Slashdot Mirror
How Do You Job-Hunt If You Work Overtime?
Lord_Dweomer asks: "As a recent college grad, I took a job to pay the bills, but soon realized that it would end up sucking the life out of me. I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?"
"All my free time, during the week, is completely non-existent, and the weekends are needed to take care of chores, and preserve my mental health. Are potential employers typically sensitive to the fact that I may not be able to interview during the week or during standard work hours? Also, will having left here after a year seem like a real black mark on my resume? My reasons for leaving, aside from the overtime (I am non-exempt), would be that I've basically been promoted in work load and responsibilities -- and have even taken on another job role, IN ADDITION to my current one. All of this without a raise in pay, or new title.
I'd quit if I had a choice, but I really need the money, yet I'm unable to look for a new job because of lack of time. How am I supposed to job hunt under these circumstances?"
I'd quit if I had a choice, but I really need the money, yet I'm unable to look for a new job because of lack of time. How am I supposed to job hunt under these circumstances?"
A lot of people take sick leave to go to job interviews. Maybe it's time for your kids to catch a nasty flu or for you to start come down with strange migraines that require you to leave work often and go to the doctor at least weekly.
I used to just be really brazen about it, showing up for work in a nice suit, disappearing for three hours, and taking phone calls from recruiters in front of my coworkers. It got one employer to give me two huge bonuses, a nice raise, and hire a junior SA to handle some of the work. There's this old proverb about squeaky wheels and grease...
Listen, I've been through this... if you've been promoted, and are assuming more responsiblity, etc. NOW!!! Hear me loud and clear, NOW!! is the time to demand for a raise. Tech. work is surprisingly very close to prostitution industry. You're basically a good hoe right now. Recognize it, and firmly ask for a raise. Have a decent figure in mind. 10-20%, more? Whatever you want. Dude, if I've learned one thing, asking never hurts. You've only got money to gain. Rather than looking for another job right now, you probably have a better chance of getting money out of these people. I was able to demand a 50% rate increase, after I got promoted, and I knew I was the shit. Now what made it easy asking for the raise and demanding it? I was ready to walk away from the job, and I knew I could at least get equal or beter pay and better working hours. So recognize you can walk away from this and lose 2-4 weeks, and find something equal and better. To effectively job search from what I've learned, you need the time. This is a whole other subject... After you know you can walk away, you get guts. Free confidence, b/c you've got nothing to lose. And you tell the manager you've got the best relation with (he counts on you like crack): I love this company, the people, etc. I don't want to go, but given everything I've demonstrated (have a list ready), I deserve appropriate compensation. (seem pissed). State a figure (i'd go high, 25%+), and then just shut up and wait for him to respond. Worst case I gaurantee: you'll get a minimal raise. Best case: you find out how afraid they are of losing you, they count on you, you're part of momentum on the project, etc. you get what you ask for. Go for it.
Good point, he's had lots of posts to slashdot...
Trolling is a art,
I'm not HR either, but speak as a hiring manager. If someone held their current employer in such high regard that they couldn't take time off to come to an interview, and they had "the most awesome resume I've ever seen" then I'd schedule a phone interview. No matter what time, I'll call him from my houme office if necessary. If I still liked him, *hell yes* I'd come in on the weekend to do an in-person interview.
I can't imagine a manager that wouldn't do the same.
If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
I definitely sympathize with you since I've been in your shoes. Here's what I would have dome differently 10 years ago if I had the experience. Any/all of these should lead to more time to look for work and/or an escape from the hellish grind you find yourself in:
/stress leave. If you can't sleep because you're working so hard, or work is desrupting your otherwise normal life, seriously think about this option. Your medical plan covers this and if you don't have insurance, then you can approach this from a workplace health & safety perspective / unemployment insurance. A hunk of every one of your paychecks goes to fund these goverment programs, so USE THEM. There is nothing wrong with this, and it doesn't mean you're 'weak'.
If you are working so hard that you are stressed to the breaking point, see your physician or psychologist, with the possibility of receiving medical clearance to go on sick leave
Recognize that your employer needs you more than you need them. I say this because if you are filling two roles for the price of one, your company probably cannot do without you. While this is tougher for people to do when they have less experience (aren't wise to 'normal' employee / employer expectations), know that you can establish boundaries and expectations. Advise your manager that you will simply not be able to fulfil the duties of BOTH positions and they're going to have to pick the ONE that you will be responsible for. If they won't play ball, tell them you intend to resign. They will do anything to keep a person that does as much work as you, including cutting your hours substantially.
Realize that salary does not mean 'you will complete as much work as we tell you to, even if it means sleeping under your desk'. There are labor laws which govern this type of employee abuse. Spend a few hours calling local government agencies and find out what your rights are. Better yet, consult a labor lawyer. He may actually be able to extract money for all the extra hours you put in. Plus, the company basically can't fire you after this, because that getting fired for attempting to protect yourself from abusive employment practices is called 'wrongful dismissal', and is worth even more money to you in a lawsuit.
All in all, finally I can just tell you to look out for yourself first. Your company isn't looking out for you, so YOU HAVE TO DO IT. I would suspect that you have a strong work ethic, and want to do good for the company and it's clients, but at the end of the day, are you reaping the profits? NO. So always look out for #1.
Lord_Dweomer asks: "As a recent college grad, I took a job to pay the bills, but soon realized that it would end up sucking the life out of me. I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?"
Leverage your time and connections.
All of those co-worker friends you have, all of those business cards you've been stockpiling at all of those work meetings? They're not just interesting pieces of paper used to convey notes and/or passwords. :) If you're on good terms with those folk, maybe it's time to take 5-10 minutes out of your lunch break to ring them up?
Alot of people I know post their resumes up on resume sites like Craigslist or to Monster/Dice/hotjobs/etc. Takes 15-30 minutes to post, then check on it once every few days. Not alot of time.
Another option is to have automated searches run for you through one of the aforementioned job sites.
Yet another option would be to get in touch with people through a business networking service like jigsaw.
"All my free time, during the week, is completely non-existent, and the weekends are needed to take care of chores, and preserve my mental health.
Okay... what do you do at lunch? Are you taking a lunch? Taking a lunch helps preserve sanity. Not to mention keeping things all legal in the employment law books.
Are potential employers typically sensitive to the fact that I may not be able to interview during the week or during standard work hours?
Depends on the employer and on your value to them. Personally, when I had a job interview, I made sure that the time we agreed upon was convenient to them, myself, and my current employer. Ie, during lunch breaks, at the start or end of day, or I take a personal day off.
The fact of the matter is, you are looking for a new job. If the new job is worthwhile to you, then you will need to invest something into getting that job. That means taking a day off sometimes.
Also, will having left here after a year seem like a real black mark on my resume?
Nope. Especially with the recent job losses in the market, it will seem pretty typical. If you are in the tech field, staying for around 1 to 2 years is, I think, around average if you are fairly well established at the company you are working for. 2+ years is if you are working towards a goal within the company. Less than that, you are building up your resume with projects, completed goals, and exposure to new technologies.
The other issue is that if the workplace doesn't work out, you really aren't obligated to stay. What's the point unless you have no other choice? If you are interviewing, you are engaging other choices.
My reasons for leaving, aside from the overtime (I am non-exempt), would be that I've basically been promoted in work load and responsibilities -- and have even taken on another job role, IN ADDITION to my current one. All of this without a raise in pay, or new title.
You really need to look at what you want here. If you want to get compensated for over-time, then you are looking at switching to an hourly wage. In which case, joining a consultant group (Taos, Kforce, ManPower, etc) would be a good way to go. If you just want a higher salary, but don't want to go hourly, then interviewing at a medium to larger sized business is the way to go. Small/Medium businesses and dot coms tend to have a small core of people who work extremely hard and long hours. Many of them are salaried. They are willing to do this because they probably either have stock options or don't feel the effort to switch jobs is good for them.
Whatever the reason, you need to look at your priorities. Want time left over for yourself, your family, your life, etc? Then add it to your want/need list. Want more money, add it onto the list as well. Which one comes first? Decide that before going into the interview.
Winged Power Photography
I don't know if this reply will get moderated any higher than anyone elses or will ever be seen but anyone, but I'd like to say that I know what it feels like to be overwhelmed, want a way out, and feel like I can't find a way to get out.
There's not an easy way to offer suggestions to a problem like this, and i wish that the rest of the commentors weren't so big on saying things like "welcome to the real world" and "nope, no way out" and actually offer some SUGGESTIONS.
If i were in that situation (and I will be shortly), is I would find a way to FEEL like I am not so overwhelmed. If you make specific ordered lists of the things you have to do each day, you can get things done sooner (like chores, or work tasks etc) and with better organization and management of time, you may find you have a few hours a night before you sleep to get on Monster.com or write or revise a resume or start searching for a new job. You can also grab a newspaper during your lunch break at work and scan ads, highlight them and stick them in your pocket before you go back to work. Every day, find a way to do some small thing related to searching for a new job instead of trying to find a large chunk of time to devote to searching.
Obviously, you'll never be able to find a large amount of time to dedicate to this if you're as busy as you say. The best solution is to manage what time you have more efficiently.
Another alternative could be to talk to your boss and discuss the pressure/stress you are under and ask if there is a way that you can delegate some of your responsibilities to others, or explain that your productivity would go up if you were able to do so. (Don't let on that you're looking for another job) Perhaps go to a supervisor instead first, or ask the advice of co-workers as to how to approach your boss or supervisor about the fact that you are completely overwhelmed and about to go insane.
just be smart about it. If finding a new job is a priority, come up with strategies for finding a few minutes or a half an hour EVERY DAY to searching for a new job. I would imagine that "searching-for-new-job" time would help your sanity anyway, so you're killing two birds with one stone if you designate this time also as self-sanity time.
I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?"
You must work in a call center. Have you thought about joining the Army? I hear they are looking volunteers. Since you have a degree, you could go for officer candidate school. It's not like you'd go and fight in an unpopular war and work in a high-stress environment.
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
One of the jobs I've had in the past was as a headhunter. The agency charged a markup of between 50-120% for contract employees and 20% of the employee's first year salary for placing a full time employee. The contract markup is a bit high, but the salary markup is pretty standard throughout the industry.
Of that, I got about 12% of the markup for contract employees and about 4% of his salary for placing him.
Never pay a headhunter, and when you use them, use several. They work for the employer, not you, so use them as an extra networking tool instead of absolutely relying on them for your next position. I networked several hundred consultants in less than a year while I was working in that job. To a recruiter, no matter how special you think you are, you're nothing but another name, and you aren't irreplacable. Quit because I hated the grind.
Also, realize that most keep regular hours and aren't going to set up an interview late at night or on weekends unless the client is a really good one or unless they're desperate for the dough. You need to make time to interview, so schedule your lunch around it.
Take sick days. If you're looking to leave, why do you care if you're taking days off. While I'm not saying get yourself fired, there's no reason you can't let your performance suffer a bit to find a better position.
I know my previous employer was suspicious that I had so many "dentist appointments" in the week or so before I handing in my resignation . . .
What the parent poster said. Companies can get hundreds of resumes for entry-level tech positions. The first pass someone will do with this stack of resumes is triage - eliminate the obviously bogus applications.
See, of those 200 applicants, 180 are coming from people that shotgun the same resume to each opening they find. These resumes are easy to spot because: 1) there's no cover letter, and 2) the resumes are keyword soup (C++JAVAFORTRANPL/1LISPSNOBOLPOSTSCRIPTVIC-20!!!)
So, you're in the lucky 20. You wrote a cover letter saying who you are, and you wrote a resume that focuses on the strengths, interests, and experience that you have that apply to the company and the specific opening.
You're now in round 2 of triage. At this point, someone with tech experience will go through the 20 surviving resumes to pick out the best 5.
So you've made it to the top 5 - great! Now, for each of these five, an HR person (or someone filling in for this role) will either arrange for a phone interview or an in-person interview. If it's a phone interview, you should have no problem (you do have a cell phone, right? Put it on your resume so they can call you during the day).
The in-person interview will take up a great deal of the company's time. Even if you're only there for an hour, you might be interviewed by eight people. That's eight person-hours of time spent on something other than coding, QAing, or running the things. That's also eight people who have to sync up their schedules to meet you!
So the HR person goes down the list of five possible in-person, and one can't come in during the week. The other four will get interviews, and *if* none of them get an offer, you might get called back. Alternately, *if* you have a stunning resume or have demonstrated an ability to walk on water, you might get to meet with the hiring manager later in the day.
My advice is for you to take a personal half-day, even if you are an hourly employee, to do interviews. Alternately, either schedule a 1hr interview around lunchtime, and be prepared to do a second 1hr if more people need to interview you from the same company, or ask for a phone interview. Companies may prefer the phone option because they can get a sense for you without spending 8 person-hours. But if they like you, you will still have to do the in-person interview later.
One more thing. If you want your resume to be noticed, do your homework on the company. Spend an hour researching them - what they do, who they are - and think about what *you* can do for them. With that knowledge, write a 3 paragraph cover letter about why you are interested in what the company does, and how you think you can help. Also, make a customized resume for the company that emphasizes your interests as they fit with the company (this is especially true if you have a lot of experience - it helps you focus and helps the person reading the resume to fit you into their model of what they are looking for.)
Best of luck with your search!
--Pat
Get this What Color Is Your Parachute book, which is quite good and goes into much detail on all things you've talked about here.
Works for me!
IANAL, but imagine a beowulf cluster of in Soviet Russia all your belong are base to us welcoming the new SCO overlords.
reading a book. One of the best is "What Color is Your Parachute?". You should be able to get it at the library, or any major bookstore. Be careful though to not be seen reading it at work. Management will probably be familiar with it too.
As an alternative, have you tried talking to your manager about the hours? It sounds like you are suffering from burnout. It happens when the hours get long (60 hours a week is not sustainable.) Your boss should know that. Sounds like your workgroup needs more staff. The overtime may be a temporary thing. As you are non-exempt, you should be paid time and a half for it. (US rules) if you're not getting paid overtime, then it's time to move on.
As an employer, I look at how many jobs you have had over time. if you stay less than 2 years, warning flags go up. That's usually over a five year average, though. If it's your first job, that is understandable. there may just not have been a good fit. It's also understandable if you are a job shopper (if you work through a temp agency).
Anyway, first you should work on having a good resume. Do not be 'cutsy' or use the Word Template without modification. Be honest, include a reason for leaving. The reason should not be longer than 10 words. Don't be critical of your current employer, but be honest.
Second, network. Join a professional organization in your field, volunteer. Get to know people in your office who are leaving. Get to know the ones who are staying too. Most jobs are found by word of mouth. Almost all of the best ones are.
thirdly, get to be the best at doing your job in the office. Even if you don't know it, your competitors do have some indication of who is doing the work and what kind of workers they are. Also, you are going to want to be able to use your current boss as a reference in the future. You want to be remembered as a good worker and a good person.
fourth, study any company you do get an offer from. Are you going from the frying pan into the fire? will you like the work? Is it a fit? As you are now employed, you can afford to be choosy. Remember that we employers like getting people who are currently working for somebody else. It means they will be more likely to be good workers. Somebody else already sifted out the duds.
Finally, don't burn bridges. It may feel good for a few minutes, but it will continue to harm you for many years. Be a stellar employee right up to the minute you last walk out the door. You have an ethical responsibility to do your job well for as long as you are being paid.
Good luck. It's a scary journey, but a worthwhile one in the end.
do you have a resume loaded with all your experience ready? if so, spend the time to load it onto the following sites:
Monster
hot jobs
Dice
Career Builder
and www.yourlocalnewspaper.com
Don't worry about your one year at a company so far, people will understand it was your first job, you got your experience and 'want to find somewhere to build your career' (or at least that's a line that used to work).
Unless you're a lame NFL Head Coach who's original team fired your a$$, no one is going to come looking to give you a job. Stay up late one night, get yourself online and order and extra shot of caffeine in the AM.
I forgot what I wanted to say, but honestly, it was important.