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Bioware Developing an MMOG

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the that's-a-nice-monday-news-piece dept.

Gamasutra reports that Canadian developer Bioware has opened a studio in Austin, Texas. The new studio will be the base of operations for development of an as yet unnamed MMORPG. From the article: "Joining the Austin team as lead designer is James Ohlen, BioWare's creative director, whose previous credits include lead or co-lead design roles on Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Neverwinter Nights, Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II. Also leading the BioWare Austin team are MMO veterans Richard Vogel and Gordon Walton." That's some serious firepower. Can't wait to hear what that's about.

75 comments

  1. I'll never switch... by JordanL · · Score: 3, Funny

    ...I play WoW for the incredible story li--wait a minute...

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    FanFictionRecs.net
    1. Re:I'll never switch... by dc29A · · Score: 4, Interesting

      ..I play WoW for the incredible story li--wait a minute...

      Lot of people don't notice the stories of the WoW universe. There WoW universe has a great background story that is rich and interesting. And infact, it's not just WoW. Earth and Beyond had an awesome story and many expansions (and original) EQ too. One of the coolest things cropping up from EQ was a weird designation of mobs from the zone Vex Thal (well some where in Akheva too). Mobs had some weird name that at first sight one would think some coder collapsed on the keyboard and that resulted in the name, but upon further research some players found the patterns. And Diabo Xi Va Temariel was no longer some weird name, but "Weapon Master" or "Master of Weapons". The name of the zone itself means "Heart of Shadow". Of course there is a rich backstory about this zone, as there is about many other things in EQ. There was a whole political like intrigue about the Planes of Power expansion, which God likes the mortals, which is incompetent, which is trying to backstab another and grab more power, and so on.

      Even seamingly disconnected dungeon areas in WoW like Stratholme and Anquirajsdflsfsfsomething (AQ) have common things: Kel'Thuzad seems to be working with the big boss of the insects, C'htun. There are also some very interesting single quest lines like the one you are required to kill Baron Rivendare, you discover along the quest line that one of his minions is infact controlling this anti-horde faction, The Scarlet Crusade, that his big priest is nothing more than a demon in disguise (Grand Crusader ForgotTheName, Balnazzar (sp?)). Another quest line related to this cult starts with a touching story about a father losing his son to some idealistic cult (The Scarlet Crusade). The horde side of the Onyxia key quest has also an interesting story. There is also the demon quest line in Blasted Land which is interesting.

      I agree, on surface these games don't seem to have any major stories other than go there kill that and come back with his head and you get phat lootz.

      But there are great stories in these games and most of them have a very rich backstory.

    2. Re:I'll never switch... by JordanL · · Score: 1

      I agree, on surface these games don't seem to have any major stories other than go there kill that and come back with his head and you get phat lootz.

      But there are great stories in these games and most of them have a very rich backstory.

      I was actually more making a joke about how no one in the game cares about the story line... only if they can get their Arc Trans for less than 5g...

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      FanFictionRecs.net
    3. Re:I'll never switch... by chrismcdirty · · Score: 1

      I have to agree with you there. WoW was the first MMO where I actually found myself reading up on the history in game. I'd actually find books lying around in game and sit and read them to take a break from 'LFG xxx'.

      If you want to get into names, CoH had some great ones for the Freakshow. They were all h4xx0rz.

      --
      It's like sex, except I'm having it!
    4. Re:I'll never switch... by Lord_Dweomer · · Score: 2, Insightful
      "I agree, on surface these games don't seem to have any major stories other than go there kill that and come back with his head and you get phat lootz."

      Unfortunately I don't see any MMORPG ever becoming MAJORLY story driven. Why? Because it is not as satisfying for the majority of their players to actually have to think through the story to progress. Remember, all MMORPGs are in essence...are glorified Skinner Boxes. Having to think through the story is simply a barrier in their clicking through of menus to get their reward. And like you said, it doesn't matter what the story is if the end result is that the quest itself is a generic "kill X, return with Y and be rewarded with Z".

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      Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
    5. Re:I'll never switch... by BloodAngel_Au · · Score: 1

      THe Matrix Online is majorly story driven.... or is was meant to be, but SOE keeps stalling the story since there takeover of the game (which WBIE still supply the content for).

      1 year after going live and we're about 5-6 months into the story :)

    6. Re:I'll never switch... by NFNNMIDATA · · Score: 2, Interesting

      And then there is the storyline for the Forsaken, the ending of which seems to be up in the air. An NPC who seemed to know what the banshee queen is really up to is in a cage in SoS but dies before revealing anything (at least in the quest line I found). Clearly the Forsaken are out for themselves and this will come to a head at some point, but I wonder if Blizz has the stones to really make some kind of world event that will radically alter their faction\reputation\etc.

    7. Re:I'll never switch... by Johnny+Mnemonic · · Score: 1

      I agree, on surface these games don't seem to have any major stories other than go there kill that and come back with his head and you get phat lootz.

      I used to try and read the storylines for the quests, but eventually, since the result was the same, I just stopped caring. Once in awhile I'll tune in, esp if the target is harder to find and I need to pay attention to the description to do so. But that's not often the case.

      I would actually prefer to have more involvement, but since it doesn't really matter it's hard to drum up the interest. And I think it's probably an insurmountable issue: it would take legions of better writers to have to put thought and subtlety into their quests, whereas now they can just put a grind target number of kills on it and pretty much put in whatever (and the latter is ultimately cheaper to manage).

      And, since WoW is an international game, I think the generic kill quests are probably easier to translate both in terms of straight language transposition and also culturally. For instance, the last time I played Final Fantasy frankly it's hard following wtf the (Japanese) characters are on about. I imagine our games are the same to them, and if it required their understanding of our storylines just to play the game they'd lose interest.

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    8. Re:I'll never switch... by Sylver+Dragon · · Score: 3, Insightful

      While the storlines in WoW are nice, they suffer from the same problem all persistent worlds suffer from, they are persistent, a.k.a. static. No matter how many people raid the Scarley Monestary Cathedral, no matter how many times I personally kill Scarlet Commander Mograine, he's still standing there the next time I walk into the cathedral, the Scarlet Crusade suffers no setback. If I complete a quest, I get some text talking about what is happening as a result, but that result is completly ficticious, nothing ever changes.
      Of course, you can't expect the world to actually change for every quest, it would be unmanagable. This was tried with Ultima Online with rather poor results. Origin would have a would event occur and a few high-level players would do it so fast, few other people had heard about it before it was done. So, unless you were one of the hard-core players, and powerful enough to get involved, the quests might as well have not existed.
      So, while the writing that went into WoW is very good, it still is not a story driven game. The backstory is there to provide a framework to hang the "go here, kill X number of Y monster quests" on.

      --
      Necessity is the mother of invention.
      Laziness is the father.
    9. Re:I'll never switch... by mbourgon · · Score: 2, Informative

      Funnily enough, in Guild Wars I found it odd the first time a particular baddie I had killed _did_ come back, because one of the people in the group still had that quest. Instanced _Worlds_ have an advantage there. It's quite a bit why I play it - there's not 500 "heroes" waiting to kill the same critter, only to have some guy run through and steal the "Spear and Magic Helmet" before you get it. It's you, the other people in your party, and The World. That's it.

      --
      "Sometimes a woman is a kind of religion, she can save your soul & set you free from all your sins" - Bad Examples
    10. Re:I'll never switch... by baadfood · · Score: 1

      It *IS* a story driven game you buffoon. If you turn on quick quest text and ignore the story thats your problem.

      Its as much story driven as Lord of the Rings. No matter how many times I read chapter 23, Frodo still does the same thing.

      WoW is an interactive novel that plays out with *you* as the lead protagonist. It doesn't matter that thousands of others have killed the scarlet commander mograine. Thousands of other people have also read LOTR.

    11. Re:I'll never switch... by forgotten_my_nick · · Score: 1

      I believe City of Heroes/Villians are attempting something to make the zone/s dynamic based on who is winning in the storyline for the zone. Or something to that effect. Until I get a look at it hard to know what else (maybe a CoX zealot can fill in the blanks. ;)

      Asherons Call had this somewhat as well. I recall the destruction of Rithwic was due to a random player being teleported to the gods in the game and asked what city he didn't like. Also when the Spires attacked some shards (servers) were able to fend them off and the remains were left behind on the server while others didn't and the zone was changed to reflect that. (afair).

  2. This is too much... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Do we really need a MMOG called Neverwinter Knights of the Old Marsh?

    1. Re:This is too much... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Must be Monday... If Bioware ever does come out with Neverwinter Knights of the Old Marsh, you read it here first. :P

    2. Re:This is too much... by IcyNeko · · Score: 1

      Naah, they'll name it NeverJedi Knights.

  3. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Bjarke+Roune · · Score: 3, Interesting

    " But anyone else think this is what they're going to do witht he Fallout franchise? I don't know whether to be scared or ecstatic..."

    The Fallout franchise is owned by Bethesda Softworks, and they are just now getting ready to work on Fallout 3 after having completed the Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion, so I do not think so. Except if Bioware and Bethesda Softworks are related, which is something I have not heard about.

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    Bjarke Roune
  4. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oops, i got those two confused...they both started with B's and i thought that Bioware was the one that grabbed that franchise from interplay...

  5. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the Fallout franchise is owned by Bethesda Softworks,

    Not quite true.

    Bethesda has the rights to make FO3. Interplay, and Herve Caen, still holds the rights to make an MMO based on the FO universe. Trust me, I follow this crud fairly religiously at the no mutants allowed website and those obnoxious jackholes wouldn't let that fact slip by.

    In fact, Herve was trying to get CI's to make a Fallout-related mmo, but so far its a no go (thank god). I'm as big a FO fan as anyone, but I'm not holding high hopes for the franchise. We'll see what Bethesda does, but...

  6. Maybe. by oneiros27 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Supposedly, although Bethesda Softworks licensed Fallout almost 2 years ago, it was not exclusive license, with Bioware still retaining MMO rights.

    As much as I'd love to see it come out, I just know that if it does, it's going to suck days or weeks of my time that could be spent more productively.

    --
    Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
    1. Re:Maybe. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not Bioware, Interplay.

    2. Re:Maybe. by Kazzahdrane · · Score: 1

      Or, in fact:

      Bethesda has obtained the rights to develop Fallout, they've licensed the Fallout franchise from Interplay (except the MMO license)

      Interplay != Bioware.

  7. They did it for the food. by smaerd · · Score: 5, Funny

    Bioware just likes good eats. They have maple syrup, beer, and putin (sp?) in Vancouver, now they'll have Barbeque Ribs, Barbeque shrimp, Barbeque Steaks, Barbeque Pork Loin....etc

    Now they just need to start a development house in Wisconsin for some cheese, brats, and uh... cheese.... and they'll be all set!

    1. Re:They did it for the food. by Doctor+Crumb · · Score: 1

      Um, Bioware isn't in Vancouver, they're in Edmonton. Which, incidentally, is known for its grade A Alberta beef, generally considered superiour to corn-fed texas beef. :P

    2. Re:They did it for the food. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it's poutine

      putin is almost putain which means whore.
      Don't eat whore, it leaves an aftertaste

    3. Re:They did it for the food. by jason+ward · · Score: 1

      You do know they're from Edmonton right? ;)

      --
      Bloggy Goodness
    4. Re:They did it for the food. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hello??? Beer? Beer brats, and cheese. Thats why I have gained so much weight from moving here.

  8. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Ignignot · · Score: 1

    According to the wiki the Fallout MMO rights are still owned by Interplay.

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    I submitted this story last night, and it didn't get posted.
  9. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Ekarderif · · Score: 0, Troll

    Fallout and Sellout: Piece of Shit were developed in house by Interplay. Fallout 2 was developed by Black Isle, a division of Interplay created by many of the original developers of Fallout. Fallout Craptics was developed by Micro Forte and 14 Degrees East. BioWare has never touched the Fallout series.

  10. design fundamentals by 0biter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Hopefully BioWare will take a page from Second Life and avoid the mistakes made by WoW. In a recent speech at the Game Developers Conference, a designer noted that the players of Second Life contribute over 20,000 design hours per day to the content of the game, which would otherwise cost Linden Labs $400 million per year to produce in-house. To be the "next big MMO", BioWare's game needs to empower players to create their own content and produce player-driven conflict. Otherwise, it'll just be another linear "RPG on rails" a la WoW.

    --
    Homepage
    Obiter Ludens Game Blog
    1. Re:design fundamentals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      The "mistake" spawned like 6 million subscriptions, growing the MMO market by 1000%. I'm sure they will try to avoid it.

    2. Re:design fundamentals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      You mean the "mistake" of being wildly popular and hugely profitable? ;-)

    3. Re:design fundamentals by temojen · · Score: 1

      User designed dungeons! But the user who designs it can't crawl it, and treasure is scaled by both the challenge rating and statistical results.

    4. Re:design fundamentals by masamax · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Just because WoW is popular doesn't make it perfect. Think of how much more interesting the game would be with user created items, or guild halls? User created buisnesses with actual store fronts, not just spamming "ENCHANTS. W ME IM AT THE AH BRIDGE". Things like that help bring in a lot more people to a game while providing more entertainment even to those with no interest in such things, because it grows the user base and gives even power gamers more options.

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      I like to kill your couch. HE DIED HARD! MOO.
    5. Re:design fundamentals by MuNansen · · Score: 1

      Have you actually SEEN Second Life? It's ugly to the point of giving eye cancer. Perfect example of the "hey wouldn't it be cool if...." mentality falling flat on its face.

      People have been pushing the "design your own content" angle for a decade at least, and it has yet to come to fruition because it's a bad idea spawned by ignorant k00l dewds that think they can design better games than the professionals despite the lack of any training or skill.

    6. Re:design fundamentals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      People have been pushing the "design your own content" angle for a decade at least, and it has yet to come to fruition because it's a bad idea spawned by ignorant k00l dewds that think they can design better games than the professionals despite the lack of any training or skill.

      Yea, I can't think of any content that has been created by users that has been worthwhile or even popular. Of course, that's because I haven't played a video game in 25 years so I don't know of things like Counter-Strike or countless other popular mods or user generated maps, textures, sounds, models, and so on. Yup, none of that user generated content has ever been more popular or of higher quality than the original "professional" produced content.

      Seriously, where have you been?! Half-Life sold well for at least 4 years mainly due to the draw of its user created content. Not only has the idea come to fruition, it's already succeeded.

    7. Re:design fundamentals by trepan · · Score: 1

      In my experience in DAoC, guild halls and player housing didn't add much to the game at all. Yeah it was neat to run around and see what guilds had done to their housing...but in the end the the "real game" was going on outside the hall or house.

      If a game can exist and grow in popularity, like WoW has, without any sort of guild housing, I question whether or not it really adds anything to the game (other than it's a demand from the user base--which I grant you is an ends unto itself).

    8. Re:design fundamentals by truffle · · Score: 1

      Simple economics shows you are not correct. World of Warcraft earns orders of magnitude more money than Second Life.

      It's great to argue that player created content would be awesome for a leading mmo, but it's clearly not required.

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      I support spreading santorum
    9. Re:design fundamentals by patio11 · · Score: 1
      Otherwise, it'll just be another linear "RPG on rails" a la WoW.

      Yeah. What kind of gaming company would pass up a chance for a commercial smash-hit like Second Life: The Second Coming in exchange for a derivative also-ran like World of Warcraft.

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      Help poke pirates in the eyepatch, arr.
    10. Re:design fundamentals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Companies want to make money. WoW made a crapload of money. Some would call that perfect.

    11. Re:design fundamentals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Otherwise, it'll just be another linear "RPG on rails" a la WoW.

      Uh... Have you actually played WoW? I'm not really seeing the "linear" bit. The thing I liked about WoW that has kept me there is the huge variety and the ability to make my characters do different things. I can kill, quest, craft, explore, socialize, compete, and otherwisxe interact in a huge variety of ways. Sure, there are storylines, but I don't feel I have to follow them.

    12. Re:design fundamentals by tukkayoot · · Score: 1
      Yeah. What kind of gaming company would pass up a chance for a commercial smash-hit like Second Life: The Second Coming in exchange for a derivative also-ran like World of Warcraft.

      You kid, but the nature of World of Warcraft, and its immense success makes it a tough act to follow. Blizzard made it big with WoW because they produced a game that was exceptionally polished (at least compared to other MMOs out there) and to a lesser degree, because they had a name many people knew and trusted. The game took a fortune to develop. World of Warcraft is not particularly innovative, but it did raise the bar with regard to graphics/art style in MMOs, and it took some of the better aspects of other MMOs and packaged them together neatly with character progression (at the lower levels) that was less prohibitive than most other MMOs at the time.

      The question is, will the same formula work a second time? In order to match the success of World of Warcraft, it will be necessary for people to either defect from WoW (or at else maintain multiple MMO subscriptions), or attract fresh blood (people who currently aren't interested in MMOs or don't know about them ... this is what put WoW in its current position, I think).

      It suppose it's possible that someone else might duplicate Blizzard's strategy and just create a more refined, polished, prettier game and enjoy a comparable number of buyers/subscribers, but it's far from a sure thing, and any attempt to one-up Blizzard is going to be enormously expensive in terms of development costs.

      Which is not to say that it's a bad idea for anybody to pursue. I have no doubt that WoW would still be very profitable even if they only had a half or even a quarter of their current subscriptions and sales to date.

      You can't expect gamers to get too excited over the next WoW clone, though, and I think that anybody who thinks they're going to duplicate WoW's success or even eclipse it by improving on WoW the same way that WoW improved on EverQuest is going to find themselves disappointed, or at very least, severely challenged.

      But there is another way. There is Second Life ... a "game" that many people dismiss, but the concept is exciting, even if the execution leaves a lot to be desired. Think of it was Ultima Online and the other early online games that came before the term "MMO" had been coined. Primitive in many respects, but a promising concept with a strong (albeit small) following, and vast room for improvement.

      Content creation doesn't have to be hard. In Second Life, it's difficult, but watching Wil Wright's Spore presentation, you can see how it can be a lot easier.

      I think the next big expolosion in the popularity of the MMO genre isn't going to be another fantasy hack and slash with prettier graphics, better designed content and a more tolerable system for character progression.

      It's going to be a fusion of the maturing concepts being pioneered today by games like Second Life and Spore and others. Powerful, intuitive content creation tools in the hands of users. Vast worlds that are largely procedurally generated (or crafted by developers using tools that heavily rely on advanced prodcedural generation) that makes unnecessary and obsolete the hacky server shards and dungeon instancing that is the current status quo. It may be a "metaverse" reality that does not revolve around a single avenue of play (combat), but instead is a reality with many games to be played and tasked to be performed, each appealing in its own right, but still linked together as a whole in a coherant manner.

      I'm not saying that this sort of game is just over the horizon. A few technologies still have a lot of maturing to do, and then it's going to take someone with the balls and bankroll to make it a reality, and even then, perfection in execution is far from being guaranteed. In a few generations though, I think that the evolved successor to Second Life is going to make the success of World of Warcraft (and its copycats) look absolutely quaint by comparison.

      I've been wrong before, though.

    13. Re:design fundamentals by JavaLord · · Score: 1

      Hopefully BioWare will take a page from Second Life and avoid the mistakes made by WoW.

      Obviously you are talking about the Paladin class.

  11. New Perspectives by ClamIAm · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hopefully the inclusion of people who have worked on games like these guys have will bring some fresh air to the MMO space. I guess I just have a problem paying for games that aren't really all that much different than everything else.

  12. Don't know what to make of this... by RogueyWon · · Score: 4, Interesting

    On the one hand, Bioware have made some of my favorite RPGs ever: The Baldur's Gate games, the first Knights of the Old Republic, Jade Empire.

    On the other hand, they've always specialised in story-intensive stuff. A MMORPG is a pretty big departure.

    But then again... Square-Enix came from the same place when they made FFXI, and that went on to be a major success by the standards of most MMORPGs (leaving aside WoW). Plus Bioware are arguably one step ahead already, as Neverwinter Nights was online focussed, even if it was a long way from being a MMORPG.

    But then... bigger development houses than Bioware have struggled and buckled under the insane workload required to produce and maintain a MMORPG.

    It'll be interesting to see what license, if any, they're using. I was kinda surprised they didn't get drawn into doing D&D Online, given they've basically made the only D&D games in recent memory that don't suck. If they had, maybe that game wouldn't be getting such dire launch publicity.

    It'll also be interesting to see if they follow up on the work they did with NWN by trying to make a MMORPG that allows for at least some player storytelling capacity (perhaps via a limited player Dungeon Master facility). That would certainly be a new direction for a mainstream MMORPG.

    1. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But then again... Square-Enix came from the same place when they made FFXI, and that went on to be a major success by the standards of most MMORPGs (leaving aside WoW).

      And Lineage I and Lineage II and... Yes, if you ignore enough other competitors, ANYTHING is a raging success!

      But FFXI was NOT a giant success in the MMORPG market that most Slashdot readers are in. FFXI was a success in Japan. It was able to get Japan, a market that very rarely plays MMORPGs, to play their MMORPG. However, outside of Japan, it was at best a second-rate MMORPG. The majority of players remain Japanese, and from what I can tell from the figures they aren't releasing their subscriber base has stopped growing.

      Not to mention that, if you've played the previous Final Fantasy games, there really isn't much of a stretch from "long boring grind-fest where you grind random encounters through a story" to "long boring grind-fest where you grind random monsters through a story with other players". Final Fantasy has never been really good at creating role-playing games, their stories have always been very linear, and their MMORPG manages to remain very linear as well.

      FFXI is still interesting from a technological standpoint, they've managed to create a system that allows people from all over the globe to play on the same servers from one of three different platforms (PS2, XBox360, Windows). From a gameplay point of view, it was essentially a small refinement of EverQuest and remains relatively uninteresting.

      It's also worth noting that originally, Square-Enix was planning on making only MMORPGs in the Final Fantasy franchise following FFX. The concept was that each one would have a life of two-three years, and then they'd release the next one. (This is why it's "Final Fantasy XI" and not "Final Fantasy Online".) They've since gone back on that and future Final Fantasy games will be offline, and they've expanded Final Fantasy XI several times. I'm actually rather disappointed by that, I would have loved to see what Square-Enix could do with an MMORPG on the next-gen consoles if they weren't constrained with remaining compatible with the PS2. A new MMORPG from Square-Enix that builds on the lessons they learned from FFXI and from WoW could be a really interesting game.

    2. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by RogueyWon · · Score: 1

      Just plain wrong on the player-base and level of success. It's steady at around the 550k mark, split about 40/40/20 Japan/US/EU (it was harmed in the EU by an extremely late release and almost no marketing). Player base hasn't grown for a while, but nor has it shrunk. It was the first Western MMORPG to be bigger than Everquest and was the biggest MMORPG around until WoW came out. World of Warcraft is undeniably bigger by an order of magnitude (6 million or something last time I heard). Lineage and the Korean RPGs are always controversial... their player accounts traditionally include a lot of time-limited subscriptions given away free with magazines and other promotions, which are never actually activated. Real player numbers are nigh on impossible to come by, probably a good bit lower than what you hear quoted.

    3. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by ZombieRoboNinja · · Score: 1

      It would be awesome if they could somehow incorporate player-controlled and/or player-created "modules" into the game, a la NWN. But if they did this, they'd basically have to abandon the concept of slow character development, because a generous DM could just hand out rewards out of proportion to the difficulty of the encounters. In other words, I think they have to make a choice between user-created content and structured character advancement. I also think the game may well stink, because Bioware's biggest strength is storytelling, which is NOT a strong point of the MMO genre.

    4. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by ichigo+2.0 · · Score: 2, Informative

      It'll be interesting to see what license, if any, they're using. I was kinda surprised they didn't get drawn into doing D&D Online, given they've basically made the only D&D games in recent memory that don't suck. If they had, maybe that game wouldn't be getting such dire launch publicity.

      I'm guessing they'll use the setting from Dragon Age or Mass Effect. IMO it's a good thing that they're dropping D&D, I mean it's a great RPG and all, but there is only so much you can do within it's limits.

    5. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If at first you don't succeed, discredit those who do, huh?

      FFXI had around 300,000 subscribers before it was released in the US. That pretty clearly makes your "550,000" number and "40/40/20" split wrong. Assuming a 50/50 split between NA/EU, that gives us roughly a 60/20/20 split, which sounds reasonable to me.

      Try this. Go on a random MMORPG forum and start talking about FFXI and see how many people know what you're talking about, and see how many response aren't "oh yeah, I played that game for a week and it sucked".

      FFXI was a large success in Japan and no one is denying that. But anyone thinking it was a success anywhere else in the world is deluding themselves. Final Fantasy games are wildly popular in Japan, we've had several recent Slashdot stories that prove that. But they've never been as popular anywhere else.

    6. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bioware has said they want to create their own unique brands starting with Jade Empire. The main reason they did licensed games was because they did not have the credibility to come up with a successful brand on their own. After Jade Empire all of their games will be new brands. As mentioned Dragon Age is essentially the continuation of Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights without the D&D license. Mass Effect can be seen as a continuation of Knights of the Old Republic without the Star Wars license.

      Hopefully it will be something new unlike another iteration of the over-the-shoulder game a la Asheron's Call, Dark Age of Camelot, and World of Warcraft. Unfortunately that is not likely. It will probably be fantasy and almost certainly be a new brand. Despite their best efforts to add something new they will discover the game is just more fun without all that innovation.

    7. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by Breakfast+Pants · · Score: 1

      Interesting tidbit: the original baldur's gate was going to be an MMORPG.

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      WHO ATE MY BREAKFAST PANTS?
    8. Re:Don't know what to make of this... by Schitzoflink · · Score: 0

      That would be cool if they did some kind of Jade empire style MMO

      --
      Mr. T carries a postage stamp in his wallet at all times on the back is a list of all the fools he doesn't pity
  13. Re:Let's hope they do a better job than SOE by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    why is this modded up, it has NOTHING to do with the article. Mod it down, idiots.

  14. Don't eat Putin by temojen · · Score: 2, Funny

    Poutine is fries with cheese curds and gravy. Russia will be upset if you eat Putin.

    1. Re:Don't eat Putin by Jurrasic · · Score: 1

      yes, and eating a Putain is likely to give you the clap at the very least as well, stick to the poutine. :)

      --
      Devil bunnies! I snort the nose! Lucifer! Banana! Banana!
  15. Re:Let's hope they do a better job than SOE by Why's_This_Fish_So_B · · Score: 1

    Oh FFS, is it even vaguely possible *one* thread with "MMOG" title could exist without the SWG dweeb gracing us with their rants?

    If you have something new to say, fine. The same thing that's already been posted 10^6 times here is already well-known.

  16. Re:I am confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There is no real information concerning the PS3 either, other than the fact that it will be named "PS3", come in a box, and have a controller.

    You're a moron for thinking that everything in the 'Games' section must have some relevant application for the present. This article is about advertisement and letting people know "Hey, something cool is on its way".

    I expect this kind of thing on Digg, but not on /.

  17. Re:I am confused by KingBraden · · Score: 1

    Perhaps I was unclear. I was making fun of the 457 stories posted each week in the games section that had no information but talked about a rumored PS3 delay.

  18. Missed Opportunity by Jfarro · · Score: 1

    Oh why oh why couldn't Star Wars: Galaxies have been operated by Bioware. These guys are the ones that made such a great game in KOTR that I felt the story was equal to that of the original trilogy. Wishing against odds, but it'd be nice if Lucasarts was so fed up with the backlash from fans against SOE's handling of the franchise that they gave Bioware a shot.

    While I'm dreaming, I'd like a pony.

  19. This could be a bad thing... by those.numbers · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Bioware is one of my all time facorite RPG creators. But the MMOG is such a huge undertaking. Just look what it's done to Blizzard (aside from making them even richer). They've got a huge MMORPG fanbase, but for the moment it has seemingly nullfied any strong motive to create good solo RPG and RTS games. I can't blame Blizzard. I just hope Bioware doesn't follow down that road.

  20. Re:Gotta be the first one to say this... by Bjarke+Roune · · Score: 1

    Thank you for clearing that up. One learns something every day :-)

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    Bjarke Roune
  21. Baldur's Gate you say? by Rib+Feast · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I personally would love to see the universe of Planescape: Torment come to life... ahh the early morning stroll down the streets of Sigil...

    1. Re:Baldur's Gate you say? by mmalove · · Score: 1

      This was precisely the comment I came hear to read - I loved Planescape Torment.

      But they need to take it outside of D&D - so that they don't get caught up with Wizards of the Coast and all the d20 nonsense - and instead use a more free form system. I know that's a big plunge, but if anyone can do it successfully, I'd lay my investment in the hands of the company that brought Sigil to life!

      --
      You can get 15 minutes of fame, but you can go down in history for infamy.
    2. Re:Baldur's Gate you say? by Vendetta · · Score: 1

      Torment used the Baldur's Gate engine, but it wasn't developed by Bioware. It was developed by Black Isle Studios.

  22. Not Impressed by vune · · Score: 1

    Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Neverwinter Nights, Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II... Would any of these games be any fun at all without the pause button?

    1. Re:Not Impressed by truffle · · Score: 1

      I played through Jade Empire without pausing!

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      I support spreading santorum
    2. Re:Not Impressed by vune · · Score: 1

      Never played JE. Is it any good? I only heard mediocre reviews, but then I saw it get some award at UGO.

    3. Re:Not Impressed by Doctor+Crumb · · Score: 1

      Jade is damned good; it's a bit slow in parts, but similar in a lot of ways to KOTOR. It's a departure from the standard swords-and-armour environment too, and has some very cool backstory. It's worth checking out if you play xbox games, and someday it might make it to PC...

  23. Two Words by Osmosis_Garett · · Score: 1

    Star Trek.

    1. Re:Two Words by those.numbers · · Score: 1

      With so many new MMOs coming out, I think that the Star Trek niche is one of the last potential heavy hitters. Theres still enough Trekies out there to make that successful. A few years back, I vowed not to pay for any MMO while there was still a good single player game out there. City of Heroes almost made me break that vow. A Star Trek MMO, if done right, will most certainly send me the way of the MMO. Especially if Bioware gives up on solid, single player RPGs in a quest to make the next WOW.