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Safe Computing For the Elderly?
wingspan asks: "My 80-year old mother is insisting on using this new fangled thing called the Internet for banking and brokerage. I researched ways for her to perform those activities safely. The typical suggestions, from organizations such as BITS [pdf], include installing anti-virus, anti-spyware, anti-spam, anti-adware, browser toolbar, and a personal firewall. The suggestions also include not clicking on links, verifying security certificates (If it has a cert, it must be a good site!), making sure the address begins with 'https://' regularly updating the security software and patching all other software, and regularly changing passwords. Personally, I think the technical suggestions are too Windows-centric, too costly, and leave too much of an attack surface. The non-technical suggestions are simply too much to ask of the elderly. What do you think? Is it possible for an elderly person to safely perform Internet banking and brokerage? If so, what system should they have, how should it be configured and maintained, and how much of the security should depend with the elderly user?"
I've had great success getting technically incompetent people to avoid the evils of the Internet by introducing them to Linux.
They hate the bootup sequence text and the weird program names, so they quit using computers altogether and get back to using ATMs.
This may or may not be what you are trying to accomplish with your grandma.
A rather elitist and patronizing view of the elderly.
Author needs to be whacked with a cane.
Use upgraded antivirus, adware and spyware blockers and a good firewall. Beyond that the main concern is to never fall for phising attacks - ie you have to teach them that their bank/broker will NEVER send them a mail asking for them to log in or any such thing. Teach them to just say no to links in emails. This is a particular problem for many inexperienced users who tend to blindly trust the email headers.
Odds of more exotic attacks are slim enough to be ignored for every day users and really isn't a concern. If they move enough money to be specifically targeted, then they have enough money to have a personal computer security expert look over the system regularly.
First of all, go with something *you* are comfortable with, because you're going to be the first person she calls in the event of an emergency.
Otherwise, considering going Apple. Sure some will decry the proprietary aspects, but it's an *easy* system to use, and with Applecare she will have a years worth of tech support from someone who is inside the US of A if you're not availabe.
My 76 yo Mom has a Powerbook for her internet related stuff, and a Winbook, because she was a long time Windows user and her embroidery stuff runs only on Windows (it's tied to a Bernina, who offers no Mac port of their software).
I think if she hadn't been into the sewing thing we could have gone straight Mac. She understands too, that if she needs to go on the internet for any reason with the WB, she uses "that other account you set up for me" (i.e. non-Admin), cause it's safer.
FWIW, the PB has been just fine for 3 years, the WB has had problems within 3 months of purchase, YMMV.
Good luck, whatever you do.
Some days it's just not worth
chewing through my restraints.
I found that it installed on Grandma faster, less hassles thanks to older hardware, and she was safer than anything. She's surfing the web safer, providing a decent firewall, and she's quite happy playing solitaire when not online. I did notice that she gets revved up when running nethack - gotta talk to Theo about that one.
Since she isnt gonna install applications but only browse the Internet, she doesnt need to understand how her OS works. So i would say go for a Ubuntu with icons to the few programs she will use on the desktop (Browser, Mail client, Text editor). Once this is done, you re safe from every threat except phising. As someone else said before you will have to teach her about the danger of links in e-mail, and that they shouldn t trust their email.
Apple Macintosh.
I bought a MacBook for my mother's birthday. She has never had any problem whatsoever and this is the first time she uses Mac OS X. My brother has bought her a Windows laptop (Toshiba) before but it was too hard to teach her the security expertise required to safely operate it connected to the Internet. Needless to say we decided to do what Slashdotters advised us to do - that is buy her a new Linux notebook (Assus). Well, let's just say that we had to find something else *cough*copyandpaste*cough*. So I bought her a MacBook. Now she can safely do anything she wants and as a bonus she can watch DVDs on a nice 17" screen. (She also told me that finally the software don't look like sh*t.) And she's probably right saying that she was sick of us telling her that she needs to learn this, read that, buy a book on this etc. She wanted to just use the dam*n thing and that's what she's doing now. So this was the best thing I could have possibly done. $3.299,00 is nothing compared to the time (and therefore - money) I have saved thanks to Apple, Inc.
Karma: Positive (probably because of superiour intellect)
I'm amazed at how user-hostile Windows is when confronted with someone who has never seen a computer. My girlfriend's elderly grandmother just got a computer for the first time. It's an interesting situation cause she has never used one before in any way or form. I was on the phone with her trying to help her out and when I'd say "click OK", I had to explain that she had to move the cursor over the box that said OK and press the button on the mouse. Now imagine that kind of user confronted with a popup saying "Google Desktop is attempting to connect to the Internet. Allow? Keep Blocking?" It totally freaked her out, and explaining firewalls and how the Internet works was futile. It's like a completely different planet for her. I don't know if Linux or Mac OS X would be any better, but I wonder. What's a good system for someone who hasn't touched a computer before? What would this system need to be like?
The perfect sig is a lot like silence, only louder
Agreed; the problem is that things that seem like trivial "user training issues" can be very difficult to teach people with memory problems. This is an issue both when dealing with the elderly, and also with the learning disabled; you have to build systems that can deal with people who may not learn and retain information quite as quickly as a 'normal' person would.
I think the key here is to teach all the important basics about not clicking on links in emails, but also try to design the system so that it reinforces these lessons and helps remind them if they start to forget.
For starters, get them an email client that can disable HTML, and turn that off. If they can't click on a link in an email and have their browser pop open, then it's a lot harder to get roped in by a phishing attack -- if they have to copy/paste it, at least there's a better chance they'll realize something is amiss. Might also want to think about literally putting a sticker on the computer that says something like "Only open banking sites from bookmarks, never links!" (okay, I'm sure someone else can come up with some catchier one-liners for warning text than I can). I feel like if everyone had a sign on the top of their screen reminding them of the dangers of phishing, maybe they'd think about it more and maybe avoid trouble once in a while.
The other thing that might be instructive would be to take them online and show them some samples of phishing emails and 419 scams and general spam, so that they know what they're probably going to receive in their Inbox, sooner or later, and how hard it is to separate from "legitimate" seeming emails. Maybe forward them an example one yourself (warn them first, and defang the links obviously); it's easy to talk about scamming or phishing in the abstract, but it suddenly becomes more real when you have one in your email box.
Any success with this project is going to require a combination of technological and user-training solutions; neither one is going to be enough on its own. The system has to help reinforce the lessons, preferably by making the "right way" of doing things also the easiest and most obvious way, and making the "wrong way" harder.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
Do this for her: Install Firefox, set up a browser bookmark for her bank's HTTPS address, and configure her email so that URLs in email phishing messages are non-clickable.
If she can figure out how to make her URLs clickable again, she's probably smart enough to learn about secure surfing. If not, at least she's less likely to be phished.
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Make a system running some Linux distro in a little box with no legacy ports available. Have three giant icons for the browser, simple word processor and email, do not give them the root password.
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Everybody wants to get on the internet and netbank, surf, mail, shop.
Imho the idea that this ought to be simple and easy for everybody is false.
Time for a bad analogy.
If I want to drive a car on the highway, i first need to :
- learn how to drive a car
- learn how to behave in traffic
Furthermore I need to have an understanding of what i'm doing in order to be able to predict the outcome of my actions.
Why is this accepted for driving a car, but not for computing and using internet? (It looks like a TV set, but it something entirely different. People watching TV don't risk identity theft, for one thing.) Internet can be a powerful tool... but powertools can cause accidents when not used properly.
Given the current situation, maybe some people are better off not owning a computer or connecting it to the net. Some elderly will do fine, some just can't wrap their head around it.
(disclaimer : i some across computer-illiterates of all ages, not just elderly.)
Ok, i must have gotten about three bad analogies in there. Let's call it a night.
I don't think this is specifically about the elderly. It is about anyone who isn't internet-savvy. The elderly, because of their lack of exposure to computers, may form a substantial group of such users, but the same would be true of new users in the developing world etc.
Get them an iMac or a Mac Mini with a 24 or 30 inch screen from Dell.
Set the system up to auto-update.
If they have vision problems there are settings on the Mac to help.
You might consider getting an additional keypad - for instance you can get one from x-keys and set it up with all the things they normally want to do - opening and closing the web brower for instance, you could even set it up for different keys to open different sites. Then clearly label the keys.
an oxymoron?
-Michael, AKA Frankie.
that is Safe Computing For the Elderly.
Get her a Sinclair ZX81.
There are two ways to keep Granny safe on the internet;
(1) If you can get her a static IP address, get her a generic PC and install your favourite distribution of Linux. Customise it for her with a few simple desktop icons. Know the root password so you can login remotely and perform maintenance (or just eject the CD-ROM and scare the shit out of her -- I used to do that all the time in the office where I work).
(2) In all other cases, get her an Apple Mac.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
"As you get older you lose your mental faculties. That's not patronizing - it's what happens. Eventually - if you live long enough - you'll start to make bad decisions."
It's not clear you lose mental faculties; certain your body gets older. But the idea that people become senile as a normal part of aging is false.
As for old people making bad decisions, so does everyone. And if I was betting, I'm betting that 21 year olds make more bad decisions than 80 year olds.
You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
My grandma uses wget. She egreps the output for <a\s+href and does wget in the link she chose. This way, instead of blindly clicking on the anchor, she picks the URL she wants and she is not phished.
Oh, yes, once grandpa modified her hosts file, transfered funds from her savings account run away with his 20 something bride.
Seriously, that's it. Put big (and I mean BIG) shortcuts with generic names on the desktop for all the programs they need. Just Internet, E-Mail, Music, and so on will do. Explain to them never to trust e-mail from people they don't know and that their bank wont e-mail them. Have all their favorite websites bookmarked, or better yet have desktop shortcuts. You can set up an SSH server for updates, and they wont even need to know about it. They presumably won't need to play games or anything, so drivers aren't a worry, but you'll have to install extra codecs and plug-ins (MP3, Java, Flash, possibly Windows Media). If you really want to do things right, set up the VNC server in GNOME (can't remember the name at the moment) so that you can connect and show them how to do things if necessary. That's it, end of story. I don't know why everybody makes things so hard.
Banking it not safe for elderly people, online or offline.
Ofcourse unless your name if John Coyote Mutombwe Esq. and you are executing the will of their late oil baron long lost relative and need $45k to get the inheritance out of Nigeria.
If the person in question is really, completely, clueless at computers, an Xubuntu box is the way to go.
Think about it: the person is so clueless that they won't use the menus; you make a shortcut on the desktop to Firefox, and rename it to "Go Online", another shortcut to Writer, and that's about it.
This has one great advantage over a mini: cost! Grab your old P3 from the basement, dust off the 128 megs of RAM, toss in an old CRT, add Xubuntu (or, if you've got a little more RAM, K/Ubuntu), and you've got a box that will suit their needs completely for practically nothing.
If, OTOH, they are going to want to be installing their own software, or doing something else "high-tech", then, yeah, go for the Mini.
Linux is for the completely inept or the 1337, everyone else should use Mac.
Obligatory Soundbite Catchphrase
They're not children. It's new (but not necessary), they've a life time of perspective on the merits of caution, and the perils of reckless ignorance. My grandparents got a computer for Christmas a few years back, I do the tech support. You know what the majority of my calls were? "No, really it's ok. It's nearly impossible for you to screw it up so bad I can't fix it easily." Now there more of a focused nature about doing specific tasks. They're almost 80, grandpa installed his own ram upgrade (without me in attendence). Maintains his own virus protection, and updates. He's also the only person who reads the EULAs who's not writing articles on them. Grandma saves her geneology to a thumbdrive, and burns CD slideshows of grandkid pictures. They were terrified that they'd break it and then they'd have a broken computer. It took a while to overcome the inertia. But all it really took is patiently outlining what they should expect in the throws of a given problem, letting them ask for clarification, and not making them feel guilty about it when the did. For me it was a joy, but I like my grandparents. The only problem they ever had was when one of my uncles talked them into having a PC shop monkey upgrade them to XP, which he promptly fucked up. It offten takes someone who imagines they know better to make a true mess of a situation.
As for the person who asked the question. If it's a gift and you're doing the support, go with what you're comfortable supporting and which meets their needs. Their needs at this stage of the game being pretty modest in all likelyhood. Between making a homepage with all the links they need, properly installed configured antivirus suits, setup firewalls, and user accounts. (Including them in the decision making process, of course.) A little bit of hands on tutoring with some follow up coaching is all it will take. I'm convinced my faith in their good sense and expecation that this would be something they could both do and enjoy added years to my grandfather's life. It's clear as his time draws to a close; having something to do, new experiences, and learning opportunities was part of what kept them both (but him in particular) going as all their friends and peers began to die. When I got them that computer I thought I was just getting them a toy, or a luxury item to amuse and entertain. In reality I was buying them time, time which I got to spend better knowing them. One of the smartest fucking things I ever did.
I've found that time and repetition work very well, regardless of OS or application. Spend the time with them as they use it. I've found 2 common causes of their problems are 1) not remembering what to do in each case, and 2) what to do in a new situation. In both cases, being able to quickly ask for and receive help works best.
rewriting history since 2109
Simply ghost the drive after a full (clean) install, and have her save the important files to a specific directory that you can have task scheduler back up once/day or on bootup if she turns the machine off when she's not using it (my mother leaves hers on all the time).
If she screws something up, nuke the main drive/partition, throw the original image back over it, and everything is good again. Unless she gets something *extremely* militant, it should work perfectly.
Echoing many of the above posts, just get her a Mac. Don't get me wrong, I'm not much of a Mac person myself and I like Linux, but as much fun as getting and configuring a nice Ubuntu box for Grandma might be for you, and as much nerd cred it might get you to be able to tell all your LUG buddies about how you've got Granny on FOSS, it'll be just as much of a PITA for her and you in the long run. One thing Mac is light-years ahead of the competition on is usability and support to someone who has never seen a computer before, which means no panicking midnight calls to you.
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
Gee do you think theres a reason for that?
I'd love to say "get a Mac", but I have to say there is one gaping hole on the Mac side that seriously needs closing. That hole is Safari, which doesn't _currently_ have a phishing monitor. They say it's coming for Leopard though. If this is the case, in a couple of months I might just day "get a Mac".
I've spent quite some time teaching basic computer/Internet usage to a wide variety of people; some as young as 5, some in their 90s. At some point you realize that there are actually two issues with regards to Internet safety. The first is securing your machine from malicious attacks (viruses, spyware, malware, etc). The second is securing yourself from social attacks by others.
You will probably find a lot of information on the first kind of safety - this is what most tech people will talk about when speaking of Internet security. There are a lot of people much smarter than I am that could tell you a lot of great ways to secure yourself. My basic advice to people was always:
- If you have high-speed Internet, buy a router with some basic firewall abilities (typically between $50 and $80 CDN)
- invest in some antivirus software. Run it at least once a week. If you have a thick client email application, configure your antivirus application to check your mail as it comes in.
- Install a spyware application. Tell her to run it once a month.
- If it's an option, buy a Mac. I would avoid installing linux simply because when Edna from the bridge club comes by to help her do something, Edna probably won't know anything about Linux, but she may know some of the more mainstream OSs/applications.
- Install a browser other than IE. Do your best to prevent her from accidentally using IE.
- Do not let her use Outlook or Outlook express. By itself it's not responsible for Internet security, but it is inherently more susceptible to problems than other thick clients.
- if at all possible, partition her drive into a data partition and an OS/Apps partition. That way you can easily reinstall everything if yo have to with only minimal data loss.
That's all that's really needed. The harder part of Internet security is actually getting the individual to act in a secure manner. Start by explaining that communicating over the Internet is just like communicating in real life. Make her feel that this is an extension of what she has been doing for the last 80 years, not some new fangled thing that has just started. That will make her feel a little more comfortable with what she is doing. With every suggestion, relate it to something that she already understands. Some basic guidelines:
- There are places that you can safely go all of the time, and there are places that you should probably never go to (insert name of seedy part of town here).
- There are people that you can trust on the Internet, and there are lots of people that you cannot trust.
- Never ever every give anyone money just because they ask for it. Only give money to people in exchange for services or products that *YOU* asked for (not that they think you need). Obviously some room for charity here, but do reinforce this point. The elderly are the target of most of the scams that try to take money for no good reason (Think "I'm a Nigerian prince that needs to borrow..."). My wife works at a bank and stops about one old lady every six weeks from emptying her bank account so that she can give it to someone in Nigeria/Egypt/Publishers Clearing House, etc.
- When providing information to people, it's always better to go to them then to have them come to you. If someone from Bank of America wants you to log into your account to check something, open up your browser and type in http://www.bankofamerica.com/, never click on a link that they provided. Yes, there is a difference. No, you probably won't be able to tell. Relate this to the idea that when your bank calls you for financial information it is always a better idea to call them right back than to provide information directly. She should initiate all transactions.
- When asked to fill out a web form, always ask these three questions:
My 95 year old grandmother has been visually impaired for over a decade. She had trouble finding good software to improve her computer experience and ended up spending several hundred dollars on something called ZoomText. http://www.synapseadaptive.com/ Which I found to be a complete and total rip off. It's better than Window's built in stuff, but it's not worth more than $50.
However! Apple has done a pretty good job of including such features, and honestly I think they might be better. She'll still need a huge damn screen, but OS X has some pretty slick Accessibility options that should be able to help her get around.
The biggest problem I know of for people being introduced to the internet at this stage is clicking on things they shouldn't. Install Firefox and AdBlocker Pro (or plus?) and have it use one of the online maintained blocking lists. Additionally walk her through all her sites and block anything that needs to be blocked. I also use FlashBlock. Make sure she knows both are installed and tell her how to use them. Old people hate having anything hidden from them according to what someone else thinks will be their benefit - especially if this lady is prepaired to do internet banking at 80.
Remote Management! Apple provides remote management software but it's not free and requires a Mac to do the remoting, where Microsoft's is free and there is an MS client for both Windows and OS X, and a 3rd party version for *NIX. However I have used VNC (RealVNC to be exact) for OS X which functions and allows the user to see what you're doing. But I've had problems keeping the server side running on OS X. Might just be me. The nice thing is you can remote to her computer from any platform.
As far as securing it, that's a matter of restricting web access and monitoring mail. And once you're on a Mac the only real issues to watch for are phishing.
I'd get her a 20" iMac. It includes a camera and she could video chat with her grandkids. It would make visits to Grandma's a bit more enjoyable as well (:
No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
I know of one person in his 80s with a Macintosh and I get calls maybe two or three times a month max, mostly dealing with internet issues (he has dialup) and the prtinter (everybody has printer issues or a laser printer.)
So for the most part he does fine, the system runs clean except the stuff he tries to install on it (repeatedly, I don't know how many times he downloads real player in a month).
Of course he does share the plight of all of us (Windows Mac and Linux combined) and that is of overwhelming spam and phishing emails (especially if the person does much e-commerce). He is shrewed enough tnot to fall into that but there is that aspect that will be a conern when getting a newbie onot the internet.
No matter what kind of system you get her, don't forget to warn her about email scams.
... anyway, I guess that becomes a whole other topic....
It took me a long time to convince my parents that there is no child in Indonesia getting the money they DID send, that there is no one trying to escape to the United States needing their money and always check for the validity of charities asking for help.
Also, the identity thefts... well, you get the point. LOL
My dad is an educated man. He has a pharmacological degree and that took many years of college and he still fell for some of those scams. Even after my "lectures" I still worry that he may end up doing something stupid and losing his entire retirement or something.
I'm certain you've already thought of this... but if anyone has any ideas how to knock some sense into someone who is from "Father knows best"
Sorry
Kris
Remember when Windows were washed, mice were trapped and UNIX guarded the harem?
"No, really it's ok. It's nearly impossible for you to screw it up so bad I can't fix it easily."
That is probably the best advice that you can offer someone. Most people are so worried about breaking it that they won't do anything to it. Explaining that it's always fixable goes a long way to improving anyone's ability.
Get them WebTV or an iOpener.
But in all seriousness, not liking Safari is no reason not to get a Mac. Since I don't have 10.4 at home so I can't use the newest Safari anyhow (and old Safari really sucks) I use Firefox almost exclusively on my emac.
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
Keep it simple as possible. If all she wants to do is the internet, set her up with something like MSN TV or maybe even a Wii once the browser comes out and if it supports SSL. Also, some cable companies offer web browsing through their digital cable box, and I'm sure that there's some linux distro out there that runs in a very small storage footprint (256MB or less) that can be run in a set top box configuration.
Bottom line, if she just wants to surf the internet, get her something that just surfs.
In Soviet Russia, Trojan exploits YOU!
Use Ubuntu, reducing spyware and virus threats, install firestarter/shorewall/etc for a firewall, and use Open DNS to block phishing. Most problems are then blocked.
runs from a cd in ram and is just Mozilla, not much else.
ByzantineOS on Sourceforge
works with most computers with a lan connection.
"The Most Fun Possible on 4 wheels" is at SunBuggy in Las Vegas
just get her the vmware secure browser device..
every time she wants to use the internet.. boot that up..
she won't get infected.. and even if she does.. you can recover with a click from a snapshot.
then when not online.. she can have all of the features she wants from windows..
I only write about this.. because most linux is not driver ready for a new machine.
windows is.. though I do like linux.. it's just a fact.
but supporting linux.. it's more secure for internet.. so why not use both worlds at once for anyone.. even grandma..
Have mercy, or at least pity, on them an shell out for a Macintosh. At least put Ubuntu or Kubuntu on the machine along with a few short cut icons and bookmarks. The MS Windows interface is overly complex and counter intuitive.
I see very old people do their banking without trouble all the time on the Fedora and Ubuntu machines set up as public stations at one site. That locale gets a lot of very old and very young visitors. Interestingly, there are several continuing students who are able to do their homework on OpenOffice.org for their classes on MS Office without trouble they only have to turn in a file or a print out, not the application they used.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Get your elderly user to take a look at the book "PC's for Dummies". Several of you spoke of scenarios in which you attempted to explain some computer or internet-related concept, only to find that your grandfather was so lacking in fundamental knowledge that your explanation made no sense to him at all. This book was written with this type of user in mind. I began using PC's later in life than most of you. "PC's for Dummies" explained many things that authors of other, allegedly, beginner level books assumed I already knew.
Not everybody has that luxury. Often, only one bank has ATMs in a given city. This was the case in Terre Haute, Indiana, during the four years that I went to school there.
I all she wants to do is access a few money sites, you could always set up a whitelist so she can't access anything else! Of course, then when her friends send her links to cute kitty pictures that she can't access, she might get cranky...oh yeah, those aren't usually links, they're usually 80MB attachments. Should be fine. :-)
IE runs pretty darn well under Wine, along with most of the ActiveX controls and other nonsense the banks seem to want. However, it tends not to run the illegitimate malware crap.
Set her up with Firefox for general internet and IE for specific banking stuff.
PHEM - party like it's 1997-2003!
Wii Browser is an Opera product, so it works on sites that Opera's Presto engine works on. And keep in mind the topic: Which site that a granny would visit would require a plug-in, other than possibly YouTube?
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Ask the hard question: what exactly is it about banking and brokering ONLINE that is so attractive and necessary? This is what should worry you, the motivation about finance sites. Some people lose all sense of danger as they age.
To give a real Internet appliance, do a minimal install of Debian with Windowmaker. Large icons in top right for web, mail, word processor, maybe photo app. People with previous computer phobias react astonishingly well to this setup, comments like, of course I can use THAT are normal. Not a fashionable choice, not what everyone else has, but its a real appliance, and it will be super fast. Ephipany will be better than firefox. Evolution or Kmail are nice because they do addresses, calendar, notes and so on. Evolution in particular can give new users a sense of it helping them organize their lives. Abiword is better than OO. If shopping is an issue, set up the shopping sites in the toolbar bookmarks under 'shopping'.
Strongly discourage banking and brokering unless there is some real extraordinary reason why phone calls to a known person will not do. How many transactions? What's the problem this solves, exactly?
But even with an appliance, its only safer, its not safe.
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It all depends. What's her Social Security Number?
what about something like this? => A mini-itx fan-less computer with a simplified keyboard (no ALT, CTRL combination), a super simplified GUI (based on linux) and no root rights by default (no need for antivirus).
If they can't see ads and pop-ups then they can't click on them to download and install malware. "Your computer's time is wrong, click here it fix it" works because non-technical people don't know any better.
There are also several things you can do in OS X to make the experience safer for her, such as restricting her account to a whitelist of URLs (including the URLs of all of her financial websites and anything else she's interested in). I don't know if that would be too restrictive for her, but maybe it would provide a good sandbox to start out in, and as her comfort level and understanding of the internet increases, she (or you) could loosen the restrictions.
Here's some advice form someone who's just finished building a new internet banking security system for the bank I work for:
DONT USE WINDOWS
Simple really.
Seriously, for someone who wasn't weaned on Windows, using a modern Linux desktop is a very viable proposition. The only trojan attack vectors we've seen are from Windows boxes. A recent survey stated that 50% of all trojanned machines run Windows XP SP2, so there's no safety there. Most are simple key-loggers which are bad enough, but there's a new wave of targetted banking site trojans designed to crack various protection schemes.
Install Linux, Mandriva is a good newbies distro. Get broadband with a hardware router/firwall. Put big icons on the panel for e-mail, browser and OpenOffice. Put a signle Bookmark for teh Banking site on the browser toolbar. Lock down the KDE desktop using Kiosk. Install Spamassasin to cut down on the phishing e-mails. Sign them up with a bank that supports Firefox (there's plenty, we do) and has a form of 2nd Factor Authentication. A smaller bank will be less of a target, but they need to be big enough to have proper security in place.
Most importantly, patiently explain to them WHY they must only ever use the bookmark to access thier banking, never reply to e-mails or follow links on other sites. Don't assume they won't understand the background, just issuing blanket orders to not do something is guaranteed to confuse and be forgotten/ignored. Explain it to them in simple, non-technical language and use analogies to things tehy do understand. If they understand the why, they will be better prepared when they do see an attack vector you haven't explicitally told them about.
John.
P.S. And yes, I've done this for my parents...
I recently migrated my father over to Ubuntu from winxp, while he is only in his 50's he was still quite new and ignorant to the world of computing. How did he take the change you might ask? He handled the change very well I must say. I think the most difficult part of Linux to the new user is getting installed and set up to perform... being that I took care of that, he can now enjoy the internet in a carefree manner and honestly just look for trouble if he so desires. Which is what the internet it is all about. It's really gratifying to be able to liberate your parents from m$ and even more so not having to worry about whether or not they will get a virus or key logged. That pretty much just leaves phishing to worry about... Thats my 411.
My bank has a perfectly straightforward web-based interface, which supports paying bills, dealing with accounts, looking at transactions, etc. And it's a small bank that phishers haven't bothered with, though somebody typosquatted the .com name back when they were first getting online. The interface works fine with Mozilla, so there's no need for IE, and I assume a Mac would work with it as well.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
They do, but generally, there is a $4 surcharge when a customer from one bank withdraws from another bank's ATM, split evenly between the two banks. In addition, banks in USA only allow deposits of cash or checks in their own ATMs.
Is there actually a law forbidding ATM owners from charging service fees to customers of other banks?
I have had the misfortune of helping my in-laws, both 75 at the time, to jump into the digital domain. We did this originally with a hand-me-down PC onto which I installed Windows 98. That PC was nothing but trouble, and we eventually gave up on it in favor of a new PC running Windows XP. I thought that XP would be less trouble; I couldn't have been more wrong. The thing got wormed and virused to death; I spent 14 hours cleaning all that stuff off. After several multi-hour tech support phone calls I had had enough, and went down and bought a Mac Mini. There was a lot of retraining involved, but the number of tech support calls fell to basically nothing -- the only one I remember, other than getting it on the net when they first set it up, was when they accidentally removed something or other from the Dock. I call it an unmitigated success. One of the replies to this suggested a variant of Ubuntu. I couldn't do that; there aren't any tools for dealing with magnification, necessary for my father-in-law, and at the time of the conversion they were using AOL which also limited choices. But in principle Firefox is all they really need, so it could work.
jim frost
jimf@frostbytes.com
And will I have done some brilliant bit of editing, killed a yeti, or totally lost it?
Yikes! I've been using "vi" for over half my life, and my life is probably half over!
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
I'm more worried about some.
Then again, Grandma probably had a wild side?
"I don't know a lot of 21 year olds who decide to leave the stove on all day after making tea. "
We need to make tea kettles more available. Basically a tea kettle with a heating element that shuts off when the water boils.
I had never heard of them until about 25 years ago when I was visiting England and every B&B had one in the room. The best part is that its very energy efficient and when it's done it shuts off so the danger is mainly from scalding.
I found some about 15 years ago made by Kenwood (!), but I rarely see them. I guess most people are coffee drinkers. But it's handy for instant soups, hot chocolate, etc.
You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
How do people in Sweden use their birthday money, or their paychecks from an employer that does not offer direct deposit, to buy things online?
Consider just starting her out with email and a web-based version of a newspaper or magazine that she's into. This will allow her to learn how to use the computer, and will allow you to gauge her vulnerabilities before she puts her money on the internet.
Another strategy is simple risk management. Assuming your grandmother has life savings that she doesn't touch often, keep that money off of the internet. You could start her off by only setting up a bank account that her weekly/monthly check goes into. This will allow her to pay bills electronically, but protect her nest-egg.
No, I will not work for your startup
A recent survey stated that 50% of all trojanned machines run Windows XP SP2 [...]Not that I'm all that surprised, but could you cite a source?
This is not a signature.