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MiniMo(zilla) Running on Windows Mobile

Posted by timothy on from the quick-progress-worthy-project dept.

webgrappa writes "If you (yes, yes, you that like OpenSource but use Win all the time) own a Windows Mobile Device, in a near future you'll trash Pocket IE and NetFront. MozillaZine has photos of MiniMo running on Windows Mobile Device."

28 of 212 comments (clear)

  1. actual pictures by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    http://rebron.org/blogarchives/2005/03/minimozilla _com.html

  2. handhelds with browsers by fludlight · · Score: 5, Funny

    Yes! No more "cheap viagra now!" popups on my palm pilot!

    1. Re:handhelds with browsers by passion · · Score: 3, Funny

      You mean you won't get messages anymore telling you that "you need to enlarge your tool"?

      --
      - passion
  3. Palm, sometime? by Justin205 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Come on, when will this be ported to Palm OS? I'm currently using NetFront on my Clie, and while it renders pages pretty great, it's slow. Very slow.

    So, when? Because Minimo on a Palm would be very nice.

    --
    "Your effort to remain what you are is what limits you."
    1. Re:Palm, sometime? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Clies are slow. You won't get very fast results.

      Try a recent Palm, but if you really want something powerful, Pocket PC is the only way to go.

      Here's an analogy: Palm OS 4 and below are like the original Mac OS or even DOS on the PC (simple, not very powerful, no multitasking), Palm OS 5 is like System 7 on Mac or Windows 3.1 (a bit more powerful, limited multitasking, a bit less simple), and Windows Mobile is like Windows NT/2000/XP (stable, powerful, and multitasking).

      PalmOS didn't even get devices that used *true* filesystems until very recently (instead of the antiquated and outgrown database format, which didn't really support advanced applications).

    2. Re:Palm, sometime? by Dan+East · · Score: 4, Informative

      http://www.mozillazine.org/talkback.html?article=6 097

      No, and from responses to previous times this question has been asked (it gets asked at least once every time someone mentions Minimo...), porting to Palm OS 5.x or below would be very hard. There was speculation that Palm OS 6 would make it a bit easier (but it'd still require someone to invest a bunch of time...)

      Dan East

      --
      Better known as 318230.
    3. Re:Palm, sometime? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Troll.

      The older Palm OS devices did not have "files". Instead, they had "databases" and "programs". There were no directories - everything was stored in the same level. Databases had types and attributes, like other filesystems, but they were transparent to the user -- they would appear as files in programs. They had a file type field stored with them; it wasn't an extension in the filename, instead it was actually stored as an attribute (like Mac OS.) There was no separation between storage memory and RAM - programs ran right from where they were stored. (Windows Mobile divides storage and program memory into two separate areas. Palm OS 5 may do this, but I'm not sure.)

      You could not just store files on a Palm or access it from a PC like a filesystem; nor could programmers access it like a filesystem. If I wanted to put some JPEGs on a Palm, I'd either need special software to convert it, or a brand new Palm that does use a filesystem, or a Palm with a SD/MMC card. Windows Mobile has a hierarchial file system... much cleaner and easier to work with. You can just copy/add/remove files as you normally would.

      WinFS isn't a filesystem in the traditional sense. It still uses NTFS as its underlying filesystem, but uses SQL (and MS SQL Server 2005)
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WinFS

  4. Nice to have a choice. by Sheetrock · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Apparently though if you're on a page with a word larger than seven characters, apparently you get the famous screen-widening effect.

    I just wish they'd distribute Firefox instead of Mozilla -- it makes a noticable difference on the desktop, and I'd imagine an even more sizeable one on a cellphone. Although I just recently saw a DivX movie on a friend's system, so maybe they're powerful enough to tolerate a little bloat.

    --

    Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
    -- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.




  5. Fantastic! by MBCook · · Score: 3, Informative
    I got a Dell Axim x50v right before Christmas and I love the little thing to death. It's screen is amazing. Some parts of WM2003se aren't perfect, but overall it is a nice little device.

    That said I am often frustrated by PocketIE. While it works (and rather well) the fact that you can't have more than one window open (no tabs) SERIOUSLY hampers me. I can't tell you how many times I'd like to open a link in a second window/tab to look at in a minute or load while I continue reading, or open a collection of 2/3 links to look at. But instead I have to choose one or the other and read that now. Then I have to remember how to get back to where I was to find the other links, and remember which links those were. I haven't browsed using a single window on any platform in at least 5 years, probably more. So this feels like a HUGE limitation to me and really cramps my browsing style.

    Having not only a second option from Pockete IE, but one that might allow me tabs/windows would be fantastic. I will download it the second it's released.

    Horray for MiniMo!

    --
    Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
    1. Re:Fantastic! by Dan+East · · Score: 4, Informative

      If all you want is tabbed browsing, then try ftxPBrowser. It is a freeware "wrapper" for IE that supports tabbed browsing, full-screen browsing, and a few other enhancements.
      http://park15.wakwak.com/~ftx/ftxp3e/

      Dan East

      --
      Better known as 318230.
  6. Minimo on desktops? by Shachaf · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Since Minimo seems to require a relatively small amount of memory (compared to Mozilla or Firefox), has anyone ever considered porting it back to the desktop so it can be used as a very lightweight browser on desktop?

  7. Honestly... by koreaman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That's what Opera is for. Mini devices. Fork over the $30 or however much it costs, it's worth it if you use your device to surf the web.

    --
    Le français vous intéresse?
    1. Re:Honestly... by Rits · · Score: 3, Informative

      Difference is, you can browse the web now with Opera on millions of mobile devices powered by Symbian and Linux. There is even a test version of Opera for Windows Mobile Smartphone Edition.

      That Minimo Google-on-phone screenshot didn't look exactly inviting. Getting small-screen rendering right is not the trivial effort some people think it is. Opera has spend a lot of time and resources on getting it right.

      --
      If you don't like having choices made for you, you should start making your own. - Neal Stephenson
    2. Re:Honestly... by Duckman5 · · Score: 3, Informative

      In all truth, that was the first thing I went to do as soon as I saw how crippled Pocket IE was on my Dell Axim, but upon reviewing Opera's download page I realized that they do not have a solution for my platform. You can see in the right where it clearly states that the Windows Mobile version of Opera does not run on Pocket PC devices. Total bummer.
      Now, with Minimo, I have another choice in browsers. Hopefully this will support the features that I want, not the least of which is the ability to have more than one window open.

  8. Download Minimo by Shachaf · · Score: 5, Informative

    I just noticed that Minimo for WinCE can already be downloaded at http://www.mozillazine.org/talkback.html?article=6 097.

  9. Name Game by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    MiniMo? Some other suggestions:

    BrushFire
    DamnSmallMozilla
    MoWin
    Fox Trot (it's a mobile device, isn't it?)
    Fox-CE (pronounced Foxy)
    Small Fox (it can be a catchy epidemic)
    LilMo

  10. Re:MiniMo? by flithm · · Score: 5, Funny

    how does minimo sound homosexual? (not that there's anything wrong with it if it does). If it bothers you just deepen your voice and say it like you're sharpening an axe or something.

    It's totally in how you say it. For example, right now I'm prancing around saying "Mantorp!" in a really high pitched girly voice. How do you like that?

    Which sounds "gay" now huh? [Deep Axe Murderer Voice] MiniMo@$*&! or [Prancy Girl Voice] Mantorp!

    Yeah I thought so.

    And just so you know. Homosexuals everywhere are offended by your use of the word gay. I could see if they named it "HomoMo" or "AnalMo" or maybe even "SuperFlamingMo" but MiniMo? No way...

    And while we're on the topic, are you really so insecure about a simple word like "MiniMo" that you might think twice about using a superior browser to one that's total crap yet has a name like "SteakKnife Gun Browser?"

    Maybe we should all join hands and prance around saying Mantorp, because you know what... I BET IT'S MORE FITTING!

  11. Meh. by oGMo · · Score: 4, Informative

    On my Zaurus SL-C860, I can run the real Firefox (or Mozilla) with pdaXrom, not to mention a whole load of other apps, including abiword, gnumeric, and other apps that, while not exactly full-blown on the PC side, completely blow away anything on the PDA side.

    With the latest betas, things are working with very minimal headache. If you're looking for PDA apps, this is a dream come true; if you're looking for a unix workstation in your pocket, this is also a dream come true. Or if you want gvim and gcc in your pocket. Or if you want snes9x in your pocket. Etc. You get the picture.

    It's really awesome to have a Linux workstation in your pocket that can dial via bluetooth through your cellphone anywhere you can get reception. Take photos with your camera, edit them right there with the latest GIMP, upload them to your server.

    It may seem obscenely expensive for a PDA, but it's also obscenely functional. You can't find a laptop this size, and it does just about everything you'd want a laptop to, except play the latest 3D games.

    --

    Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage

  12. MiniMo seems lonly by DarkMantle · · Score: 4, Funny

    I think Minimo needs some companions.

    Like MiniLarry, and MiniCurly.

    --
    DarkMantle I been bored, so I started a blog.
  13. Re:MiniMo? by r.jimenezz · · Score: 5, Informative

    "Mínimo" is Spanish for minimal.

    --
    The revolution will not be televised.
  14. actual link (for us lazy ones) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Pictures

  15. PalmOS DBs vs. filesystems by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 4, Interesting

    And the change to filesystem methodology for Palms is a good thing WHY?

    The old database-style techniques were far more efficient. When PalmOne moved to a filesystem-based architecture with the Treo 650, users found that N megs of RAM in the new device was equivalent to N/2 megs of RAM in the old device.

    PalmOS has always been more efficient and far better than Windows Mobile for any embedded device. PalmOS devices have historically been more usable despite 1/10 the processing power of a WinCE device thanks to the fact that PalmOS was designed from the ground up for mobile devices, while WinCE and its bastard brethren are a horrendous hack.

    Unfortunately, PalmOS 5.x is a step backwards. POS 5.x runs on significantly faster hardware than OS4, with practically no benefits in 95% of situations. It's still a hell of a lot better than any mobile version of Windows.

    --
    retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    1. Re:PalmOS DBs vs. filesystems by nxtw · · Score: 5, Informative
      And the change to filesystem methodology for Palms is a good thing WHY?

      New applications. Multimedia. More demanding games. Because the competition is both more advanced *and* has taken over market share.

      The old database-style techniques were far more efficient. When PalmOne moved to a filesystem-based architecture with the Treo 650, users found that N megs of RAM in the new device was equivalent to N/2 megs of RAM in the old device.

      It was never "equivalent". First, PalmOne should have included more RAM in the Treo 650. Second, a sacrifice in efficency is necesarry. However, the way in which they mapped old databases to files was not very efficent. The old system was hindering the platform greatly.

      PalmOS has always been more efficient and far better than Windows Mobile for any embedded device.

      PalmOS was very kludgy, not 32-bit, etc. If by "embedded device" you mean "plain-jane simple organizer", I agree completely.

      PalmOS devices have historically been more usable despite 1/10 the processing power of a WinCE device

      WinCE has had the same basic architecture from the beginning. While it didn't work out as well to begin with (the OS wasn't very mature and hardware wasn't too great,) it has evolved and is now a very decent platform. PalmOS devices have always been usable, and rather simple to use, but you can't use it for much.

      As for processing power - clearly they needed more. The old Dragonball CPUs took a few seconds to decode JPEGs and had no hope at playing mp3s.

      thanks to the fact that PalmOS was designed from the ground up for mobile devices

      It was designed for simple organizers.

      while WinCE and its bastard brethren are a horrendous hack.

      That's an unsubstantiated anti-Microsoft troll.

      PalmOS still does not have anything close to the mutlimedia support present on Windows Mobile (yes, people *do* like to put music on their PDAs and watch movies too), nor does it have the advanced gaming or emulation support (yes, people like to play games too.) For those that like to multitask... they can. I can run IRC, AIM, browse the web, and play music (streaming radio if I want it to be), all at the same time. And you can do so much from the device itself - you don't need to have a computer with the right software to be able to install software, mess around, etc.

      Unfortunately, PalmOS 5.x is a step backwards. POS 5.x runs on significantly faster hardware than OS4, with practically no benefits in 95% of situations. It's still a hell of a lot better than any mobile version of Windows.

      Step backwards? Do you think they switched to ARM because it was a step backwards? No. They needed to move forward. Windows Mobile does so much more, and people see that. PalmOne is really struggling to catch up now. People enjoy using their PDAs to go online and play mp3s. "95% of situations" of what Palm OS did originally won't benefit from a faster CPU, but what people want to do now requires a faster CPU.

  16. "We've created a clone of Mozilla... by d_54321 · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...one eighth your size"

    "I shall call him... mini-mo"

    --
    Support the FairTax
  17. Zaurus port? by samdu · · Score: 3, Interesting

    When will there be a Zaurus port of this? I'm aware of only one such project, but thus far I've been unable to get Firefox to run on the standard Sharp ROM. I tried OpenZaurus but it was buggy. It certainly would be nice to be able to run Firefox on the many Linux-based handhelds.

  18. Better browsers for PocketPC have been around... by shoolz · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Try: http://park15.wakwak.com/~ftx/

    I've been using it for about 2 years... tabbed browsing, text sizing, 'simply view' mode (no side scrolling or useless formatting), and the app is a mere 73K. Nice.

  19. No real zoom though (unlike opera) by Ezza · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If you look you'll see that the Google logo is at 1:1 resolution.
    That's because the gecko renderer doesn't support "true" zoom of text + images (yet), so until that's fixed it'll only be useful if you've got a nice big screen (and/or you like to scroll). Of course the Opera engine has been able to do this for years..
    The relevant mozilla bug is https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4821
    (copy & paste to your browser)

    --
    I'm a perfectionist but I'm trying to cut back.
  20. Obligatory by Creamsickle · · Score: 3, Funny

    That's an unsubstantiated anti-Microsoft troll.

    You must be new here.

    --
    On the 0th day, God created C