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U.S. to Gain Access to EU Retained Data
shenanigans writes "After the EU recently ratified controversial data retention laws for ISPs and other telecommunication companies, it now looks like the US government will get full access to the data. From the article: 'US authorities can get access to EU citizens' data on phone calls, sms and emails, giving a recent EU data-retention law much wider-reaching consequences than first expected'. Apparently, the US has been calling members of the EU to 'ensure that the data collected [...] be accessible to them'."
We know no country in the world misses a chance to be US's little bitch.
Those who do, get attacked.
But don't worry, the US Government would never abuse that information! That would be unethical. That's why everyone in the US is so pleased with the President and his national security policies.
The road to tyranny has always been paved with claims of necessity.
I'm sure with a track record like the Bush Administration's, with domestic wiretapping, indefinite detentions and torture, acts of aggression and brinkmanship against sovereign nations, lying to the U.N., and managing to convince the majority of Americans that this was all incidental, that this access to data won't be abused. After so many mistakes, they've surely learnt their lessons now.
"President George Bush did not deny the allegations in a television statement last night, but insisted that his administration had not broken any laws."
Nixon would be proud.
"You're everywhere. You're omnivorous."
That's the key phrase. The FBI, Scotland Yard and other equivalent government police forces already share data of this nature. (IE large bank transactions, criminal histories, etc)
Country A can't spy on its own citizens (legally), but country B can (because they are "foreigners"). Country B can't spy on its own citizens (legally), but country A can (because they are "foreigners"). Gee, I wonder how they'll solve that problem?
I'm starting to think I should just set up a web page and post my photograph, fingerprints, blood type, DNA records, phone conversations, credit-card, passport, travel history, social-security numbers, and real-time GPS coordinates. It would save alot of hassle and expense.
I have to apologize for the US. I didn't vote for Bush!
Every time I think that the US comes out on top on violating basic rights to privacy, some country in the EU outdoes us. You'd think with such a rich history of war, the citizens would know better.
how it's no big deal when your European governments retain data on you because you know that they'd never misuse it.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Ohhhhh...no. No fucking way. This is some kind of joke, right? Because if not, the fact that the US government is not only willing to fuck over its own citizens but also to use its political largesse to dick with everyone else is just about enough for me to start condoning terrorism. This is essentially what this is, really - the implicit threat behind all of this smells terribly badly. I was already pissed off more than enough by the EU wanting to implement this in the first place.
should absolutly try to solve this kind of problems together with our American fellows, since in a global world a problems for someone is also going to be a problem of all. I mean, please let's not start Yet Another Flamewar about EU vs USA.
Wondering why i am doing so strange posts? I am trying to get a "+5,Flamebait" or "-1,Insightful" rating.
US authorities can get access to EU citizens' data on phone calls, sms' and emails, giving a recent EU data-retention law much wider-reaching consequences than first expected, reports Swedish daily Sydsvenskan.
... agreements" the notes said.
The EU data retention bill, passed in February after much controversy and with implementation tabled for late 2007, obliges telephone operators and internet service providers to store information on who called who and who emailed who for at least six months, aimed at fighting terrorism and organised crime.
A week later on 2-3 March, EU and US representatives met in Vienna for an informal high level meeting on freedom, security and justice where the US expressed interest in the future storage of information.
The US delegation to the meeting "indicated that it was considering approaching each [EU] member state to ensure that the data collected on the basis of the recently adopted Directive on data retention be accessible to them," according to the notes of the meeting.
Representatives from the Austrian EU presidency and from the European Commission said that these data were "accessible like any other data on the basis of the existing
The EU representatives added that the commission would convene an expert meeting on the issue.
Under current agreements, if the FBI, for example, is interested in a group of EU citizens from a member state who are involved in an investigation, the bureau can ask for help with a prosecutor in that member state.
The national prosecutor then requests telephone operators and internet service providers for information, which is then passed on to the FBI.
This procedure opens the way for US authorities to get access under the EU data-retention law, according to the Swedish newspaper.
In the US itself meanwhile, fury has broken out in the US congress after reports revealed that the Bush administration covertly collected domestic phone records of tens of millions of US citizens since the attacks in New York on 11 September 2001.
President George Bush did not deny the allegations in a television statement last night, but insisted that his administration had not broken any laws.
Not all conservatives are stupid,
but it is true that most stupid people are conservative.
- Hume
Finally, a step in the right direction! After years of fucking with our own citizens, we're finally reaching out and fucking with somebody else's.
Hey, at least we're not violating our own constitution on this one.
I know that a lot of people will disagree, but I think this is actually an argument in favor of a strong EU, rather than the other way around. If EU citizens got their act together and created more grass roots pressure groups to put pressure on Brussels, it would be easier to keep a united europe from being arm twisted by the US rather than so many small countries. Just remember how much respect the US has had for Danish wishes to keep Greenland a nuclear free zone...Or how much heed was paid to Blair's request to have steel import quotas not be applied to the UK in spite of the fact that he went out on a limb for them engaging his country in an illegal invasion on what were clearly false pretenses. Remember how Blair wanted token US participation in the climate change conference so as not to appear to come home empty handed? How much deference did he win on that one?
The fact is that to have your voice heard, you need to be an effective counterweight, and pack some clout. This doesn't mean that everything has to be turned into a childish pissing-contest, the way it so often is, but that you need to have enough clout to have your wishes taken into account in bilateral relations
It is EU citizens' responsibility to have this sort of policy reverted at the EU level, not the US's (just as it is US citizens who have to deal with the NSA's very liberal interpretation of wiretap laws...), but once a decision has been taken, the EU has more of a chance of having it be respected that a country with some 5 million inhabitants on its own, just like washington is taken more seriously at the international level than, say, Iowa would on its own.
EU-wide NGO's and parties are still in their infancy. I really hope they get their act together sooner rather than later, people too often forget that reverting any democratic deficit in the institutions has a lot to do with effectively using the conduits available. Democracy is a process you can't expect to get anything out of if you're not willing to put something into it.
Slashdot: news from nerds.
And how do you know that hasn't already happened?
Do you really think they'd make such a development public, rather than classifying it as "undisclosed for reasons of national security"?
The purpose of "national security" used to be to protect the citizens from foreign agents. Now it's merely a political tool to protect the politicians from their own citizens.
I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
...the sound of mobile phones and computers being crushed to bits. ...coming to a garbage truck NEAR YOU.
How long does this sick comedy have to go on before people decide it is time to kick all their stuff into the bin and go live in a cottage somewhere out in the woods with only the most basic amenities, keeping only a PO Box number for the bare essential communications?
I'm getting really pissed at the Powers That Be for pulling their virtual torture ropes ever tighter around privacy and personal liberty.
Soon people will decide that "Amish Paradise" is actually at a much more comfortable distance away from the proverbial Hell than the other alternatives.
(Kudos to Weird Al for making me borrow his song title.)
The Hacker's Guide To The Kernel: Don't panic()!
...is a threat to national security.
Simple Machines in Higher Dimensions
They hate us because of our freedom!
So the solution, of course, is to take away our freedom.
Only in America, the land of the free, can the government illegally spy on your phone calls, internet activity, and reading habits, and get away with it. Hell according to some poll, American citizens are OK with it. In my eyes it's treason what the gov't is doing. If this is the land of the free then why do I have to worry about what I'm saying on the phone when I'm talking to my friend about buying a firearm? Just the phrase "Let's go shooting today" can get me on a red list? Please.
I love my country, not my gov't.
That which does not kill me only postpones the inevitable.
I've lost all faith in everyone, I can't wait until somebody invents teleporters and then they can beam me out of my house as soon as they think I might try and do something illegal.
Come on, they are terrorists, they are dumb, right? The only reason why they attack anybody is because they are evil, right? Plluuuueeeaaasssee.
I'd be surprised if with all this data retention and spying (both US and EU) there will be single terrorist caught *before* the act.
Guess how many terrorists have been caught by the London camera network - which was installed to track down terrorists. If you guessed "zero" you'd 100% correct. Instead that very camera network is now used to keep track of every vehicle that enters the inner city on London.
Somehow through the EU politicians get away with things that would be doomed to fail in any memberstate - well, maybe except Great Britain.
I wish we would gather the same kind of energy to fight poverty, and other more pressing social issues.
FOR HEAVENS SAKE WILL THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT - FUCK OFF!!!!! It's no bloody wonder the world wants to stick a bomb under the White House when these paranoid schizophrenic war mongering assholes will not leave you or anyone to live in peace. I beg and plead with every decent United States citizen to do the world a favor and oust these prats from turning everyone against you. Enough is enough - and trust me I will be doing the same on my side of the pond. Long live freedom.
I live in the EU, so naturally I'm concerned about this.. But: I don't care who reads my sms messages because frankly I expect them to be insecure. My phone calls themselves, yes I worry a little over that because it would enable social networks to be drawn up. But by far the biggest thing I was concerned about was my email, which accounts for well over 90% of my communications.
Then I remembered that I use web based email from a well known search engine who are based in the US. Isn't my data already within US jurisdiction?
(yes, I know TFA is refering to EU-ISP-owned data, but I think it's less of a sudden move than many realise)
It's worked so far. Since Sept. 11 2001, I can't sign up for a new bank account without providing my driver's license and social security card now, and no one has crashed two airplanes into another large building. Coincidence? I think not!
But
All this will do is allow the government to find who you were calling after you've blown yourself up. They hope that that will lead them to someone higher up the chain.
It might.
But it is more dangerous because it can be used to track who your political opponents are calling and what they're saying to each other.
Our ForeFathers were willing to die fighting for their Freedom.
Now, our people are willing to surrender their Freedom for the "protection" offered by the government.
I am moving to China.
The EU is here to stay. The three largest nations control it, without much democracy and the markets are closed. To gain access to the markets you either have to be a member or pay an insane fee.
Norway is not a member, so we pay a fee that is larger than Germany to the EU just to get access to their markets. Norway has 4 640 200 citizens, Germany got 83 251 851. In return we must also make all these directives a part of Norwegian law to ensure Norwegian corporations compete on equal terms and do not gain any advantage.
Norway can afford it, but most nations in Europe can not. They just bend over and hope to get accepted.
Not sure we have it any better outside and we have to follow all the madness they decide yet we have no way to influence the decisions of the EU.
I've stayed pro-US all my life, but the developments the past 5 years has made me even more skeptical to the US than the EU. I see both as a big threat to privacy.
The world is pretty much screwed the way I see it. I fear that there is no return.
There's already been a fight over data transfer from the EU to the US. EU privacy laws are strict and forbid leaking data to any place without the same protections. There were long negotiations ending in a fudge.
So is the EU simply ignoring the law this time?
The E.U. is worse in terms of democracy, because a lot of its government is done not by people elected by the demos, but by people nominated by national governments and without direct accountability to the people they govern. This is one of the reasons that I want out.
Instead of people spending all their time wondering why we aren't doing anything to stop Dubya from setting up his 1000 Year Empire, they can take a moment to think about what they are doing to stop their own countries from capitulating to everything the U.S. demands.
Unfortunately the media on all sides seems to have forgotten what reporting is all about, seems like you have to read blogs out there to get straight information without opinions being shoved down your throat. The media is the powerful polarizing tool. Unless a person has millions of dollars to spread the word it cannot effectively be communicated to the people that matter. So people that disagree have to stand up and say something in the hopes of finding someone with the resources who agrees. It starts in places like these but yes, come election time I'm gonna have to get out and spread the word as much as I can just like I did around the last election.
Probably didn't make a big impact but its worth trying.Ultimately this will end like the US-EU air passenger data deal - with no data being turned over.
When this arrangement was made, this was exactly the predicted outcome. So its literally no suprise.
What is a suprise is that the citizens (and subjects) of EU countries don't say a word about it, or not enough to make their elected representatives worry they'll lose their place a trough if they don't change things.