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Do-Not-Call List, Two Years Later
Carl Bialik writes "The Wall Street Journal is reporting that two years after the National Do Not Call Registry took effect, regulators say the system is working, but only six federal fines have been issued. More than half of registered consumers say they're still getting unwanted calls, according to a recent phone survey. Now, a fresh fight is brewing over which calls are restricted and which ones aren't. Twenty-five states maintain their own do-not-call lists, and many of them impose tougher restrictions on the kinds of calls that telemarketers can make."
Telephone surveyors are exempt.
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http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/dncalr
The federal Do-Not-Call system has worked very well for me.
The Oregon state government was charging for Do-Not-Call. Now the state system has been terminated.
Thank you for stating the simple phrase! I'm amazed at how many people scream and yell and get angry about telemarketers. One simple phrase "Please place me on your Do-not-Solicit list." would cure most of it.
I worked as a telemarketer for a year. I heard people yell at me every day and it didn't change anything. Those people would get calls over and over and over. It was the ones who were calm and said the magic phrase didn't call again.
A little polite respect gets you much farther than spewing vitriol across the telephone line.
Post-rock/Ambient/Drone and other noise.
Think of the do-not-call list as a service. You just got called by the service people to see how they're doing.
We get no calls in KY. The only calls we do get are from the police, firefighters, and a few other fund raisers. KY has it's own list. The KY / Fed combo is working great for us.
These kinds of companies generally need call only once for the damage to be done. I can't remember many occasions where the same company has called several times.
That solution "tell them to put me on the do-not-call list" simply keeps the burden on the consumer, not the telemarketer. Also, how do you do it to recorded calls?
BTW, before the national registry, there was a law requiring all telemarketing firms to send out written copies of their do-not-call policies to consumers upon request. Any individual violations of the request to send written copies of the DNC policy was something you could sue for in small claims court. Most telemarketers had never heard of this rule, and most were never trained about it.
Robert Nagle, Idiotprogrammer, Houston
I also worked as a telemarketer for a year.
I was completely amazed at how people are so uninformed about the whole thing. I realise we were bothering them, but that doesn't change the law or how incredibly simple it is to get us to stop calling back.
I called on behalf of Qwest (the phone/Internet company). Qwest is kinda serious about the Do-Not-Call list. They don't call ANYBODY who isn't already a Qwest customer. Even if they're not on the Do-Not-Call list. And Qwest is, of course, allowed to call its own customers unless they've asked them specifically to be taken off the list (because they have an Existing Business Relationship).
So this kinda got annoying after a while:
me: 'Hi, i'm calling on behalf of Qwest, is so-and-so there?'
guy: 'LISTEN HERE WE'RE ON THE DO NOT CALL LIST I'M GOING TO REPORT YOU' click
It's just like... OK... that's cool that you're on the DNC list, but we're still legally allowed to call you. So since you have no idea what you're talking about and just hung up on us, we're just going to call you again. I hope acting like an ass hole was worth it.
People not understanding the DNC law was the biggest annoyance we got. You'd be amazed. Almost nobody understands what the hell it does. I just can't fathom why you would sign up for something without having any idea what the fuck you're signing up for.
Another thing that was annoying is the people who just hang up on you. And then they threaten you the next time you call, as if them hanging up last time was some kind of legal contract that you were supposed to adhere to. If you just hang up on a telemarketer, they're going to call you back. No doubt about it. They will do it. You never told them not to call back, for all they know maybe you just dropped the phone. Or maybe your 5-year-old answered. They don't know.
Messing with telemarketers does not get them to stop calling you. No matter how many times you call them a fag or ask them what they're wearing or hang up on them or ask them how they'd like it if you called them during dinner, they're still going to call back. JUST TELL THEM TO TAKE YOU OFF THEIR FUCKING LIST.
All you have to do is say 'put me on your do-not-call list'. That's it. THEY'LL NEVER BOTHER YOU AGAIN. If they do, you can call the FCC and get them fined $11'000 or whatever (and you get up to $500 out of it).
If you are in the U.S. and the line is registered residential, then this has been illegal since 1991.
Some relevant links:
'The tyrant will always find pretext for his tyranny.' - Aesop's Fables
I actually liked being a telemarketer. But I think that's because I'm a VERY laid back guy and I understood the person on the other end wasn't venting at me. And you're right, the money is great for a college kid. A friend of mine was making 45K/year working 25 hours a week while still in high school.
Post-rock/Ambient/Drone and other noise.
I had learned the magic phrase, "Could you take me off the call list?"
Better still: "Take me off all of your call lists, for all of your clients". Otherwise, they can still get away with calling you for different customers.
HTH,
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Actually, they're not allowed to call cell phones.
There's a federal law that says that telemarketers can't call on lines where the recipient pays for the call. It's to prevent telemarketers from making deals with cell phone providers to call and annoy you on your dime, while your cell provider makes bank during "premium" call hours.
I thought recorded calls were illegal.
Or, you could just fill them all out and send them in. It costs them about $50 to pull a full credit report on you. This is a bad idea on cards that have an annual fee, of course, unless you're sure they'll reject you.
This is very, VERY bad advice. At least here in Canada, and I'm pretty sure credit bureaus work the same in most countries.
Each time a credit report is done on you, it gets entered into your record, to stay there for 7 years, as an attempt at obtaining credit. Every one of these entries lowers your credit score a bit. Have more than a few in a short period of time (like a year), and you will be denied credit for YEARS.
Also, racking up a bunch of cards, even if you don't use them, can really mess things up for when you actually need some credit. You want a car loan, but have 15 credit cards with zero balance on them? Sorry. You've over-extended yourself.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
1. Having some facility to record your calls on demand is a good idea for dealing with this. When this sort of thing happens, start recording.
2. If caller-id is blocked, you can use *57 to generate a log at the phone company containing the true origin of the call. It will not be available to you but it is held for some time (30 days? -- I'd have to check on that) and can be retrieved through a subpoena. So if someone breaks the law like this, or by making threatening calls, and you are mad enough, you can do something about it.
For example: you list your phone number in the yellow pages, marketing materials, or the state lists when you incorporate your home business. You then receive business-to-business marketing calls - quite within the law - even though you're listed on the do-not-call list.
You *69 the company calling you, and proceed to yell at the salesperson, and hang up. I grab the phone, call the person back, inform them that by listing their home number as a business number in marketing collateral, yellow pages, the filing when you incorporated, you voided anything the DNC list has to do with you. Business-to-business calls are not covered by the do-not-call list, and if you don't want your home phone to receive sales calls even during business hours, get a separate line for the business.
Well, she apologies, and rather than being a royal bitch at that point, thanked me for telling her. Come to find out, her husband had incorporated a business he had in the works, and unbeknownst to her, used the home phone number for everything.
So, I'm not surprised that 51% of those surveyed are running into this. I never have my sales folks check the do not call lists because every one of our calls is business-to-business - no need to check. I am not surprised only 2 fines were issued. The bulk of the 1,000 to 2,000 calls per day are probably people whinig about B2B calls, which are absolutely positively not covered by the list - nor should they be.
Don't want sales calls? Don't list your number in association with your home business. Get a separate line.
The record holder (pun intended) is 1 hour and 25 minutes.
Oh, that's nothing. A friend of mine once managed to string one of them along for 6 or 7 hours. He was painting an apartment while the owners were away, so he had no use for the phone anyhow. If you have multiple phone lines - all the better.
Most telemarketers are required by company policy to stay on the line until they make a sale or the victim hangs up - they're completely powerless to stop this. Especially if you say something like "Yeah, let me just find my credit card."
In case any telemarketers want to know: YES, I do advocate this sort of behavior, and NO, I don't feel the least bit guilty about cutting into your earnings. There's plenty of honest ways to make a living.
While I forgot what these phone books were called, they do give out phone numbers:
I did computer work on the side for a mortgage company back in the mid-90's, and they had the most interesting phonebooks. The phone company has a special white pages that are leased to certain companies that list phone numbers not by customer/company names, but by street address. All numbers are included in this book, even unlisted ones. While I was able to manage to leaf through one, the owner of the business treated them like they were solid gold.
The phone company has all sorts of lists. So does just about anyone else. Anything you buy that may show a certain interest, predisposition to buying over the phone, give to charity, new home owner, you name it - a list exists to be bought and sold.
I tried every decent and legal way I could think of to resolve the issue w/the business before I rented the chicken suit
You worked as a telemarketer and you still don't know what you are talking about. I don't blame you for the ignorance only your lack of proper training. Having someone say 'take me off your/the/some/a list" does nothing. The entity can purchase a new list with your number and call again. So what you have suggested has no ligit purpose. One needs to specifically state that they want their number (name is unnecessary and not relevent) ADDED to the company's do-not-call list. That specificlaly requires the company to add the number to their scrub list. It is this list against which all future lists are to be compared/scrubbed so that you do not get called again.
From what part of your anatomy did you get that "you get $500" comment? You are not a whistleblower and are not entitled to recovered funds. Had you been trained properly (or completed your own research) you would know that $500 is not automatic, nor is it some limit. The Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991 provides a private right of action (PROA) (i.e. you have the right to sue the offending entities) thorugh which you are entitled by statute $500 per violation of the law (and there can be many violations in a single call). That amount is set by law and cannot be reduced, however the court in its discredtion can treble (that means triple), the damages if you can shoe the offendind entity violated the law willfully or knowingly.
The law has a lot of nuiances, so you just have to do a little research. Google '47 USC 227' or 'CFR 64.1200' and learn more. In short each of these things are violations of the law:
* prerecorded commercial call initiated to a residence with an EBR (established business relationship)
* call initated to a device through which the user has to pay (e.g. cell phone)
* falure to send the person a copy of the company's policy regarding the maintenace of their DNC list
* failure in trianing person placing the call in existance and use of company DNC list
* failure to have a company do-not-cal list
* failure to properly identify the entity eithe rplacing the call or on who's behalf a call is made
* making two or more violating live calls in a 12 month period (yes, this means that a company has to live call you at least twice after a DNC request in order for you to have a PROA
That is just a short list, but there are plenty more requirements. The fact is very few people are aware of their rights. I have had only 3 cases in court and have won or settled each one and have settled a couple of more without having to file. So believe me, my knowledge is a good deal more extensive than your own in this area. Once I graduated school and got a real job (the telemarketing research and suits were used as a learning experience) I didn't have time to push any more, but around the holidays I get a lull and may pick it up again for kicks and giggles.
Cave, wreck, and deep diver.