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Computer Designed Car Sets Speed Record

amcdiarmid writes "Several sources are reporting that the first entirely computer designed car, the JCB Dieselmax, has broken the diesel speed record of 236MPH at a speed of 328MPH. From the article: 'The record attempt came after a string of trial runs on the runways at the airbase. But while testing went well, the team endured a troubled time in the US. The combination of the altitude (4,000ft) and the higher air temperatures affected the performance of the second engine, which was generating insufficient turbo boost pressure and led to days of work for the small team of engineering experts.'"

52 of 247 comments (clear)

  1. That's pretty fast by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Funny

    broken the diesel speed record of 236MPH at a speed of 328MPH.

    But they could probably top 350 MPH if they'd ditch the CB antenna and Yosemite Sam "Back Off" mudflaps.

    this thing gets some real looks at the Sapp Bros.

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    1. Re:That's pretty fast by Tackhead · · Score: 4, Funny
      > But they could probably top 350 MPH if they'd ditch the CB antenna and Yosemite Sam "Back Off" mudflaps.

      Me an' Tim was haulin' chickens
      O'er a lakebed outa Wiggins
      And we had spent all night on the uphill side,
      Of thirty seven hundred square miles of hell called Bonneville Flats,
      (Which was up on the great divide...)

      And we was sittin' there readin' Slashdot,
      And moderatin' like Crow T. Trollbot,
      And I says "Tim, let's send an Internet down the tubes,
      And then send them chickens on down t'other side"
      (Yeah, lets give them hens a ride.)

      Chorus:
      Bonneville flats, way up on the great divide,
      Truckin' on down, the other side.

      Leverton put down his bottle,
      With Andy's foot down on the throttle,
      Ate a couple o' smores, then 1500 horse,
      from a two-thousand-ought-six Dieselmax screamed to life.
      (We woke up the chickens.)

      We roared up off'n that shoulder,
      Sprayin' pine cones rocks 'n boulders,
      And put four hundred head of them Rhode Island Reds
      And a couple of burnt out roosters on the line.
      (Look out below. 'cause here we go...)

      ...and I really don't have to change another word of Wolf Creek Pass, by C.W. McCall, from that point onwards, because the ride was just about as hairy.

      'Cept for that feed store in downtown Pagosa Springs. Place was still a mess from when that truck done run through it.

  2. all part of the plan by User+956 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Several sources are reporting that the first entirely computer designed car, the JCB Dieselmax, has broken the diesel speed record of 236MPH at a speed of 328MPH.

    ..and it will help those computers find Sarah Connor just that much more quickly.

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
    1. Re:all part of the plan by Majik+Sheff · · Score: 3, Informative

      Approx 528 Km/H or 881664 furlongs/fortnight

      --
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  3. Imagine the bandwidth of... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    a diesel computer designed car going 328 MPH filled with hard drives.

  4. Then it did it again... by chill · · Score: 4, Informative
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    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    1. Re:Then it did it again... by BWJones · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yeah, this was their plan to do it incrementally. I got some great shots of the JCB team doing their thing during Speed Week here. The Dieselmax team was having some problems setting up the car for the salt and were gradually working their way up and had planned all along to really go for the record the week or so after Speed Week.

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  5. Deisel motors by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 3, Funny

    But while testing went well, the team endured a troubled time in the US.

    Sources said the motor had been making an unbelievably loud clunking sound, as well as spewing black smoke. Only later did they figure out that was the way the engine was supposed to sound.

    (/RM101, the not-so-proud one-time owner of a Diesel Mercedes Benz, the loudest, most embarrassing-to-drive car he's ever owned)

    --
    Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
    1. Re:Deisel motors by BLKMGK · · Score: 4, Informative

      This particular diesel doesn't smoke - it's running a blended mix to help prevent that. Black smoke is unburned fuel and a sign of an improperly tuned diesel. The low sulphur fuel will help air quality and allow us to FINALLY get some of the better diesels here but I don't think it will change the exhaust smoke since if the car is running right it shouldn't smoke anyway. I've got a new TDI and I've yet to see any smoke but expect to see some come Winter...

      --
      Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
    2. Re:Deisel motors by afidel · · Score: 4, Informative

      The black smoke hasn't been a problem for properly maintained engines ever, but much cleaner diesel's should be available in the US this fall. Refineries have been producing S15 Low Sulphur diesel since June and all retail outlets should have it by October 15th according to EPA requirements. This means that manufacturers can start importing designs from europe that are designed to run on ultra low sulphur diesel fuel. These designs are MUCH less polluting then engines designed for low grade diesel. For more info see link

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    3. Re:Deisel motors by arivanov · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The only way not to see smoke ever is to do additional injection of propane into the fuel mix which is known as gas-diesel, eco-diesel or white diesel (depending on the country). It is quite common in European public transport. In some places (Milan, other Italian cities, parts of Germany, etc) most of public transport runs on this and it is great. No smoke whatsoever. Unfortunately (as most things invented by Germans on the continent) it is not allowed for cars and trucks in the UK. You can have it on a boat or on a stationary diesel generator, but you cannot have it on a car (at least officially).

      Considering the quality of air in London and the fact that all London buses and all London cabs are diesel this is not just stupid. This is outright criminal.

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    4. Re:Deisel motors by BLKMGK · · Score: 2, Informative

      Duh, of course it should and it *does*. You'll note that COLDER temps actually cause LEANER Air/Fuel mixtures not rich which is what black smoke indicates. However colder temps also mean that the fuel doesn't atomize nearly as easily - even at the sick pressures the TDI uses. The result with a diesel, just like a gas vehicle, is rich mixtures in order to get combustion at all and that means some smoke from a diesel as unburned particles make it out the pipe. Warm it up quickly and the emissions impact is lessened.

      --
      Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
  6. Are we talking... by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Funny

    a diesel computer designed car going 328 MPH filled with hard drives.

    An information super highway, here?

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  7. The Speed of /. by 1+(smarterThanYou) · · Score: 3, Informative

    http://www.engadget.com/2006/08/23/diesel-powered- car-edges-on-half-the-speed-of-sound/ Apparently Slashdot isn't as fast as it used to be. That car has already hit 360+ mph. 320+ mph is now old hat. As an aside, all these smaller blogs seem to be able to keep up with the news much better than slashdot these days. I often find myself with a feeling of deja vu when I'm on Slashdot, as I've no doubt read the clippings elsewhere a few days prior. Ah, the problems inherent in scale.

    1. Re:The Speed of /. by Moofie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      So go. I won't miss you. Promise.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    2. Re:The Speed of /. by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 2, Interesting
      I often find myself with a feeling of deja vu when I'm on Slashdot, as I've no doubt read the clippings elsewhere a few days prior.

      Does that really matter in the big scheme of things? When I was a kid, I found out about stuff like this in places like Popular Science magazine. Most all the tech news I read was already at least a couple of months old by the time I saw it, but despite that I seem to have turned out OK.

  8. Come on, 'entirely computer designed' ? by ScentCone · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The connotation is that someone signed onto a machine somewhere and at the command prompt, typed "design_car -fast -diesel", and poof, there's the design.

    It's a human-designed car, designed by humans using computers (as they have for decades), and no pencils this time. TFA goes on and on about all the people on the team and the work they did, and that's great. So, what's with the headline and summary?

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    1. Re:Come on, 'entirely computer designed' ? by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 4, Funny
      design_car -fast -diesel
      What is it with these Linux geeks. They think the whole world works on the command line. Everyone knows that this car was built by double clicking on "Car", selecting "diesel" in the "Car Design Wizard" and then pushing the speed slider to the top. And apparently there's a hidden option in the registry that increases the range of the speed slider so we expect this record to be broken again very soon.
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    2. Re:Come on, 'entirely computer designed' ? by lemonylimey · · Score: 2, Informative

      What's trying to be said on the site is that the car didn't undergo any physical testing or prototypes before the metal was cut for the production car. The mechanical parts were tested with Finite Element Analysis and, more notably, the Aerodynamics entirely with Computational Fluid Dynamics. Although most cars are designed entirely on computers these days (The Deiselmax on Unigraphics, incidentally), they'll invariably make a model of the car and test it in a physical wind tunnel. This is true of even ultra-high-end development like F1 - the Toyota team has three Wind Tunnels that run 24/7/365 when they're not down for maintainance.

      This wasn't an option for the Dieselmax for two reasons. The first was the speed involved - most automotive wind tunnels with the 'rolling road' surface required for accurate results top out around 240mph, way short of 375mph. The second, much more important factor is size - this car is nine meters long! Normally high-speed road car models are tested at between 1/3rd and 1/6th scale, and to fit the Dieselmax onto a rolling road tunnel would require a very small model, and the results you got from it would be very nearly useless.

  9. FYI by hurfy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Since it was the 1st thought i had......

    Gas-powered seems to be at 410mph

    No idea why that record held so long for diesel at what seems a low number (236 vs 410)

    1. Re:FYI by DragonWriter · · Score: 3, Informative

      IIRC, diesel engines generally produce less power output per pound of engine weight, which hurts them in speed contests against gasoline negines. Their advantage in many applications is that they are more cost effective in terms of the kind and quantity of fuel consumed to do their work.

    2. Re:FYI by kfg · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No idea why that record held so long for diesel. . .

      It's pretty simple really; lack of interest. It takes someone to put in the time and spend the money and it's not one of your sexier targets.

      For the production outfits like Volkswagon there's also very little promotional value in streamliners and virtually none for custom engined cars. They've got to hop up what they sell to imply that's what you're buying.

      And diesel buyers are economy buyers.

      KFG

    3. Re:FYI by StikyPad · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'm not sure, but I suspect diesel burns slower. Diesels are also more difficult to build because the compression is much higher, and the fuel is injected at the top of the stroke when the air is already compressed. I imagine both of these could cause problems creating high-RPMs, which is how most standard gasoline racing engines generate their enormous torque.

      I'm not an engineer, but that's just my (un)educated guess.

    4. Re:FYI by LunaticTippy · · Score: 3, Informative

      You're wrong about diesel. It is a more efficient design, giving much higher torque per pound of engine weight and often more horsepower. There is an interesting bit about a diesel race car needing to be handicapped to compete fairly with gasoline cars here.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    5. Re:FYI by BLKMGK · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Diesel gives more torque partly because as a fuel it contains more BTUs per gallon than gas - it has more energy. Compression ignition is also more effeciently (apparently) which results in better MPG. Part of the reason why that Audi did so well was because it didn't have to refuel nearly as often as it's competitors - I believe it was allowed to run the same size fuel tank as the others. As for weight - diesels generally have heavier engines as they stick to iron and don't use aluminum. The compression loads are a great deal higher and the aluminum apparently cannot handle it.

      Personally I cannot wait for someone to build a diesel hybrid. Now that ought to get some good MPG!

      --
      Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
    6. Re:FYI by cerebis · · Score: 3, Informative
      No idea why that record held so long for diesel at what seems a low number (236 vs 410)

      By default, really.

      236mph, while indeed fast, isn't extrodinarily fast by today's standards in car performance. It will have simply been a lack of interest. If they break the broader "internal combustion" record of 409.3mph it would be more impressive, but then again that was set in 1965...

    7. Re:FYI by Massive146 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But weight doesn't matter that much in top speed contests. The top speed is determined almost entirely by the horsepower and aerodynamic drag. It's only a problem if it takes too long to accelerate up to speed. During speed week they have 4 miles to get up to speed. If that is not long enough, I'm sure they can come back later, on their own, and get a longer course set up.
      But I'm not sure what disadvantages a diesel engine would have. Maybe because not as much research has gone into high performance diesel engines as standard gas engines. Or maybe because diesel engines tend to be built much larger to handle the higher combustion pressures. And a larger engine would result in a less aerodynamic car. I think the former is the most likely reason.

    8. Re:FYI by JonathanR · · Score: 2, Informative

      The diesel torque advantage (over the otto cycle) is due to the higher brake-mean-effective-pressure of that thermodynamic cycle.

      The volumetric fuel efficiency (mpg) advantage is in part due to the higher LHV (lower heating value) of diesel fuel.

      The energy efficiency advantage is, in part, due to the higher compression ratio typically used and in part due to the lack of induction throttling for power control (less pumping losses). The noise generated by diesels is mostly due to the fast cylinder pressure rise. Diesel noise reduction is partly effected by compromising the ideal diesel cycle (and some of the related efficiencies).

    9. Re:FYI by bibi-pov · · Score: 2, Informative
      Personally I cannot wait for someone to build a diesel hybrid. Now that ought to get some good MPG!
      You mean like the buses in New York City for instance, or the Fex-Ex fleet ? And these are just a few example, checkout this page
      As for diesel in a personal car, well, a lot of people work on it, have prototype and even have scheduled to sell them in a couple of years. Just ask google for more...
  10. Yeah, but... by dgatwood · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...the ping times are a bitch.

    --

    Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    1. Re:Yeah, but... by x2A · · Score: 4, Funny

      It took 5 days for a car my secretary sent to reach me, because it got stuck in traffic. You see, cars aren't like trucks, you can't just dump loads of stuff onto them. Cars are a cereal of tubes, they run on... I'm not finished, they run on milk in a bowl. Excelsior!

      --
      The revolution will not be televised... but it will have a page on Wikipedia
    2. Re:Yeah, but... by doubtless · · Score: 2, Funny

      did your secretary notify you of the internet I sent to you last week?

      --
      geek page at KY speaks
  11. You're wrong. by Poromenos1 · · Score: 2, Funny

    You're full of it. The article is 100% true.

    This post was designed by a computer.

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    1. Re:You're wrong. by ampathee · · Score: 2

      You can tell it's a computer by the courier typeface.

  12. I followed the link... by agentcdog · · Score: 4, Funny

    and was surprised to see that this thing really runs on 440 AA batteries. Quite the misleading article. Diesel indeed.

    --
    If I understand Dirac correctly, his meaning is this: there is no God, and Dirac is his Prophet. -Pauli
  13. In other news.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Ford has announced that they will begin testing a prototype computer built entirely by a car. The car used to design the computer is actually a Beowolf cluster of recalled Explorers and Expeditions from the Firestone debacle of some years ago.

    "We think we can use the characteristics of our best-selling cars to build huge, powerful computers with more space than anyone else", said a Ford spokesperson. "Our latest prototype model already has eight CPU cores in a V shape. It can seat seven hard drives (two of which are situated at the front of the enclosure, visible through the glass front bezel of the machine) and we're making lots of strides in how we can build tires on to the thing so we can drive it around the office while we download our emails and pick up our kids from soccer practice."

    Chevrolet declined to comment on whether or not they were working on something similar. All they said is that they think Fords suck and tried to sell us on a new Corvette. "It's an American Revolution", said the salesman we interviewed at the local Chevrolet dealership.

  14. Neat by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 2, Funny

    I found a pic of it here.

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  15. Turbo Boost by Megane · · Score: 4, Funny

    The combination of the altitude (4,000ft) and the higher air temperatures affected the performance of the second engine, which was generating insufficient turbo boost pressure and led to days of work for the small team of engineering experts.

    Don't they know that K.I.T.T. can only use the Turbo Boost once per episode?

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  16. Re:Sure that's fast... by Tarquin+Sidebottom · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Interestingly enough, as well as a common driver (as pointed out in the post above), both vehicles had their aerodynamics designed by Ron Ayers.

    http://www.jcbdieselmax.com/html/team.php?team_id= 5

  17. Designed? by quanminoan · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I RTFA and visited the site but exactly how is this car "designed entirely by computers"? More likely is that the computers optimized each component through simulations based on human input. Can anyone fill us in to how exactly the computers helped design the car?

  18. Funny though by Fei_Id · · Score: 2, Informative

    I believe the fastest gasoline powered vehicle; was a single engined vehicle. This diesel is a twin engine. Aerodynamics play a HUGE HUGE factor in top speeds. It takes an enormous amount of horsepower just to increase the top speed by a small amount. Same reason why bikes suck so bad on the top end. Their power to weight ratios on paper show ridiculously fast acceleration numbers possible at higher speeds. But in reality; they are beaten by lower power/weight cars for higher speed runs; solely because of aerodynamics. That and power/weight means much less at higherspeeds. Its more about horsepower and gearing. Ok I'm talking to much now. PS. Ever seen a diesel drag racing vid of a semi-fast one? They blow huge columns of thick black smoke.

  19. Forget fast...... by Rank_Tyro · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...."we need ludicrous speed".

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  20. It uses 2 backhoe engines! by gurudyne · · Score: 2, Informative

    One of the design factors for the original engine was to function as a backhoe counterweight. This made the engine block and other components so robust that the engine could easily survive the 2-stage turbocharging.

    They used 200 liters of ice for cooling, had diesel particulate filters on the exhaust, and got 4 miles to the gallon. The car had only 2 gallons of fuel to start. They used a tractor with the same engine, untweaked, as a push vehicle.

    --
    Hey, Mom! Is it beer, yet?
  21. Conversions by cheese-cube · · Score: 2, Informative

    For the more metrically inclined among us, 236 M/h equals 379 Km/h (105 m/s) and 328 M/h is 527 Km/h (142 m/s). While the imperial system does have its merits, 527 Km/h looks so much faster than 328 M/h :P

  22. Why care? by bjackson1 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This is a serious question. Why should I care how fast we can get a diesel engine based car to go? Last time I checked the fastest I drive is around 80mph. I'd be much more interested to see more efficent engines, than more powerful. However, could this technology trickle down to produce more efficent engines? Is there any practical application to this, besides pure speed?

    1. Re:Why care? by donaldm · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Surprisingly people do base their car purchase on how fast a car can go and the brand that can do this.

      I just recently brought a VW Passat 2.0 TDi with Direct shift gearbox and there are a few words that describe it. Excellent performance, economical (approx 5.5l/100km (approx 42 US mpg) to 7.0l/100km), comfortable seating (5), large boot, luxury mod cons and cheaper then its petrol equivalent. Granted there are some petrol cars that can beat it off the lights (if you are into this) but it seems strange that in normal Drive (there is sports and tiptronic as well) I still leave most cars behind and I am not even trying. On the open road I can easily keep up with the traffic and the engine is very quiet although there is a little bit of diesel rattle at idle. That's not bad for a engine that is rated at 103kW (138hp) with 320NM torque and there are better engines coming (with about the same fuel economy) within a few months.

      Modern diesel cars are very competitive in price between their petrol equivalent. It must also be noted that 50% of cars sold in Europe are diesel although in the US and in Australia it is nowhere near that but it is increasing.

      Before anyone buys a diesel car please do some homework taking into account the price difference between the diesel and its equivalent petrol engine (the VW Passat was cheaper but some other diesel cars are not) also work out how far you are going to travel in a year and the cost in fuel to to this. In addition work out the difference in servicing costs (diesel should be cheaper but be careful). Just about all other things such as tyres, registration and insurance should be the same.

      Use Google to search on diesel, bio-diesel, comparison between petrol as well as other fuels such as hydrogen, alcohol ... etc and it gets very interesting.

      --
      There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
  23. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  24. Re:British Engineering by BiggerIsBetter · · Score: 2, Funny

    Joke all you like, but it's very difficult to make an engine that leaks oil continuously yet never actually falls apart.

    --
    Forget thrust, drag, lift and weight. Airplanes fly because of money.
  25. Re:But this thing uses TWO engines. by Cederic · · Score: 2, Insightful


    Oh please. That thing's slow to accelerate (compared to several production cars, let alone production motorbikes) and adding another engine will massively damage its weight. Its top speed is practically pedestrian - my French family saloon can go as fast.

    Incidentally, how do you define a 'right hand turn'? Not that turning matters on a straight-line speed record (although keeping the thing in a straight line becomes interesting - Andy Green had the wheel turned to full lock trying to keep in a straight line on the land speed record run).

  26. That's pretty much over 88 MPH... by Bega · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...but does it have a Flux Capacitor?

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  27. Re:But this thing uses TWO engines. by donaldm · · Score: 2, Informative

    Looked up this "bike" (3 wheels). Nice! but many bikes can beat most cars from a standing start, however some diesel cars (keeping on-topic) can actually go much faster than 140mph but there are very few places in the world that you can do this legally much less safely. I had a Subaru WRX (there are many cars that can beat this) that could easily reach this speed but you needed to go to a track to do it. Get caught by the cops and its by-by license and "watch your fingers" as the cell door closes.

    Anyway back on topic.

    A jet or rocket engine could easily beat any road vehicle in a straight line but what we are looking at here is a diesel powered car with mechanical linkage from engine to road wheels. I tried a Google search and this is definitely a first although they say they are going to try for 400mph. Should be interesting since to win as the fastest internal combustion engine car they have to beat the following.

    For petrol internal combustion engine so far (note the date):
    When: November 13, 1965
    Where: Bonneville Salt Flats, USA
    Who: Bob Summers USA
    Car Name: Goldenrod
    Speed: 409.277mph, 658.526kph (over 1 mile)

    All other cars after this have been jet(turbo fan) or rocket. Then again none of them are street legal.

    --
    There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
  28. British Engineering very good at small scale prod by Flying+pig · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Who does most of the engineering in Formula 1? It employs more graduate engineers in the UK than you would imagine. The trouble with the UK is we are incredibly good at small scale production of highly designed objects, but the poor quality of our management, sales and marketing means we are no good at high volume production - we just don't do high volume customer service. When it comes to breaking records we can churn out things like Thrust 2. We churn out things like the Harrier but we can't build volume commercial aircraft (and BAe wants out of Airbus). JCB make excellent specialised industrial machinery, which is the end use for the Diesels they are testing to destruction in this record breaker. Dyson makes his vacuum cleaners in Malaysia, but the engineering is done in the UK.

    Ford makes its European Diesel engines in Dagenham, and Honda makes advanced cars successfully in the West Country. Give us some decent (i.e. foreign) management and sales to support our engineering efforts, and we are up there with the best.

    --
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