in building a stable core yourself, and enjoy the freedom of knowing what you're doing.
:w
The platform.progeny site just mentions an alpha 1 release, that's been out for a while.
Is there a newer release out?
Last i heard they gave up and took their toys back home...When did they return?
---- Booth was a patriot ----
That is truly cool. Somebody mod this chap up! Gentoo's lack of a swanky installer is probably the only thing stopping new users from trying it. :-)
Karma: It's all a bunch of tree-huggin' hippy crap!
Are they back in the business of making Linux distributions? I thought that Progeny 1.0 was going to be their first and the last release.
IIRC, the Anaconda installer used in Progeny only supports i386. But I might be wrong.
"Oh, a lesson in not changing history from Mr I'm-my-own-Grandpa." - Dr Hubert Farnsworth
Come on (not one) people, LHTMFL (learn how to make links).
You gotta love those open source developers. Why work together on one project, and make some real progress, when you can fork off a dozen independent projects who work on the same thing, just for personal glory and your name in the release notes ? Lets reinvent the wheel ten more times and make yet another Debian !
Is this componentized packages similar to apples approach to installing application on there os? i.e all the components for the application to work in Mac OS x is all contained in a folder like executable? Is my understanding correct? Garrett
On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 11:24:58 -0500, Jeff Licquia wrote: > On Wed, 2004-07-14 at 11:09, Shimon wrote: > > i have ask on slashdot, look your site inside out... i dont see any > > where, where it says the list of apps. > > Sorry about that. We will look into posting a component list. In the > meantime, you can get a list of components here: > > http://archive.progeny.com/progeny/linux/debian/di sts/cl/
>
> Some of those components may not be on the CD, however; we're still
> finalizing the list of components we'll be shipping in the final
> release.
>
> > ps i looked on distrowatch they have of aphla 1 still you might want
> > to update with them too.
>
> We did let them know; hopefully, they'll update soon.
>
>
thats the email