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MPAA Looks to Sniff Internet2 Traffic for Sharers
Danathar writes "It looks like the MPAA is pretty scared that Internet2 users are able to trade movies at high speed without them being able to know what's being traded, since you have to be a member of the Internet2 network to have a connection. As a result, they are asking to become a member."
No.
Love,
Internet2
okay, they can join, but they have to sit in the back of the class room and no raising their hands, got it.
Anyone seen my jagged little pill?
So they're asking to become a member of a limited group, for the sole purpose of suing other members of the group?
Can you say: "Hell No."?
first subpoena!
Laws are designed to help us co-exist with each other, to respect one another and bring order and a set of rules to abide by so that we can pool in our interests and progress as a civilization.
People or "things" like RIAA and MPAA abuse these laws, which were written to help bring progress. They abuse them into filling their coffers with wealth that is meaningless when it does not really help anybody. More so when it happens at the expense of others, and at the expense of progress.
Internet2 is primarily designed for scientists and research organizations, to pool in their resources and create a powerful network to facilitate better research interaction. Experimental particle physics data goes over several gigabytes, cosmic ray measurements are tremendously huge, gene databanks are big -- this is the kind of information that these networks are built for. Sure, some kid may be misusing them, but the percentage of people doing this would be far too less to be of any consequence (it has come down from 30% to 7%).
People like MPAA just will abuse the system, bring in more bureacracy, more rules and more regulations that will hinder how genuine users will use the system. They will wrap it nice and dandy around money and laws, and buy out our corrupt politicians who will dance to the jingle of wealth. And in the progress, they just will affect real people doing real work.
They are dragging everyone to the level of technology that they can control. Rather than adapt to the new technologies and grow with it, they try and exert their control by legal battles and money. Why can't they admit and move on to an era where their policies and principles encourage the technology, rather than deter it?
I sincerely hope that they are not let on board the Internet2. And I sincerely hope that one day our society is rid of parasitic savages of the likes of MPAA and RIAA. They're the scum and a disgrace of our civilization. They are the true deterrents to progress.
I hereby volunteer to let the MPAA install a camera in my livingroom and bedroom to insure I do not fast forward past ads, initiate a public viewing, or copy any of their bread-and-butter.
or have lawsuits become their bread-and-butter? *Sigh* either way.. I want to do my duty.
** "It's not my job to stand between the people talking to me, and the ones listening to me." -- Pego the Jerk
The article mentioned "researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second" ... and if they want to watch the traffic for "neferious" content, that is gonna require one heck of a Network IDS (Intrusion Detection System - SNORT is a popular open source IDS) to keep up ... and the vast majority of the traffic will be about as exciting as watching grass grow
Hulk SMASH Celiac Disease
First they take the Eternet speed record out of context ( "Recently, researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second. That was enough speed to transfer a full-length DVD anywhere in the world in less than five seconds, researchers said." ) and make this seem like the standard. I'm sure there just TERABYTES of DVD and mp3s sitting on Internet2 using their "new math".
Just say NO!
From internet2.edu: Internet2 is a consortium being led by 207 universities working in partnership with industry and government to develop and deploy advanced network applications and technologies, accelerating the creation of tomorrow's Internet.
I don't want to give them any ideas, but the MPAA has a chance at getting in by claiming to want to devise a method for distributing movies legally. However, hopefully I2 will look beyond that and deny them entry...
Robert Bindler
A Computer Science student's views on technology.
Internet2 was designed (and funded) for use by universities and educational facilities, as well as governments so they could "[develop] and [deploy] advanced network applications and technology, accelerating the creation of tomorrow's Internet." It doesn't really seem as though the MPAA has anything to bring to the table. Their membership application should be denied on that basis alone. Plus the fact that there is simply no evidence that there is anything untoward happening on Internet2, just that it's *possible*.
Get a life, MPAA.
Where can I apply to be a member of Internet2? I want to help .. uh .. sniff for .. uh .. illegal stuff. I REALLY want to help the MPAA out :)
Right now Internet2 is primarily a research network, and I think it should stay that way. It's useful for shuttling (large amounts of) research data back and forth, as well as examining new router/switching/etc technology. (No coincendence that many of the speed records are set on Internet2).
What it doesn't need is the massive commericalization that has occured on good oi' internet 1. Yes, piracy and filesharing that is unmonitored is definately a problem. But the real problem is not that it's unmonitored, it's that students with no need for access to the network have it. Why can Joe DormLiver piggy back on Internet2? Does he need research access?
They should politely tell the MPAA to fuck itself, and then develop some controlled access. I suggest only connecting research computers to the net, along with a few proxy servers so professors and grad students (and undergrads also doing research) can still use it remotely.
It would be interesting to do bonafide p2p and network research over Internet2, but that is not what the MPAA is looking for.
-Ryan
AUWYHSTOT (Acronyms are Useless When You Have to Spell Them Out Too)
Tell them that you've made them members of Internet2 but really make them members of Internet0, wherein there is naught but a group of Haitians trading the complete collection of Ernest movies (Ernest Goes to Camp, Ernest Goes to Jail, Ernest Goes to Haiti and Becomes a Zombie, etc.).
You are in error. No-one is screaming. Thank you for your cooperation.
There are many good reasons for the MPAA to join the Internet2 research project. Huge bandwidth, multicasting architecture, realtime multimedia: all these features might have a legitimate association excited about the future, and their role in bringing better service to their members and market. Instead, the MPAA has become interested only as a cop, not in contributing to the development of the technology itself. They'll just wait for Internet2 to be developed, at great expense in time, money and inspiration, by others - then they'll eventually cash in. Their only attitude towards the future is fear, emboldened a bit by greed.
The great lesson here is that Internet2 is only a litmus test. The MPAA acts exactly the same way on Internet1, and everywhere else. We're just witnesses to the miracle of the birth of their racket on Internet2. Burn, Hollywood, Burn (our should I say "Stream").
--
make install -not war
If the MPAA is allowed on Internet2, where else will they want access to? Your college's intranet? Your corporate network? ISP's LAN networks? There are many other fast network connections where piracy could take place.
Sure, Internet2 is 'members only'. But I think it's safe to say that most if not all of the members have standard commodity connections as well. So anything you can get to from I2 you can get to from the regular Internet, just at a reduced speed. There might be a small number of exceptions, but in general it's true. Being on I2 only affects the path taken by the traffic. It doesn't affect what's reachable.
I suspect the MPAA wants to be a member more so they can go to the member meetings and make a stink. Keep an eye on things from the inside so to speak.
I've got about 300 DVDs, and I probably buy at least 1 per week (if not more when I visit the Wal Mart $5 bin). It concerns me that they focus so much attention on the few who download movies. I would prefer that they.....say.....spend that money to develop enhancements to the DVD experience (something that isn't included in an encoded pirate version of any particular movie).
,like cockroaches, will ALWAYS exist) could be better spent to enhance their own industry....or (more likely to peak the interest of the MPAA) line their own pockets. Litigation isn't cheap, nor is computer/network forensics.
/. crowd would stop hating us"
There have been times that I've downloaded a movie from the Internet, enjoyed it, and purchased that movie from a local store so that I could watch it in higher quality and benefit from the additional DVD features (Southpark Movie). Other times, I've realized that the time spent downloading a particular movie (Blair Witch Project) could've been better spent playing solitaire.
Sometime soon, I hope, the MPAA will realize that the money they spend sniffing out pirates (who
Somewhere, there is an MPAA representitive reading this article who is thinking "Hmmm....he's right...I could get a raise and people like Trey Parker and the
"Lame" - Galaxar
While it seems ridiculous to include MPAA as a member of Internet2 under the pretense that it is helping research, we still cannot let Internet2 turn into a free-for-all of file sharing and illegal movie swapping. There is a reason that sharing copyrighted material is illegal. Intellectual property forms that basis of our society, and certainly it is critical for research institutions that "trade" in information. Being a member of Internet2 should be a privilege, and one with responsibilities taken seriously. Governments and universities are spending millions to get their systems on I2, and it is not the public's job to finance piracy. It would be terrible to see I2, which is quite powerful now, turn into another (regular) internet filled with all its trash, and with all its bandwidth consumed sharing movies.
That said, I cannot support commercialization of Internet2 or an invasion of it by MPAA just to allow them to sue I2 users. But in order to keep internet2 aligned with its true goals of promoting research, we will have to give some governing council the authority (even imperative) to fight this piracy and THEN take it to the respective IP owners like MPAA. I think it is silly that the burden should fall on MPAA to regulate such things, and it is because of this lunatic system that we are forced to deal with lawsuits from companies who snoop at file sharers. Pirating movies should have a penalty similar to stealing them physically: go to the city court and explain yourself in front of a judge your crime and regret, rather than dealing with expensive lawyers and publicized cases as is happening now.
The DMCA was used to threaten Ed Felton and his students into silence when they was about to present a research paper on the weaknesses of digital music security. The case sent a chilling tidal wave through the educational system.
With the spirit that Internet2 is designed for educational and research purposes and the precedent set by the Felton case, Hollywood's membership request should be denied in about three nanoseconds.
They are not welcome.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
I don't see any membership level listed in the I2 bylaws that would allow even a collaborative level of membership within I2. All of the current corporate members have something technical or educational to offer to the membership. The MPAA doesn't as far as I can tell. In fact it want sa regulatory voice within the oranization. Article I, Section 2 of the bylaws prohibit all non-Regular Members from having voting rights. Unless of course the I2 Board of Trustees rolls over and lets the MPAA in. Grrr...
Internet2 is a hotbed of IPv6 as well.
:-)
Wait till they get a taste of "privacy enhanced addresses" on IPv6 and find out some of those machines can change their addresses at random and not be tracable (only tracable to the subnet and no address server required or logs kept). They'll have to track'm down by MAC address (assuming no one is spoofing and morphing MAC addresses - how long will that take?) and wire by wire, switch by switch, once they're on the subnet itself, with the "cooperation" of the local techie staff. That's not even counting the really wicked stuff you can pull with multiple addresses (thousands, if you like) and different client and server addresses). BitTorrent already has IPv6 patches and some v6 BitTorrent seeders and servers.
Hmmm...
Internet2 + High Bandwidth + IPv6 + Privacy Enhanced addresses = good time to buy in stock in antacid vendors.
The MPAA and RIAA and going to make for a run on their wares...
Oh... This is gonna be good...
Whatever happened to learning stuff?
End of Line.
I just got through reading the latest New York Times magazine which featured many long and detailed articles on DVD and the movie industry.
The amount of disturbance to the industry caused or even potentially caused by Div-X converting and downloading is so tiny compared to the amount of resources and ill-will generated by their heavy-handed response to this so-called threat that one must come to the conclusion that the MPAA leadership is mentally unbalanced.
They are acting like the people who wash their hands ten times after touching a public door handle. They just aren't being rational.
The NYT Magazine articles mentioned that each DVD sale of $15 brings $9.00 of pure profit to the film studios that they don't have to share with anyone. This is the source of all the profit in the film industry. This is the fuel that is making the current entertainment boom possible.
Hundreds of millions of DVDs are sold each year and billions will be sold in the coming years.
Why are they so obsessed with ten thousand or so people sharing rotgut quality Div-X copies? Especially when each one takes several hours to download?
Even at minimum wage the wages for the amount of time spent downloading a stupid DivX is more than the price of a pristine DVD of the same title.
Nothing about this makes any sense.
It will probably just fade as embarrassment when the MPAA actually examines the real numbers involved and comes to its senses.
Is Internet2 just going to become a huge VPN over the Internet or is it a completely segregated network infrastructure?
It's physically separate; that's why it's faster.
Screw "learning stuff" - what about getting drunk and getting laid?
Blockbuster, Hollywood video, Netflick.
And the Internet.
The story is about the MPAA, not the RIAA.
I'm aware of that, I used that to indicate that the economic model has gone anachronic with the new medium in place.
Quality sound and video. Additional material like "how we did it", and even games and other material. All for a reasonable price.
Never denied it. That's why I buy the DVDs for.
Now tell me again why you're justifying the abuse of a taxpayer funded, research network?
For the same reason that we are not locked up in cages and allowed to do nothing but work during our working hours.
Because we're not drones to abide by a set of rules and follow it to the dot. People use the network primarily for research, a small percentage use it for other purposes too. So fucking what?
When the rest of my taxpayer money is used to wage wars that I do not support and not in stem-cell research that I do support, you're more concerned about a bunch of kids using it for entertainment purposes.
And oh, Internet2 is not entirely taxpayer, it is supported by money from several companies -- AT&T, Intel, Sun, Cisco and the like.
The following two quotes are from the MPAA's own 11/11/04 press release:
Must be terrible...the industry is losing $3.5 BILLION a year in revenue? They must just be drowning in the losses!
Wait a moment. This industry, suffering these massive, crippling losses from piracy, is doing BETTER than most sectors of the economy?
Here's the problem, and that is that the MPAA's figure is grossly inflated. Effectively, the MPAA figures EVERY download as a lost sale. (The MPAA's figures on downloading are also inflated, but that's pretty technical and better left to someone who can explain it comprehensively.) However, even provided that they're correct, they presume that EVERYONE who downloads a movie would have, instead, gone to a theater or bought a DVD in place of every download. (They also assume that these people don't do that anyway, and look at a lower-quality download to decide if the movie is WORTH seeing or purchasing on DVD.) This is, quite simply, not true.
It's time for the **AA's to quit whining. DESPITE widespread downloading, and bad business practices that turn customers away in large numbers, their revenues and market shares grow daily. Given that, it's hard for them to claim that downloads, whether on Internet1 or 2, are threatening to put them out of business.
To fight the war on terror, stop being afraid.
We get complaints every once in a while from the MPAA or their lackeys, claiming that some host on our network is sharing copies of movies -- The Matrix, Harry Potter, Star Wars: Revenge of George Lucas's Crack Pipe ... you name it.
Here's the funny thing: they're all wrong.
Every one of them. Wrong. I have never received an MPAA copyright-violation complaint that even had the slightest chance of being correct.
Here's how I know: We have a ridiculously big IP allocation, several times more than we need. Most IP addresses in our space are not used, and have never been used. Like, say, X.Y.1.1, or X.Y.64.64. And yet it is for addresses just such as these that we get complaints.
As far as I can tell, the cause of it is that shitheads somewhere in the world abuse our IP addresses behind NAT, instead of using RFC1918 private addresses as God intended them to. And just like with SIP or any other protocol that uses IP addresses in the protocol level to name hosts, file-trading protocols leak NAT addresses.
The abused addresses get published onto file-trading networks as places to get files. The MPAA's drones pick up these leads, and -- without checking -- give them full credence, and fire off complaints to us. They do not even bother to ping the host and listen for our router screaming back, "You blithering fool, there's no such host. There isn't even such a network!"
Any network operator who still gives any credence to these complaints is a fool. They are all wrong. Even if I got one for an address that actually had a host on it -- or, at least, had ever had a host on it! -- I expect it would also be wrong.
Every once in a while I get a complaint from these losers on a slow day, when I have some spare time and am feeling bored in the office. So I put on my slowest, laziest "I've been working a cushy, do-nothing public-sector IT management job for years, I don't know my ass from a router" tone of voice and phone up the MPAA lackey whose number's on the complaint.
I'm oh so very concerned. There's a pirate on our network? Is he breaking the law? What's his computer? You know -- what's his computer? Yeah, I mean, his eye pee. How do I connect to his eye pee and prove he's got these files? Do I need kazz-uh to do that? Wait ... can I do that legally, or am I breaking the Constitution? What's a pee-to-pee anyway, is that some kind of sex perversion?
You get the idea. I thoroughly encourage every other research and educational site network operator to do the very same. Waste their time. Get your stupid out. Stall 'em, stymie 'em, but be very concerned that you don't want any of them Internet pirates pirating your Internet. (Or ask if they know where to find hot lesbian porn.) Most important -- keep the stooge on the line; the MPAA is probably paying him hourly.
One of your fallacies is that you presume that the RIAA is being "hurt" by internet downloading of music.
They'd like you to think that they are being so hurt.
But all the studies say otherwise, citing no statistical variance in sales compared to the general economic condition before, during, or after peak Napster use.
The fact is that the "harm" only exists in the feevered dreams of averice fixed firmly in the deluded heads of RIAA executives.
The harm to the MPAA might be higher, as really bad movies dont' get purchased or re-rented. Heck, most people who buy DVDs don't watch them more than once or twice. So if somone downloads a marginal movie, they are less likely to buy/rent it by a wide margin.
Music has a much lower commitment-to-engage than a movie. You can listen to music in your car or on the bus or while you are doing any number of other things. Movies you have to stop and watch.
Since Music is more re-usable the purchase-after-download factor has to be pretty high.
I would think for movies it would be otherwise.
To some extent the MPAA's strongest argument to stop downloading would be to first _GUT_ the RIAA's claims to harm and then show why it's different for movies. Without that infighting the "**AA" effect will damn the MPAA with the RIAA's brush.
Sucks to be them.
Solidarity with shit-covered losers will likely result in you finding yourself covered in shit, think about that MPAA...
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
Well as it seems to be time for another Slashdot "*AA debate" I'd just like to add my tuppence worth to the debate.... as in the future there won't be just "the internet" ( or indeed "the internets") to contend with.
What about networks of bluetooth enabled phones/portable MP3 players/car stereos that each hold several gigabytes of music and which can automatically connect to each other ?
You want a particular song ? You want all songs by a particular artist ? You're interested in a particular genre ?
Put search criteria on your devices wanted list and when you come into proximity of another devices that holds what you're looking for it transfers it over while you walk past/are drinking at a bar/are in a club/are sitting in a traffic jam etc. etc.
"Walkabout" short range P2P.
And for added social interaction then if someone elses device show the same sorts of preferences as yours it give both of you a little beep so you can start up a conversation.
Also how about "slightly more powerful than today" local neighbourhood wireless LANS ? Even if you're not part of the full time local network their might be guest channels/log ins/local broadcsts so when you drive through a neighbourhood you join in the local "neighbourhood swap shop".
But the best is yet to come. How about when storage capacity is available on something approaching, or even on, a nano scale ?
Maybe someone will create a "smart sticker" which is slightly thicker than todays regular sticker but which holds several gigbytes of data plus a small, solar powered, short range, transmitter.
Pop that up in a public place and everyone passing can pick up what's on it (so long as they have a compatible device). Guerilla marketing at it's best and a killer way to advertise new bands "come see us at club x on x and here are a few full tunes to whet your appetitie"
Who knows maybe this "fantasy tech" could even be incorporated into clothing, beer cans, grocery cartons, bricks... you name it.
So these *AA imbeciles can legislate, bribe and sue until they're blue in the face but they are simply pissing in the wind.
If they think they're having a hard time with todays technology, then think what the future will bring.
Sky subscribers are morons. They pay to be advertised at !