Slashdot Mirror
Sony More Trustworthy Than Microsoft
DesertBlade writes "Forrester Research examined the trust that American households place in PC and consumer electronics. Sony, Dell and Bose all recieved a ranking of A+ while Microsoft recieved a C (I know most of you would say it is closer to a F). "Microsoft faces big consumer defection risk. One measure of consumers' dissatisfaction with Microsoft is seen in the 5.4 million households that give it a brand trust score of 1 [distrust a lot] or 2 [distrust a bit]. Compared with all Microsoft users, these at-risk users have higher income, are much more likely to be male, and are bigger online spenders.(see endnote 7) These households know they run Microsoft software but would be just as happy to leave it behind -- if they could." Does Microsoft face that big of a risk?"
I must say, I'm shocked, with all my personal experiances with them.
Yep, I trust Sony. That's why I don't mind them installing a rootkit on my computer.
Behind Dell, Gateway (?), IBM (!?)--who at home aspires to buy something from IBM?
I don't much care for Sony nor Microsoft, but that distrust sort of falls by the wayside whenever the next Halo* comes out (or whatever your franchise of choice is). We tend to go with the evil we know and purchase as if we had no choice, even those of us that really ought to know better.
*Mock away. I like what I like. And more importantly, my wife likes it.
Anyway, its all 'Brand Potential' and 'Brand Trust' so its all tainted with the marketing veneer of bullshit. I've never worked out how marketeers can get away with 'statistics' that have so many holes they look like a lace dress - but a scientist delivers statistically valid climate data and 'there is too much uncertainty'.
We have a sick society
Neither of which earned my trust truth be told.
Sony is obvious, but Dell, besides the lack of quality in certain parts (which could be directly correlated to cheap prices), loads their new computers with tons of bloatware - you have to sit there and remove programs for an hour to get the speed you expect from your new computer and then still, remnants are left.
This might be standard among the big boys in the PC industry, but last time I got a Mac - I was pretty amazed by the lack of crap (wonders if that will change with Jobs being part-owner of Disney)....
oh if only there were a way!
$META_SIG_JOKE
As it is now, Linux/BSD and Macs lag behind on games, and Linux on desktop speed. Both have some form of compatibility problems, and Macs are expensive. As it is, Windows is the only choice a lot of people have.
By summer it was all gone...now shesmovedon. --
Well, they haven't exactly blown away the home computer market.
SEO Firefox Extension
The Apple Car: looks great, but you need to buy a new engine every year......
I disagree (that MS is closer to an 'F').
Microsoft is the ultimate 'C'. They have built an empire on being just good enough. I mean, a *lot* of very useful work is done on windows the world over, it can't be classified as an abject failure.... but man, it sure is lackluster.
Yup. The very pinnacle of mediocrity. That's the microsoft way.
They still have tremendous inertia in the marketplace. How long has it taken for the general public to have the same perception of Microsoft as a typical /.er? The biggest problem is that Microsoft has gotten people to believe that computers are inherently unreliable, unstable, and buggy - so that people EXPECT such behavior from any computer, not just one with a Microsoft OS or application software on it. As long as a large number of people expect crappily behaving computers, Microsoft's position is secure. In a similar manner, Microsoft has acclimated the business world to the idea that a standalone PC is incomplete without anti-virus, anti-spyware addons and a dedicated IT staff to maintain them.
On the other hand, businesses tend to hold onto computers and custom/favorite apps much longer than individuals do. Apple may have a shot of displacing Windows from household computers, as many people become more savvy about what they need a computer for, which can usually be covered by web browsing, email, document reading, picture viewing, video watching, and music listening, and are willing to pay a bit so they don't have to constantly tinker with their systems. I think replacing Microsoft in the enterprise world will be much harder.
The whole damned report is biased. It's like a Slashdot poll!! Only yuppies by Bose. It's the names the average joe hardly knows that sound best. Klipsch, Energy, Definitive Technologies, A&R, Sunfire, and too many others to even mention. /rant - Just had to sound off
Exactly what I've always thought - allthough I think Apple could blow away any market it chooses to enter.
To put this another way:
Apple chooses to enter only those markets it can blow away.
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Not as long as most people are poor and stupid!
Being trustworthy is not the same as being trusted. Some companies are not worthy of trust, but recieve it due to the ignorance of consumers (and vice versa).
I find these types of surveys useless. I've been running on the same install of winxp for the last two years. I've had no serious viruse and a little bit of malware. I don't find that the system runs any slower then it did the first day, although I'm sure it is, and I would give winXP, from my experience, a B. Having said that. My friends, who incidentally are in the same computer program as me and thus have the same technical know how, are constantly complaining about windows, how slow and crappy it is. I quite frankly don't know what their problem is. So saying that M$ should recieve a C is pointless, because if they asked people like me about it instead of people like my friends then they would do better then a C.
They don't even have to fuck up the technology that much. I mean look at the delayed Vista, its been five years and no one has been able to touch them. Microsoft knows that. That is why their software really only has to *just* work and *just* be useable enough. Their domination is based on that amazing business model they are in, nothing else.
The question is what are YOU going to do about it ? Are you going to keep paying the fee ? If you're an OS maker, are you going to work, not only on the technology, but on the all important business relationships, including working on disrupting MS's relationships ?
Exactly what I've always thought - allthough I think Apple could blow away any market it chooses to enter. ... as long as the market is "portable music players".
Or did I enter a weird alternate reality where there's a Pippin in every living room?
Agreed. I'm sure the main reason for the numbers favouring Sony over Microsoft is the fact that non-techies don't understand the phrase "rootkit", but they do understand the phrase "fuck, it broke".
Erotic is when you use a feather. Exotic is when you use the whole chicken.
I think it would be useful to provide our views on various companies, as a sort-of Slashdot corporate barometer:
Companies that can do no wrong:
Companines that can do no right:
Companies that are currently back in the fold:
Companies where there's a question-mark over our allegience:
I can't think of any strong collective slashdot feelings towards other companies - although, of course, there are plenty of individuals with a beef against particular companies (e.g. that sorehands guy who really didn't like Mattell). Am I missing any?
Damn proles always throw surveys (and elections) out of whack.
You forgot google!
J.
...about as far as I can throw them. There was a time when I thought their software was easy to use and learn stuff with, right around the Win98, Office 97, Visual Studio 6 days. I found the interfaces simple, usable, and didn't get in my way. Of course, this was all when I first started learning about computers and how to write software, so all of this was a new experience for me.
But as new versions came out, the interfaces got clunky and bloated, with features I didn't need, and the software felt less reliable, got in my way more, and generally irritated me. Meanwhile, Microsoft was stretching out and developing new software for other areas of the software market. And it seems like the more products they try to make, the worse the general quality becomes.
And then of course, I learned about all of the anti-competitive practices they had used to get to their current market position. FUD tactics, OEM discounts for using their products, using their Windows monopoly to give an advantage to their other software. Bleh.
So why should I trust anything from Microsoft? They're not focused on getting solid reliable products out to the customer. They're only trying to shove their way into any market they can and push everyone else out. Should I trust a company with that kind of motives?
Respect the laws of physics, for the laws of physics have no respect for you.
D'oh! Yes, I forgot Google. Pre-IPO, they would have been a shoe-in for the "can do no wrong" category, but recent issues over censorship and privacy means that their position there is a little tenuous. I guess overall though, we still love Google, don't we?
I'm no huge Dell fan, but they do what they do well--they sell computers for cheap. But Bose, and to a lesser extent Sony, pretty much base their business on being overrated. Bose would go out of business if it sold its products on their merits, and Sony would certainly get a run for their money from many other competitors who currently have a much smaller marketshare.
English is easier said than done.
Cynics will notice that the headline is logically equivalent to "Microsoft even Less Trustworthy Than Sony"
You can't easily hate Microsoft, because whether you like them or not, at some point you actually have to use their products. Sony, though, Sony is easy to boycott. Sony you can boycott, and loudly proclaim your boycott, without having to really expend any effort or make any personal sacrifices on your part.
Does it count as a boycott if you use a product without paying for it?
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Actually, that's a fairly standard business practice: don't enter markets you have no chance of success in. Maxim
Or to spin it a different way: Microsoft less trustworthy than Sony. :)
Get your own free personal location tracker
Remember when Apple entered that market. They did blow it away in 1975.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Microsoft on the other hand freakin gets slammed every 5 minutes by a different media source, small and large. For crying out loud, Slashdot simply scoffs and says "ANOTHER security update? Dupe!" when theres a new security alert. Of course customers/consumers are going to be paranoid of them.
Heck just look at the different responses between the rootkit fiasco and government reaction to Windows. Sony gets off with a slap on the wrist and a few reports on the major news networks. Microsoft on the other hand gets dragged into court for YEARS, gets sued in MULTIPLE countries, its basicly told to butcher its own work only to have consumers ignore the hack job versions AND it gets threatened AGAIN when they try to ship a new version of Windows with anti-virus software. Which of the two do you think is going to be more popular even for the educated, news following, tech savvy person?
I don't like Microsoft as much as anyone else (Goddamnit Microsoft quit spreading yourself out and focus on a product line so they're all not crappy half-done pieces of work) but saying Microsoft is pure crap compared to Sony is like saying a terrorist is SO MUCH worse than a murderer. They both kill people, the only difference is one gets a wider, and thus worse, reputation for his actions.
I find it ironic that Microsoft's core business is software which is probably what the grade is based on. It's ironic because hardware is one area which they have actually had quite a good track record. They make very VERY good keyboards and mice. I never hesitate to get one when I need a replacement. Their fingerprint reader works pretty well. And until they stopped selling it, their 802.11b wireless routers were some of the very few on the market that even my mother could setup and worked quite reliably. I honestly wonder why they haven't gone deeper into the hardware market. Maybe even into...dare I say it?...computers. Most of the problems with Windows seem to come from the fact that they have to deal with a nearly endless array of hardware in near infinite combinations running random amounts and types of software. If they were able to design a reference computer, I actually think there's a good chance it would run pretty well. It seems to me that they ought to be headed towards the same ground that Apple now occupies. Just my $0.02.
"The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well."
I have considered building and selling my own PCs, so that when clients tell me they're looking for a new PC and ask me who I recommend, I can offer to sell them something good, because I really haven't seen a major OEM I can recommend in good faith.
Go for it. In fact, I strongly recommend that you do so! Put together PCs from OEM parts. (hint: MA Labs is a GREAT distributor) It takes a $1 screwdriver, a power outlet, about 15 Sq Ft of counter space, and a 3-day prepay for parts. In the US, give yourself at least $100-$200 in margin. (it's not about percentage of markup, it's about absolute value, because it usually takes the same amount of time to build/support a cheap-o PC as an expensive one) And, make sure you charge a reasonable fee for additional services. Your time is money, after all!
You'll probably make out on your very first sale. Wash, rinse, repeat, and in just a few years, with some hard work, you'll have your own bona-fide business. Then, you'll be an executive, a notable in your community, and you can join the ranks of CEOs and business owners all over the country who write off their vehicles, and pay others to punctually open the store at 9:00 AM while you saunter in around noon. You can complain about high taxes, the cost of insurance, and the IRS, while sitting at the airport waiting for the mechanic to inspect the airplane you're considering purchasing.
It really is that simple! It's the path I've travelled, and it was well worth it... (and yes, I'm about to buy an airplane)
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
The main problem with Sony is twofold.
a) Quality, they centralized their support structures with desastrous results. In the past a vendor network was making the support, and they got high ratings in quality (just like apple still does) The centralized support saved them money but they now have a lousy support reputation which kills off their sales. The vendors are not very eager to push their stuff as well, due to low margins, while sony still has high prices so no incentive to buy their stuff over the price point either.
b) Sony media slowly kills sony electronics while small companies take over. Most of the idiocy hitting sony electronics came from sony media (DRM, strongly enforced region codes while chines play all under the sky players were sold for 50 bucks next), rootkits etc... This is all stuff coming from the movie division and is hitting the electronics division hard, really hard. The current event showint this is that their UMD disk now is partially declared dead as movie format, the UMD never could take over due to strongly enforced DRM and the price hike coming with it (Speaking of endless greed) which made it significantly more expensive than DVDs.
Maybe not the "home computer" market... but go into just about any successful graphic design/advertising/media production house and you will see macs... everywhere. They're damned fine machines for content creation.
If, however, you also include factors like product quality and innovation then things look somewhat different. The Ohhhs and Ahhhs coming from the computer press every time Microsoft releases a new iteration of Windows are usually quite modest compared to the headlines you get when Apple does the same.
Which is utterly irrelevant - unless you're in the habit of judging a product by the size of its hype cloud. By your measuring stick, for instance, OpenBSD has zero quality and innovation, since there are no 'Ohhhs and Ahhhs coming from the computer press' when a new iteration is launched.
Still, if you meant Apple has blown away the computer market PR then your argument makes perfect sense.
Does it count as a boycott if you use a product without paying for it?
To Microsoft, using their products without paying is better than not using their products at all. One less Apple or Linux user is a win to them, even if they don't get money directly from you. Because you are a still helping create the "everyone needs windows/office/... to communicate" preassure, and some of those using Microsoft products because of that preassure WILL pay for them. Especially companies. Often a company will give "it's what everyone knows" as the reason for buying Microsoft products. And everyone knows because they have an illegal copy at home.
Microsoft knows this. Bill has said himself that a person using Windows without paying is better than one not using Windows at all.
Wouldn't the ball really get rolling *after* they dropped it?
Lalala
Perhaps it helps to think of Sony as a consumer version of IBM as it was 10 years ago. The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, and even when it does, left hand is quite prepared to fuck the right hand over in some way. The net result is a schizophrenic company which sells cool products that are hobbled by DRM or use stupid proprietary formats or storage and consequently don't sell very well.
All the companies mentioned have put out their share of crap. Just the same, each of them has put out at least ONE decent product as well. Really though, the article is all about consumer brand preferences, and isnt a fair measure of quality. (BOSE for example) Myself I like Sony, and I dont buy CD's so that whole rootkit thing hasn't bothered me. Just the same, I have had a few junky Sony products. (How about a Clie that only does about half of what it says it can on the box, or a discman that begins playing cds at about half-speed two weeks after the warranty is out.) Best strategy. Look at the product in-store if possible. Never buy something you cant return, and examine every feature, every structural component. How many of you have ever resorted to using electrical tape to hold your remote control batteries in? Guess what, the one you bought wasn't built to last, just look pretty.
First of all, you could make an argument that MS is at fault with the rootkit issue because of their own design decisions in the OS, and the complete failure to prevent these things from being so easily installed.
But, how can people complain so much about this horrible idea by Sony, when it the end it probably caused no damage as opposed to the mess that we have out there of virus and spyware riddled computers infected because Windows is not robust enough? At the end of the day, this rootkit is nothing compared to what Microsoft has allowed to happen to all the infected PCs out there in the world.
- sigs are for wimps.