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Classroom Bullies On The Internet

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the lord-of-the-flies dept.

peter303 writes "Oldtimers are familiar with sociopaths in usenet newsgroups and chat rooms. The NY Times has an article about grade school kids who bully on the Internet. These include message bombing and slanderous web pages. The web allows one to extend bad manners from real life."

27 of 599 comments (clear)

  1. Different From The Old Days by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Funny
    Size doesn't matter on the internet. Physical bulk is only good for slamming a fist down on the keyboard in frustration. Numbers help, if you're trying to spam or text message someone (but only those clever enough can get away with it with anonymity. If you're the skinny little runt or the ugly kid always picked on, the internet can even the odds in harrassing back. Best not to pick fights with girls, either, as they fight meaner than boys.

    Haven't seen it yet, but will probably at some point, the following bumpersticker phrase:

    my k1d 0wns y0ur k1d'5 c0mput3r
    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    1. Re:Different From The Old Days by eln · · Score: 5, Funny

      I do believe you'd get your ass kicked for having a bumper sticker like that.

      So is this the reason why people seem to be so much more rude on the Internet? Is it geeks getting out their pent-up aggression from being picked on all the time in the real world? Is it people taking their anger at that asshole who cut them off on the way to work out on the faceless masses on the Internet?

      Besides, if you believe that size doesn't matter on the Internet, you clearly haven't been getting the same kind of email I've been getting.

    2. Re:Different From The Old Days by Mr.+Bad+Example · · Score: 5, Insightful

      > So is this the reason why people seem to be so much more rude on the Internet?

      I think it's mostly that people don't have to deal with real-world consequences. You can say things in text to people that would get your face beaten in if you said them in person.

    3. Re:Different From The Old Days by Trigun · · Score: 5, Funny

      Oh fuck off. Like that happens. If I ever run into you on the street, I'm going to make you eat those words.

    4. Re:Different From The Old Days by bigbigbison · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So is this the reason why people seem to be so much more rude on the Internet?

      I was going to make the joke about only a moron would ask such a stupid question, but I see people beat me to it.

      However, there are a couple reasons why people can be rude on the internet. One is, as others have emtnioned, the anonymity. If you piss people off, you can just go somewhere else. And you can have fun annoying strangers.

      That mainly applies to trolls. But another reaosn why flame wars erupts so easilly is that people are usually at a website or a chat room because of the topic more than the people. Therefore, people are generally interested in information and that mutual interest in technology, or whatever, is the reason they are on the same site, rather than friendship.

      Finally, there is also the fact that a lot of people have poor communication skills and don't put their message across as well and because text is much more limited than face to face communication, subtlties are often lost.

      --
      http://www.popularculturegaming.com -- my blog about the culture of videogame players
    5. Re:Different From The Old Days by wolenczak · · Score: 5, Interesting

      While in highschool back in 1995 a kid was spoofing my account and abusing some root exploits, it was a VT100 console, by that time every computer at the lab had an static IP address that matched a number written on sticker in the screen. Got his IP address, took a look at who was at the computer, and literaly I walk towards him, grabbed him from the neck and kicked his ass out of the lab.

      I was prohibited to enter the lab for the rest of the term, but he was kicked out of school.

    6. Re:Different From The Old Days by blackmonday · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Isn't it the same inside a car? It always surprises me how people drive like rude asses, then step out of their car and become normal friendly people again. I'm a nice guy on the road, but it's happened more than once that someone I recognize cuts me off or drives rudely around me - then they recognize me and their face changes. An ashamed smile adorns their face. Strange, I always wanted to see studies on that.

    7. Re:Different From The Old Days by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      A little twist here...

      I was prohibited to enter the lab for the rest of the term, but he was kicked out of school.

      Basically, the kid doing the hacking got no punshment but the violence (you) was dealt with harshly.

      I see the same exact thing with my kids in school. My kids get picked on (as do many other kids). Some examples.. some kids forcably took my sons MP3 player from him and would not give it back, eventually they did but the headphones were broke. They took his shoe and pulled the laces out, stuck gum in his hair etc... For a 12 year old, that type of abuse is hard to handle. He refused to get up in the morning, did not want to go to school, claimed he was sick etc.. After numerous attempts of my trying to deal with the situation in a logical and mature manner by dealing with the guidance office abd principal, absolutely nothing had changed. Finally at a conference with the prinicipal and my son, I told my son to get out of his seat from the bus, calmly walk up to the offender and punch the SOB right in the face as hard as he could and if the kid got up, do it again in the stomache or in the nuts by any means possible. I had to resort to barbaric fighting to solve my sons emotional stress. The principal bluntly stated that he was going to put that in his record that I stated that and if anything like that happened, my son would be immediately expelled and charged. Funny how the school can allow and do nothing about any amount of mental abuse but physical abuse is dealt with immediately. I do not really know how they can deal with mental abuse issues but neither did they. After attempting to resolve the situation I finally provided my own a method that I know would work. The confidence he gained from that talk and further talks about the subject allowed him to stand up to the groups of kids without actually having to "fight" it out.

      I'm sure many here will never agree to fighting and honestly I do not either but I can tell you the mental abuse a picked on child and their parents have to deal with is 1000x worse then a bully with a bloody nose. It is far better to snap early and use fists then to wait and bottle up the pain until they do something far worse. Too bad the school system does not think that way and could not provide any guidance.

    8. Re:Different From The Old Days by affreca101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Or it trains you to have a thick skin. Thankfully, I am a girl, so escaped most of the physical abuse in middle school, but as a unashamed nerd, I had plenty harassment. I found that nothing offends me now. You can tell me I'm ugly, people hate me, I'm weak.. and I don't care. A "self"-esteem if you will. I had a supportive family, and a big sis who stepped in the only time the abuse got physical. It hurts, but if you support your kids, they are tougher than you give them credit for, so help them with their coping skills before suggesting violence.

  2. Old story by n9uxu8 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The journalists drag up this dreck every year or whenever there is a school "incident". dave

  3. Common sense applies to AIM too! by garcia · · Score: 5, Insightful

    A lot of this story was about moronic kids taking pornographic pictures of themselves or friends and it quickly circulating. No fucking way, porn, spreading fast on the Internet? Who would have thought!

    But a growing number of teenagers are learning the hard way that words sent into cyberspace can have more severe consequences than a telephone conversation or a whispered confidence. As ephemeral as they seem, instant messages (better known as I.M.'s) form a written record often wielded as a potent weapon for adolescent betrayal and torment.

    NOTHING is worse than the fucking "telephone game". Story starts innocuous enough about Timmy getting reprimanded by the Gym teacher and ends up into some outlandish bullshit about Timmy getting his cock sucked by the male Gym teacher for missing a basket during an important shot in a worthless game during class.

    Yeah I suppose the written record could be changed to make people more and more guilty looking but it's most likely getting circulated in tact (I know how stuff is copy/pasted between AIM windows). If the girl said some racial epitaph and it got spread over AIM and her school suggested she leave so be it. She probably lucked out better than if it had been said verbally and stretched...

    Kids should be taught the same things we preach... Do not allow anyone to contact you on AIM unless they are on your buddy list or at the very least have it prompt you if you don't have them on your list. At least they can't won't get to fill up your SMS inbox with messages about your stupid behavior.

    Have some common sense and don't post pictures of yourself masturbating, don't send messages about how you think of someone else, and don't allow yourself to be video taped by other kids doing sexual things with others.

    1. Re:Common sense applies to AIM too! by adamh526 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Have some common sense and don't post pictures of yourself masturbating, don't send messages about how you think of someone else, and don't allow yourself to be video taped by other kids doing sexual things with others.

      This should be obvious, but a technical communications professor I once had always said that when you're sending (even private) electronic communications, assume everybody in the world is going to see/read it, ESPECIALLY people you wouldn't want to.

    2. Re:Common sense applies to AIM too! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny
      ...Have some common sense...

      Good job! You just figured out the solution to 97% of all teenagers' problems! Now that the theoretical framework is laid out, implementation should be a snap!

    3. Re:Common sense applies to AIM too! by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Insightful
      People are getting stupider.

      People are NOT getting stupider!

      You know, the internet has been around for awhile now and it's only in the last four to six years that people have become increasingly stupid and juvenile.

      Did it ever occur to you that the internet, anonymity of postings, etc. brings out peoples truer nature? I wish I could point to one of the studies on this, but conclusions are that people communicate much more than they used to (notice all the people jawing on cellphones while they drive, which they couldn't do a couple decades ago without a fat wad of cash, IIRC cell phones were invented in 1948, but few could afford this luxury) the more they communicate the more deeper they dig into their thoughts, reveal more of their character. Typing is more congnitive process than speech, as you can backspace over and otherwise edit your thoughts to make a point more clearly. Beyond the words there's the behaviour, how often do you communicate, to what do you respond, how do you respond, etc.

      In short, people aren't more stupid, they're simply revealing the stupidity that's always been there.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  4. Parry Aftab and Katie *ARE* BULLIES. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In fact, I would say that Katie is a sociopath, as well.

    I assume the Slashdot crowd doesn't need to be reminded that this is the same "Parry Aftab" and WiredSaftey.org program as pushed by the trampy little "Katie" of "Katie.com" domain theft fame from a couple weeks ago. The same girl that was stupid enough to get herself involved with a 40 year old man alone in his hotel room and then tried to extort an innocent woman out of her legitimately held domain name all under the guise of "I'm a stupid twit and made a bad choice when I was a teenager and now I'm going to spend the rest of my life trying to milk it for every dime I possibly can".

    Parry Aftab, Katie and the whole lot are a bunch of fucking twits. They see problems where none exist and blame everyone else in the world for their own personal failures of choice and behavior. God I can't fucking STAND these idiots and I can't believe Slashdot is now "promoting" news for the same twat that we were flaming the hell out of a short time ago.

    But it did not end there. As soon as Amanda got home, the instant messages started popping up on her computer screen. She was a tattletale and a liar, they said. Shaken, she typed back, "You stole my stuff!" She was a "stuck-up bitch," came the instant response in the box on the screen, followed by a series of increasingly ugly epithets.

    Oh, boo fucking hoo. Don't give people you don't like your instant messaging name, then. Or rather than engaging in petty arguing, sign off. Or block them. What does it take to warn or block someone on AIM? Two or three button clicks? For fuck's sake, it's a few mean words on a computer - it's not like these "bullies" are shoving broomhandles up their "victims" asses.

    It's one thing for kids to be whiney little thin-skinned shits, but it's another for the lawyer - Parry Aftab, Wired and that Katie bitch to make big bank going around promoting these social rejects. These retards that can't back down from confrontation by doing the obvious - like blocking people in AIM or simply grow up and deal with the fact that not everyone is going to like you and sometimes your feelings will be hurt.

    This story just makes me want to puke, as do those who are clearly exploiting the "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!" angle of it. Also - just because you're a porky fuck who almost got herself raped in a hotel by a man three times her age (where the fuck were your parents?!) doesn't make you an "expert". That's like saying that junkies are experts on drugs. Just because you inject a bunch of drugs into your veins doesn't make you an expert about them anymore than driving a car makes me a mechanic - and in the same way, being a stupid twat that makes herself a perfect "victim" doesn't make you any more an expert on these things.

    For instance, last spring, when an eighth-grade girl at Horace Mann School in the Riverdale section of the Bronx, sent a digital video of herself masturbating to a male classmate on whom she had a crush, it quickly appeared on a file-sharing network that teenagers use to trade music. Hundreds of New York private school students saw the video, in which the girl's face was clearly visible, and it was available to a worldwide audience of millions.

    What the fuck? If a thirteen year old kid is stupid enough to videotape herself masturbating and send it to a classmate, she DESERVES for it to be spread around the school and to be humiliated for it. Sometimes there is a price to pay for being a fucking moron. And the persons with the social and mental problems aren't the people who harass or humiliate her for it - it's the girl who has such a fucking warped brain that she thinks passing around videos of herself with her fingers or a dildo in her pre-pubescent snatch is the way to win over a boyfriend. That kid needs to be sent to a fucking boarding school and undergo major psychotherapy.

    This whole fucking article is one tale after another of stupid kids doing stupid things and then running to mommy and getting sympathetic attention when it comes time to pay for their stupid actions. God forbid people learn from mistakes by paying for them.

  5. Her day will come ... by YankeeInExile · · Score: 5, Funny

    Scene - a high school girl complaining to her guidance counselor...

    • Student: I was online last night, and somebody said I was fat.
    • Counselor:I see.
    • Student:And they wanted to know why I wear the same pair of jeans eve ry day.
    • Counselor:How cruel.
    • Student:And how I have Wal-Mart clothes.
    • Counselor:Well, in that case, I reccomend you study computers. That way when you graduate, you can go online, and it won't matter if you're fat and wear the same Wal-Mart jeans every day for a year, you will still be the hottest chick that any of the other geeks in your university can get, and they will lavish you with attention. And, in a fitting turnaround, THEY will do YOUR homework.
    --
    How does the Slashdot Effect happen given that no slashdotters ever RTFA?
  6. Heh by antifoidulus · · Score: 5, Informative

    Kids may want to watch that they don't piss off the wrong person on the internet.
    In Japan a girl slit the throat of another girl over insulting comments made over the internet.

    --
    Monstar L
  7. Fork it over by Skyshadow · · Score: 5, Funny

    gimme your lunch money, or i'm going to fork out a hurt process on your ass.

    --
    Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
  8. bah by nomadic · · Score: 5, Funny

    When I want to hurt someone emotionally I just write a slanderous mambo about them.

  9. Idioticy of today's youth. by GoofyBoy · · Score: 5, Funny

    >Have some common sense and don't post pictures of yourself masturbating, don't send messages about how you think of someone else, and don't allow yourself to be video taped by other kids doing sexual things with others.

    I, as a mature and responsible member of society, am shocked that they were doing this ... for FREE.

    Do you know how much money they could have gotten if they that set up a pay-site and charged $19.99 per month (first 7 days free)?!?!?!

    I fear for our future.

    --
    The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
  10. Any sort of bully by Ignignot · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Is just a coward who thinks there can be no retribution for their actions. Then they go and try to demonstrate their power by doing bad things. Oftentimes social outcasts are targetted (like nerds) because they have few friends to draw support on to provoke a response against the bully. That these same victims are then turning around and doing the same thing online saddens me; it reminds me of people who are still steamed over a few childish words or actions from their pre-college days. In either case some bullies have managed to have a large affect on the person's life, and other people's lives through them. Chances are that by the time they're in their twenties, someone who was a bully in high school has either repented his actions or matured to the point where they would no longer even think of pushing someone around. Some of their victims, OTOH, will still have the persecuted mentality. You'll feel a lot better if you simply forgive people who did you wrong as children. The forgiveness isn't for them, it is for you.

    --
    I submitted this story last night, and it didn't get posted.
  11. Re:No one better agree with this story by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I disagree. Oh, and I'll make it easy for you: My IP is 127.0.0.13 Bring it on!

  12. Clifford Stoll is RIGHT! by Asprin · · Score: 5, Insightful


    You see, folks! Clifford Stoll is right! Computers in the classroom are not only an unnecessary and useless distraction, but now they are probably also a serious legal liability.

    Please, for the sake of the children, start by unplugging the computers and networks and teach them how to use books again.

    /Seriously considering changing my last name to "Luddite"

    --
    "Lawyers are for sucks."
    - Doug McKenzie
  13. Reasonability and Copyrights by virg_mattes · · Score: 5, Insightful

    > If someone is "stupid" enough to leave their diary lying around a publisher can steal it, do they deserve to have it published in the daily newspaper?

    Not applicable to the situation at hand. She passed the video to the boy herself, which established a desire to distribute. Having your diary stolen doesn't establish this desire.

    > The girl's legal rights were violated: specifically, her copyright to her video. Regardless of what he thought of the contents, it was illegal for her "boyfriend" to publish her work without her consent.

    Incorrect. If she didn't apply for a copyright, or at the very least include some notice not to distribute in the video or otherwise, she didn't establish any reasonable desire to copyright, so enforcing it would be problematic at best. More importantly, copyright violation is a civil tort, so she would have to demonstrate monetary loss due to his distribution, like for example if she was charging for distribution and he gave it away. No such monetary loss occurred, so there's no case for copyright infringement.

    More to the point, however, is her recourse. If she truly wanted to make him pay for doing what he did, she could have reported him to the local police. A video of a 13-year-old girl masturbating is child pornography anywhere in the U.S., and by putting the video up on a P2P network, he's guilty of distribution, which is a felony offense. While he was sitting in reform school for five years, he'd have time to reflect on how "not nice" his action was. Also, any classmate who taunted her with comments about seeing the video would be subject to arrest for posession, so the story would die quickly.

    Virg

  14. Re:Real world should have consequences too by dasmegabyte · · Score: 5, Interesting

    That grass did cost $18 mil. I'd rather see 250,000 people choking the sidewalks and subways of NYC, anyway. Problem here is that they all want to get together. That's stupid -- if you get all of your ideas in one place, it's much easier to ignore. Split up into 25,000 groups of ten and stand on the sidewalks all over NYC. This would be a protest to be proud of.

    --
    Hey freaks: now you're ju
  15. Take it from someone in this age group. Really. by ScytheBlade1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'll openly admit that I'm in this "age group". I'm 16.

    If my parents knew that I had just told you people my age, my mom at least would completly flip out and be scared that someone is coming to abduct me based on this alias and that age. (But that's a different story. This is /., and I would expect that at least most of you have more common sense than that.)

    I recently had a friend who went point-blank suicidal. I'll refer to him as a he, but note I'm not disclosing that. He threatened that he was both cutting himself and was holding a gun (.45 to be precise, a shotgun) to their head.

    This was told to me over, heh, IM. (Once I realized he was serious, I called the police, meh, that's beside the point.) But, let me comment a bit on this story.

    "I have kids coming into school upset daily because of what happened on the Internet the night before," Ms. Yuratovac said. " 'We were online last night and somebody said I was fat,' or 'They asked me why I wear the same pair of jeans every day,' or 'They say I have Wal-Mart clothes.' "

    *gasp* Let's sit down and think here. Is this really any worse at all than something like this happening in real life? Here's a hint: it's not, it's actually easier to work with than it is in real life. Why is this? It's called the "block" button. Harsh as this may sound, if they sit there and listen to such things, all the while in perfect control and having the ability to change that, then it is in my opinion partially their fault for not clicking the block button and actually dealing with it.

    Amanda has her Internet messages automatically forwarded to her cellphone, and by the end of the game she had received 50 - the limit of its capacity.

    I'm going to assume ICQ or MSN were used for this, which makes it (sending of IMs to a phone) incredibly easy. MSN, it's a matter of right-clicking and hitting 'Sent to mobile device'. ICQ, just check the SMS button.

    The end user is in perfect control of this, should they want this to happen. MSN it's a checkbox in the options to turn it off (which must be turned on in the first place, mind you), and ICQ it's essentially the same thing. There was nothing preventing "Amanda" from not being subjected to this. From this story, everything that happened could have been prevented with about 45 seconds of clicking. (Okay, the exception being things like this, but again, turn the phone off. There are ways of preventing this. Of course, I really, really would like to see something like an whitelist/blacklist for phone text messages in the future.)

    Some of you may ask why I'm essentially "assulting the abused." I am 16, I do know what it's like when this happens, and I do know that, at times, it can cause things such as counseling, etc. etc. etc. I am not assuming that life is perfect and everyone enjoys a perfect life with no one harassing them.

    It goes back to a point I made earlier: IM is not any different than real life, except in the fact that it's exponentially easier to deal with. It's the internet. If they spam your e-mail, get a new e-mail. Harass you via SMS web-to-phone? Turn it off.

    Then deal with the "offenders" in real life, compared to sitting there and listening.

    Like, duh? Hello? These kids don't need advice on how to stay safe online, they need a reality check. In every scneario described, it could have been changed. You hear stories like this, other /.'ers linking to people commiting suicide as a result of talking on IM to people, but really, sit down, and think. IM is not any different than real life. If someone can convince someone, push some over the edge, over the instant messenger, I shudder to think what that person would be vulnerable to in real life.

    The instant messenger should be considered just as dangerous as real life, at very very most, because you don't have to be there, you have a choice not

  16. Re:Real world should have consequences too by rthille · · Score: 5, Funny

    Nope, those are just lying in their graves!

    --
    Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/