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Red Hat Founder Offers Help in Apple vs.Tiger Lawsuit
Art Vanderlay writes "Robert F. Young, a founder of Linux distributor Red Hat and now owner
of the Hamilton Tiger-Cats
Canadian football team, has offered Apple Computer CEO Steve Jobs a
quick way out of a lawsuit by TigerDirect over the latest version of
Tiger. According to the Globe and Mail, Mr. Young
has offered to license the Hamilton Tiger-Cats' historical use of the
word Tiger to Apple free of charge. The Hamilton Tiger-Cats have
been around since 1869. '136 years ago we were called The Tigers,' Mr.
Young said. 'If anyone owns the exclusive rights to the word tiger
with that much history and tradition, it's gotta be us.'"
I don't know whether that will be a whole lot of help, as service and trade marks are limited to being in respect of some specific area of trade/ practice, and I don't see a whole lot of overlap between sports teams and computer software.
If someone were looking for prior art, I think William Blake (1757-1827) got there before a Canadian football team:
The Tyger
Tyger! Tyger! burning bright
In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
In what distant deeps or skies
Burnt the fire of thine eyes?
On what wings dare he aspire?
What the hand dare seize the fire?
And what the shoulder, & what art,
Could twist the sinews of thy heart?
And when thy heart began to beat,
What dread hand? & what dread feet?
What the hammer? what the chain?
In what furnace was thy brain?
What the anvil? what dread grasp
Dare its deadly terrors clasp?
When the stars threw down their spears,
And water'd heaven with their tears,
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the Lamb make thee?
Tyger! Tyger! burning bright
In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye
Dare frame thy fearful symmetry?
Humorous signatures are over-rated.
While the "free" license is a good gesture, it's also indirectly implying that Apple needs approval from other entities to trade, and that's the risk that shouldn't be ignored.
What if this Tiger-Cats is bought by another business?
And not to mention TigerDirect is more or less in the same trade (which determines the trademark's validity) as Apple, and sports is not yet computer hardware-related until robots start playing.
If Apple wants to trade as 'Apple' exclusively in computer hardware, then it must be prepared that TigerDirect wants to trade as 'Tiger' exclusively.
Rock that crushes, Paper & Scissors that don't matter.
A trademark used in one indstry has nothing to do with a trademark used in another industry; this is how Apple Computers can call itself "Apple", much to the displeasure of Apple Record Label. I highly doubt that a trademark infringment suit brougt by the Tiger-Cats against Tiger Direct will get anywhere. (How the former World Wrestling Foundation lost the rights to WWF stumps the shit out of me.) IMHO Apple is in the wrong on this.
The retailer has owned trademarks on Tiger, TigerDirect and TigerSoftware since 1996.
Last time we discussed this, the general conclusion is that TigerDirect had *registered* trademarks on all of these *except* "Tiger". Apple, OTOH, has a registered trademark on the term "Tiger". Has anyone tracked down this mysterious registration, or is TigerDirect merely claiming that their use of the mark precedes Apple's? (As I understand it, trademarks are not required to be registered. However, it can be very difficult to prove the usage of a common mark without it.)
Honestly, I think TigerDirect is entitled to nothing more than "TigerDirect" and its derivitives. I have never seen them referred to as simply "Tiger", and I find nothing confusing about a product name vs. a company name. IMHO, TD has a long road ahead of them if they want to prove that Apple is misusing their mark. And what does TD really think they're going to get out of it anyway? The cost of the suit will drain their company dry before they ever see even a meger return. Perhaps they think Apple will settle?
TigerDirect's contention is that Apple's use of the word "tiger" has knocked the retailer from the top of search results on Google, Yahoo and MSN.
What a bunch of poppycock. If you do a search for "Tiger Direct" or "Tiger Computers" on Google, you get Tiger Direct. Even if you search for "Tiger", you still get Tiger Direct before Apple. But just because they happen to come up on a search for "Tiger" does not give them the right to claim the use of that mark.
Mr. Young is also currently CEO of Lulu.com, which provides independent publishers with free access to on-demand publishing tools for books, e-books, music, images and calendars.
Watch out for that website. It's a real Lulu! (insert groaning here)
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Trademarking of common words is just... stupid.
You can't have these kind of issues with a made-up name like Coca-Cola, right?
Apple, Tiger, Windows, whats next? Imagination isn't a prerequisite anymore in marketing, it seems.
Eureka Science News - automatically updated
change the name to Liger!
"Mind over matter: If you don't mind, then it doesn't matter"
-1, Redundant.
All movements for social change begin as missions, evolve into businesses, and end up as rackets.
I want an exclusive trademark on the word "the". Sounds like a good name for my company. Any other company that tries to use that name will have to pay me money :-P
--LWM
Nothing more.
While Tiger Direct has a (if somewhat sleazy) case, there's little confusion between a football team and computer sw. This is just Red Hat attempting to cash in on the PR surrounding this while looking like a good guy.
"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey
Trademark is generally only relevant for trade done in a specific domain - so usage of Tiger for a football franchise won't disallow another company to use football as a software reseller.
Where Apple potentially gets in trouble is that there is a company that is a software reseller that is doing business under the trademark of Tiger. Whether Apples line of business and Tiger Direct are closely enough related that the courts would disallow Apples usage of the trademark is unclear.
LetterRip
if such companies are so eager to preserve a stupid trademark, why don't they do something to preserve their symbol: the tiger? He's in the brink of extinction, ya know?
I don't feel like it...
It's not like Apple's changing its name to Tiger. It's just a code name for the CURRENT REV of their OS. It's gonna last, what, 8 months? Then it'll be some other big cat.
BFD
You're looking for quotes? See my journal.
In fact, Apple got in trouble in the 70s when they first used the word and had to agree that Apple (computer company) would not get into the business of Apple ( music company). Of course, Apple (music company) cried foul recently over iTunes....
So, you can see cross-industry trademarks DO have to be negotiated.
Does anyone know what happened to the Fedora Vs Fedora Trademark Problem? http://www.fedora.info/redHat.shtml I think this topic was posted on /. way back in 2003
http://slashdot.org/articles/03/11/20/1722215.shtm l?tid=110&tid=187
I am really surprised to see much info on how
the issue got settled.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Reminds me of when Tiger Woods tried to stop a golf course from using its name "Tiger's Eye", which it was named way before Tiger Woods became Tiger Woods. He obviously lost, but he did manage to get Nike to remove all of it's products from the Pro Shop!
PtPete
Hell, Tigers have a longer history with the term, and I'd hate to meet their lawyer in court...
I'm not tense. I'm just terribly, terribly, alert.
What a crock! The context of the use of the word (trademark) is important. This team was using it football, outside of the U.S. Tiger Direct trademarked it as a term applying to Software. For a company like Apple who has alread run aground of trademake issues when they used a name that conflicts with Apple Records and started dealing in the music industry, you would think they would have know better to at least do a simple search before grabbing a name was that clearly registered with the Trademark office. I hope Tiger Direct wins big on this one.
Apples didn't invent the term "Apple". But they would agressively defend the use of the name or related names within the industry if others started using them. They should expect the same when they try to grab Tiger's registered property. Some hoser football team or even some cats in Asia don't change that.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
Hell, Tigers have a longer history with the term, and I'd hate to meet their lawyer in court...
They're gggrreeaat! - Tony
No consumer is going to mistake Apple's Tiger OS for Tiger-Direct's discount (IBM-compatible) hardware. T-D's suit is a frivolous PR grab, much like this Ti-Cat offer. I hope Jobs gets his OS PR into lots more venues as a result of this ridiculous lawsuit, which actually will build the Apple brand in T-D's market - where they do compete, under "Macintosh" vs. "PC" brands.
--
make install -not war
This is a bit offtopic, but I'd advise everyone to avoid doing business with TigerDirect. I ordered the parts for my current computer from them and a great number of them didn't work properly. Worse, most of the warranties are "in-kind;" i.e. "Your RAM doesn't work? That's okay, send it back and we'll send you more RAM that doesn't work."
I also had to go out and buy a USB mouse because if I plug in devices in both PS/2 ports the computer won't boot properly, and the SATA hard drive I bought from them worked for all of two days before breaking.
None of these are compatibility issues, by the way; I replaced the defective Tiger parts with the same brand parts from a reputable local store (where they were more expensive) and the computer worked. The reason Tiger's prices are so low is that they sell factory seconds, meaning parts which didn't pass the company's quality inspection, so most of the stuff you buy from TigerDirect is non-functioning.
I used to read Caltizzle. I was a lot cooler than you.
Add me to the list of people that will:
* Never shop there
* Tell my friends to never shop there
* Email them and let them know why
I'm sick of hearing about ridiculous lawsuits like this.
Let's see:
Tiger's Eye the golf course opened in 2000, at the zenith of Woods' first great run. So it wasn't there 'way before Tiger Woods became Tiger Woods'.
Also, a fairly thorough Google search of "Tiger Woods" with "Tiger's Eye" alone or along with "lawsuit", "dispute", "pro shop", "Nike", etc., turns up nothing. In contrast, Woods' dispute with an artist, a yacht company, and an advertising company all jump right out.
So, unless you can provide a link, I call bullshit.
Taking the initiative I want to google bomb Tiger direct by linking it to the name Butthead Vendor to Tiger Direct.
ANd here I'm linking Apple to Tiger and to Tiger Direct.
I urge you to join me in adding links. Put these in your sig for the next month so they are all over slashdot!
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
This reminds me of the famous McDonalds name incident from some years back, where McDonalds tried to force a restaurant named McMunchies to change it's name. That's when Lord MacDonald of the Clan Donald got into the act. Quoting from a press release at http://www.mcspotlight.org/media/press/clandonald_ jan97.html:
Lord Macdonald of Macdonald, premier clan chief of Clan Donald, has appointed Ronald W McDonald to be Sergeant-Major at Arms of the Guardians of Clan Donald: the linear descendant of the chief's bodyguard. It will be open to all Macdonalds and their septs, dependents, and descendants, who are in good standing in the community. Successful applicants will be enlisted as Sergeants at Arms and issued with a Warrant in the form of a Certificate which is suitable for framing. The cost of membership is £1 (postal orders please) or £2 sterling for overseas applicants.
Needless to say, history was on their side even more than it was with the Tiger name here. If you don't use an original name, don't expect to be protected like an original name.