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Robots With Square Wheels?

Roland Piquepaille writes "About eighteen months ago, I told you about a tricycle with square wheels which needed a specially designed road. But now, Distributed Robotics, a company from Troy, N.Y., is developing robots with square wheels which don't need specific roads. These new 'cars' propel themselves on flat surfaces by taking advantage of gravity. This might sound crazy, but the inventors think it could lead to new robots and toys, and more generally to new micro-machines or MEMS applications."

44 of 203 comments (clear)

  1. question by baldass_newbie · · Score: 5, Funny

    So, instead of a donut for a flat, do you get a danish?

    --
    The opposite of progress is congress
  2. ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 5, Funny

    OMG

    "The shifting weight sequentially drives each wheel that is under the weight to sit flat on the ground, thus moving the other wheels in a rotational manner, and the car in a linear direction; reversing the direction of the rotating weight, reverses the direction of the car. There are also several methods for steering the car that are under development" says Steven Winckler, President of Global Composites.

    This thing has a rotating hammer around its roof and just moves around based on the shifting weight.

    Thats should be fun on the motorway in a morning

    Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?

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    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by mwvdlee · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?
      Because if, against all odds, you managed to do it, you'd be rich and famous beyond your wildest dreams.
      Besides, what's the challenge of trying to invent something when people believe it _can_ be done?

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    2. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by chris_eineke · · Score: 3, Funny
      Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?
      Because it makes you go in circles?
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      "All you have to do is be fragile and grateful. So stay the underdog." Chuck Palahniuk, Choke
    3. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by kinnell · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?

      Because when you're making machines at microscopic scales, you get a whole new set of problems. Lubricating bearings is difficult, because conventional lubricants are too viscous. Assembling complex devices is difficult, because you need complex devices to do it. And reliably creating smooth round surfaces is difficult because irregularities in the material cause rough surfaces. Flat surfaces are easy to make - just shear a crystaline material.

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    4. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How exactly can you make a motorized rotating turret without doing all of the things you just suggested were difficult.
      Read my other posts on this subject to see that I am already aware of these kinds of problems.

      --
      liqbase :: faster than paper
    5. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by RPI+Geek · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?

      The contact information at the bottom of the page gives it away if you know the guy, which I do: Steve Derby was my advisor and one of my professors at RPI just this past spring. He's the type of person who loves to tinker with new ideas and who will probably come up with a revolutionary solution to some problem. Our projects for that class involved coming up with an idea that interested us and running with it for a few weeks (using the methods we learned in the class, of course). Most of the class predictibly came up with half-baked ideas that needed a lot of work (mine fell into this category), but some of the people came up with some truly good ideas, and you could tell that Derby loved seeing these ideas and learning from them.

      I don't know the other person who's listed there, but I would guess that he's an RPI alumnus.

      Also, I can see this working without a "rotating turret of doom" mounted to it. Imagine one of these carts moving about a pitching and rolling ship (or even just a roling one, with a bit of thinking about it). I can't see how square wheels would be _practical_ for anything but a novelty, but maybe someone smarter than me will find a use for it.

      --

      - "Nobody came out that night, not one was ever seen. But Old Man Stauf is waiting there, crazy sick and mean!"
    6. Re:ROTATING TURRET OF DOOM! by big_a · · Score: 2, Funny
      Why are folks so obsessed with literally reinventing the wheel?
      Because they've already invented a better mousetrap?
  3. Do you have stairs in your house? by Big+Nothing · · Score: 4, Funny

    With square wheels, these new and improved robots are especially well adapted to climbing stairs. Do you have stairs in your house?

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    1. Re:Do you have stairs in your house? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Of course! How else would I keep the daleks out?

  4. Next up by NorwBlue · · Score: 3, Funny

    Rev.2 will have triangelshaped wheels. The benefit You might ask? Well, 1 less hump pr. rotation.

    1. Re:Next up by cjanota · · Score: 2

      With more sides though, the difference in radial distance is reduced and the moving of the weight would do less. The limiting case would be the circle where shifting the weight does nothing.

      --
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  5. Reinventing the Wheel by AthenianGadfly · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think this is a really good idea for moving any sort of vehicle forward. However, I have an idea that might make it even more efficient... perhaps they could cut off the corners of the wheels to create an octagonal wheel, which would mean less force would be required to turn the wheel. Maybe, somewhere down the line, it could be expanded even further to have more sides and even fewer sharp angles. Now that I think of it, perhaps the edge of the wheel could be configured in some sort of smooth "curve" to eliminate corners altogether... hmmm... imagine what it could evolve into someday.

    It looks like these improvements of mine could really take off and go somewhere. I'd better patent it.

    1. Re:Reinventing the Wheel by ArsenneLupin · · Score: 4, Funny
      I'd better patent it.

      Too late. It's already been done!

  6. Lasers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    This might sound crazy, but the inventors think it could lead to new robots

    Will these be killer robots with lasers? If so, put me down for about 50 of them, and deliver them to Roland's place.

  7. An intriguing challenge for mathematicians. by Strolls · · Score: 5, Funny
    The tricycle article says:
    So far, no one has found a road-and wheel combination in which the road has the same shape as the wheel. That's an intriguing challenge for mathematicians.
    but this seems to me to be most obviously untrue. A conventional road has the same cross-section as the planet it's built on... so a hypothetical flat road encircling the globe is as near as damnit circular. Now what shape are wheels? An intriguing challenge for mathematicians and bloggers, perhaps.
    1. Re:An intriguing challenge for mathematicians. by whopis · · Score: 2, Interesting
      A conventional road has the same cross-section as the planet it's built on... so a hypothetical flat road encircling the globe is as near as damnit circular. Now what shape are wheels?

      You are correct that a conventional road is circular (or at least much closer to being circular than the straight line that we perceive it to be). However, the constraints of the problem (from the article) included "keeping the axle moving in a straight line and at a constant velocity". Clearly a conventional road fails to meet this constraint since objects moving along a circular path are not traveling at a constant velocity.

    2. Re:An intriguing challenge for mathematicians. by Eivind · · Score: 3, Informative
      But equally clear, the challenge as stated, is unsolvable. Any reasonable definition of "wheel" requires it to be able to turn multiple rounds, in effect a wheel must be a closed loop.

      If the road is the same shape, then the road must also be a closed loop.

      There's no way a vehicle can move straigth along a road that is a closed loop. At best it could move straigth for a short while, but eventually the road has to curve to be able to close back on itself.

    3. Re:An intriguing challenge for mathematicians. by slashname3 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Didn't you just define a tank tread? Seriously, ;) isn't a tank tread a closed loop road way that the wheels of the tank drive on?

  8. Obligatory by connah0047 · · Score: 2, Funny

    I think they are trying to reinvent the wheel here...

  9. Explanation for the mechanically challenged. by Sparr0 · · Score: 4, Informative

    The vehicle described here, and built as a prototype, has 4 square wheels each with different orientations (evenly spaced). When the front left wheel sits flat the rear left wheel is 1/16th of a turn from being flat. Shifting the center of gravity of the car towards that rear left wheel causes it to 'fall' forward to sit flat, which rotates all 4 wheels 1/16th of a turn. The front left wheel is now 1/16th past flat (and 3/16ths from the lying flat on its next side) and the rear right wheel is 1/16th from being flat. Shift the weight to the rear right and it rolls forward another 1/16th of a turn. This produces moderately wobbly and slightly jerky motion, but could prove to be a simpler method of locomotion at very small scales, especially if magnetism instead of gravity is used to pull the wheels down/forward.

  10. Re:Why? by Sarmis · · Score: 5, Informative

    Sometimes reading the article reads to fascinating statements, which answer the question you apparently pose after reading only the blurb. Such as this tidbit: ""For use in micro-machines or MEMS applications, one of the key benefits is that the motor and gearing moving the shifting weight is all in a plane parallel to the motion surface. No right angle gearboxes are required. The connection between the two axels can be accomplished by simple linkages""

  11. Why comprehending TFA is important too by Legion303 · · Score: 4, Funny

    "Thats should be fun on the motorway in a morning"

    True. Running over "robots, micro machines, novelty toys, and others" on your way to work might give you a flat.

    1. Re:Why comprehending TFA is important too by TERdON · · Score: 2, Informative

      Because less parts = cheaper...

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      I have a really elegant proof for Fermat's last theorem. If this sig was only a bit longer...
  12. Re:Why? by Grimster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Because it's a new way to do an old task. Is it practical? I don't know, how many "impractical" or "silly" things later were found to be extremely useful?

    Looking at the article I was just struck with a sense of "whoa neat" at the simplicity of the idea yet the fact (as far as I know) it's never been done before (using a "helicopter" of shifting weight to propel a car forward by it's properly aligned square wheels). Sometimes it's not so much "why?" but "why hasn't anyone ever thought of this before?".

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    --- www.f-theocean.com
  13. Re:Why? by KlaymenDK · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I RTA, and I I think this is very neat (if not elsewhere, this could at least be very useful in wheel-and-circle-deficient Lego builds! ;o) ).

    Still, I don't see it. Surely, if you keep the axle linkages, sand the wheels down, and merely rotate the motor 90 degrees so its drive shaft is parallel to the axles, that would also yield propulsion without right-angle gearing, no? Granted, you would need a chain drive or a (non-angled) set of gears to connect motor and axle, unless the axle IS the drive shaft.

  14. Toys? Seriously? by Sockatume · · Score: 5, Funny

    I don't know how parents will take to a toy with four spinning pointy wheels and a rotating hammer on top.

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  15. Where's Rudolph when you need him? by Woldry · · Score: 4, Funny

    ::sings:: Weeee're on the islannnd of miiiisfit tooooyyyys....

    Okay, I'll go sit in my [square] corner now.

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  16. Tip it's center of gravity and all bets are off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    With a drive system that relies on gravity and a horizontal swinging weight, these Rube Golberg contraptions would be especially ill-adapted to climbing any inclined surface.

    Put it at a stair-climbing angle and when the hammer swings to the back it'll just tumble backwards.

  17. Subscribers by $RANDOMLUSER · · Score: 5, Funny

    The next blog entry on a page hit whore's site is ready now, but subscribers can see it early.

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  18. Misfit train.. by Vellmont · · Score: 3, Funny

    Looks like Rudolph's misfit train will finally have a purpose.

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    AccountKiller
  19. Square wheels wouldn't help anyway by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A few moments playing it out in your head will make it obvious that square wheels are actually worse at climbing stairs than round ones. Sitting on them, sure. Climbing them, not so much. A star-shaped wheel might be better, but it'd have to be big (each flat side as long as the step itself) which means a big vehicle, which means a big, heavy swinging hammer jerking the vehicle in every direction on it's way up.

    And that still wouldn't work, even if you shifted the hammer forward to keep it from throwing itself down the stairs. The things propulsion comes from each wheel being offset from each other, but being offset for propulsion means they can't all maintain optimal contact with the steps.

    This thing is limited to running on a flat, smooth, hard, obstacle-free, level surface, and doesn't even move smoothly on that. Plus swinging a large hammer seems much less efficient than driving a small wheel. It's a curiosity with no practical application. The tag at the bottom of slashdots page ATM is apt: Too clever is dumb.

  20. Re:Why? by Potor · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The beauty of a university (even in this age of patents, industrial parks, and spin-offs) is that in theory any problem can be investigated without having to be justified. Who knows if this experiment will go anywhere (pun really not intended), but the ultimate (perhaps, commercial) form of any pure research is quite hard to imagine ab inititio.

    I know that you are just asking a question, and indeed a good question. I am simply trying to forestall the opinion that because the advantages are not immediately to be seen, this must be a waste.

  21. 'Tis the season! by Equis · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I just saw this great report on television the other day. It turns out no one wants a Charlie in the Box, a squirtgun that squirts jelly, or a robot with square wheels. They're all just Misfits.

    Oh, and Bumbles bounce.

  22. Perfect for the Scion Xb or the Honda Element by digitaldc · · Score: 4, Funny

    Now you can have square wheels to go with your box car

    --
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  23. In other news... by Quixadhal · · Score: 4, Funny

    Scientists make use of extensive surplus budget to create the new threadless screw.

    "We think this new screw will help the industry by providing a less complex fastening device for the end users, and it should be more economical for manufacturers as well."

    The new threadless screw serves the same function as a traditional screw, but doesn't require a complex torque-riddled installaton process. Simple repeated impacts will drive the new screw home with far less effort.

    "The average consumer is often frustrated with traditional screw technology. Do you need flat heads, phillips, star-point? Will sheet metal screw threads work, or do you need the heftier wood threads? Self-threading points, or rounded? It's mind-boggling! These new screws are great. They only have one head type, and you just pick the length and heft you need. That's all!"

    Scientists expect the threadless screw to be a big hit in 2006, and look forward to tackling the next problem at hand.

    "We're thinking of developing a shorter lever next year... One that doesn't require so much space to operate. It will have less leverage, but most people don't really use the leverage their current levers provide."

    1. Re:In other news... by everphilski · · Score: 2, Funny

      You hit the nail on the head. Not really.

      -everphilski-

  24. Reversing is Simple by giafly · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just replace the offset weight by a helium balloon.

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    Reduce, reuse, cycle
  25. square wheel to circle to square again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    It seems that we have come full square...

  26. Mindstorms by Siener · · Score: 2, Informative

    Looking at the photo in the article, this seems like a perfect project to implement in Lego Mindstorms. Anyone up for it?

  27. Re:Link mirror by keeboo · · Score: 3, Insightful
  28. Woooooooooosh...... by Overzeetop · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Not only did you miss the joke, you didn't even ge the right fastener.

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  29. I did it!!!! do i get a prize????? by Artfldgr · · Score: 2, Interesting

    no one has made a road and a wheel in which the two are the same? obviously this person has never used a gear and rail... duh...